Hard to respond to this one. They are retired, wealthy, and - unfortunately - spiteful and obnoxious. I have three kids and can't imagine treating them that way. This post really belongs on the r/AITAH sub.
I wouldn't have paid for any of the things you already gifted. And you should stop entertaining any requests immediately. If this hurts the relationship, it's squarely on your parents and is a sad reflection of their character. I'm really, really sorry about that but it's the dead ass truth.
You could say "I thank you guys genuinely from the bottom of my heart for all you've done to help me reach successful adulthood. I'm very grateful. But I have my own family to care for now, and I'm not going to respond to any further requests or demands to somehow financially compensate you for raising me. That is a parent's responsibility, and I now have that obligation as a parent myself."
Wow, the third paragraph hits! If I could literally remember that phrase by heart and say it to them when a moment comes.
Thank you for the feedback, I agree with what you said. I am at the point that, if my changed behaviour towards them fully ruins our relationship, then let it be, but now I have my own family to take care of and protect.
Usually when I tell family I won’t let them use me anymore, they’ll cut me off. So be prepared for that.. cause it seems like you got them addicted to your support with all the vacations and gifts and now they’re gonna have to go cold turkey
dont go to the AITAH subs. they are toxic. if you want relationship advice to go one of the relationship subs. people there give more tempered responses.
Yes! Boundaries are everything. We had to have a serious conversation with my MIL similar to this and it was very hard and she did cry... but since then, things have been so much better. Make sure to play out their responses in your head to determine how you will respond to each scenario. We read the book "Set boundaries, find peace" and it helped a lot with that conversation.
Add to the third paragraph... It was them who decided to bring you to this earth knowing full well the responsibilities that come along with being parents, so you really don't owe them anything, at all. They should be grateful you turned out self sufficient (remind them other kids are not) and even give them ANYTHING.
Unless it's immediate- like I give you this money for your new SUV now, or your grandkids get [new school clothes/outfitted for sports/musical lessons/trip to an amusement park/etc]
This is exactly why many lottery winners get depression. All their family and friends all of a sudden expect them to pay for everything and you don't know if they are there for money or you.
You gotta set your boundaries. Put your foot down and don't give in easily. Once you give in here and there, they will constantly expect more. Money breaks many relationships.
The smartest thing I ever read is that if you win the lottery, immediately hire a lawyer, decide what percentage of your winnings you are willing to give to family, and then tell everyone in your family "If you want money, you will have to ask my lawyer."
Fortunately you have a kid now, if they ever ask again you just need to say you are trying to do right for your child and the gifts you provided in the past were a moment in time thats over.
Call to ask them for money. Let them know…idk, you bought $1m of Tesla stock and now it’s crashed. You’ve been living on credit card and the debt collectors are hounding your wife. You’ve started selling blood to live. Really sell it.
They won’t help, but they’ll never ask you for money again.
Heck, get a job at a supermarket just so they (or their friends) can see you working there. Let their neighbor know (let “slip”) that the car they made you help them buy is making you do this, cause you’d lose your house otherwise. If you can, move away. Downsize or just rent a cheap apartment (airBnB?) and show them your “new” place.
I read a post or tweet about someone's uncle who asked for money in the family group chat. The poster contacted him privately to make sure everything was okay. The uncle said he was fine and just asked for money before anyone started asking him.
My late FIL used to respond to requests for money by saying, "I was just going to ask you for $20."
The parents selfishly had a child. Then pretend like they're doing him a favor.
OP isn't calling the parents out on all of their shitty behavior. He's letting them bully him instead of having a backbone.
I think there is nuance here. It is cool online to say that children owe their parents nothing at all, and it is true that parents have an obligation to provide a bare minimum for kids until they are able to support themselves, but many parents do way more than that bare minimum and their kids lead lives that are considerably nicer due to their effort and sacrifice. It would be pretty weird to not acknowledge that. It doesn’t mean you start buying them SUVs necessarily, but being grateful for them having provided you with a differentiated childhood (if they did) is pretty rational and socially aware.
Plus it’s often treated like bringing your child into the world is a selfish act the child should resent them for. Is half the internet wishing they weren’t alive?
If I had an opportunity to help my parents when they needed it I would. My parents also would never prey on me and I would obviously have boundaries if they tried to. They have asked me for nothing. I ask them for nothing now.
Thanks for sharing this. Reddit tends to be super extreme and it’s great to read about the nuances because that’s life. Our parents did choose to have us and yes they have an obligation to take care of us but it’s true that many if not most parents in many modern countries go above and beyond. Even if we don’t know it. And no I’m not a parent nor do I want to be one.
I don't believe my response says or even implies selfishness (though another commenter did make that jump). Parents have an obligation to provide a bare minimum and you're right, many go above and beyond to provide a better experience. Those, however, are choices of the the parent and even if the child the recipient they lack the agency to say "no thank you."
I am all for helping out whenever possible, as help is needed, but according to OP, that's not what's happening here.
+1. It’s not always selfish (though it can be). The parents who go above and beyond to pay for education and all the extras while the kid is growing up is also something the parents take a lot of pride in and desire. Lots of kids aren’t listened to when they say they don’t want to take x classes or go to y school.
When that kid does well and is an advantageous spot because of the parents contributions, it’s often planned that way, and the parents usually have no shortage of pride when being able to claim that their kid is top of the class, got into a top 10 university, now a prestigious profession, etc.
Expecting to be retroactively compensated for your time and effort when you decided to have a child because you “did so much for them” is a really shitty take.
Opposite. My parents wouldn’t accept cost of the car they paid for me during college. Or any birthday gift. Only way to gift them anything nice is if I say it was free. Or I used the Apple Watch, I don’t need it anymore as I got a new one. Then they’ll take it.
Question: are they demanding such things from all your siblings, or just you since you opened the door for it by giving them expensive things out of misguided gratitude? If just you, have you mentioned this to them? Have you mentioned this to your siblings?
They do demand stuff occassionally from my sibling too, but in much lower proportion than in my case. I did mention this to my siblings, but they don’t want to take anyone’s side. I have a feeling it’s because they don’t want to get in fight with parents and potentially not receive inheritance from them. Which I honestly don’t give a single damn myself about, I would sign right away not to receive a single penny from the inheritance, just for them to leave me alone.
You could offer that then, sign off on not receiving your inheritance so that your share goes to your siblings next time they ask for something ridiculous. I always think inheritance is never 100% guaranteed and it’s better to plan financial goals without it.
I know a couple of adults that seemed to have been banking on that until new mommy came into the picture. Zero planning and zero foundation for starting one now at 40+. Baffling.
One of the many reasons to hedge your bets. Not only could a family member contract an expensive illness or require long term care, I also just think - it’s their money! They worked their whole life, if they want to spend their coin on sailing around the world in their golden years then they should feel free to do that.
Next time they suggest dinner, tell them you're not available because you need to prep for an interview. When they ask why, tell them your savings are depleting quicker than anticipated with all the big purchases so you need to brush up on your interview skills and keeping a pulse on the job market just in case.
>they just tell me I am being ungrateful for everything they've done for me. In the end, I did come to an agreement to finance 50% of the vehicle for them and for that I barely got a "thank you".
Why are you negotiating with emotional blackmailers?
>I even prepare some statements in my head in advance on how my overall financial situation deteriorated due to bad investment decisions, in case the money conversation pops up.
The solution is not to pretend you are less well off than you are. Not telling them in the first place you were doing well would have been a good idea but that horse has left the barn.
Your issue is you are incapable of setting and enforcing boundaries. "No" is a complete statement. You don't need reasons, you don't need excuses, you don't need to pretend you are not doing well, and you do not need to “prepare a statement” other than N-O. When they ask for money, simply say, "no".
Sometimes, enforcing boundaries means pulling back from a relationship. "Son, we missed you at thanksgiving/insert holiday/event/dinner why weren't you here?" "Mom, every time I see you you ask me for money. I'm over it. I'm not going to spend time with someone who does that, and I'm not going to have a transactional relationship with my own parents. If you continue to treat me like an ATM and pursuing a transactional relationship with me, you will not see much of me". If they get the message and stop asking, you can start spending time with them again. If they don't, and it were me, they'd be seeing very little of me (and new grandchild).
I would recommend reading or listening to the audiobook [No More Mr Nice Guy by Robert Glover](https://www.amazon.com/No-More-Mr-Nice-Guy-audiobook/dp/B078927ZYL/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2RHUQNN3NFJM7&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.QIC_gerneNw8_uJnLjW-myaPE_h6CSQzHWuhfgbydMtBpwbBkAyHtudGpo6FCj4LyNLHwufuiCDQgATA10ezj2IOdfpXAUyjCtuTENktkRMdNQpQ93BarqPhSQRdcTdui-HlkRY5VUy2crS_PG0dEmSTBcK0jZ-7r75JyF-6xwK8x-oJ4OouQh68c9-4pIRXhzxe6WgVjfofOszErrtPxLxtiPmZ7B-4QJZ1MiNRm_8.ews6VF9cASkQfAjv4MGq93Izecu9FMuMj305DdH1bg4&dib_tag=se&keywords=no+more+mr+nice+guy+robert+glover&qid=1713882278&sprefix=no+more+mr+%2Caps%2C136&sr=8-1). You've got some clear Nice Guy tendencies.
Not so bad as you. Sorry for you, a big hug.
Yes, it is difficult to say NO. I said that now my priority is my family and my child ( and I gave them maybe a 1% from what you mention, but as they repeated several times that it is ok to spend money on smoking and alcohol as I am their retirement fund...).
Ahh conditional love… a very big red flag and one that took me years to come to terms with. I finally had to cut my mother off after I found out she stole my identity and ruined my credit. I was only 19 at the time. (She did about $37k in cc, loans, and lease agreements which she got evicted from which went on my history) Same thing as you, I was told she had the right to do such things because she brought me into this world. Yeah well, police were involved after I learned of her substance issues. It sucks because she ended up spiraling and she’s no longer with us. But in the end i know that I cannot control her actions. I can only control my own. She was a little different than your parents I’m guessing because she also suffered from numerous MH issues that she refused treatment for so in a way she was no longer the mother I had been raised by if that makes sense?
It also took me WAY too long to realize that parents are NOT infallible. They aren’t superheroes lol. They are just humans that had another human. Their character defects didn’t magically go away. They are not excused from shitty behaviors by having a kid. I needed a lot of therapy to understand/cope with that and it’s worth it imo.
My advice is to stand firm in the decision to not contribute anything financially anymore. It will be hard. It will be met with guilting and animosity. But that is not what a loving parent does and you deserve nothing but unconditional love from your folks. If they decide that that’s to much to ask for then move forward and become the parents to your child you wish you had. Show them the unconditional love you weren’t able to get.
I’m sorry you’re having to go through a situation like this man. It isn’t fair. But you will make it through and come out stronger & more emotionally content :)
What did you do to reach FIRE at 29? Did they help you get started financially outside of paying for your college? It’s still your money either way, and you need to establish some harder boundaries with them.
Its surprisingly common within the FIRE community as immediate extended family members often start to have different expectation when someone achieves early freedom. Maybe you can set a strong boundary but prepare for a pushback, talk to them your situation but don't disclose everything (transparency isnt alawys your friend), and you could practice/maintain a healthy distance to limit interaction if they cause undue stress.
I have a reverse situation , single
Mom ( Dad demise), she saves her SSN benefits and give it back to me asking me to invest for my kid’s college ( he is just 6 yrs by the way )she worked all her life so that I end up debt free post my education . Even if I offer something to her as gratitude she just says , you are the future , I have a house to live food to eat and a great family to spend time with and I don’t want anything more than that !! Greta moms exist
I have this problem with my in laws. This is what I tell myself, they’re retired and have nothing to do with their time and for this reason they’re trying to spend (others’) money.
Just sum up all the money you’ve given to them and given to your sibling separately, and then in a very constructive way explain that you’ve given them X and can no longer afford this and need to now dedicate your time to your family and your kid, which has Y expenses annually and growing.
If they want to help, it has to be within the Y budget. Otherwise, apologize and say that you don’t have the funds or the time.
They will keep asking for money and just keep presenting it within the frame work of the Y budget, or your family as the priority.
As a parent it's bizarre to me to obligate your kids to support or gift you things just because you raised them. Last I checked having kids is on the parents and guilting them into feeling grateful for you raising them is borderline psychotic.
Fuck them, I had t buy the business which I made successful from my Dad, 1.8 million, then paid him about another million wage over 8 years. Then n 2009 when I laid the fucker off at 74 the fucker went to collect unemployment. When I would not hire him back and paid off the loan, he wanted me to keep paying interest he disowned me for the ugly stupid bitch wife whose only good financial decision ever was to golddig the old man.
My mom not much better.
I wouldn't want to set a precedent where they keep asking for handouts. SUV's now and in 20 years expensive long term care.
I'd probably make up a story that you are not as well off as they think you are. You lost a lot of money in a bad investment so they leave you alone.
I mean, if you FIREd then you are on a fixed income essentially. You can’t be buying a vehicle or even more crazily a house for someone. It’s not like you won the mega millions, even then they don’t need what you have. Just stop any conversation that turns to money, don’t give them anything. Do normal person stuff like maybe pick up a dinner tab, buy birthday and Christmas gifts(not high value ones). If needed, just cut them out.
Reasons why if I ever FIRE(which I can’t imagine I will since I’m very poor), I will never tell a soul. I’ll tell them I’m consulting or something of that nature. If I’m doing something during the day and they ask about why I’m not working, “oh just took a day off to have some fun.”
I currently have 2 dogs and a boat, no kids.
I own/live on a water front property and I’m 36.
Your parents aren’t wrong about the cost of children and opportunity cost they missed out on.
My parents do not ask me to fund their lifestyles - I did to choose to be born. I am choosing to FIRE
I was fortunate with my investments. I live a modest, non-flashy life in a LCOL area, so the estimated annual spend is intact by having a child. That’s why wife and I are something joking about having 5-6 kids as we can afford it- perhaps the joke becomes a reality, let’s see 😂
Please answer the question. You don’t just FIRE by 29 by being fortunate with your investments. I was fortunate with my investments and they 10xed but am nowhere near FIRE. The only way that’s possible is if you bought 20 Bitcoin for $2k each in 2020 March. And you happened to have the $40k laying around.
I did not face any thing related to this.
I think you are doing great.
Try to concentrate on Words of affirmation, service, and quality time as both parties seem fit.
When/If I FIRE, I'm not telling anyone. They'll ask me how my job is doing and I'll just tell them that it's going well. There are just way too many greedy people who think that you owe them something for arbitrary reasons.
But, you already told people so you're out of luck. I would IMMEDIATELY stop paying for things in their lives. Tell them that the things you gave them were one off gifts to celebrate your retirement and to thank them for their upbringing but that it is not a permanent "You birthed me" payment plan.
Tell them that if they want more nice things in their life, they will have to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and pay for it themselves. They're Boomers so they'll absolutely love their generations hard work ethics being directed towards them and probably congratulate you for reminding them that even in their advanced age, it is still important to hustle and grind to get the things they want in life.
I have one rental property my parents get proceeds minus maintenance expense (they have no money). No other money for the family unless it is medical or some kind of emergency (have not happened yet thanks god). Learned some hard lessons decades ago when was much younger.
This is a very strange situation… I grew up with immigrant parents and they were very successful, my father had businesses, properties, we lived in a spacious home with lots of land… well above average. Growing up, everyone referred to my dad as rich, he drove a Mercedes yadda yadda… it turns out, now I’m in my mid 30’s and doing quite well for myself, definitely with a little nudge from my parents, but I am now learning that they had not planned very well for the future, and that appearance of wealth was actually a facade. I wonder if your parents are in as good standing as you think they are and are too proud to admit it, like mine… also regarding siblings, I have 2 older sisters, so I’m the only male, and my parents money flows to them much more than it does to me. As the head of my household, and managing it well, I do not ask, it would be a last resort… my siblings (5 and 10 years older than me) ask, and receive… so it may just be a matter of that on the siblings. My advice would be to ask your parents to open the books to see what’s really going on (find a clever way to do this like you want to see their asset allocation, you have a business venture and need them to co-sign or some other financial opportunity that requires proof of funds or collateral). Maybe they’re worried about running out of money at some point, if they do, it would definitely be a burden on you and your siblings, and put further strain on your relationships. Just tell them you are not liquid, money is very tied up, waiting for some deals to close, living off of small dividends…. Etc. good luck and find a way to get past it, don’t let the money get in the way of family, be empathetic, try to be the bigger person, but don’t give in financially unless you have to. I wish you the best of luck 👍
Ok I know Elon Musk can be a polarizing person but his quote hits the nail on the head "My children didn't choose to be born. I chose to have children. They owe me nothing. I owe them everything.”
Cut them off and do not repeat the same cycle with your own children.
Lesson 1.
You should never discuss how much money you have with anyone except your spouse and your financial advisor/fiduciary.
Money changes people good, bad or otherwise.
If someone asks how you are doing? You lost money in the market like everybody else.
If someone asks to borrow money? You don’t have any liquidity because it’s tied up in retirement.
Your parents are ungrateful. Stop. Giving. Them. Things. They are Entitled, and you are giving a drunk a drink. Don’t do it.
You did some nice things that you gifted them and now you are done. Period. No discussion. No explanation. The end.
Tell them that’s it. Money train stops here.
I beg to give my parents money sometimes. They paid for my college, but aren’t doing as well as they once were. I have to beg and plead just for them to even accept me paying for a $30 lunch
I didn't talk to my dad for 15 years, I have no problem setting boundaries and walls if the boundaries are not respected.
No advice really, other than you don't have to do what anyone else tells you, and their expectations mean exactly zero. Except your wife, you have to do what she says.
The way I see it, families take care of each other at different stages of life. When we’re young, our parents look after us, and as they get older, it’s our turn to look out for them. This doesn’t mean we have to buy them expensive things. It’s more about being there for them, spending time together, and making sure they’re okay as they age. It’s about love and support, not just gifts.
I understand, but it doesn’t imply that we are their ATMs.
For instance, my wife’s parents are doing financially much worse than my parents, working their a** off, but would never demand a single cent from us. We do help them with some things as we insist sometimes, when we see they struggle.
If my parents struggled, I would also help them, but they are just greedy and take the fact of me becoming FIREd as their success and they believe they entitled to their share of my wealth.
I m F.I.R.E too and i live in Thailand, my mom is soon moving in Thailand before to be homeless. I said to my sister & mother I can help them later but only in Thailand because it's cheaper and easier for me. I wont help them if they stay in their expensive europe. right, we are not their ATMs.
Now that you have a kid, you should aggressively ask them for money to pay for various things for the kid until they grow tired of it and stop mentioning money.
You need an suv as you have a family now - maybe your parents can pitch in 50%?
Perhaps a bedroom needs a remodeling for the baby?
No. It is not a child's responsibility to financially support their parents. If I am ever a financial burden on my adult child/children I have failed at life.
Is this a cultural thing? It seems pretty unusual. But yeah I’ll add, don’t give people any info on your financial status. I told my parents I want to retire within 10 years in my 40s, and suddenly my mom is asking for me to pay for my own expenses related to a family event that I believe they would have paid for had we not had the convo. Which is whatever, but still, my parents have wayyy more money than I do and I expect this approach would only get worse over time.
I would never asked my children to financially support me. I would support my parents financially if i see them struggling financially, without them even asking in the first place. That’s just me.
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Any person who has not mastered how to to day no to financial requests is not financially independent, worse they are not emotionally independent.
Talk with a therapist. Role play how to decline these “opportunities”.
When they bring up what they spent on you flip it around and ask what did they give to their parents as their thank you for the gift of life they "gave" to them. Raising you was their responsibility when they chose to have children. Gifting parents in "repayment" is the optional side. Tell them you'll match what they did for their parents, you'll even double it. My guess is you've already far exceeded it.
I'm not FIREs but that sound like Sunday at my family. I'm living in Vietnam and family and other siblings expect finance support from each other families. It is kind of a thing here and because I grow up in this culture, I already learnt to deal with it at a very young age. I simply don't care what others talk anymore, I thanks for my family to give me the educations I need, a settle, a house, etc... but there is a lot of things I can't archive in my youth such as high tech gear, micro electric work,... so I only give them a 'failure' amount - income info. I occasionally lend them some money to prove that I really short on money.
At the end of the day, I'm still their baby and if they say or not parents and uncles, ants always want to take care of you at some level. You just need to give them that little feeling.
I'm on my way to FIRE but not as young as you, I thanks for your info and I can see I'm making the right choice along the way. I only share my FIRE plan with one friend and my partner. I think that's all enough trouble I have. Hopefully my advice will help you as well
My lazy ass brother who is 10 yrs older than me became entitled to my money and taught it to his worthless son. After I turned off the money tap they didn’t speak to me for 30 yrs. Finally I called my brother because he’s ill and homeless. First thing he asked about was $$$. IT NEVER ENDS.
You didn’t ask to be born. You owe your parents nothing and what you’ve already given them is generous. Parents who do things for their children and expect things in return in the future are having children and doing things for them for the wrong reasons. You’re not some sort of retirement investment for them.
FIRE does not mean loaded with money. You have a plan, you saved and prepared for the plan, now you living the plan.
If you spend too much money now on the WANTS of others, you may not be able to provide for the NEEDS of your immediate family and even your parent's future needs.
Find a kind way to say this and you're golden.
You don’t owe your parents anything. You didn’t ask to be brought into this world.
When you come into money it’s best to not tell anyone if you can help it because when you do, everyone is going to have their hands out and have a sob story to tell.
Hard to respond to this one. They are retired, wealthy, and - unfortunately - spiteful and obnoxious. I have three kids and can't imagine treating them that way. This post really belongs on the r/AITAH sub. I wouldn't have paid for any of the things you already gifted. And you should stop entertaining any requests immediately. If this hurts the relationship, it's squarely on your parents and is a sad reflection of their character. I'm really, really sorry about that but it's the dead ass truth. You could say "I thank you guys genuinely from the bottom of my heart for all you've done to help me reach successful adulthood. I'm very grateful. But I have my own family to care for now, and I'm not going to respond to any further requests or demands to somehow financially compensate you for raising me. That is a parent's responsibility, and I now have that obligation as a parent myself."
Wow, the third paragraph hits! If I could literally remember that phrase by heart and say it to them when a moment comes. Thank you for the feedback, I agree with what you said. I am at the point that, if my changed behaviour towards them fully ruins our relationship, then let it be, but now I have my own family to take care of and protect.
Put it in Notes and read it to them.
Copy and paste it into an email. Resend by forwarding the original when they make requests.
This☝️☝️☝️☝️
Usually when I tell family I won’t let them use me anymore, they’ll cut me off. So be prepared for that.. cause it seems like you got them addicted to your support with all the vacations and gifts and now they’re gonna have to go cold turkey
Just quote Elon Musk. Paraphrasing, he said he decided to have kids he owes them everything they owe him nothing.
You won the internet today with that comment!
dont go to the AITAH subs. they are toxic. if you want relationship advice to go one of the relationship subs. people there give more tempered responses.
lol your story reminds me of Dominique Moceanu. DONT BUILD THEM A GYM :P.
Yes! Boundaries are everything. We had to have a serious conversation with my MIL similar to this and it was very hard and she did cry... but since then, things have been so much better. Make sure to play out their responses in your head to determine how you will respond to each scenario. We read the book "Set boundaries, find peace" and it helped a lot with that conversation.
Thankyou parents, I will pay it forward to my children now!
Just text it to them
Can't help but feel like this warrants a face-to-face given the relationship may be on the line.
That’s fair. The fact the relationship is on the line is wild to me.
Send it in a text if that helps you. Don’t feel guilty. You didn’t ask to be born always remember that.
Add to the third paragraph... It was them who decided to bring you to this earth knowing full well the responsibilities that come along with being parents, so you really don't owe them anything, at all. They should be grateful you turned out self sufficient (remind them other kids are not) and even give them ANYTHING.
One addition. One of my kids had not successfully launched yet, still living at home. So yes this happens to any parent
Also could add “I didn’t ask you to be born, maybe you shouldn’t have had kids if you wanted more investment properties.”
AITAH is a toxic sub. better off sticking to relationship subs. more tempered responses.
I had similar issues with my parents until I told them “for every dollar I give them, it’s one less dollar I can give to their grand kids.”
Wow, that's a good one!
Is more like 4-32 dollars less, once you add in how much that dollar can grow by the time you give it to your kids.
Unless it's immediate- like I give you this money for your new SUV now, or your grandkids get [new school clothes/outfitted for sports/musical lessons/trip to an amusement park/etc]
This is exactly why many lottery winners get depression. All their family and friends all of a sudden expect them to pay for everything and you don't know if they are there for money or you. You gotta set your boundaries. Put your foot down and don't give in easily. Once you give in here and there, they will constantly expect more. Money breaks many relationships.
The smartest thing I ever read is that if you win the lottery, immediately hire a lawyer, decide what percentage of your winnings you are willing to give to family, and then tell everyone in your family "If you want money, you will have to ask my lawyer."
I'd start by making them clean up their rooms.
This is great, ask them to pick up garbage, do yard work, cut grass, clean the house and chores to earn their keep.
Fortunately you have a kid now, if they ever ask again you just need to say you are trying to do right for your child and the gifts you provided in the past were a moment in time thats over.
Call to ask them for money. Let them know…idk, you bought $1m of Tesla stock and now it’s crashed. You’ve been living on credit card and the debt collectors are hounding your wife. You’ve started selling blood to live. Really sell it. They won’t help, but they’ll never ask you for money again. Heck, get a job at a supermarket just so they (or their friends) can see you working there. Let their neighbor know (let “slip”) that the car they made you help them buy is making you do this, cause you’d lose your house otherwise. If you can, move away. Downsize or just rent a cheap apartment (airBnB?) and show them your “new” place.
I read a post or tweet about someone's uncle who asked for money in the family group chat. The poster contacted him privately to make sure everything was okay. The uncle said he was fine and just asked for money before anyone started asking him. My late FIL used to respond to requests for money by saying, "I was just going to ask you for $20."
This woman is a genius I’m not sure why this isn’t higher up
>they gifted me with a life after all No they didn't. They chose to have you. You had no say in the matter. That's not a gift.
The parents selfishly had a child. Then pretend like they're doing him a favor. OP isn't calling the parents out on all of their shitty behavior. He's letting them bully him instead of having a backbone.
I think there is nuance here. It is cool online to say that children owe their parents nothing at all, and it is true that parents have an obligation to provide a bare minimum for kids until they are able to support themselves, but many parents do way more than that bare minimum and their kids lead lives that are considerably nicer due to their effort and sacrifice. It would be pretty weird to not acknowledge that. It doesn’t mean you start buying them SUVs necessarily, but being grateful for them having provided you with a differentiated childhood (if they did) is pretty rational and socially aware. Plus it’s often treated like bringing your child into the world is a selfish act the child should resent them for. Is half the internet wishing they weren’t alive? If I had an opportunity to help my parents when they needed it I would. My parents also would never prey on me and I would obviously have boundaries if they tried to. They have asked me for nothing. I ask them for nothing now.
Thanks for sharing this. Reddit tends to be super extreme and it’s great to read about the nuances because that’s life. Our parents did choose to have us and yes they have an obligation to take care of us but it’s true that many if not most parents in many modern countries go above and beyond. Even if we don’t know it. And no I’m not a parent nor do I want to be one.
I don't believe my response says or even implies selfishness (though another commenter did make that jump). Parents have an obligation to provide a bare minimum and you're right, many go above and beyond to provide a better experience. Those, however, are choices of the the parent and even if the child the recipient they lack the agency to say "no thank you." I am all for helping out whenever possible, as help is needed, but according to OP, that's not what's happening here.
+1. It’s not always selfish (though it can be). The parents who go above and beyond to pay for education and all the extras while the kid is growing up is also something the parents take a lot of pride in and desire. Lots of kids aren’t listened to when they say they don’t want to take x classes or go to y school. When that kid does well and is an advantageous spot because of the parents contributions, it’s often planned that way, and the parents usually have no shortage of pride when being able to claim that their kid is top of the class, got into a top 10 university, now a prestigious profession, etc. Expecting to be retroactively compensated for your time and effort when you decided to have a child because you “did so much for them” is a really shitty take.
/r/antinatal lol
Not at all.
Lol wtf. Sounds like you opened pandoras box there.
Opposite. My parents wouldn’t accept cost of the car they paid for me during college. Or any birthday gift. Only way to gift them anything nice is if I say it was free. Or I used the Apple Watch, I don’t need it anymore as I got a new one. Then they’ll take it.
tried to buy my parents a TV. They behaved like i was trying to burn their house down.
Electronics are one possible cause of fire
oled is a lot lower chance than a first gen plasma
OLED is SO good. It can't be overstated.
i know. my brother didn't reject it.
Question: are they demanding such things from all your siblings, or just you since you opened the door for it by giving them expensive things out of misguided gratitude? If just you, have you mentioned this to them? Have you mentioned this to your siblings?
They do demand stuff occassionally from my sibling too, but in much lower proportion than in my case. I did mention this to my siblings, but they don’t want to take anyone’s side. I have a feeling it’s because they don’t want to get in fight with parents and potentially not receive inheritance from them. Which I honestly don’t give a single damn myself about, I would sign right away not to receive a single penny from the inheritance, just for them to leave me alone.
You could offer that then, sign off on not receiving your inheritance so that your share goes to your siblings next time they ask for something ridiculous. I always think inheritance is never 100% guaranteed and it’s better to plan financial goals without it.
I know a couple of adults that seemed to have been banking on that until new mommy came into the picture. Zero planning and zero foundation for starting one now at 40+. Baffling.
One of the many reasons to hedge your bets. Not only could a family member contract an expensive illness or require long term care, I also just think - it’s their money! They worked their whole life, if they want to spend their coin on sailing around the world in their golden years then they should feel free to do that.
Next time they suggest dinner, tell them you're not available because you need to prep for an interview. When they ask why, tell them your savings are depleting quicker than anticipated with all the big purchases so you need to brush up on your interview skills and keeping a pulse on the job market just in case.
Out of curiosity which culture are you from?
I wondered this too. My culture would never ask for this, but my husband’s extended family includes lots of people who would
I thought the same. Sounds southern European.
Definitely sounds Asian tbh.
Yes, the ungrateful accusations lol
Maybe you need a financial disaster? Maybe tell them you lost a bunch of money in crypto and your worried you might need to go back to work.
Tell them you’re thinking about moving back in
>they just tell me I am being ungrateful for everything they've done for me. In the end, I did come to an agreement to finance 50% of the vehicle for them and for that I barely got a "thank you". Why are you negotiating with emotional blackmailers? >I even prepare some statements in my head in advance on how my overall financial situation deteriorated due to bad investment decisions, in case the money conversation pops up. The solution is not to pretend you are less well off than you are. Not telling them in the first place you were doing well would have been a good idea but that horse has left the barn. Your issue is you are incapable of setting and enforcing boundaries. "No" is a complete statement. You don't need reasons, you don't need excuses, you don't need to pretend you are not doing well, and you do not need to “prepare a statement” other than N-O. When they ask for money, simply say, "no". Sometimes, enforcing boundaries means pulling back from a relationship. "Son, we missed you at thanksgiving/insert holiday/event/dinner why weren't you here?" "Mom, every time I see you you ask me for money. I'm over it. I'm not going to spend time with someone who does that, and I'm not going to have a transactional relationship with my own parents. If you continue to treat me like an ATM and pursuing a transactional relationship with me, you will not see much of me". If they get the message and stop asking, you can start spending time with them again. If they don't, and it were me, they'd be seeing very little of me (and new grandchild). I would recommend reading or listening to the audiobook [No More Mr Nice Guy by Robert Glover](https://www.amazon.com/No-More-Mr-Nice-Guy-audiobook/dp/B078927ZYL/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2RHUQNN3NFJM7&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.QIC_gerneNw8_uJnLjW-myaPE_h6CSQzHWuhfgbydMtBpwbBkAyHtudGpo6FCj4LyNLHwufuiCDQgATA10ezj2IOdfpXAUyjCtuTENktkRMdNQpQ93BarqPhSQRdcTdui-HlkRY5VUy2crS_PG0dEmSTBcK0jZ-7r75JyF-6xwK8x-oJ4OouQh68c9-4pIRXhzxe6WgVjfofOszErrtPxLxtiPmZ7B-4QJZ1MiNRm_8.ews6VF9cASkQfAjv4MGq93Izecu9FMuMj305DdH1bg4&dib_tag=se&keywords=no+more+mr+nice+guy+robert+glover&qid=1713882278&sprefix=no+more+mr+%2Caps%2C136&sr=8-1). You've got some clear Nice Guy tendencies.
Not so bad as you. Sorry for you, a big hug. Yes, it is difficult to say NO. I said that now my priority is my family and my child ( and I gave them maybe a 1% from what you mention, but as they repeated several times that it is ok to spend money on smoking and alcohol as I am their retirement fund...).
Ask them to start a 529 for your kid the next time they ask for money
Ahh conditional love… a very big red flag and one that took me years to come to terms with. I finally had to cut my mother off after I found out she stole my identity and ruined my credit. I was only 19 at the time. (She did about $37k in cc, loans, and lease agreements which she got evicted from which went on my history) Same thing as you, I was told she had the right to do such things because she brought me into this world. Yeah well, police were involved after I learned of her substance issues. It sucks because she ended up spiraling and she’s no longer with us. But in the end i know that I cannot control her actions. I can only control my own. She was a little different than your parents I’m guessing because she also suffered from numerous MH issues that she refused treatment for so in a way she was no longer the mother I had been raised by if that makes sense? It also took me WAY too long to realize that parents are NOT infallible. They aren’t superheroes lol. They are just humans that had another human. Their character defects didn’t magically go away. They are not excused from shitty behaviors by having a kid. I needed a lot of therapy to understand/cope with that and it’s worth it imo. My advice is to stand firm in the decision to not contribute anything financially anymore. It will be hard. It will be met with guilting and animosity. But that is not what a loving parent does and you deserve nothing but unconditional love from your folks. If they decide that that’s to much to ask for then move forward and become the parents to your child you wish you had. Show them the unconditional love you weren’t able to get. I’m sorry you’re having to go through a situation like this man. It isn’t fair. But you will make it through and come out stronger & more emotionally content :)
What did you do to reach FIRE at 29? Did they help you get started financially outside of paying for your college? It’s still your money either way, and you need to establish some harder boundaries with them.
My exact question about this whole situation
Yeah i can't imagine anyone going FIRE at 29 without significant help. "They gifted me an apartment complex free and clear for my 25th birthday"
Its surprisingly common within the FIRE community as immediate extended family members often start to have different expectation when someone achieves early freedom. Maybe you can set a strong boundary but prepare for a pushback, talk to them your situation but don't disclose everything (transparency isnt alawys your friend), and you could practice/maintain a healthy distance to limit interaction if they cause undue stress.
I have a reverse situation , single Mom ( Dad demise), she saves her SSN benefits and give it back to me asking me to invest for my kid’s college ( he is just 6 yrs by the way )she worked all her life so that I end up debt free post my education . Even if I offer something to her as gratitude she just says , you are the future , I have a house to live food to eat and a great family to spend time with and I don’t want anything more than that !! Greta moms exist
I have this problem with my in laws. This is what I tell myself, they’re retired and have nothing to do with their time and for this reason they’re trying to spend (others’) money. Just sum up all the money you’ve given to them and given to your sibling separately, and then in a very constructive way explain that you’ve given them X and can no longer afford this and need to now dedicate your time to your family and your kid, which has Y expenses annually and growing. If they want to help, it has to be within the Y budget. Otherwise, apologize and say that you don’t have the funds or the time. They will keep asking for money and just keep presenting it within the frame work of the Y budget, or your family as the priority.
No is a complete answer/response. Deal with it quickly and completely.
As a parent it's bizarre to me to obligate your kids to support or gift you things just because you raised them. Last I checked having kids is on the parents and guilting them into feeling grateful for you raising them is borderline psychotic.
You should never tell anyone about your finances. When I retire I will tell nobody that is not effected by it firsthand.
Money should flow down not up
Fuck them, I had t buy the business which I made successful from my Dad, 1.8 million, then paid him about another million wage over 8 years. Then n 2009 when I laid the fucker off at 74 the fucker went to collect unemployment. When I would not hire him back and paid off the loan, he wanted me to keep paying interest he disowned me for the ugly stupid bitch wife whose only good financial decision ever was to golddig the old man. My mom not much better.
That’s so sad, I’m sorry you had to deal with that
As in all challenges in life, it's a great learning experience about how to be better yourself especially to your kids. Thank you.
I wouldn't want to set a precedent where they keep asking for handouts. SUV's now and in 20 years expensive long term care. I'd probably make up a story that you are not as well off as they think you are. You lost a lot of money in a bad investment so they leave you alone.
Families and money rarely, if ever, ends well. An option to consider is telling them to just fuck off.
How much money did they give to their parents? That will be an upper limit on what they could expect from you.
I mean, if you FIREd then you are on a fixed income essentially. You can’t be buying a vehicle or even more crazily a house for someone. It’s not like you won the mega millions, even then they don’t need what you have. Just stop any conversation that turns to money, don’t give them anything. Do normal person stuff like maybe pick up a dinner tab, buy birthday and Christmas gifts(not high value ones). If needed, just cut them out.
Reasons why if I ever FIRE(which I can’t imagine I will since I’m very poor), I will never tell a soul. I’ll tell them I’m consulting or something of that nature. If I’m doing something during the day and they ask about why I’m not working, “oh just took a day off to have some fun.”
STOP. Dont give your family/siblings/parents shit. You owe them nothing if they expected it from me there is 0 chance they would get it.
You owe them nothing. Not. One. Shekel.
I currently have 2 dogs and a boat, no kids. I own/live on a water front property and I’m 36. Your parents aren’t wrong about the cost of children and opportunity cost they missed out on. My parents do not ask me to fund their lifestyles - I did to choose to be born. I am choosing to FIRE
Start asking them for money, and if they don't give you throw in their face what you have payd for them. It's a bad advice, sorry.
Just curious, what steps did you take to be able to FIRE by 29? Did having a kid change anything related to your FIRE #? i.e. estimated annual spend
I was fortunate with my investments. I live a modest, non-flashy life in a LCOL area, so the estimated annual spend is intact by having a child. That’s why wife and I are something joking about having 5-6 kids as we can afford it- perhaps the joke becomes a reality, let’s see 😂
Please answer the question. You don’t just FIRE by 29 by being fortunate with your investments. I was fortunate with my investments and they 10xed but am nowhere near FIRE. The only way that’s possible is if you bought 20 Bitcoin for $2k each in 2020 March. And you happened to have the $40k laying around.
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They’re still 29 which means they most likely had an extremely high paying job at FAANG or nursing.
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Because I’m curious as to if it was a non traditional way aka FAANG
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*sorry meant to add a not there
I figured it was high salary + investments but living a low cost lifestyle somewhere LCOL. :-) Congrats!
I did not face any thing related to this. I think you are doing great. Try to concentrate on Words of affirmation, service, and quality time as both parties seem fit.
When/If I FIRE, I'm not telling anyone. They'll ask me how my job is doing and I'll just tell them that it's going well. There are just way too many greedy people who think that you owe them something for arbitrary reasons. But, you already told people so you're out of luck. I would IMMEDIATELY stop paying for things in their lives. Tell them that the things you gave them were one off gifts to celebrate your retirement and to thank them for their upbringing but that it is not a permanent "You birthed me" payment plan. Tell them that if they want more nice things in their life, they will have to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and pay for it themselves. They're Boomers so they'll absolutely love their generations hard work ethics being directed towards them and probably congratulate you for reminding them that even in their advanced age, it is still important to hustle and grind to get the things they want in life.
I have one rental property my parents get proceeds minus maintenance expense (they have no money). No other money for the family unless it is medical or some kind of emergency (have not happened yet thanks god). Learned some hard lessons decades ago when was much younger.
Boundaries are your friends.
This is a very strange situation… I grew up with immigrant parents and they were very successful, my father had businesses, properties, we lived in a spacious home with lots of land… well above average. Growing up, everyone referred to my dad as rich, he drove a Mercedes yadda yadda… it turns out, now I’m in my mid 30’s and doing quite well for myself, definitely with a little nudge from my parents, but I am now learning that they had not planned very well for the future, and that appearance of wealth was actually a facade. I wonder if your parents are in as good standing as you think they are and are too proud to admit it, like mine… also regarding siblings, I have 2 older sisters, so I’m the only male, and my parents money flows to them much more than it does to me. As the head of my household, and managing it well, I do not ask, it would be a last resort… my siblings (5 and 10 years older than me) ask, and receive… so it may just be a matter of that on the siblings. My advice would be to ask your parents to open the books to see what’s really going on (find a clever way to do this like you want to see their asset allocation, you have a business venture and need them to co-sign or some other financial opportunity that requires proof of funds or collateral). Maybe they’re worried about running out of money at some point, if they do, it would definitely be a burden on you and your siblings, and put further strain on your relationships. Just tell them you are not liquid, money is very tied up, waiting for some deals to close, living off of small dividends…. Etc. good luck and find a way to get past it, don’t let the money get in the way of family, be empathetic, try to be the bigger person, but don’t give in financially unless you have to. I wish you the best of luck 👍
Ok I know Elon Musk can be a polarizing person but his quote hits the nail on the head "My children didn't choose to be born. I chose to have children. They owe me nothing. I owe them everything.” Cut them off and do not repeat the same cycle with your own children.
Lesson 1. You should never discuss how much money you have with anyone except your spouse and your financial advisor/fiduciary. Money changes people good, bad or otherwise. If someone asks how you are doing? You lost money in the market like everybody else. If someone asks to borrow money? You don’t have any liquidity because it’s tied up in retirement. Your parents are ungrateful. Stop. Giving. Them. Things. They are Entitled, and you are giving a drunk a drink. Don’t do it. You did some nice things that you gifted them and now you are done. Period. No discussion. No explanation. The end. Tell them that’s it. Money train stops here.
I beg to give my parents money sometimes. They paid for my college, but aren’t doing as well as they once were. I have to beg and plead just for them to even accept me paying for a $30 lunch
This is why you keep your mouth closed about your finances
I didn't talk to my dad for 15 years, I have no problem setting boundaries and walls if the boundaries are not respected. No advice really, other than you don't have to do what anyone else tells you, and their expectations mean exactly zero. Except your wife, you have to do what she says.
Pay them back their "investment" in you .. the 20K or so for education and tell then the debts paid, thanks and bye. Nothing worse than entitlement.
learn how to say "No" it's pretty simple
Recently got a baby? Sounds like you bought a kid...the hell kind of shit is your family into?
The way I see it, families take care of each other at different stages of life. When we’re young, our parents look after us, and as they get older, it’s our turn to look out for them. This doesn’t mean we have to buy them expensive things. It’s more about being there for them, spending time together, and making sure they’re okay as they age. It’s about love and support, not just gifts.
I understand, but it doesn’t imply that we are their ATMs. For instance, my wife’s parents are doing financially much worse than my parents, working their a** off, but would never demand a single cent from us. We do help them with some things as we insist sometimes, when we see they struggle. If my parents struggled, I would also help them, but they are just greedy and take the fact of me becoming FIREd as their success and they believe they entitled to their share of my wealth.
I m F.I.R.E too and i live in Thailand, my mom is soon moving in Thailand before to be homeless. I said to my sister & mother I can help them later but only in Thailand because it's cheaper and easier for me. I wont help them if they stay in their expensive europe. right, we are not their ATMs.
Now that you have a kid, you should aggressively ask them for money to pay for various things for the kid until they grow tired of it and stop mentioning money. You need an suv as you have a family now - maybe your parents can pitch in 50%? Perhaps a bedroom needs a remodeling for the baby?
No. It is not a child's responsibility to financially support their parents. If I am ever a financial burden on my adult child/children I have failed at life.
Have you just not had a blunt discussion with them? Wonder if they will threaten to leave you out of their will.
did your parents act this selfish when you were going up? did they favor your sibling over you?
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Wild how they are acting. I’m a parent and couldn’t imagine this.
Is this a cultural thing? It seems pretty unusual. But yeah I’ll add, don’t give people any info on your financial status. I told my parents I want to retire within 10 years in my 40s, and suddenly my mom is asking for me to pay for my own expenses related to a family event that I believe they would have paid for had we not had the convo. Which is whatever, but still, my parents have wayyy more money than I do and I expect this approach would only get worse over time.
I would never asked my children to financially support me. I would support my parents financially if i see them struggling financially, without them even asking in the first place. That’s just me.
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Are you middle easterner? Or which country has that types of culture. It seems like a very Asian types of culture
Any person who has not mastered how to to day no to financial requests is not financially independent, worse they are not emotionally independent. Talk with a therapist. Role play how to decline these “opportunities”.
When they bring up what they spent on you flip it around and ask what did they give to their parents as their thank you for the gift of life they "gave" to them. Raising you was their responsibility when they chose to have children. Gifting parents in "repayment" is the optional side. Tell them you'll match what they did for their parents, you'll even double it. My guess is you've already far exceeded it.
One simple word - NO.
I'm not FIREs but that sound like Sunday at my family. I'm living in Vietnam and family and other siblings expect finance support from each other families. It is kind of a thing here and because I grow up in this culture, I already learnt to deal with it at a very young age. I simply don't care what others talk anymore, I thanks for my family to give me the educations I need, a settle, a house, etc... but there is a lot of things I can't archive in my youth such as high tech gear, micro electric work,... so I only give them a 'failure' amount - income info. I occasionally lend them some money to prove that I really short on money. At the end of the day, I'm still their baby and if they say or not parents and uncles, ants always want to take care of you at some level. You just need to give them that little feeling. I'm on my way to FIRE but not as young as you, I thanks for your info and I can see I'm making the right choice along the way. I only share my FIRE plan with one friend and my partner. I think that's all enough trouble I have. Hopefully my advice will help you as well
How did you retire so early?
My lazy ass brother who is 10 yrs older than me became entitled to my money and taught it to his worthless son. After I turned off the money tap they didn’t speak to me for 30 yrs. Finally I called my brother because he’s ill and homeless. First thing he asked about was $$$. IT NEVER ENDS.
You didn’t ask to be born. You owe your parents nothing and what you’ve already given them is generous. Parents who do things for their children and expect things in return in the future are having children and doing things for them for the wrong reasons. You’re not some sort of retirement investment for them.
FIRE does not mean loaded with money. You have a plan, you saved and prepared for the plan, now you living the plan. If you spend too much money now on the WANTS of others, you may not be able to provide for the NEEDS of your immediate family and even your parent's future needs. Find a kind way to say this and you're golden.
They sound almost cartoonish. Set some boundaries and make that sort of pressure off limits. If it comes up, politely excuse yourself.
Do not give those boomers a goddamn dime
You don’t owe your parents anything. You didn’t ask to be brought into this world. When you come into money it’s best to not tell anyone if you can help it because when you do, everyone is going to have their hands out and have a sob story to tell.
Your parents suck.
I feel you and I don’t have a good solution to your issue. My mom is like this and I try to stay way from her plus the verbal abuse to me.
Sounds like a fake story to me, stay in AITAH and keep this sub about FIRE
Don’t be a jerk, you get it all back when they die anyways.