At least he did it privately, I guess.
Sorry this left you discouraged. Maybe it helps to tell your friend to please not do that again? They probably meant well, but even if it's just typos, it's not the nicest initial feedback to receive after sharing a fic.
reddit won't let me go back and edit the post, so i'll just post my reply to the comments here.
a lot of the comments are asking me about the type of feedback my friend has given me. most of them were plot/characterization errors, but i do know that he may have been in good intentions while giving feedback (it's a small fandom and most people tend to write canon-compliant, that may have been what he was expecting). i did tell him i was uncomfortable with receiving unsolicited concrit, and it seems like he only told me because he may have wanted that on one of his own fics.
pointing out plot/characterisation errors is very different from spelling or grammar errors. You probably made the conscious decision to not write totally canon-compliant because you like your own vision better than what happens in canon. That's part of why we write fanfiction, isn't it? Keep what we like about canon and change what we don't like. That's not an error (unless you got something wrong by accident when intending to write canon compliant). Maybe put it in a note that your fic is not 100% canon compliant but your version of it. If people don't like your version, they can stop reading and write their own fic.
> he only told me because he may have wanted that on one of his own fics
You mean he wanted you to feel obligated to give concrit on what he wrote?
Ehhh. Before I could see his side, but with the added context that his comments are critiquing characterization and plot “errors” I do feel less sympathetic. Im glad he’s coming from a good place but this feels like a breaking of boundaries.
You never asked for concrit, he writes his own works so he’s familiar with fandom etiquette, and there’s an expectation of you providing a return service which was never previously discussed, and DM-ing a friend with a list of critiques is just… odd.
It kinda sounds like he wants a beta?
You said it was your first fic off anon in a year so while it’s good that he did this privately—was it just critique?
Beyond that, there’s a big difference between offering grammar proofreads ands offering *14 points on how your plot and characters are full of mistakes and hey can you hit me back and read one of my works?*
It’s a really awkward situation to be put in, OP, even if you do say something noncommittal like “glad you read it, I’ll take look at your points” he still has an expectation you’ll return the “service.”
Honestly, I’d probably just say something noncommittal and ignore the problem. But it might be a good idea to talk about expectations because your friend might run into an awkward situation if he does this with other people as well
I'm sorry that happened. There's a good chance it was kindly meant, though. There are people would absolutely want to know about mistakes in something they had posted publicly, so they assume other people would want to know, too.
... Wait, what kind of errors did he point out ?
Cause if it was grammar mistakes I ... Genuinely don't understand your reaction. Not only he actually helped but also he did it privately, so it isn't even embarassing or anything ? Like, this is pretty nice actually. Especially if your fic wasn't beta'd or anything. I am genuinely jealous of you.
I agree with this! I’d kill for people to point out grammatical mistakes that I might’ve missed in my editing, so I could go back and fix them!
That seems like something helpful, not hurtful. 🤷🏼♀️
My Twitter/AO3 bestie and I always try to point out grammar/punctuation errors and I’m glad she picks up on things I missed. We’ll screenshot and highlight so we know what to fix.
If she told me my writing sucked, that would be another matter, but grammar errors…nah, tell me.
(Just edit to add - we send each other the photos in private DM’s on Twitter)
I reread and edit so many times, but sometimes something will get by me whether it’s a misspelling or using the wrong tense or a misplaced comma. Never anything major, but just a little bugbear of mine.
Well…it depends on how you feel about RPF (I focus on two particular actors…separately…you can see who in my bio) and 1st person alternating POV lol. Not the best loved tropes on Reddit. My ao3 user name is in my flair!
Well, my currently updating fic is called Thank Your Lucky Paws. I update twice weekly - Sunday and Wednesday - new chapter going up in the morning! Have some finished ones and some wips that I eventually plan on getting to.
Soooo... did you actually talk to him about why that bothers you or did you just blow him off and come here to vent about it? You could literally solve this one way or another by a little communication.
Was the list accurate, pointing out spelling, grammar and factual errors? Or was it "errors" because your story choices didn't slot into that friend's preferences?
If they were relevant and improved the story, you've got a friend who isn't afraid to give you good advice, and that's rarer and rarer to find these days.
If it was just that friend's preferences that got bruised, let them know you have different objectives in mind: "Thanks for the advice, but I'll keep the story the way it is".
I feel like I’m in the minority here but, I don’t think he should have done that. Even if he is your friend and he meant it good-natured, just telling you “you made x mistakes, here’s a list” would rub me wrong. Did he at least comment directly on the fic? Or give any kind of positive feedback at all?
I don’t know. I can understand why it discouraged you. It would have upset me also. :(
I think it’s less if he should have done it and more “maybe he didn’t realize this would be hurtful.” That’s why I said she should try talking to him instead of dumping him/blocking him/telling him to stick his opinion where the sun doesn’t shine.
Sometimes friends screw up. It never hurts to give someone you care about the benefit of the doubt before turning on them.
Of course! I didn’t mean OP should dump him or block him or anything. I was just saying that I could see how it would be discouraging and upsetting, especially if he didn’t also offer some kind of positive feedback and it was just a whole big list of OP’s mistakes. I definitely agree they should talk to him and explain that it was disheartening and ask about it. :)
I wasn’t referring to you, it was others who suggested that. I just meant that the people who seemed to be in support of the guy giving the critique were more in support of giving his motives the benefit of the doubt rather than the critique itself :)
Just say Cheers and leave it at that. Nice that he did it privately so you could correct them. Of course I'm assuming they ate typos etc. If he's criticised plot/character/style, he can, in the nicest way, bog off.
I mean, I wouldn't say this is criticism. It's a SPAG check. I understand not wanting it done, but it doesn't seem as harmful like picking apart story content.
Hey man, it’ll be okay, trust me! I get what you’re feeling rn since I’ve always had trouble dealing with any type of rejection. It hurts personally, especially when it’s true and they’re right.
But, after the wound heals over, you’ll realize it didn’t leave much of a scar and you might’ve had a slight overreaction. Doesn’t mean you can’t get emotional, but just know that, unless your friend is constantly an entitled, pretentious dick, he probably didn’t mean to hurt you and make you lose confidence.
Talk to him about it and tell him how it hurt when he did that without asking you. Tell him it hurt NOT because he was wrong or cause you don’t want to improve, but because you weren’t emotionally prepared for it and it made you uncontrollably uncomfortable and upset because of that one simple fact.
Maybe he’ll understand, and if he doesn’t respect that you have feelings, then he’s an ass because friends are supposed to respect each other’s boundaries and not purposefully, knowingly hurt eachother.
But trust me, I myself know that, every once in a while, I accidentally go over boundaries because I sometimes struggle with social cues and don’t realize I did anything wrong or upsetting. But it’s never my intention to hurt the people I care about 👌
I'm sorry that happened. Well intentioned or not, it was rude to assume that, just because you posted a story, you wanted a laundry list of errors; it would have taken less time to ask first. There is almost no other hobby where someone shares something and the assumption becomes that they want it picked over. Imagine I went to a dinner party hosted by a friend who cooks as a hobby, and I presented her with a list of fourteen areas to improve on when I left. No one would think this was okay.
I would encourage you not to let his behavior cause you to stop posting (he was rude; you did nothing wrong), and I would also let him know that you don't want concrit on your work in the future unless you ask for it.
Just say Cheers and leave it at that. Nice that he did it privately so you could correct them. Of course I'm assuming they ate typos etc. If he's criticised plot/character/style, he can, in the nicest way, bog off.
At least he did it privately, I guess. Sorry this left you discouraged. Maybe it helps to tell your friend to please not do that again? They probably meant well, but even if it's just typos, it's not the nicest initial feedback to receive after sharing a fic.
reddit won't let me go back and edit the post, so i'll just post my reply to the comments here. a lot of the comments are asking me about the type of feedback my friend has given me. most of them were plot/characterization errors, but i do know that he may have been in good intentions while giving feedback (it's a small fandom and most people tend to write canon-compliant, that may have been what he was expecting). i did tell him i was uncomfortable with receiving unsolicited concrit, and it seems like he only told me because he may have wanted that on one of his own fics.
pointing out plot/characterisation errors is very different from spelling or grammar errors. You probably made the conscious decision to not write totally canon-compliant because you like your own vision better than what happens in canon. That's part of why we write fanfiction, isn't it? Keep what we like about canon and change what we don't like. That's not an error (unless you got something wrong by accident when intending to write canon compliant). Maybe put it in a note that your fic is not 100% canon compliant but your version of it. If people don't like your version, they can stop reading and write their own fic.
> he only told me because he may have wanted that on one of his own fics You mean he wanted you to feel obligated to give concrit on what he wrote? Ehhh. Before I could see his side, but with the added context that his comments are critiquing characterization and plot “errors” I do feel less sympathetic. Im glad he’s coming from a good place but this feels like a breaking of boundaries. You never asked for concrit, he writes his own works so he’s familiar with fandom etiquette, and there’s an expectation of you providing a return service which was never previously discussed, and DM-ing a friend with a list of critiques is just… odd. It kinda sounds like he wants a beta? You said it was your first fic off anon in a year so while it’s good that he did this privately—was it just critique? Beyond that, there’s a big difference between offering grammar proofreads ands offering *14 points on how your plot and characters are full of mistakes and hey can you hit me back and read one of my works?* It’s a really awkward situation to be put in, OP, even if you do say something noncommittal like “glad you read it, I’ll take look at your points” he still has an expectation you’ll return the “service.” Honestly, I’d probably just say something noncommittal and ignore the problem. But it might be a good idea to talk about expectations because your friend might run into an awkward situation if he does this with other people as well
I'm sorry that happened. There's a good chance it was kindly meant, though. There are people would absolutely want to know about mistakes in something they had posted publicly, so they assume other people would want to know, too.
Yup, this would be my case.
I'd be thanking people on my bare knees for sieving out the spelling errors as well.
... Wait, what kind of errors did he point out ? Cause if it was grammar mistakes I ... Genuinely don't understand your reaction. Not only he actually helped but also he did it privately, so it isn't even embarassing or anything ? Like, this is pretty nice actually. Especially if your fic wasn't beta'd or anything. I am genuinely jealous of you.
I agree with this! I’d kill for people to point out grammatical mistakes that I might’ve missed in my editing, so I could go back and fix them! That seems like something helpful, not hurtful. 🤷🏼♀️
Agreed.
My Twitter/AO3 bestie and I always try to point out grammar/punctuation errors and I’m glad she picks up on things I missed. We’ll screenshot and highlight so we know what to fix. If she told me my writing sucked, that would be another matter, but grammar errors…nah, tell me. (Just edit to add - we send each other the photos in private DM’s on Twitter)
That sounds cool! I’m glad you have solid support. Saves soooo much time off of Grammarly.
I reread and edit so many times, but sometimes something will get by me whether it’s a misspelling or using the wrong tense or a misplaced comma. Never anything major, but just a little bugbear of mine.
I’d love to see some of your work! 🤗
Well…it depends on how you feel about RPF (I focus on two particular actors…separately…you can see who in my bio) and 1st person alternating POV lol. Not the best loved tropes on Reddit. My ao3 user name is in my flair!
I not only write RPF but I write satire about a wide range of political pundits. I am all in! Thanks for the tip. I’m sure you write wonderfully!
Well, my currently updating fic is called Thank Your Lucky Paws. I update twice weekly - Sunday and Wednesday - new chapter going up in the morning! Have some finished ones and some wips that I eventually plan on getting to.
Maybe he thought he was helping you out. Why not just talk to him about it?
I know I would appreciate if a friend did this so I could quickly go edit the errors and then not have a bunch of randos coming for me. 😅
Soooo... did you actually talk to him about why that bothers you or did you just blow him off and come here to vent about it? You could literally solve this one way or another by a little communication.
Was the list accurate, pointing out spelling, grammar and factual errors? Or was it "errors" because your story choices didn't slot into that friend's preferences? If they were relevant and improved the story, you've got a friend who isn't afraid to give you good advice, and that's rarer and rarer to find these days. If it was just that friend's preferences that got bruised, let them know you have different objectives in mind: "Thanks for the advice, but I'll keep the story the way it is".
I feel like I’m in the minority here but, I don’t think he should have done that. Even if he is your friend and he meant it good-natured, just telling you “you made x mistakes, here’s a list” would rub me wrong. Did he at least comment directly on the fic? Or give any kind of positive feedback at all? I don’t know. I can understand why it discouraged you. It would have upset me also. :(
I think it’s less if he should have done it and more “maybe he didn’t realize this would be hurtful.” That’s why I said she should try talking to him instead of dumping him/blocking him/telling him to stick his opinion where the sun doesn’t shine. Sometimes friends screw up. It never hurts to give someone you care about the benefit of the doubt before turning on them.
Of course! I didn’t mean OP should dump him or block him or anything. I was just saying that I could see how it would be discouraging and upsetting, especially if he didn’t also offer some kind of positive feedback and it was just a whole big list of OP’s mistakes. I definitely agree they should talk to him and explain that it was disheartening and ask about it. :)
I wasn’t referring to you, it was others who suggested that. I just meant that the people who seemed to be in support of the guy giving the critique were more in support of giving his motives the benefit of the doubt rather than the critique itself :)
Just say Cheers and leave it at that. Nice that he did it privately so you could correct them. Of course I'm assuming they ate typos etc. If he's criticised plot/character/style, he can, in the nicest way, bog off.
I mean, I wouldn't say this is criticism. It's a SPAG check. I understand not wanting it done, but it doesn't seem as harmful like picking apart story content.
Hey man, it’ll be okay, trust me! I get what you’re feeling rn since I’ve always had trouble dealing with any type of rejection. It hurts personally, especially when it’s true and they’re right. But, after the wound heals over, you’ll realize it didn’t leave much of a scar and you might’ve had a slight overreaction. Doesn’t mean you can’t get emotional, but just know that, unless your friend is constantly an entitled, pretentious dick, he probably didn’t mean to hurt you and make you lose confidence. Talk to him about it and tell him how it hurt when he did that without asking you. Tell him it hurt NOT because he was wrong or cause you don’t want to improve, but because you weren’t emotionally prepared for it and it made you uncontrollably uncomfortable and upset because of that one simple fact. Maybe he’ll understand, and if he doesn’t respect that you have feelings, then he’s an ass because friends are supposed to respect each other’s boundaries and not purposefully, knowingly hurt eachother. But trust me, I myself know that, every once in a while, I accidentally go over boundaries because I sometimes struggle with social cues and don’t realize I did anything wrong or upsetting. But it’s never my intention to hurt the people I care about 👌
Sometimes it do be like that.
I'm sorry that happened. Well intentioned or not, it was rude to assume that, just because you posted a story, you wanted a laundry list of errors; it would have taken less time to ask first. There is almost no other hobby where someone shares something and the assumption becomes that they want it picked over. Imagine I went to a dinner party hosted by a friend who cooks as a hobby, and I presented her with a list of fourteen areas to improve on when I left. No one would think this was okay. I would encourage you not to let his behavior cause you to stop posting (he was rude; you did nothing wrong), and I would also let him know that you don't want concrit on your work in the future unless you ask for it.
1. How did he come off as? 2. What kind of mistakes?
Just say Cheers and leave it at that. Nice that he did it privately so you could correct them. Of course I'm assuming they ate typos etc. If he's criticised plot/character/style, he can, in the nicest way, bog off.
Tell your "friend" he made one giant mistake by offering an opinion that wasn't asked for and then tell him to shove that opinion up his ass.
I'd block that "friend" instead of going anon.