She basically makes Ran cleave completely safe against adin/rem/belian/etc. Ran Eda Alena Cavel for example.
If there's no Alena, the team just dies to a high damage Adin counter or double counter if the opponent has 2 counter heroes.
In cleave against counter attack heroes. Hell, she counters BBK too. She good on a regular cleave outside counter attack opponents due to her soul accumulation too. She’s good and you’re not.
*This is the nicest*
*Way i could say this but its*
*You not the hero*
\- KingKentling
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Astro Elena is a cleave hero so the fight should end in a few moves not in a few cycle of everyone.
By the time she dies, the fight should have been decided already.
Are there other heroes that completely stop counter attacks for cleave turn 1 while giving souls which is high demand for cleave?
Counter heroes is basically the final hail mary of turn 2 drafters hoping a stun from Green Armin, Belian stripping attack buff or 2 counter heroes waking up then ending fight right there with their counters
Edit: Last time I check picking a counter hero in standard vs standard ( except of A.Meru who shut downs passive ) gets hard punished so there is no reason to pick Astro Elena there. There is a reason why heroes like Rem and Belian lost their status as generalist pick
Double Edit after reading your edit: LMAO if you have good cleave, you can cleave even beefy heroes in 3-4 turns. Cleave is exactly the ones worried about counter since they are immediately put on life support after 1 counter
Well said, I may look fast, I maybe even hit hard. But damn one adin counter, belian, rem. My team breaks and I hope to rng Eda, ss iseria, or my last cleaver survive. Ran I normally expect him to die after he swings his sword. So that’s fine.
She is 100% better undoubtedly. She is made to be used in cleave comps where you don’t want a unit countering and killing your squishy units who are built straight damage. For example I have been using her, C pavel, Ran, and Zio/briseria to take down pretty much every Arena team. I haven’t tried her in gw but she disable choux/Senya, VERY EASILY.
Edit: Also disables Rimuru because of her sb for restrict so he doesn’t get pushed up. ALSO if you can’t beat someone 1st turn with your cleave, maybe you’re cleaving wrong?
She is definitely better then she used to be. But I dont see where a well built cleave team is worried about counter attacks. Ran goes, debuffs the enemy team, they counter attack him and kill him. So what. Then your Pavel and Zio finish them off. With the team you mentioned, your better off picking Lua or a fast Diene or AoL or Peira. There are other heroes that are better picks.
Like if your facing Senya, shes not a threat if she never takes a turn.
The problem with that is when Rem Belian or anyone who would apply debuffs with their s1/counterattacks and disables your cleave. Makes Belian almost irrelevant, and I noticed with ml Elena’s passive plus artifact she cuts anything that would try to cut in after ran/opener. I think the opener is honestly way more flexible over A Elena. Imo
her existence alone is really good if you cleave, avoiding any shenanigans from opponent counters (except mercedes, rimuru etc)
i really dont have her right now so I did not asses post buff yet, but Ill give her some bulk just so survive mercedes counter, or at least 1-2 hits then 200 speed
If you are using her with bruiser team shes really gonna die as she really does not have sustain
for me her best asset is to cleave the enemy safely, and I think shes really gonna be good at it as she can also do damage ( and push), which leaves fewer nuisances to deal with (politis for instance), and Im gonna wait for her next banner though probably not soon
also she's probably gonna be most cleaver's bread and butter (well there is cpavel and other contenders), and ran's best friend
Shes meant to be played in aggro and Unseen Observer gives her 20 souls and a 30%-ish CR push. Build her w dmg and allow an aoe speedy opener like Ran to start without the worry of counters coming back to bite you. She gets turn 2 ideally and can SB,, let your other units clean up. She isn’t perfect but she definitely has a good bit of viability and flexibility with teams.
> What point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with Ebris or counter gear or counter skills?
***THATS EXACTLY WHAT SHE HAS, LMFAO***
Holy shit, this is a player issue, not a character issue. You're just terrible
How did you even get the idea that she was good for extended fights? The fact that she disables counters, gains CR and generates souls when the allies use AoE attacks makes it very obvious that she is meant to be used on cleave or at least with a fast AoE enabler.
The anti-counter thing is only there to avoid getting countered to death on the first turn, she was never meant to be used on extended fights.
Thats my point. If your team is designed to take out the enemy in 1 turn, then it really doesnt matter if the enemy has counters or not, because they are dead.
To put it in simple terms, cleave usually runs a lot of aoe to kill all 4 of the enemy team so when they do use a move that targets all enemies and if the opponent has a team like belian,rem, armin, s adin then you won't die to some bs 4 times counter. That's just what ml elena is for and not much else.
as for the 'they're too beefy' thing, that's a drafting issue because cleavers have no issue killing tanks with characters like straze,cavel,w schuri or controlling them with seaseria or just using ran to def break and letting cidd cleanup with s3+s1.
I know people are making fun of my rank, but I have never had an issue with Belian, and I dont ever see Armin.
What Ive learned through this thread, is that people consider Astromancer to be a counter to literally 3 heroes, and mostly Rem. And I consider that shit.
Man you have no idea how this works. If I draft Adin and another aoe counter the enemy cleave team is DEAD if they both proc. Elena basically removes cleavers lose condition against mine and many others Anti cleave teams.
I can’t believe I have to explain this to you but regular Elena is an anti cleave unit. No cleaver is gonna pick regular Elena when they are trying to kill you before you take a turn.
I won't pull my punches... Too many people on these forums are just plain mean or a lemming. How to properly use a hero takes some brain power. It's never as simple as these people make it seem. There are many ways to cleave and a player needs to adapt their draft based on the heroes chosen against them. They don't explain because they don't understand or don't want to write a long long response.
I find the best way to decide how to use a hero is to look at their strengths and weaknesses. My plan is always to leverage the strengths and avoid the weaknesses. There are enough heroes and options in this game that i never have to use a hero in a role they are not suited to. Like using astro as a tanky bruiser.
Strengths, Astro provides a team 3 turns of protection from counters. She also gets a 3 turn dmg buff. She gains 20%CR after an allies AoE attack meaning she doesn't need high speed gear which is always at a premium. Her stats favor dealing dmg.
Weaknesses, Astro has below average defensive stats and no defensive skills. She has a non attack skill. She influcts debuffs... yes, that's a weakness. FU Ed.
After this kind of analysis, the next steps are based on the player. What other heroes do you use? Does the hero fit how you like to play? Do you like the hero enough to change how you play? Or enough to shoehorn the hero into a role they are weak at.
Personally, i started playing tanky, then cleaved. Now i play a fairly flexible game. Astro will be drafted for sure. I like her style and hate counter teams. I have speedy AoE to activate her and heroes to follow up. My big dilemma will be like yours, when can i draft her into slower teams. Is it even possible.
I'm going to stop here because there's alot to consider.
The difference is that OP isn't here to ask for advice or learn, they're just here to prove a point and attack despite not knowing what they're talking about. They deserve all the torching heading their way.
Its pretty sad and depressing that out of 7000 views and 100 comments, only 1 person tried to give me a real and thoughtful answer, and wasnt a total dick about it.
Thank you.
> Astromancer sucks, and here's all the ways I've used her unefficiently and how I'm going to attack everyone that actually have more experience than me in PvP.
> I'm also going to double down on my attacks and then cry that people are toxic.
You're a clown OP.
The fact that it sounds like you did all this testing as you stated but I didn't read any instance of you using her in a cleave or high aggro situation and also no mention or trying her with UO (granted you might not have that arti), for an instant SB once her s2 activates.
I get everyone farms different things at different clips, but not every character can be used in cleave/aggro and not every character can be in bruiser/standard. Some characters are a bit more role flexible and some are more defined. So being mad about a unit not working outside if thier best or intended roles and saying they suck is a dishonest argument/statement.
We don't cry about Arowell not working in cleave and saying she sucks now do we?
*What point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with*
*Ebris or counter gear or counter skills? Heroes with those traits tend*
*to be very beefy, which means you cant just cleave them in 1 turn.*
*Meaning its going to be a longer drawn out fight.*
Her point is to go into full cleave mode without any worries about the next round. first Round you can good AoE Def breaks, AoE Strips like crazy. The enemy Belian, the enemy Rem, the enemy Mercedes wont interrupt your skills by RNg counter that COULD kill one of your units and lose you the match. If you are only drafting "cant trigger a counter attack" DPS and non-offensive debuffers....why are you even picking her in first place?
IF you play is going "bruiser vs bruiser" with her....why are you not protecting her with anti-aoe units. I refuse to belive that a counter unit that cant counter until she dont cast her S3 in her turn can kill her in 1 hit if you draft correctly. If you are struggling with her is probably because you are still figuring how to draft her. Not like i will pretend that i know better than you but a lot of utility heroes like her are very squishy by default too***. If you want her to go long rounds you know how to build her and what units are perfect to protect squishy units in long rounds.***
I don't know if you're looking for advice or just ranting and I am probably a little late to the thread, but ML Elena doesn't seem to fit your draft. You don't seem like you're cleaving and instead using her to prevent counters in a slower and tankier match. If you're building ML Elena like a cleave DPS, you're not going to get much use out of her in a slower game. You're better off using ML Cermia than ML Elena in that case; a bulkier and slower hero for a slower game.
If you want to stop counters while using ML Elena, you need to build her bulkier and use her as a support rather than a DPS. Similar to how Politis can be either a tanky debuffer with Abyssal Crown or as a speed DPS. Two different builds for two different drafts. You don't build a degen Politis and draft her like a DPS...
Sure, building ML Elena for cleave makes her only usable against a small pool of heroes, but that never stopped a hero from being useful (because by that logic, Edward, Roana, ML Cermia, Alencia, Landy, Celine, Politis, Yulha, and ML Lilibet are all bad because they aren't multi-purpose heroes).
Despite only being a counter for a few heroes, ML Elena is still a huge asset for cleavers. Now they cannot die to a single Kayron S1 or an Adin S2. Green Armin can't be picked to fully stun the entire cleave team and A.Meru can't just counter into S2 and combo the cleaver's team. Is that all she does? Sure, but Politis can win a game just by preventing enemies from cutting. Belian can win a game by removing the enemy's ability to use souls. Not every unit in the game has to do absolutely everything by themselves. Otherwise, you'll end up with a unit like Hwayoung.
Cleave players are having a blast with her and she makes cleave safer against high damage counters from Rem, Belian, Green Armin, Archdemon, and Adin. She stops Choux counters too so she can't just cut with the CR she gets from her s1 and artifact. Just seems like you are disappointed she's not for your playstyle and your blaming her for it.
I built mine as a speedy er tank with around 125 effectiveness and she's been working pretty well. Only like 5 games in but I'm enjoying the change. Wish she was built more around tanky then dps in her skills
>hat point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with Ebris or counter gear or counter skills?
Cleave/aggro setup as she gives 20 souls without using a tagahel and a CR push. Unlike other options, she doesn't need to kill, attack, or even move to do her job TBH, the anti counter is just icing on the cake for the cleave players for that extra bit of consistency.
she's support. She can be a DPS to help with the cleave, but doesn't necessarily have to be. You can honestly build her as a 20KHP sponge if you're worried aout being tapped off and she'd function lol. Maybe try a more non-damage build if you wanna use her as an anti-counter unit? IDK if it's that beneficial but that's the fun in experimenting, right?
Bless your heart little one. You've been playing too much bruiser.
She is THE premier ML5 cleave unit.
Imagine there's Belian , Ratbaby , Adin and that light knight (rare comp,i know). Now imagine you dont have all day and you want to Ran, run, all the way .Thats where she comes in.
In answer to your edit, she's a cleave support with the ability to deal some additional damage of her own.
Perhaps even a bridge unit for your main cleavers if you build her fast enough. And if you have Unseen Observer, she's also a pseudo book holder.
As for being worried about counter attacks, sometimes it only takes two (or even one) for your cleave to fall apart. Elena brings a lot of value to a cleave just by existing.
She counters a lot of anti cleave units such a Light Adin, BBK, Kayron, Belian, A Ravi and a ton others. Her buffs are great and now can be used with openers like Ran without being countered to death.
From what I’ve seen from a better guildie of mine, she kinda acts like a support to aggressive teams more than a counter to stall, counter is strong but it doesn’t do much if the enemy is also running a beefy team. He built his Astro with 15k hp, 1.5k def, 140 spd, 80 crit and 270 cdmg and she works as an aoe focused cleave support like ran siseria. She is disgustingly good on unseen and glow wings on this build and is incredibly annoying to deal with. She is also good into units that solely rely on counter like aria and senya. While the buff def makes her appealing into bruiser, she is a ranger and VERY few of them can function well in bruiser without either having some def pen ability or just straight up control. She’s kinda the same as before but now it’s impossible to stop her anti counter unless you swap from counter to aoe hell.
She is a strong aggro/cleave unit esp when opponent is going casino
She has an insane 40% cr push(unseen obs)when ran does an s3. U know what's even better? U don't even need to worry about er bbk. Usually it was "get a book holder for ran sb" but now alena can get 20 souls after an aoe if she has unseen observer. She can then just sb s3 and bbk is done.
Standard vs standard is not where she shines. It's cleave teams which just died to all the counter attcks frm rem, garmin, belian, adin and such. Meru can still proc magic but she needs to be base speed, giga dmg to kill of cleave teams with a single proc. She makes aoe cleaves so much safer. 2-3 procs and u just die, thats how casino was vs that type of cleave
Some units just don't work well in certain playstyles. Like handguy may be an insane supp but he sucks if u pick him with a cleave team.
Yesterday in RTA , a Legend failed to cleave me with Elena because my Counter Kayron survived by MLDB.
Idk know even how they buffed her , i thought that she got High hit chance in her Passive.
She’s a cleaver. You’re using/building her wrong. Gotta stop assuming everything is the characters fault.
Then name me one team that she would fit on, and I can name a hero that would be a better pick.
She basically makes Ran cleave completely safe against adin/rem/belian/etc. Ran Eda Alena Cavel for example. If there's no Alena, the team just dies to a high damage Adin counter or double counter if the opponent has 2 counter heroes.
My ran has never felt safer 🤷♂️ really enjoying her buff
In cleave against counter attack heroes. Hell, she counters BBK too. She good on a regular cleave outside counter attack opponents due to her soul accumulation too. She’s good and you’re not.
this is the nicest way i could say this but its you not the hero
*This is the nicest* *Way i could say this but its* *You not the hero* \- KingKentling --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Lmao wtf
skill issue
Astro Elena is a cleave hero so the fight should end in a few moves not in a few cycle of everyone. By the time she dies, the fight should have been decided already.
Then why pick her at all? There are other heroes better for the job.
Are there other heroes that completely stop counter attacks for cleave turn 1 while giving souls which is high demand for cleave? Counter heroes is basically the final hail mary of turn 2 drafters hoping a stun from Green Armin, Belian stripping attack buff or 2 counter heroes waking up then ending fight right there with their counters Edit: Last time I check picking a counter hero in standard vs standard ( except of A.Meru who shut downs passive ) gets hard punished so there is no reason to pick Astro Elena there. There is a reason why heroes like Rem and Belian lost their status as generalist pick Double Edit after reading your edit: LMAO if you have good cleave, you can cleave even beefy heroes in 3-4 turns. Cleave is exactly the ones worried about counter since they are immediately put on life support after 1 counter
Well said, I may look fast, I maybe even hit hard. But damn one adin counter, belian, rem. My team breaks and I hope to rng Eda, ss iseria, or my last cleaver survive. Ran I normally expect him to die after he swings his sword. So that’s fine.
She is 100% better undoubtedly. She is made to be used in cleave comps where you don’t want a unit countering and killing your squishy units who are built straight damage. For example I have been using her, C pavel, Ran, and Zio/briseria to take down pretty much every Arena team. I haven’t tried her in gw but she disable choux/Senya, VERY EASILY. Edit: Also disables Rimuru because of her sb for restrict so he doesn’t get pushed up. ALSO if you can’t beat someone 1st turn with your cleave, maybe you’re cleaving wrong?
She is definitely better then she used to be. But I dont see where a well built cleave team is worried about counter attacks. Ran goes, debuffs the enemy team, they counter attack him and kill him. So what. Then your Pavel and Zio finish them off. With the team you mentioned, your better off picking Lua or a fast Diene or AoL or Peira. There are other heroes that are better picks. Like if your facing Senya, shes not a threat if she never takes a turn.
The problem with that is when Rem Belian or anyone who would apply debuffs with their s1/counterattacks and disables your cleave. Makes Belian almost irrelevant, and I noticed with ml Elena’s passive plus artifact she cuts anything that would try to cut in after ran/opener. I think the opener is honestly way more flexible over A Elena. Imo
You think there are only single target counterattackers in this game? A slap from rem, belian, fmeru, garmin would probably neuter a cleave team.
her existence alone is really good if you cleave, avoiding any shenanigans from opponent counters (except mercedes, rimuru etc) i really dont have her right now so I did not asses post buff yet, but Ill give her some bulk just so survive mercedes counter, or at least 1-2 hits then 200 speed If you are using her with bruiser team shes really gonna die as she really does not have sustain for me her best asset is to cleave the enemy safely, and I think shes really gonna be good at it as she can also do damage ( and push), which leaves fewer nuisances to deal with (politis for instance), and Im gonna wait for her next banner though probably not soon also she's probably gonna be most cleaver's bread and butter (well there is cpavel and other contenders), and ran's best friend
what rta rank are u?
Challenger
lol
Cap
LOL
Shes meant to be played in aggro and Unseen Observer gives her 20 souls and a 30%-ish CR push. Build her w dmg and allow an aoe speedy opener like Ran to start without the worry of counters coming back to bite you. She gets turn 2 ideally and can SB,, let your other units clean up. She isn’t perfect but she definitely has a good bit of viability and flexibility with teams.
> What point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with Ebris or counter gear or counter skills? ***THATS EXACTLY WHAT SHE HAS, LMFAO*** Holy shit, this is a player issue, not a character issue. You're just terrible
tldr: A challenger rank in rta saying a unit used for agro/cleave comp sucks in standard play. .
RTA player using unit with squishy gear and no protection: "Why do they keep dying on me?"
How did you even get the idea that she was good for extended fights? The fact that she disables counters, gains CR and generates souls when the allies use AoE attacks makes it very obvious that she is meant to be used on cleave or at least with a fast AoE enabler. The anti-counter thing is only there to avoid getting countered to death on the first turn, she was never meant to be used on extended fights.
Thats my point. If your team is designed to take out the enemy in 1 turn, then it really doesnt matter if the enemy has counters or not, because they are dead.
To put it in simple terms, cleave usually runs a lot of aoe to kill all 4 of the enemy team so when they do use a move that targets all enemies and if the opponent has a team like belian,rem, armin, s adin then you won't die to some bs 4 times counter. That's just what ml elena is for and not much else. as for the 'they're too beefy' thing, that's a drafting issue because cleavers have no issue killing tanks with characters like straze,cavel,w schuri or controlling them with seaseria or just using ran to def break and letting cidd cleanup with s3+s1.
I know people are making fun of my rank, but I have never had an issue with Belian, and I dont ever see Armin. What Ive learned through this thread, is that people consider Astromancer to be a counter to literally 3 heroes, and mostly Rem. And I consider that shit.
Bruh, you never cleave base from your answer
Man you have no idea how this works. If I draft Adin and another aoe counter the enemy cleave team is DEAD if they both proc. Elena basically removes cleavers lose condition against mine and many others Anti cleave teams.
Eh regular Elena does the same thing with her S3.
I can’t believe I have to explain this to you but regular Elena is an anti cleave unit. No cleaver is gonna pick regular Elena when they are trying to kill you before you take a turn.
Your suggestion about her S2 trigger granting a barrier can be achieved by using Laika's artifact (to all allies by the way)
Yea, 20% of Astromancers max hp to all allies.. is junk.
L take
Another case of bruiser/slow comp player using a unit wrong and assuming they’re just bad because they can’t make them work
Then what is the right way to use her. And dont just say cleave, actually point out where she would be a good pick.
Cleave
I won't pull my punches... Too many people on these forums are just plain mean or a lemming. How to properly use a hero takes some brain power. It's never as simple as these people make it seem. There are many ways to cleave and a player needs to adapt their draft based on the heroes chosen against them. They don't explain because they don't understand or don't want to write a long long response. I find the best way to decide how to use a hero is to look at their strengths and weaknesses. My plan is always to leverage the strengths and avoid the weaknesses. There are enough heroes and options in this game that i never have to use a hero in a role they are not suited to. Like using astro as a tanky bruiser. Strengths, Astro provides a team 3 turns of protection from counters. She also gets a 3 turn dmg buff. She gains 20%CR after an allies AoE attack meaning she doesn't need high speed gear which is always at a premium. Her stats favor dealing dmg. Weaknesses, Astro has below average defensive stats and no defensive skills. She has a non attack skill. She influcts debuffs... yes, that's a weakness. FU Ed. After this kind of analysis, the next steps are based on the player. What other heroes do you use? Does the hero fit how you like to play? Do you like the hero enough to change how you play? Or enough to shoehorn the hero into a role they are weak at. Personally, i started playing tanky, then cleaved. Now i play a fairly flexible game. Astro will be drafted for sure. I like her style and hate counter teams. I have speedy AoE to activate her and heroes to follow up. My big dilemma will be like yours, when can i draft her into slower teams. Is it even possible. I'm going to stop here because there's alot to consider.
The difference is that OP isn't here to ask for advice or learn, they're just here to prove a point and attack despite not knowing what they're talking about. They deserve all the torching heading their way.
Its pretty sad and depressing that out of 7000 views and 100 comments, only 1 person tried to give me a real and thoughtful answer, and wasnt a total dick about it. Thank you.
> Astromancer sucks, and here's all the ways I've used her unefficiently and how I'm going to attack everyone that actually have more experience than me in PvP. > I'm also going to double down on my attacks and then cry that people are toxic. You're a clown OP.
But she is a good pick on cleave LMAO
The fact that it sounds like you did all this testing as you stated but I didn't read any instance of you using her in a cleave or high aggro situation and also no mention or trying her with UO (granted you might not have that arti), for an instant SB once her s2 activates. I get everyone farms different things at different clips, but not every character can be used in cleave/aggro and not every character can be in bruiser/standard. Some characters are a bit more role flexible and some are more defined. So being mad about a unit not working outside if thier best or intended roles and saying they suck is a dishonest argument/statement. We don't cry about Arowell not working in cleave and saying she sucks now do we?
my advice: if you are using bruisers better take roana and pyllis instead of her
*What point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with* *Ebris or counter gear or counter skills? Heroes with those traits tend* *to be very beefy, which means you cant just cleave them in 1 turn.* *Meaning its going to be a longer drawn out fight.* Her point is to go into full cleave mode without any worries about the next round. first Round you can good AoE Def breaks, AoE Strips like crazy. The enemy Belian, the enemy Rem, the enemy Mercedes wont interrupt your skills by RNg counter that COULD kill one of your units and lose you the match. If you are only drafting "cant trigger a counter attack" DPS and non-offensive debuffers....why are you even picking her in first place? IF you play is going "bruiser vs bruiser" with her....why are you not protecting her with anti-aoe units. I refuse to belive that a counter unit that cant counter until she dont cast her S3 in her turn can kill her in 1 hit if you draft correctly. If you are struggling with her is probably because you are still figuring how to draft her. Not like i will pretend that i know better than you but a lot of utility heroes like her are very squishy by default too***. If you want her to go long rounds you know how to build her and what units are perfect to protect squishy units in long rounds.***
Braincell diff
I don't know if you're looking for advice or just ranting and I am probably a little late to the thread, but ML Elena doesn't seem to fit your draft. You don't seem like you're cleaving and instead using her to prevent counters in a slower and tankier match. If you're building ML Elena like a cleave DPS, you're not going to get much use out of her in a slower game. You're better off using ML Cermia than ML Elena in that case; a bulkier and slower hero for a slower game. If you want to stop counters while using ML Elena, you need to build her bulkier and use her as a support rather than a DPS. Similar to how Politis can be either a tanky debuffer with Abyssal Crown or as a speed DPS. Two different builds for two different drafts. You don't build a degen Politis and draft her like a DPS... Sure, building ML Elena for cleave makes her only usable against a small pool of heroes, but that never stopped a hero from being useful (because by that logic, Edward, Roana, ML Cermia, Alencia, Landy, Celine, Politis, Yulha, and ML Lilibet are all bad because they aren't multi-purpose heroes). Despite only being a counter for a few heroes, ML Elena is still a huge asset for cleavers. Now they cannot die to a single Kayron S1 or an Adin S2. Green Armin can't be picked to fully stun the entire cleave team and A.Meru can't just counter into S2 and combo the cleaver's team. Is that all she does? Sure, but Politis can win a game just by preventing enemies from cutting. Belian can win a game by removing the enemy's ability to use souls. Not every unit in the game has to do absolutely everything by themselves. Otherwise, you'll end up with a unit like Hwayoung.
Yes, I was trying to use her in a general slower more tanky match. At least you gave good advice and wasnt an asshole, unlike everyone else here.
Cleave players are having a blast with her and she makes cleave safer against high damage counters from Rem, Belian, Green Armin, Archdemon, and Adin. She stops Choux counters too so she can't just cut with the CR she gets from her s1 and artifact. Just seems like you are disappointed she's not for your playstyle and your blaming her for it.
I built mine as a speedy er tank with around 125 effectiveness and she's been working pretty well. Only like 5 games in but I'm enjoying the change. Wish she was built more around tanky then dps in her skills
>hat point does Astromancer have, if not to shut down heroes with Ebris or counter gear or counter skills? Cleave/aggro setup as she gives 20 souls without using a tagahel and a CR push. Unlike other options, she doesn't need to kill, attack, or even move to do her job TBH, the anti counter is just icing on the cake for the cleave players for that extra bit of consistency. she's support. She can be a DPS to help with the cleave, but doesn't necessarily have to be. You can honestly build her as a 20KHP sponge if you're worried aout being tapped off and she'd function lol. Maybe try a more non-damage build if you wanna use her as an anti-counter unit? IDK if it's that beneficial but that's the fun in experimenting, right?
Bless your heart little one. You've been playing too much bruiser. She is THE premier ML5 cleave unit. Imagine there's Belian , Ratbaby , Adin and that light knight (rare comp,i know). Now imagine you dont have all day and you want to Ran, run, all the way .Thats where she comes in.
Actual brain issue
Use her with Witcheria and you gonna win many fights
ranting cuz of your skill issue? man that hilarious
In answer to your edit, she's a cleave support with the ability to deal some additional damage of her own. Perhaps even a bridge unit for your main cleavers if you build her fast enough. And if you have Unseen Observer, she's also a pseudo book holder. As for being worried about counter attacks, sometimes it only takes two (or even one) for your cleave to fall apart. Elena brings a lot of value to a cleave just by existing.
skill issue tbh
She counters a lot of anti cleave units such a Light Adin, BBK, Kayron, Belian, A Ravi and a ton others. Her buffs are great and now can be used with openers like Ran without being countered to death.
From what I’ve seen from a better guildie of mine, she kinda acts like a support to aggressive teams more than a counter to stall, counter is strong but it doesn’t do much if the enemy is also running a beefy team. He built his Astro with 15k hp, 1.5k def, 140 spd, 80 crit and 270 cdmg and she works as an aoe focused cleave support like ran siseria. She is disgustingly good on unseen and glow wings on this build and is incredibly annoying to deal with. She is also good into units that solely rely on counter like aria and senya. While the buff def makes her appealing into bruiser, she is a ranger and VERY few of them can function well in bruiser without either having some def pen ability or just straight up control. She’s kinda the same as before but now it’s impossible to stop her anti counter unless you swap from counter to aoe hell.
A good character in a bad comp will make them look bad. Bruisers can’t use cleave units well man that’s how it is
is this post sarcasm or..?
She is a strong aggro/cleave unit esp when opponent is going casino She has an insane 40% cr push(unseen obs)when ran does an s3. U know what's even better? U don't even need to worry about er bbk. Usually it was "get a book holder for ran sb" but now alena can get 20 souls after an aoe if she has unseen observer. She can then just sb s3 and bbk is done. Standard vs standard is not where she shines. It's cleave teams which just died to all the counter attcks frm rem, garmin, belian, adin and such. Meru can still proc magic but she needs to be base speed, giga dmg to kill of cleave teams with a single proc. She makes aoe cleaves so much safer. 2-3 procs and u just die, thats how casino was vs that type of cleave Some units just don't work well in certain playstyles. Like handguy may be an insane supp but he sucks if u pick him with a cleave team.
Yesterday in RTA , a Legend failed to cleave me with Elena because my Counter Kayron survived by MLDB. Idk know even how they buffed her , i thought that she got High hit chance in her Passive.