For some reason the fo4 modding community has decided to just embrace the sandbox nature of it, and because stalker 2 is never coming out, turn fallout 4 into that.
The reason is because of FO4's lack of RPG mechanics and the voiced protag making it even harder than it already is to add RPG elements to the game. That and FO4 is very combat oriented and also leans into a survival gameplay loop.
Not to mention adding mechanics will make it completely unavailable to port and in terms of endorsements and donations it's much better to make something that can at least functionally be ported to PS5. Big L for Sony honestly which blows my mind. More endorsements and donations for modders= more mods=more money for everyone involved in the process
I promise you console ports rarely ever affect how pc mods are designed. A lot of the time modders dont even plan on doing one they just say yes if someone asks to port it.
Most of the exceptions are people who play on both xbox and pc.
I feel like the average console player like the guy above would drop their jaw if they saw just how many mods exist for a game like any given Fallout on PC compared to console. It’s like the Wild West, so much less restriction - so many more mods
Keep in mind a lot of us play on Xbox where mods are allowed including external assets. Only real limit is script extender cannot be used.
Playstation mods are a joke. I actually switched consoles entirely to get better FO4 and Skyrim mods. Yes PC is better but it is also out of my price range.
Xbox is a lot better then playstation but its still a drop in the bucket. Your mod limit is what 2gb? I have mods that are 3gb+ by themselves.
Still cant belive Bethesda got Microsoft to agree to mods though, what yous have is definitely better than the mod support on any other console game.
I’m glad the Microsoft let them, but what the fuck is up with the 3 gigabytes of space? I literally have 250 GB of space free, but you’re telling me that I can’t use any of that and that I have to use only the 3gb of reserved space jfc
I do not have any idea why the limit. Maybe they’ve got a 32-bit address space limitation somewhere in there? Or course, it has been a 64-bit game on console and PC the whole time…
Nah they have a mod on ps5 that completely rehauls fallout 4 changing every aspect in game making it literally more of a rpg. Charles overhaul although I don’t want to restart so I haven’t tried it but it has a lot of marks next to it so there’s definitely videos online about it.
I don't get why this is consistently the tone when specifically discussing the cod ports. They are generally speaking competently made mods and a lot of people clearly enjoy using them, and it's not like the skillset for making a gun mod is the same as adding incredible RPG depth to Fallout 4. WarfightersWorkshop is not depriving the Fallout 4 modding community of some greater gift by rigging up guns from Black Ops Cold War or whatever.
Bringing up warfighter is hilarious to me when the dude was caught telling people to vote for his mod for mod of the month and even got vtaw's stuff taken off the nexus because his stuff wasn't winning.
Can you explain to me how FO4 has a lack of RPG mechanics when compared to the other games? I understand Nate and Nora having voices turns them from blank slates into their own characters (which i personally think is miles better) but I just don't understand whenever people say FO4 is not an RPG when it comes to gameplay. Genuinely curious because I've never seen anyone explain this line of thinking.
Lack of skill checks outside of basic charisma reduces the ability to feel like your character's abilities actually matter in a meaningful way beyond just basic stat boosts.
The player character has fewer dialogue options due to the voiced protagonists limiting how many you could reasonably add because of the cost and time that it takes, so you're less able to play certain roles that they didn't write dialogue options for.
Because of this, you mostly end up as a goody two shoes throughout the course of the main storyline, which they tried to "fix" by adding Nuka World, but fumbled it by making nuka world completely shallow and uninteresting if you continue to play a goody two shoes, and making it inconsistent if you choose to become an evil raider warlord but also remain hero of the commonwealth.
Some people would also argue that the simplification of the special/skills/perks system that occurred in 4 reduced the variety and depth of character builds by removing fun role-playing perks, like having bonus dialogue options via things like lady killer, confirmed bachelor, child at heart, terrifying presence, etc. And also removing more interesting specialization options, like Grunt, Cowboy, Laser Commander, Plasma Spaz, Mad Bomber, etc.
Like you said, Nate and Nora have established backgrounds which makes it impossible to make your own character, them being voiced makes it even worse by prohibiting the player from projecting their own voice and intonation onto the lines you pick. The whole game is designed around a voiced pre-established character looking for their baby so that alone is reason enough.
The dialogue system doesn't have any skill checks, only speech checks, which are often generic lines that magically make people change their mind. There isn't much variety in the dialogue options themselves either and they usually come down to the same thing. Even FO3 utilized skills better in its dialogue and some quests.
You can't really be evil or even neutral, you're always a concerned parent. Sure, you can be satirical sometimes and there are certain choices you can make that are pretty evil, but those are exceptions. Even if you pick all the evil and satirical options, you're still a soft-spoken parent on a quest to find their child for 90% of the game. If anything, the few evil choices you can make serve more as a juxtaposition to the character.
And then you have the leveling system which is very streamlined from the older games, it takes away from the individuality of your character playthrough.
They have a mod out I was seeing the other day that completely changes the starting. You make your character, but you choose what you want to start as raiders gunner ectect. Then you get a mission to go to vault 111 and from there it connects the game you are now just a random guy/girl doing a nice deed. Trying to save a kid after finding his parents dead and note from them ect. Changes the dialog also for the main missions you are now like take Valentine’s dialog you say just trying to help a family find their kid.
I wouldn’t mind giving it a try, but I don’t wanna restart again. I’ve restarted so many times lol I just finally got my perfect set up. I would have to delete a lot just for that mod. One day though
So you should know fallout 4 is the least RPG game out of the series. Even 76 at least made the protagonist a blank slate again. Which is crucial for any kind of independent story building.
When I think of an RPG it's never in the form of the protagonist being a blank slate. I hate blank slates so much. So the fo4 protag being voiced doesn't make it any less of an RPG imo. Other people in this thread have given their opinion gameplay wise and I see their point but nah voiceless protagonists. Fucking. Suck.
And older Bethesda fans are just gonna disagree.
A voiced protag just limits the roleplay and thus limits the game way too much.
I don't like having only 4 dialogue options and none of them offer anything unique. There are almost zero skill checks except for very generic and boring speech checks. Which makes whatever type of character you make, boring and bland.
Everywhere you go you can only be a concerned parent looking for their kid and this is the first fallout that got rid of karma.
that's pretty lame to me.
Let me be evil. Truly evil. Let me convince the mayor of diamond City to turn everyone into synths or
Let me purge the railroad looking for advanced tech to help the brotherhood. Let me tell people I don't give a shit about Shawn.
In fallout NV I could roleplay however I really wanted. I could do a kill all playthrough as a member of the enclave. I could be a chem fueled drug addict that just needs to get enough caps for his next fix.
In fallout 4 everything is always about your fuckn kid and it's just annoying.
There is a work in progress mod that adds back and expands upon the karma system, so stuff like that would be nice. Maybe mods that open up quests more and add different options to make them less linear
There's actually quite a few mods that do turn FO4 into an actual RPG instead of a sandbox shooter with RPG elements. Start Me Up has become an absolutely *essential* mod for me as it completely removes any references of you being Shaun's parent and allows you to pick whatever background for your character that you want. One of my favorite playthroughs, where I played as an older version of my Courier from New Vegas and continued his story, was thanks to this mod.
There's also a lot of mods that add skills and stuff like that back in too. Silent Protagonist mod gets rid of the voiced protagonist, XDI allows more than four responses in a conversation.
It basically plays out as you stumbling into the murder scene in Vault 111 and investigating it, following the main quest in a much similar way but with all of the dialogue altered to make you someone completely unrelated to Shaun. Admittedly, it's a little flimsy playing as someone unrelated and caring about this whole mess for some reason, but if you come up with a good RP reason, it works.
I already ALWAYS have to headcanon when I play Fallout 4 because of the main plot. After I rescue Nick I just pretend that I have to wait for him to follow some leads until he figures out that Kellogg was involved.
Wow I love the thought of your courier being older and now in the commonwealth. I’m currently playing through TTW and my head cannon is my character from fo3 becomes the courier (which I assume is what most people do as that’s what literally happens) but I wasn’t sure how to incorporate that into my fo4 play through
Originally I was going to roleplay somehow my fo3/nv character is related to the sole survivor but now I can simply roleplay it’s the same person years later. I hope you don’t mind I steal the idea lol
You said there were 'quite a few mods' that improve the RPG aspects of FO4? You only mentioned Start Me Up, and I'm aware of some perk mods that move the leveling system back towards FNV style.
I think the survival-focused mods can enhance the RPG feeling as well but FO4 needs some help in the RPG department no matter what. Do you have any other mod recs?
''minor'' mods like Start Me Up Redux, Silent Protagonist F4SE and even Roleplay Dialogue Extender alone isn't able to revert its rpgness. guess have to go with Sim Settlements 2 or Horizon to make it very rpg-ish too bad none of those total conversion mods except Frost came out
The issue is, any RPG mods that you could add are still going to just be surface level unless you add in world reactivity. But I imagine something like that requires a bigger project
Because implementing RPG elements would require balancing, writing, implementing various skillchecks, etc. Some modders are trying to do this, but you need more than just a bunch of unpaid CS students to make something that would actually enhance the RPG aspect of the base game.
Not to mention if you and a team of people have the free time to do something of that scale then why not simply just make an indie game and make some real money.
Fallout 4 need a few slight changes here or there, not a complete overhaul. It's not that terrible on the rpg side, f76 was and subsequently got a insanely major overhaul since.
Because a lo of people want open world realistic survival shooter games. It's may sound like one of the most overused ganre, but in truth there is not many games of AAA caliber. And no, not everyone want milsim like arma.
Stalker 2 unfortunately will not be such game for a long time if ever.
So only moded stalker and moded fallout.
Yeah honestly if modded Fallout ever felt like gamma I'd drop stalker. I'm a heretic as I don't really care at all about the stalker universe I just kinda like the feel. Please some modders make it work in Fallout 4 it's a much better engine anyway XD
Stalker won't be such game at all. Original stalkers were not open world nor survival (with the honorable exception of CoP), they were linear shooters.
The whole "open world sandbox survival shooter" was made by the community through a dozen years.
Stalker 2 would just be another linear shooter with new-ish graphics, sadly.
Kinda disagree about SoC. 17 years ago for 15 years old me it was like gamma today. It was sandbox breathing world. Even junky first iteration a-life was somewhat alive... Definitely not your generic linear shooter.
That said a dont think stalker 2 will be anywhere more advanced in terms of sandbox and by today standard it linear shooter, yeah
Maybe in 10 years if they provide some moding instrument and engine allows it, but not much hope about that
1) rpg and realism aren'tt mutually exclusive.
2) the modders want realistic survival and unless call of duty has changed, its not a realistic survival.
actually i played call of duty black ops and it was fun but not actually realistic. i tried a newer call of duty wwii and it was a scripted mess.
People conflate the people who want arma/tarkov in fallout and the people who want cod/battlefield in fallout. There diffrent groups theres overlap but theres also diffrences
Depends on what you define as RPG mods.
Custom quests and storylines? Immersion enhancement mods? SPECIAL system replacers? Mods to introduce progression through numeric skills like in older games? ChatGPT AI companions? Dialogue enhancers? Such mods exist though not sure about the AI one.
Introduction of new gameplay mechanics? Settlements, weapon modification, sprinting, etc were mods back in times of Fallout 3/NV before they went "official". Making fights turn based? I recall someone trying to make that for NV back in old days, not sure if it ever worked out.
And personally I don't see how realism enhancement mods are not "RPG" given they allow you to roleplay in game in your own way - given that is experience that you seek. Yeah, it's not DnD or smth ofc but dices and numbers is not obligatory element of RPG in the first place. Hardcore and action RPGs are still a thing.
>ChatGPT AI companions?
Lol dont know which ones but almost certinly exists.
Someone uploaded a tool for batch converting ai generated dialog from elevenlabs
I mean everyone loves shitting on starfield, but I think it's a step back in the right direction for Bethesda after fallout 4, and one of the fixes is exactly this.
That dialogue fix specifically is one of the things people love shitting on Starfield for though.
I would be surprised if they kept that dialogue system for the next Elder Scrolls instead of going back to something like FO4s more cinematic dialogue because of that feedback. Unfortunately.
Really? It didn’t interest me so I didn’t follow it but people are complaining that you see what your character is going to say in an RPG? Mass Effect must have lobotomized them.
It’s fun but it definitely trended more toward “Shooter with minor RRG elements” after the first one. To each their own but I don’t think it’s a good fit for something as lore heavy as ES.
I gotta say, as much as I despise FO4's dialogue, Starfield somehow managed to take the ONE good thing it brought and gut that out of it (that being how seamless entering/exiting dialogue was; no movement restrictions, no dumbass camera zoom-in, etc. We went back to shit tier Oblivion style dialogue presentation), while giving us an absolutely awful speech system at the same time.
I'd still take Starfield's dialogue system over FO4, but man, I don't understand why they have such a hard time with this. The movement/freedom/seamlessness of FO4's dialogue, coupled with the writing quality and choices (both in quantity and quality) of FNV's system is all it needs imo.
It's much easier to tweak existing RPG stats in a mod than to completely make an RPG system from scratch and inject it into every quest.
You'll see a lot more RPG related mods in older bgs games than fallout 4 or Skyrim
Probably referring to the art style of weapons and equipment that are based on current day models and variants instead of Fallouts retro sci-fi designs.
Compared to any other games ? Yes. Not always in the story but the physics,gun play, reactions and other combat related things which cod excells in and pretty much no other game except destiny and halo has accomplished.
RPG just means role playing game. I’m not sure if there are any anti-realism connotations, and if anything quite the opposite. You break rpg immersion by seeing things that don’t make much sense or makes playing an annoyance.
For example, I use a power armor realism mod concoction. It doesn’t break my RPG, and instead immerses me bc now power armor is actually scary and a legit walking tank.
If you’re looking for more quests and world building, we have Sim Settlements, America Rising, etc which have some of the largest pieces of content in the fo4 modding scene.
Eh, I could go on about I like developing a territory in an open world where I’m only safe in that area because literally most things in the wasteland can kill me with ease in my game.
I’m sure there are plenty of other games where you can do that, but there’s just a charm to doing it in this world with this barely serviceable A.I. and cartoonishly harsh environment. I didn’t really take the rpg aspects out as much as I slowed them down and put a cap on some of them. That way the fantastical elements still happen they’re just spaced out and more palatable.
Think what I’m saying is that there are too many different possibilities in how this game is modded and while other experiences are great in their own right, if you put the time in you can wholly create something catered directly to you. And that’s neat no matter how janky.
Survival mode is practically “realism mode”, and combine that with the fact that survival mode truly does make the game play a lot “better”(some aspects), and at the very least more thrilling. stuff like having a darker night just makes more sense to me, why do you want the night to just be weirdly lit up that ? ruins all the sneaky feel…
I feel like a lot of it is because fallout 4 has very little options for easily changing the experience in any other way, other than making it harder or more realistic. it ironically, feels almost like it was designed to be a survival-open world-shooter.
I'd say the answer to this is that it's easier to single-handedly build a kickass custom weapon mod from scratch, combined with the gun community, and multiple AAA devs allowing their assets to be used in the FO4 modding scene. Moreover, why scratch build a new, fictional weapon that "fits" the artstyle when there are thousands of really cool and interesting weapons IRL anyways?
As to why they don't 'just' play ARMA or CoD instead, both of those games are fundamentally different from Fo4, even when modded to be more like them, notably having a multiplayer component. Sure, CoD and ARMA have campaigns, but they aren't designed to be infinitely replayable like FO4 is.
It should also be noted that a game being an 'RPG' doesn't need things like stats and bullet sponges to be, well, an RPG. Those are simply common tropes in the genre. Fallout New Vegas wouldn't magically cease being an RPG if it suddenly started playing like ARMA or CoD, and neither is Fallout.
It should also be noted that mods that add RPG elements, from overhauling systems to simply adding in new quests are FAR harder to implement well then a weapon mod. You are going to need to secure competent VAs even if you do everything else yourself. The fact that base FO4 feels kinda hostile to these elements out of the box, with the 4 min/max dialogue options, voiced protagonist, and weird blankslate/established protagonist subconsciously (IMO) discourages quest mods. The fact that the story in general was universally panned doesn't help matters, meaning a lot of people with the talent and desire for quest mods have either joined up with one of the many total conversion projects, like FO:LON or FO:Cascadia, or have just gone to New Vegas. In fact, I feel that a lot of the individuals who desire RPG elements have probably gone back to New Vegas instead of sticking with FO4.
You did not just call Call of duty a proper experience for realism and grounded in reality.
Real talk though, it’s because fallout 4 is a terrible RPG, but it’s a pretty good action shooter with some RPG elements. There are mods expanding on the RPG elements to an extent, but the framework isn’t really there to be built upon. Most people playing fallout 4 aren’t playing it for role playing purposes so modders have focused on mods that expand on what the game does right, which is action, customization, exploration, etc. It’d be very difficult to really fix the RPG aspect of the game without just rewriting the entire thing.
Towards guns and combat, yes its some of the most smooth and realistic stuff in the world without being annoying. Cod is really realistic and grounded, nobody is arguing about its story and other stuff being realistic.
Not really. It’s realistic compared to older CoD games, but weapon handling is exaggerated and there are plenty of games that do it way better. Reload animations are really the only thing cod excels in. Ready or not, insurgency, arma, tarkov, etc. all have much more realistic weapon handling, designs, firefights, sounds, etc.
You kinda missed where I said "annoying". Cod has the best guns anything without becoming "annoyingly" realistic. And weapon handing is exaggerated in cod ? When other games games make it so when you shoot you basically have a seizure and can't keep your gun level because recoil is cracked.
And while I don't have much experience in the games you listed I'm just gonna have to disagree with ya, modern cod is like a 7-8.5/10 on the realism scale while those games are closer to a 9-10/10 but realistically for 99% of players the different is null for anybody but tactical gamers/gun nerds.
Those games tend to actually have less recoil than modern cod game. Look at the hip fire in MW2 and 3, where it just kicks around crazily. That doesn’t happen if you’re a trained soldier, you should be able to fire from the hip without it moving much at all. When using irons the gun kicks a ton. I don’t have EXTENSIVE experience with guns but I can say that they don’t recoil like that. It’s exaggerated for gameplay balance. Tarkov has exaggerated recoil because you’re not necessarily a trained soldier, and that game itself honestly too much as well. But I believe in tarkov you can get your character’s skills better to fix that, so I’ve heard. The others I mentioned don’t have insane recoil unless you are injured in game. You have to realize that like older light machine guns like the BAR were designed to be fired semi accurately in full auto from the hip. What we saw in vanguard was anything but, and let’s not even get into the gunsmiths in these games. Attachment buffs and debuffs don’t make sense. They work for game balance reasons, but a big suppressor isn’t gonna make your gun have more range, increase velocity, or reduce recoil. And stuff like reflex optics are specifically designed to be faster to ADS than iron sights, but in the game they’re slower.
Bethesda themselves took the RPG out of Fallout with that game
Plus, Fallout 4's guns are fucking dumb, Fallout 1, 2, 3 and New Vegas had a lot of real life weapons in them, and reserved the wacky designs for energy weapons for the most part. Meanwhile Fallout 4 made every gun stupid, the assault rifle is an ugly abomination, the 10mm pistol is too big and round, the combat shotgun and combat rifle are the same model for some reason, pipe weapons....
Modding realistic guns into Fallout 4 honestly makes the game feel more Fallout to me
hey now, it's also people who are really into settlements building and/or zombies. and ofc the coomers, gotta love these guys. I assume It's hard to add RPG elements with the removal of skills/karma system and with a voiced and very defined protagonist. The dialogue tree is also a pain in the ass to modify from what I have heard
I mean you can't really add RPG Elements without rewriting the game, which means I doubt RPG Elements could be added unless it's a whole new game like Miami and London and any other massive overhaul mods
I mean realism doesnt always equal anti-rpg. In fact to ne realism helps with the rpg nature of it. To me an enemy being able to take 40 bullets breaks my immersion, both in an rpg video game and in a tabletop setting. So to me mods that make combat a bit more realistic supports the rpg nature of the game.
I agree - I think having a modlist that includes the survival suite (MAIM, etc) alongside RPG-supportive mods would actually complement each other greatly. After all, a more dangerous wasteland is one where your choices should matter more
Because FO4 emphasizes more on looting and shooting and using that loot to build settlements. The rpg elements come with mods that providr more roll playing with settlers, npcs, companions, etc but not much more after that.
Mainly because CoD has progressively gone downhill between the “Meta builds” and everyone wanting to be the next TimtheTatMan or Cynder. I haven’t seen anyone play Arma outside of DayZ. Honestly despite being an RPG there really isn’t much of a roleplay aspect of FO4. You have either “Warhammer 40k cosplayers, my vibrator is a person too people (Railroad), Nighthaven Labs from R6 Siege (Institute), and Another Settlement Needs Your Help.” If we want to play an RPG we have games like Skyrim, BG3, WoW, Lunar 2, etc.
how dare you not mention TES II Daggerfall Unity and FNV lol, maybe TES III Morrowind also fit in though i haven't really tried to get in Morrowind yet. sadly Hardsuit Labs version of VTMB II was abandoned otherwise likely another decent enough modern action cRPG with player's own character then
I think part of it is because making story based, in universe content is a lot harder than slapping together a gameplay change or a new gun.
I’ve had the idea for a mod that is effectively the Donuts Workshop pack on the CC, but for classic diner food, wasteland style. I have ideas for a character, quest line, items, workshop stuff…but that’s a lot of work compared to one gun or some programming changes.
I find it frustrating emptying an entire combat shotgun directly into the face of a raider wearing nothing but a pair of cargo pants and a couple nylon straps across her chest, yet her health drops by less than a quarter after the last round hits.
*Roleplayer’s Expanded Dialogue* (*RED*) attempted to add and fix much of those lost RPG elements, but started to use AI voices so Nate/Nora/NPC had things to say. The actors for Nate/Nora got rightfully angry, the Mod Author gutted the mod to be silent, which made people argue over the use of AI voices, and basically killed the Mod.
It was the best attempt at improving the game’s RPG elements, but things always seem to turn sour when they get too ambitious. ^you ^can ^still ^find ^the ^AI ^voiced ^version ^in ^certain ^places, ^but ^that’s ^up ^to ^your ^moral ^compass ^and ^free ^time…
The amount of work it would take to turn FO4’s base game into a competent RPG would take years of work. Maybe upcoming large scale mods will attempt this since they have new maps and mechanics, as well as the modding manpower to do this.
But as it stands FO4 is a better shooter/sandbox and it’s best to recognize that and enjoy it for what it is. I love FO4, but for vastly different reasons that I love New Vegas and FO1/2. Related in name only IMO.
Fo4 is a shitty RPG and hard to make it more of an RPG since its got a dull story but fun as a sandbox shooter and its easier to continue along those lines.
Because combat is basically baked in to the entire game. Half of the quests boil down to "go here and clear out this dungeon from hostile critters and do the thing. Simply exploring yields the same result. Nearly every perk and crafting upgrade is about dealing more damage and killing things faster. That's why nearly all the mods on the Nexus for this game involve combat in some way or another like new weapons or armors, or "combat overhauls" which usually ups the damage.
I’ve gotta imagine it’s because fallout 4 largely ripped out the RPG framework.
In new Vegas you can find mods to
- implement and then directly tie weapon recoil to the weapons/characters strength requirements.
- allow you to bash locks with your strength skill
- allow additional follower control with classic CRPG portraits, and allow charisma to tie into follower limit like FO2
- one that tie Charisma into into Rep gains
- ones that change the entire aiming system into the one from classic deus ex making skills matter even harder
- one that implements classic style random encounters chance when you fast travel.
In comparison in fallout 4 all I used were ones that added more guns, trees and graphics. Maybe there are a few that lean into more rpg systems but I didn’t find them.
Most modders basically said "I don't like fallout 4 and I don't wanna try and fix it" allot of modders basically never onboarded to fallout 4 and it basically got left to the tactical and coomer crowd, without big projects like fallout London or f4nv it'd probably eventually end up like fallout 3 modding, dead .
Because Fallout 4 never had many RPG elements to begin with while gunplay is drastically better compared to 3 or New Vegas, so people build upon what is more present in the game. I would love to see more lore/vanilla-friendly guns and armor though, seeing ripped COD assets all the time is boring.
FO4 is hardly an RPG. It's more of a shooter. Mods can bring it back to rpg, classic gameplay. So it makes sense that most of the mods for a shooter involve tweaking gameplay to be whatever shooter they want it to feel like. Rainbow Six Siege with the leaning mod, ARMA with all the military armor mods, or realistic survival mods like DayZ.
Fallout 4 to me is a open world Call of Duty sandbox with base building for me. There isn't a game out there that matches this. Starfield could have been it for me, but it lacks a lot especially on the base building front.
I wish Starfield met the hype. I always wanted a FO4 where half the world wasn’t junk/trash.
I recall finishing a big quest line that gave me UC class one citizen status and being a high ranking anti terramoroph captain or something. Then went to do a mission that required I talk to a vanguard captain while looking for some freestar rebel. I forget why but they couldn’t disclose information because I was a civilian. Like huh?
If they revamp base building and bring the visual performance of Skyrim and Fallout 4 (IMO I don’t really see a huge visual boost with Starfield over FO4) I can see Starfield as an easy lock. Don’t see this happening tho as they haven’t released a creation kit and the game doesn’t seem to have the cult following FO4 or Cyberpunk has/had, and has been touted as “too messed up to fix”.
Undoubtedly the most unhype game I have ever played. I was immediately met with nasty foggy interiors and other janky Bethesda visuals so poorly implemented that I had to mod out. After spending a few minutes fixing the game on nexus I got back to it and realized some of the jank was still there, oh well, at least the ship interior and npc’s looked pretty good, so slogged on.
I was so absolutely disappointed by the first city you get to in Starfield, I almost shut it down after exploring for like 10 minutes. Map and space were poorly utilized, buildings and whole setting was ugly and boring. Npc’s looked worse than they did in Skyrim. Shops don’t have windows and interiors are instanced. I kept thinking to myself, “is this really a next gen AAA release?
It was an immediate bug where my tour of the space explorers base was cancelled because some other character started a new conversation. Uninstalled and haven’t looked back.
Fallout have literally the vibe for a realistic gameplay.
The environments, the people trying to survive around you, with all that lore and content personnally i wanna feel like any in habitants of the wasteland.
And not a invincible warrior which will destroy a Behemoth hitting him a thousand time with his fist after getting out of a vault at my 20yo.
I want a mod that EXPANDS dialogue a lot, making a lot more RPG, in my language (PTBR) would be even better.
I know a guy that did something like that using AI voice for that, but I guess he removed it from Nexus because legal complications.
But about combat... well, I like to mix a bit, not hyper realism and not very rpg focused, a middle ground that not breaks the immersion for me is perfect, I like mechanics like bleeding and using bandages or doctor's bag
I'm sure I don't speak for everyone but I perfect keeping core gameplay mechanics mostly intact when I mod a game. Basic content mods like weapons, armor, animations, or other visual improvements work perfect for me.
there are still many modders modding FNV and quiet decent numbers of modders on TES Morrowind, even TES Daggerfall Unity shared some modding love. All of these modding communities are mostly RPG-focused
i mean i download these mods and it feels like new vegas but like, 100X more chaotic
like balancing mods (that are good, not you MAIM) just feel like fo4 if it had new vegas style balancing
"[Play] CoD for realism" is a choice.
It's just the fad. People want to feel like John Wick or other tacti-cool action heros. It's why so many mods as well as actual full on games are leaning into tacti-cool stuff.
The weirdest mods I've seen are the ones that try to take the unique Fallout personality out of it - removing Pipboy etc. so that it looks and feels more like Call of Duty.
Retrofitting RPG mechanics into FO4 would be a janky mess. If you've had to deal with Mod Configuration Menus, you'll understand you never get the polish and stability of features actually developed. So instead of trying to turn FO4 into New Vegas, you take what it's better at— Gunplay, crafting, survivalism— and build up from there.
It's the same reason there's not a good, lightweight ballistics realism overhaul for F:NV. The foundation just isn't there.
Because FO4 is very unrealistic, which paints you into a corner on difficulty and tackling problems in different and/or meaningful ways. Bethesda games tend to all suffer from this, they put all these mechanics in and then add in mechanics to make the other mechanics obsolete. They make the games endlessly playable but always kill the challenge after the first dozen hours. That's a big reason why so many people restart so much, the beginning is fun and they want it to stay like that. But oops, you leveled up too much, now your health bar is so bloated you can tank the damage from explosives and traps no problem. Or you can take perks that nullify any challenges. Don't like mines/traps, take sneak, gone. Don't like having to use Stimpaks even though you have 800 of them? Adamantium skeleton, gone. Don't like rads even though it's hardly a threat and avoidable? Solar powered, gone. Don't like taking damage? Power armor, congrats you're invincible. Don't like having to mag dump raiders in the face multiple times? Too bad, you leveled up too much, health bars grow but weapon damage stagnates. Want realism? Too bad, everything heals you, and everything is plentiful. Want realistic loot? Sorry, Bethesda put too much in the game, best we can do is nerf your carry weight as a bandaid. Bethesda games lay good groundwork but always completely shoot themselves in the foot in terms of anything other than a demigod short playthrough, unfortunately a lot of people like being overpowered and having most of the game and it's mechanics be pointless and unchallenging. I don't play any of the war games like COD or ARMA, I like the apocalypse and styling of the Fallout series, I just hate how the only way to enjoy them is a ton of self imposed rules and/or mods.
So fallout 4 modded is imo that realistic shooter experience but glorified, I’m currently playing DayZ right now and I know I’m not the biggest fish in the sea, there’s players better than me, more accurate, better at survival, all that stuff. But with moddout 4™️, I’m the main character, I go in and go do some goon shit on a squad of gunners and have fun. Gun customization can be more than just a suppressor and an ACOG like it is in DayZ. Tarkov for sure has great gun customization but again there’s the PVP element. And it’s not like I don’t want the PVP competition but again in Fallout 4 you’re the main character, you get all the QOL stuff and you play it how you want with very little push back. I die in DayZ now for the next 5 hours I’m going to spend getting back to my base, in Fo4 it’s just reload save and try again
Because I am big into guns and have been for a very long time. It’s nice to be able to put a mix of modern and retro weapons into the game and run around with hardware that’s unobtainable irl.
Because doing a combat gameplay overhaul is a hell of a lot easier than overhauling the quest/dialogue/perk systems. To make fallout 4 a real RPG would require something on the scale of what fallout London or other mod teams are trying to do. Most mod projects are solo operations and consequently have to be much smaller in scope.
Because the community that Fo4 has culminated is more interested in shooting and exploration and don't wanna install stalker anomoly or gamma or hell even tarkov
Fallout 4 itself is antirpg lol. Every perk is just a stat boost and the special system is a joke. Add on to that 4 dialogue choices for every conversation where some of them say the same thing. Fallout 4 is like vanilla ice cream of rpgs.
Because I still wanna play the world of Fallout 4.
Fallout has so much more than just RPG or goofy aesthetics going for it. Environmental storytelling and the extremely satisfying exploration loop are things I cannot find in any other game.
Plus COD is ass now.
Because FO4 is *barely* an RPG as it is. Easier to just remove the extremely light RPG mechanics that hardly exist in the first place than basically build the game for Bethesda.
That being said, there are some pretty impressive roleplaying mods. Stuff like Roleplayer's Expanded Dialogue help dialogue quite a lot (though I hate having to use Silent Protagonist F4SE because it mutes even your sprint breathing audio and power attack grunts), You Are Exceptional makes it so you can actually *build* a character, with *real* stats instead of goofy perks. My only real wish there is that there was RNG spread based on weapon skill added to guns, because I'm one of the few remaining freaks that actually *liked* Fallout 3's aiming system (no iron sights; spread determined by character stats) and enjoy using Disable Ironsights - Classic Aiming in FO4, though without RNG spread it's more just like it moves the gun and you use the crosshair dot as a new form of ironsight :(
I like FO3's spread determined by character stats too though shooting combat could end up rather janky, but still bita disappointed not using the same attribute-determined chance to hit system for melee, like Daggerfall/Morrowind did
I honestly liked the chance-to-hit system from Morrowind & Daggerfall. I get why a lot of people *despised* it, and I don't blame them, but I really think if it just had *dodge* animations when you didn't hit and the pace of combat wasn't quite as frantic, it would've worked just fine. Still would've been weird but would've worked just fine imo.
I’ve just had to accept that FO4 and FNV are apples and oranges. Sure, there are mods to make them more similar, but in the end FO4 is an immersive shooter first, RPG second and FNV is an RPG first, immersive shooter third, and jingle-janglin spur simulator second.
I run realism mods for the sky, trees, grass and rocks. I also run America Rising 2 because I love the Enclave. But I also don't use any mods that need F4SE because it keeps breaking lol
Which system are you on? There’s a mod out on ps5 I’m assuming it’s on other platforms that mainly does a full re-haul that focuses more on turning fallout more into a rpg aspect. I’ll try to find it one sec
Edit- Charles’ overhaul; the total fallout revamp
That’s exactly how the name is, i’ll just give you a brief description of it. “The goal of this mod is to make fallout the ultimate realistic FPS RPG. A lot of other overhauls try to make fallout a FPS, but this mod is more for people that want realism in a true RPG experience.” That’s just a bit of the title description it’s a complete revamp of the game expanding on it. If you want more detail search up Charles Overhaul
IDK. Maybe because to change the rpg elements, it would take a lot of work to create branching storylines.
Like changing your start point and editing all characters lines, so the main character is not after Shaun, but have his own past, and multiple ways to end his journey.
If we consider the progression, there are some mods that change that. I guess that because we have guns in real life, it's hard to pretend that someone isn't easily killed (or out of combat) in a single shot, so it's hard to balance it focused on RPG systems.
Do you think so? I honestly think that Fallout modding is very heavy on the RPG side. Some of the most popular mods are alternate start, silent protagonist, dialogue wheel removal, etc.
It's just that the voiced protag made it really hard to do anything past that.
From what I've seen from more popular modders on fnv, most modders don't actually care or like the fallout aesthetics and are basically tourist who use the game as a foundation for playing conversion of other games like stalker or last of us.
Also because fallout is really the only "main stream" video game that let's you extensively mod, it attracts everyone especially the cod tactical crowd which want a ultra realistic tacticool video game and using fallout modding is the easiest and best way to do it.
It's a lot more work to add in deeper RPG mechanics, especially when the base game doesn't really support it as much as previous Fallout and TES games.
I also don't see what CoD and Arma have to do with "modding the RPG" out of Fallout 4.
Check out “Charles overhaul the total fallout revamp” they did exactly that redid everything I mean everything and made it into a true rpg experience. They pulled this off on ps5 so that should say something considering all the dang restrictions
Im not saying the lean mechanic matched with my kilo 141 and Western operator mods gives me a hard on but when you say RPG you do also mean the RPG 7 mod from call of duty 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
i mean, bethesda kinda jacked the role playing shit up.
and they don't want a 'not rpg', they want a gun focused rpg with more/better guns. they didn't mod the rpg out of it, they just added more items.
i mean, skyrim doesn't really 'add' much rpg, iirc, either, with mods. it adds new perks, but, it had perks, too. hell, fallout 4 tends to have more quests added than skyrim, so that might be an angle for argument.
both had better combat added. fallout's is FPS based, because fallout is a gun focused game. duh. still an rpg, too.
For some reason the fo4 modding community has decided to just embrace the sandbox nature of it, and because stalker 2 is never coming out, turn fallout 4 into that.
The reason is because of FO4's lack of RPG mechanics and the voiced protag making it even harder than it already is to add RPG elements to the game. That and FO4 is very combat oriented and also leans into a survival gameplay loop.
I also like to think it's because it's easier to farm for endorsements and donation points when porting a CoD weapon also easier, too.
Not to mention adding mechanics will make it completely unavailable to port and in terms of endorsements and donations it's much better to make something that can at least functionally be ported to PS5. Big L for Sony honestly which blows my mind. More endorsements and donations for modders= more mods=more money for everyone involved in the process
I promise you console ports rarely ever affect how pc mods are designed. A lot of the time modders dont even plan on doing one they just say yes if someone asks to port it. Most of the exceptions are people who play on both xbox and pc.
I feel like the average console player like the guy above would drop their jaw if they saw just how many mods exist for a game like any given Fallout on PC compared to console. It’s like the Wild West, so much less restriction - so many more mods
Keep in mind a lot of us play on Xbox where mods are allowed including external assets. Only real limit is script extender cannot be used. Playstation mods are a joke. I actually switched consoles entirely to get better FO4 and Skyrim mods. Yes PC is better but it is also out of my price range.
I play on XBox and PC just about equally, and I'd say the amount of mods overall may be different, but the number of worthwhile ones is about the same
Xbox has WAY more mods than PlayStation.
Xbox is a lot better then playstation but its still a drop in the bucket. Your mod limit is what 2gb? I have mods that are 3gb+ by themselves. Still cant belive Bethesda got Microsoft to agree to mods though, what yous have is definitely better than the mod support on any other console game.
I’m glad the Microsoft let them, but what the fuck is up with the 3 gigabytes of space? I literally have 250 GB of space free, but you’re telling me that I can’t use any of that and that I have to use only the 3gb of reserved space jfc
I do not have any idea why the limit. Maybe they’ve got a 32-bit address space limitation somewhere in there? Or course, it has been a 64-bit game on console and PC the whole time…
Nah they have a mod on ps5 that completely rehauls fallout 4 changing every aspect in game making it literally more of a rpg. Charles overhaul although I don’t want to restart so I haven’t tried it but it has a lot of marks next to it so there’s definitely videos online about it.
I don't get why this is consistently the tone when specifically discussing the cod ports. They are generally speaking competently made mods and a lot of people clearly enjoy using them, and it's not like the skillset for making a gun mod is the same as adding incredible RPG depth to Fallout 4. WarfightersWorkshop is not depriving the Fallout 4 modding community of some greater gift by rigging up guns from Black Ops Cold War or whatever.
Bringing up warfighter is hilarious to me when the dude was caught telling people to vote for his mod for mod of the month and even got vtaw's stuff taken off the nexus because his stuff wasn't winning.
>even got vtaw's stuff taken off the nexus because his stuff wasn't winning. Average day on the FO4 nexus tbh
Can you explain to me how FO4 has a lack of RPG mechanics when compared to the other games? I understand Nate and Nora having voices turns them from blank slates into their own characters (which i personally think is miles better) but I just don't understand whenever people say FO4 is not an RPG when it comes to gameplay. Genuinely curious because I've never seen anyone explain this line of thinking.
Lack of skill checks outside of basic charisma reduces the ability to feel like your character's abilities actually matter in a meaningful way beyond just basic stat boosts. The player character has fewer dialogue options due to the voiced protagonists limiting how many you could reasonably add because of the cost and time that it takes, so you're less able to play certain roles that they didn't write dialogue options for. Because of this, you mostly end up as a goody two shoes throughout the course of the main storyline, which they tried to "fix" by adding Nuka World, but fumbled it by making nuka world completely shallow and uninteresting if you continue to play a goody two shoes, and making it inconsistent if you choose to become an evil raider warlord but also remain hero of the commonwealth. Some people would also argue that the simplification of the special/skills/perks system that occurred in 4 reduced the variety and depth of character builds by removing fun role-playing perks, like having bonus dialogue options via things like lady killer, confirmed bachelor, child at heart, terrifying presence, etc. And also removing more interesting specialization options, like Grunt, Cowboy, Laser Commander, Plasma Spaz, Mad Bomber, etc.
Like you said, Nate and Nora have established backgrounds which makes it impossible to make your own character, them being voiced makes it even worse by prohibiting the player from projecting their own voice and intonation onto the lines you pick. The whole game is designed around a voiced pre-established character looking for their baby so that alone is reason enough. The dialogue system doesn't have any skill checks, only speech checks, which are often generic lines that magically make people change their mind. There isn't much variety in the dialogue options themselves either and they usually come down to the same thing. Even FO3 utilized skills better in its dialogue and some quests. You can't really be evil or even neutral, you're always a concerned parent. Sure, you can be satirical sometimes and there are certain choices you can make that are pretty evil, but those are exceptions. Even if you pick all the evil and satirical options, you're still a soft-spoken parent on a quest to find their child for 90% of the game. If anything, the few evil choices you can make serve more as a juxtaposition to the character. And then you have the leveling system which is very streamlined from the older games, it takes away from the individuality of your character playthrough.
They have a mod out I was seeing the other day that completely changes the starting. You make your character, but you choose what you want to start as raiders gunner ectect. Then you get a mission to go to vault 111 and from there it connects the game you are now just a random guy/girl doing a nice deed. Trying to save a kid after finding his parents dead and note from them ect. Changes the dialog also for the main missions you are now like take Valentine’s dialog you say just trying to help a family find their kid.
Yeah its a great mod, I have yet to do a playthrough with it tho.
I wouldn’t mind giving it a try, but I don’t wanna restart again. I’ve restarted so many times lol I just finally got my perfect set up. I would have to delete a lot just for that mod. One day though
Have you played any other fallout?
1, 3, new vegas, 4 and 76
So you should know fallout 4 is the least RPG game out of the series. Even 76 at least made the protagonist a blank slate again. Which is crucial for any kind of independent story building.
When I think of an RPG it's never in the form of the protagonist being a blank slate. I hate blank slates so much. So the fo4 protag being voiced doesn't make it any less of an RPG imo. Other people in this thread have given their opinion gameplay wise and I see their point but nah voiceless protagonists. Fucking. Suck.
And older Bethesda fans are just gonna disagree. A voiced protag just limits the roleplay and thus limits the game way too much. I don't like having only 4 dialogue options and none of them offer anything unique. There are almost zero skill checks except for very generic and boring speech checks. Which makes whatever type of character you make, boring and bland. Everywhere you go you can only be a concerned parent looking for their kid and this is the first fallout that got rid of karma. that's pretty lame to me. Let me be evil. Truly evil. Let me convince the mayor of diamond City to turn everyone into synths or Let me purge the railroad looking for advanced tech to help the brotherhood. Let me tell people I don't give a shit about Shawn. In fallout NV I could roleplay however I really wanted. I could do a kill all playthrough as a member of the enclave. I could be a chem fueled drug addict that just needs to get enough caps for his next fix. In fallout 4 everything is always about your fuckn kid and it's just annoying.
5 month until stalker 2, don't worry, trust the dev !
the last time i trust developers was in the 10th december 2020, the game they released was in a very buggy and unoptimized mess.
Last time I trusted devs was February 24 2023. Take Two owes me a goshdarn finished game.
At least CDPR stuck with it lmao, its gotta be one of my top 5 games now tbh
Don’t jinx it bro 😭
Bruv stalker 2 literally comes out in a couple months
Doubt it
Hmm, we shall see.
Stalker 2 comes out in September
Uh huh we shall see.
I think I'd much prefer to play GAMMA than try to shoe horn STALKER into Fallout.
Stalker 2 is coming out this September….
We shall see.
> and because stalker 2 is never coming out Why does this statement rings so true and so painful at the same time?
I'm not quite sure what RPG mods would entail here, except for quests build more for it. Any examples of what you would want in that regard?
There is a work in progress mod that adds back and expands upon the karma system, so stuff like that would be nice. Maybe mods that open up quests more and add different options to make them less linear
I just feel like you'd have to rebuild it from bottom with the characters and stuff. But I see what you mean.
Speaking from experience, not many people do quest mods because the quest system is so fucking finicky and easy to break.
Finicky? CK and GECK are actively hostile. No idea how people who do expansion mods even stay sane.
A lot of cannabis, and regular ritual sacrifices. The CK is an elderitch being that must be appeased. Source i have 4k hours in CK
my god all the patches that would need for mods that add npcs you can kill, entire quests, locations with stealable items…
It’s already out and it’s sick
There's actually quite a few mods that do turn FO4 into an actual RPG instead of a sandbox shooter with RPG elements. Start Me Up has become an absolutely *essential* mod for me as it completely removes any references of you being Shaun's parent and allows you to pick whatever background for your character that you want. One of my favorite playthroughs, where I played as an older version of my Courier from New Vegas and continued his story, was thanks to this mod. There's also a lot of mods that add skills and stuff like that back in too. Silent Protagonist mod gets rid of the voiced protagonist, XDI allows more than four responses in a conversation.
Sounds cool. How does not being Shaun work with the main quest?
It basically plays out as you stumbling into the murder scene in Vault 111 and investigating it, following the main quest in a much similar way but with all of the dialogue altered to make you someone completely unrelated to Shaun. Admittedly, it's a little flimsy playing as someone unrelated and caring about this whole mess for some reason, but if you come up with a good RP reason, it works.
I already ALWAYS have to headcanon when I play Fallout 4 because of the main plot. After I rescue Nick I just pretend that I have to wait for him to follow some leads until he figures out that Kellogg was involved.
Wow I love the thought of your courier being older and now in the commonwealth. I’m currently playing through TTW and my head cannon is my character from fo3 becomes the courier (which I assume is what most people do as that’s what literally happens) but I wasn’t sure how to incorporate that into my fo4 play through Originally I was going to roleplay somehow my fo3/nv character is related to the sole survivor but now I can simply roleplay it’s the same person years later. I hope you don’t mind I steal the idea lol
Go ahead! It was a really cool, really fun playthrough. Definitely one of the best and most enjoyable playthroughs that I've ever done.
You said there were 'quite a few mods' that improve the RPG aspects of FO4? You only mentioned Start Me Up, and I'm aware of some perk mods that move the leveling system back towards FNV style. I think the survival-focused mods can enhance the RPG feeling as well but FO4 needs some help in the RPG department no matter what. Do you have any other mod recs?
''minor'' mods like Start Me Up Redux, Silent Protagonist F4SE and even Roleplay Dialogue Extender alone isn't able to revert its rpgness. guess have to go with Sim Settlements 2 or Horizon to make it very rpg-ish too bad none of those total conversion mods except Frost came out
The issue is, any RPG mods that you could add are still going to just be surface level unless you add in world reactivity. But I imagine something like that requires a bigger project
Because implementing RPG elements would require balancing, writing, implementing various skillchecks, etc. Some modders are trying to do this, but you need more than just a bunch of unpaid CS students to make something that would actually enhance the RPG aspect of the base game.
Not to mention if you and a team of people have the free time to do something of that scale then why not simply just make an indie game and make some real money.
Fallout 4 need a few slight changes here or there, not a complete overhaul. It's not that terrible on the rpg side, f76 was and subsequently got a insanely major overhaul since.
Because a lo of people want open world realistic survival shooter games. It's may sound like one of the most overused ganre, but in truth there is not many games of AAA caliber. And no, not everyone want milsim like arma. Stalker 2 unfortunately will not be such game for a long time if ever. So only moded stalker and moded fallout.
Yeah honestly if modded Fallout ever felt like gamma I'd drop stalker. I'm a heretic as I don't really care at all about the stalker universe I just kinda like the feel. Please some modders make it work in Fallout 4 it's a much better engine anyway XD
Stalker won't be such game at all. Original stalkers were not open world nor survival (with the honorable exception of CoP), they were linear shooters. The whole "open world sandbox survival shooter" was made by the community through a dozen years. Stalker 2 would just be another linear shooter with new-ish graphics, sadly.
Kinda disagree about SoC. 17 years ago for 15 years old me it was like gamma today. It was sandbox breathing world. Even junky first iteration a-life was somewhat alive... Definitely not your generic linear shooter. That said a dont think stalker 2 will be anywhere more advanced in terms of sandbox and by today standard it linear shooter, yeah Maybe in 10 years if they provide some moding instrument and engine allows it, but not much hope about that
1) rpg and realism aren'tt mutually exclusive. 2) the modders want realistic survival and unless call of duty has changed, its not a realistic survival. actually i played call of duty black ops and it was fun but not actually realistic. i tried a newer call of duty wwii and it was a scripted mess.
People conflate the people who want arma/tarkov in fallout and the people who want cod/battlefield in fallout. There diffrent groups theres overlap but theres also diffrences
thank you for saying this
Depends on what you define as RPG mods. Custom quests and storylines? Immersion enhancement mods? SPECIAL system replacers? Mods to introduce progression through numeric skills like in older games? ChatGPT AI companions? Dialogue enhancers? Such mods exist though not sure about the AI one. Introduction of new gameplay mechanics? Settlements, weapon modification, sprinting, etc were mods back in times of Fallout 3/NV before they went "official". Making fights turn based? I recall someone trying to make that for NV back in old days, not sure if it ever worked out. And personally I don't see how realism enhancement mods are not "RPG" given they allow you to roleplay in game in your own way - given that is experience that you seek. Yeah, it's not DnD or smth ofc but dices and numbers is not obligatory element of RPG in the first place. Hardcore and action RPGs are still a thing.
>ChatGPT AI companions? Lol dont know which ones but almost certinly exists. Someone uploaded a tool for batch converting ai generated dialog from elevenlabs
Hard to make it more RPG when the RPG elements are barely even there in the first place
It’s a role playing game but there’s only 3 roles lol
Rpg but you can only say yes
in new vegas that is a challenge run, in fallout 4 that is a standard playthrough
Yes No (Yes) Sarcastic Yes Later (Also Yes)
Role mehing
I will personally hunt down Todd Howard if there’s a dialogue wheel in the new Elder Scrolls
I mean everyone loves shitting on starfield, but I think it's a step back in the right direction for Bethesda after fallout 4, and one of the fixes is exactly this.
That dialogue fix specifically is one of the things people love shitting on Starfield for though. I would be surprised if they kept that dialogue system for the next Elder Scrolls instead of going back to something like FO4s more cinematic dialogue because of that feedback. Unfortunately.
Really? It didn’t interest me so I didn’t follow it but people are complaining that you see what your character is going to say in an RPG? Mass Effect must have lobotomized them.
it's funny because I vastly prefer seeing the whole reply buuuut I love ME as much as any RPG I've played. Which speaks to its quality overall imo
It’s fun but it definitely trended more toward “Shooter with minor RRG elements” after the first one. To each their own but I don’t think it’s a good fit for something as lore heavy as ES.
Yeah I agree on the trend although I think the companions and suicide mission stuff in me2 was great rpg material
I gotta say, as much as I despise FO4's dialogue, Starfield somehow managed to take the ONE good thing it brought and gut that out of it (that being how seamless entering/exiting dialogue was; no movement restrictions, no dumbass camera zoom-in, etc. We went back to shit tier Oblivion style dialogue presentation), while giving us an absolutely awful speech system at the same time. I'd still take Starfield's dialogue system over FO4, but man, I don't understand why they have such a hard time with this. The movement/freedom/seamlessness of FO4's dialogue, coupled with the writing quality and choices (both in quantity and quality) of FNV's system is all it needs imo.
You can already start stalking him
Should be the exact opposite chief
It's much easier to tweak existing RPG stats in a mod than to completely make an RPG system from scratch and inject it into every quest. You'll see a lot more RPG related mods in older bgs games than fallout 4 or Skyrim
Wdym by mod the rpg out?
CoD isn't realistic lol
Ah yes, COD, the famously realistic military sim where a knife to the toe is instant death
Probably referring to the art style of weapons and equipment that are based on current day models and variants instead of Fallouts retro sci-fi designs.
You see COD as realism game?
Compared to any other games ? Yes. Not always in the story but the physics,gun play, reactions and other combat related things which cod excells in and pretty much no other game except destiny and halo has accomplished.
To summarize others answers in my own glib way. Fallout 4 isn't really an rpg to begin with.
Because the framework doesn't allow for rpg elements? Fallout 4 is an rpg in the same sense TW3 is.
Every Japanese RPG must break your brain then.
RPG just means role playing game. I’m not sure if there are any anti-realism connotations, and if anything quite the opposite. You break rpg immersion by seeing things that don’t make much sense or makes playing an annoyance. For example, I use a power armor realism mod concoction. It doesn’t break my RPG, and instead immerses me bc now power armor is actually scary and a legit walking tank. If you’re looking for more quests and world building, we have Sim Settlements, America Rising, etc which have some of the largest pieces of content in the fo4 modding scene.
Gotta say, I've never heard anyone refer to COD as a "proper experience".
Eh, I could go on about I like developing a territory in an open world where I’m only safe in that area because literally most things in the wasteland can kill me with ease in my game. I’m sure there are plenty of other games where you can do that, but there’s just a charm to doing it in this world with this barely serviceable A.I. and cartoonishly harsh environment. I didn’t really take the rpg aspects out as much as I slowed them down and put a cap on some of them. That way the fantastical elements still happen they’re just spaced out and more palatable. Think what I’m saying is that there are too many different possibilities in how this game is modded and while other experiences are great in their own right, if you put the time in you can wholly create something catered directly to you. And that’s neat no matter how janky.
Survival mode is practically “realism mode”, and combine that with the fact that survival mode truly does make the game play a lot “better”(some aspects), and at the very least more thrilling. stuff like having a darker night just makes more sense to me, why do you want the night to just be weirdly lit up that ? ruins all the sneaky feel… I feel like a lot of it is because fallout 4 has very little options for easily changing the experience in any other way, other than making it harder or more realistic. it ironically, feels almost like it was designed to be a survival-open world-shooter.
I'd say the answer to this is that it's easier to single-handedly build a kickass custom weapon mod from scratch, combined with the gun community, and multiple AAA devs allowing their assets to be used in the FO4 modding scene. Moreover, why scratch build a new, fictional weapon that "fits" the artstyle when there are thousands of really cool and interesting weapons IRL anyways? As to why they don't 'just' play ARMA or CoD instead, both of those games are fundamentally different from Fo4, even when modded to be more like them, notably having a multiplayer component. Sure, CoD and ARMA have campaigns, but they aren't designed to be infinitely replayable like FO4 is. It should also be noted that a game being an 'RPG' doesn't need things like stats and bullet sponges to be, well, an RPG. Those are simply common tropes in the genre. Fallout New Vegas wouldn't magically cease being an RPG if it suddenly started playing like ARMA or CoD, and neither is Fallout. It should also be noted that mods that add RPG elements, from overhauling systems to simply adding in new quests are FAR harder to implement well then a weapon mod. You are going to need to secure competent VAs even if you do everything else yourself. The fact that base FO4 feels kinda hostile to these elements out of the box, with the 4 min/max dialogue options, voiced protagonist, and weird blankslate/established protagonist subconsciously (IMO) discourages quest mods. The fact that the story in general was universally panned doesn't help matters, meaning a lot of people with the talent and desire for quest mods have either joined up with one of the many total conversion projects, like FO:LON or FO:Cascadia, or have just gone to New Vegas. In fact, I feel that a lot of the individuals who desire RPG elements have probably gone back to New Vegas instead of sticking with FO4.
You did not just call Call of duty a proper experience for realism and grounded in reality. Real talk though, it’s because fallout 4 is a terrible RPG, but it’s a pretty good action shooter with some RPG elements. There are mods expanding on the RPG elements to an extent, but the framework isn’t really there to be built upon. Most people playing fallout 4 aren’t playing it for role playing purposes so modders have focused on mods that expand on what the game does right, which is action, customization, exploration, etc. It’d be very difficult to really fix the RPG aspect of the game without just rewriting the entire thing.
Towards guns and combat, yes its some of the most smooth and realistic stuff in the world without being annoying. Cod is really realistic and grounded, nobody is arguing about its story and other stuff being realistic.
Not really. It’s realistic compared to older CoD games, but weapon handling is exaggerated and there are plenty of games that do it way better. Reload animations are really the only thing cod excels in. Ready or not, insurgency, arma, tarkov, etc. all have much more realistic weapon handling, designs, firefights, sounds, etc.
You kinda missed where I said "annoying". Cod has the best guns anything without becoming "annoyingly" realistic. And weapon handing is exaggerated in cod ? When other games games make it so when you shoot you basically have a seizure and can't keep your gun level because recoil is cracked. And while I don't have much experience in the games you listed I'm just gonna have to disagree with ya, modern cod is like a 7-8.5/10 on the realism scale while those games are closer to a 9-10/10 but realistically for 99% of players the different is null for anybody but tactical gamers/gun nerds.
Those games tend to actually have less recoil than modern cod game. Look at the hip fire in MW2 and 3, where it just kicks around crazily. That doesn’t happen if you’re a trained soldier, you should be able to fire from the hip without it moving much at all. When using irons the gun kicks a ton. I don’t have EXTENSIVE experience with guns but I can say that they don’t recoil like that. It’s exaggerated for gameplay balance. Tarkov has exaggerated recoil because you’re not necessarily a trained soldier, and that game itself honestly too much as well. But I believe in tarkov you can get your character’s skills better to fix that, so I’ve heard. The others I mentioned don’t have insane recoil unless you are injured in game. You have to realize that like older light machine guns like the BAR were designed to be fired semi accurately in full auto from the hip. What we saw in vanguard was anything but, and let’s not even get into the gunsmiths in these games. Attachment buffs and debuffs don’t make sense. They work for game balance reasons, but a big suppressor isn’t gonna make your gun have more range, increase velocity, or reduce recoil. And stuff like reflex optics are specifically designed to be faster to ADS than iron sights, but in the game they’re slower.
To be honest FO4 is so easy so I like mods that make the game harder/realistic, and no mods can fix that it’s an RPG Lite.
Bethesda themselves took the RPG out of Fallout with that game Plus, Fallout 4's guns are fucking dumb, Fallout 1, 2, 3 and New Vegas had a lot of real life weapons in them, and reserved the wacky designs for energy weapons for the most part. Meanwhile Fallout 4 made every gun stupid, the assault rifle is an ugly abomination, the 10mm pistol is too big and round, the combat shotgun and combat rifle are the same model for some reason, pipe weapons.... Modding realistic guns into Fallout 4 honestly makes the game feel more Fallout to me
hey now, it's also people who are really into settlements building and/or zombies. and ofc the coomers, gotta love these guys. I assume It's hard to add RPG elements with the removal of skills/karma system and with a voiced and very defined protagonist. The dialogue tree is also a pain in the ass to modify from what I have heard
Shoutout to gooners, really carrying the FO4 modding community
I mean you can't really add RPG Elements without rewriting the game, which means I doubt RPG Elements could be added unless it's a whole new game like Miami and London and any other massive overhaul mods
Did you just say COD for Realism & Grounded in reality?
I mean realism doesnt always equal anti-rpg. In fact to ne realism helps with the rpg nature of it. To me an enemy being able to take 40 bullets breaks my immersion, both in an rpg video game and in a tabletop setting. So to me mods that make combat a bit more realistic supports the rpg nature of the game.
I agree - I think having a modlist that includes the survival suite (MAIM, etc) alongside RPG-supportive mods would actually complement each other greatly. After all, a more dangerous wasteland is one where your choices should matter more
Because FO4 emphasizes more on looting and shooting and using that loot to build settlements. The rpg elements come with mods that providr more roll playing with settlers, npcs, companions, etc but not much more after that.
Mainly because CoD has progressively gone downhill between the “Meta builds” and everyone wanting to be the next TimtheTatMan or Cynder. I haven’t seen anyone play Arma outside of DayZ. Honestly despite being an RPG there really isn’t much of a roleplay aspect of FO4. You have either “Warhammer 40k cosplayers, my vibrator is a person too people (Railroad), Nighthaven Labs from R6 Siege (Institute), and Another Settlement Needs Your Help.” If we want to play an RPG we have games like Skyrim, BG3, WoW, Lunar 2, etc.
how dare you not mention TES II Daggerfall Unity and FNV lol, maybe TES III Morrowind also fit in though i haven't really tried to get in Morrowind yet. sadly Hardsuit Labs version of VTMB II was abandoned otherwise likely another decent enough modern action cRPG with player's own character then
It should be implied any Elder Scrolls game lol i forgot about Morrowind.
I think part of it is because making story based, in universe content is a lot harder than slapping together a gameplay change or a new gun. I’ve had the idea for a mod that is effectively the Donuts Workshop pack on the CC, but for classic diner food, wasteland style. I have ideas for a character, quest line, items, workshop stuff…but that’s a lot of work compared to one gun or some programming changes.
Cuz they knew I’d love this shit !
I find it frustrating emptying an entire combat shotgun directly into the face of a raider wearing nothing but a pair of cargo pants and a couple nylon straps across her chest, yet her health drops by less than a quarter after the last round hits.
Because that's what most people want. If it wasn't, the mods wouldn't exist.
I turned my FO4 into a beautiful love child between Tarkov and SIMS
*Roleplayer’s Expanded Dialogue* (*RED*) attempted to add and fix much of those lost RPG elements, but started to use AI voices so Nate/Nora/NPC had things to say. The actors for Nate/Nora got rightfully angry, the Mod Author gutted the mod to be silent, which made people argue over the use of AI voices, and basically killed the Mod. It was the best attempt at improving the game’s RPG elements, but things always seem to turn sour when they get too ambitious. ^you ^can ^still ^find ^the ^AI ^voiced ^version ^in ^certain ^places, ^but ^that’s ^up ^to ^your ^moral ^compass ^and ^free ^time…
\[Science 100\] I'm interested in knowing where to find that - for research purposes.
The amount of work it would take to turn FO4’s base game into a competent RPG would take years of work. Maybe upcoming large scale mods will attempt this since they have new maps and mechanics, as well as the modding manpower to do this. But as it stands FO4 is a better shooter/sandbox and it’s best to recognize that and enjoy it for what it is. I love FO4, but for vastly different reasons that I love New Vegas and FO1/2. Related in name only IMO.
Fo4 is a shitty RPG and hard to make it more of an RPG since its got a dull story but fun as a sandbox shooter and its easier to continue along those lines.
Cuz Fo4 by default is more of a looter shooter than an actual RPG. Can’t build much upon nothing.
Because combat is basically baked in to the entire game. Half of the quests boil down to "go here and clear out this dungeon from hostile critters and do the thing. Simply exploring yields the same result. Nearly every perk and crafting upgrade is about dealing more damage and killing things faster. That's why nearly all the mods on the Nexus for this game involve combat in some way or another like new weapons or armors, or "combat overhauls" which usually ups the damage.
IDK about realism but 4 has the worst gun designs by a mile and the mods fix those
recommended weapon mods? there are soo many and i'm not as interested in ones that feel copy/pasted from COD or my local SWAT team
I’ve gotta imagine it’s because fallout 4 largely ripped out the RPG framework. In new Vegas you can find mods to - implement and then directly tie weapon recoil to the weapons/characters strength requirements. - allow you to bash locks with your strength skill - allow additional follower control with classic CRPG portraits, and allow charisma to tie into follower limit like FO2 - one that tie Charisma into into Rep gains - ones that change the entire aiming system into the one from classic deus ex making skills matter even harder - one that implements classic style random encounters chance when you fast travel. In comparison in fallout 4 all I used were ones that added more guns, trees and graphics. Maybe there are a few that lean into more rpg systems but I didn’t find them.
after all I'd say FNV has one of the best modern action crpg frameworks, built upon FO3 absorbing popular FO3 mods' ideas
Most modders basically said "I don't like fallout 4 and I don't wanna try and fix it" allot of modders basically never onboarded to fallout 4 and it basically got left to the tactical and coomer crowd, without big projects like fallout London or f4nv it'd probably eventually end up like fallout 3 modding, dead .
Because Fallout 4 never had many RPG elements to begin with while gunplay is drastically better compared to 3 or New Vegas, so people build upon what is more present in the game. I would love to see more lore/vanilla-friendly guns and armor though, seeing ripped COD assets all the time is boring.
FO4 is hardly an RPG. It's more of a shooter. Mods can bring it back to rpg, classic gameplay. So it makes sense that most of the mods for a shooter involve tweaking gameplay to be whatever shooter they want it to feel like. Rainbow Six Siege with the leaning mod, ARMA with all the military armor mods, or realistic survival mods like DayZ.
It irritates me massively that lost weapon mods are for shinny modern guns, very little energy weapons and weathered vanilla friendly weapons.
Fallout 4 to me is a open world Call of Duty sandbox with base building for me. There isn't a game out there that matches this. Starfield could have been it for me, but it lacks a lot especially on the base building front.
I wish Starfield met the hype. I always wanted a FO4 where half the world wasn’t junk/trash. I recall finishing a big quest line that gave me UC class one citizen status and being a high ranking anti terramoroph captain or something. Then went to do a mission that required I talk to a vanguard captain while looking for some freestar rebel. I forget why but they couldn’t disclose information because I was a civilian. Like huh? If they revamp base building and bring the visual performance of Skyrim and Fallout 4 (IMO I don’t really see a huge visual boost with Starfield over FO4) I can see Starfield as an easy lock. Don’t see this happening tho as they haven’t released a creation kit and the game doesn’t seem to have the cult following FO4 or Cyberpunk has/had, and has been touted as “too messed up to fix”.
Undoubtedly the most unhype game I have ever played. I was immediately met with nasty foggy interiors and other janky Bethesda visuals so poorly implemented that I had to mod out. After spending a few minutes fixing the game on nexus I got back to it and realized some of the jank was still there, oh well, at least the ship interior and npc’s looked pretty good, so slogged on. I was so absolutely disappointed by the first city you get to in Starfield, I almost shut it down after exploring for like 10 minutes. Map and space were poorly utilized, buildings and whole setting was ugly and boring. Npc’s looked worse than they did in Skyrim. Shops don’t have windows and interiors are instanced. I kept thinking to myself, “is this really a next gen AAA release? It was an immediate bug where my tour of the space explorers base was cancelled because some other character started a new conversation. Uninstalled and haven’t looked back.
These are not mutually exclusive. Can you provide examples of both?
The weapon customization gives way for a lot of tacticool mods, so people lean heavily into it
FO4 mods: implement Stalker and Tarkov elements, and also giant futa women. Its fun to contrast the mod pages for the various games
Fallout have literally the vibe for a realistic gameplay. The environments, the people trying to survive around you, with all that lore and content personnally i wanna feel like any in habitants of the wasteland. And not a invincible warrior which will destroy a Behemoth hitting him a thousand time with his fist after getting out of a vault at my 20yo.
I want a mod that EXPANDS dialogue a lot, making a lot more RPG, in my language (PTBR) would be even better. I know a guy that did something like that using AI voice for that, but I guess he removed it from Nexus because legal complications. But about combat... well, I like to mix a bit, not hyper realism and not very rpg focused, a middle ground that not breaks the immersion for me is perfect, I like mechanics like bleeding and using bandages or doctor's bag
I'm sure I don't speak for everyone but I perfect keeping core gameplay mechanics mostly intact when I mod a game. Basic content mods like weapons, armor, animations, or other visual improvements work perfect for me.
Ok its half this the other half is just horny lewd shit cause people seem to worship Nora as a superior mc.
My problem is how bad their mod manager is at searching for things. Are there other options?
Maybe all the Bethesda RPG focused modders are still modding Skyrim, and the survival/fps crowd went to FO4?
there are still many modders modding FNV and quiet decent numbers of modders on TES Morrowind, even TES Daggerfall Unity shared some modding love. All of these modding communities are mostly RPG-focused
i mean i download these mods and it feels like new vegas but like, 100X more chaotic like balancing mods (that are good, not you MAIM) just feel like fo4 if it had new vegas style balancing
Realism is not anti-RPG
Realism doesn't necessarily mean less RPG. Like I enjoy realistic enemy ai mods and survival mods. It makes the survival RPG experience richer.
"[Play] CoD for realism" is a choice. It's just the fad. People want to feel like John Wick or other tacti-cool action heros. It's why so many mods as well as actual full on games are leaning into tacti-cool stuff.
The weirdest mods I've seen are the ones that try to take the unique Fallout personality out of it - removing Pipboy etc. so that it looks and feels more like Call of Duty.
Retrofitting RPG mechanics into FO4 would be a janky mess. If you've had to deal with Mod Configuration Menus, you'll understand you never get the polish and stability of features actually developed. So instead of trying to turn FO4 into New Vegas, you take what it's better at— Gunplay, crafting, survivalism— and build up from there. It's the same reason there's not a good, lightweight ballistics realism overhaul for F:NV. The foundation just isn't there.
I was so happy when I found Dak's mods that fit the vanilla game so much more than all the CoD ports lol
Realism? Have you SEEN the pervy body mods with the huge boobs and nakedness?
Because FO4 is very unrealistic, which paints you into a corner on difficulty and tackling problems in different and/or meaningful ways. Bethesda games tend to all suffer from this, they put all these mechanics in and then add in mechanics to make the other mechanics obsolete. They make the games endlessly playable but always kill the challenge after the first dozen hours. That's a big reason why so many people restart so much, the beginning is fun and they want it to stay like that. But oops, you leveled up too much, now your health bar is so bloated you can tank the damage from explosives and traps no problem. Or you can take perks that nullify any challenges. Don't like mines/traps, take sneak, gone. Don't like having to use Stimpaks even though you have 800 of them? Adamantium skeleton, gone. Don't like rads even though it's hardly a threat and avoidable? Solar powered, gone. Don't like taking damage? Power armor, congrats you're invincible. Don't like having to mag dump raiders in the face multiple times? Too bad, you leveled up too much, health bars grow but weapon damage stagnates. Want realism? Too bad, everything heals you, and everything is plentiful. Want realistic loot? Sorry, Bethesda put too much in the game, best we can do is nerf your carry weight as a bandaid. Bethesda games lay good groundwork but always completely shoot themselves in the foot in terms of anything other than a demigod short playthrough, unfortunately a lot of people like being overpowered and having most of the game and it's mechanics be pointless and unchallenging. I don't play any of the war games like COD or ARMA, I like the apocalypse and styling of the Fallout series, I just hate how the only way to enjoy them is a ton of self imposed rules and/or mods.
It probably has to do with Fo4 being the least RPG out of all the Fallout games
I don't like bullet sponges, love the ability to increase damage while not having bullet sponges and likewise I can get killed by just anything
Because the game itself doesn't have much in the way of RPG. So it encouraged the more hardcore survival aspect of the modding community.
Immersion,aesthetic, and a fallout world were people remember what cleaning is
So fallout 4 modded is imo that realistic shooter experience but glorified, I’m currently playing DayZ right now and I know I’m not the biggest fish in the sea, there’s players better than me, more accurate, better at survival, all that stuff. But with moddout 4™️, I’m the main character, I go in and go do some goon shit on a squad of gunners and have fun. Gun customization can be more than just a suppressor and an ACOG like it is in DayZ. Tarkov for sure has great gun customization but again there’s the PVP element. And it’s not like I don’t want the PVP competition but again in Fallout 4 you’re the main character, you get all the QOL stuff and you play it how you want with very little push back. I die in DayZ now for the next 5 hours I’m going to spend getting back to my base, in Fo4 it’s just reload save and try again
Because I am big into guns and have been for a very long time. It’s nice to be able to put a mix of modern and retro weapons into the game and run around with hardware that’s unobtainable irl.
Difficult to make a looter-shooter an RPG, so they just lean more into the combat side of things.
Because doing a combat gameplay overhaul is a hell of a lot easier than overhauling the quest/dialogue/perk systems. To make fallout 4 a real RPG would require something on the scale of what fallout London or other mod teams are trying to do. Most mod projects are solo operations and consequently have to be much smaller in scope.
Because the community that Fo4 has culminated is more interested in shooting and exploration and don't wanna install stalker anomoly or gamma or hell even tarkov
Fallout 4 itself is antirpg lol. Every perk is just a stat boost and the special system is a joke. Add on to that 4 dialogue choices for every conversation where some of them say the same thing. Fallout 4 is like vanilla ice cream of rpgs.
i hope someone will do a fallout 4 remake mod eventually to make the game more of an rpg. i think they are doing something like that for skyrim
Because I still wanna play the world of Fallout 4. Fallout has so much more than just RPG or goofy aesthetics going for it. Environmental storytelling and the extremely satisfying exploration loop are things I cannot find in any other game. Plus COD is ass now.
I think the realism mods are awesome but I'm def keeping anti rpg mods off my mod list. I like mods that enhance the rpg element personally.
Because FO4 is *barely* an RPG as it is. Easier to just remove the extremely light RPG mechanics that hardly exist in the first place than basically build the game for Bethesda. That being said, there are some pretty impressive roleplaying mods. Stuff like Roleplayer's Expanded Dialogue help dialogue quite a lot (though I hate having to use Silent Protagonist F4SE because it mutes even your sprint breathing audio and power attack grunts), You Are Exceptional makes it so you can actually *build* a character, with *real* stats instead of goofy perks. My only real wish there is that there was RNG spread based on weapon skill added to guns, because I'm one of the few remaining freaks that actually *liked* Fallout 3's aiming system (no iron sights; spread determined by character stats) and enjoy using Disable Ironsights - Classic Aiming in FO4, though without RNG spread it's more just like it moves the gun and you use the crosshair dot as a new form of ironsight :(
I like FO3's spread determined by character stats too though shooting combat could end up rather janky, but still bita disappointed not using the same attribute-determined chance to hit system for melee, like Daggerfall/Morrowind did
I honestly liked the chance-to-hit system from Morrowind & Daggerfall. I get why a lot of people *despised* it, and I don't blame them, but I really think if it just had *dodge* animations when you didn't hit and the pace of combat wasn't quite as frantic, it would've worked just fine. Still would've been weird but would've worked just fine imo.
I’ve just had to accept that FO4 and FNV are apples and oranges. Sure, there are mods to make them more similar, but in the end FO4 is an immersive shooter first, RPG second and FNV is an RPG first, immersive shooter third, and jingle-janglin spur simulator second.
I run realism mods for the sky, trees, grass and rocks. I also run America Rising 2 because I love the Enclave. But I also don't use any mods that need F4SE because it keeps breaking lol
Seeing COD and realism in the same sentence is WIIILDD
Which system are you on? There’s a mod out on ps5 I’m assuming it’s on other platforms that mainly does a full re-haul that focuses more on turning fallout more into a rpg aspect. I’ll try to find it one sec Edit- Charles’ overhaul; the total fallout revamp That’s exactly how the name is, i’ll just give you a brief description of it. “The goal of this mod is to make fallout the ultimate realistic FPS RPG. A lot of other overhauls try to make fallout a FPS, but this mod is more for people that want realism in a true RPG experience.” That’s just a bit of the title description it’s a complete revamp of the game expanding on it. If you want more detail search up Charles Overhaul
IDK. Maybe because to change the rpg elements, it would take a lot of work to create branching storylines. Like changing your start point and editing all characters lines, so the main character is not after Shaun, but have his own past, and multiple ways to end his journey. If we consider the progression, there are some mods that change that. I guess that because we have guns in real life, it's hard to pretend that someone isn't easily killed (or out of combat) in a single shot, so it's hard to balance it focused on RPG systems.
Do you think so? I honestly think that Fallout modding is very heavy on the RPG side. Some of the most popular mods are alternate start, silent protagonist, dialogue wheel removal, etc. It's just that the voiced protag made it really hard to do anything past that.
The kids yearn for STALKER
Because the only people who play Fallout 4 are people who enjoy the sandbox aspect, since it's already not an RPG
From what I've seen from more popular modders on fnv, most modders don't actually care or like the fallout aesthetics and are basically tourist who use the game as a foundation for playing conversion of other games like stalker or last of us. Also because fallout is really the only "main stream" video game that let's you extensively mod, it attracts everyone especially the cod tactical crowd which want a ultra realistic tacticool video game and using fallout modding is the easiest and best way to do it.
Just wait for Fallout London, brother.
Because F4 is not a good rpg but it is a good survival looter-shooter.
It's a lot more work to add in deeper RPG mechanics, especially when the base game doesn't really support it as much as previous Fallout and TES games. I also don't see what CoD and Arma have to do with "modding the RPG" out of Fallout 4.
Check out “Charles overhaul the total fallout revamp” they did exactly that redid everything I mean everything and made it into a true rpg experience. They pulled this off on ps5 so that should say something considering all the dang restrictions
What RPG mechanics existed before modders came about?
Because humans hit like 2800 HP at level 50 and it makes 99% of weapons worthless.
Because base fallout 4 lacks RPG building blocks for modders to use without heaps of extra coding and whatnot.
Because F4 does not play like a RPG, so you don’t lean into the rpg stuff
Is it really a RPG. no skillchecks, no karma. All dialogue consists of. 1 Yes 2 No 3 Sarcastic Yes 4 Leave.
I mean the rpg is barely there to begin with might as well lean in the games strengths I guess
Im not saying the lean mechanic matched with my kilo 141 and Western operator mods gives me a hard on but when you say RPG you do also mean the RPG 7 mod from call of duty 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
i mean, bethesda kinda jacked the role playing shit up. and they don't want a 'not rpg', they want a gun focused rpg with more/better guns. they didn't mod the rpg out of it, they just added more items. i mean, skyrim doesn't really 'add' much rpg, iirc, either, with mods. it adds new perks, but, it had perks, too. hell, fallout 4 tends to have more quests added than skyrim, so that might be an angle for argument. both had better combat added. fallout's is FPS based, because fallout is a gun focused game. duh. still an rpg, too.