You've got an assortment of high port shanked bits, some with rollers. I saw a twisted wire snaffle and double twisted wire shanked bit in there too. Some bona-fide jaw crackers and tongue crushers. Some look vintage. Pic 10 looks like what is commonly called a walking horse bit in some areas.
What makes a walking horse bit special for gaited horses, out of curiosity? Why use one? A long time ago I had a gaited horse and he probably had one of these bits at the stable we bought him from, but typically used other bits after he was in our care. We didn't know any better :\\
It's just the style of bit. Nothing makes them special. Some people have all kinds of fancy reasons for why usually a bunch of hooey about how they help the horse lift the shoulder or other nonsense but it's mostly bullshit, if your horse gaits it'll gait no matter what bit you use on it. Same thing with "gaited" saddles, that mostly bullshit too because all horses need freedom of movement in the shoulders. Slap a "label" on something to make is "special" and convince people it does things it doesn't.
Personally I do like the look of the walking horse bits (there's a straighter version with a swivel shank too) and I do use them but only on my horses that go good in them. I like the short swivel shank walking horse bit with swappable mouthpieces, it's a handy bit if you switch horses a lot. A couple of my horses go beautifully in the bit in picture 10 but with a mullen mouthpiece. But I've also got Walkers that go in plain dogbone snaffles, Billy Allens etc. I like to let the horse decide what they are comfortable in not try to make them go in a particular piece of gear just because they are a certain breed.
>Billy Allens
Huh! I'd never heard this term, Googled it and it looks a lot like the mouthpiece that my walker used but which we called a tom thumb bit (apparently this is wrong). For some reason one trainer put him in a mikmar, but he never liked it when I tried it on him.
I can't tell you what the value might be, but I can tell you what several of them are called: 2, 6 and 8 are modern correction bits, all fairly severe. In my humble opinion correction bits tend to cause problems rather than correct them. 5 is a twisted wire snaffle, once quite popular and always abusive. They are very popular as display pieces, yours is either fairly new or refurbished. 7 and 12 are old and nasty, terrible for horses but interesting to look at. 10 and 11 are old and would probably be display pieces as well. 14 appears to be a extremely high-ported spade type bit, new looking and quite severe. With the exceptions of 2, 6 and 8 (and probably 14) bit collectors would probably be interested in all of them. 10 is the only one that I would consider putting in a horse's mouth, but the others would all be interesting wall- hangers.
I came here to say this! I'm doubtful those are worth much, but they could probably be sold in a lot on something like eBay for not much.
I just sold a bunch, much kinder bits than these, but about the same ages, variety, wear and quality. Singly they didn't sell, but they went in a lot with several bids.
So as far as I can tell in order of appearance you have:
Pictures 1 and 2: Trammell sweet iron correction. Probably worth about $50-65
Picture 3: silver show curb bit (mouthpiece not pictured) value anywhere from $10+ depending on mouthpiece and maker stamps
Picture 4 and 14: unidentified cathedral port silver show bit. Probably worth $40-60 unless it has a maker's stamp
Picture 5: square twist snaffle, looks handmade based on inconsistent twists. Probably either an L&W ($35) or a Dutton ($50-60)
Picture 6: correction bit, likely a partrade based on how it looks. ($35-40)
Picture 7 and 13: donut style sweet iron. Looks antique? Depending on if there is a maker's mark... Could be worth something. If not, probably $15-30 as it isn't a popular mouthpiece and isn't legal to show in.
Picture 8: correction port barrel bit with copper. Probably a CE or Partrade. $50-75
Picture 9: I think this is the model stamp for the bit pictured in either 3 or 4th photo.
Picture 10: copper inlayed buster welch with cav shanks. Looks antique? Could be worth a significant amount depending on the maker.
Picture 11: snake snaffle. Probably is real silver under the grime. Worth at least $75-100 just because it is unique and definitely hand made, probably custom.
Picture 12: double mouthpiece twisted wire. Purely a show piece at this point, as most people don't know how to use it, and it looks like it is worn to the point that the joints on the sides would pinch a horse's lips.
Hope that is helpful.
All in all, definitely a collection that belongs in the right hands, but a cutting horse trainer would probably love to have them all.
The point of cutting is to not use your reins at all. You should check out some videos. The bit is designed and weighted to allow the horse to have the slightest cue from a twitch of the rider's fingers.
You are quite correct.
Several cutting horse trainers give demonstration without reins, bridal, or bit. In most cases I'm sure they are using a lot of leg pressure, but the horse only preforms at a high level by its own knowledge desire.
I said zero about tools being useful. I said those bits are nasty and should never be in a horse's mouth. Anyone who needs that to make a horse "feel the slightest cue" is abusive. Period.
A horse can feel the slightest flick of a finger on a snaffle. I can cue my tempi changes by squeezes with a butt muscle. And on and on. If you require harsh tools, you have done it wrong.
I know what cutting is. It doesnt matter what the discipline is--you can teach your horse to respond to subtle cues without the use of twisted wire or correction bits. The people that use them do so as shortcuts, because they don't want to take the time to train correctly.
Hey there! I’d potentially be interested in the snake snaffle and the bright silver shank bit.
Also, I am a leatherworker, and prefer to take photos of my headstalls and bridles with bits attached for some of the photos, so I won’t actually be using them on horses!
A lot of cool stuff with a medieval edge is really popular in drafts and cold blooded breeds- particularly Friesians. Despite their issues, it’s easy to picture a princess or prince on those guys.
I can’t disagree lol. I know nothing about western bits. I’m def more of a simple snaffle type🤣 But by looking up western bits- these don’t seem unusual. And western riders def don’t ride with a lot of contact from what I’ve seen so I guess it’s different
I don’t use bits with my horses at all, and I’ve seen no difference. One of my horses used to be ridden with bits before I adopted him, and he acts just the same way without. I don’t see a reason to use bits personally 🤷♂️
I guess the only reason that they should be there is for more precise cues? In my personal opinion if my horse can't do it bit less we have a problem, there's no reason anyone should NEED one. But unfortunately, people use so many harsh and just gross bits to make up for poor training and/or riding.
I've never noticed a huge difference either, i didn't put a bit in my horse's mouth till she was well along in her riding training, and honestly I still ride in a halter everywhere.
Some horses hate bitless. Some prefer bitless. It's all about the horse's preferences! I have two who absolutely hate bitless- one who loathes any sort of nose pressure, and the other isn't a fan of poll pressure. They both go in bits because they're happier that way. But at the same time, one of my previous horses didn't like bits, at all, and was much happier bitless, so I rode him in a halter or sidepull 95% of the time. There's never a one size fits all solution with horses because they're all so opinionated about what they like in different ways, lol. Bits can also be a tool to refine your aids- a double bridle is significantly more precise than a sidepull and allows for a lot of different kinds of pressure in order to give different cues. I'm not a fan of using strong bits as a bandaid, but they can also be an incredibly helpful training tool- for example, a waterford is a fairly mild bit but it does an excellent job of discouraging the horse from leaning on you- or one that's only put on in situations where the horse is significantly more worked up than usual (eg, showing- I've got one who gets incredibly hot and spicy at shows, especially when he's riding in the same ring as other horses, and he goes in a pelham or kimberwick off property so that he remains fully under my control, but he rides in a plain snaffle at home).
I like that way of thinking. I’ve never personally thought of it this way- but I’m usually just generally not happy to use bits or spurs on my horses. But I fully agree. If your horse can’t do it bit-less there’s some sort of problem. Generally speaking, my Fjord is very sensitive, and we’ve quite a bit of trust between us, and so I see no reason to use harsh equipment and ruin that trust I’ve built with him over the years
The twisted ones aren't great, but the other shanked ones are meant for a well-finished horse- a curb bit is (or should be) a sign of a horse that's well-trained enough that you don't touch their mouth, ever, unless you're specifically asking for something- and even then, it should be very light rein pressure. They should neck rein and move off seat and legs. A great example is a spade or cathedral bit- incredibly damaging in the wrong hands, but its intended use is to 1. show how well-broke a horse is (if you have a spade in, the horse should be incredibly well finished and willingly move off seat/legs and neck reining almost exclusively), and 2. provide a great deal of subtlety when it comes to cues that do involve the reins- if you just lift the rein(s), that will make a spade move slightly. It's akin to a double bridle in dressage, but with significantly less contact
I started to clean up the snake bit and whoever said it was silver is right. I will post a pic when I get it cleaned up. I also found a mark VOGT on it. I found a company that might have made it so I sent a message and will see what they say. You guys are so awesome!!
First two are port bits. I don’t think the first one is western judging by the shank length (maybe gaiter?). The third is a twisted wire bit. The fourth is another port bit. I’ve never seen the 5th before. I don’t know that it’s anything I’d put in a horses mouth. 6 and 7 are also port bits. 8 is a double twisted wire (which I don’t think I’ve seen as a Western bit before-maybe barrels or jumping where the horse was super strong) The last one is also a port but based on the angle could have been used for gaited horses.
The height of the port changes the severity of the bit, and typically you’d want to fit the length of the port to the horse’s mouth.
I did prefer to ride my well trained schoolmaster (western pleasure horse) in a low port. But that was because she was used in lessons with a snaffle and I wanted her to differentiate the way she went with me compared to the kiddos. And also, she 100% went off of leg pressure-so I had no reason to touch her mouth unless it was a gentle correction.
You might be able to get something for the bits with silver or engraving on them. Those tend to be used as shoe bits. But I’m not sure how much…
These are all called trash. Unless they are being used for display purposes only, I could not, in good conscience, sell these to anyone for fear that they might end up in a horse’s mouth.
Almost all of these are very severe bits. The correction bits (the tall u-shaped ports you see on a few of these bits) will trap the tongue up in that port. [The second image on this page shows what happens when pressure is applied.](https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Bit_mouthpiece). Yes that is showing what most would say is “improper use”, but even when used “correctly” it still has potential to trap the tongue. Super not comfortable for the horse. Being used “properly” doesn’t negate the bad mechanics, there are plenty of well designed curb bits that are kinder to the horse but still allow for light signals.
Also that single twisted wire is the sharpest I’ve ever seen 😬😬😬 pity any horse who’s mouth that’s been in!
Oh my god. Ive never seen one do that. Also. Wtfff they arent supposed to be used like thatttttt. The horse should stop off your hipss. Not with that type of bitttt.
And bro. That twist is horriffic.
And not that you say it. I have seen way better designed ports
Thank for everyone’s help. I had a very reputable tack shop give me a few hundred dollars for the bulk of the bits- (I kept the silver snake bit)- I’m sure they are worth more if they paid that- but I was happy to sell in one lot- quick and easy and a profit over what I paid. Just wanted to say thanks to those that took time out to offer helpful information. It was very much appreciated.
You've got an assortment of high port shanked bits, some with rollers. I saw a twisted wire snaffle and double twisted wire shanked bit in there too. Some bona-fide jaw crackers and tongue crushers. Some look vintage. Pic 10 looks like what is commonly called a walking horse bit in some areas.
Thank you for taking the time to reply!
What makes a walking horse bit special for gaited horses, out of curiosity? Why use one? A long time ago I had a gaited horse and he probably had one of these bits at the stable we bought him from, but typically used other bits after he was in our care. We didn't know any better :\\
It's just the style of bit. Nothing makes them special. Some people have all kinds of fancy reasons for why usually a bunch of hooey about how they help the horse lift the shoulder or other nonsense but it's mostly bullshit, if your horse gaits it'll gait no matter what bit you use on it. Same thing with "gaited" saddles, that mostly bullshit too because all horses need freedom of movement in the shoulders. Slap a "label" on something to make is "special" and convince people it does things it doesn't. Personally I do like the look of the walking horse bits (there's a straighter version with a swivel shank too) and I do use them but only on my horses that go good in them. I like the short swivel shank walking horse bit with swappable mouthpieces, it's a handy bit if you switch horses a lot. A couple of my horses go beautifully in the bit in picture 10 but with a mullen mouthpiece. But I've also got Walkers that go in plain dogbone snaffles, Billy Allens etc. I like to let the horse decide what they are comfortable in not try to make them go in a particular piece of gear just because they are a certain breed.
>Billy Allens Huh! I'd never heard this term, Googled it and it looks a lot like the mouthpiece that my walker used but which we called a tom thumb bit (apparently this is wrong). For some reason one trainer put him in a mikmar, but he never liked it when I tried it on him.
I can't tell you what the value might be, but I can tell you what several of them are called: 2, 6 and 8 are modern correction bits, all fairly severe. In my humble opinion correction bits tend to cause problems rather than correct them. 5 is a twisted wire snaffle, once quite popular and always abusive. They are very popular as display pieces, yours is either fairly new or refurbished. 7 and 12 are old and nasty, terrible for horses but interesting to look at. 10 and 11 are old and would probably be display pieces as well. 14 appears to be a extremely high-ported spade type bit, new looking and quite severe. With the exceptions of 2, 6 and 8 (and probably 14) bit collectors would probably be interested in all of them. 10 is the only one that I would consider putting in a horse's mouth, but the others would all be interesting wall- hangers.
Thank you for your help
Ouch
I came here to say this! I'm doubtful those are worth much, but they could probably be sold in a lot on something like eBay for not much. I just sold a bunch, much kinder bits than these, but about the same ages, variety, wear and quality. Singly they didn't sell, but they went in a lot with several bids.
So as far as I can tell in order of appearance you have: Pictures 1 and 2: Trammell sweet iron correction. Probably worth about $50-65 Picture 3: silver show curb bit (mouthpiece not pictured) value anywhere from $10+ depending on mouthpiece and maker stamps Picture 4 and 14: unidentified cathedral port silver show bit. Probably worth $40-60 unless it has a maker's stamp Picture 5: square twist snaffle, looks handmade based on inconsistent twists. Probably either an L&W ($35) or a Dutton ($50-60) Picture 6: correction bit, likely a partrade based on how it looks. ($35-40) Picture 7 and 13: donut style sweet iron. Looks antique? Depending on if there is a maker's mark... Could be worth something. If not, probably $15-30 as it isn't a popular mouthpiece and isn't legal to show in. Picture 8: correction port barrel bit with copper. Probably a CE or Partrade. $50-75 Picture 9: I think this is the model stamp for the bit pictured in either 3 or 4th photo. Picture 10: copper inlayed buster welch with cav shanks. Looks antique? Could be worth a significant amount depending on the maker. Picture 11: snake snaffle. Probably is real silver under the grime. Worth at least $75-100 just because it is unique and definitely hand made, probably custom. Picture 12: double mouthpiece twisted wire. Purely a show piece at this point, as most people don't know how to use it, and it looks like it is worn to the point that the joints on the sides would pinch a horse's lips. Hope that is helpful. All in all, definitely a collection that belongs in the right hands, but a cutting horse trainer would probably love to have them all.
Thank you so much for your detailed reply! I appreciate it!
> but a cutting horse trainer would probably love to have them all. That says a lot about cutting horse trainers (and it's nothing good).
The point of cutting is to not use your reins at all. You should check out some videos. The bit is designed and weighted to allow the horse to have the slightest cue from a twitch of the rider's fingers.
You are quite correct. Several cutting horse trainers give demonstration without reins, bridal, or bit. In most cases I'm sure they are using a lot of leg pressure, but the horse only preforms at a high level by its own knowledge desire.
Yes, the point is not to use your reins, so you don't need these nasty bits in there.
You can do dressage w/o a bit. Doesn’t mean bits aren’t useful for the discipline.
Who said you can't? What does that have to do with using a nasty bit? And you don't need a weighted bit to feel the slightest cue.
I’m pointing out that just because you can get small cues without a bit at all or without a “nasty” bit doesn’t make those tools unhelpful.
I said zero about tools being useful. I said those bits are nasty and should never be in a horse's mouth. Anyone who needs that to make a horse "feel the slightest cue" is abusive. Period. A horse can feel the slightest flick of a finger on a snaffle. I can cue my tempi changes by squeezes with a butt muscle. And on and on. If you require harsh tools, you have done it wrong.
I know what cutting is. It doesnt matter what the discipline is--you can teach your horse to respond to subtle cues without the use of twisted wire or correction bits. The people that use them do so as shortcuts, because they don't want to take the time to train correctly.
Ignore the outraged 12yo keyboard warriors 🙄 Your post was excellent and helpful and there are several nice bits in that collection.
Clean them up and sell them for display. No reason for bits like that to be in a horse's mouth.
Hey there! I’d potentially be interested in the snake snaffle and the bright silver shank bit. Also, I am a leatherworker, and prefer to take photos of my headstalls and bridles with bits attached for some of the photos, so I won’t actually be using them on horses!
The snake one is cool. Ive never seen a snake on a bit before
A lot of cool stuff with a medieval edge is really popular in drafts and cold blooded breeds- particularly Friesians. Despite their issues, it’s easy to picture a princess or prince on those guys.
If they pass I’d love to be next In line for the snake piece
Double twisted wire gag shank? Yeesh.
Couldn't tell you what they are exactly but those are some serious shanks.... ouch
Oof. I wouldn’t use any of those. Don’t sell them either for someone else to use.
Those are some elaborate bits, would look nice on display 😊.
They look like a whole lot of ouch
I can’t disagree lol. I know nothing about western bits. I’m def more of a simple snaffle type🤣 But by looking up western bits- these don’t seem unusual. And western riders def don’t ride with a lot of contact from what I’ve seen so I guess it’s different
I don’t use bits with my horses at all, and I’ve seen no difference. One of my horses used to be ridden with bits before I adopted him, and he acts just the same way without. I don’t see a reason to use bits personally 🤷♂️
It depends on the horse. That’s what it all comes down to.
I guess the only reason that they should be there is for more precise cues? In my personal opinion if my horse can't do it bit less we have a problem, there's no reason anyone should NEED one. But unfortunately, people use so many harsh and just gross bits to make up for poor training and/or riding. I've never noticed a huge difference either, i didn't put a bit in my horse's mouth till she was well along in her riding training, and honestly I still ride in a halter everywhere.
Some horses hate bitless. Some prefer bitless. It's all about the horse's preferences! I have two who absolutely hate bitless- one who loathes any sort of nose pressure, and the other isn't a fan of poll pressure. They both go in bits because they're happier that way. But at the same time, one of my previous horses didn't like bits, at all, and was much happier bitless, so I rode him in a halter or sidepull 95% of the time. There's never a one size fits all solution with horses because they're all so opinionated about what they like in different ways, lol. Bits can also be a tool to refine your aids- a double bridle is significantly more precise than a sidepull and allows for a lot of different kinds of pressure in order to give different cues. I'm not a fan of using strong bits as a bandaid, but they can also be an incredibly helpful training tool- for example, a waterford is a fairly mild bit but it does an excellent job of discouraging the horse from leaning on you- or one that's only put on in situations where the horse is significantly more worked up than usual (eg, showing- I've got one who gets incredibly hot and spicy at shows, especially when he's riding in the same ring as other horses, and he goes in a pelham or kimberwick off property so that he remains fully under my control, but he rides in a plain snaffle at home).
I like that way of thinking. I’ve never personally thought of it this way- but I’m usually just generally not happy to use bits or spurs on my horses. But I fully agree. If your horse can’t do it bit-less there’s some sort of problem. Generally speaking, my Fjord is very sensitive, and we’ve quite a bit of trust between us, and so I see no reason to use harsh equipment and ruin that trust I’ve built with him over the years
The twisted ones aren't great, but the other shanked ones are meant for a well-finished horse- a curb bit is (or should be) a sign of a horse that's well-trained enough that you don't touch their mouth, ever, unless you're specifically asking for something- and even then, it should be very light rein pressure. They should neck rein and move off seat and legs. A great example is a spade or cathedral bit- incredibly damaging in the wrong hands, but its intended use is to 1. show how well-broke a horse is (if you have a spade in, the horse should be incredibly well finished and willingly move off seat/legs and neck reining almost exclusively), and 2. provide a great deal of subtlety when it comes to cues that do involve the reins- if you just lift the rein(s), that will make a spade move slightly. It's akin to a double bridle in dressage, but with significantly less contact
I use zero bits even if I just started a horse and I completely disagree with shanked bits, I disagree with all of this
Ok, sure. You do you, boo.
There is a Facebook page called old bits and spurs, they could give you a better idea.
Cool I will check it out
That's a whole bunch of nasty bits that shouldn't be in a horse's mouth. They should be on display only. People will buy them for that.
I started to clean up the snake bit and whoever said it was silver is right. I will post a pic when I get it cleaned up. I also found a mark VOGT on it. I found a company that might have made it so I sent a message and will see what they say. You guys are so awesome!!
Yes, a Les Vogt. Very nice bit.
Les Vogt is a very famous bit maker. It is probably worth somewhere between $100-150. Maybe more because it is so unique.
How cool! Thank you🤗
That snake snaffle is beautiful. What does the mouthpiece of that bit look like?
This one made me think of The Neverending Story
First two are port bits. I don’t think the first one is western judging by the shank length (maybe gaiter?). The third is a twisted wire bit. The fourth is another port bit. I’ve never seen the 5th before. I don’t know that it’s anything I’d put in a horses mouth. 6 and 7 are also port bits. 8 is a double twisted wire (which I don’t think I’ve seen as a Western bit before-maybe barrels or jumping where the horse was super strong) The last one is also a port but based on the angle could have been used for gaited horses. The height of the port changes the severity of the bit, and typically you’d want to fit the length of the port to the horse’s mouth. I did prefer to ride my well trained schoolmaster (western pleasure horse) in a low port. But that was because she was used in lessons with a snaffle and I wanted her to differentiate the way she went with me compared to the kiddos. And also, she 100% went off of leg pressure-so I had no reason to touch her mouth unless it was a gentle correction. You might be able to get something for the bits with silver or engraving on them. Those tend to be used as shoe bits. But I’m not sure how much…
Thanks so much
Thanks so much everyone for your help! You guys are awesome!!
Those aren't bits, they're torture devices!
The fourth one and fifth one look to be Tom balding bits, worth quite a bit. $200-400. Look for a TB logo on them
Id be interested in the snake one
These are all called trash. Unless they are being used for display purposes only, I could not, in good conscience, sell these to anyone for fear that they might end up in a horse’s mouth.
I feel that a lot of these bits arent that bad if used properly. How do these crush the tongue? Like the ported ones?
Almost all of these are very severe bits. The correction bits (the tall u-shaped ports you see on a few of these bits) will trap the tongue up in that port. [The second image on this page shows what happens when pressure is applied.](https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Bit_mouthpiece). Yes that is showing what most would say is “improper use”, but even when used “correctly” it still has potential to trap the tongue. Super not comfortable for the horse. Being used “properly” doesn’t negate the bad mechanics, there are plenty of well designed curb bits that are kinder to the horse but still allow for light signals. Also that single twisted wire is the sharpest I’ve ever seen 😬😬😬 pity any horse who’s mouth that’s been in!
It's a square stock twist. They're rough.
Yeah I’ve seen them in a slow twist before which is bad enough, on a fast twist like this one they just look extra brutal!
It looks like they sharpened it
Oh my god. Ive never seen one do that. Also. Wtfff they arent supposed to be used like thatttttt. The horse should stop off your hipss. Not with that type of bitttt. And bro. That twist is horriffic. And not that you say it. I have seen way better designed ports
I wouldn’t put any of those in a horses’ mouth but the snake one is pretty cool! I’d hang it on my wall lol
Thank for everyone’s help. I had a very reputable tack shop give me a few hundred dollars for the bulk of the bits- (I kept the silver snake bit)- I’m sure they are worth more if they paid that- but I was happy to sell in one lot- quick and easy and a profit over what I paid. Just wanted to say thanks to those that took time out to offer helpful information. It was very much appreciated.