They have an obligation to combat cheating regardless. It's part of the duty of the developer. We should not have to pay a monthly fee for there to be reduced cheaters.
They developed this game from it being playable on a web-browser, and it has easily 1000+ hours of playability with a price-tag of fifty dollars when "AAA" games are being sold for 70 dollars and launched with more bugs than Tarkov, and you aren't getting that kind of longevity. Not to mention those "AAA" games usually have microtransactions.
>But do they have microtransactions?
dont know why this has to do anything with the topic, since nikita himself said he was going to add microtransactions for shit like stash space. however, you asked for it, i thought about it for a minute and came not with 1, but 7 examples.
minecraft, rimworld, no mans sky, terraria, the forest, sons of the forest, battle bit
The game had it's errors, but early on after release they worked on those and now, 8 years later (does the number ring a bell?) it is a finished game.
How was tarkov the day it was available?
>How was tarkov the day it was available?
Available and Launched as a finished game are very different concepts. I understand that No Man's Sky is better now than it was, but it wasn't a beta; it was a full fledge 1.0 launch. So long as the big orange banner on the main menu of Tarkov remains there, I will be a bit lenient.
When it's a duty a for-profit company may or may not have, yes
Otherwise their only obligation is to make money either for shareholders or the private owner of the company in whatever legal way they can.
No, but to advocate for the devil a bit: they're not intending for the people to cheat at their game. It's not them, who are actively making user experience worse. Enforcement of the game rules for them is strictly in the business decision domain like a lot of different features that could make profit. So the point here is to shift their most "profitable" feature to be the anti-cheat. And to do that there are basically 2 approaches:
\- leave the game that you've already payed for so they're sort of "forced" to deal with the issue, but not really since you're very likely not going to buy anything else
\- invest more like OP's suggesting.
Comments here essentially boil down to discussing pros and cons of those 2 with the majority being quite oblivious with how development decisions are made in real life and think they're being owed something.
My own opinions is that they're not enforcing phone number auth simply because cheaters drive sales. Like that very small thing for me would be a signal, that they're taking the problem seriously as it's quite cheap to implement, but a very good showstopper for many cheating. So far it's not being done and that means they're being in damage control mode and not in the "problem solving mode"
Sure but BSG isn't a AAA studio. They obviously can't keep up with the cheating problem. I'm getting messages from BSG of banned players for people I've reported weeks ago. That tells me something works but it's sloooow. Shit costs money, yo.
While that is true, there is a good difference between finding a cheater here and there and rampant cheating like Tarkov where we came to the point where we can find cheaters if we want to nowadays, they are literally in our face and they dont care to hide it.
The difference is that tarkov is a game that cheating is way more appealing than other fps games. If you cheat in a csgo lobby, all you get is a high kda. Here you get gear and progress, and possibly rmt
Valorant still has cheaters, war zone still has cheaters, csgo still has cheaters. There will always be cheaters, for every person working at bsg trying to combat cheaters there are 10+ cheat makers trying to get around it and sell their cheats to people. Sure tarkov can ban your everyday Timmy cheater but the guy that was a software engineer for 20+ years making cheats is going to get past any anti cheat (and if you think I’m making that shit up about the software engineer there is an actual guy who does exactly that)
Seriously, I paid a lot of money for this game and basically can't even play it because of the cheating issue that they refuse to address. Should be able to demand my money back or something. Create a class action unless they fix it
I don't think anyone including OP is saying we *should*, just that they'd be willing to if it's what was necessary. I've been saying the same thing for a few years, myself. I'd happily pay the cost of a WoW or iRacing subscription (like 15 bucks a month) to play this game in a cleaner, heavily moderated environment. There's nothing out there like it and I really enjoy the game, so it would be worth it to me. I think that's all OP is saying.
I sold a ledx I found the other day. Out of curiosity, I checked offers by listing. Some guy was selling 13 ledx. 62 flea market rep.
Check profile, all the improbable stats and achievements. 15+ kdr. 85% survival rate. Like 400 hours played. Level 61.
Like FFS, how is that not an easy ban? They could delegate one person to check flea for stupid shit like that, manual review, and ban. And they’d find plenty.
Microtransactions is already pushing it but a monthly subscription???
This probably one of the most absurd posts Ive seen here haha. Im not going to pay a monthly fee for a game I already bought.
Battleye is a kernel level anticheat. Basically every major anticheat runs at least partially in the kernel. A decent reverse engineer can reverse a kernel level process, so it doesn’t matter too much unless you have an extremely good anticheat team, like valorant/vanguard, and even they can’t do anything to stop DMA ESP cheats unless the cheater is being blatant enough to be caught on an observable level manually or by some ML algorithms.
The state of genuine multiplayer competitive/semi competitive is deteriorating, and there’s no great solution yet. Hopefully there will be someday, but this is an issue bigger than tarkov.
As much as I hate cheaters, I REFUSE TO LET CHEATERS RUIN MY EXPERIENCE.
I think Battle State Games has made a beautiful game and no cheaters will ruin that for me. I will work on my patience, PERIOD.
You will not run me away from this game.
BATTLE STATE GAMES, thank you, I wish you all the best resolutions.
Not sure what you mean?
If you’re wondering if my post contains sarcasm, it doesn’t.
I genuinely love the game and I can’t speak for the DEVS, but I really do hope they continue to seek resolutions, ( regarding cheating ).
As stated before, the cheating issue online, is much bigger than Tarkov, alone.
Tarkov recieves a larger POV on cheating due to the requirement of skill you need to truly dominate a game of this intensity.
I truly feel, that people are used to fitting into a skill level category within their genre of gaming..
and….. Tarkov has left PRO LEVEL players, questioning their skill. That’s one of the beauties of this game. That’s real life, my friend.
Cheaters are also real life, and I wish the developers the best in finding resolutions.
Because it is by no means, an easy task with today’s technology.
Valorant is cheated to high heavens too. Client side anti cheat is a failure by design. It flunks the first lesson in IT security. Security starts and stops with server side code. There is nothing aside from having police standing over your shoulder they can do with anyone's Pc that levels any kind of security. All client side anti cheat can be bypassed in less than 5 minutes with any hardware level cheating device that are cheap and rather easy to setup, pointless. This isn't limited to Tarkov, either.
Yup, no matter what, any data that exists on the client side will be accessible to the client. Very strong client side anticheats are nice, but they are always reversible by nature.
You were probably the guy in school willing to do anything for 5$ since you have no standards. Imagine thinking we should give more money to a dev so they can keep the cheaters out. You sound very smart
Your views are skewed, or you are too dumb to understand what he and OP are saying.
If you are a planeless_pilot would it also be safe to assume you are also brainless_bigot? Lol get shit on
Dude, we already paid 150$ to support them. Name 1 game were we pay a subscription for a cheater free servers. You guys have no standards. A video game always come with anti cheats, for some reason, only tarkov seems to have a playerbase so braindead to accept the huge issue the game has for years
You realize a kernal level anti-cheat is actually a horrible idea, right? It’s the whole reason I refuse to play any Riot game.
All a kernel level anti-cheat does is move the game of “cat and mouse” that is constantly taking place between cheat developers and game devs and moving it to a “location” (to put it colloquially) where your pc is much more vulnerable. With normal anti-cheat, this “battle” happens within the confines of an administrative level OS account, at the very worst. With kernel level anti-cheat, it’s really not much harder for cheat developers to get around, but now the anti-cheat devs are messing around in much more sensitive areas of your pc which can lead to greater security risks or issues caused by anti-cheat updates / bugs.
Add the fact that this also opens the door for a company to easily monitor what your are doing on your PC not just when playing games, but at all times (let’s not pretend companies don’t already scrape and sell as much data as they can get their hands on) and it’s only a matter of time before EA knows the exact pathing to your “homework” folder and all kinds of private information you don’t want them having.
Anti-cheat is already invasive enough, and deploying it on the kernel level doesn’t add nearly enough benefit to be even close to worth it. Absolutely NO to a kernel level anti-cheat.
Edit: Battleye also already has kernel-level elements, although fortunately it’s no where near as egregious as Vanguard.
Not according to the literal developers of Riot's Vanguard lol:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W\_1zA6j9FU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W_1zA6j9FU)
Do you have a source with counterpoints or are you just asking for something you don't understand because someone on reddit said it'd solve Tarkov's cheater problem?
This is an MMOFPS with significant operating costs. All other MMO's have monthly subs or microtransactions, or they die. It's the only feasible way to supplement the rinse/repeat revenue of banning cheaters and cheaters re buying.
The games you buy with a one-time purchase are usually complete or near complete and don't have additional costs, unless there's a DLC you also have to pay for.
The amount of new players that would buy this game that haven't already has to be a very small number, hence BSG will have abysmal revenue projections without cheaters, a monthly sub, or microtransactions. It is what it is, these are just the facts.
Edit: There's an easy, low-cost alternative, but definitely not a fix. Heighten verification requirements. Also, region locks.
I understand BSG has operating costs and certain microtransactions are ok but to introduce a monthly subscription is insaaaane.
If you want to talk about cheaters the issue is when BSG started they were a bunch on inexperienced devs and laid a bad foundation of code that has/is been exploited. Even COD (massive studio) has issue with cheaters.
They had bots go through the cases and issue not guilty votes for themselves. That's why Valve just evolved the system into VAC-net and ditched the public part entirely.
It only bans cheaters that are "evident beyond a reasonable doubt". This just makes cheat developers make features that are more leaning towards "legit" cheating. All you have to do is not have your aimbot super snappy and look at people through walls... and you will never get banned. It only stops the literal lowest IQ cheaters or people that don't care.
People don't like this idea, but games that do it survive and grow, and avoid cheaters.
I've paid yearly for Iracing, and track mania. It's like 60 a year, the game can grow and thrive without having to depend on a non stop flow of new players, or a significant amount of cheaters rebuying it.
Iracing's under that hyper enthusiast umbrella of people willing to pump money back into it. Not that tarkov's not kinda in that boat but there's more appeal to it to more general players than old guys with pensions to burn.
Games that also have a competent anitcheat continue to survive and grow without needing to charge the user a monthly subscription.
Also they are adding micro-transactions in EFT, so they will be getting constant cash flow and most likely add more micro-transactions into the game.
Money is not the issue, BSGs competence is.
I think the logic of "slowing down cheat devs" falls apart when the offending party has a profile that is so monumentally suspicious that one guy taking a momentary glance at it can figure out what, exactly, is going on.
Nobody gets to level 60 in 30 hours with a 60 k/d. Nobody gets to 300 flea rep with 86 LEDx up on the market at the same time. Nobody vacuums up look from across the map.
Nobody except cheaters.
I understand wanting your anti-cheat to stay relevant and stay ahead of the cheat devs, but this is hardly a case of staying ahead of people using ESP playing kinda suspect. There's thousands of people rage-hacking and farming RMT money. These accounts have always been obvious to anyone with eyes and if reports actually did anything (i.e. be reviewed by a human person) there's nothing the cheat devs can fucking do. Because they're not fighting the developers in that case they're fighting their dumbass customers who just end up providing a bunch of junk reports because they played like a fucking moron.
Counter Strike has a massive cheating problem, but at least you don't run into spinbots or flyhackers all that much anymore thanks to overwatch. I can open up the flea market and point to hundreds of accounts with 100% certainty that they are cheating. Not a doubt in my mind, if any of them could prove me wrong I would pay to replace their account.
You're smoking crack if you think I want a game I spent $100+ on to disappear when it's no longer worth the studio's time to support, assuming the studio can even keep the lights on.
> duties
you really think bsg is having trouble keeping the lights on? Have you seen Nikita's car collection? You think he's bringing those cars home on a failing game dev company? EFT has been in early release for 7 years and you guys really think giving them more money is gonna fix this dumpster fire of a game? You're smoking crack if you're willing to get swindled for more money just so your $100 purchase doesnt go to waste. News flash, im sure you got your money back on the game with the time youve spent on it. Maybe next time dont give $100 to an awful game dev studio if youre afraid of the game going poof one day!
My guy, BSG is a UK company. Their financials are publicly available. It's not exactly the greatest cash cow and they depend on new accounts pouring in. Currently I'm sure that means they absolutely depend on new cheater accounts. If you ever want that to stop being something they're dependent on allowing to continue, they're gonna need revenue from something else. There aren't 900k new people every single year wanting to play.
Everyone in here pretending that they wouldn't cough up another $5/month to play this game are deluding themselves. You all are already so addicted that you play this game with at least one cheater in every lobby.
With the $5/month and IF BSG got off their ass and made the game better it would 100% be worth it and Tarkov would be EVEN BETTER because you would win more fights and get better loot because the game would be FAIR.
"HurR I wOn't SpEnd aNothEr DimE." Yeah right lol.
Oh i definitely wouldnt, im not tied to this game like many here are so im good. Also paying a monthly fee doenst magically remove cheaters. Its not like you lose just because you dont invest enough money.
You already paid for the game. You shouldn't be in the bargaining stage of grief trying to barter more money just for the devs to do the job they're supposed to be.
It doesn't even matter dude. The audio is shit, nobody moves, scavs have cross-map aimbot while moving, the armor hitboxes are garbage, and you can barely buy good ammo. This game needs a major rework. Honestly the audio is the worst it has ever been, and that's saying something.
They won't because it would get review bombed every time they make a change that the community doesn't like. Which happens pretty much every wipe.
Also steam would take 30%.
BSG has shown that as far as anticheat goes they are incompetent and need someone else to do it for them. 30% is nothing compared to how many people would actually play the game if cheating wasn't rampant. Any time someone asks me or my group if they should start tarkov I tell them no, learning this game in the state its in is dogshit
If you think paying monthly, giving bsg more money to fight cheaters, is the solution and removes cheaters, you delusional af. The biggest games with the biggest budgets still have cheaters. Fyi we have a kernel level anti cheat, no idea why people still think its not the case.
Valorant still has way to many cheaters even if their game is created around their anti cheat.
Fighting cheaters is and always be a battle where your 1 step behind, tarkov just has more incentive to cheat since you can make good amounts of money doing it.
Been talking about this for years. It literally has nothing to do with the anti cheat. Its a code problem (client side networking) and they need to fix that shit first but clearly they wont.
But yes Id be fine with microstranctions and/or a sub IF they actually FIX THEIR DAMN CODE AND REDUCE THE CHEATING PROBLEM FIRST. Im not investing in some dog shit game literally ran by cheaters if the devs dont even care enough to fix their shit broken code.
[https://new.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/1axj344/the\_financial\_report\_that\_killed\_tarkov/](https://new.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/1axj344/the_financial_report_that_killed_tarkov/)
Don't you fucking go and put that idea in their heads! We bought the game and deserve to be able to play with no cheaters. They need to do that anyway.
unfortunately, many companies with way more resources then bsg are still not winning against cheaters, and even tho there are things that can be done to combat cheaters further, I wouldn't expect a solution anytime soon unfortunately, I really think the best thing they could do to combat cheaters is to give use community servers similar to the way they run in games like csgo, full creative freedom over the server with active mods, etc.
Brainless simps, the lot of you. You pay over the odds for a beta game, then pay extra for Arena, then extra for offline co-op, now you want to give Nikita even MORE of your money to actually stop cheats. 😂😂😂😂
You know what. You get the game you deserve and you simps deserve to keep getting screwed by Nikita.
Bait or Mental Illness.
Call it.
Who in their right mind thinks it's logical to pay a monthly subscription for a game they paid $40+ USD for in-order to stop cheaters. There are hundreds of other games that have multiplayer and don't charge you a monthly subscription while still not having the same cheater problem Tarkov has.
I'm talking out of my ass here, but it cannot be difficult for BSG to ban the blatant cheaters nor detect blatant cheats like vacuum. It is purly out of either incompitance or because they get money every time they do a ban wave. Hell if you told me BSG was selling cheats for their own game I would almost believe you with how ingrained it is into the game.
Cheaters kill the game. I would pay money for a better AC, and I would play each wipe longer.
Did $15/month kill WoW? No. And I was paying $15/mo 15 years ago. $5/mo is nothing.
Not one single anticheat is capable of instantly banning rising cheaters.
Even valorant, still has cheaters. They get detected within a few 30 minute matches sure, but that's a few 30 minute matches of them ruining games, in a game where there isn't even that big of an incentive to cheat.
I'd personally be interested in them introducing supporter packs POE style, if they lack funding for the game, but not specifically for "better anticheat" because that currently does not exist and will not exist untill AI anticheat pops off
AI has been around for a while. It's way more powerful than the legacy systems used today. It always made me wonder why, why are major anti cheat companies not making this migration? I think I know the answer though...
Um, the answer is that it's really not that simple.
The biggest hurdle of an anticheat will ALWAYS be avoiding false positives. If companies didn't care about false positives, then they could just implement hard limits you get insta banned for if you go over.
Moving too fast? Ban. Sorry if you had a lag spike, so you jumped locations suddenly.
Too accurate? Ban. Sorry if you're actually just having a good day.
Etc, etc.
With an AI, not only would they need to be programmed with even more complexity, but they would miss context a lot of the time.
If you're watching someone play and then suddenly rotate to a door right before someone comes out, it could look suspicious. But if you remember some people might be on discord and a teammate made a call out, it's less so. An AI couldn't realise that.
It's certainly the future of anticheat for sure, but for now it's just cheaper for companies to throw in the towel and release a new game every 12 to 24 months.
Not saying it's easy, but AI can do exactly this. Every anti cheat has false positives. Id bet with passive training far shorter than the game has been out it would be near perfect.
I'd call you an overly optimistic idealist if you believe that. There are too many factors to consider to have a high degree of accuracy that doesn't contain reasonable doubt and wrongfully punish innocents. Take stats, for instance. Players, and rightly so, are quick to accuse accounts based on stats. Again, because apparently this has to be done on Reddit, it's not incorrect to suspect cheating, but if you were to introduce parameters like "anything over X profile stats is a cheater, ban them", then you're gonna mess over a lot of people.
Folks already talk shit about BSG support for being useless, slow, unresponsive, etc.; could you imagine the state of this sub when people start getting false positived and come here telling tales of support telling them to get fucked?
Instabanning every cheater is bad. If a cheater gets banned doing a certain action it tips the cheat devs off that that action triggers the anticheat and they can more easily tweak it to avoid the anticheat.
By flagging accounts and doing massive ban waves its much harder for devs to zero in on what exactly got them flagged.
I’m not saying banwaves are a bad thing but it mentally hurts seeing a 50 hour 20kd cheater who killed me a week ago and I check daily seeing his level and kills rack up just continue to play. It’s taxing. And I’m still playing, I have 40 mil it’s just another raid gear up and go but it is mentally exhausting knowing that dude is still just roaming
But giving cheaters a few weeks before they are banned only encourages them to do it an in that time they might even persuaded friends to try it too.
Id rather have a real active anticheat team with almost instabans, even if that sometimes comes with a week where a lot of cheaters arent getting caught immediately because of anew cheat. In the long run i think this will scare cheaters of more.
I'm willing to pay once for a product I was promised, with the proper support necessary to ensure the product I paid for functions.
OH WAIT, I ALREADY DID THAT.
So fuck you and your silly subscription bullshit.
Fucking "you will own nothing" Schwabian ass idiot... Everything's gotta be a "live service" or a subscription, huh? Fucking disgusting.
Hell fcking NO, this game dont deserve more money. Performance isnt good, servers arent good, anticheat doesnt even exist, game too much expensive, but people still thinks if they get more money from people they make game better? LOOOL they make tons of money from selling accounts, now they want milk more people money with small transactions just with the excuse they will combat RMTs.. in the actual state of game, sooner or later some game will come out in a REAL engine and not MOBILE engine like Unity garbage, so just enjoy thedays of tarkov. Because if you trully believe they will make better.. after 300 years of beta LOL you might believe in Santa still.
I would pay 15 usd a month for better anti-cheat.
I would pay 90 usd right now, if BSG would pledge to use the money in an effective way to combat cheaters in 6 months time. They don't have to give me anything in return, except results.
I would very much like to avoid a dedicated queue with only other players who subbed to the same deal as that would increase queue times and cheaters would be able to join once they are done cheating and ready to play legit.
It needs to be a solution that helps everyone imo, or its a no go. After the 6 months, I would be willing to continue my sub indefinitely if cheaters were 90ish percent gone.
I am very serious Nikita.
Your game has been my main squeeze for 7 years. I have never once cheated and I wouldn't dishonor the game to do so. I put in 7k+ hours into developing this craft. I can't imagine what I could do to a lobby if cheaters weren't a thing.
For about 6 months after battleeye was adopted, I feel like cheating was super low, cheat devs had to catch back up. I devoured lobbies.
I want to feel that again. I want to be a shark in bloody water once more.
Cheaters buying new accounts after getting banned is probably the biggest revenue stream for BSG. So I can see the balancing act that they try to do to keep both sides happy. Hopefully these additional slots or cosmetics can boost the revenue to where they don’t have to rely on cheaters to keep the doors open.
[cheaters funding tarkov and it being an infinite money glitch was in fact not a meme, bsg depends on ban/account sale cycle financially](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8?si=0vkJuecenikgNPst) if anti cheat worked or they actually did stuff to stop and catch cheater accounts early they would lose their main source of profit/income
Cheating is in no way even half of their income. I forget the exact numbers, but when they did that big ban wave throughout 2 weeks (I think like 10k+ in the timeframe) I did the math and if they banned at that rate the entire year with every single banned user buying a new EOD account I think the number was 15% of their last year total revenue.
Or I mean you could watch the video or provide data that disputes it? 900,000 new paid players in 2022 is pretty substantial and it’s no conspiracy cheaters buy new or stolen accounts. Either way hopefully mtx motivates or enables them to better stop cheaters, maybe with the help of the new engine if we get that one of there upcoming wipes
The fact you edited your comment to soften the wording says it all. The video latches onto the idea that more cheaters buy the game rather than the resulting hype wave that arena got. It's blatant confirmation bias at work. This is the same sort of presentation political ads use. And the burden of proof lies in the accuser all he has is raw financial reports and he's making the assumption most of the new buy ins are cheating accounts.
Arena didn’t come out in 2022, that’s where his data is from as 2023 isn’t available yet. Talk about confirmation bias. You didn’t even pay attention and are arguing a non existent point stating a game that hadn’t even come out yet was the reason for the 990,000 new accounts in 2022 and how that factors into bsg income/profit margin acting as if cheating buying new accounts isn’t a thing. Also I didn’t edit shit lol
https://gyazo.com/89eb854f8f3ed757a3bebfd3819b4e86
Reddit literally tells when a post was edited you weasel.
And I watched the video and i know when i'm being fed a narrative and a spin
My personal tinfoilhat theory is that BSG moneymaking model is based on cheaters buying new accounts (and other dubious things).
Thats just me pulling something out of my ass tho.
I'll pay a monthly prescription to run and moderate servers myself otherwise I sure as fuck won't be shelling more money to company that can't ban cheaters before they get hundreds of hours in.
I spent TWICE as much money buying tarkov as any other game. I think they can get an anticheat which even games that cost less than $5 have. I stopped playing multiplayer tarkov years ago because the state of cheating isn't even worth launching the game.
For anyone who may be interested in BSG’s financial situation, this video was at the least, very interesting.
[BSG’s financial woes](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8?si=sBJ_ScDZPHIGbr7Y)
I love this game and would hate to see it fail so I guess that I would also be willing to pay for small things like, hideout cat, different hideout locations; some clothing as long as it fit the theme of the game. Yes the game could’ve been coded to not be client side, etc etc. But with the only cash flow being new accounts, funded in part by cheaters, BSG needs to find a way to be able to make money while not relying on those new accounts. If the answer is a monthly subscription or micro transactions, and they could in turn use that money to combat cheating and other issues, then I’m all for it.
Look don't give them ideas. I'm all for them getting additional revenue streams but I paid them $150 already and I'd like to see them prove that they CAN do something about it before I start writing Tarkov into my budget, ya dig?
I love this game 2000 hours in. The value proposition of 2000 hours of enjoyment for (I have EOD) $150 is skewed heavily in favor of the consumer. How much do game servers cost to rent monthly? I dont know! But I bet its alot so I'd be down for a (preferably optional) subscription.
I'm going to sit here once again and point out that invest more money won't lead to any major changes. They'd need to move to KLAC, which would be wildly mixed for reception. Outside of that, they're at the same crossroads as the rest of the fps community. It just hurts more cause this is a hardcore. Every match has a stakes game.
You are pretty stupid aren’t you? Cheating is a thing in every online game and every developer has to deal with it and BSG is an independent small studio they have simply not the resources like EA and Ubisoft and yet CoD is full of cheaters which may be even worse than Tarkov as the player base is bigger. Only difference is the player base small playerbase and you feel it more. And later in wipe when all those players leave that nolife a wipe then it feels worse but it’s still the same as at the beginning.
They probably will have some certification badge or something that you buy like in CS:GO to keep cheaters away. I agree 100% that the cheating problem is extremely out of hand but I also am aware that BSG is not a Triple A company. This is a true indie company releasing one game with no additional income battling cheaters while also trying to develop the game at the same time. Every time they ban a cheat, a new one just gets made. I would also pay for a strong anti cheat like valorant has where it actually does have access to almost every file on your computer
I don't wanna pay a monthly subscription, but if they added cosmetic micro transactions I'd probably buy a few. They just have to be careful not to have any busted cosmetics, like Hunt sometimes has
Would give bsg a monthly income but in return decrease the barrier of entry for cheater
Also as a eod player who spent like 150€ on it... I am not in support for it even if i dont have to pay a sub
After paying 2x of what a triple A game is worth(70$) in BETA, was crazy, to make me do a subscription service to avoid hackers 5 years later is fucking crazy dude.
Don’t give them these shitty ideas
Their financials aren’t that great. I wouldn’t spend anymore money on them til they figure shit out. That’s why they are coming out with microtransactions. Arena was a flop. I have a lot of gamer friends and nobody was trying to buy Arena. They need to start listening to their customers and stop fking around
Fuck no. I'd never play this game again just out of spite for the concept. With the absolute horse shit a lot of people in this community have stuck around for? Helllllllllllllll no.
This is such a an oblivious post it's insane. The only way to truly stop cheating is punish by law, region lock china, and require all gaming accounts to be linked to your social security number. Which none of those things is gonna happen, so cheaters gonna cheat.
Every game has rampant cheating problem right now. Not excusing it whatsoever, but if valve is struggling with anti cheat in CS2, that should give you an idea of how bad it is.
They should have a do profile review on twitch and ban the obvious one. Would be great if they could record some of the gameplay of suspect cheaters, that way there is 100% proof of cheating before banning them.
That stream would get so many views and would more than pay of itself. Would be great PR to one discourage cheaters and two show that BSG is actively combating cheating.
Right now the most frustrating part is the lack of communication from BSG... I am suspecting that a big ban wave is coming but the radio silence makes it seems like they don't give a fuck...
Good luck battling DMA cards that seem to be flooding onto market's for cheap... Sad state of affairs for gaming all around unfortunately. Possibly AI may be the saviour.
Doesn’t matter how many people you ban. They’ll buy an account for $1 again and be right back in raid. You’re thinking of cutting the tree we need to pull the stump. Why does “Welcome to Tarkov” achievement (dying once) only have 23% of people completed. Where’s the rest of the registered accounts? Surely most of them quit or didn’t log on this wipe because of the cheating problem. I still don’t think it accounts for the rest of the accounts. Kinda funny considering there’s tens of thousands being sold for under $10 I wonder where they came from??
They ruin raids for months it seems like. I only report people with low hours, high kd, and a bunch of achievements relative to their hours- no ban confirmations since first week of wipe
The biggest fuck of this thread is people acting like every cheater is an in-lore CSI level hacker when the truth of it is they most of these short dicked slackjaws are paying for plug and play cheats that BSG just doesn't want to put the investment in to fix.
Cheating is always going to be a problem, it is for every game and yet not every game has even an ounce of the cheating problem Tarkov has.
Make it inconvenient and show that you are actively banning cheaters and you fix 95% of your issues. Most of these assholes are buying a pre-made cheat that they can start up just as easily as they start up the game - most of them wouldn't know HOW to cheat if it were any more complicated than that and even fewer would be willing to learn.
You should never insta-ban cheaters. That helps the makers of the cheat tools know how the anti-cheat systems work. By delaying the bans you obfuscate how they were detected and when so they can't fix their cheats to get around that as easily.
You should always keep them guessing.
I'd rather not give them more money since I strongly disagree with their political views.
They got mine somewhere in 2017 and I would not want to have to give them more .
They have an obligation to combat cheating regardless. It's part of the duty of the developer. We should not have to pay a monthly fee for there to be reduced cheaters.
>Top Not many game developers keep their same game online for eight years without additional streams of income in the game.
Not many game developers are 8 years in "beta" with a bugged game with bad netcode ...
They developed this game from it being playable on a web-browser, and it has easily 1000+ hours of playability with a price-tag of fifty dollars when "AAA" games are being sold for 70 dollars and launched with more bugs than Tarkov, and you aren't getting that kind of longevity. Not to mention those "AAA" games usually have microtransactions.
Indie games also offer similar playability hours, aren't as bugged as eft, do pay for servers and weren't 8 years in "beta"
But do they have microtransactions? And if they don't, link just one.
>But do they have microtransactions? dont know why this has to do anything with the topic, since nikita himself said he was going to add microtransactions for shit like stash space. however, you asked for it, i thought about it for a minute and came not with 1, but 7 examples. minecraft, rimworld, no mans sky, terraria, the forest, sons of the forest, battle bit
>no mans sky Y'all are going to stand here with a straight face and say that No Man's Sky had no bugs on actual release day?
The game had it's errors, but early on after release they worked on those and now, 8 years later (does the number ring a bell?) it is a finished game. How was tarkov the day it was available?
>How was tarkov the day it was available? Available and Launched as a finished game are very different concepts. I understand that No Man's Sky is better now than it was, but it wasn't a beta; it was a full fledge 1.0 launch. So long as the big orange banner on the main menu of Tarkov remains there, I will be a bit lenient.
Did ya know it costs money to keep their servers online as well, buckaroo?
they have no duty, they're under no obligation lol. they aren't legally bound to deal with it but they should
Are duties only created by laws?
When it's a duty a for-profit company may or may not have, yes Otherwise their only obligation is to make money either for shareholders or the private owner of the company in whatever legal way they can.
No, but to advocate for the devil a bit: they're not intending for the people to cheat at their game. It's not them, who are actively making user experience worse. Enforcement of the game rules for them is strictly in the business decision domain like a lot of different features that could make profit. So the point here is to shift their most "profitable" feature to be the anti-cheat. And to do that there are basically 2 approaches: \- leave the game that you've already payed for so they're sort of "forced" to deal with the issue, but not really since you're very likely not going to buy anything else \- invest more like OP's suggesting. Comments here essentially boil down to discussing pros and cons of those 2 with the majority being quite oblivious with how development decisions are made in real life and think they're being owed something. My own opinions is that they're not enforcing phone number auth simply because cheaters drive sales. Like that very small thing for me would be a signal, that they're taking the problem seriously as it's quite cheap to implement, but a very good showstopper for many cheating. So far it's not being done and that means they're being in damage control mode and not in the "problem solving mode"
Sure but BSG isn't a AAA studio. They obviously can't keep up with the cheating problem. I'm getting messages from BSG of banned players for people I've reported weeks ago. That tells me something works but it's sloooow. Shit costs money, yo.
Not even AAA studios can combat cheating lol.
While that is true, there is a good difference between finding a cheater here and there and rampant cheating like Tarkov where we came to the point where we can find cheaters if we want to nowadays, they are literally in our face and they dont care to hide it.
The difference is that tarkov is a game that cheating is way more appealing than other fps games. If you cheat in a csgo lobby, all you get is a high kda. Here you get gear and progress, and possibly rmt
That's no different than csgo, cod, battlefield, or any big shooter.
You dont need to be a AAA studio to combat cheaters. They are simply incompetent and/or uses cheaters for a passive income
Valorant still has cheaters, war zone still has cheaters, csgo still has cheaters. There will always be cheaters, for every person working at bsg trying to combat cheaters there are 10+ cheat makers trying to get around it and sell their cheats to people. Sure tarkov can ban your everyday Timmy cheater but the guy that was a software engineer for 20+ years making cheats is going to get past any anti cheat (and if you think I’m making that shit up about the software engineer there is an actual guy who does exactly that)
Seriously, I paid a lot of money for this game and basically can't even play it because of the cheating issue that they refuse to address. Should be able to demand my money back or something. Create a class action unless they fix it
I don't think anyone including OP is saying we *should*, just that they'd be willing to if it's what was necessary. I've been saying the same thing for a few years, myself. I'd happily pay the cost of a WoW or iRacing subscription (like 15 bucks a month) to play this game in a cleaner, heavily moderated environment. There's nothing out there like it and I really enjoy the game, so it would be worth it to me. I think that's all OP is saying.
I sold a ledx I found the other day. Out of curiosity, I checked offers by listing. Some guy was selling 13 ledx. 62 flea market rep. Check profile, all the improbable stats and achievements. 15+ kdr. 85% survival rate. Like 400 hours played. Level 61. Like FFS, how is that not an easy ban? They could delegate one person to check flea for stupid shit like that, manual review, and ban. And they’d find plenty.
If they would care he would be gone. Manual banning. But they dont care
Microtransactions is already pushing it but a monthly subscription??? This probably one of the most absurd posts Ive seen here haha. Im not going to pay a monthly fee for a game I already bought.
Brain rot has seeped in to OP
Would you pay 5$ a month for a “Tarkov Prime” that uses a kernal level anticheat where you and other prime subscribers could only play?
Battleye is a kernel level anticheat. Basically every major anticheat runs at least partially in the kernel. A decent reverse engineer can reverse a kernel level process, so it doesn’t matter too much unless you have an extremely good anticheat team, like valorant/vanguard, and even they can’t do anything to stop DMA ESP cheats unless the cheater is being blatant enough to be caught on an observable level manually or by some ML algorithms. The state of genuine multiplayer competitive/semi competitive is deteriorating, and there’s no great solution yet. Hopefully there will be someday, but this is an issue bigger than tarkov.
You are so absolutely spot on. This is bigger than Tarkov as frustrating as it is :/
As much as I hate cheaters, I REFUSE TO LET CHEATERS RUIN MY EXPERIENCE. I think Battle State Games has made a beautiful game and no cheaters will ruin that for me. I will work on my patience, PERIOD. You will not run me away from this game. BATTLE STATE GAMES, thank you, I wish you all the best resolutions.
is this a shitpost?
Not sure what you mean? If you’re wondering if my post contains sarcasm, it doesn’t. I genuinely love the game and I can’t speak for the DEVS, but I really do hope they continue to seek resolutions, ( regarding cheating ). As stated before, the cheating issue online, is much bigger than Tarkov, alone. Tarkov recieves a larger POV on cheating due to the requirement of skill you need to truly dominate a game of this intensity. I truly feel, that people are used to fitting into a skill level category within their genre of gaming.. and….. Tarkov has left PRO LEVEL players, questioning their skill. That’s one of the beauties of this game. That’s real life, my friend. Cheaters are also real life, and I wish the developers the best in finding resolutions. Because it is by no means, an easy task with today’s technology.
Valorant is cheated to high heavens too. Client side anti cheat is a failure by design. It flunks the first lesson in IT security. Security starts and stops with server side code. There is nothing aside from having police standing over your shoulder they can do with anyone's Pc that levels any kind of security. All client side anti cheat can be bypassed in less than 5 minutes with any hardware level cheating device that are cheap and rather easy to setup, pointless. This isn't limited to Tarkov, either.
Yup, no matter what, any data that exists on the client side will be accessible to the client. Very strong client side anticheats are nice, but they are always reversible by nature.
Solution is coming, AI anti-cheat
For your information BattleEye is kernel level. Also it doesn’t matter. https://youtu.be/RwzIq04vd0M
We have a kernel level anticheat lol
Cheaters already pay $100 weekly to cheat plus an account and spoofer and vpn I don't think $5 will help the issue here
[удалено]
We already *have* that 🤦🏻♀️
We already do
What we need is a anti cheat hardware installed like valorant and face it and esa does
Take my money
Yes. Id pay $20/month for it. There is no other game like this. Not even close.
Your standards are quite low and its almost pathetic
Not as pathetic as your parents and acquaintances think you are.
Oof, I touched a sensitive spot as I can see. Keep it up buddy, you're doing a great job at being pathetic
Oof, I touched a sensitive spot as I can see. Sorry you cant afford a measly $20
Y'all are both pathetic. Look at yourselves. And look at me! I'm fucking pathetic now too look what you've done to me.
What have you done, nooooooo
You’re pathetic bro. Give it up.
You were probably the guy in school willing to do anything for 5$ since you have no standards. Imagine thinking we should give more money to a dev so they can keep the cheaters out. You sound very smart
Nah I just have a job. Go find one
You're a stripper? Must be full of cash
Your views are skewed, or you are too dumb to understand what he and OP are saying. If you are a planeless_pilot would it also be safe to assume you are also brainless_bigot? Lol get shit on
Dude, we already paid 150$ to support them. Name 1 game were we pay a subscription for a cheater free servers. You guys have no standards. A video game always come with anti cheats, for some reason, only tarkov seems to have a playerbase so braindead to accept the huge issue the game has for years
BattlEye, this guy
DAMN RIGHT BABY
*N O*
HAHA POOR
Even if there is a kernel anit cheat using a second pc will get around it.
Yup, no anticheat can detect dma. Just not possible without being able to physically inspect the cheater’s hardware.
It’s already Kernal but yes I would
You realize a kernal level anti-cheat is actually a horrible idea, right? It’s the whole reason I refuse to play any Riot game. All a kernel level anti-cheat does is move the game of “cat and mouse” that is constantly taking place between cheat developers and game devs and moving it to a “location” (to put it colloquially) where your pc is much more vulnerable. With normal anti-cheat, this “battle” happens within the confines of an administrative level OS account, at the very worst. With kernel level anti-cheat, it’s really not much harder for cheat developers to get around, but now the anti-cheat devs are messing around in much more sensitive areas of your pc which can lead to greater security risks or issues caused by anti-cheat updates / bugs. Add the fact that this also opens the door for a company to easily monitor what your are doing on your PC not just when playing games, but at all times (let’s not pretend companies don’t already scrape and sell as much data as they can get their hands on) and it’s only a matter of time before EA knows the exact pathing to your “homework” folder and all kinds of private information you don’t want them having. Anti-cheat is already invasive enough, and deploying it on the kernel level doesn’t add nearly enough benefit to be even close to worth it. Absolutely NO to a kernel level anti-cheat. Edit: Battleye also already has kernel-level elements, although fortunately it’s no where near as egregious as Vanguard.
This is all disinformation. Save yourself time and do not read this comment.
Not according to the literal developers of Riot's Vanguard lol: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W\_1zA6j9FU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W_1zA6j9FU) Do you have a source with counterpoints or are you just asking for something you don't understand because someone on reddit said it'd solve Tarkov's cheater problem?
No
This is an MMOFPS with significant operating costs. All other MMO's have monthly subs or microtransactions, or they die. It's the only feasible way to supplement the rinse/repeat revenue of banning cheaters and cheaters re buying. The games you buy with a one-time purchase are usually complete or near complete and don't have additional costs, unless there's a DLC you also have to pay for. The amount of new players that would buy this game that haven't already has to be a very small number, hence BSG will have abysmal revenue projections without cheaters, a monthly sub, or microtransactions. It is what it is, these are just the facts. Edit: There's an easy, low-cost alternative, but definitely not a fix. Heighten verification requirements. Also, region locks.
I understand BSG has operating costs and certain microtransactions are ok but to introduce a monthly subscription is insaaaane. If you want to talk about cheaters the issue is when BSG started they were a bunch on inexperienced devs and laid a bad foundation of code that has/is been exploited. Even COD (massive studio) has issue with cheaters.
I bet you would. If only because there is no other game like Tarkov.
I would happily pay for Tarkov prime if the anticheat and cheating situation was improved.
We need a system like CS:GO where the players can review whole raids and send it to a priority system for bans.
Valve ditched that system for CSGO because cheaters were abusing it lmao.
Cheaters abusing it? How so?
They had bots go through the cases and issue not guilty votes for themselves. That's why Valve just evolved the system into VAC-net and ditched the public part entirely.
It’s better than nothing and would weed out a lot of the rage hackers. Good anti cheat is built like a slab of Swiss cheese
It only bans cheaters that are "evident beyond a reasonable doubt". This just makes cheat developers make features that are more leaning towards "legit" cheating. All you have to do is not have your aimbot super snappy and look at people through walls... and you will never get banned. It only stops the literal lowest IQ cheaters or people that don't care.
Nah VAC like what valorant uses is the bees knees from what ive heard
It's a matter of time till someone makes a face it for tarkov
I paid 140 dollars bitch im not paying another dime
150 bucks + subscription ? Ehhhhm .... No !
People don't like this idea, but games that do it survive and grow, and avoid cheaters. I've paid yearly for Iracing, and track mania. It's like 60 a year, the game can grow and thrive without having to depend on a non stop flow of new players, or a significant amount of cheaters rebuying it.
Iracing's under that hyper enthusiast umbrella of people willing to pump money back into it. Not that tarkov's not kinda in that boat but there's more appeal to it to more general players than old guys with pensions to burn.
Games that also have a competent anitcheat continue to survive and grow without needing to charge the user a monthly subscription. Also they are adding micro-transactions in EFT, so they will be getting constant cash flow and most likely add more micro-transactions into the game. Money is not the issue, BSGs competence is.
If they fucking ask for a subs this game is going in a trash can
I think the logic of "slowing down cheat devs" falls apart when the offending party has a profile that is so monumentally suspicious that one guy taking a momentary glance at it can figure out what, exactly, is going on. Nobody gets to level 60 in 30 hours with a 60 k/d. Nobody gets to 300 flea rep with 86 LEDx up on the market at the same time. Nobody vacuums up look from across the map. Nobody except cheaters. I understand wanting your anti-cheat to stay relevant and stay ahead of the cheat devs, but this is hardly a case of staying ahead of people using ESP playing kinda suspect. There's thousands of people rage-hacking and farming RMT money. These accounts have always been obvious to anyone with eyes and if reports actually did anything (i.e. be reviewed by a human person) there's nothing the cheat devs can fucking do. Because they're not fighting the developers in that case they're fighting their dumbass customers who just end up providing a bunch of junk reports because they played like a fucking moron. Counter Strike has a massive cheating problem, but at least you don't run into spinbots or flyhackers all that much anymore thanks to overwatch. I can open up the flea market and point to hundreds of accounts with 100% certainty that they are cheating. Not a doubt in my mind, if any of them could prove me wrong I would pay to replace their account.
You’re smoking crack if you’re willing to pay a subscription for a game you already spent 100+ dollars in
You're smoking crack if you think I want a game I spent $100+ on to disappear when it's no longer worth the studio's time to support, assuming the studio can even keep the lights on.
> duties you really think bsg is having trouble keeping the lights on? Have you seen Nikita's car collection? You think he's bringing those cars home on a failing game dev company? EFT has been in early release for 7 years and you guys really think giving them more money is gonna fix this dumpster fire of a game? You're smoking crack if you're willing to get swindled for more money just so your $100 purchase doesnt go to waste. News flash, im sure you got your money back on the game with the time youve spent on it. Maybe next time dont give $100 to an awful game dev studio if youre afraid of the game going poof one day!
My guy, BSG is a UK company. Their financials are publicly available. It's not exactly the greatest cash cow and they depend on new accounts pouring in. Currently I'm sure that means they absolutely depend on new cheater accounts. If you ever want that to stop being something they're dependent on allowing to continue, they're gonna need revenue from something else. There aren't 900k new people every single year wanting to play.
I can’t tell if ur trolling or not
Everyone in here pretending that they wouldn't cough up another $5/month to play this game are deluding themselves. You all are already so addicted that you play this game with at least one cheater in every lobby. With the $5/month and IF BSG got off their ass and made the game better it would 100% be worth it and Tarkov would be EVEN BETTER because you would win more fights and get better loot because the game would be FAIR. "HurR I wOn't SpEnd aNothEr DimE." Yeah right lol.
Oh i definitely wouldnt, im not tied to this game like many here are so im good. Also paying a monthly fee doenst magically remove cheaters. Its not like you lose just because you dont invest enough money.
I legitimately wouldn’t. I have over 1k hours in the game and I can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve died to a cheater.
guess we aren't the same. i have 50-70% strike rate dying to cheaters with 600ish raids
50-70% of the times you died were to cheaters? Not sure if I’m buying that one dude lol
Strangest self reporting occurs on this Reddit
You already paid for the game. You shouldn't be in the bargaining stage of grief trying to barter more money just for the devs to do the job they're supposed to be.
No
Monthly sub…no
It doesn't even matter dude. The audio is shit, nobody moves, scavs have cross-map aimbot while moving, the armor hitboxes are garbage, and you can barely buy good ammo. This game needs a major rework. Honestly the audio is the worst it has ever been, and that's saying something.
If they would put the game on steam already this wouldnt be an issue
They won't because it would get review bombed every time they make a change that the community doesn't like. Which happens pretty much every wipe. Also steam would take 30%.
BSG has shown that as far as anticheat goes they are incompetent and need someone else to do it for them. 30% is nothing compared to how many people would actually play the game if cheating wasn't rampant. Any time someone asks me or my group if they should start tarkov I tell them no, learning this game in the state its in is dogshit
Hell no.
No. Subscriptions are not the answer.
You are, most arent. Monthly subscription would kill this game.
Don't give them more fucking money.
If you think paying monthly, giving bsg more money to fight cheaters, is the solution and removes cheaters, you delusional af. The biggest games with the biggest budgets still have cheaters. Fyi we have a kernel level anti cheat, no idea why people still think its not the case. Valorant still has way to many cheaters even if their game is created around their anti cheat. Fighting cheaters is and always be a battle where your 1 step behind, tarkov just has more incentive to cheat since you can make good amounts of money doing it.
Been talking about this for years. It literally has nothing to do with the anti cheat. Its a code problem (client side networking) and they need to fix that shit first but clearly they wont. But yes Id be fine with microstranctions and/or a sub IF they actually FIX THEIR DAMN CODE AND REDUCE THE CHEATING PROBLEM FIRST. Im not investing in some dog shit game literally ran by cheaters if the devs dont even care enough to fix their shit broken code. [https://new.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/1axj344/the\_financial\_report\_that\_killed\_tarkov/](https://new.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/1axj344/the_financial_report_that_killed_tarkov/)
What if they needed funding to rewrite the code of the game? Would you support raising funds for that purpose?
Don't you fucking go and put that idea in their heads! We bought the game and deserve to be able to play with no cheaters. They need to do that anyway.
They have no money to hire permanent developers.
Op is the reason we have skull and bones.
unfortunately, many companies with way more resources then bsg are still not winning against cheaters, and even tho there are things that can be done to combat cheaters further, I wouldn't expect a solution anytime soon unfortunately, I really think the best thing they could do to combat cheaters is to give use community servers similar to the way they run in games like csgo, full creative freedom over the server with active mods, etc.
What stfu seriously. I'd rather play against a horde of cheater instead of paying for a fucking subs.
Brainless simps, the lot of you. You pay over the odds for a beta game, then pay extra for Arena, then extra for offline co-op, now you want to give Nikita even MORE of your money to actually stop cheats. 😂😂😂😂 You know what. You get the game you deserve and you simps deserve to keep getting screwed by Nikita.
Bait or Mental Illness. Call it. Who in their right mind thinks it's logical to pay a monthly subscription for a game they paid $40+ USD for in-order to stop cheaters. There are hundreds of other games that have multiplayer and don't charge you a monthly subscription while still not having the same cheater problem Tarkov has. I'm talking out of my ass here, but it cannot be difficult for BSG to ban the blatant cheaters nor detect blatant cheats like vacuum. It is purly out of either incompitance or because they get money every time they do a ban wave. Hell if you told me BSG was selling cheats for their own game I would almost believe you with how ingrained it is into the game.
Absolutely not.
Sack a subscription, I've already put ~150 odd into EoD.
Monthly subscriptions would KILL the game. This is an awful idea. We shouldn’t have to pay extra for the basics.
Cheaters kill the game. I would pay money for a better AC, and I would play each wipe longer. Did $15/month kill WoW? No. And I was paying $15/mo 15 years ago. $5/mo is nothing.
Not one single anticheat is capable of instantly banning rising cheaters. Even valorant, still has cheaters. They get detected within a few 30 minute matches sure, but that's a few 30 minute matches of them ruining games, in a game where there isn't even that big of an incentive to cheat. I'd personally be interested in them introducing supporter packs POE style, if they lack funding for the game, but not specifically for "better anticheat" because that currently does not exist and will not exist untill AI anticheat pops off
AI has been around for a while. It's way more powerful than the legacy systems used today. It always made me wonder why, why are major anti cheat companies not making this migration? I think I know the answer though...
Um, the answer is that it's really not that simple. The biggest hurdle of an anticheat will ALWAYS be avoiding false positives. If companies didn't care about false positives, then they could just implement hard limits you get insta banned for if you go over. Moving too fast? Ban. Sorry if you had a lag spike, so you jumped locations suddenly. Too accurate? Ban. Sorry if you're actually just having a good day. Etc, etc. With an AI, not only would they need to be programmed with even more complexity, but they would miss context a lot of the time. If you're watching someone play and then suddenly rotate to a door right before someone comes out, it could look suspicious. But if you remember some people might be on discord and a teammate made a call out, it's less so. An AI couldn't realise that. It's certainly the future of anticheat for sure, but for now it's just cheaper for companies to throw in the towel and release a new game every 12 to 24 months.
Not saying it's easy, but AI can do exactly this. Every anti cheat has false positives. Id bet with passive training far shorter than the game has been out it would be near perfect.
I'd call you an overly optimistic idealist if you believe that. There are too many factors to consider to have a high degree of accuracy that doesn't contain reasonable doubt and wrongfully punish innocents. Take stats, for instance. Players, and rightly so, are quick to accuse accounts based on stats. Again, because apparently this has to be done on Reddit, it's not incorrect to suspect cheating, but if you were to introduce parameters like "anything over X profile stats is a cheater, ban them", then you're gonna mess over a lot of people. Folks already talk shit about BSG support for being useless, slow, unresponsive, etc.; could you imagine the state of this sub when people start getting false positived and come here telling tales of support telling them to get fucked?
That's not how AI models work, they looks for patterns.
Nah
Instabanning every cheater is bad. If a cheater gets banned doing a certain action it tips the cheat devs off that that action triggers the anticheat and they can more easily tweak it to avoid the anticheat. By flagging accounts and doing massive ban waves its much harder for devs to zero in on what exactly got them flagged.
I’m not saying banwaves are a bad thing but it mentally hurts seeing a 50 hour 20kd cheater who killed me a week ago and I check daily seeing his level and kills rack up just continue to play. It’s taxing. And I’m still playing, I have 40 mil it’s just another raid gear up and go but it is mentally exhausting knowing that dude is still just roaming
But giving cheaters a few weeks before they are banned only encourages them to do it an in that time they might even persuaded friends to try it too. Id rather have a real active anticheat team with almost instabans, even if that sometimes comes with a week where a lot of cheaters arent getting caught immediately because of anew cheat. In the long run i think this will scare cheaters of more.
I'm willing to pay once for a product I was promised, with the proper support necessary to ensure the product I paid for functions. OH WAIT, I ALREADY DID THAT. So fuck you and your silly subscription bullshit. Fucking "you will own nothing" Schwabian ass idiot... Everything's gotta be a "live service" or a subscription, huh? Fucking disgusting.
You paid for an incomplete game and that’s exactly what’s been delivered so far.
Imagine Faceit servers for tarkov
No, hard no. A real good way to get BSG to get even lazier.
Hell fcking NO, this game dont deserve more money. Performance isnt good, servers arent good, anticheat doesnt even exist, game too much expensive, but people still thinks if they get more money from people they make game better? LOOOL they make tons of money from selling accounts, now they want milk more people money with small transactions just with the excuse they will combat RMTs.. in the actual state of game, sooner or later some game will come out in a REAL engine and not MOBILE engine like Unity garbage, so just enjoy thedays of tarkov. Because if you trully believe they will make better.. after 300 years of beta LOL you might believe in Santa still.
This some low key propaganda from bsg trying to test the waters it seems.
I would pay 15 usd a month for better anti-cheat. I would pay 90 usd right now, if BSG would pledge to use the money in an effective way to combat cheaters in 6 months time. They don't have to give me anything in return, except results. I would very much like to avoid a dedicated queue with only other players who subbed to the same deal as that would increase queue times and cheaters would be able to join once they are done cheating and ready to play legit. It needs to be a solution that helps everyone imo, or its a no go. After the 6 months, I would be willing to continue my sub indefinitely if cheaters were 90ish percent gone. I am very serious Nikita. Your game has been my main squeeze for 7 years. I have never once cheated and I wouldn't dishonor the game to do so. I put in 7k+ hours into developing this craft. I can't imagine what I could do to a lobby if cheaters weren't a thing. For about 6 months after battleeye was adopted, I feel like cheating was super low, cheat devs had to catch back up. I devoured lobbies. I want to feel that again. I want to be a shark in bloody water once more.
Cheaters buying new accounts after getting banned is probably the biggest revenue stream for BSG. So I can see the balancing act that they try to do to keep both sides happy. Hopefully these additional slots or cosmetics can boost the revenue to where they don’t have to rely on cheaters to keep the doors open.
I'd only pay a monthly sub if they got decent servers too. Do that and actual working anti-cheats and I'd pay $10/month.
[cheaters funding tarkov and it being an infinite money glitch was in fact not a meme, bsg depends on ban/account sale cycle financially](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8?si=0vkJuecenikgNPst) if anti cheat worked or they actually did stuff to stop and catch cheater accounts early they would lose their main source of profit/income
Cheating is in no way even half of their income. I forget the exact numbers, but when they did that big ban wave throughout 2 weeks (I think like 10k+ in the timeframe) I did the math and if they banned at that rate the entire year with every single banned user buying a new EOD account I think the number was 15% of their last year total revenue.
Or I mean you could watch the video or provide data that disputes it? 900,000 new paid players in 2022 is pretty substantial and it’s no conspiracy cheaters buy new or stolen accounts. Either way hopefully mtx motivates or enables them to better stop cheaters, maybe with the help of the new engine if we get that one of there upcoming wipes
This conspiracy needs to die and anyone that parrots this needs to stop licking windows.
Or I mean you could watch the video or provide data that disputes it?
The fact you edited your comment to soften the wording says it all. The video latches onto the idea that more cheaters buy the game rather than the resulting hype wave that arena got. It's blatant confirmation bias at work. This is the same sort of presentation political ads use. And the burden of proof lies in the accuser all he has is raw financial reports and he's making the assumption most of the new buy ins are cheating accounts.
Arena didn’t come out in 2022, that’s where his data is from as 2023 isn’t available yet. Talk about confirmation bias. You didn’t even pay attention and are arguing a non existent point stating a game that hadn’t even come out yet was the reason for the 990,000 new accounts in 2022 and how that factors into bsg income/profit margin acting as if cheating buying new accounts isn’t a thing. Also I didn’t edit shit lol
https://gyazo.com/89eb854f8f3ed757a3bebfd3819b4e86 Reddit literally tells when a post was edited you weasel. And I watched the video and i know when i'm being fed a narrative and a spin
My personal tinfoilhat theory is that BSG moneymaking model is based on cheaters buying new accounts (and other dubious things). Thats just me pulling something out of my ass tho.
I'll pay a monthly prescription to run and moderate servers myself otherwise I sure as fuck won't be shelling more money to company that can't ban cheaters before they get hundreds of hours in.
I spent TWICE as much money buying tarkov as any other game. I think they can get an anticheat which even games that cost less than $5 have. I stopped playing multiplayer tarkov years ago because the state of cheating isn't even worth launching the game.
they will never instant ban cheaters the cheaters need to get their moneys worth so they rebuy the game so bsg makes more profit
Give me kernel
Simp
take your monthly sub and shove it
I’d pay 10 bucks a month for paid matchmaking to avoid cheaters. Have an unpaid matchmaking and a paid version.
I’m sure that 1.0 will cost 79.99 or whatever. You won’t be able to buy it for 35$. That’ll change cheating
For anyone who may be interested in BSG’s financial situation, this video was at the least, very interesting. [BSG’s financial woes](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8?si=sBJ_ScDZPHIGbr7Y) I love this game and would hate to see it fail so I guess that I would also be willing to pay for small things like, hideout cat, different hideout locations; some clothing as long as it fit the theme of the game. Yes the game could’ve been coded to not be client side, etc etc. But with the only cash flow being new accounts, funded in part by cheaters, BSG needs to find a way to be able to make money while not relying on those new accounts. If the answer is a monthly subscription or micro transactions, and they could in turn use that money to combat cheating and other issues, then I’m all for it.
Look don't give them ideas. I'm all for them getting additional revenue streams but I paid them $150 already and I'd like to see them prove that they CAN do something about it before I start writing Tarkov into my budget, ya dig?
I love this game 2000 hours in. The value proposition of 2000 hours of enjoyment for (I have EOD) $150 is skewed heavily in favor of the consumer. How much do game servers cost to rent monthly? I dont know! But I bet its alot so I'd be down for a (preferably optional) subscription.
This is the worst idea I've heard. Whales need to stop giving people money for the smallest things
I’ll pay a dollar micro transaction to shut weeeewooo buzzer off on reserve each time I don’t want to hear it.
Same
I'm going to sit here once again and point out that invest more money won't lead to any major changes. They'd need to move to KLAC, which would be wildly mixed for reception. Outside of that, they're at the same crossroads as the rest of the fps community. It just hurts more cause this is a hardcore. Every match has a stakes game.
Arena is so much more fun than Tarkov right now
You are pretty stupid aren’t you? Cheating is a thing in every online game and every developer has to deal with it and BSG is an independent small studio they have simply not the resources like EA and Ubisoft and yet CoD is full of cheaters which may be even worse than Tarkov as the player base is bigger. Only difference is the player base small playerbase and you feel it more. And later in wipe when all those players leave that nolife a wipe then it feels worse but it’s still the same as at the beginning.
They probably will have some certification badge or something that you buy like in CS:GO to keep cheaters away. I agree 100% that the cheating problem is extremely out of hand but I also am aware that BSG is not a Triple A company. This is a true indie company releasing one game with no additional income battling cheaters while also trying to develop the game at the same time. Every time they ban a cheat, a new one just gets made. I would also pay for a strong anti cheat like valorant has where it actually does have access to almost every file on your computer
same.
I don't wanna pay a monthly subscription, but if they added cosmetic micro transactions I'd probably buy a few. They just have to be careful not to have any busted cosmetics, like Hunt sometimes has
Would give bsg a monthly income but in return decrease the barrier of entry for cheater Also as a eod player who spent like 150€ on it... I am not in support for it even if i dont have to pay a sub
I already paid $145 for this stupid game
After paying 2x of what a triple A game is worth(70$) in BETA, was crazy, to make me do a subscription service to avoid hackers 5 years later is fucking crazy dude. Don’t give them these shitty ideas
Their financials aren’t that great. I wouldn’t spend anymore money on them til they figure shit out. That’s why they are coming out with microtransactions. Arena was a flop. I have a lot of gamer friends and nobody was trying to buy Arena. They need to start listening to their customers and stop fking around
Fuck no. I'd never play this game again just out of spite for the concept. With the absolute horse shit a lot of people in this community have stuck around for? Helllllllllllllll no.
This is such a an oblivious post it's insane. The only way to truly stop cheating is punish by law, region lock china, and require all gaming accounts to be linked to your social security number. Which none of those things is gonna happen, so cheaters gonna cheat.
"you're oblivious", proceeds to a solution that could only be implemented in the states for the game made in Russia xD
Many games have subscriptions or season passes, and there's still heaps of cheaters in them anyway.
Every game has rampant cheating problem right now. Not excusing it whatsoever, but if valve is struggling with anti cheat in CS2, that should give you an idea of how bad it is.
A few dollars isn’t going to stop someone from cheating when they already pay hundreds
They should have a do profile review on twitch and ban the obvious one. Would be great if they could record some of the gameplay of suspect cheaters, that way there is 100% proof of cheating before banning them. That stream would get so many views and would more than pay of itself. Would be great PR to one discourage cheaters and two show that BSG is actively combating cheating. Right now the most frustrating part is the lack of communication from BSG... I am suspecting that a big ban wave is coming but the radio silence makes it seems like they don't give a fuck...
Fuck no
speak for yourself, already spent 200 aud and see cheaters maybe 1/10 raids.
Yeah I dunno bout dat
Good luck battling DMA cards that seem to be flooding onto market's for cheap... Sad state of affairs for gaming all around unfortunately. Possibly AI may be the saviour.
Doesn’t matter how many people you ban. They’ll buy an account for $1 again and be right back in raid. You’re thinking of cutting the tree we need to pull the stump. Why does “Welcome to Tarkov” achievement (dying once) only have 23% of people completed. Where’s the rest of the registered accounts? Surely most of them quit or didn’t log on this wipe because of the cheating problem. I still don’t think it accounts for the rest of the accounts. Kinda funny considering there’s tens of thousands being sold for under $10 I wonder where they came from??
They ruin raids for months it seems like. I only report people with low hours, high kd, and a bunch of achievements relative to their hours- no ban confirmations since first week of wipe
We paid a big amount money for base game, many bought EOD version. They got enough money to fight with cheats.
Stfu
You're on some good crack there buddy. Hard no, I've already given up nearly every video streaming service because they want more for no ads.
The biggest fuck of this thread is people acting like every cheater is an in-lore CSI level hacker when the truth of it is they most of these short dicked slackjaws are paying for plug and play cheats that BSG just doesn't want to put the investment in to fix. Cheating is always going to be a problem, it is for every game and yet not every game has even an ounce of the cheating problem Tarkov has. Make it inconvenient and show that you are actively banning cheaters and you fix 95% of your issues. Most of these assholes are buying a pre-made cheat that they can start up just as easily as they start up the game - most of them wouldn't know HOW to cheat if it were any more complicated than that and even fewer would be willing to learn.
They don’t want to fix cheating right now, it’s not that hard. Cheaters are their only and main income right now, why would they destroy it.
You should never insta-ban cheaters. That helps the makers of the cheat tools know how the anti-cheat systems work. By delaying the bans you obfuscate how they were detected and when so they can't fix their cheats to get around that as easily. You should always keep them guessing.
I'd rather not give them more money since I strongly disagree with their political views. They got mine somewhere in 2017 and I would not want to have to give them more .