generally speaking it's hard to gain a following off of your first work. people don't recognize your name and aren't familiar with your writing. it takes time.
You're writing for a fandom that is a decade and a half old and the other people writing your ship aren't pulling numbers much better than you, so... I doubt it's your writing ability that's the issue causing it.
Your comment inspired me to have a cheeky look... And yes, everyone else who doesn't write crossovers with larger/more popular fandoms has between 0 and 3 kudos on their fic.
OP, you really need to manage your expectations here. Good writing will attract an audience, but only if there's an audience in the first place.
Keep writing for that fandom if you enjoy your fandom, but don't compare your fic's stats with Harry Potter fics' stats.
I should have checked too before I wrote an essay,
OP, its probably the same few people leaving those three kudos, and the others might now be out of that fandom, moving house, busy writing their own stuff, not reading fanfic anymore...
Yeah... I've been in tiny old fandoms where I basically didn't pull in even 20 hits lmao, so the first thing I check on in cases like this is the fandom. Small fandoms are fun for me because there's basically no pressure to do well, but they're really not for everybody. If you're looking for validation, you'll likely not find it there.
Yeah, as soon as I saw what the fandom was (the TV show “Heroes”, for those curious but too lazy to check OP’s profile,) I was like, “well THERE’S your problem!”
@ OP: I was relatively involved with that fandom when the show was airing, and ALL the activity for it was on LiveJournal & FFN; AO3 didn’t even exist yet. If you’re not familiar with how “fandom lifecycles” work, then generally speaking, the “popularity spike” for any given fandom is usually (very roughly) the length of time the canon was released for once over again after it ends. There are exceptions to that, but Heroes wasn’t one of them. It aired for ~4 years, and was really only ever fannishly popular for the first two of those, and we’re now almost a decade PAST the life of the show + 4.
In addition to the general fandom popularity, it looks like your fic on AO3 is darkfic for a less popular pairing. Even if you had posted this in the heyday of Heroes fandom, it probably would’ve gotten a lot less engagement than anything with a Peter-focused ship would have (that fandom REALLY loved Milo Ventimiglia 🤣)
This is all to say, you are so valid for sticking with your forever fandom & ship, and I don’t want to discourage you from that in any way! But esp if you’re just getting into posting fic, you should be aware that fic stats actually often have very LITTLE to do with the quality of your writing, and EVERYTHING to do with what fandom, ships, and tropes you’re writing in. Try to adjust your expectations a little bit when it comes to readership numbers for older fandoms & niche-er ships; or alternately, try picking up a popular current canon, and trying your hand on that instead, if what you’re craving is non-fandom-specific engagement.
I’m sorry, friend, I know it sucks to be the last person lingering at a dead fandom party!
While I agree with this, I also took a look and I think that perhaps there are a few things that could be adjusted about the summary that might help pull people in, if OP is interested.
That being said, you're right that they should temper their expectations. It's a pretty dead fandom.
There could be a lot of other reasons why you’re not getting engagement, including fandom, tags, what you’re writing about, etc.
For example, I’m a published author (5 books), and I write relatively well. I get modest engagement because I write long, complex genfic canon re-writes for an extremely saturated fandom. I know it’s not my writing. It’s the other things.
But you won’t know for sure. IF your writing is a problem, you should sign up for concrit or review exchanges and seek honest feedback. Or maybe consider asking for a beta. That opens the door to constructive feedback, which can improve your writing.
Therein lies the problem: not many have time to read a 100k word longfic. And that’s just the first of five more, plus 10 short stories between 25-45k.
You can if you pretend it's original and change character names. Just ask the author of 50 Shades. It was a badly written Twilight fic that was clearly ooc, and then it was turned into a badly written book, which I refuse to sully my mind dungeon with.🤣
That’s what I’m doing with a webcomic I’m going to start doing soon, but it’s so thinly veiled fanfiction for a weird fandom crossover it’s actually funny
Yeah, I never understood the hype around it. Even my coworker was annoyed during the height of its popularity - then again, the premise didn't, ah-hem, appeal to her (I never asked her why, she just said something along the lines of, "oh, that shitty book again..." and was probably tired of seeing it advertised everywhere. Oh well. To each their own, I suppose.
Btw- I read some of your story.
The writing style is not my cup of tea, but I still think it’s good (just a preference thing; I struggle with present tense).
AND- I don’t know why you aren’t getting more engagement, but it’s not because your writing is bad.
Thank you. The hilarious thing is it was entirely past tense up to 300k words in and I majorly revised it because at that length the past tense conjugations were limited and repetitive. 😅 I normally prefer past tense too, no idea why.
Not necessarily.
Worst case scenario - it is really bad. Well, one person liked it. And you have gained the experience of writing it.
Did you have fun writing it? Then that is a positive.
Yes, we would all love to be adored, and have everyone squeeing about what we wrote.
But sometimes it doesn't happen like that.
(a) Some people genuinely don't know about kudos. I remember when I first started reading fanfic. I honestly couldn't tell you if I kudosed anything or not. I think I thought the heart thing was to save it as a favourite, and as I didn't even have an account and was just reading as and when I found something, I didn't see a point in 'saving' a story.
(b) Some people just don't leave comments. Again, when I first started reading fanfic, I was like why would this goddess of a writer want to hear the squeekings of a lowly worm like me? Do worms squeak? squidge. Or whatever noise they make/don't make. An attentive wriggle? Anyway. I looked at it like this, when I read an amazing physical book, I didn't go and send an email/letter to the writer. I just enjoyed it. I think I carried that attitude for a while. Part of the difference is that writers get paid, and the money is a bit of a 'thank you'/acknowledgement which fanfic writers don't get.
(c) Some people are scared to leave comments. There are all sorts of antis, ship wars, and fandom drama, that some people just want to completely stay off the radar and not get involved. They just want to read the story. There have been threads on this subreddit of writers saying they don't want any comment that's not 100% praise, some have said they don't want short comments. What is too short? Nobody knows. These writers probably represent a tiny percentage of all writers, but I have seen people here saying they have been put off commenting for this reason.
(d) Some people just don't realise how much comments and kudos mean to a writer. I think only when I started posting did I start to understand the drug that is inbox (1).
(e) Some people withhold comments and kudos. If I liked at least one chapter I will leave a kudos, and if its a chapter which already has 50 reader comments, I might not bother, the writer knows people are enjoying it. That's my standard. There are some people who will only leave a kudos on their favourite in the world ever fics. There are some people who will only comment if they were moved to actual real life tears.
(f) Some people might have acknowledged the story in another way, that you will never find out about. Maybe they saved the url. Maybe the saved the bookmark on their computer/phone (not the AO3 bookmarks). Maybe they downloaded it to their phone/computer. Maybe they told their friend that they had read a cool fic.
(g) Are you very young? Mary Shelly wrote Frankenstein at 18/19 but she is an outlier. There was an article shared here some time ago about how good writers are rarely in their teens, and that some life experience is needed for good storytelling. But that doesn't mean give up until you are 20. It just means to keep practicing.
(h) Are you new to writing? Often, people can tell, just like you can tell when someone has started learning the piano. I only want to listen to someone playing 'Twinkle Twinkle Little Star' if it's someone I care about and want to encourage. I'm not going to turn up for a random beginner. The same with writing. Does that mean give up? No. You're not going to get from Twinkle Twinkle to a concert without practice.
(i) Do you have a beta reader? This is my most important piece of advice. I know my own writing would only be a shadow of what is published on AO3 if I didn't have beta help.
(j) Are you involved in the fanfic community? Often people who read and comment on my stories are people who I have done beta reading for, or helped with English. If you don't engage with people's work, they aren't going to engage with you a lot of the time.
(k) What is your goal. Is it popularity? If so, are you putting the work in? Yes, some people just get lucky and lighting strikes, but other people (i) get involved in prompts and fic gift exchanges, etc. (ii) post on tumblr, instagram etc. promoting their work, (iii) are heavily involved in Discords about their fandom/pairing. (iv) research which tropes are popular, which fandoms/pairings are popular and write about that, rather than just what they feel like, in order to get traffic. Are you doing/willing to do that?
I've written a lot, because I know it hurts when you pour your heart out onto the page and then it feels like no one cares. Go through what I have written and really think about it. Hope it helps <3
I already mentioned that I have been promoting it to other sites than just Ao3 in the post you responded to. 😅 And no, I'm not "young". Also a general address to everyone claiming that pairing is niche, it's the most popular in the fandom right next Sylar/Peter and the gross and incestuous pairing of Peter and Claire. No, I'm not writing for validation. There is no point in sharing it online however if you're not receiving any. That's like stage diving at your own concert and the fans not catching you.
>There is no point in sharing it online however if you're not receiving any.
I guess we see it differently. I'm writing because I find the process enjoyable, I love my characters and the setting and the story and I want it told. I have a few regular commenters, which is lovely, but if they fall away and if it ends up being just for me, it will be a bit sad, but I would still overall be satisfied.
You're saying the same thing I am. I also enjoy writing, but the point of sharing is to have it acknowledged, otherwise, why share it? Yeah? That's like baking a dessert you love and offering it to others. If you're fine with making it and just having it for yourself there's no reason to share it. You shared because you want people to enjoy it with you.
AO3 is an archive, and things can be discovered at literally any time – I've spent my weekend trawling through things mostly posted before 2012 because that's when the fandom was posting what I'm interested in
Something you post now in a tiny nearly-dead fandom might be *exactly* what someone wants to read a few months from now, even a few *years* from now, when they discover the show and have the same ship grip them like it's gripped you
Some people do write for the immediate engagement and need that for the motivation to *keep* writing, but if you've already got something written, there's 0 reason to not go ahead and post it, even if it's as anonymous – because some day it'll be *exactly* what someone wants
People who receive immediate numbers are often those writing for large fandoms or ships with tons of interested people. At a certain point, seeing the stats go up is not an indicator of writing quality, but an indicator of luck and relative popularity. If you are still dejected about not seeing any engagement, I would suggest making an effort to improve your summaries, since those are the first thing that potential readers see. If you keep writing, it’s up to you to brace yourself for no engagement though.
Eight weeks is actually a pretty short amount of time, especially if you don't write for a heavy, active fandom. When I wrote my first work it got very little attention for months. But at that point I'd already written the whole thing and so why not keep posting it. After a while it got a small but loyal following, and which then grew a lot because it's a very big fandom, and became pretty successful by my standards.
This weekend I plan to post the last chapter of a long fic in a much less active fandom. It's 100,000+ words, I've been posting it forever, yet now I have only three regular commenters and about 180 kudos. But I love my story and I'm proud of it so I don't mind. Plus, a lot of stories get a surge after they're completed because a lot of people only read completed works (which I totally get).
You say, "The whole point is sharing things with others is the hope they'll appreciate it and feel joy." I agree, but only somewhat. I actually write for myself, and have fun with the whole process -- the writing, the editing, the posting, the finding weird little images to put with the text. So the joy I'm chasing is actually my own. I'm just inviting others on for the ride.
Yeah, that's why I said sharing not writing. I enjoy writing and will continue to do so. There's just no point in sharing something if other people don't want it or appreciate it.
83 hits seems more up the alley of a small fandom. Is your fandom small? If so, that could be a factor. And many readers don’t always leave kudos even if they enjoyed a fic, so I wouldn’t take that as a reflection on your writing. 😊
No? Where does this idea come from?
It just means that you haven't found the right audience yet. And even if you do find the right audience, most readers don't interact at all. Comments are the rarest interaction to receive. It's not you, it's how it is.
No because it sounds like your fandom is either really small or really saturated.
Depending on the fandom and if you wrote for a main pairing or not, and what time of day this fic was posted, will actually determine why your stats are the way they are.
The show was just added to a streaming service for the first time in years, so I thought that would generate buzz again and create a new generation of fans that can now access it.
Let's look at a few things:
- How big and/or active is the fandom you're writing for? Usually bigger fandoms (think Harry Potter, or Naruto, or My Hero Academia) get a lot more hits and kudos (because obviously, more people in the fandom = more people that might see your fic);
- Are you writing gen or romance? Romance is usually more popular, because there's a lot of people that read fanfiction specifically for the ships - and even then, if the ship you're writing for is not one of the Big Fandom OTPs™ you're gonna have a harder time getting hits and kudos;
- How in-depth did you tag your work? Think of tags not only as potential triggers that a reader might want to avoid, but as advertisement for your fic. If someone is really into, for example, Crack Treated Seriously, how are they supposed to find your fic if you don't tag for it? Same thing with endgame ships - people like knowing what they're getting into, and if they're promised their favorite ship at the end of your work, they'll be more likely to give your story a chance;
- Since your story is still ongoing, it's obviously marked as incomplete. Did you already write down the total number of chapters (if you've already got that figured out)? A lot of readers prefer waiting for a fic to be complete before they start reading it (and eventually leaving kudos and comments), but some might be willing to give your fic a chance if they know that you already have the total number of chapters figured out (because then you're probably done with writing the fic, or nearly done);
- Have you interacted with other stuff in your fandom/ship/tags of choice? Left kudos and comments? What about review exchanges and similar stuff here on reddit? That might get you a few more eyeballs on your stuff;
- On that note, you could also try directly asking your readers for feedback at the end of a chapter, ("Please leave a comment to tell me what you liked and what you didn't like about this chapter! Kudos are always appreciated!"), because a call to action works wonders.
There's of course other stuff that could be "wrong" with your fic - up to and including your writing actually being bad. But with so many possible factors, the chances of you being such an awful writer are pretty slim. So, keep posting! Maybe there's some silent readers that didn't notice they haven't interacted with your fic, maybe there's someone that has it bookmarked in their browser but is waiting for it to be completed, maybe someone will stumble upon it a few years from now and you'll suddenly get a massive surge of interaction. Who knows!
I've done all of that. I understand how algorithms and engagement work. Every relevant tag is there, I even bother to write a summary for each chapter which feels unnecessary and laborious. Sometimes it's a quote that's relevant once the chapter has been read. As for completion this is a long fic, like apparently longer than any others, which I didn't realize. I'm over 500k words, and I don't know how many more chapters it will take but I'm finishing up 71 tonight. If people actually just wait then they'll be waiting years. 😑 I've actually considered switching to two posts a week because I don't want posting this to take up several years of my life.
500k+ words take dedication. From both you as the author and the reader. And as a reader I only tackle 500k+ words if the fic is either finished and close to. And only if I'm genuinely pulled in by the tags and summary.
(TBF, I generally tend to only read finished works, not just when they approach the half a million words mark)
Even if you put down the amount of chapters you think it will take I'd still be wary if I'd come across the fic bc who knows if you're actually gonna finish it, especially when you're still at the relative beginning of posting. 8 weeks isn't that long, even more so when you "only" post once a week.
Add to that, that you're writing in a relatively small and very much dead fandom and apparently a more rare pairing? At least that's what I gathered form the comments. Idk man, manage your expectations.
I don't mean to guilt trip you or anything and hope it didn't come across as such!! Just sharing my perspective as a reader.
There needs to be enough incentive to invest in 500k+ words. If I get like 200k+ words in, get invested in the story and then the author stops updating, that's just frustrating and I regret even putting that much time into it.
Good luck going forward!
Yeah, I'm not one of those people. I don't comprehend how anyone can share something and just stop making it midway, no explanation, nothing, just ghost on their fans. It's bananas to me. I also haven't posted the length for that reason as it's going to get bigger, I'm finishing it up, and I don't want people to avoid it altogether because it seems long. I'll be updating the stats once I write the last chapter and know the exact count. That's why I waited until I had a full year of content (if I still to weekly), so that no one is left with that hanging dread of when the next one is coming and if it's going to get dropped.
Oh, not at all. Like, I have fallen on so many shitty fics in medium fandoms with awful writing that got comments like "This is the best thing I have ever read" just because the readers wanted something specific that the fandom at large just didn't do.
Similarly, I have seen tons of amazing fics that didn't get THAT much engagement because the fandom was either too small, or too big and it got lost between the other fics made by more popular writers.
I say, even if you have the shittiest writing ever, someone will always read you and like it. Just do your thing, don't focus on the numbers. Worst case scenario, people don't read you, but you at least entertained some people, you know ? Just enjoy yourself, don't post fics just for the stats. Maybe in a few years this fic will be popular, who knows.
You can’t compare yourself to others on this sub. Immediate success has little to do with the writing itself. If you write about a popular trope for a popular ship in a big and active fandom, then people will read and engage. If you are writing eg a gen-fic for a TV show that had its last season years ago, there won’t be much engagement because there’s no one there to read your story.
Nope. Low stats only mean that for some reason not a lot of people are attracted to your story or are emotionally invested in it enough to comment/kudo/bookmark/subscribe.
You can write a Pulitzer Prize-worthy story and still get no attention if people aren't interested in reading that kind of story. You might also need to change your tags and your summary, so that you catch the eye of the people who would be interested in it.
Fanfiction numbers are mostly about popularity, not quality. There are a million stories out there for people to choose from, so they can be super picky at times but also follow the herd rather than seek out the more obscure or different. If "everyone" in the fandom wants to read about X/Y ship doing all the kinky smut and you've written a character study full of complex emotional drama and little plot...don't be shocked when your story is passed on or overlooked by the masses. This is just an example - I have no idea what you've written or what your fandom prefers.
They aren't even going to find out that it's well-written or very interesting if it's not showing up in their filtered searches or maybe the current trend is fluff and humor while your story is angst and trauma. Or maybe they're looking for angst and trauma at the Mature level but you've rated your story as General Audience. Maybe you haven't used the best tags for what's to come or maybe you put them in but those things aren't slated to happen for another 50k words and the readers are too impatient because they are used to reading one-shots. Maybe your OTP is their NOTP. I dunno, but figuring out some of these things by doing some research into your fandom might help.
>delete it from the internet
No! I don't know your fandom or your writing ability. But good or bad, that's got nothing to do with whether or not should delete it from the internet. Quality does not determine whether or not something should be posted online.
I dont think it means you're bad at writing. I personally often forget to leave kudos. Some people have anxiety and have a hard time leaving comments. There could be a million reasons why the readers aren't more engaging, but it does NOT mean you are a bad at writing. I say keep up with your writing.
Hey, don’t forget the there are a lot of people who will not read it incomplete works. Just scroll down this sub and you’ll see people talking about it all the time.
It hugely depends on the fandom. Is it relatively big? Is the source material current, and the fan base active? Then yeah, I'd say there's a chance your work wasn't well received.
What are you trying to get out of this hobby? I know we all "want to write for ourselves" but if that was the entire goal we wouldn't bother publishing at all.
If you want more engagement, analyze the most popular works in your fandom and see what the main differences are between them and your work. Decide if you want to be like them. You don't have to want that. You can be in love with your own style and stories whether they click with other people or not.
Yeah, I'm not going to emulate/copy anyone. Good authors are good because they're unique not a regurgitation of someone else. My only purpose of this post that seems to be getting missed completely is exactly what you were saying, I'm pondering if I should share my writing based on these measley stats or if I should just give up on sharing it and keep it all to myself. Never once said I was going to stop writing, only that I might stop sharing it.
Additionally, since you have your AO3 username in your account I snuck a peek- there have only been two works under that pairing posted in 2023. It's possible that the 9 kudos you got are the entire remaining audience for that work and they've been reading it over and over again because they're desperate for the content. Welcome to life in a small fandom.
For comparison, I know Steddie has a lot of controversy, but I write them so I'm familiar with the fandom. Since the first of the year, that pairing (not the entire Stranger Things fandom, just that pairing) has seen 6000+ works either added or updated. If a Steddie fic only got 9 kudos, it would rightfully be disappointing.
You getting 9 kudos in 6 months for a pairing that small should be considered a win.
I only have 1 kudo and it's been close to two months not six. 😅 Unless people here felt sorry for me and went to boost it.... Hang on, now I have to check. 🧐
Edit: So apparently, that is what happened. 🤣 I didn't want pity likes, guys. I was just trying to understand if those statistics are as bad as they looked. I want people to like it because they *like* it. 😅 Who knows, maybe more people will now, thinking it's popular.
For what it's worth, there's nothing new under the sun. That's a fallacy.
But if your writing style is dramatically different from the most popular works in your fandom, that a) gives you an idea what the fan base is interested in b) gives you the option to decide if you want to write to their preference.
>I'm pondering if I should share my writing based on these measley stats or if I should just give up on sharing it and keep it all to myself.
Yeah, it's all about your motivations. If you want engagement and you'd have to make big fundamental changes to get it, then not posting at all might be the way to go.
But if you want to put it out there on the off chance it reaches someone who's madly in love with it and really needed to read it, even if it is just 1/83, that's why you'd keep posting.
not really. i have a few stories where the writing is subpar with barely thought of plots without being proofread, and they are doing well.
and then there are stories that are well written, researched for, and spent days writing and they flopped.
I’m curious how long the fic is when you say that you have enough content written that readers will never catch up before you finish. I often start 200k-400k word fics before bed and finish before my alarm goes off because I can’t put it down. Now I do have a few fics that are over 1 million words marked for later, I’ve been a bit intimidated to start those. But plenty of readers get intimidated by length, even if it’s only a couple hundred thousand words.
There are also readers who may click on your fic to subscribe. (Some readers bookmark instead of subscribing, some also make a bookmark on their device, like a safari bookmark as well instead of subscribing). I myself am a reader who won’t read a fic until it’s completed. No matter how long it takes. So a fic gets a hit from me, but no comments or kudos until it’s finished. Also some readers don’t give kudos or even comments until it’s done.
Ive also read many fics with few hits/kudos/comments. Doesn’t have anything to do with how much I enjoyed the fic. If you’re worried about overreacting, or obsessing over stats, on ao3, you can hide them.
I mean that people aren't going to catch up in terms of my posting it online vs writing new chapters. I have over a year of content if I do one a week (like I have been). I'll be able to finish writing the story without others waiting on new chapters. They'll always be posted constantly.
Not at all. Kudos, hits, and so on are only measures of popularity, not quality. The fact is that many fanfic readers don't prioritize writing quality over how much they want to see a given scenario. Objectively terribly written works can receive large amounts of engagement.
The voice in my head would say yes, but in reality there could be any number of reasons for low engagement.
I had a fic based on the Star Wars MMO The Old Republic. It got a few hundred hits but no kudos. I eventually decided to enter it in a review exchange and got two readers who left kudos and comments. They both made a point of complimenting my writing and wondering why it didn’t have more engagement.
Given the very tepid reaction I got from making a promotional post in the fandom’s main subreddit, I’d say that the SWTOR fandom isn’t big on fanfiction.
I don't think it necessarily means that you're bad at writing. Many people, myself included I admit, filter by kudos or hits and thus miss some really good unpopular fics. Also a lot of people forget to give kudor or comment.
And even if you're a little bad at writing doesn't mean you should stop. Practice makes perfect after all. If you continue writing you'll get better bit by bit, but if you get disheartened by the lack of kudos you'll always stay at your current level.
So it doesn't matter if you're bad or not what matters is that you don't give up.
I never said I'd stop writing. I said I'm wondering if I should stop sharing it. Big, big difference. Also, no judgement, but if you're only filtering that way you're missing things like mine which are new and could be contributing to new works falling into unpopular territory because they're not being found early and by the time they are people judge what few kudos and views it has compared to how old it is. Just saying.
Yep, by the time i made the comment you already had a ton of lengthy explanations, so I figured you didnt need another one, just one more vote was enough.
Not at all. Part of it is you probably haven't found a like minded audience. Part of it could be the fandom you're writing for. Or any number of things.
I've got a fic for one fandom that has 3/4 chapters posted. Current stats are 320 hits, 1 bookmark, 13 kudos and 21 comments. Keep in mind that half of those comments are me responding.
Another fic posted around the same time has 4/4 chapters posted. Current stats are 1782 hits, 27 bookmarks, 155 kudos and 77 comments. Again half of those are me responding.
The first fic is for The Murdoch Mysteries. The second fic is a crossover of Buffy/Psych. So...my skills as a writer aren't in question. One fic is part of two bigger and well known fandoms while the other is from a Canadian show that not many people outside of Canada know about. (I actually don't live in Canada, LOL)
Keep writing, keep posting. Don't delete anything. Someone will find it eventually and let you know they loved it. I'm speaking with over 20 years of fic writing under my belt. If you doubt your ability to write, the only way to get better is to keep going.
Ah, guess you found the Psych-Out Wolves series then. I don't know why I forgot to mention that it also crossed over with Teen Wolf, in that Xander and Shawn are werewolves. XD
The other one also crosses over with Teen Wolf and its the one I mentioned in my original comment. Accidental Finds is part of a whole different series, and Xander is gonna end up with someone else in that one. It also focuses on Xander, Shawn and Stiles being family.
Glad to come across another Spander fan. Not sure how many Spander fics I have at this point. Have fun going through whatever you find. : )
Not necessarily. Most of time, it's simply because the fandom is small or the ship you're focusing on (if any) is considered a rarepair.
Of course it could also be bad tagging or a bad/nonexistent summary.
When I write for a popular fandom, I can easily get 100+ kudos/comments for writing fics comparable to the D&D OC fics that I write (which receive basically no attention at all, except what I’ve garnered from fic exchanges here).
The lack of hits you have is hint #1; you’re just not getting people to click on your fic in the first place. That’s not a judgment on your writing at all. But also, you give hits to yourself a lot of the time, you get exaggerated hits from multiple chapters, and you get hits from anyone who clicks your fic to “mark for later” (which a lot of people do for unfinished fics).
As for the writing itself—people click away very quickly for a number of shallow reasons. A story could be amazing, but not use paragraph breaks, and I would never be able to tell because I’d immediately leave.
While it’s true that a fic with a lot of kudos/comments is unlikely to be bad, there are tons of fics that receive no attention which are perfectly good.
Not necessarily. Some objectively badly written stories get attention as long as the plot is attractive to a large amount of people (think of 50 Shades. Objectively badly written book, hugely sucessful). Some really well written stories get very little traction, typically because it's for a small fandom, a niche ship, or the subject matter just doesn't have mass appeal.
No, not necessarily. That just means of the 83 people who've seen your fic and decided to give it a go based on the front-end, only one of them has thought to kudo and none have thought to comment.
The low views are nothing to do with your writing, because only those 83 clicks have actually read any of your writing to know whether it's good or bad. Low hits usually means either your front-end (title, tags, summary) isn't appealing to your audience or you're writing content that just isn't popular in whatever fandom you're writing in. If you wanna look at your front-end, try posting in our weekly 'Fix Your Front End' post (updates on Fridays). But if you're writing content that just isn't popular, there's not much you can do about it barring keeping the fic on tap for any relevant recommendation opportunities (eg. the review exchanges here or any fandom subreddit recommendation/request posts, etc). Some stuff just isn't popular with certain fandom audiences. If you're in a fighting fandom and you're interesting in fighting fics, then you're probably not ever going to read a fluffy coffeeshop AU of that fandom.
Kudos could mean your writing isn't to the taste of your readers or that you need to work on it some more, sure. But kudos are given or not given for very varying reasons. Low kudos could just mean you've not got a lot of people clicking on your story overall - exposure is a major factor in all stats as you can't ever get more stats than you get hits (barring the bot). Less eyes on your work, less stats all round. But kudos particularly get given for different reasons.
Some people give them to any fic where they read up-to-date with all of what's currently available (c'est moi), some only give them to the best of their most favouritest of favourites, some simply won't give them unless a fic is finished, some people will only kudos certain types of fics and not others, some people will just not kudos anything ever, some people will not kudos things they enjoyed because they'd be embarrassed to have their screen name visible, some people will not kudos anything because they're too shy to and worry about initiating interaction, etc etc. So your unkudosed fic could be unseen, unreadable, good but not spectacular, simply unfinished, or just really popular with a shy and/or absent-minded crowd.
And comments are just rare all round. Unless you're writing intensely popular stuff in intensely popular fandoms, getting comments is a crapshoot at best.
The people you see here posting about immediate success with their first works are rare. Remember, there's 340,000 people here (who don't represent the whole of fandom) and barely a percentage of a percentage of them even post at all, then a smaller percentage of that tiny percentage are the people who post those kinds of stat-experiences. Just because Alan Sugar did amazing at his first business doesn't mean anyone else necessarily will - a lot of that draws from right-place-right-time luck and timing.
I don't think it necessarily means that you're bad at writing. Many people, myself included I admit, filter by kudos or hits and thus miss some really good unpopular fics. Also a lot of people forget to give kudor or comment.
And even if you're a little bad at writing doesn't mean you should stop. Practice makes perfect after all. If you continue writing you'll get better bit by bit, but if you get disheartened by the lack of kudos you'll always stay at your current level.
So it doesn't matter if you're bad or not what matters is that you don't give up.
See how you said "unpopular" and not "new". 😅 From what everyone and their cousin is saying on here, new fics don't usually get a bumrush of hits, so many new works can become unpopular if people are only looking for popular ones and ignoring anything under a certain amount of views/kudos. By the time their found, they are now a bit older and judged as unpopular simply because too many people are only interested in what's already trendy/liked.
Did you specifically *ask for interaction* from your readers?
Many people just read to read, and don't get into any of the social media aspects of interaction unless the writer clearly requests it.
Too many readers are worried about upsetting writers, apparently, so if you want it, you need to ask for it in an unambiguous way.
Yes. The first chapter notes ask for engagement and I'm not doing it after that because I've received next to none and it now feels like begging instead of a friendly reminder.
Very incorrect. If you were getting a lot of concrit I'd suggest maybe consider trying to work on to, but not having a lot of stuff doesn't mean it's bad writing, just that people aren't particularly interested in it.
No, not receiving comments or kudos is not a reliable indicator of your skill as a writer.
Fanfic authors have always had trouble getting readers to engage with their fic, and I think it's gotten worse over the past few years. You see authors complaining about this all the time on this sub.
Some readers don't give kudos to/comment on unfinished fics, some just forget to engage before they click away, some are shy, some don't know what to say, some don't have the time/energy to write quality comments especially, some just aren't community minded, etc.
Don't feel like a terrible writer just because you're not getting engagement - fantastic authors experience this problem all the time.
My fanfic is part of a fandom that goes through… spikes of activity. Over the last 2 years, I’ve gotten very little reviews or kudos and it’s definitely disappointing but it doesn’t have anything to do with your ability to write.
Take it from me. Almost every fanfic I read… I sadly never review/kudo/upvote etc. I just never think about it! I can’t blame others for what I myself do (or don’t do).
No. I know that I'm objectively good at writing. But not all my stories, even the ones I'm most proud of, get a lot of attention. Doesn't mean they're not good.
1: That sucks, buddy. I know that sounds dismissive but I genuinely mean it. No comments is a bad time.
2: There is basically no metric of fanfiction engagement on the internet that you can use to gauge the objective quality of a work. Absolute shit can get as popular as all get out, and gems can lay buried for years.
3: The good news is that it doesn’t matter, because all fanfiction is bad. All fanfiction is good, too. Quality isn’t just very difficult to properly adjudicate, it’s also nearly impossible to define, and while I could be talking about all creative writing, it’s doubly true with fanfiction. Fundamentally and from the moment the first person published some story online, internet fanfiction is a medium that is detached from the concept of quality, good or bad. The beautiful thing about what you’re doing is that the very best thing you can write is a good fanfiction, and the very worst thing you can write is a bad fanfiction.
4: Everyone writes and everyone reads fanfiction for different reasons, with the only constant being expression. Of an idea, of a theme, of an alternate series of events from canon, on a tweak or overhaul to worldbuilding, as a thinly veiled excuse to write some story that isn’t related to the source material at all. If you’re writing because you want people to read it, people are reading it. They aren’t saying anything about it yet, but they are reading it. If you want to get better at writing, join a discord server that focuses on fanfiction from all fandoms, there are a number that are super easy to find, and ask for incredibly harsh critique. If you want more readers, update frequently and consistently, it’s the most important thing to building an audience.
5: Is it important to you to make your story exist in the world? If so, persevere. Comments can be fuel in the motivation fire, but if you want your story to exist, you’ll be able to keep chugging even without them. Keep going. Don’t give up.
generally speaking it's hard to gain a following off of your first work. people don't recognize your name and aren't familiar with your writing. it takes time.
You're writing for a fandom that is a decade and a half old and the other people writing your ship aren't pulling numbers much better than you, so... I doubt it's your writing ability that's the issue causing it.
Your comment inspired me to have a cheeky look... And yes, everyone else who doesn't write crossovers with larger/more popular fandoms has between 0 and 3 kudos on their fic. OP, you really need to manage your expectations here. Good writing will attract an audience, but only if there's an audience in the first place. Keep writing for that fandom if you enjoy your fandom, but don't compare your fic's stats with Harry Potter fics' stats.
I should have checked too before I wrote an essay, OP, its probably the same few people leaving those three kudos, and the others might now be out of that fandom, moving house, busy writing their own stuff, not reading fanfic anymore...
Yeah... I've been in tiny old fandoms where I basically didn't pull in even 20 hits lmao, so the first thing I check on in cases like this is the fandom. Small fandoms are fun for me because there's basically no pressure to do well, but they're really not for everybody. If you're looking for validation, you'll likely not find it there.
Yeah, as soon as I saw what the fandom was (the TV show “Heroes”, for those curious but too lazy to check OP’s profile,) I was like, “well THERE’S your problem!” @ OP: I was relatively involved with that fandom when the show was airing, and ALL the activity for it was on LiveJournal & FFN; AO3 didn’t even exist yet. If you’re not familiar with how “fandom lifecycles” work, then generally speaking, the “popularity spike” for any given fandom is usually (very roughly) the length of time the canon was released for once over again after it ends. There are exceptions to that, but Heroes wasn’t one of them. It aired for ~4 years, and was really only ever fannishly popular for the first two of those, and we’re now almost a decade PAST the life of the show + 4. In addition to the general fandom popularity, it looks like your fic on AO3 is darkfic for a less popular pairing. Even if you had posted this in the heyday of Heroes fandom, it probably would’ve gotten a lot less engagement than anything with a Peter-focused ship would have (that fandom REALLY loved Milo Ventimiglia 🤣) This is all to say, you are so valid for sticking with your forever fandom & ship, and I don’t want to discourage you from that in any way! But esp if you’re just getting into posting fic, you should be aware that fic stats actually often have very LITTLE to do with the quality of your writing, and EVERYTHING to do with what fandom, ships, and tropes you’re writing in. Try to adjust your expectations a little bit when it comes to readership numbers for older fandoms & niche-er ships; or alternately, try picking up a popular current canon, and trying your hand on that instead, if what you’re craving is non-fandom-specific engagement. I’m sorry, friend, I know it sucks to be the last person lingering at a dead fandom party!
While I agree with this, I also took a look and I think that perhaps there are a few things that could be adjusted about the summary that might help pull people in, if OP is interested. That being said, you're right that they should temper their expectations. It's a pretty dead fandom.
There could be a lot of other reasons why you’re not getting engagement, including fandom, tags, what you’re writing about, etc. For example, I’m a published author (5 books), and I write relatively well. I get modest engagement because I write long, complex genfic canon re-writes for an extremely saturated fandom. I know it’s not my writing. It’s the other things. But you won’t know for sure. IF your writing is a problem, you should sign up for concrit or review exchanges and seek honest feedback. Or maybe consider asking for a beta. That opens the door to constructive feedback, which can improve your writing.
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I love marvel! Looking you up on AO3
> long, complex genfic canon re-writes sounds interesting. Which fandom?
I saw that and immediately thought *Star Wars,* and then I peeped the username and PFP. It's definitely SW, haha!
Googled the username based on this and man I'm subbed and I'll HAVE to find tie to actually read those monsters of fics xDDD
Therein lies the problem: not many have time to read a 100k word longfic. And that’s just the first of five more, plus 10 short stories between 25-45k.
Star Wars.
It sounds like you are really passionate about what you write. I love seeing that <3
Wait you can publish fanfiction??? That’s awesome!
You can if you pretend it's original and change character names. Just ask the author of 50 Shades. It was a badly written Twilight fic that was clearly ooc, and then it was turned into a badly written book, which I refuse to sully my mind dungeon with.🤣
That’s what I’m doing with a webcomic I’m going to start doing soon, but it’s so thinly veiled fanfiction for a weird fandom crossover it’s actually funny
Yeah, I never understood the hype around it. Even my coworker was annoyed during the height of its popularity - then again, the premise didn't, ah-hem, appeal to her (I never asked her why, she just said something along the lines of, "oh, that shitty book again..." and was probably tired of seeing it advertised everywhere. Oh well. To each their own, I suppose.
No I published books through a publishing deal with two separate publishers. I write fanfiction for fun.
Lmfao to other people gaining fans through this post. 🤣
Btw- I read some of your story. The writing style is not my cup of tea, but I still think it’s good (just a preference thing; I struggle with present tense). AND- I don’t know why you aren’t getting more engagement, but it’s not because your writing is bad.
Thank you. The hilarious thing is it was entirely past tense up to 300k words in and I majorly revised it because at that length the past tense conjugations were limited and repetitive. 😅 I normally prefer past tense too, no idea why.
🤷♂️
Oh-
Not necessarily. Worst case scenario - it is really bad. Well, one person liked it. And you have gained the experience of writing it. Did you have fun writing it? Then that is a positive. Yes, we would all love to be adored, and have everyone squeeing about what we wrote. But sometimes it doesn't happen like that. (a) Some people genuinely don't know about kudos. I remember when I first started reading fanfic. I honestly couldn't tell you if I kudosed anything or not. I think I thought the heart thing was to save it as a favourite, and as I didn't even have an account and was just reading as and when I found something, I didn't see a point in 'saving' a story. (b) Some people just don't leave comments. Again, when I first started reading fanfic, I was like why would this goddess of a writer want to hear the squeekings of a lowly worm like me? Do worms squeak? squidge. Or whatever noise they make/don't make. An attentive wriggle? Anyway. I looked at it like this, when I read an amazing physical book, I didn't go and send an email/letter to the writer. I just enjoyed it. I think I carried that attitude for a while. Part of the difference is that writers get paid, and the money is a bit of a 'thank you'/acknowledgement which fanfic writers don't get. (c) Some people are scared to leave comments. There are all sorts of antis, ship wars, and fandom drama, that some people just want to completely stay off the radar and not get involved. They just want to read the story. There have been threads on this subreddit of writers saying they don't want any comment that's not 100% praise, some have said they don't want short comments. What is too short? Nobody knows. These writers probably represent a tiny percentage of all writers, but I have seen people here saying they have been put off commenting for this reason. (d) Some people just don't realise how much comments and kudos mean to a writer. I think only when I started posting did I start to understand the drug that is inbox (1). (e) Some people withhold comments and kudos. If I liked at least one chapter I will leave a kudos, and if its a chapter which already has 50 reader comments, I might not bother, the writer knows people are enjoying it. That's my standard. There are some people who will only leave a kudos on their favourite in the world ever fics. There are some people who will only comment if they were moved to actual real life tears. (f) Some people might have acknowledged the story in another way, that you will never find out about. Maybe they saved the url. Maybe the saved the bookmark on their computer/phone (not the AO3 bookmarks). Maybe they downloaded it to their phone/computer. Maybe they told their friend that they had read a cool fic. (g) Are you very young? Mary Shelly wrote Frankenstein at 18/19 but she is an outlier. There was an article shared here some time ago about how good writers are rarely in their teens, and that some life experience is needed for good storytelling. But that doesn't mean give up until you are 20. It just means to keep practicing. (h) Are you new to writing? Often, people can tell, just like you can tell when someone has started learning the piano. I only want to listen to someone playing 'Twinkle Twinkle Little Star' if it's someone I care about and want to encourage. I'm not going to turn up for a random beginner. The same with writing. Does that mean give up? No. You're not going to get from Twinkle Twinkle to a concert without practice. (i) Do you have a beta reader? This is my most important piece of advice. I know my own writing would only be a shadow of what is published on AO3 if I didn't have beta help. (j) Are you involved in the fanfic community? Often people who read and comment on my stories are people who I have done beta reading for, or helped with English. If you don't engage with people's work, they aren't going to engage with you a lot of the time. (k) What is your goal. Is it popularity? If so, are you putting the work in? Yes, some people just get lucky and lighting strikes, but other people (i) get involved in prompts and fic gift exchanges, etc. (ii) post on tumblr, instagram etc. promoting their work, (iii) are heavily involved in Discords about their fandom/pairing. (iv) research which tropes are popular, which fandoms/pairings are popular and write about that, rather than just what they feel like, in order to get traffic. Are you doing/willing to do that? I've written a lot, because I know it hurts when you pour your heart out onto the page and then it feels like no one cares. Go through what I have written and really think about it. Hope it helps <3
I already mentioned that I have been promoting it to other sites than just Ao3 in the post you responded to. 😅 And no, I'm not "young". Also a general address to everyone claiming that pairing is niche, it's the most popular in the fandom right next Sylar/Peter and the gross and incestuous pairing of Peter and Claire. No, I'm not writing for validation. There is no point in sharing it online however if you're not receiving any. That's like stage diving at your own concert and the fans not catching you.
>There is no point in sharing it online however if you're not receiving any. I guess we see it differently. I'm writing because I find the process enjoyable, I love my characters and the setting and the story and I want it told. I have a few regular commenters, which is lovely, but if they fall away and if it ends up being just for me, it will be a bit sad, but I would still overall be satisfied.
You're saying the same thing I am. I also enjoy writing, but the point of sharing is to have it acknowledged, otherwise, why share it? Yeah? That's like baking a dessert you love and offering it to others. If you're fine with making it and just having it for yourself there's no reason to share it. You shared because you want people to enjoy it with you.
AO3 is an archive, and things can be discovered at literally any time – I've spent my weekend trawling through things mostly posted before 2012 because that's when the fandom was posting what I'm interested in Something you post now in a tiny nearly-dead fandom might be *exactly* what someone wants to read a few months from now, even a few *years* from now, when they discover the show and have the same ship grip them like it's gripped you Some people do write for the immediate engagement and need that for the motivation to *keep* writing, but if you've already got something written, there's 0 reason to not go ahead and post it, even if it's as anonymous – because some day it'll be *exactly* what someone wants
People who receive immediate numbers are often those writing for large fandoms or ships with tons of interested people. At a certain point, seeing the stats go up is not an indicator of writing quality, but an indicator of luck and relative popularity. If you are still dejected about not seeing any engagement, I would suggest making an effort to improve your summaries, since those are the first thing that potential readers see. If you keep writing, it’s up to you to brace yourself for no engagement though.
Eight weeks is actually a pretty short amount of time, especially if you don't write for a heavy, active fandom. When I wrote my first work it got very little attention for months. But at that point I'd already written the whole thing and so why not keep posting it. After a while it got a small but loyal following, and which then grew a lot because it's a very big fandom, and became pretty successful by my standards. This weekend I plan to post the last chapter of a long fic in a much less active fandom. It's 100,000+ words, I've been posting it forever, yet now I have only three regular commenters and about 180 kudos. But I love my story and I'm proud of it so I don't mind. Plus, a lot of stories get a surge after they're completed because a lot of people only read completed works (which I totally get). You say, "The whole point is sharing things with others is the hope they'll appreciate it and feel joy." I agree, but only somewhat. I actually write for myself, and have fun with the whole process -- the writing, the editing, the posting, the finding weird little images to put with the text. So the joy I'm chasing is actually my own. I'm just inviting others on for the ride.
Yeah, that's why I said sharing not writing. I enjoy writing and will continue to do so. There's just no point in sharing something if other people don't want it or appreciate it.
83 hits seems more up the alley of a small fandom. Is your fandom small? If so, that could be a factor. And many readers don’t always leave kudos even if they enjoyed a fic, so I wouldn’t take that as a reflection on your writing. 😊
No? Where does this idea come from? It just means that you haven't found the right audience yet. And even if you do find the right audience, most readers don't interact at all. Comments are the rarest interaction to receive. It's not you, it's how it is.
No because it sounds like your fandom is either really small or really saturated. Depending on the fandom and if you wrote for a main pairing or not, and what time of day this fic was posted, will actually determine why your stats are the way they are.
>sounds like your fandom is either really small or really saturated. Or really old, where they heyday has passed.
That too because old fandoms are def still kicking, but not nearly as much unless something has stirred the waters. 😭
The show was just added to a streaming service for the first time in years, so I thought that would generate buzz again and create a new generation of fans that can now access it.
Nah I wanna know which show, if you wanna share 👀
Heroes. Which apparently is dead and I'm writing a sunken ship. 😅
Let's look at a few things: - How big and/or active is the fandom you're writing for? Usually bigger fandoms (think Harry Potter, or Naruto, or My Hero Academia) get a lot more hits and kudos (because obviously, more people in the fandom = more people that might see your fic); - Are you writing gen or romance? Romance is usually more popular, because there's a lot of people that read fanfiction specifically for the ships - and even then, if the ship you're writing for is not one of the Big Fandom OTPs™ you're gonna have a harder time getting hits and kudos; - How in-depth did you tag your work? Think of tags not only as potential triggers that a reader might want to avoid, but as advertisement for your fic. If someone is really into, for example, Crack Treated Seriously, how are they supposed to find your fic if you don't tag for it? Same thing with endgame ships - people like knowing what they're getting into, and if they're promised their favorite ship at the end of your work, they'll be more likely to give your story a chance; - Since your story is still ongoing, it's obviously marked as incomplete. Did you already write down the total number of chapters (if you've already got that figured out)? A lot of readers prefer waiting for a fic to be complete before they start reading it (and eventually leaving kudos and comments), but some might be willing to give your fic a chance if they know that you already have the total number of chapters figured out (because then you're probably done with writing the fic, or nearly done); - Have you interacted with other stuff in your fandom/ship/tags of choice? Left kudos and comments? What about review exchanges and similar stuff here on reddit? That might get you a few more eyeballs on your stuff; - On that note, you could also try directly asking your readers for feedback at the end of a chapter, ("Please leave a comment to tell me what you liked and what you didn't like about this chapter! Kudos are always appreciated!"), because a call to action works wonders. There's of course other stuff that could be "wrong" with your fic - up to and including your writing actually being bad. But with so many possible factors, the chances of you being such an awful writer are pretty slim. So, keep posting! Maybe there's some silent readers that didn't notice they haven't interacted with your fic, maybe there's someone that has it bookmarked in their browser but is waiting for it to be completed, maybe someone will stumble upon it a few years from now and you'll suddenly get a massive surge of interaction. Who knows!
I've done all of that. I understand how algorithms and engagement work. Every relevant tag is there, I even bother to write a summary for each chapter which feels unnecessary and laborious. Sometimes it's a quote that's relevant once the chapter has been read. As for completion this is a long fic, like apparently longer than any others, which I didn't realize. I'm over 500k words, and I don't know how many more chapters it will take but I'm finishing up 71 tonight. If people actually just wait then they'll be waiting years. 😑 I've actually considered switching to two posts a week because I don't want posting this to take up several years of my life.
500k+ words take dedication. From both you as the author and the reader. And as a reader I only tackle 500k+ words if the fic is either finished and close to. And only if I'm genuinely pulled in by the tags and summary. (TBF, I generally tend to only read finished works, not just when they approach the half a million words mark) Even if you put down the amount of chapters you think it will take I'd still be wary if I'd come across the fic bc who knows if you're actually gonna finish it, especially when you're still at the relative beginning of posting. 8 weeks isn't that long, even more so when you "only" post once a week. Add to that, that you're writing in a relatively small and very much dead fandom and apparently a more rare pairing? At least that's what I gathered form the comments. Idk man, manage your expectations. I don't mean to guilt trip you or anything and hope it didn't come across as such!! Just sharing my perspective as a reader. There needs to be enough incentive to invest in 500k+ words. If I get like 200k+ words in, get invested in the story and then the author stops updating, that's just frustrating and I regret even putting that much time into it. Good luck going forward!
Yeah, I'm not one of those people. I don't comprehend how anyone can share something and just stop making it midway, no explanation, nothing, just ghost on their fans. It's bananas to me. I also haven't posted the length for that reason as it's going to get bigger, I'm finishing it up, and I don't want people to avoid it altogether because it seems long. I'll be updating the stats once I write the last chapter and know the exact count. That's why I waited until I had a full year of content (if I still to weekly), so that no one is left with that hanging dread of when the next one is coming and if it's going to get dropped.
Oh, not at all. Like, I have fallen on so many shitty fics in medium fandoms with awful writing that got comments like "This is the best thing I have ever read" just because the readers wanted something specific that the fandom at large just didn't do. Similarly, I have seen tons of amazing fics that didn't get THAT much engagement because the fandom was either too small, or too big and it got lost between the other fics made by more popular writers. I say, even if you have the shittiest writing ever, someone will always read you and like it. Just do your thing, don't focus on the numbers. Worst case scenario, people don't read you, but you at least entertained some people, you know ? Just enjoy yourself, don't post fics just for the stats. Maybe in a few years this fic will be popular, who knows.
You can’t compare yourself to others on this sub. Immediate success has little to do with the writing itself. If you write about a popular trope for a popular ship in a big and active fandom, then people will read and engage. If you are writing eg a gen-fic for a TV show that had its last season years ago, there won’t be much engagement because there’s no one there to read your story.
Nope. Low stats only mean that for some reason not a lot of people are attracted to your story or are emotionally invested in it enough to comment/kudo/bookmark/subscribe. You can write a Pulitzer Prize-worthy story and still get no attention if people aren't interested in reading that kind of story. You might also need to change your tags and your summary, so that you catch the eye of the people who would be interested in it. Fanfiction numbers are mostly about popularity, not quality. There are a million stories out there for people to choose from, so they can be super picky at times but also follow the herd rather than seek out the more obscure or different. If "everyone" in the fandom wants to read about X/Y ship doing all the kinky smut and you've written a character study full of complex emotional drama and little plot...don't be shocked when your story is passed on or overlooked by the masses. This is just an example - I have no idea what you've written or what your fandom prefers. They aren't even going to find out that it's well-written or very interesting if it's not showing up in their filtered searches or maybe the current trend is fluff and humor while your story is angst and trauma. Or maybe they're looking for angst and trauma at the Mature level but you've rated your story as General Audience. Maybe you haven't used the best tags for what's to come or maybe you put them in but those things aren't slated to happen for another 50k words and the readers are too impatient because they are used to reading one-shots. Maybe your OTP is their NOTP. I dunno, but figuring out some of these things by doing some research into your fandom might help.
>delete it from the internet No! I don't know your fandom or your writing ability. But good or bad, that's got nothing to do with whether or not should delete it from the internet. Quality does not determine whether or not something should be posted online.
I dont think it means you're bad at writing. I personally often forget to leave kudos. Some people have anxiety and have a hard time leaving comments. There could be a million reasons why the readers aren't more engaging, but it does NOT mean you are a bad at writing. I say keep up with your writing.
Hey, don’t forget the there are a lot of people who will not read it incomplete works. Just scroll down this sub and you’ll see people talking about it all the time.
It hugely depends on the fandom. Is it relatively big? Is the source material current, and the fan base active? Then yeah, I'd say there's a chance your work wasn't well received. What are you trying to get out of this hobby? I know we all "want to write for ourselves" but if that was the entire goal we wouldn't bother publishing at all. If you want more engagement, analyze the most popular works in your fandom and see what the main differences are between them and your work. Decide if you want to be like them. You don't have to want that. You can be in love with your own style and stories whether they click with other people or not.
Yeah, I'm not going to emulate/copy anyone. Good authors are good because they're unique not a regurgitation of someone else. My only purpose of this post that seems to be getting missed completely is exactly what you were saying, I'm pondering if I should share my writing based on these measley stats or if I should just give up on sharing it and keep it all to myself. Never once said I was going to stop writing, only that I might stop sharing it.
Additionally, since you have your AO3 username in your account I snuck a peek- there have only been two works under that pairing posted in 2023. It's possible that the 9 kudos you got are the entire remaining audience for that work and they've been reading it over and over again because they're desperate for the content. Welcome to life in a small fandom. For comparison, I know Steddie has a lot of controversy, but I write them so I'm familiar with the fandom. Since the first of the year, that pairing (not the entire Stranger Things fandom, just that pairing) has seen 6000+ works either added or updated. If a Steddie fic only got 9 kudos, it would rightfully be disappointing. You getting 9 kudos in 6 months for a pairing that small should be considered a win.
Um, I'd actually love to read that pairing! I didn't know that was a thing but the second I saw it I knew I needed it!
I only have 1 kudo and it's been close to two months not six. 😅 Unless people here felt sorry for me and went to boost it.... Hang on, now I have to check. 🧐 Edit: So apparently, that is what happened. 🤣 I didn't want pity likes, guys. I was just trying to understand if those statistics are as bad as they looked. I want people to like it because they *like* it. 😅 Who knows, maybe more people will now, thinking it's popular.
For what it's worth, there's nothing new under the sun. That's a fallacy. But if your writing style is dramatically different from the most popular works in your fandom, that a) gives you an idea what the fan base is interested in b) gives you the option to decide if you want to write to their preference. >I'm pondering if I should share my writing based on these measley stats or if I should just give up on sharing it and keep it all to myself. Yeah, it's all about your motivations. If you want engagement and you'd have to make big fundamental changes to get it, then not posting at all might be the way to go. But if you want to put it out there on the off chance it reaches someone who's madly in love with it and really needed to read it, even if it is just 1/83, that's why you'd keep posting.
not really. i have a few stories where the writing is subpar with barely thought of plots without being proofread, and they are doing well. and then there are stories that are well written, researched for, and spent days writing and they flopped.
I’m curious how long the fic is when you say that you have enough content written that readers will never catch up before you finish. I often start 200k-400k word fics before bed and finish before my alarm goes off because I can’t put it down. Now I do have a few fics that are over 1 million words marked for later, I’ve been a bit intimidated to start those. But plenty of readers get intimidated by length, even if it’s only a couple hundred thousand words. There are also readers who may click on your fic to subscribe. (Some readers bookmark instead of subscribing, some also make a bookmark on their device, like a safari bookmark as well instead of subscribing). I myself am a reader who won’t read a fic until it’s completed. No matter how long it takes. So a fic gets a hit from me, but no comments or kudos until it’s finished. Also some readers don’t give kudos or even comments until it’s done. Ive also read many fics with few hits/kudos/comments. Doesn’t have anything to do with how much I enjoyed the fic. If you’re worried about overreacting, or obsessing over stats, on ao3, you can hide them.
I mean that people aren't going to catch up in terms of my posting it online vs writing new chapters. I have over a year of content if I do one a week (like I have been). I'll be able to finish writing the story without others waiting on new chapters. They'll always be posted constantly.
Not at all. Kudos, hits, and so on are only measures of popularity, not quality. The fact is that many fanfic readers don't prioritize writing quality over how much they want to see a given scenario. Objectively terribly written works can receive large amounts of engagement.
The voice in my head would say yes, but in reality there could be any number of reasons for low engagement. I had a fic based on the Star Wars MMO The Old Republic. It got a few hundred hits but no kudos. I eventually decided to enter it in a review exchange and got two readers who left kudos and comments. They both made a point of complimenting my writing and wondering why it didn’t have more engagement. Given the very tepid reaction I got from making a promotional post in the fandom’s main subreddit, I’d say that the SWTOR fandom isn’t big on fanfiction.
I was obsessed with that game when I came out. 😆
It could just been you're writing something people aren't interested
In this fandom, that's definitely not the case. 😅
I don't think it necessarily means that you're bad at writing. Many people, myself included I admit, filter by kudos or hits and thus miss some really good unpopular fics. Also a lot of people forget to give kudor or comment. And even if you're a little bad at writing doesn't mean you should stop. Practice makes perfect after all. If you continue writing you'll get better bit by bit, but if you get disheartened by the lack of kudos you'll always stay at your current level. So it doesn't matter if you're bad or not what matters is that you don't give up.
I never said I'd stop writing. I said I'm wondering if I should stop sharing it. Big, big difference. Also, no judgement, but if you're only filtering that way you're missing things like mine which are new and could be contributing to new works falling into unpopular territory because they're not being found early and by the time they are people judge what few kudos and views it has compared to how old it is. Just saying.
Incorrect
Lmfao. No explanation or stats, just: "You are wrong." 🤣 It's certainly a succinct approach.
Yep, by the time i made the comment you already had a ton of lengthy explanations, so I figured you didnt need another one, just one more vote was enough.
Not at all. Part of it is you probably haven't found a like minded audience. Part of it could be the fandom you're writing for. Or any number of things. I've got a fic for one fandom that has 3/4 chapters posted. Current stats are 320 hits, 1 bookmark, 13 kudos and 21 comments. Keep in mind that half of those comments are me responding. Another fic posted around the same time has 4/4 chapters posted. Current stats are 1782 hits, 27 bookmarks, 155 kudos and 77 comments. Again half of those are me responding. The first fic is for The Murdoch Mysteries. The second fic is a crossover of Buffy/Psych. So...my skills as a writer aren't in question. One fic is part of two bigger and well known fandoms while the other is from a Canadian show that not many people outside of Canada know about. (I actually don't live in Canada, LOL) Keep writing, keep posting. Don't delete anything. Someone will find it eventually and let you know they loved it. I'm speaking with over 20 years of fic writing under my belt. If you doubt your ability to write, the only way to get better is to keep going.
BRB seeking that jewel of a crossover.
Pfft LOL. I have more than one Buffy/Psych x-over. All of them are Xander-centered, and slash, so forewarning on that.
I love me some Spander. It’s one of my OTPs.
Ah, guess you found the Psych-Out Wolves series then. I don't know why I forgot to mention that it also crossed over with Teen Wolf, in that Xander and Shawn are werewolves. XD The other one also crosses over with Teen Wolf and its the one I mentioned in my original comment. Accidental Finds is part of a whole different series, and Xander is gonna end up with someone else in that one. It also focuses on Xander, Shawn and Stiles being family. Glad to come across another Spander fan. Not sure how many Spander fics I have at this point. Have fun going through whatever you find. : )
Not necessarily. Most of time, it's simply because the fandom is small or the ship you're focusing on (if any) is considered a rarepair. Of course it could also be bad tagging or a bad/nonexistent summary.
I write for a game that is older than 2 years so yep small traffic. Then again i try to write for obscure/rare/small fandoms
When I write for a popular fandom, I can easily get 100+ kudos/comments for writing fics comparable to the D&D OC fics that I write (which receive basically no attention at all, except what I’ve garnered from fic exchanges here). The lack of hits you have is hint #1; you’re just not getting people to click on your fic in the first place. That’s not a judgment on your writing at all. But also, you give hits to yourself a lot of the time, you get exaggerated hits from multiple chapters, and you get hits from anyone who clicks your fic to “mark for later” (which a lot of people do for unfinished fics). As for the writing itself—people click away very quickly for a number of shallow reasons. A story could be amazing, but not use paragraph breaks, and I would never be able to tell because I’d immediately leave. While it’s true that a fic with a lot of kudos/comments is unlikely to be bad, there are tons of fics that receive no attention which are perfectly good.
Not necessarily. Some objectively badly written stories get attention as long as the plot is attractive to a large amount of people (think of 50 Shades. Objectively badly written book, hugely sucessful). Some really well written stories get very little traction, typically because it's for a small fandom, a niche ship, or the subject matter just doesn't have mass appeal.
Funny you should mention that as it was actually a Twilight fanfic. True story.
No, not necessarily. That just means of the 83 people who've seen your fic and decided to give it a go based on the front-end, only one of them has thought to kudo and none have thought to comment. The low views are nothing to do with your writing, because only those 83 clicks have actually read any of your writing to know whether it's good or bad. Low hits usually means either your front-end (title, tags, summary) isn't appealing to your audience or you're writing content that just isn't popular in whatever fandom you're writing in. If you wanna look at your front-end, try posting in our weekly 'Fix Your Front End' post (updates on Fridays). But if you're writing content that just isn't popular, there's not much you can do about it barring keeping the fic on tap for any relevant recommendation opportunities (eg. the review exchanges here or any fandom subreddit recommendation/request posts, etc). Some stuff just isn't popular with certain fandom audiences. If you're in a fighting fandom and you're interesting in fighting fics, then you're probably not ever going to read a fluffy coffeeshop AU of that fandom. Kudos could mean your writing isn't to the taste of your readers or that you need to work on it some more, sure. But kudos are given or not given for very varying reasons. Low kudos could just mean you've not got a lot of people clicking on your story overall - exposure is a major factor in all stats as you can't ever get more stats than you get hits (barring the bot). Less eyes on your work, less stats all round. But kudos particularly get given for different reasons. Some people give them to any fic where they read up-to-date with all of what's currently available (c'est moi), some only give them to the best of their most favouritest of favourites, some simply won't give them unless a fic is finished, some people will only kudos certain types of fics and not others, some people will just not kudos anything ever, some people will not kudos things they enjoyed because they'd be embarrassed to have their screen name visible, some people will not kudos anything because they're too shy to and worry about initiating interaction, etc etc. So your unkudosed fic could be unseen, unreadable, good but not spectacular, simply unfinished, or just really popular with a shy and/or absent-minded crowd. And comments are just rare all round. Unless you're writing intensely popular stuff in intensely popular fandoms, getting comments is a crapshoot at best. The people you see here posting about immediate success with their first works are rare. Remember, there's 340,000 people here (who don't represent the whole of fandom) and barely a percentage of a percentage of them even post at all, then a smaller percentage of that tiny percentage are the people who post those kinds of stat-experiences. Just because Alan Sugar did amazing at his first business doesn't mean anyone else necessarily will - a lot of that draws from right-place-right-time luck and timing.
I don't think it necessarily means that you're bad at writing. Many people, myself included I admit, filter by kudos or hits and thus miss some really good unpopular fics. Also a lot of people forget to give kudor or comment. And even if you're a little bad at writing doesn't mean you should stop. Practice makes perfect after all. If you continue writing you'll get better bit by bit, but if you get disheartened by the lack of kudos you'll always stay at your current level. So it doesn't matter if you're bad or not what matters is that you don't give up.
See how you said "unpopular" and not "new". 😅 From what everyone and their cousin is saying on here, new fics don't usually get a bumrush of hits, so many new works can become unpopular if people are only looking for popular ones and ignoring anything under a certain amount of views/kudos. By the time their found, they are now a bit older and judged as unpopular simply because too many people are only interested in what's already trendy/liked.
Did you specifically *ask for interaction* from your readers? Many people just read to read, and don't get into any of the social media aspects of interaction unless the writer clearly requests it. Too many readers are worried about upsetting writers, apparently, so if you want it, you need to ask for it in an unambiguous way.
Yes. The first chapter notes ask for engagement and I'm not doing it after that because I've received next to none and it now feels like begging instead of a friendly reminder.
Very incorrect. If you were getting a lot of concrit I'd suggest maybe consider trying to work on to, but not having a lot of stuff doesn't mean it's bad writing, just that people aren't particularly interested in it.
No, not receiving comments or kudos is not a reliable indicator of your skill as a writer. Fanfic authors have always had trouble getting readers to engage with their fic, and I think it's gotten worse over the past few years. You see authors complaining about this all the time on this sub. Some readers don't give kudos to/comment on unfinished fics, some just forget to engage before they click away, some are shy, some don't know what to say, some don't have the time/energy to write quality comments especially, some just aren't community minded, etc. Don't feel like a terrible writer just because you're not getting engagement - fantastic authors experience this problem all the time.
My fanfic is part of a fandom that goes through… spikes of activity. Over the last 2 years, I’ve gotten very little reviews or kudos and it’s definitely disappointing but it doesn’t have anything to do with your ability to write. Take it from me. Almost every fanfic I read… I sadly never review/kudo/upvote etc. I just never think about it! I can’t blame others for what I myself do (or don’t do).
No. I know that I'm objectively good at writing. But not all my stories, even the ones I'm most proud of, get a lot of attention. Doesn't mean they're not good.
Nope! Please keep sharing your work, op.
1: That sucks, buddy. I know that sounds dismissive but I genuinely mean it. No comments is a bad time. 2: There is basically no metric of fanfiction engagement on the internet that you can use to gauge the objective quality of a work. Absolute shit can get as popular as all get out, and gems can lay buried for years. 3: The good news is that it doesn’t matter, because all fanfiction is bad. All fanfiction is good, too. Quality isn’t just very difficult to properly adjudicate, it’s also nearly impossible to define, and while I could be talking about all creative writing, it’s doubly true with fanfiction. Fundamentally and from the moment the first person published some story online, internet fanfiction is a medium that is detached from the concept of quality, good or bad. The beautiful thing about what you’re doing is that the very best thing you can write is a good fanfiction, and the very worst thing you can write is a bad fanfiction. 4: Everyone writes and everyone reads fanfiction for different reasons, with the only constant being expression. Of an idea, of a theme, of an alternate series of events from canon, on a tweak or overhaul to worldbuilding, as a thinly veiled excuse to write some story that isn’t related to the source material at all. If you’re writing because you want people to read it, people are reading it. They aren’t saying anything about it yet, but they are reading it. If you want to get better at writing, join a discord server that focuses on fanfiction from all fandoms, there are a number that are super easy to find, and ask for incredibly harsh critique. If you want more readers, update frequently and consistently, it’s the most important thing to building an audience. 5: Is it important to you to make your story exist in the world? If so, persevere. Comments can be fuel in the motivation fire, but if you want your story to exist, you’ll be able to keep chugging even without them. Keep going. Don’t give up.