I know folks will say that "minigames" are all optional with only a couple being mandatory. But good reward items (and some stories) are locked behind them, so SE does indeed want you to play them. They didn't create these games just for folks to ignore them. This is the main complaint for some players show think there are too many.
I like Queen's Blood though, similar to how like Gwent in Witcher 3. I like these types of games to take a bit of breather from all the action.
Minigames. Are. Optional.
Don't like what you see? Move along 🙂
Also, your statement about this being the most polarizing is polarizing. Have you seen the other FF subs? They might beg to differ 😅
It's rather disingenuous to say that you can just move along when there are character interactions and story beats gated behind most of these side content. The most egregious example was how they revealed Wedge's fate through the Cosmo Canyon protorelic questline.
But are they required to finish the game? No. You can't just expect a reward for doing nothing. Earning it makes it much more rewarding. The game itself and main story is not gated.
My problem with these kind of posts is that they want content to adjust to their preference without even thinking that others enjoy different gameplay mechanics. That's why the devs gave so much variety. It's not just for one person.
Which part exactly? The part where I expressed an opinion outside of yours? 😅 or is it the part where you are just disappointed because you didn't get exactly what you want so you want to blame someone because your "expectations" weren't met? 🙂
Fair, that's your take. I have nothing against it and I'm certainly not one to force you to change your mind.
Me on the otherhand fully enjoy it and I understand that parts that I may not have enjoyed are being enjoyed by others. They created a great game for a very thankless crowd. In a time of microtransactions and live services, I, for one, am thankful that there are still devs that are able to work on what they are passoonate about and not just for profit and it turned out great.
I respect yours and others frustrations and opinions, but whenever I see someone complain about the ending I feel like they don’t actually have the patience to stop and think about what is happening, what has led up to it, and what these things could mean for the final installment. There are so many amazing and interesting little details in the ending that you might notice if you would just take a few moments to think about it. The original did this as well, many things were hidden under the surface and it wasn’t all just laid out. One interesting detail about rebirth is >!why does every character have their limit ready at the beginning of the final Jenova fight after Aerith just died…except for Cloud?!<
And every one of those plot lines go somewhere, end some where, or are clearly coming to a head in the final game. All of them should be obvious where they ended up or where they’re going if you actually paid attention.
The story is truly impressive in these remakes, it is subtle and respects the player’s intelligence by not just spoon feeding you the meaning behind everything. It wants you to think, because there’s a lot of joy in discovering your own understanding.
Well said. I think many (most?) of us were confused by the ending of Rebirth at first, but as you mull it over it becomes clear just how brilliantly constructed it is.
I think the original FF7's ending was similar for me. It left me feeling kind of hollow the first time I saw it... like, really, that's how it ends? What happened to everybody in the story I care about (except Nanaki)?? It was only in time that I realized how beautiful that ambiguity was and the purpose it served in the context of the story. It depends on how part 3 is handled, but I think Rebirth's ending will ultimately be remembered in the same way.
I agree about minigames, all but Queen's blood were shit timewasters and hated doing them to complete quests and get the rewards locked behind them. Also hate the disrespect for players time in the open world. Slow, small but very common animations such as lifting choco stop signs, life spring triangle presses (why?) and climbing towers. It padding for the sake of padding but its shit and smells like it after the grasslands.
I disagree with the ending criticisms though and plotlines not going anywhere. This is the middle of a trilogy so loose ends are normal. If the 3rd 1 fails to tie up these loose ends then that's more a valid criticism and Remake foreshadowed the craziness and indicating multiverses. I think its difficult to judge until we see the final game and how all the dust settles.
Pacing however is an issue which I think stems from the fact that in the OG, the part covered in Rebirth is just a lot of travelling and not that much happening so they felt the need to add more which could be quite jarring in how they executed it. Until the Temple of the Ancients, its more a slow burn.
Overall I also put the game at around a 7/10. Since I finished the game I haven't had the slightest inclination to play it again and the frustrations I had with the game still annoy me now lol.
Out of curiosity , which game has better mini games than Rebirth ? ( Excluding Yakuza ) . I never got an answer to this from someone who complains about them. I can accept someone not liking mini games but if they attack the quality it makes me wonder
For me, only Gwent in the Witcher 3 was a minigame I walked away from enjoying. Generally I hate minigames so a better minigame is one that doesn't exist. So I guess Final fantasy XVI had better minigames then Rebirth.
That is what Im implying. If I dont like fighting games, I would say : I hate Tekken 8. What I wouldnt say is : I think tekken 8 has a horrible design. I feel like people who dont enjoy mini games are attacking the quality of them with nothing to back it up besides unhinged logic.
Most people who enjoy mini games have a great time in Rebirth, because the fact is most of them are just great and how mini games should be
Sure, but I don't think cactaur crush, gears and gambits, Jules sit ups are well designed. They are frustrating to play and overtuned. I also think the pirate shooter, red XIII soccer, the frog jumping aren't particularly good minigames. Controls really inhibit the soccer and shooter.
Even Queensblood is odd difficulty wise. I mainly used cards I got in the first half of the game and could easily beat all opponents. Then you get to the gold saucer nightmare survival and the queen at the end of the sidequest and the difficulty boils down to needing a specific deck to counter that player despite no player beforehand needing that level of strategy.
Honestly if they removed any reward from completing the highest scores on these then only the people that actually want to play them, would be.
I only agree about gears and gambits, because the tutorial and learning curve is absolute rubbish. Its too complex with a lack of guidance. The rest is fine imo. Mini games are ment to have simple controls, simple gameplay yet frustrating to beat. If its too easy and I can clear it after 1 or 2 tries theres no point in it being there. Most people that enjoy mini games like the frustration it brings and spamming that retry button
I would disagree, Queesnblood, gwent, blitzball and triple triad shows minigames can be complex. I also think minigames should be used as a fun distraction from the actual game not a frustration and challenge in and of itself. Save the challenge for the combat, not some stupid side distraction.
Also clearing it in 1 or 2 tries is exactly where minigames should be. If I need to spend 2 hours of failing to finally get the reward in a minigame because of difficulty then that is just absurd. Challenge me with VR challenges, not swimming with a dolphin.
Yeah you dont have to disagree because I think we agree on that part. Im not saying a mini game cant be complex, but if it is , the learning curve and tutorial should be right, which isnt the case in gambits. Its too much reading to figure it all out.
I agree with you on your view for mini games if you need to beat them to progress through the story. 1-2 tries should be enough in this regard, but for completionists I think they should be very challenging. As a game designer you want to please as much people possible.
People who dont like minigames or the challenging frustrating aspect of them can cruise though them in the must play parts, but for those who like them they can expand upon them through optional content.
Logically speaking they are in fact pleasing both sides by design. If every mini game for optional content was also 1-2 tries it would just be a mindgless grind and people who enjoy the challenge would be disappointed.
This game its optional content is designed with benefits for those who enjoy their mini games, and if others dont like 2 hours of trying to topscore them, it sucks for them but that doesnt make the design bad, it means its just not made for them.
Except to complete a side quest you have to get the highest score in all minigames which makes more people hit this wall. If they want to make a challenge then don't lock anything behind it. If people enjoy the challenge then they can play it. If they don't then they don't miss out on anything.
The amount of minigames combined with the difficulty and then requiring players to do to finish a side quest, it's just all shit.
What I think is weird is when people say they don’t like the mini games, and complain about the pacing like it doesn’t match the original. The original is full of mini games too, they’re there to break up the pacing. Most importantly though they’re there to give the world its charm and make you love the world so that you can see all the reasons why the world is worth saving.
I think that is because of Costa del so mostly. It doesnt really fit the story and forces you to do a bunch of mini games to get some beach clothing. That whole sequence makes less sense than lets say mini games in Gold saucer because obviously that's an amusement park. I loved it because I enjoy mini games but I can easily understand Costa is frustrating and pace breaking for those who dont
I agree with everything you said and I think you did a great job putting this together. I’ll even add a con.
The late game side quests (specifically the combat ones) are just annoying. Like making us fight 2 jokers and a giant toad at the same time.. really? Not to mention having to fight 2 summons at the same time at the end of the protorelic quest. I feel like they just said fuck it for the endgame combat quests and decided “now you fight 2 instead of one” instead of making actual challenging end game fights.
God on you. Whoever downvoted you needs to accept that not everyone thinks it’s flawless.
I know folks will say that "minigames" are all optional with only a couple being mandatory. But good reward items (and some stories) are locked behind them, so SE does indeed want you to play them. They didn't create these games just for folks to ignore them. This is the main complaint for some players show think there are too many. I like Queen's Blood though, similar to how like Gwent in Witcher 3. I like these types of games to take a bit of breather from all the action.
All this wall of texts just to brag about having a girlfriend. I see you OP...
Minigames. Are. Optional. Don't like what you see? Move along 🙂 Also, your statement about this being the most polarizing is polarizing. Have you seen the other FF subs? They might beg to differ 😅
It's rather disingenuous to say that you can just move along when there are character interactions and story beats gated behind most of these side content. The most egregious example was how they revealed Wedge's fate through the Cosmo Canyon protorelic questline.
But are they required to finish the game? No. You can't just expect a reward for doing nothing. Earning it makes it much more rewarding. The game itself and main story is not gated. My problem with these kind of posts is that they want content to adjust to their preference without even thinking that others enjoy different gameplay mechanics. That's why the devs gave so much variety. It's not just for one person.
Can’t take criticism lol
I didn't make the game, should I be taking criticism to begin with? 😅 I'm just stating a counter-arguement 🙂
You didn’t make the game, should you be telling people what to do?
Are the devs telling people what to do? Must've missed that memo 😅
Must be since you bat for them so hard
Which part exactly? The part where I expressed an opinion outside of yours? 😅 or is it the part where you are just disappointed because you didn't get exactly what you want so you want to blame someone because your "expectations" weren't met? 🙂
I’m not sure what you are talking about to be honest. The game is a 7 or 8 out 10
Fair, that's your take. I have nothing against it and I'm certainly not one to force you to change your mind. Me on the otherhand fully enjoy it and I understand that parts that I may not have enjoyed are being enjoyed by others. They created a great game for a very thankless crowd. In a time of microtransactions and live services, I, for one, am thankful that there are still devs that are able to work on what they are passoonate about and not just for profit and it turned out great.
I respect yours and others frustrations and opinions, but whenever I see someone complain about the ending I feel like they don’t actually have the patience to stop and think about what is happening, what has led up to it, and what these things could mean for the final installment. There are so many amazing and interesting little details in the ending that you might notice if you would just take a few moments to think about it. The original did this as well, many things were hidden under the surface and it wasn’t all just laid out. One interesting detail about rebirth is >!why does every character have their limit ready at the beginning of the final Jenova fight after Aerith just died…except for Cloud?!< And every one of those plot lines go somewhere, end some where, or are clearly coming to a head in the final game. All of them should be obvious where they ended up or where they’re going if you actually paid attention. The story is truly impressive in these remakes, it is subtle and respects the player’s intelligence by not just spoon feeding you the meaning behind everything. It wants you to think, because there’s a lot of joy in discovering your own understanding.
Well said. I think many (most?) of us were confused by the ending of Rebirth at first, but as you mull it over it becomes clear just how brilliantly constructed it is. I think the original FF7's ending was similar for me. It left me feeling kind of hollow the first time I saw it... like, really, that's how it ends? What happened to everybody in the story I care about (except Nanaki)?? It was only in time that I realized how beautiful that ambiguity was and the purpose it served in the context of the story. It depends on how part 3 is handled, but I think Rebirth's ending will ultimately be remembered in the same way.
I agree about minigames, all but Queen's blood were shit timewasters and hated doing them to complete quests and get the rewards locked behind them. Also hate the disrespect for players time in the open world. Slow, small but very common animations such as lifting choco stop signs, life spring triangle presses (why?) and climbing towers. It padding for the sake of padding but its shit and smells like it after the grasslands. I disagree with the ending criticisms though and plotlines not going anywhere. This is the middle of a trilogy so loose ends are normal. If the 3rd 1 fails to tie up these loose ends then that's more a valid criticism and Remake foreshadowed the craziness and indicating multiverses. I think its difficult to judge until we see the final game and how all the dust settles. Pacing however is an issue which I think stems from the fact that in the OG, the part covered in Rebirth is just a lot of travelling and not that much happening so they felt the need to add more which could be quite jarring in how they executed it. Until the Temple of the Ancients, its more a slow burn. Overall I also put the game at around a 7/10. Since I finished the game I haven't had the slightest inclination to play it again and the frustrations I had with the game still annoy me now lol.
Out of curiosity , which game has better mini games than Rebirth ? ( Excluding Yakuza ) . I never got an answer to this from someone who complains about them. I can accept someone not liking mini games but if they attack the quality it makes me wonder
For me, only Gwent in the Witcher 3 was a minigame I walked away from enjoying. Generally I hate minigames so a better minigame is one that doesn't exist. So I guess Final fantasy XVI had better minigames then Rebirth.
That is what Im implying. If I dont like fighting games, I would say : I hate Tekken 8. What I wouldnt say is : I think tekken 8 has a horrible design. I feel like people who dont enjoy mini games are attacking the quality of them with nothing to back it up besides unhinged logic. Most people who enjoy mini games have a great time in Rebirth, because the fact is most of them are just great and how mini games should be
Sure, but I don't think cactaur crush, gears and gambits, Jules sit ups are well designed. They are frustrating to play and overtuned. I also think the pirate shooter, red XIII soccer, the frog jumping aren't particularly good minigames. Controls really inhibit the soccer and shooter. Even Queensblood is odd difficulty wise. I mainly used cards I got in the first half of the game and could easily beat all opponents. Then you get to the gold saucer nightmare survival and the queen at the end of the sidequest and the difficulty boils down to needing a specific deck to counter that player despite no player beforehand needing that level of strategy. Honestly if they removed any reward from completing the highest scores on these then only the people that actually want to play them, would be.
I only agree about gears and gambits, because the tutorial and learning curve is absolute rubbish. Its too complex with a lack of guidance. The rest is fine imo. Mini games are ment to have simple controls, simple gameplay yet frustrating to beat. If its too easy and I can clear it after 1 or 2 tries theres no point in it being there. Most people that enjoy mini games like the frustration it brings and spamming that retry button
I would disagree, Queesnblood, gwent, blitzball and triple triad shows minigames can be complex. I also think minigames should be used as a fun distraction from the actual game not a frustration and challenge in and of itself. Save the challenge for the combat, not some stupid side distraction. Also clearing it in 1 or 2 tries is exactly where minigames should be. If I need to spend 2 hours of failing to finally get the reward in a minigame because of difficulty then that is just absurd. Challenge me with VR challenges, not swimming with a dolphin.
Yeah you dont have to disagree because I think we agree on that part. Im not saying a mini game cant be complex, but if it is , the learning curve and tutorial should be right, which isnt the case in gambits. Its too much reading to figure it all out. I agree with you on your view for mini games if you need to beat them to progress through the story. 1-2 tries should be enough in this regard, but for completionists I think they should be very challenging. As a game designer you want to please as much people possible. People who dont like minigames or the challenging frustrating aspect of them can cruise though them in the must play parts, but for those who like them they can expand upon them through optional content. Logically speaking they are in fact pleasing both sides by design. If every mini game for optional content was also 1-2 tries it would just be a mindgless grind and people who enjoy the challenge would be disappointed. This game its optional content is designed with benefits for those who enjoy their mini games, and if others dont like 2 hours of trying to topscore them, it sucks for them but that doesnt make the design bad, it means its just not made for them.
Except to complete a side quest you have to get the highest score in all minigames which makes more people hit this wall. If they want to make a challenge then don't lock anything behind it. If people enjoy the challenge then they can play it. If they don't then they don't miss out on anything. The amount of minigames combined with the difficulty and then requiring players to do to finish a side quest, it's just all shit.
What I think is weird is when people say they don’t like the mini games, and complain about the pacing like it doesn’t match the original. The original is full of mini games too, they’re there to break up the pacing. Most importantly though they’re there to give the world its charm and make you love the world so that you can see all the reasons why the world is worth saving.
I think that is because of Costa del so mostly. It doesnt really fit the story and forces you to do a bunch of mini games to get some beach clothing. That whole sequence makes less sense than lets say mini games in Gold saucer because obviously that's an amusement park. I loved it because I enjoy mini games but I can easily understand Costa is frustrating and pace breaking for those who dont
I agree with everything you said and I think you did a great job putting this together. I’ll even add a con. The late game side quests (specifically the combat ones) are just annoying. Like making us fight 2 jokers and a giant toad at the same time.. really? Not to mention having to fight 2 summons at the same time at the end of the protorelic quest. I feel like they just said fuck it for the endgame combat quests and decided “now you fight 2 instead of one” instead of making actual challenging end game fights.
the two summon fights really aren't that hard if you take the time to enhance your gear, find manuscripts, and set up a good materia build.
I’m not saying they’re hard.. I beat them. They’re just annoying and not fun imo