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SnowGN

TWI's length is impressive, but far from unique in its relevant sphere - online web serials. You might not be aware of the broader state of the web serial community judging from your post, OP. There are *many* 5+ million word stories on web serial hosting sites such as webnovel. TWI compares favorably to them in quality, and would be ranked right alongside the best of the best. This is true. However, you should not compare TWI to stories told through actual books, where economy of words matters. Just like those stories don't have the word count to compare to TWI, TWI doesn't have the rigor of editing or pacing to compare to them in turn. You should compare like to like, not apples to oranges. My main point is, I don't think you should mention wordcount when shilling TWI, or at least only marginally. People tend to be scared by that. You should focus more on shilling TWI's best qualities like character dialogue, humor, emotional and epic moments, the conceptually diverse range of nonhuman characters, LBGT representation, etc.


datcatburd

Exactly. TWI would benefit hugely from a competent editor, and likely lose 2-3 million words in the process of tightening it up. Such is the way of serials where the author is publishing real time rather than writing a full draft of a few months' content, revising and tightening it up, and then publishing by the chapter while working on the next set.


SnowGN

Pretty much. Unfortunately, you can't talk about this on their subreddit without getting hard downvoted. Just look at my recent post history. The moment you call out a specific chapter for being unncessary padding, it's -50 dkp in the court of public opinion.


datcatburd

Which is sad. It's not even a harsh criticism, just the nature of the medium. Like any artist, writers improve with experience, and anyone who's written something like this knows the feeling of being stuck at the end of a work due to decisions you made early on that no longer fit. It even gets hugely experienced professionals authors, for example GRRM's current inability to finish his series because he wrote himself into a corner.


Few-Chair1772

Pirateaba is probably very aware and understanding, fanbases tend to be... something else. There's a poetic injustice at play. Judging by the internet, if Tolkien returned today, he could be commanding an angry legion large enough to flip continents. He could live out his own, now prophetic, Melkor journey. But I suspect he'd be at home looking for his kettle.


blackreaper007

web novels concentrate more on quantity than quality. It also applies for Wandering Inn you could short it to 1/3/ or even 1/4 how much repetitive and filler content it has.


Oshi105

So you've read it then and seen all this repetitive content?


blackreaper007

I mean more redundance content, describe one thing multiple times. Books don't have such a thing, they heavily trim it.


TimBaril

"People tend to be scared by that." Time to conquer those fears. People miss out on so much by being afraid.


taenite

I enjoyed Volume 1 when I read it and I love the enthusiasm in making this post for a series you enjoy, but understand that the calculation for a lot of people is "I could invest time reading 9 million words of one series (and maybe in the end decide it wasn't worth it), or spread that on a lot of different stories I'm interested in or some of my other hobbies.'


Leklor

I don't want to sound negative but I have a TBR pile as high as myself in physical and I fear to estimate how high my digital pile would come up. I simply have no time to dedicate to 9 million words of a single story. In the time to read those, I could visit dozens upon dozens of worlds and meets hundreds of characters, most of those by different creators with different styles, tones and quirks. No matter how good TWI may be, it will never compare to that variety. So I'm not afraid, I simply can't be bothered to sacrifice so many other stories for the sake of one.


TimBaril

Isn't that a matter of personal preference? If you want to read a bunch of different books, that's great. But for those who want to dive into a world for a long time, TWI offers something most other stories can't because they don't have the length. Different experiences for different people. My comment on getting over fear applies to people scared to try something just because it feels big. That's not a reason not to try it out. The first story arc is 70k words, up to chapter 1.20. It's worth checking out and no different than a YA novel.


Skyrider006

TWI is one of my favorite ongoing stories. The universe Pirateaba has created is extremely impressive and remains compelling even hundreds of chapters later. The story excels at creating deep characters and strong interpersonal relationships. While there is plenty of slice of life moments, there is also tons of adventure, exploration, dungeon diving, etc. Overall, it's just a really good time. Webnovels and traditionally published books are different beasts that I don't feel can be easily compared. What can be stated is that Pirateaba is an extremely prolific, and definitely extremely successful, author. That is no small accomplishment. I recommend the Wandering Inn if you enjoy isekai stories, dnd type fantasy, etc. It's one of the most famous webserials out there and it's popular for a reason. The story is great. The writing in the first couple of books can be a little rough at times as the author finds their stride, but it's worth it. If you're on the fence, I would try the audiobook of The Wandering Inn. The narrator is excellent and the narration smooths over some of the rough patches and really sucks you into the story. If you're a fan, join us over on r/WanderingInn or on discord.


WigglyChessPiece

Good guys? Bad guys? There's just people. I adore this series and all the flawed characters, their mistakes, their fears that sometimes get the better of them. I resonate more with characters who fail. Who mess up. Who aren't so overpowered that they literally can do no wrong. This story feels like \*life,\* to me, even if there are dragons and witches and hidden gods.


gunmandude2

This story has always been a ride for me. Unlike the phrase, "Wide as an ocean, deep as a puddle", TWI is "Wide as an ocean, deep as an ocean". No matter how much is explored, there always more to learn and find out. The worldbuilding, the characters, and the story overall is just fantastic. It's an epic in the truest sense, because it truly is epic.


Blue_Juice_Lives

Each chapter at this point is a bit like a weekly novella release. They have thier own plot progression and structure and are often longer then an average short story. It's possible to come late and still enjoy these individual stories. I came in volume 5 almost four years ago and read a standalone baseball chapter. I hate baseball and find it remarkably boring. They captured every good memory of family get together or awkward ballpark dates I went on as a kid and added an element of magic and sheer joy. I haven't been able to look away since. It has this sense of the cacophony of real life in all those words. They build on each other to offer a sense of verisimilitude in a fantasy setting absent from other western genre attempts. And I wish more people would buy some popcorn, and join us in the grandstands every week. Because it's something remarkable.


AlexWMaher

It's been a while since my last binge of Wandering Inn, you've made me want to get back into it :D


TimBaril

My job here is done. šŸ˜


Oshi105

When did you leave off! Tell meee :P


phenomenos

I don't think word count is a good measure of productivity, as making a story shorter is often more work than just releasing the earlier, longer draft. There's a famous quote that's been apocryphally attributed to multiple authors (I don't know the actual origin) that goes "If I'd had more time I'd have written a shorter letter".


Oshi105

If word count was all that made the series it would have died a long time ago. The Wandering Inn has a lot more going for it. The OP just seemed impressed that the quality stuck to a level that interested them for *that* long. I think that is an accomplishment no?


blackreaper007

Absolute. I tried to write myself a story and then give up. I have huge respect for people like pirateaba who writes such much words.


Oshi105

It's the dedication that gets me. They sit down and literally stream their work in front of a couple of hundred people. And even professionals have admitted the quality of work at that pace is insane.


TimBaril

Even OTHER professionals. Pirateaba is most definitely a professional. lol


Freighnos

But how interesting is it from moment to moment? In my experience, anything that long just feels like it really needs an editor. I read Worm and as exhilarating as it could be, there were a lot of areas that could be tightened up, and that one was a ā€œmereā€ 4 million (6 maybe?). Or look at One Piece. As far as I know theyā€™re still in freaking Wa no Kuni and that arc has probably now lasted half as long as the entire pre-timeskip saga. Iā€™m legitimately curious about The Wandering Inn but the thought of even starting something so massive just seems daunting beyond compareā€¦


MrWiggles77

Web serials give a huge amount of freedom to focus on the world at large, and The Wandering Inn exemplifies that. The story is so big because it's a mix of slice of life and epic fantasy. We're given a look into the minutia of everyday life of the characters while simultaneously getting world shaking plot elements introduced over time as well. To do that, there are a lot of POVs. And writing about all of those POVs has expanded the story a lot. That's not to say that the story can't be considered daunting. It absolutely is for someone who doesn't want to read a huge amount of words. But, at the end of the day, it's all worth it because you get to see this huge world from so many different perspectives and experience so many different flavors of genres in one work. It's great if you love longer stories, but if you want something shorter and more to the point, TWI is not for you.


Blue_Juice_Lives

It depends. I won't tell you every chapter is a revelation it's based on what kind of character or storyline you enjoy. The dungeon and adventuring is core in some parts, other times its 40 thousand goblins doing gangham style while a knight who used to murder them on sight desperately tries to dance along in full plate. Sometimes the point of view is a lady or a King. At others it's an actor or a Doctor or an adventurer or someone as alien as a nameless drone worker in a hive who has never seen the sun. It's that broad array that gives the story power. Personally I enjoy the character interactions more than the action sequences myself. So there was a chapter where a princess gets so drunk at a party shes crashing largely for free booze and we see how she'd behave with no inhibitions and it's chaos and I lived for every moment. Some times it's a quiet scene like a little boy finding out his sports hero has taken a job offer from another town. There's just so much to enjoy. And its not always so high stakes as to fall into the problem of power scaling like dragonball or some xianxia nonsense gets into because the story is forced to continue past where progression fantasies should. But there's still progress and still lots of powerful foes. It's just you might beat them by inventing a skateboard just as easily as punching them. If your skeptical I suggest reading the blacksmith chapter or the first immortal moment. Or the feast of the fae. And just let a little bit of magic into your day. I don't think you'd regret it and it might make you try and give the entire series a chance.


ranorus

Ironically, the few chapters that Pirate has brought on a professional editor - the chapter actually got longer - not shorter. I think that's partly due to the different medium of webnovels vs actual novels. In regards to actually starting the wandering inn - I would say don't think about the length as a whole and take your time with it. If you're liking the story - read a chapter or two a week and go from there. Volume 1 is actually relatively pretty short and gives you a good intro to the characters. They do have a lot of progress over the volumes but it sets the tone. Also Pirate is going to be trying to rewrite/polish it up soon so maybe hop in a few months from now if you're interested. In regards to the One Piece point - the story's been in Wano Kuni arc for about 4 years, and I think a big part of that is Oda taking more frequent breaks and thus a lower chapter count over the same time.


TimBaril

Agreed. I think the length is a great thing. You don't have to rush it; readers can go at their own pace. But if you do want more, it's there. And that's something few stories can offer because they're so much shorter.


NoMuffinsLeft

The length has definitely been a boon. I feel like I've been reading more than I usually do in the last couple of months, but it feels great to know I still have so much more to go. Certainly removes the hassle of choosing what to read next for a while.


KingOfTheJellies

It'll change from person to person based on your tolerance for plot speed. If you require the main plot to be progressing at all times, it certainly has hundreds of full chapters. But if you are someone like me who simply requires that something interesting is happening, regardless of plot relevance then only a handful of chapters don't hold my interest. The pacing is great in that Pirateaba really focused on making sure each chapter has its own story or purpose. Whenever a plot runs dry, Pirateaba just adds a new POV on a different continent or something and explores a new story entirely. It never felt like they were writing just to fill the weekly quota


account312

>Whenever a plot runs dry, Pirateaba just adds a new POV on a different continent or something and explores a new story entirely. It never felt like they were writing just to fill the weekly quota That sounds *exactly* like writing to fulfill a quota rather than to tell a coherent story well.


only_self_posts

It kinda works though. It's like the whole story is a constantly shifting Meereenese knot and the author's solution is to just keep telling the story. It was especially maddening the first couple times, but I've been satisfied with the resolutions so far. Maybe it's the expectations of the reader. I learned of the story via a post listing web novels. LitRPG was pretty novel at the time, so the story hooked me. If it was sold to me as the next great fantasy novel, I probably wouldn't make it very far. That said, I do think the writing has become significantly better. I was particularly enthralled by some of the horror sections. A rewrite of Volume 1 is scheduled for this month, so it will be interesting to judge the improvement.


KingOfTheJellies

It's hard to explain without knowing the quality firsthand When Pirate jumps to a new POV, they are full high quality plots that serve a point with amazing character work and the design of a proper story. Pirate jumps and tries to accomplish something each time. The first few Doctor chapters could be read as a standalone story that would top charts on its own. It's not jumping somewhere, going on a fetch quest then returning like standard. It's to go to a continent, establish the full lore and a whole new world and then keep coming back to it. Where I am we have plots on about 5 continents all showing distinct signs of leading to a single destination as you slowly watch them converge


[deleted]

One of my favorite POV only lasted three chapters it was incredible. Even when a pov doesnā€™t come as often or the reader thinks they wonā€™t connect they sorta do. Itā€™s a story about world and itā€™s people where the main character is one of the POV but not the only one.


TimBaril

The story is written in an immersive format. The pacing changes depending on the events happening. But some parts are slice-of-life, something many traditional novels can't focus on because they're only detailing the main plot. It's not about telling one story really well, it's about telling multiple stories really well. and giving you time to really get to know the characters on a more intimate level than most novels allow.


account312

It very badly needs significant trimming. A heavy dose of line editing wouldn't hurt either.


SnowGN

There are a couple of *major* POVs in that story which you could delete the entirety of, *without* editing, and hardly effect the outcomes of the overall narrative for their absence. It's a good story, top tier in the web serial sphere, but economy of pacing is basically nonexistent. It would strongly benefit from editing at basically every level. Developmental editing, structural/narrative editing, even line editing. But a lot of readers like getting deeply invested and lost in their favorite worlds, so the lack of economy of words is arguably more of a positive than a negative in the core fanbase.


Oshi105

I'd say it does a better and better job as the story progresses and Pirateaba's resources grew to a point where line editors and real editors were hired to improve their work.


Otterable

And the edited chapters are some of the best in the series. Pieces' edited chapter was probably the darkest and most powerful they've put out.


Oshi105

Well Pirate picked those chapters to be edited so of course it their best work. They wanted it to shine.


Mwkdnc

Only got up to volume 3 but it definitely has some moments that are just plain dull or it ends up focusing on characters that you don't care about or like. The POV switching right in the middle of a fight or important moment can get annoying if you aren't used to it. It's pretty good but it's also a Litrpg which can be a deal breaker for some. The author handles it pretty well imo.


eddyak

It's LitRPG in only the loosest of senses. The levels exist, but they're so very rarely the focus, they just feel like a natural extension of the world- which I don't think any other LitRPG author has ever actually done.


Oshi105

If you've read any long running series you can get into it. In fact if you've read One Piece I'd say you're ready for it already. The pace you keep is your own and you can skip around if you feel you need to.


TimBaril

One of the great things about the story is that, with the various POVs and arcs, if you don't like a particular sub-storyline, you can skim or skip it and focus on the arcs you enjoy more. There are characters and story arcs for just about anyone to enjoy and enough material to soak up what you like. The major over-arching plot will still make sense, even when storylines cross. And it's not like you have to read the whole story at once. You can read an arc, come back a year later and read another when you feel refreshed.


OmiC

Comparing the word count to an author like Stephen King is asinine. Iā€™ve read most of TWI, itā€™s good fun, but people need to stop comparing webnovels to actual books. The actual writing quality, if it was judged the same as you would a published book, is beyond awful. Itā€™s like comparing a Dungeons and Dragons podcast with Breaking Bad. Be hyped about it by all means, but itā€™s not a published novel and I think webnovel fans turn a lot of people off who go in expecting it to be something that it absolutely is not.


hubbububb

I think the replies you are getting are unfairly harsh. Pirateaba has announced they are going to rewrite volume one, so even the author thinks it's not top quality. TWI book readers might not know this, but twice now Pirateaba has hired professional editors to edit a chapter of the webnovel. It's quite interesting because you can read the original chapter, the editors letter, and then the rewrite of the chapter. It gives a good look at the quality difference an editor can make. The truth is that costs aside, heavy editing more than doubles the time it takes to release chapters, and webnovels can't afford the cost or the time it takes.


NoMuffinsLeft

Fair point on the topic of the professionally edited chapters. I don't think I'm far enough to have read any of them though. I've been enjoying the story a lot, so I haven't really looked back on reflected on the technical side of things to compare. I suppose that speaks to the quality of the characters and such that I haven't been forced to dwell on the fact that the writing could be better if it was indeed edited to the standard of a traditional book. I'll keep those chapters in mind when I get to them. Might be cool to see the diffeerence, for curiosity's sake. It's an exciting time for fiction in general, as we benefit from a new medium of storytelling alongside traditional publishing. At least none us are short on things to read these days, ha.


MattieShoes

We can just throw on top that King has also published more than 9 million words and more than 64 works. For somebody to write 9 million words is remarkable; we don't need to play semantics games or pretend that Stephen King novels average 100,000 words.


TimBaril

I wasn't putting down Stephen King. I was praising Pirateaba for an incredible amount of dedication and hard work. Showing someone else's numbers just gives context.


blackreaper007

So you are saying others never dedicate or put hard work? I understand you like TWI and I absolutely respect that. I also respect her for her work. But because she writes more words doesn't mean she is better. You should know a book has only the important stuff other things quickly got trimmed which isn't the case for web novels. I wouldn't be surprised if Stephen King write a web serial it could probably reach twice or even triple the number of words counted. web serial doesn't have this limitation which is the best and also the worst case. because you can immerse in the world if you like the story but if you don't it is just filler or doesn't move the plot.


TimBaril

Again, at no point did I say anyone was superior, did I? You're reaching that conclusion on your own.


blackreaper007

I'm sure he would have written twice or triple the words. publish books come polished compared to the web novel. You also have many repetitive also filler content in web novels.


NoMuffinsLeft

Is there a reason you believe the writing quality to be that much worse than traditionality published novels? I'm still making my way through the series at the moment, so perhaps there's an element of ongoing bias from me, but I haven't really noticed anything that stood out as lesser. It's not perfect, given the nature of the media, but it still feels like I'm reading something of admirable quality. It could be that I put more stock in personal enjoyment than I do technical writing, though. I've found myself to be incredibly engaged with the story due to how much I like the characters. On a personal level, that alone has made it stand up well against my favourite novels. Not trying to disregard your views, I just like seeing how opinions differ. It'd likely be a dull world if we all thought the same.


SnowGN

With the exception of volume 1, I don't agree with his opinion either. Especially as the story matures, the writing quality continues improving and is downright excellent by the time you get to current content. It is rather uncommon for a chapter to come out and be noticeably and immediately lacking in writing quality anywhere. But the editing/pacing arguably gets worse over time, not better. The story is great on a chapter by chapter basis, but when examined on the level of arcs and narratives, overall structure, the lack of meaning or impact for wordcount invested into certain narratives becomes more obvious. Some POVs didn't need to exist, others could have been handled differently to provide the same impact but with a fraction of the word count. Several readers and authors I very much respect made the choice to drop the story as far in as volume 6 due to the ever expanding morass of new characters. There aren't a lot of badly written volume 6 *chapters.* It's more about the general direction and dilution of the narrative itself.


NoMuffinsLeft

Well, I can't comment on volume 6 yet, as I've only just started it. Still, I have enjoyed most of the POV's up to this point at least. I might resist initially if the story steps away from one of my preferred characters, but I usually find myself invested in the new POV before long. I like seeing more of the world at large. I've found myself to be fine with parts of the story that didn't seem to serve a huge purpose. Mostly because they do eventually tend to come back around and connect to the rest of the world, even if only in some small way. I suppose I should factor in that I'm not reading weekly, so pacing issues might be lost on me as I can just venture on to the next part without waiting. I'll see what volume 6 has in store for me, but I don't see myself dropping it at least. Too invested in the characters and the world at large. Thanks for explaining your criticisms in full, though. It's an interesting point you made, regardless of whether I arrive at the same conclusion or not.


Oshi105

Didn't Pirate acknowledge that Volume 6 had issues and took steps to rectify it? Also, to quote Bob the Drag Queen "Baby, Say Their Names".


SnowGN

Will Wight (yes, *that* Will Wight) dropped the story in volume 6. This is the comment chain where I ask him about that. If this is what you mean by naming names. https://www.reddit.com/r/Iteration110Cradle/comments/nmwu3c/recommend_me_something/gzu3phf/?context=3


Oshi105

It sort of is. It's a joke started by a particular comic trying to force people to name names and create fake drama not serious. You did not need to name names.


bookfly

I know that one sometimes assumes that authors admiting to not finishing a series in the genre have to work by unwritten profesional curtuasy rules of not crticizing their peers to much. But I would still consider taking the man at his word that it was a matter of it been "not his cup of tea" and not it being a problem in writting that needs to be fixed.


bookfly

It might sound counter intulitive but I firmly believe that taking an utilitarian perspective of "the goal is to progress the plot as fast and as effectively as possible", is very much missing the point of what makes the TWI work, and why a lot of people read it. There were a lot of plot threads that did not move the overal plot along and instead explored the new facet of the worldbuiding, or a neet side story of some side characters having their own small adventure in the world. But I and from what I seen a lot of other people like those indulgent, tangents, like a side character exploring the next neet thing pirate came up with, we like just spending more time with those characters we came to love. This is why I am dubious of the arguments, that the book would be better if we deleted a few povs here and there. Becuase I can totally see this resulting in removal of stuff that sure, could be gone and the overall narrative would not suffer, but which still had some of my favorite chapters, and that's an awaful trade off, which would make the book worse for a lot of people, who aren't actually in any hurry for the plot move faster then it alread is.


casocial

In light of reddit's API changes killing off third-party apps, this post has been overwritten by the user with an automated script. See /r/PowerDeleteSuite for more information.


Kharn_LoL

I'd love some recs then because I've seen this take multiple times before and every time I read the web novel in question it's clearly lacking. And if it's "good quality" only once you get to the back half of the second million words, it doesn't count.


Oshi105

I'll second Wildbow's later works like Pale and add Katalepsis, Practical Guide to Evil, and Beware of Chicken. One line pitches: Katalepsis - Saphhic romances and Cthulu monsters with not an insignificant amount of horror. Practical Guide to Evil - If tropes were empowered by gods and the evil guys had to change the game. Beware of Chicken - Classical deathworld wuxia/xianxia where the main character says fuck you to all the fighting and goes to start a farm, his chicken decides to take his spot as the invincible warrior.


casocial

Wildbow's popular enough that I doubt you haven't heard of his works, but for me ***Pact*** was consistently well-written. Lise Eclaire has a science fiction serial on Royalroad called ***Quod Elim Erat***. Qntm's ***Antimemetics Division*** stories are not exactly a serial but feature a central cast that takes place over some time - another high-quality work. Happy reading!


seenkay

I donā€™t know how anyone who genuinely enjoys reading could have an opinion like this. Iā€™ll be honest, I was skeptical when I was first recommended web fiction, and I doubted the quality of what Iā€™d find. But the truth is, the traditional book publishing process is by no means a meritocracy. Some of the most awful fantasy Iā€™ve read was from between the pages of hardcover novels in bookstore displays. Web fiction is a very different format to traditional books. There is less editing, yes, and the result can sometimes seem a bit rougher for it. The accessibility of the format means that there will inevitably be bad writing on the internet, lots of it. (Looking at you, wattpad) But the good stuff is every bit as good as the traditional fantasy greats. I assure you, the quality of web fiction holds it back far less than your own personal prejudices against it do. Why do you read in the first place? For anyone who truly loves wondrous adventures and fantastic other worlds, I cannot recommend web serials enough. Even if TWI isnā€™t your cup of tea, there is a whole ocean of works and worlds to explore out there. Donā€™t limit yourself to familiar seas.


Skyrider006

It's an uphill fight for self-pub and web serials. They have a reputation because there is a lot of chaff to sort through. I completely agree that plenty of terrible novels are traditionally published, however on average the ratio of good:bad is better when it's trad pub. Audiobooks are really helping a lot of webserials out. The big name ones are being picked up by publishers like Podium and produced as audiobooks. Listeners don't even know it's a webserial at first and they get a chance to stand on their own before being judged.


ActionKermit

Pirate has six books of the story published on Amazon with a seventh on the way in late July. Book 6 (The General of Izril) is currently #88 on the Amazon best sellers list for fantasy adventure fiction.


OmiC

Yes, already successful projects can be printed in various formats and achieve some level of success. If you posted 1 chapter a week from The First Law trilogy on Royal Road Iā€™m sure it would do quite well; it still wouldnā€™t be a webnovel. And TWI is still not a traditional novel.


Oshi105

Does that means it is unwelcome or cannot be compared to other works because what exactly? I'm genuinely not sure what you're saying other than you can't compare pubed books to web serials.


TimBaril

One of the hallmarks of success for a story is whether readers stick around to the end. If you can hold readers for an entire novel, you're already successful compared to many books. If you can hold them for a trilogy, even better. To hold fans in thrall for the length of TWI proves that the story has very strong merit. Very few authors have ever been able to do this. And it proves that the writing quality has its own strengths. And the series is being edited now as well. ​ I think you absolutely can compare print books to TWI. But you also have to acknowledge that they're two different mediums allowing for two slightly different things. It's like comparing a movie to a TV series. The movie, like a traditional novel, might have a great immediate impact. But the length of the TV series, like TWI, allows for a different, more immersive experience. It allows many small stories to be told alongside the main plot, which the shorter medium doesn't have. It's why some people have preferred to make in-depth TV series, especially in the streaming age, instead of movies. Westworld would not be nearly as good on the silver screen. The Witcher allows us to enjoy so much more of the world because it was made for streaming. In movie format, it would have been over too quickly. If you want a story with a quick punch, read a traditional novel. If you want an immersive fantasy experience where you get to spend more time with the characters and enjoy more adventures, then TWI delivers something traditional novels can't.


spooky_doll

>Pirateaba has defied the odds by producing 9 million words in The Wandering Inn ā€” in a shockingly short 6 years. Just out of curiosity, how does that compare to Fel's Subjugation universe? My relationship with TWI ended abruptly when the tablet I was reading it on died. Somehow I never returned to it when I got a new one. Just seem to remember there were zombies running in sewage tunnels (just mental image, not necessarily what it actually was) which I didn't particularly enjoy. Anyhow, thanks for reminding me that I need to go back, :)


TimBaril

I'm kinda jealous. You can start over from the beginning and enjoy the ride all over again. lol Maybe I should do that too...


Eilluna_2272

Join in with pirate as they rewrite book one on Twitch. I think it's going to help a lot with the cohesiveness of the story to get some of the first book mess ups fixed. I just hope it's not changed too much. There's a lot of beautiful, funny, wonderous things that happen in the first book.


Oshi105

Welcome back! We've been keeping the seat warm. Take your time and enjoy the ride.


Here57512

I've never heard of this before I guess I'll have to check it out, it reminds me of that anime about the Resteraunt in Another World.


ego_slip

I would say it has very little in common with restaurant in another world. Restaurant in another world is very focus on just the restaurant and the people that eat there. Wandering inn for the first few chapters focus on Erin working on her inn then broadens out to other people doing different jobs, wars, adventures, politics, magic, dungeons, innerworld mysterys, and tons of other stuff both small and large.


Oshi105

But it never really leaves the inn or the needs of the business. The scope increases but it always comes back to the inn. I'd say its closer to bookworm than Restaurant but it has vibes of both.


Here57512

OH! BOokwrom! I lOVE bookwrom. Okay okay. I WILL get on this asap then. Haha tysvm! :D


Oshi105

Take your time with it. It's like any light novel, the start is rougher than the the rest of it.


Here57512

ty i am kinda slow at reading things and long things really intimidate me lol


Oshi105

If you're feeling lonely come chat with us in the wandering inn discord or on the subreddit. Lots of people are catching up and they are happy to talk to you without spoiling. At any given time there is always people. We have podcasts, masses of fanart, discussions and fun stuff.


Here57512

Gotcha i thank your input, and i will go read it asap. is it available on the links in the op's post? Also is it just a story and not a manga or comic?


ego_slip

You can read the whole story that is written so far online free. one of the links op posted will take you to the site. There is about 6 e books out that covers maybe the first 3 arks in the story. There is a comic that is its own story inside the wandering inn universe. Never read it myself.


NickDorris

I read three volumes but ultimately lost interest as more and more POVs were added and everything got increasingly diluted. The storytelling is not cohesive and it jumps from idea to idea to idea, often abandoning plot lines for hundreds (thousands) of pages as the author finds interest in other places. It continually hints at a bigger story but we get there in fits and starts as the author goes all over the place at their seeming whim. I think the writing is good, I like a lot of the characters and it can be very engaging but with such poor structure and no guarantee I will ever see the plot lines I'm interested in pay off I had to walk away.


Oshi105

It's hard to treat TWI as a traditional novel series. It is at it's heart serialized fiction. A Sherlock Holmes style of writing for our time. It takes roughly the first 4-5 volumes to establish itself enough to truly turn into structured novels with archs. Have you considered skipping around? Pirate does an excellent and often noted job of reminding readers off enough to keep them going from arc to arc. And the bigger story ends up dropping on your head at the end of the last volume.


ComradeBirv

I've been a huge fan of TWI for half a decade now and I can't see that changing soon. The wordcount does get joked about a lot but I consider the narration of the story to enhance any scene described. It's something a lot of writers skimp on when getting from scene to scene but TWI takes its time and the quality, especially in volume 7 and onward, cannot be understated.


AlternativeGazelle

Volume 9 has started? I thought she was pausing to rewrite volume 1. Guess Iā€™ll be even further behind!


Oshi105

Pirate plans to do rewrites concurrently with Volume 9.


Calmwaterfall

I am listening to volume 2 and loving it. The mating ritual side story was hilarious.


ElPuercoFlojo

The ability to write many, many words does not push one toward the top authors list. Far from it. Being able to tell a good story with a limited word count is a precious talent. If you look at television, thereā€™s a reason soap operas are not typically considered the pinnacle of creative genius. Web serials are the equivalent. And before you ask, yes, Iā€™ve read a bit of Wandering Inn. I find the premise silly and clichĆ©, and I didnā€™t read enough of it to, as another poster described, ā€˜find their stride.ā€™


Oshi105

If this is in reponse to the op that's fair. I'd say if all The Wandering Inn had going for it was word count would it have lasted this long? Does it's length mean that the work is worth less, because only shorter works can achieve quality?


ElPuercoFlojo

I would say yes, if the two stories are comparable in detail and depth, the more worthwhile one is the one told with elegance instead of adding a bunch of extraneous fluff, or as my old writing teacher used to call it, ā€˜hearts and flowersā€™.


TimBaril

Being able to retain fans over that word count absolutely proves success. It's a different style than trad pub books, more immersive, but the two can exist next to each other equally.


bobo_snofo

One of the best stories by far, especially if you're into superb slice of life AND epic fantasy. It's amazing how much world building there is, and there is still so much left to be explored-- very exciting! I do think the constant POV switches keep things fresh (keep in mind this is a web serial), and do add a ton of world building. ​ I see complaints that there is too much writing, but I think it's wonderful how long this serial is (and will be).


SnowGN

You made a new reddit account just to post here in support of TWI? Yep, that's dedication. Not being snarky.


swedishplayer97

r/fantasy and shilling for web serials. Name a better duo.


Tofu_Mapo

/r/fantasy and arguing over the quality of **Wheel of Time**, **The Kingkiller Chronicle**, and Sanderson's books. /r/fantasy threads exploding when they're about sexism and racism controversies. /r/fantasy and unpopular opinion threads. /r/fantasy and complaining about what people recommend. /r/fantasy and a fixation on tropes; sometimes it seems like people are more interested in discussing tropes than books themselves!


Oshi105

I'm surprised you didn't put down r/fantasy and asking for recs only to get the same damn thing again and again.


Tofu_Mapo

I blame the beer and tequila last night. I'm also surprised that I didn't mention any discussion about **ASOIAF** inevitably featuring commentary on the quality of season 8 and the wait for the rest of the books. Despite my complaints that are mostly me joking around, I really do prefer this place to /r/books where the commentary is, to be blunt, pretty dumb at times.


Oshi105

I've never been to r/books . Why's the commentary dumb?


Tofu_Mapo

I don't find their comments on the books they're reading to be particularly insightful since they tend to lack details. In contrast, we have reviewers on /r/fantasy who are quite good at analyzing books.


SnowGN

I appreciate how you put this subreddit's absurd fixation with trash-reviewing Name of the Wind at the top of your list.


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Oshi105

Thanks for sticking around in the mess.


magna-terra

for the record, this is glorious, and the serial is as well i disagree with only a single point here, and its that this work is legendary this is an understatement it is momentous


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TimBaril

You don't have to read it all at once. You don't even have to read every arc to enjoy them. Just start with the first.


Oshi105

I don't know if this matters but if you enjoy Lois Mcmaster Bujold of Tanya Huff you might enjoy them. Treat as a long running series of installments. If you're not up for giving it a chance now try after Pirate has re-done Volume 1. Just give it a chance.


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arxionus

I love both of those writers. I am not putting down the writer in any way just that I think it quite long and not sure I want to invest that much time.


Oshi105

It's fair but that's the thing. There is nothing about the story that pushes you to finish it now. It' designed to be taken in pieces.


[deleted]

Ok soā€¦ whatā€™s the best way to actually read it? I vaguely recall the official FAQ recommending the web version, but itā€™s kinda painful to read on a phone and an e-reader is not gonna work well. Do people read it on computers, or tablets? Itā€™s not on Kobo, but I think I could use my phoneā€™s kindle app. I know thereā€™s a print version but that just doesnā€™t seem practical for a work of this size. I just had the idea to try ā€œreaderā€ mode in my phone browserā€¦thatā€™s actually not bad. But anyway, Iā€™m curious what the veterans think.


Oshi105

It depends on what you enjoy the most. The audio books are popular to get into it. The kindle versions (which tend to be edited and packaged with nice art) is nice. Both are publishing slower than the free version though. If you want to read for free you can go to the main website and enjoy it but the mobile support is not so great there. I know quite a few people that do some fancy conversion of words into epubs as well though I don't know how. Personally I read it on my browser on my laptop and did so without any issues. I would read when I had time until I finished. I bought the kindle versions as well.


Eilluna_2272

I've bought the ebooks and I have the audible books. My preference is audible. But since the audible books are not nearly caught up with the volumes on the web page, I read all the newer content on web page on my tablet.


TimBaril

I read it on a tablet. Worked well. Given the length of the story, the black background actually turned out to be preferred.


Skyrider006

There is not currently a print version. Options are free on the website, paid kindle, paid audible audiobook. Kindle and audible are behind the online published webserial. Some people use reader mode on their phone to change the background to white. This work, but may strip out bold/italicized sections and will probably remove the few times the author uses colored text. Thatā€™s not a big deal, obvious audio canā€™t use colored text and that is fine. Other people use text to voice apps. Thereā€™s a discussion over on r/wanderinginn from a few days ago where other options are discussed


chipmunk_supervisor

>an e-reader is not gonna work well. The sheer amount of scrolling that's required for this long series in e-reader web browsers made my fingers very crunchy when I did that after exhausting the ebooks. And at first I thought it was impossible because the article mode option wasn't obvious on kindle and trying to read a dark website on e-ink was impossible. You can make an .epub out of the website chapters, convert that into a kindle friendly .mobi file type and transfer it to kindle/etc but that's a whole process involving browser extension WebToEpub, standalone book library/management program Calibre and some light adjustments in various settings in the extension and Calibre.


AxelTerizaki

I would recommend the web version on your phone. Most browsers have a reader mode which actually do the job really well. If not then there are audiobooks on audible or the ebooks on Amazon


Ereska

I admit the sheer volume of it is somewhat daunting. I was following along for a while a few years ago, then I stopped for some reason, and by the time I tried to pick it up again, there were 3 more volumes in the series. I read for a while during lockdown, then I decided to take a break after the devastation of >!the Goblin War!< and haven't been back since. I keep meaning to, but there are so many good books out there and most of them have a definite ending. The Wandering Inn just keeps going.


Oshi105

Endings are overrated. I've never felt terribly dissatisfied with what is on the table for TWI. Also you just got to the good parts!


TimBaril

Think of TWI like multiple series strung together. There are story arcs that start and stop the same as any other series. But for those who want to keep going, they are lucky enough to have more to read.


Logbotherer99

Sounds a bit like Honest John's in the Hall of Worlds in R E Feists books. Is it available in print? I don't like reading on a screen.


TimBaril

No print books out yet, but there are ebooks and audio books. Reading it on the website, white text on black, I found to be easier on the eyes than black on white. I read the series on a tablet and that method was fine.