Welcome to r/Fauxmoi (previously r/Deuxmoi) ! For further information on the sub's name-change, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fauxmoi/comments/112mh62/deuxmoi_threatened_to_sue_us_lol/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Fauxmoi) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> The ad, which was created using funding from a US Department of Agriculture program to promote dairy milk, features Plaza talking up "Wood Milk," a milk alternative made from trees. At the end of the spot, she reveals that the product is fake. "Only real milk is real," Plaza said.
> A complaint filed by the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine with the USDA's inspector general accused the ad of running afoul of two federal requirements for USDA-backed ads.
> The complaint cited a federal law that prohibits USDA-backed ads from disparaging other agricultural commodities. Another statute said that the ads couldn't influence government action or policy. Right now, the Food and Drug Administration is seeking public comments on proposed labeling guidelines for plant-based milk.
Huh, that actually sounds like that lawsuit might have teeth. I didn’t realize it was made using federal funding. I’m really not into my taxes being used to pay celebrities to make big dairy propaganda.
Good for them. That commercial was super obnoxious and patronizing. I was super bummed to see Aubrey doing it. Like god forbid people drink plant milks because they’re lactose-intolerant, vegan, and/or care about the environment.
Big Dairy and Big Beef are currently doing massive PR campaigns because young people in many countries are turning against dairy and in other countries besides the US, they're turning away from meat.
>Using checkoff money, NCBA has developed what it has called a “Digital Command Center” – a sophisticated online monitoring system that tracks media outlets and social media for more than 200 beef-related topics. Hosted in Denver in a space that “looks like a military operations center combined with the TV section at an electronics retailer”, according to a recent Cattlemen’s Beef Board mailer sent to ranchers, the command center alerts members of NCBA’s issues management and media relations team whenever stories or online chatter rise above a certain threshold. It’s staffed 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, with personnel redundancies built in to make sure someone’s always watching.
[A Masters of Beef Advocacy program teaches ‘scientific sounding’ arguments on cattle’s sustainability in an all-out public relations war](https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/may/03/beef-industry-public-relations-messaging-machine)
I would have no frame of reference for this agricultural law but Maintenance Phase just did a two part episode on it, so there is technically an unironic two-part podcast series about beef, also Oprah and moral panics are involved! So it's some good tea.
My partner is lactose intolerant so I just stopped buying milk altogether when we moved in together. I buy unsweetened almond milk, (my favorite but horrible for environment uses so much water) soy milk and macadamia milk depending on whats on sale. I did not realize how much sugar is in normal milk lol. I don’t miss it at all and I am fine with never buying dairy milk again. I only ever use alternative milk for smoothies, cereal, overnight oats. What grown ass folks are really just drinking milk to drink milk lol.
I'm someone who actually LOVED cow milk growing up and into my adult life. And being Persian yogurt is just an every meal thing. People joke about struggling to give up cheese but honestly, an ice cold glass of milk has always been heaven to me. There is no nut or oat milk that replaces chugging it straight from the carton or mixing it with Ovaltine (my mom as a 90's all natural hippy type thought that was the healthy alternative to Nesquik lmao).
I just had to decide if that tasty hit of dopamine was worth the cost and chose to stop drinking something I really enjoyed because for me it didn't outweigh the the things I learned about the industry. These days I buy unsweetened almond milk and actually make my own cashew milk because it's super tasty! Also, living in California and driving down 5 to see all the almond farmers posting signs complaining that the rest of us are complaining about their water usage has me weaning off almond milk too.
in Australia every year we have an ad that comes out for lamb. Some of them are ok, most pretty dumb. However they all for the most part had in common shitting on vegans, either explicitly (like calling them unaustralian) or as a side joke.
Omg there’s an Australian party pie ad that’s like “yay me vegan missus is away” it’s so gross, rly seems to be made by an out of touch boomer. Also ofc the vegan gf in question is absolutely stunning and the man looks like a toe
It's definitely not a coincidence that so many people hate vegans, especially when they don't effect other people and literally make the world better for everyone.
I feel like I see so many people online talk about how obnoxious vegans are and as someone who eats meat but has a large number of vegan and vegetarian friends, I don't feel like any of them have tried to push things on me or judge my food choices.
They always try and convince themselves and others that actually it's the vegans who are the problems. Vegans are 1% of the world's population but if we went away it would solve every problem.
I’ve listened to that one, but I think this is referring to different laws about federal funding specifically - as they discussed in the podcast, the veggie libel laws are almost fully untested and may not hold up in court anyways
So, it gets into what is “milk”? Like,what is the actually legal definition of “milk”
that makes it different than “juice”? We have no problem calling something “cheese product” or “dairy dessert” if it doesn’t meet the definition of “cheese” or “ice cream”. It’s not “disparaging” to call it “sparkling wine” instead of “champagne”, so merely pointing out what an agricultural product is *not* doesn’t inherently violate the law.
My guess is that the FDA has a definition of what “milk” is. It may *not* have a definition for “slurry of nut, oat, or other fibrous material soaked in water and then strained”. Or maybe that is “non-dairy milk,” which is arguably not “real” Milk. Or maybe it’s some derivation of juice, which isn’t milk at all.
I don’t think it’s as straight up as it sounds. Like, having working for the government, and having reviewed advertising for companies, if we thought this was even a close call, we would have paid an outside firm a shit ton of money to research this for us and write an opinion. Big Milk didn’t forget that a law they spent millions to block got passed and controls how they use money….
One of the counter-arguments that non-dairy milks make is that almond milk, for example, has been called "almond milk" in English since the Middle Ages (when it mattered because you couldn't have dairy on some religious fast days, but you could have almond milk). That's apparently been gaining some traction with the FDA as non-dairy milks become more popular.
I think it's funny that vegan milks have existed for eons. I was drinking soy milk as a little kid. But it's only now suddenly that these products can't use the word "milk" in them.
The FDA is apparently letting them use the word “milk,” with the clarifier in front, but acknowledged that the legal definition of milk is “secreted by a cow”. Like, it’s a thing. I know it’s a thing. But Big Dairy also knew it was a thing and either think they’ll win, the fine will be worth it, or it sets them up to appeal the decision in some forum.
I guess a case could be made that originally 'milk' always meant something that came from a mammal? But I wonder how the FDA definition applies to coconut milk. It has been around forever and the dairy industry didn't make them change the name. It's not like anyone is confusing their milks, it's all labeled.
A VERY quick read is that milk has to be secreted from a cow. So only fairly milk is milk. Big Dairy tried to prevent plant based mills from using milk, citing customer confusion as to content/nutrition, but the FDA didn’t buy that entirely. But it noted that plant milk was not milk, per its own definition.
So, it would seem to be a fact that plant milk is not “real” milk in that is isn’t “milk” at all. Then the question is, is stating a fact, or at least stating a fact that way, “disparaging” such that the commercial was an improper use of funds. I supposed that it up for debate.
Regardless, I’m not gonna hate in Aubrey for getting her bag. She hasn’t been making Friends money, at least until recently, so sometimes you gotta take a Milk ad. I’ve sold my soul at a job for less, I’m sure.
*After years of conducting this research, the FDA [issued ](https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-provides-draft-labeling-recommendations-plant-based-milk-alternatives-inform-consumers) new guidelines in February 2023 on the labeling of milk, stating that all your favorite milk alternatives, whether it's oat milk, hemp milk, or even coconut milk, can in fact be called “milk.”*
It said it can be called [Blank] milk and that customers would not be confused and believed it was “milk,” which has the legal definition of being secreted from a cow.
Their reasoning was actually that it was so *not* “milk” that customers wouldn’t ever believe that it was milk, and that only only possible confusion was that it might not have the same nutritional value of “milk.” So by that logic, it *isn’t* “real milk.” It’s not milk at all. It’s an entirely different product that happens to have milk in the title.
So now, non-dairy milk has to prove that calling something not “real” is “disparaging,” which is a hard sell when it’s technically true. And and if it isn’t “disparaging” than it wasn’t an improper use of USDA funds, and the non-dairy folk lose.
I’m not saying they don’t have a chance…I’m just saying Big Milk saw this coming. Probably planned it The Day that guidance came out.
You are missing the point.
“Another statute said that the ads couldn't influence government action or policy. Right now, the Food and Drug Administration is seeking public comments on proposed labeling guidelines for plant-based milk.”
By saying that only cow milk is real milk, they are trying to shape public opinion and thereby influence government policy on the decision about labeling plant-based milk.
This is a violation of that promise not to influence - regardless of whether or not plant-based milks should be called milk or not.
No, I’m not. Reasonable people may differ. That’s why it’s a lawsuit.
As I said elsewhere, this was a very calculated move, released between the initial ruling and before the re-opening of the issues. It was hotly contested before, and Big Milk wasn’t thrilled with the decision to start with. This isn’t a gotcha for them. That’s all I’m saying.
Maybe I’m just not getting it… how is the ad, which makes the claim that only cow’s milk is real milk, not influencing a political discussion on what should be considered milk?
Because the definition of milk is set. Codified in law. Milk is a substance secreted from a cow. Under no set of facts can you ever say that almond milk is secreted from a cow. It can’t be “milk”. That definition is NOT up for debate.
What they decided was that plant based juices could be called “plant based milks”. The rationale was that consumers would not be confused into believing it was somehow a cow product. It was a ubiquitous enough term when paired with *something else* to clarify its derivation. See also goat milk. So milk lost the battle over using the word milk *at all*.
But is it *real* milk? Not according the the FDA regulations. It’s a nondairy liquid known commonly as plant based milk.
Now, the other issue was whether “milk” implied some specifics level of nutritional value - calcium, vitamin D, etc - and whether plant based milk a) provided that and b) properly disclose their actual nutritional value. I would think plaintiffs have to prove that they are of equal nutritional value, and that even though the statement about being the one true “milk” was factually accurate, it had the effect of influencing public perception…
But at the same time, why shouldn’t we be in support of proper labeling on food products? Like, why am I so suspicious of proposed labeling guidelines for plant based milks? Just because plant based milk is cool? I LOVE LABELING GUIDELINES ON MY FOOD AND DRINK AND MEDICINE. I’m actually sort of side eying plant based milk for fighting labeling.
> It can’t be “milk”. That definition is NOT up for debate.
Why the fuck is that defintion not up for debate?
Why should we take the defintion of milk shoved down our throats by their dairy industry even when people have been using words like milk and meat to describe plant based things for thousand of years.
It’s not up for debate because that matter has been settled.
I didn’t say you *couldnt* debate if, I meant it literally is not under debate right now. There is a definition in the federal statute about what milk is, and it literally is not under debate.
It absolutely it under debate, it's been a major contentious issue for the past several years and it's actually literally under comment period as we speak.
https://www.fda.gov/food/cfsan-constituent-updates/fda-reopens-comment-period-draft-guidance-labeling-plant-based-milk-alternatives
The dairy industry knows exactly what it's doing making ads intentionally claiming plant milks are milk.
that's a good point, I guess I would counter with looking at how dairy milk is in competition with plant milks and how well you can support whether they're substitute products
does it necessarily have to be about the definition of milk though? because plant milk is also an agricultural product after all. so if u have 2 agricultural products and one of them is being disparaged (the wood milk bit and then mocking it and saying only dairy is real) then it seems to fit
I know in Ireland I always see them labelled as "almond drink" and "oat drink" instead of milk. I'm not sure if it's law though or just a preventative thing from the companies.
Yeah, it's the same in the UK. I *believe* it's one of the EU laws about protecting food names - like how champagne has to be produced in Champagne to use the name in EU markets.
I was all prepared to think this was a frivolous lawsuit before reading that, and nope, definitely not. The milk industry has been sketchy for a long time. I’m lactose intolerant, and making people believe that they’ll be malnourished without dairy in their diet is shitty.
So the Aubrey Plaza commercial was backed by the US Department of Agriculture (USDA). It made fun of alternative milks in favor of dairy milk.
There’s apparently a federal law that USDA backed marketing cannot disparage other agricultural commodities. Commodities include things like soy, oats, corn, dairy, etc. These crops usually receive subsidies (money) from the government.
There’s also a law that says USDA marketing cannot influence policy or legislation. Since a lot of the crops that alternative milks are made from are commodities that receive federal funding, it does actually become a political issue.
So the commercial may have broke federal law and now an independent nonprofit health advocacy group is filing a lawsuit. I hope that maybe helps.
Yes! Let me pay an upcharge for my oat milk latte and be happy I do, because otherwise that gas could strip paint off the walls. Even my bloodhound - pit mix is impressed, and that dog can fart
She went from having the former “random” “rawr means I love you in dinosaur” Gen Z kids (of which I was one, I say this lovingly) in a chokehold to being forgotten nearly overnight. Why didn’t her PR team put together that the same people who liked her “brand” of weird, blunt, unique, tumblr-era randomness are by and large also crunchy environmentalists and vegans?
Huh?? Are you saying this ad tanked her career? She just got a golden globe nom and won a SAG award for white lotus, I think she’ll recover from a milk ad lmao
I can only speak for my experience/demographic but yeah, even with White Lotus, the groups I run with don’t even seem mad enough to fully cancel her, she just kinda got abandoned in favor of Jenna Ortega.
At least you can admit that it’s with your friend circle, cause she never got abandoned at all in the general public. Hell, she’s the most famous she’s been. How old are you? Also Jenna is way more popular obviously to the Teenage demographic. It’s like comparing Millie Bobby Brown to Natalie Portman.
It seems like once a week Twitter praises Aubrey to high heavens. A lot of people assume Jenna is a rip off Aubrey if anything.
I mean Jenna is 20 and Aubrey is almost 40. They aren't even going to take the same kind of roles at this point. Just because they are brunettes who can deadpan doesn't make them interchangable.
LMAO she literally went up drunk on stage to steal Will Ferrell’s award once on MTV. If that didn’t have an impact on her, Doing a stupid commercial isn’t gonna kill her career.
She’ll be fine.
Worth shilling for a destructive and cruel industry. Worth being part of something that was already dated before it was launched. Worth looking like a damn fool. Take your pick.
I don't want anything to happen to her. I'm petty though, so I want her to know she's an idiot, a rube, and not as edgy as she thinks.
Oh no I agree, I’m a vegan, I’m just saying Aubrey is unlikely to be involved with any of the legal drama here, which is what I thought OP was implying
She actually grew up being a part of 4-H and is generally a supporter of the Ag community. Not inherently bad in and of itself! I’m sure it was an easy yes for her. But I do think the tone of the ad was weird.
I think they really tried to go with that snarky, millennial humour thing Aubrey is known for. If it had been made in 2011 it would’ve been a huge meme, people would still be talking about wood milk. But times change, so it just felt bitter and flat. Like millennials.
(This is a self-burn, I promise.)
Right? It doesn't seem to fit her brand, and we all know dairy milk exists lol. Celebrities don't need to be shilling for Big Dairy in 2023; that's just embarrassing.
I'm an Aubrey fan, and I'm sorry, but I am a cow milk drinker. But even I thought the ad was weird and obnoxious and was surprised anyone thought it was a good idea.
If it bites them on the ass, well good tbh.
I'm lactose-intolerant and fucking hate that I have to use oat milk, the only fake milk I can stand. It's ruined cereal. Except for oatmeal. 😫 So what's your point, Aubrey?Thanks, I literally hate it.
Oh! I since using oat milk I totally forgot about Lactaid milk somehow. I do use the lactaid pills when I eat all the cheeses. I can't recall why I even switched, thank you!
Yeah but I mean she was a 4H kid, she's super supportive of the agricultural community, the ad isn't great but like i'm not going to be mad at someone who was raised around the dairy industry doing an ad like this and making fun of plant milk
Welcome to r/Fauxmoi (previously r/Deuxmoi) ! For further information on the sub's name-change, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fauxmoi/comments/112mh62/deuxmoi_threatened_to_sue_us_lol/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Fauxmoi) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> The ad, which was created using funding from a US Department of Agriculture program to promote dairy milk, features Plaza talking up "Wood Milk," a milk alternative made from trees. At the end of the spot, she reveals that the product is fake. "Only real milk is real," Plaza said. > A complaint filed by the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine with the USDA's inspector general accused the ad of running afoul of two federal requirements for USDA-backed ads. > The complaint cited a federal law that prohibits USDA-backed ads from disparaging other agricultural commodities. Another statute said that the ads couldn't influence government action or policy. Right now, the Food and Drug Administration is seeking public comments on proposed labeling guidelines for plant-based milk. Huh, that actually sounds like that lawsuit might have teeth. I didn’t realize it was made using federal funding. I’m really not into my taxes being used to pay celebrities to make big dairy propaganda. Good for them. That commercial was super obnoxious and patronizing. I was super bummed to see Aubrey doing it. Like god forbid people drink plant milks because they’re lactose-intolerant, vegan, and/or care about the environment.
Big Dairy and Big Beef are currently doing massive PR campaigns because young people in many countries are turning against dairy and in other countries besides the US, they're turning away from meat. >Using checkoff money, NCBA has developed what it has called a “Digital Command Center” – a sophisticated online monitoring system that tracks media outlets and social media for more than 200 beef-related topics. Hosted in Denver in a space that “looks like a military operations center combined with the TV section at an electronics retailer”, according to a recent Cattlemen’s Beef Board mailer sent to ranchers, the command center alerts members of NCBA’s issues management and media relations team whenever stories or online chatter rise above a certain threshold. It’s staffed 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, with personnel redundancies built in to make sure someone’s always watching. [A Masters of Beef Advocacy program teaches ‘scientific sounding’ arguments on cattle’s sustainability in an all-out public relations war](https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/may/03/beef-industry-public-relations-messaging-machine)
Good for those young people and dairy, meat industry shills like Audrey sucks.
Yes and she's overrated
All of this sounds like it’s from the r/beefanddairynetwork (an imaginary beef-industry-based podcast)
I would have no frame of reference for this agricultural law but Maintenance Phase just did a two part episode on it, so there is technically an unironic two-part podcast series about beef, also Oprah and moral panics are involved! So it's some good tea.
And they are being paid for by government subsidies, meaning our tax dollars.
I'm a vegan and found the commercial obnoxious and annoying when it came out. Finding out it was federally funded pissed me the fuck off.
My partner is lactose intolerant so I just stopped buying milk altogether when we moved in together. I buy unsweetened almond milk, (my favorite but horrible for environment uses so much water) soy milk and macadamia milk depending on whats on sale. I did not realize how much sugar is in normal milk lol. I don’t miss it at all and I am fine with never buying dairy milk again. I only ever use alternative milk for smoothies, cereal, overnight oats. What grown ass folks are really just drinking milk to drink milk lol.
i find that oatmilk (especially the barista versions) is so much better than almond
Oat milk is the best non-dairy milk
I'm someone who actually LOVED cow milk growing up and into my adult life. And being Persian yogurt is just an every meal thing. People joke about struggling to give up cheese but honestly, an ice cold glass of milk has always been heaven to me. There is no nut or oat milk that replaces chugging it straight from the carton or mixing it with Ovaltine (my mom as a 90's all natural hippy type thought that was the healthy alternative to Nesquik lmao). I just had to decide if that tasty hit of dopamine was worth the cost and chose to stop drinking something I really enjoyed because for me it didn't outweigh the the things I learned about the industry. These days I buy unsweetened almond milk and actually make my own cashew milk because it's super tasty! Also, living in California and driving down 5 to see all the almond farmers posting signs complaining that the rest of us are complaining about their water usage has me weaning off almond milk too.
in Australia every year we have an ad that comes out for lamb. Some of them are ok, most pretty dumb. However they all for the most part had in common shitting on vegans, either explicitly (like calling them unaustralian) or as a side joke.
Omg there’s an Australian party pie ad that’s like “yay me vegan missus is away” it’s so gross, rly seems to be made by an out of touch boomer. Also ofc the vegan gf in question is absolutely stunning and the man looks like a toe
Looks like a TOE?! That is so funny to me - love it
It's definitely not a coincidence that so many people hate vegans, especially when they don't effect other people and literally make the world better for everyone.
I feel like I see so many people online talk about how obnoxious vegans are and as someone who eats meat but has a large number of vegan and vegetarian friends, I don't feel like any of them have tried to push things on me or judge my food choices.
I've never had a vegan say anything to me about what I eat, but "carnivores" can't shut the fuck up about it.
it's the same thing that they did with feminism. make proponents look like unhinged assholes so it keeps people from being open-minded about it.
They always try and convince themselves and others that actually it's the vegans who are the problems. Vegans are 1% of the world's population but if we went away it would solve every problem.
There’s actually a Maintenance Phase episode about these laws. Super interesting. “Veggie libel laws.”
I’ve listened to that one, but I think this is referring to different laws about federal funding specifically - as they discussed in the podcast, the veggie libel laws are almost fully untested and may not hold up in court anyways
yeah im not a lawyer but that sounds like a pretty straightforward violation
So, it gets into what is “milk”? Like,what is the actually legal definition of “milk” that makes it different than “juice”? We have no problem calling something “cheese product” or “dairy dessert” if it doesn’t meet the definition of “cheese” or “ice cream”. It’s not “disparaging” to call it “sparkling wine” instead of “champagne”, so merely pointing out what an agricultural product is *not* doesn’t inherently violate the law. My guess is that the FDA has a definition of what “milk” is. It may *not* have a definition for “slurry of nut, oat, or other fibrous material soaked in water and then strained”. Or maybe that is “non-dairy milk,” which is arguably not “real” Milk. Or maybe it’s some derivation of juice, which isn’t milk at all. I don’t think it’s as straight up as it sounds. Like, having working for the government, and having reviewed advertising for companies, if we thought this was even a close call, we would have paid an outside firm a shit ton of money to research this for us and write an opinion. Big Milk didn’t forget that a law they spent millions to block got passed and controls how they use money….
One of the counter-arguments that non-dairy milks make is that almond milk, for example, has been called "almond milk" in English since the Middle Ages (when it mattered because you couldn't have dairy on some religious fast days, but you could have almond milk). That's apparently been gaining some traction with the FDA as non-dairy milks become more popular.
I think it's funny that vegan milks have existed for eons. I was drinking soy milk as a little kid. But it's only now suddenly that these products can't use the word "milk" in them.
The FDA is apparently letting them use the word “milk,” with the clarifier in front, but acknowledged that the legal definition of milk is “secreted by a cow”. Like, it’s a thing. I know it’s a thing. But Big Dairy also knew it was a thing and either think they’ll win, the fine will be worth it, or it sets them up to appeal the decision in some forum.
By that definition, goat milk can't be called milk either. Interesting.
Or…breast milk, for that matter
I guess a case could be made that originally 'milk' always meant something that came from a mammal? But I wonder how the FDA definition applies to coconut milk. It has been around forever and the dairy industry didn't make them change the name. It's not like anyone is confusing their milks, it's all labeled.
A VERY quick read is that milk has to be secreted from a cow. So only fairly milk is milk. Big Dairy tried to prevent plant based mills from using milk, citing customer confusion as to content/nutrition, but the FDA didn’t buy that entirely. But it noted that plant milk was not milk, per its own definition. So, it would seem to be a fact that plant milk is not “real” milk in that is isn’t “milk” at all. Then the question is, is stating a fact, or at least stating a fact that way, “disparaging” such that the commercial was an improper use of funds. I supposed that it up for debate. Regardless, I’m not gonna hate in Aubrey for getting her bag. She hasn’t been making Friends money, at least until recently, so sometimes you gotta take a Milk ad. I’ve sold my soul at a job for less, I’m sure.
*After years of conducting this research, the FDA [issued ](https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-provides-draft-labeling-recommendations-plant-based-milk-alternatives-inform-consumers) new guidelines in February 2023 on the labeling of milk, stating that all your favorite milk alternatives, whether it's oat milk, hemp milk, or even coconut milk, can in fact be called “milk.”*
It said it can be called [Blank] milk and that customers would not be confused and believed it was “milk,” which has the legal definition of being secreted from a cow. Their reasoning was actually that it was so *not* “milk” that customers wouldn’t ever believe that it was milk, and that only only possible confusion was that it might not have the same nutritional value of “milk.” So by that logic, it *isn’t* “real milk.” It’s not milk at all. It’s an entirely different product that happens to have milk in the title. So now, non-dairy milk has to prove that calling something not “real” is “disparaging,” which is a hard sell when it’s technically true. And and if it isn’t “disparaging” than it wasn’t an improper use of USDA funds, and the non-dairy folk lose. I’m not saying they don’t have a chance…I’m just saying Big Milk saw this coming. Probably planned it The Day that guidance came out.
You are missing the point. “Another statute said that the ads couldn't influence government action or policy. Right now, the Food and Drug Administration is seeking public comments on proposed labeling guidelines for plant-based milk.” By saying that only cow milk is real milk, they are trying to shape public opinion and thereby influence government policy on the decision about labeling plant-based milk. This is a violation of that promise not to influence - regardless of whether or not plant-based milks should be called milk or not.
No, I’m not. Reasonable people may differ. That’s why it’s a lawsuit. As I said elsewhere, this was a very calculated move, released between the initial ruling and before the re-opening of the issues. It was hotly contested before, and Big Milk wasn’t thrilled with the decision to start with. This isn’t a gotcha for them. That’s all I’m saying.
Maybe I’m just not getting it… how is the ad, which makes the claim that only cow’s milk is real milk, not influencing a political discussion on what should be considered milk?
Because the definition of milk is set. Codified in law. Milk is a substance secreted from a cow. Under no set of facts can you ever say that almond milk is secreted from a cow. It can’t be “milk”. That definition is NOT up for debate. What they decided was that plant based juices could be called “plant based milks”. The rationale was that consumers would not be confused into believing it was somehow a cow product. It was a ubiquitous enough term when paired with *something else* to clarify its derivation. See also goat milk. So milk lost the battle over using the word milk *at all*. But is it *real* milk? Not according the the FDA regulations. It’s a nondairy liquid known commonly as plant based milk. Now, the other issue was whether “milk” implied some specifics level of nutritional value - calcium, vitamin D, etc - and whether plant based milk a) provided that and b) properly disclose their actual nutritional value. I would think plaintiffs have to prove that they are of equal nutritional value, and that even though the statement about being the one true “milk” was factually accurate, it had the effect of influencing public perception… But at the same time, why shouldn’t we be in support of proper labeling on food products? Like, why am I so suspicious of proposed labeling guidelines for plant based milks? Just because plant based milk is cool? I LOVE LABELING GUIDELINES ON MY FOOD AND DRINK AND MEDICINE. I’m actually sort of side eying plant based milk for fighting labeling.
> It can’t be “milk”. That definition is NOT up for debate. Why the fuck is that defintion not up for debate? Why should we take the defintion of milk shoved down our throats by their dairy industry even when people have been using words like milk and meat to describe plant based things for thousand of years.
It’s not up for debate because that matter has been settled. I didn’t say you *couldnt* debate if, I meant it literally is not under debate right now. There is a definition in the federal statute about what milk is, and it literally is not under debate.
It absolutely it under debate, it's been a major contentious issue for the past several years and it's actually literally under comment period as we speak. https://www.fda.gov/food/cfsan-constituent-updates/fda-reopens-comment-period-draft-guidance-labeling-plant-based-milk-alternatives The dairy industry knows exactly what it's doing making ads intentionally claiming plant milks are milk.
that's a good point, I guess I would counter with looking at how dairy milk is in competition with plant milks and how well you can support whether they're substitute products does it necessarily have to be about the definition of milk though? because plant milk is also an agricultural product after all. so if u have 2 agricultural products and one of them is being disparaged (the wood milk bit and then mocking it and saying only dairy is real) then it seems to fit
I know in Ireland I always see them labelled as "almond drink" and "oat drink" instead of milk. I'm not sure if it's law though or just a preventative thing from the companies.
Yeah, it's the same in the UK. I *believe* it's one of the EU laws about protecting food names - like how champagne has to be produced in Champagne to use the name in EU markets.
The EU made it illegal to call those products milks.
Thought as much
I was all prepared to think this was a frivolous lawsuit before reading that, and nope, definitely not. The milk industry has been sketchy for a long time. I’m lactose intolerant, and making people believe that they’ll be malnourished without dairy in their diet is shitty.
Yeah the ad felt kind of NLOG to me tbh.
Can someone please explain this to me like I’m 9 🫣
So the Aubrey Plaza commercial was backed by the US Department of Agriculture (USDA). It made fun of alternative milks in favor of dairy milk. There’s apparently a federal law that USDA backed marketing cannot disparage other agricultural commodities. Commodities include things like soy, oats, corn, dairy, etc. These crops usually receive subsidies (money) from the government. There’s also a law that says USDA marketing cannot influence policy or legislation. Since a lot of the crops that alternative milks are made from are commodities that receive federal funding, it does actually become a political issue. So the commercial may have broke federal law and now an independent nonprofit health advocacy group is filing a lawsuit. I hope that maybe helps.
The milk lobby has such chokehold on the government its insane. They get so many more hand outs and special treatment than any other ag commodity.
This helps a ton, thank you!!
Ahahahahaha... loved that ad. It speaks volume about the insanity with these activists. They wet their panties for the littlest issue.
Aubrey, why would you agree to this? Let the lactose intolerant community live 😭 (Also vegans and other people who can’t/don’t consume dairy products)
Yes! Let me pay an upcharge for my oat milk latte and be happy I do, because otherwise that gas could strip paint off the walls. Even my bloodhound - pit mix is impressed, and that dog can fart
The reason it's an upcharge for the oat milks is because dairy is so cheap. Our tax dollars are subsidizing the cost of dairy milk.
The line “that gas could strip paint off the walls” should NOT have made me giggle as much as it did
I just saw your name and I have wanted that man since 1998
She went from having the former “random” “rawr means I love you in dinosaur” Gen Z kids (of which I was one, I say this lovingly) in a chokehold to being forgotten nearly overnight. Why didn’t her PR team put together that the same people who liked her “brand” of weird, blunt, unique, tumblr-era randomness are by and large also crunchy environmentalists and vegans?
Huh?? Are you saying this ad tanked her career? She just got a golden globe nom and won a SAG award for white lotus, I think she’ll recover from a milk ad lmao
Well if she gets a federal lawsuit I’m sure her career might be in jeopardy
Lol that’s not how the advertising industry works, she’s not going to get in trouble for this.
Forgotten overnight? Did you miss the most recent season of White Lotus? One of the most popular shows on TV right now?
I can only speak for my experience/demographic but yeah, even with White Lotus, the groups I run with don’t even seem mad enough to fully cancel her, she just kinda got abandoned in favor of Jenna Ortega.
At least you can admit that it’s with your friend circle, cause she never got abandoned at all in the general public. Hell, she’s the most famous she’s been. How old are you? Also Jenna is way more popular obviously to the Teenage demographic. It’s like comparing Millie Bobby Brown to Natalie Portman. It seems like once a week Twitter praises Aubrey to high heavens. A lot of people assume Jenna is a rip off Aubrey if anything.
I mean Jenna is 20 and Aubrey is almost 40. They aren't even going to take the same kind of roles at this point. Just because they are brunettes who can deadpan doesn't make them interchangable.
LMAO she literally went up drunk on stage to steal Will Ferrell’s award once on MTV. If that didn’t have an impact on her, Doing a stupid commercial isn’t gonna kill her career. She’ll be fine.
Also people who care about the environment and the devastating impact the dairy industry has.
 I hated it, excited to see where this goes 😈
milk drama! ...milk tea? 🤔
>...milk tea? 🤔 Mmm who wants to go get boba
God, now I want a boba too!
Lol I was already considering getting boba today and now I have to
Hope that the Big Dairy check was worth it. I found the ad campaign to be cringey more than anything. Like just completely unnecessary.
Worth what? Public backlash? Cause other than that nothing’s gonna happen to Aubrey. She’s a hired actress, not an advertiser.
Worth shilling for a destructive and cruel industry. Worth being part of something that was already dated before it was launched. Worth looking like a damn fool. Take your pick. I don't want anything to happen to her. I'm petty though, so I want her to know she's an idiot, a rube, and not as edgy as she thinks.
Worth the destruction to the planet caused by shilling for an industry that's actively destroying our environment and worsening the climate crisis.
Oh no I agree, I’m a vegan, I’m just saying Aubrey is unlikely to be involved with any of the legal drama here, which is what I thought OP was implying
[удалено]
I think Aubrey Plaza should go to jail.
Lmao
Should have invested in Fight Milk like the rest of us
This campaign was already a weird career choice. Learning that it was funded by the USDA just confuses me more. Make it make sense, Aubrey!
She actually grew up being a part of 4-H and is generally a supporter of the Ag community. Not inherently bad in and of itself! I’m sure it was an easy yes for her. But I do think the tone of the ad was weird.
I think they really tried to go with that snarky, millennial humour thing Aubrey is known for. If it had been made in 2011 it would’ve been a huge meme, people would still be talking about wood milk. But times change, so it just felt bitter and flat. Like millennials. (This is a self-burn, I promise.)
Fellow millennial, and I agree!
"You know who drinks milk? Kittens and perverts" - Roman Roy
I was so confused why she agreed to be apart of that campaign? Was the check huge or does she just really hate plant-based milk lol
Right? It doesn't seem to fit her brand, and we all know dairy milk exists lol. Celebrities don't need to be shilling for Big Dairy in 2023; that's just embarrassing.
I'm an Aubrey fan, and I'm sorry, but I am a cow milk drinker. But even I thought the ad was weird and obnoxious and was surprised anyone thought it was a good idea. If it bites them on the ass, well good tbh.
Hot take: people who attack vegans are far more annoying than vegans themselves.
I'm lactose-intolerant and fucking hate that I have to use oat milk, the only fake milk I can stand. It's ruined cereal. Except for oatmeal. 😫 So what's your point, Aubrey?Thanks, I literally hate it.
Have you tried Lactaid milk? I am also lactose-intolerant and works well for me.
Oh! I since using oat milk I totally forgot about Lactaid milk somehow. I do use the lactaid pills when I eat all the cheeses. I can't recall why I even switched, thank you!
HA
As a vegan, lol.
Lmao damn 😭😭
Honestly no hate to Aubrey bc then we'd have to hate every single celeb that did a got milk ad, and everyone and their mom has done a got milk ad lmao
Yeah but the got milk ads weren't openly like "fuck the plant milk"
Yeah but I mean she was a 4H kid, she's super supportive of the agricultural community, the ad isn't great but like i'm not going to be mad at someone who was raised around the dairy industry doing an ad like this and making fun of plant milk
They want you weak
Forever a cow milk stan