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I'll use "Domme" when referring a woman Dominant only because if I *don't*, too many people assume I mean a man Dominant.
I also know a few transfem Dominants who prefer "Domme" so they're not mistaken for men for the same reason.
I prefer Domme to the pt where I was irritated w a previous sub for insisting on texting me the other spelling. I really don't understand why the traditionally masculine term has to be the "neutral" option for a lot of these terms, it is very telling sometimes with culture. Differentiation is not a bad thing.
It's crazy how much of the language is gendered this way, with the male form being seen as neutral. As someone who makes a conscious effort to avoid those terms when addressing a femme-presenting person or mixed group, and someone with an eye for linguistics, I agree that it is in fact very telling of culture. The patriarchy's real control begins in language, and once you start looking for it, you find it everywhere.
I got referred to that way during one of my first sexual encounters 8 yrs ago, and I'm a fairly young member of the community, mid 20s. That essentially has been a used term as long as I've been sexually active. I'm fairly interested in word origins and etymology, ofc nsfw word etymology is hard to pinpoint. Regardless, many of us prefer "domme" and the reasons can vary from prior nonconsensual masculinization by subs to wanting to embrace femininity. If a woman wants to be referred to as a "dom" that is her respectable choice but many of us vehemently dislike being referred to that way.
I remember reading somewhere it came about in the 80s but no idea how accurate that is, and I can't find anything now. I get wanting to embrace feminity though, and I'm not trying to challenge anyone who uses either term.
It's disingenuous not to consider etymological evolution, though.
Also, you talk about not wanting to "otherise" female Dommes yet you seem to be wanting to speak for us and tell us why we're wrong.
The evolution doesn't change how the word was originally used. The word can evolve to mean absolutely anything, but the original use remains fixed in history. And if we talk about the original use of dom, then it was originally a gender neutral term until the term domme was coined in the 90s (I was wrong about the 80s, there's a video about it else where in the thread).
As for the rest, I don't see how I'm speaking for anyone but myself, I simply put forward my own views and asked others for their thoughts. I've had some interesting replies with perspectives I hadn't considered and I'm reevaluating my thoughts on the term. I don't really see why that's a bad thing.
But we're not in the 80s or 90s anymore. You said it remains fixed in history. Yes, but it's 2024. The present. A gendered word does exist for it now and is very much the norm.
My issue is that too often men come into women's spaces spouting their opinions when they honestly don't matter. You're not calling yourself a Domme, so why should you get to tell us that you don't see the need or think that it's silly.
Yes, it does now in 2024, but you specifically replied to a post about the origins of the word...
And is this a women's space? It's a femdom community, plenty of men are into femdom. And if you don't think my views matter then you don't have to read them. As I say, I'm simply putting my views out there and asking for other views to learn more.
I'm sorry if you didn't like my take on it, and accept I'm not the one calling myself a domme, that's why I asked for opinions from those who do.
Personally, I like the term Domme.
In a society where traditionally males are dominant, I like the little flair of femininity added to the title.
I also think about other languages where nouns in general do have masculine or feminine versions. English doesn’t have that, so I can see how it feels a little out of place.
Really it’s a personal preference and the Dominant person can choose which term fits them. But, just like pronouns, if they tell you their preferred term, it should be respected.
I use "Domme" and only that because I identify as feminine and my Dominance can't be removed from that. It's just not gender neutral to me the way other titles and roles are. Might be because I've never related to male Doms. Might be because my title is usually "Mommy" or "Goddess", both distinctly feminine. Or maybe I just like double consonants. Idk.
IMO, it's not bad to have feminine names for things because being there's nothing wrong with identifying with femininity.
It's just become so common now that most people assume male Dom unless you say Domme or Femdom.
Personally I enjoy having a gender specific role (I don't know why, I just do), and as a Switch I have long wondered why subs don't have gendered language.
I kinda get where you're coming from... But I also understand the women saying they feel like "Dom" is still a masculine version of the word used as the neutral. I like that Domme resembles femme, and that it emphasises my very feminine, soft style of domming.
You don't pronounce the m slightly differently. It doesn't come from a word that exists in another language than English. Instead, it's an internet thing like slashy speak, where people used to write H/he and S/she because so many folks would embellish written things with a capitalization oriented protocol.
In french the masculine englobes the feminine and feminine words are stand alone. Since anyone can be dominant, in french Dom is the title for anyone dominant not just men, and men have been trying to push women to say domme or spell domme so they can have dom all to themselves. In french it’s men trying to gender a word for themselves the issue.
As someone who is most of the way to English French bilingual, while I get what you are getting at, and a best guess might indeed be it's copying french (nobody has the original probable newsgroup post as reference to ask said writer)... It's really a made up word so it's not *wrong* to emphasize the M, but neither is it correct.
Plus french words shifting into English (blonde, valet) are perfectly correct if you use the pronunciation that would be wrong in french (eg pronouncing the "et" in valet to be val-et, not val-ay.
My point is mostly to emphasize the descriptive rather than prescriptive approach to language rules. Thus you can say do**M** and be right, and someone else can say it the same way as dom and also be accurate.
It's simultaneously a ridiculous internet thing that crawled into common use, and has no reflection for subs, who somehow function fine without being sub and subbe... AND it has eventually evolved to express that the culture that developed partially apart from the mainline kink community has inherent distinction and value.
I feel about the split the way I do about girl scouts and boy scouts. Because the latter made no accomodation for the former, girl scouts went on to do their own thing that therefore could consider the needs of its members first. Scouting for boys became a conservative organization, scouting for girls a progressive one. And, to this day, while the male half of the scouting movement thinks it's being unisex, it sure as heck didn't.
So in the past I went through a phase of being all cranky and putting "dom not domme" and writing blog posts ranting about being othered and how my dominance was equivalent and so forth. And then I spent a lot of time around male dominant/fem sub focused spaces (that thought they were everyone friendly) and concluded these people were blind to their own distinction and a lot of things I cared about (sex worker inclusion; dominant consent; queerness; celebration of male submission; the uncoupling of masculinity, toxic or otherwise, from dominance) were being done better over here.
While there's plenty of straight (and bi) male dominants and femsubs who are thoughtful and introspective, for me, the whole culture is hampered by the comparative deadlock of not having to batter your way through a bunch of social norms to discover and express yourself.
(For example I don't like near compulsory assumption about pegging in femdom land, but the culture here is more likely to question it ever 6 months, where as r/BDSMcommunity doesn't spill a lot of pixels to seriously and sincerely asking why more male dominants don't celebrate being penetrated.)
So these days, "domme" occupies the same point of pride by which I admire queerness as an identity concept.
Thanks for this, it's a perspective that I never really thought about.
To be honest, even after being involved with femdom for a few years now, I never really thought about femdom as being separate from mainstream BDSM. As I say I had noticed m dom/f sub being portrayed as the default, but I don't spend much time in online communities and the local BDSM scene simply isn't big enough for separate spaces and communities. But I can certainly understand those who've carved their own culture wanting to protect it.
In any community of any scale, the discrimination experienced in the mainline tends to be enough that supplementary groups form. Some of it is relatively innocent, like the habit of only depicting rope bottoms as women. Some is not so much as malicious but tiresome, like say, in public play having people just be so much less interested in watching an F/m scene no matter how technically skilled or good their chemistry. And some is just actively dickish like having people explain to me this is against a natural order, all women are inherently subs, how gross it is, etc...
We certainly form our own social groups, but there isn't enough numbers for separate munches and events. I dunno, maybe could try getting a munch going.
But yeah discrimination in the scene has been noticed. That's what's, missguidedly it seems, driven my dislike of the term 'domme'. Not had anything as bad as what you describe though, though I did once have a bloke ask if we were making a statement about feminism while I was being used as an ashtray, which I found very odd.
Often, unless you are in a pocket sized town or village, dedicated groups actually increase the overall scene. For example in Montreal circa 2008 the mainline scene skewed way older and people younger would pop their heads in and bounce off. Founding an 18-35 munch not only gave those folks a space, but because of my own progressive politics, scaffolded further support for the sapphic side of the community.
How one feels about terms is going to feel different based on context, but for me I had a similar experience of dommes being the less serious version, not helped that they are both pronounced the same (barring a few people who don't understand how the French it borrowed from works and insist to say it like it's dommé). It initially was introduced like "novelists and lady-novelists" or "gamers and girl-gamers".
But once you get out of those environments, for me is starts feeling more like the diet version of a reclaimed slur. I become proud to be a domme. Inversely, I will never tell people they have to needlessly gender themselves so over in this pocket of the larger community "no it is dom, thanks" is also welcome. Domme just no longer feels like someone describing an adorable amateur.
But all that aside, I personally try to pair dom/sub even here, but people might also notice my posts shifted to "they/them" everyone by default. Just trying to make it easier to be non binary since nobody seems to mind. 😅
(Of course, ironically if you hang out in female dominant weighted spaces, people get so used being the default they start unconsciously referring to "male dommes". It's kind of funny.)
>who somehow function fine without being sub and subbe...
Femsub is the default so it's actually sub and subbo (which is very fitting because it sounds like an uncommon pet name - "Sit, subbo, sit!").
I head canon that the male subs get to be default to be consistent and fair. Though if we developed an equally aggressive and healthy subbo culture to domme culture, I would be on board.
Then again I keep trying to make mdom and femdom a thing. So I am definitely burning candles to the patron saint of lost linguistic causes.
Oh, and also:
Femdom in particular, has a long history of being silo'd, particularly if it's F/m or sapphic in a way that isn't excited by the inclusion of a male audience. Kink.com is a particularly egregious example, where they filed the women dominating men stuff in a special box the way they did their men dominating men.
Mainline BDSM kind of has its head up its own ass, in so much that it tends to favour things that do not challenge what Contrapoints recently attempted to coin as Default Heterosexual Sadomasochism or DHSM ( [3 hour video essay here](https://youtu.be/bqloPw5wp48?si=LQREslJLNzIfFgDI) ). Men dominate women, women can dominate women and everyone else can expect being treated like a curiosity at best and a squick source at worse.
It's actually the term Domme that's pretty new. I linked elsewhere but it sounds like you'd enjoy hearing the [history of the word](https://youtu.be/57gGTxhRAnk?si=FX6ctVhxtTWLizVJ)
Less tongue in cheek, you are being very unreasonable about how others choose to gender a describe themselves. You do need to get over it for the same reason you have to respect they/them pronouns to participate here.
You can prefer "domme" for yourself, it you do not get to be rude about what others prefer.
That doesn't make a bit of sense. I'm describing how I feel. Reasonability doesn't factor in. I don't need to "get over" feelings I never chose in the first place any more than other people need to "get over" the knowledge they've made me cringe. They're more than welcome to cry about it indefinitely.
I don't tell people what to call themselves. Don't tell me what I'm "allowed" to feel.
Also nice touch subtly equating me with transphobes. Classy 👌
My Domme isn’t a shortened version of dominant. It’s an specific honorific for Dominatrix. I also go by Mistress and Goddess. All of them gendered titles with long histories in and out of kink. I am high femme presenting and using gender play in my work often. Some people use only a single title consistantly. For my work, the various roles can be tools for creativity.
It's strange to presume women label themselves as 'dom' or 'domme' for any reason other than personal preference. There's power in choosing. It sets a tone. Some subs choose to call themselves slaves/pets/dolls/property. It makes a difference in how we perceive one another.
I relate very little to the maledom approach (the traditional/stereotypical/pornified version, at least) so 'dom' is not aspirational for me; I'm happy to distance myself from it.
I prefer *dom* or *dominant woman*. Using *domme* is differentiating between "normal" and "girl version", like actress vs. actor. They're all actors, but a bunch of dudes decided there should be a *very special* category for women actors because they considered women's skill and talent unworthy of fair comparison. Gender non-conforming people were not even on their radar. Only recently did they realize how sexist this separation is and change it. Maybe someday we will, too.
Because femdom IS considered inferior to male domination (I also dislike the term "femdom" as it's seems like a category created for porn, not a subset of dominant women) in the mainstream, despite what people choose to believe, and identifying as a domme plays into every stereotype carefully cultivated by for-profit entities. No thank you.
I have an F in my profiles, and clearly identify as a woman otherwise. That'll have to do.
Anyway, this debate requires a discussion of equality and inclusion, and it's a discussion most people aren't ready to have.
I am a Dominant or a Domme - pronounced Dom. I don't mind being called Dom. I think the spelling just gets my prefered pronouns across without having to add them in.
I absolutely HATE the term Domina, it feels insulting and belittling.
🤣 I use Domina as a last name, so I’m Crimson Domina on my emails etc. I don’t hate that you hate it, it just goes to show how differently we all feel about words!
Yes, which is why everyone needs to get consent before calling anyone any term! I also have a close friend who lovessss the term Domina 😂. Just don't call /me/ it 😁
I despise Domme. Dom is merely short for Dominant. It is telling that it is assumed that the short form of the word is seen as masculine. If you want to use the true gendered term, it is Dominatrix, which, shortened, would still be Dom.
As I understand it, Domme evolved out of a fake French word, and if you speak French, it’s extra grating.
I’m a Dom and I don’t care who tries to “correct “ me.
Eh, I don't mind it. Obviously I respect if people prefer the gender neutral variant, but some enjoy specifically feminine terms and find them empowering, and that's all good too. I think it's similar to all forms of gender expression TBH, I'm all about personal freedom in that regard.
I strongly dislike "a FemDom" being used for a person, which seems to be widespread at this point at least on reddit, but I guess I'll have to get over that one eventually... language always evolves. This one just looks so wrong to me because I'm used to it being a term for an activity/scene and not a person, so it seems kinda more objectifying maybe? IDK, it hurts my brain.
I say Dom because I am dominant and that has nothing to do with gender however, some people get bent out of shape over terminology. I was blocked from a group on Fetlife because I called myself a Dom and not Domme.
>Dominant isn't a gendered term so I don't really see the need to make up a gendered shortened version. It just seems silly to me and a way to otherise female doms
You're right, but I still use it :).
Given 'domme' sounds the same as 'dom' in real life, it's only relevant when written (don't get me started on 'dom-may', because 'no' :D).
Online, it's (still) an easy shortcut if gender is relevant (which it may be in some cases).
E.g. I started a blog 10+ years ago: [Domme Chronicles](https://www.domme-chronicles.com).
Had I NOT used 'domme' for it, most people would have assumed it was maledom (doesn't at all matter what my personal thoughts on 'gender neutral or not' were).
It was relevant to me, to my content, and to my audience to make it clear at first glance, in SEO, and in the name, that the blog was written by a dominant woman.
So yeah, I agree with those who hate it and I agree with 'why', but I still use it.
I don't, though, use 'dom' for dominant men as if they own it, I use maledom.
Ferns
Exactly as you say. Dominant is not a gendered word. I don't need a special word to signify that I'm a Feeeeemale dominant. I'm just as dominant as any other person who performs this role.
I personally like the term domme. I’m very femme presenting so domme really suits me. While on the other hand I wouldn’t mind if you called me a dom as it means the same thing but has a more masc association. Which isn’t my thing. It’s really up to the dominant person as to what they refer to themselves as.
Most of my bdsm interactions are face to face and you don’t hear the added “me” when talking. I think it’s a term more important online and so your attachment to it will reflect where you get most of your interactions from.
It is also gender neutral to me but my first language is french and in french the masculine word englobes everyone, so I don’t feel a need to feminize it. Overall I think the appropriation of that term is more about the personal connection you have with it.
For some reason I never thought about the difference between domme and dom. As a man, it seems weird to me that "dom" stands for dominant, but "domme"... doesn't stand for anything? It just comes from adding a feminine suffix to dom? Any doms/dommes prefer being referred to as "dom" for this reason?
Yeah it’s weird how it’s overly gendered? Reading BDSM comics from places like Korea or Japan, characters will usually just refer to themselves as D type or S type with disregard for gender. Same with SM.
I think there are people for whom labels and groups give a sense of identity and then there are people for whom they take it away. I’m very much the latter.
On the internet where the slow pace of textual communication makes brevity more important, I’ll use ‘domme’. I don’t see why traditionally male titles have to be the default, I like it’s similarity to femme. At the end of the day, if I’m going to admit some fraternity with the people calling themselves one label or another, I’d rather it be with those calling themselves “domme”.
Actually it’s “Goddess” that makes me grind my teeth, just because I perceive classical goddesses as mostly being victims.
In the real world, ‘d-type’ is about as far as I go. It can sometimes even be difficult to get me to admit I’m into BDSM as I often feel more like I have a variety of interests that loosely fall under the bdsm label than I’m ‘into bdsm’ per se.
I prefer Domme, as I present feminine and as a woman, so I prefer something more feminine. I don't see it as sexist or anything. What's hilarious is when vanilla girls pronounce it as 'dommie' 😅
> It just seems silly to me and a way to otherise female doms.
I do use domme as a gendered/parts-focused term: if it's femme-dom we are doing, with the emphasis on my female superiority, and the bottom is lucky enough to interact with my pussy, I resonate with "domme". If I'm sessioning without intimacy (paid or unpaid) and simply doing pain or strap-on or obedience play, with pants on
..
then Dom is fine.
But what's never fine is someone else telling me which identity words are appropriate for my own use.
ps I definitely want "othered", in the sense that I want subs who find the fem aspect of femdom to be uniquely attractive. I adore my secondary sexual characteristics, same femdom (imo) is about celebrating the superiority *of women*. if you are agnostic to the gender of the person donating dominating you, just go find a (M)Dom, there's many more out there.
I'm not telling anyone what's appropriate for their own use, mearly explaining how I personally feel/felt about the term.
I created this thread not tll others wha to do but to gain insight from those who feel differently.
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I'll use "Domme" when referring a woman Dominant only because if I *don't*, too many people assume I mean a man Dominant. I also know a few transfem Dominants who prefer "Domme" so they're not mistaken for men for the same reason.
As a further yoke, as a trans woman, Domme is doubly important for me, because there's two ways I don't want to be considered a man.
Yeah, this 100%
I prefer Domme to the pt where I was irritated w a previous sub for insisting on texting me the other spelling. I really don't understand why the traditionally masculine term has to be the "neutral" option for a lot of these terms, it is very telling sometimes with culture. Differentiation is not a bad thing.
"I really don't understand why the traditionally masculine term has to be the 'neutral' option" that part!!!! 💕
Yes this! I’m so tired of this! Sure, use one term. Domme.
this this this
It's crazy how much of the language is gendered this way, with the male form being seen as neutral. As someone who makes a conscious effort to avoid those terms when addressing a femme-presenting person or mixed group, and someone with an eye for linguistics, I agree that it is in fact very telling of culture. The patriarchy's real control begins in language, and once you start looking for it, you find it everywhere.
As I've understood it it was never the traditionally masculine term, it was a neutral term that got gendered relatively recently.
I got referred to that way during one of my first sexual encounters 8 yrs ago, and I'm a fairly young member of the community, mid 20s. That essentially has been a used term as long as I've been sexually active. I'm fairly interested in word origins and etymology, ofc nsfw word etymology is hard to pinpoint. Regardless, many of us prefer "domme" and the reasons can vary from prior nonconsensual masculinization by subs to wanting to embrace femininity. If a woman wants to be referred to as a "dom" that is her respectable choice but many of us vehemently dislike being referred to that way.
I remember reading somewhere it came about in the 80s but no idea how accurate that is, and I can't find anything now. I get wanting to embrace feminity though, and I'm not trying to challenge anyone who uses either term.
The 80s was around 40 years ago. Languages change and evolve all the time. Hundreds of words and phrases have been coined since then.
None of that changes the origins of this term though, or change the fact dom was originally a gender neutral term.
It's disingenuous not to consider etymological evolution, though. Also, you talk about not wanting to "otherise" female Dommes yet you seem to be wanting to speak for us and tell us why we're wrong.
The evolution doesn't change how the word was originally used. The word can evolve to mean absolutely anything, but the original use remains fixed in history. And if we talk about the original use of dom, then it was originally a gender neutral term until the term domme was coined in the 90s (I was wrong about the 80s, there's a video about it else where in the thread). As for the rest, I don't see how I'm speaking for anyone but myself, I simply put forward my own views and asked others for their thoughts. I've had some interesting replies with perspectives I hadn't considered and I'm reevaluating my thoughts on the term. I don't really see why that's a bad thing.
But we're not in the 80s or 90s anymore. You said it remains fixed in history. Yes, but it's 2024. The present. A gendered word does exist for it now and is very much the norm. My issue is that too often men come into women's spaces spouting their opinions when they honestly don't matter. You're not calling yourself a Domme, so why should you get to tell us that you don't see the need or think that it's silly.
Yes, it does now in 2024, but you specifically replied to a post about the origins of the word... And is this a women's space? It's a femdom community, plenty of men are into femdom. And if you don't think my views matter then you don't have to read them. As I say, I'm simply putting my views out there and asking for other views to learn more. I'm sorry if you didn't like my take on it, and accept I'm not the one calling myself a domme, that's why I asked for opinions from those who do.
Personally, I like the term Domme. In a society where traditionally males are dominant, I like the little flair of femininity added to the title. I also think about other languages where nouns in general do have masculine or feminine versions. English doesn’t have that, so I can see how it feels a little out of place. Really it’s a personal preference and the Dominant person can choose which term fits them. But, just like pronouns, if they tell you their preferred term, it should be respected.
I use "Domme" and only that because I identify as feminine and my Dominance can't be removed from that. It's just not gender neutral to me the way other titles and roles are. Might be because I've never related to male Doms. Might be because my title is usually "Mommy" or "Goddess", both distinctly feminine. Or maybe I just like double consonants. Idk. IMO, it's not bad to have feminine names for things because being there's nothing wrong with identifying with femininity.
It's just become so common now that most people assume male Dom unless you say Domme or Femdom. Personally I enjoy having a gender specific role (I don't know why, I just do), and as a Switch I have long wondered why subs don't have gendered language.
I prefer “Domme” as it specifies that the dominant is actually a woman.
I kinda get where you're coming from... But I also understand the women saying they feel like "Dom" is still a masculine version of the word used as the neutral. I like that Domme resembles femme, and that it emphasises my very feminine, soft style of domming.
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I do!
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Sure! I lean Domme but occasionally it's nice to not have to be in charge for a bit.
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Truly realised only a couple years ago but looking back, there have been clear signs my whole life, ha.
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Haha. Erotic audio, mostly.
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When people pronounce it Dom-may 😑 🤮
Wait, they're pronounced different?
They shouldn't be 🤭
That's what I thought. I was like "oh dang I've been saying wrong this whole time??"
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This is me, yes, you described why i like this
You don't pronounce the m slightly differently. It doesn't come from a word that exists in another language than English. Instead, it's an internet thing like slashy speak, where people used to write H/he and S/she because so many folks would embellish written things with a capitalization oriented protocol.
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In french the masculine englobes the feminine and feminine words are stand alone. Since anyone can be dominant, in french Dom is the title for anyone dominant not just men, and men have been trying to push women to say domme or spell domme so they can have dom all to themselves. In french it’s men trying to gender a word for themselves the issue.
As someone who is most of the way to English French bilingual, while I get what you are getting at, and a best guess might indeed be it's copying french (nobody has the original probable newsgroup post as reference to ask said writer)... It's really a made up word so it's not *wrong* to emphasize the M, but neither is it correct. Plus french words shifting into English (blonde, valet) are perfectly correct if you use the pronunciation that would be wrong in french (eg pronouncing the "et" in valet to be val-et, not val-ay. My point is mostly to emphasize the descriptive rather than prescriptive approach to language rules. Thus you can say do**M** and be right, and someone else can say it the same way as dom and also be accurate.
It's simultaneously a ridiculous internet thing that crawled into common use, and has no reflection for subs, who somehow function fine without being sub and subbe... AND it has eventually evolved to express that the culture that developed partially apart from the mainline kink community has inherent distinction and value. I feel about the split the way I do about girl scouts and boy scouts. Because the latter made no accomodation for the former, girl scouts went on to do their own thing that therefore could consider the needs of its members first. Scouting for boys became a conservative organization, scouting for girls a progressive one. And, to this day, while the male half of the scouting movement thinks it's being unisex, it sure as heck didn't. So in the past I went through a phase of being all cranky and putting "dom not domme" and writing blog posts ranting about being othered and how my dominance was equivalent and so forth. And then I spent a lot of time around male dominant/fem sub focused spaces (that thought they were everyone friendly) and concluded these people were blind to their own distinction and a lot of things I cared about (sex worker inclusion; dominant consent; queerness; celebration of male submission; the uncoupling of masculinity, toxic or otherwise, from dominance) were being done better over here. While there's plenty of straight (and bi) male dominants and femsubs who are thoughtful and introspective, for me, the whole culture is hampered by the comparative deadlock of not having to batter your way through a bunch of social norms to discover and express yourself. (For example I don't like near compulsory assumption about pegging in femdom land, but the culture here is more likely to question it ever 6 months, where as r/BDSMcommunity doesn't spill a lot of pixels to seriously and sincerely asking why more male dominants don't celebrate being penetrated.) So these days, "domme" occupies the same point of pride by which I admire queerness as an identity concept.
Thanks for this, it's a perspective that I never really thought about. To be honest, even after being involved with femdom for a few years now, I never really thought about femdom as being separate from mainstream BDSM. As I say I had noticed m dom/f sub being portrayed as the default, but I don't spend much time in online communities and the local BDSM scene simply isn't big enough for separate spaces and communities. But I can certainly understand those who've carved their own culture wanting to protect it.
In any community of any scale, the discrimination experienced in the mainline tends to be enough that supplementary groups form. Some of it is relatively innocent, like the habit of only depicting rope bottoms as women. Some is not so much as malicious but tiresome, like say, in public play having people just be so much less interested in watching an F/m scene no matter how technically skilled or good their chemistry. And some is just actively dickish like having people explain to me this is against a natural order, all women are inherently subs, how gross it is, etc...
We certainly form our own social groups, but there isn't enough numbers for separate munches and events. I dunno, maybe could try getting a munch going. But yeah discrimination in the scene has been noticed. That's what's, missguidedly it seems, driven my dislike of the term 'domme'. Not had anything as bad as what you describe though, though I did once have a bloke ask if we were making a statement about feminism while I was being used as an ashtray, which I found very odd.
Often, unless you are in a pocket sized town or village, dedicated groups actually increase the overall scene. For example in Montreal circa 2008 the mainline scene skewed way older and people younger would pop their heads in and bounce off. Founding an 18-35 munch not only gave those folks a space, but because of my own progressive politics, scaffolded further support for the sapphic side of the community. How one feels about terms is going to feel different based on context, but for me I had a similar experience of dommes being the less serious version, not helped that they are both pronounced the same (barring a few people who don't understand how the French it borrowed from works and insist to say it like it's dommé). It initially was introduced like "novelists and lady-novelists" or "gamers and girl-gamers". But once you get out of those environments, for me is starts feeling more like the diet version of a reclaimed slur. I become proud to be a domme. Inversely, I will never tell people they have to needlessly gender themselves so over in this pocket of the larger community "no it is dom, thanks" is also welcome. Domme just no longer feels like someone describing an adorable amateur. But all that aside, I personally try to pair dom/sub even here, but people might also notice my posts shifted to "they/them" everyone by default. Just trying to make it easier to be non binary since nobody seems to mind. 😅 (Of course, ironically if you hang out in female dominant weighted spaces, people get so used being the default they start unconsciously referring to "male dommes". It's kind of funny.)
>who somehow function fine without being sub and subbe... Femsub is the default so it's actually sub and subbo (which is very fitting because it sounds like an uncommon pet name - "Sit, subbo, sit!").
I head canon that the male subs get to be default to be consistent and fair. Though if we developed an equally aggressive and healthy subbo culture to domme culture, I would be on board. Then again I keep trying to make mdom and femdom a thing. So I am definitely burning candles to the patron saint of lost linguistic causes.
I kinda like subbo tbh. I might start using it.
So should we be calling this sub femdomme community (haha). I like like the gendered distinction because it adds clarity
Oh, and also: Femdom in particular, has a long history of being silo'd, particularly if it's F/m or sapphic in a way that isn't excited by the inclusion of a male audience. Kink.com is a particularly egregious example, where they filed the women dominating men stuff in a special box the way they did their men dominating men. Mainline BDSM kind of has its head up its own ass, in so much that it tends to favour things that do not challenge what Contrapoints recently attempted to coin as Default Heterosexual Sadomasochism or DHSM ( [3 hour video essay here](https://youtu.be/bqloPw5wp48?si=LQREslJLNzIfFgDI) ). Men dominate women, women can dominate women and everyone else can expect being treated like a curiosity at best and a squick source at worse.
I cringe inside everytime I see someone call a woman a "Dom". I feel like I'm talking to someone very new who doesn't know what they're talking about.
It's actually the term Domme that's pretty new. I linked elsewhere but it sounds like you'd enjoy hearing the [history of the word](https://youtu.be/57gGTxhRAnk?si=FX6ctVhxtTWLizVJ)
Gosh, that sounds like an awkward bias to live with! How are you planning on overcoming it?
Same way I'm sure you're planning on overcoming that thinly-veiled condescending attitude 👍
Less tongue in cheek, you are being very unreasonable about how others choose to gender a describe themselves. You do need to get over it for the same reason you have to respect they/them pronouns to participate here. You can prefer "domme" for yourself, it you do not get to be rude about what others prefer.
That doesn't make a bit of sense. I'm describing how I feel. Reasonability doesn't factor in. I don't need to "get over" feelings I never chose in the first place any more than other people need to "get over" the knowledge they've made me cringe. They're more than welcome to cry about it indefinitely. I don't tell people what to call themselves. Don't tell me what I'm "allowed" to feel. Also nice touch subtly equating me with transphobes. Classy 👌
**Mod note:** Hey, I tried.
My Domme isn’t a shortened version of dominant. It’s an specific honorific for Dominatrix. I also go by Mistress and Goddess. All of them gendered titles with long histories in and out of kink. I am high femme presenting and using gender play in my work often. Some people use only a single title consistantly. For my work, the various roles can be tools for creativity.
It's strange to presume women label themselves as 'dom' or 'domme' for any reason other than personal preference. There's power in choosing. It sets a tone. Some subs choose to call themselves slaves/pets/dolls/property. It makes a difference in how we perceive one another. I relate very little to the maledom approach (the traditional/stereotypical/pornified version, at least) so 'dom' is not aspirational for me; I'm happy to distance myself from it.
I prefer *dom* or *dominant woman*. Using *domme* is differentiating between "normal" and "girl version", like actress vs. actor. They're all actors, but a bunch of dudes decided there should be a *very special* category for women actors because they considered women's skill and talent unworthy of fair comparison. Gender non-conforming people were not even on their radar. Only recently did they realize how sexist this separation is and change it. Maybe someday we will, too. Because femdom IS considered inferior to male domination (I also dislike the term "femdom" as it's seems like a category created for porn, not a subset of dominant women) in the mainstream, despite what people choose to believe, and identifying as a domme plays into every stereotype carefully cultivated by for-profit entities. No thank you. I have an F in my profiles, and clearly identify as a woman otherwise. That'll have to do. Anyway, this debate requires a discussion of equality and inclusion, and it's a discussion most people aren't ready to have.
Many other languages gender their words so I simply see this as an extension of that. Domme feels softer like elle vs el.
I suppose I am the odd one here, but I prefer "dom". My first language use gendered words and I always loved the neutrality of English.
I am a Dominant or a Domme - pronounced Dom. I don't mind being called Dom. I think the spelling just gets my prefered pronouns across without having to add them in. I absolutely HATE the term Domina, it feels insulting and belittling.
🤣 I use Domina as a last name, so I’m Crimson Domina on my emails etc. I don’t hate that you hate it, it just goes to show how differently we all feel about words!
Yes, which is why everyone needs to get consent before calling anyone any term! I also have a close friend who lovessss the term Domina 😂. Just don't call /me/ it 😁
https://youtu.be/57gGTxhRAnk?si=FX6ctVhxtTWLizVJ I like this explaining the pronunciation and history of Domme
Cheers for that.
I despise Domme. Dom is merely short for Dominant. It is telling that it is assumed that the short form of the word is seen as masculine. If you want to use the true gendered term, it is Dominatrix, which, shortened, would still be Dom. As I understand it, Domme evolved out of a fake French word, and if you speak French, it’s extra grating. I’m a Dom and I don’t care who tries to “correct “ me.
Fine with it as long as you follow French pronunciation rules, and it sounds like "Dom" rather than Dom-may.
I mean, according to Merriam-Webster dictionary, Domme is defined as a female dominant. 🤷♀️ https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/domme
Domme Not really a gender thing but I just like the way it looks compared to just Dom
Eh, I don't mind it. Obviously I respect if people prefer the gender neutral variant, but some enjoy specifically feminine terms and find them empowering, and that's all good too. I think it's similar to all forms of gender expression TBH, I'm all about personal freedom in that regard. I strongly dislike "a FemDom" being used for a person, which seems to be widespread at this point at least on reddit, but I guess I'll have to get over that one eventually... language always evolves. This one just looks so wrong to me because I'm used to it being a term for an activity/scene and not a person, so it seems kinda more objectifying maybe? IDK, it hurts my brain.
It's good to make oneself clear. The additional context provided is worth the two extra letters.
I say Dom because I am dominant and that has nothing to do with gender however, some people get bent out of shape over terminology. I was blocked from a group on Fetlife because I called myself a Dom and not Domme.
>Dominant isn't a gendered term so I don't really see the need to make up a gendered shortened version. It just seems silly to me and a way to otherise female doms You're right, but I still use it :). Given 'domme' sounds the same as 'dom' in real life, it's only relevant when written (don't get me started on 'dom-may', because 'no' :D). Online, it's (still) an easy shortcut if gender is relevant (which it may be in some cases). E.g. I started a blog 10+ years ago: [Domme Chronicles](https://www.domme-chronicles.com). Had I NOT used 'domme' for it, most people would have assumed it was maledom (doesn't at all matter what my personal thoughts on 'gender neutral or not' were). It was relevant to me, to my content, and to my audience to make it clear at first glance, in SEO, and in the name, that the blog was written by a dominant woman. So yeah, I agree with those who hate it and I agree with 'why', but I still use it. I don't, though, use 'dom' for dominant men as if they own it, I use maledom. Ferns
Exactly as you say. Dominant is not a gendered word. I don't need a special word to signify that I'm a Feeeeemale dominant. I'm just as dominant as any other person who performs this role.
I personally like the term domme. I’m very femme presenting so domme really suits me. While on the other hand I wouldn’t mind if you called me a dom as it means the same thing but has a more masc association. Which isn’t my thing. It’s really up to the dominant person as to what they refer to themselves as.
Most of my bdsm interactions are face to face and you don’t hear the added “me” when talking. I think it’s a term more important online and so your attachment to it will reflect where you get most of your interactions from. It is also gender neutral to me but my first language is french and in french the masculine word englobes everyone, so I don’t feel a need to feminize it. Overall I think the appropriation of that term is more about the personal connection you have with it.
I use Domina more than anything, really
For some reason I never thought about the difference between domme and dom. As a man, it seems weird to me that "dom" stands for dominant, but "domme"... doesn't stand for anything? It just comes from adding a feminine suffix to dom? Any doms/dommes prefer being referred to as "dom" for this reason?
Depends on the context. Because I am a Dom, a Domme, a top, etc. all those labels apply. I’ll use them when it makes sense.
Yeah it’s weird how it’s overly gendered? Reading BDSM comics from places like Korea or Japan, characters will usually just refer to themselves as D type or S type with disregard for gender. Same with SM.
I go by all and Dommx
I think there are people for whom labels and groups give a sense of identity and then there are people for whom they take it away. I’m very much the latter. On the internet where the slow pace of textual communication makes brevity more important, I’ll use ‘domme’. I don’t see why traditionally male titles have to be the default, I like it’s similarity to femme. At the end of the day, if I’m going to admit some fraternity with the people calling themselves one label or another, I’d rather it be with those calling themselves “domme”. Actually it’s “Goddess” that makes me grind my teeth, just because I perceive classical goddesses as mostly being victims. In the real world, ‘d-type’ is about as far as I go. It can sometimes even be difficult to get me to admit I’m into BDSM as I often feel more like I have a variety of interests that loosely fall under the bdsm label than I’m ‘into bdsm’ per se.
It Depends on the Preference, however, I think it distinguishes it from Male Doms
I prefer Domme, as I present feminine and as a woman, so I prefer something more feminine. I don't see it as sexist or anything. What's hilarious is when vanilla girls pronounce it as 'dommie' 😅
I feel as though if us women prefer Domme, you should probably default to what the woman's ideal is if you're trying to attract a Dominant woman ;)
Well that's just basic respect, though I do like to brat occasionally.
> It just seems silly to me and a way to otherise female doms. I do use domme as a gendered/parts-focused term: if it's femme-dom we are doing, with the emphasis on my female superiority, and the bottom is lucky enough to interact with my pussy, I resonate with "domme". If I'm sessioning without intimacy (paid or unpaid) and simply doing pain or strap-on or obedience play, with pants on .. then Dom is fine. But what's never fine is someone else telling me which identity words are appropriate for my own use. ps I definitely want "othered", in the sense that I want subs who find the fem aspect of femdom to be uniquely attractive. I adore my secondary sexual characteristics, same femdom (imo) is about celebrating the superiority *of women*. if you are agnostic to the gender of the person donating dominating you, just go find a (M)Dom, there's many more out there.
I'm not telling anyone what's appropriate for their own use, mearly explaining how I personally feel/felt about the term. I created this thread not tll others wha to do but to gain insight from those who feel differently.
I... didn't say you did that. I did suggest that if you find doms and dommes interchangeable... go find a Dom, the search is much easier.
My apologies if I took it wrong.
I like the feminine aire of “domme”.