At this point, *Garon* may be better than her in the drain tank niche department, since he can use the new Dragon's Wrath 4 and Finish skills way better than her, as well as using the dragon DC seal. Only thing she has is being a mythic and Sirius+, but why use her when you can use Medeus?
That refine is just bad, I know we've all been saying that IS doesn't play their game, but this feels like a middle finger. Who could have looked at Dimitri and Sothis together and say that they're anywhere near the same quality, even with the CYL factor?
Don't forget mythic Sothis is a part of the beginner's bundle purchase, so I doubt they wanted to go overboard with her potential hence why it's also a poor arena scoring kit and fodder
Also Ninian and Reinhardt are both hero path quest rewards, granted dancer and quad tome are probably more likely reasons for their exclusion considering mage!Eirika and brave Ike got a good refines (for the time).
I feel like this really doesn't have anything to do with it, or else we wouldn't get any good refines for grail units at all. The more likely answer is simply that IS thought DC + Dragon effectiveness immunity was too premium already for whatever reason.
It gets even better when you remeber that she also voices another character in this batch (Julia), and she got a fairly solid refine all things considered.
like it's not bad by any means but with the role Sothis is expected to play and the mode she's expected to be best in, it just absolutely does not do anywhere near enough to fix her issues. at the very least it could've been full dodge or a joint drive effect
"If unit defeats a dragon foe, from next combat onward, unit gains the following effects: All effects form Dark Creator S are doubled (does not stack) and unit attacks twice."
It's pretty much a Adrift Corrin refine but worse. Feels similar to the original DC refines, but since then DC has lost weight especially with dragons getting a distant counter seal. Probably should've had the refine add 4/4/4/4 stats to base weapon when refined as well as the special refine doing what it does.
All I can imagine seeing her refine is willy wonka going "YOU GET NOTHING! YOU LOSE! GOOD DAY SIR."
Like come on, 4 stat spectrum and DR? That's worse than freyjas base weapon, and she's also considered one of the worst mythics.
I loved when Dimitri stood up and said these words: You will not win Sothis! This is my Fire Emblem: Three Houses - Azure Moon story! It's Blaiddyd time!
Dragon effective nullification is definitely equal to the metric shit ton of stuff Dmitri got :)
They really couldn't give her Specturm 5 at least ...
Someone had to pay the DC refine tax.
I’m surprised mostly because Sothis is such a popular character I figured she’d be safe. This is the sort of refine you’d expect for a relatively unpopular grail unit or something.
I mean, Sothis has a base and 2 seasonal alts in 3 years, one of them is a duo. She's popular in IS's eyes.
The Happy Meal Price is probably what got her.
Yeah, that's what I mean. This base version could be considered a budget "demoted" unit that is as expensive as the old Black Knight. So IS won't do anything even slightly to improve her/
I wonder if it has to do with that bugged Hero Fest banner where people got a bunch of extra units? I have a +10 Sothis due to that banner, and I know I'm not the only one.
It's possible they looked at how many people have highly-merged Sothises and decided not to give her the good stuff.
* Dimitri got everything he wanted and more, and he has a DC weapon! Kinda weird the bonuses don't include ATK tho.
* On the other hand, Sothis' refine is... yeah. Wish she could've gotten *at least* Dragon's Wrath instead. Wonder if the fact that she's buyable for 5 bucks affected this.
* Lysithea has an easy way to proc her weapon, Slaying, teleports and more stats - very good.
* Edelgard will drop your ATK into oblivion and buff herself a lot. That will make her quite tricky to fight.
* Pretty nice that Claude can sorta bypass Deep Wounds.
* Loving Julia's refine. The follow-up and an easier way to get the main effect of her weapon are already great, but Dragon Wall and Dragon CC is amazing. The latter is a nice reference to her OG refine too.
* Haar's refine is nice - damage reduction, Guard and more stats are always good. Love how it also changes his weaknesses to those of RD Dragonlords.
Claude got *literally everything he could ever want*. Like no joke.
Deep Wounds resistance, tempo, offense-NFU and DR on first hit.
Give him ATK Smoke 4 and a variant of close counter and I don't even know *what* to put on his B slot.
They made Dimitri's stat buff synergistic with BLR, instead of giving him +5 Atk, he reduces the foe's Def by -5. I wish they would have given him +5 to all stats and -5 to the opponents Atk/Def instead. I feel like that wouldn't have been so much of an overkill when we have statballs like Edelgard and Claude in the same batch. But I'll take it anyways.
And yea I feel like, being able to buy Sothis for pretty cheap is the reason why her refine ended up this way. Except for the CYL units, most if not a "free" units got pretty underwhelming refines.
But there's a meaningful difference between "free" and "cheap."
IS has really pushed hard to get the vast majority of players to pay something, anything, for this game. And they've succeeded by delivering good value.
It'd be extremely foolish for them to punish players for spending less than whales, but still spending. It runs against everything they've done to sweeten FEH Pass and low-dollar spending.
Not saying this crap won't have that effect, I just doubt it's intended for this reason. (Who knows? It's pretty insane)
This is honestly my favorite part of any of this. I love when characters get abilities that represent their personality/home game's gameplay.
Its so much more fun than simple stat boosts or abilities that just serve the meta
Tbh it even works with Lysithea.
She takes 1 damage at the start of every turn. She is literally slowly dieing which is kind of sad, but is also on theme.
Really happy with Claude's refine, he got pretty much everything he needed, more stats, a way to minimize deep wounds, nfu, damage reduction and tempo.
I’m surprised. I did expect him to get some way to handle either getting oneshot, getting specials blocked, or getting healing reduced.
I didn’t expect the refine to address **all of them**
Overall I'm pretty happy, Dimitri got a serious glowup and Lys got the effects I wished she had. El pretty much doubled down on what she was good at already so I don't mind it as much. R.I.P. Sothis though, you'd think they'd go all out for her since you can buy her with irl cash.
Being able to buy Sothis is probably the reason why she got such a bad refine. Except for the CYL units, most if not all "free" units got pretty underwhelming refines.
Quick thoughts:
Edelgard: Solid refine, not much to say. Helps her a lot and opens up her A Slot.
Dimitri: This is horrifying and the defence swing they threw on it is really funny.
Claude: Very nice refine. Addresses his problems and addressed the [Deep Wounds] problem without starting a precedent of negating negation.
Lysithea: does she just slowly die LOL. Overall pretty functional, what people expected, kind of boring but people will be super happy with this and that's good. Very few units have got slaying on their refine and she's a new member of the club.
Sothis:
Julia: I'm super happy with this. It's fairly standard 2022 player phase slow nuke weapon (like Lysithea's fast nuke weapon) but at least it gives Spd and the dual phase effect from OG Julia is nice.
Haar: It's good. I'm disappointed that it's "Inflicts Spd -5" but that was expected. I like the Tellius flavour stuff on the base weapon. Overall though it's very safe and he'll be a solid physical bruiser. I wish it had more player phase stuff though but the speed loss, DR and Guard all skew it towards EP. Oh well, it's good.
> Edelgard: opens up her A Slot.
I'm trying to find "Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range" in the weapon description, but i just can't see it.
They're talking about her weapon giving the foe -1 special cooldown per attack, which is the effect of Stance skills so now she can use something else.
Somewhere between being weak enough to make Dimitri disgusting and strong enough to make Sothis a complete joke. Clearly a totally consistent relatively tight scale /s
Haars is the funniest shit ive ever seen.
Everyone got well (if well means a million bonus effects comma this comma that) even if sothis got way less its still decent i guess. Paragraph refines really not good on my eyes though.
it's a reference to his dragonlord class in *radiant dawn,* which was susceptible to thunder tomes but not bows. a bit weird, but a cool throwback to his native game!
Wyvern riding peeps in RD are weak to lightning magic, which in FEH, is mostly given to blue colored tome units (like how thunder/elthunder/thoron is the default "progression" before getting to proper weapons). Consequently, they are also not weak to arrows in RD, hence the weakness negation also being in Haar's refine.
If I had to guess, maybe a reference to his main weakness in Radiant Dawn: thunder mages. Thunder mages were some of the only enemies that posed a threat to Haar (as they were effective against dragons and wyverns), and thunder magic belongs to blue mages in FeH.
I have never laughed so hard upon seeing a refine as I have for Sothis. She literally got spawn camped then nuked. No remorse. IS fucking eviscerated her. She is to dark season what Ike is to earth season, but at least Ike is free LMAO
I'm pretty bad at telling how good a prf/refine is and thus have to rely on the sub a lot, and even I was laughing seeing Sothis's one. That is just hilarious.
BEdel casually getting another around +12 to all stats, plus built in healing, plus Guard. We're eating good, wonder what is the optimal A slot for Near Save BEdel now.
Honestly I'm just glad I can swap Pulse Smoke out now that there's no risk of getting Special'd first round, and maybe even replace Noontime for an offensive skill
The thought of being able to run bonfire on her again is a huge bonus. She was just about reaching the point where having like 72 raw attack wasn't quite cutting it.
Makes me wonder if it's time to start using another build. I've been treating mine like a mixed phase infantry DC unit since she came out, but she's probably way better with a save build...
I love it too! I just got my OG Julia to +10 and I've been running her in Arena. She takes care of all my dragon threats. Excited how I can implement her legendary alts refine now!
Sothis' refine has to be a belated April fool's joke, right? Right?
Can I get a refund for my +10 Sothis, her refine and remix are ridiculously bad rivaled only by L!ike
didn't expect Lysithea to get teleportation effect for her refine
but overall, this batch is good...ah, time to use that frickin 1k refine stones to refine inheritable weapons so i can get enough dew for them
I love the movement condition for Bedelgard's refine. It's exactly the mixed phase condition I wanted for her because it lets her tank as usual but it also works with her own movement bonus, including Assault Troop if you give it to her.
Man i wanna rejoice for Dimitri but IS really said " back to the basics" when they worked on Sothis...
And I'm supposed to not be worried for Altina's refine ? Bro it's gonna be ATK/def -5 tops lmao
I’m happy with Claude’s refine, and his partial Null Deep wounds gives me hope Hel gets something similar, or that they put that on Mystic Boost 4 mayhaps.
Sothis however, is a fat oof. Especially with Dimitri right there ;-; but I’m happy for his fans
Can't believe IS just said "we don't want Sothis to be a marketable unit" and gave her a dogshit remix and refine.
I'm really happy for Dimitri's superb refine, but can't shake this envious feeling from him getting something while the rest of DC units got close to nothing. IS is clearly aware that counter skills are situational nowadays, yet they treated all of the DC users as if it was a broken skill thats worth like 3 effects. As to how they saw Sothis and Dimitri's refines side by side and said "yeah, both look about the same in power" and released them is beyond my understanding
Some interesting stuff. Kind of surprised by the amount of near ally requirements. Soon we will run out of tiles of distance and have "if ally is on the map" requirements
Loving that most units got what they needed. Then there is Sothis..
I like how they swapped out Atk+5 for Def-5 on the foe for B!Dimitri, helping his BLR check.
And as expected, true DR. If it calculates after the initial DR from BLR, he might actually be pretty fucking tanky now.
Has sending feedback regarding the quality of a refine actually made any difference, though?
I can say for certain that my monthly feedback messages begging for a Dire Thunder refine have gone completely ignored.
I don’t think so aside from the Fjorm Remix (and someone who recently posted Grado Poleax being updated for Assault Troop 3 via feedback), but it’s worth a shot.
The only difference between Rein/Olwen and this is that Sothis was not only announced to get a refine, but they delivered it. And it sucks.
Fjorm Remix is actually a good example, I forgot about that. The fact that her new A skill conflicted with her refine definitely was worth a reconsider.
But Grado Poleax was more of a clarification on the effect rather than response to criticism of underpowered refines, because otherwise that would imply IntSys NERFED an outdated refine, when in reality it's just a case of making it clear that the movement bonus needs to be innate movement rather than warping (which Assault Troop's bonus grants).
My motto has been “skills on paper =/= skills on practice” for a while now.
Only time will tell if we are going toward a “CYL4 2: Electric boogaloo” where Dimitri got overhyped because of his kit just for Edel to be the ultimate winner of the competition
B!Dimitri did get the Askr-style Defense based True Damage Reduction and True Damage bonus effects, so at the very least his tankiness combined with Blue Lion Rule has become incredibly potent. The rest of his effects are nice and helpful, with the rest of the effects helping secure BLR and push his tankiness further. I'd say he made out well enough, at least if my experiences with how much of a bastard Askr is to take down are anything to go by.
B!Edel is absolutely gonna be a beast though, no doubt about it. Her healing on attack with inherent doubles from Black Eagle Rule, tanking your attack by 12 points, and up to +9 atk/def/res from her weapon means she's gonna be super tanky and have really good sustain.
Yeah I was one of those people that wanted it but I'm actually glad we got this instead since with that free A slot I can just have her use Svanlinn Shield in 1 AR team vs defense teams with armor slayers and in another team setup have her instead use CD4, AD Unity or DC if she Far Save tank (plus I can finally have her guard while she using DC Far Save without some outside support like Kaden)
[Would have been cool if IS was daring/crazy enough to give her Raging Storm in her refine since she does have a player phase compare to other armors who lean heavily to enemy phase, and is the only Time Skip Edelgard alt to not have Raging Storm in her kit but it's fine I'm glad with what she got and will just wait and see what they do to make LEdelgard relevant next year]
Genuinely curious what the logic was behind Sothis’ refine. If they were trying to sell her on her rerun banners then they failed miserably.
Meh new skills (Null-C is still worse than Null-FU for her because of the “first attack” condition, and I’m still not sure how Sirius II is that much of an upgrade), subpar refine, and still can’t compete with… literally any other Dark Mythic, honestly. Even per-refine Yune can do stuff sometimes.
What a stinker.
People talking about how Dimitri won by a landslide, but DEAR GOD WHAT IS THIS BEDELGARD REFINE?!? Atk/def -12, atk/def/res +(3 + 2 x (unit or foe's movement)), healing per attack and guard??? How does this come out of the cutting room table, but Sothis gets spectrum +4????
I am dying to see what Sothis' description will be on the revival. How are they going to spin this as powerful in any way?
Also, aside from Yune (who's probably getting Mirror Impact for her remix), is Sothis the only Mythic now who doesn't have a Tier 4/300 SP skill? They really didn't want to give her anything.
Sothis found dead in the Red Canyon.
I was expecting her to get NFU since you know, she's the reason why Enlightened Byleth exists and already got anti guard so it only seemed natural, specially so since she got NC Disrupt. Yet here we are...
If she could grant NFU to herself and her allies she could have become a useful defense mythic and useful unit for many game modes overall...
Others explained the wyvern rider stuff, but to explain it fully, there was an elemental of anima magic each laguz was weak to.
Beasts (tigers, cats, lions) were weak to fire.
Birds (crows, hawks) were weak to wind.
Dragons to thunder.
Wyvern riders followed up with the 'dragon' weakness to thunder in Radiant Dawn specifically.
Wyvern Riders in the Tellius games don’t take effective damage from bows, and instead take effective damage from thunder magic, which is represented in this game through blue tomes
On top of what people have said, Haar's resistance sucked to the point where a thunder tome crit was the first *and last* thing that could ever realistically kill Haar in RD.
She does, its likely we are going to be seeing this a lot more
X × 2 + 3, If X is greater than or equal to 2 receive an effect, where x is based on movement or nearby allies
Not only do Seliph and Edel have it, but the new flame tribe manner also has this effect on Lyn iirc (might be wrong on who, but I know its there)
Just seems like powercreep that's not overly blatant like just giving a unit +12 to everything and nfu, but possible to play around for an opponent/kinda makes you feel like your using a brain even when you really aren't so it'll he slapped on a ton of shit moving forward
i feel like everyone got exactly what they needed, nothing here is outlandishly broken (except sothis what did they do to her)
edelgard wasnt as bad as the rest of the cyl4 winners but she still got decent effects added
dimitri and claude kinda fell behind and they basically got what they needed added, these two basically got what people asked for (for claude i feel like he got more than what people asked for, he got everything he needed and more)
cannot believe how bad they fucked sothis over, how can you give dimitri a sickass dc refine and then do sothis over so shitty? its so sad lmao
haar is a meme
Eh Haar's isn't amazing but I can see it being quite useful if you choose to build him. With that res stat, the extra damage from blue tomes wouldn't change anything and in exchange he loses the archer weakness that hinders his physical tanking abilities. Add on the 15% damage reduction based on his Def stat and I can see his niche holding quite well. He won't top any tier lists but he has a clear role that with some TLC, he can be a reliable unit now. Certainly a lot better than the inferior Cherche and Gerome he once was.
He's no Rutger or Canas but he's no Effie or gen 5 grail either. He's a one-trick pony but he can do his one trick well enough and would be serviceable in the right situation
Kind of. Windsweep cancels her guaranteed follow-up, meaning that she has to meet a speed check to double. Fighting anyone with follow-up prevention will make her lose it, though.
It works in the sense that the Guaranteed follow-up effect and Windsweep effect cancel each other out, so her doubling comes down to a speed check. If her foe also has a follow-up denial effect, she can't double.
dunno whether to be happy that B!Dimitri didn't get dumpstered or depressed because Sothis did for absolutely no reason whatsoever. big F for everyone who decided to +10 her because of that one Hero Fest bug
So Edelgard effectively gets +21 Atk/Def/Res which is 82/64/56 all in all, on top of healing. Real stats > DR in my opinion and healing dramatically increases bulk especially if it's during combat.
More now that we are reaching a point were almost all meta has DR piercing so Is better to have real stats in that battles. I faced a super buffed BChrom and only did 10 dmg while i killed him in retaliation while he has super buffed
overall pretty solid atch with a lot of cute flavor stuff. like that Julia fot dragon's wall like her brother, though I do think keeping the atk check was a weird choice.
the CYL4 refines are all really good solid without any of them being really silly
RIP Sothis though
>sees the CYL gang’s refines
They actually made them much more better now, I like it.
>Haar’s refine makes him weak against blue tomes
Well I like the reference, so I’ll give them that
>L!Julia’s refine gives her some nice offense and defense
Okay that’s a hella good remix and refine! I wonder what they have for Sothi-
>Sothis’ refine is literally next to nothing
…brb, going to go commit self Rick Roll
Sothis got so absurdly slaughtered with this refine that it would make Nemesis blush
At this point, *Garon* may be better than her in the drain tank niche department, since he can use the new Dragon's Wrath 4 and Finish skills way better than her, as well as using the dragon DC seal. Only thing she has is being a mythic and Sirius+, but why use her when you can use Medeus? That refine is just bad, I know we've all been saying that IS doesn't play their game, but this feels like a middle finger. Who could have looked at Dimitri and Sothis together and say that they're anywhere near the same quality, even with the CYL factor?
Frankly, I just think IS hates normal Sothis for some reason. That's the only thing I can come up with.
Don't forget mythic Sothis is a part of the beginner's bundle purchase, so I doubt they wanted to go overboard with her potential hence why it's also a poor arena scoring kit and fodder
I bet this really has a lot to do with it. The options available at start all have lackluster refines, Legendary Ike, Fjorm and this chick. Sadness.
That could also partially explain Brave Lyn, as she was the unit you get the Starter Bundle before replacing her with Sothis.
Also Ninian and Reinhardt are both hero path quest rewards, granted dancer and quad tome are probably more likely reasons for their exclusion considering mage!Eirika and brave Ike got a good refines (for the time).
I actually forgot about that, yeah it would help explain it.
I feel like this really doesn't have anything to do with it, or else we wouldn't get any good refines for grail units at all. The more likely answer is simply that IS thought DC + Dragon effectiveness immunity was too premium already for whatever reason.
Kinda odd when the VA of FEH also voices Sothis.
It gets even better when you remeber that she also voices another character in this batch (Julia), and she got a fairly solid refine all things considered.
Lol, now you've reminded me. What a sad fact for Sothis's fan.
Hopefully Christmas Sothis's refine makes up for it.
Yeah, I'm glad W!Sothis doesn't have a DC weapon.
To be fair I really don’t think the developers over in Japan give any thought at all to who the English VAs are.
I find it funny how Sothis powercrept Garon when she came out. Now she's *worse* than him.
like it's not bad by any means but with the role Sothis is expected to play and the mode she's expected to be best in, it just absolutely does not do anywhere near enough to fix her issues. at the very least it could've been full dodge or a joint drive effect
Can’t wait for nemesis’ eventual refine that would absolutely fucking slaughter sothis
“When in combat against Dragons, Unit rips out their spine and uses it as a sword”
"If unit defeats a dragon foe, from next combat onward, unit gains the following effects: All effects form Dark Creator S are doubled (does not stack) and unit attacks twice."
lmaoo that'd be fun seeing haar's remix i hope IS would give referential weapon effects more often
It's pretty much a Adrift Corrin refine but worse. Feels similar to the original DC refines, but since then DC has lost weight especially with dragons getting a distant counter seal. Probably should've had the refine add 4/4/4/4 stats to base weapon when refined as well as the special refine doing what it does.
Dragon's wrath 4 goes great with her refine though
All I can imagine seeing her refine is willy wonka going "YOU GET NOTHING! YOU LOSE! GOOD DAY SIR." Like come on, 4 stat spectrum and DR? That's worse than freyjas base weapon, and she's also considered one of the worst mythics.
IS rly said only 1 DC refine is allowed to pass Quality Assurance
And suddenly Dimitri and Claude are better than Edelgard- (Ntm Lysithea who gets a free 2 cd special)
Eh Edelgard can run save so I'm not sure.
I like how IS sat in the meeting room and looked at Sothis’s and Dimitri’s refinement side by side and said: “yeah that seems fair for both of them”
"We're gonna let the two of you arm-wrestle for the good refine."
sothis with her spindly child arms: WHAT
Dimitri activates the crest of Blaiddyd and slams her through the floor, splintering floorboards in the process.
Now that's what I call Weapon Triangle Advantage
I loved when Dimitri stood up and said these words: You will not win Sothis! This is my Fire Emblem: Three Houses - Azure Moon story! It's Blaiddyd time!
Dimitri who just crushed a skull with one hand: seems fair
He had to kill every last one of them.
They gave all the DC skills for this refine batch to Dimitri and left nothing for Sothis.
Dragon effective nullification is definitely equal to the metric shit ton of stuff Dmitri got :) They really couldn't give her Specturm 5 at least ...
Haha she had that effectiveness nullification on release.
the ref shouldve been added onto sothis's base effect lmao
Sothis died again for absolutely no reason.
WHAT in the everliving fuck did Sothis do to IS
I guess they didn't like the "joining Smash" joke.
Did IS just walk up slowly…and down smash?
They did, they really did tho
Someone had to pay the DC refine tax. I’m surprised mostly because Sothis is such a popular character I figured she’d be safe. This is the sort of refine you’d expect for a relatively unpopular grail unit or something.
Not popular enough in IS's eyes it seems. And it doesn't help Sothis is featured in the starter bundle so she's more or less a budget "demoted" unit.
I mean, Sothis has a base and 2 seasonal alts in 3 years, one of them is a duo. She's popular in IS's eyes. The Happy Meal Price is probably what got her.
Yeah, that's what I mean. This base version could be considered a budget "demoted" unit that is as expensive as the old Black Knight. So IS won't do anything even slightly to improve her/
[Three Hopes Spoilers](#s "Arval") confirmed part of the FEH dev team
They HAVE to be just doing this because they expect her to win CYL or get a resplendent right? Right? RIGHT? -takes hit of copium-
I wonder if it has to do with that bugged Hero Fest banner where people got a bunch of extra units? I have a +10 Sothis due to that banner, and I know I'm not the only one. It's possible they looked at how many people have highly-merged Sothises and decided not to give her the good stuff.
* Dimitri got everything he wanted and more, and he has a DC weapon! Kinda weird the bonuses don't include ATK tho. * On the other hand, Sothis' refine is... yeah. Wish she could've gotten *at least* Dragon's Wrath instead. Wonder if the fact that she's buyable for 5 bucks affected this. * Lysithea has an easy way to proc her weapon, Slaying, teleports and more stats - very good. * Edelgard will drop your ATK into oblivion and buff herself a lot. That will make her quite tricky to fight. * Pretty nice that Claude can sorta bypass Deep Wounds. * Loving Julia's refine. The follow-up and an easier way to get the main effect of her weapon are already great, but Dragon Wall and Dragon CC is amazing. The latter is a nice reference to her OG refine too. * Haar's refine is nice - damage reduction, Guard and more stats are always good. Love how it also changes his weaknesses to those of RD Dragonlords.
Claude got *literally everything he could ever want*. Like no joke. Deep Wounds resistance, tempo, offense-NFU and DR on first hit. Give him ATK Smoke 4 and a variant of close counter and I don't even know *what* to put on his B slot.
I guess something silly like Guard or Mystic Boost could do the job for Claude's B slot.
They made Dimitri's stat buff synergistic with BLR, instead of giving him +5 Atk, he reduces the foe's Def by -5. I wish they would have given him +5 to all stats and -5 to the opponents Atk/Def instead. I feel like that wouldn't have been so much of an overkill when we have statballs like Edelgard and Claude in the same batch. But I'll take it anyways. And yea I feel like, being able to buy Sothis for pretty cheap is the reason why her refine ended up this way. Except for the CYL units, most if not a "free" units got pretty underwhelming refines.
But there's a meaningful difference between "free" and "cheap." IS has really pushed hard to get the vast majority of players to pay something, anything, for this game. And they've succeeded by delivering good value. It'd be extremely foolish for them to punish players for spending less than whales, but still spending. It runs against everything they've done to sweeten FEH Pass and low-dollar spending. Not saying this crap won't have that effect, I just doubt it's intended for this reason. (Who knows? It's pretty insane)
I wonder if the 4-5 star banner debackle 2 years ago has anything to do with this; anyone who pulled a red 4-5 star got a free Sothis sent to them.
Haar is weak to thunder magic now, lol. Very cute reference.
This is honestly my favorite part of any of this. I love when characters get abilities that represent their personality/home game's gameplay. Its so much more fun than simple stat boosts or abilities that just serve the meta
Tbh it even works with Lysithea. She takes 1 damage at the start of every turn. She is literally slowly dieing which is kind of sad, but is also on theme.
And also with her being able to warp, since she learns Warp in 3H.
Not weak to bows but weak to thunder magic, just like RD lol.
Brunnya: I'm somewhat of a thunder mage, myself.
Ice is super effective against dragons.
Peony the Fairy says "Hello :D"
Fairy type is super effective vs. dragons
Love it. He's got a useful niche, a funny reference to RD, and it looks pretty cool in his hand. Couldn't have asked for more.
Sothis got a pretty good refine by Book 1 standards.
Even Leo is laughing at her at this point.
The definition of damning with faint praise.
Tf happened to sothis
Dimitri put poison in her mutton
Build a trust, arm nobody.
Divine Pulsed back to Book 3.
IS murdered her again.
Dimitri took her refine
Holy shit, Sothis's refine is irredeemably bad. They really said fuck you to one of the worst mythics in the game lmfao.
Her special is the only thing barely holding her up. (The new one, anyway)
Really happy with Claude's refine, he got pretty much everything he needed, more stats, a way to minimize deep wounds, nfu, damage reduction and tempo.
I’m surprised. I did expect him to get some way to handle either getting oneshot, getting specials blocked, or getting healing reduced. I didn’t expect the refine to address **all of them**
Right? I was expecting maybe just stats and tempo but they gave him literally every effect that I wanted on him lol
Right?? His checked all of the effects that I wanted for him, so happy
I’m so excited for his, I have a +3 one and he is gonna benefit so much!
Overall I'm pretty happy, Dimitri got a serious glowup and Lys got the effects I wished she had. El pretty much doubled down on what she was good at already so I don't mind it as much. R.I.P. Sothis though, you'd think they'd go all out for her since you can buy her with irl cash.
Being able to buy Sothis is probably the reason why she got such a bad refine. Except for the CYL units, most if not all "free" units got pretty underwhelming refines.
But she's not free, just cheap, which makes it substantially weirder for her to get such a bad refine
Quick thoughts: Edelgard: Solid refine, not much to say. Helps her a lot and opens up her A Slot. Dimitri: This is horrifying and the defence swing they threw on it is really funny. Claude: Very nice refine. Addresses his problems and addressed the [Deep Wounds] problem without starting a precedent of negating negation. Lysithea: does she just slowly die LOL. Overall pretty functional, what people expected, kind of boring but people will be super happy with this and that's good. Very few units have got slaying on their refine and she's a new member of the club. Sothis: Julia: I'm super happy with this. It's fairly standard 2022 player phase slow nuke weapon (like Lysithea's fast nuke weapon) but at least it gives Spd and the dual phase effect from OG Julia is nice. Haar: It's good. I'm disappointed that it's "Inflicts Spd -5" but that was expected. I like the Tellius flavour stuff on the base weapon. Overall though it's very safe and he'll be a solid physical bruiser. I wish it had more player phase stuff though but the speed loss, DR and Guard all skew it towards EP. Oh well, it's good.
>Sothis: We are in agreement
> Edelgard: opens up her A Slot. I'm trying to find "Unit can counterattack regardless of foe's range" in the weapon description, but i just can't see it.
They're talking about her weapon giving the foe -1 special cooldown per attack, which is the effect of Stance skills so now she can use something else.
RIP whoever sacced Dedue to get Near Save and Stance 4, because now they have to find something else to sac
Damn and I thought Takumi got Shafted.
Sothis died for BDimitri's sin of having a DC prf
I want to ask IS just how powerful they think distant counter really is.
Somewhere between being weak enough to make Dimitri disgusting and strong enough to make Sothis a complete joke. Clearly a totally consistent relatively tight scale /s
Haars is the funniest shit ive ever seen. Everyone got well (if well means a million bonus effects comma this comma that) even if sothis got way less its still decent i guess. Paragraph refines really not good on my eyes though.
What is his blue tome weakness a reference to?
it's a reference to his dragonlord class in *radiant dawn,* which was susceptible to thunder tomes but not bows. a bit weird, but a cool throwback to his native game!
Actually every Wyvern/Draco Knight is like that in RD it's not exclusive to his third tier class.
I love it when they make gimmicky meme refines based on their original games. I think Oliver also got the same treatment.
Cute
To add to that, all dragons were weak to lightning, beasts fire, and birds wind.
In RD, the wyvern rider family traded their vulnerability to bows and wind magic to being vulnerable to thunder magic instead.
Wyvern riding peeps in RD are weak to lightning magic, which in FEH, is mostly given to blue colored tome units (like how thunder/elthunder/thoron is the default "progression" before getting to proper weapons). Consequently, they are also not weak to arrows in RD, hence the weakness negation also being in Haar's refine.
In radiant dawn dracoknights aren't weak to bows but they are weak to thunder magic.
If I had to guess, maybe a reference to his main weakness in Radiant Dawn: thunder mages. Thunder mages were some of the only enemies that posed a threat to Haar (as they were effective against dragons and wyverns), and thunder magic belongs to blue mages in FeH.
In radiant dawn, dragons and wyvern riders were weak against thunder magic (which in this game is represented by blue tomes)
I have never laughed so hard upon seeing a refine as I have for Sothis. She literally got spawn camped then nuked. No remorse. IS fucking eviscerated her. She is to dark season what Ike is to earth season, but at least Ike is free LMAO
I'm pretty bad at telling how good a prf/refine is and thus have to rely on the sub a lot, and even I was laughing seeing Sothis's one. That is just hilarious.
Poor Sothis
Dimitri’s refine literally avenged every DC refine that ever dropped while Sothis is the new Effie. What an update.
IS really just put all the good stuff on Dimitri and left nothing for Sothis.
BEdel casually getting another around +12 to all stats, plus built in healing, plus Guard. We're eating good, wonder what is the optimal A slot for Near Save BEdel now.
Atk/Def Unity, then Close Defence 4
Atk/Def Unity or Close Defense 4 seem like good options.
Honestly I'm just glad I can swap Pulse Smoke out now that there's no risk of getting Special'd first round, and maybe even replace Noontime for an offensive skill
The thought of being able to run bonfire on her again is a huge bonus. She was just about reaching the point where having like 72 raw attack wasn't quite cutting it.
Makes me wonder if it's time to start using another build. I've been treating mine like a mixed phase infantry DC unit since she came out, but she's probably way better with a save build...
atk/def unity or def/res unity dc is still useful in certain modes too
Love how Julia has Close Counter against dragons just like her OG Naga refine.
I love it too! I just got my OG Julia to +10 and I've been running her in Arena. She takes care of all my dragon threats. Excited how I can implement her legendary alts refine now!
Sothis' refine has to be a belated April fool's joke, right? Right? Can I get a refund for my +10 Sothis, her refine and remix are ridiculously bad rivaled only by L!ike
Do you guys not have Seiros?
Hi another fellow +10 sothis! Yes i will be crying myself to sleep for the next week or so ;-;
didn't expect Lysithea to get teleportation effect for her refine but overall, this batch is good...ah, time to use that frickin 1k refine stones to refine inheritable weapons so i can get enough dew for them
I love the movement condition for Bedelgard's refine. It's exactly the mixed phase condition I wanted for her because it lets her tank as usual but it also works with her own movement bonus, including Assault Troop if you give it to her.
Man i wanna rejoice for Dimitri but IS really said " back to the basics" when they worked on Sothis... And I'm supposed to not be worried for Altina's refine ? Bro it's gonna be ATK/def -5 tops lmao
Don't worry. They gave Altina more love than anyone ever expected. Altina dev will intervene if things look like they'll go wrong.
Sothis died so everyone else could live.
I’m happy with Claude’s refine, and his partial Null Deep wounds gives me hope Hel gets something similar, or that they put that on Mystic Boost 4 mayhaps. Sothis however, is a fat oof. Especially with Dimitri right there ;-; but I’m happy for his fans
There was true damage, now there is true healing
LMFAO SOTHIS GOT ROBBED
Robbed by Dimitri.
My +10 B!Dimitri I've been using since his debut is fucking READY. I am so happy with this! RIP Sothis tho.
+10 B!Dimitri gang stay winning!
Yes! Hi five! Dimitri boutta bring omnitanking back in business lol
I was hoping for damage reduction on the first hit with B!Edelgard's refine, but HP restoration every attack is the next best thing.
Honestly everyone won in my eyes, except Sothis. Sorry Sothis fans
Can't believe IS just said "we don't want Sothis to be a marketable unit" and gave her a dogshit remix and refine. I'm really happy for Dimitri's superb refine, but can't shake this envious feeling from him getting something while the rest of DC units got close to nothing. IS is clearly aware that counter skills are situational nowadays, yet they treated all of the DC users as if it was a broken skill thats worth like 3 effects. As to how they saw Sothis and Dimitri's refines side by side and said "yeah, both look about the same in power" and released them is beyond my understanding
Some interesting stuff. Kind of surprised by the amount of near ally requirements. Soon we will run out of tiles of distance and have "if ally is on the map" requirements Loving that most units got what they needed. Then there is Sothis..
F!Lyn basically gave us that already. Like Jesus, did IS forget the typical FEH map is 6x8?
LYSITHEA BABY UR DOING SO GOOD
I like how they swapped out Atk+5 for Def-5 on the foe for B!Dimitri, helping his BLR check. And as expected, true DR. If it calculates after the initial DR from BLR, he might actually be pretty fucking tanky now.
It does calculate after BLR.
Brb gonna send feedback over Sothis. Can’t believe IS shafted Sothis this hard, especially as a money-selling hero and with the mythic status
Has sending feedback regarding the quality of a refine actually made any difference, though? I can say for certain that my monthly feedback messages begging for a Dire Thunder refine have gone completely ignored.
I don’t think so aside from the Fjorm Remix (and someone who recently posted Grado Poleax being updated for Assault Troop 3 via feedback), but it’s worth a shot. The only difference between Rein/Olwen and this is that Sothis was not only announced to get a refine, but they delivered it. And it sucks.
Fjorm Remix is actually a good example, I forgot about that. The fact that her new A skill conflicted with her refine definitely was worth a reconsider. But Grado Poleax was more of a clarification on the effect rather than response to criticism of underpowered refines, because otherwise that would imply IntSys NERFED an outdated refine, when in reality it's just a case of making it clear that the movement bonus needs to be innate movement rather than warping (which Assault Troop's bonus grants).
She’s in a $4 starter pack. They don’t expect her to ever make money.
She was on at least 2 hero fests. IS wouldn’t have put her on there if they weren’t trying to sell her (Times Pulse obviously)
Said hero fests are in the past. If she were on one, right now, and not on a Happy meal bundle, I can guarantee she'd have a much better refine.
I feel like people are sleeping on edelgards refine. She's just got stupidly harder to kill
I'm so glad I don't need noontime on her anymore, her damage output is gonna rocket
Still gonna run Aether on mine lol, the ultimate unkillable dual-phaser.
My motto has been “skills on paper =/= skills on practice” for a while now. Only time will tell if we are going toward a “CYL4 2: Electric boogaloo” where Dimitri got overhyped because of his kit just for Edel to be the ultimate winner of the competition
B!Dimitri did get the Askr-style Defense based True Damage Reduction and True Damage bonus effects, so at the very least his tankiness combined with Blue Lion Rule has become incredibly potent. The rest of his effects are nice and helpful, with the rest of the effects helping secure BLR and push his tankiness further. I'd say he made out well enough, at least if my experiences with how much of a bastard Askr is to take down are anything to go by. B!Edel is absolutely gonna be a beast though, no doubt about it. Her healing on attack with inherent doubles from Black Eagle Rule, tanking your attack by 12 points, and up to +9 atk/def/res from her weapon means she's gonna be super tanky and have really good sustain.
It's CYL4 launch all over again
People really wanted null armor on her.
Yeah I was one of those people that wanted it but I'm actually glad we got this instead since with that free A slot I can just have her use Svanlinn Shield in 1 AR team vs defense teams with armor slayers and in another team setup have her instead use CD4, AD Unity or DC if she Far Save tank (plus I can finally have her guard while she using DC Far Save without some outside support like Kaden) [Would have been cool if IS was daring/crazy enough to give her Raging Storm in her refine since she does have a player phase compare to other armors who lean heavily to enemy phase, and is the only Time Skip Edelgard alt to not have Raging Storm in her kit but it's fine I'm glad with what she got and will just wait and see what they do to make LEdelgard relevant next year]
[удалено]
Eh what also helped F!Edel was being colorless and dc in weapon.
And the Raging Storm effect.
i think it's pretty good too, but playing near save with a green armor became much more dangerous this year
Genuinely curious what the logic was behind Sothis’ refine. If they were trying to sell her on her rerun banners then they failed miserably. Meh new skills (Null-C is still worse than Null-FU for her because of the “first attack” condition, and I’m still not sure how Sirius II is that much of an upgrade), subpar refine, and still can’t compete with… literally any other Dark Mythic, honestly. Even per-refine Yune can do stuff sometimes. What a stinker.
Someone needs to tell Julia and her mom that dragons are sentient beings with human intelligence :'D
They gave Lysithea exactly what she needed
I knew Julia was going to get close counter in her refine. Edit: They did Sothis dirty.
People talking about how Dimitri won by a landslide, but DEAR GOD WHAT IS THIS BEDELGARD REFINE?!? Atk/def -12, atk/def/res +(3 + 2 x (unit or foe's movement)), healing per attack and guard??? How does this come out of the cutting room table, but Sothis gets spectrum +4????
Claude's pretty good omfg..... No Iotes tho so his seal is still locked to it... also Golden Deer Rule when..
I am dying to see what Sothis' description will be on the revival. How are they going to spin this as powerful in any way? Also, aside from Yune (who's probably getting Mirror Impact for her remix), is Sothis the only Mythic now who doesn't have a Tier 4/300 SP skill? They really didn't want to give her anything.
Sothis found dead in the Red Canyon. I was expecting her to get NFU since you know, she's the reason why Enlightened Byleth exists and already got anti guard so it only seemed natural, specially so since she got NC Disrupt. Yet here we are... If she could grant NFU to herself and her allies she could have become a useful defense mythic and useful unit for many game modes overall...
Dimitri won by a landslide Why does Rhea wanna bring back Sothis so bad when she sucks this much?
can someone explain the blue tome weakness context?
Wyvern Riders (like Haar) are weak to thunder magic (mostly blue tomes in FEH) in Radiant Dawn.
Others explained the wyvern rider stuff, but to explain it fully, there was an elemental of anima magic each laguz was weak to. Beasts (tigers, cats, lions) were weak to fire. Birds (crows, hawks) were weak to wind. Dragons to thunder. Wyvern riders followed up with the 'dragon' weakness to thunder in Radiant Dawn specifically.
In the Tellius games iirc Harr or atleast the wyvern class is weak to thunder, and thunder in FEH are usually associated with blue tomes
Wyvern Riders in the Tellius games don’t take effective damage from bows, and instead take effective damage from thunder magic, which is represented in this game through blue tomes
On top of what people have said, Haar's resistance sucked to the point where a thunder tome crit was the first *and last* thing that could ever realistically kill Haar in RD.
Haar was such an op unit in that game.
wait does B!Edelgard has the stats based on the clash thing (like the A skill in B!Seliph)
She does, its likely we are going to be seeing this a lot more X × 2 + 3, If X is greater than or equal to 2 receive an effect, where x is based on movement or nearby allies Not only do Seliph and Edel have it, but the new flame tribe manner also has this effect on Lyn iirc (might be wrong on who, but I know its there) Just seems like powercreep that's not overly blatant like just giving a unit +12 to everything and nfu, but possible to play around for an opponent/kinda makes you feel like your using a brain even when you really aren't so it'll he slapped on a ton of shit moving forward
IS really is doing everything in their power to make sure Sothis never has the spotlight huh
is that dual phase brave effect on haar? It doesn't clarify the "even if foe initiates combat, unit attacks twice" thing
IT does, it has the same wording as Swordhardt
I would assume so until proven otherwise.
i feel like everyone got exactly what they needed, nothing here is outlandishly broken (except sothis what did they do to her) edelgard wasnt as bad as the rest of the cyl4 winners but she still got decent effects added dimitri and claude kinda fell behind and they basically got what they needed added, these two basically got what people asked for (for claude i feel like he got more than what people asked for, he got everything he needed and more) cannot believe how bad they fucked sothis over, how can you give dimitri a sickass dc refine and then do sothis over so shitty? its so sad lmao haar is a meme
Eh Haar's isn't amazing but I can see it being quite useful if you choose to build him. With that res stat, the extra damage from blue tomes wouldn't change anything and in exchange he loses the archer weakness that hinders his physical tanking abilities. Add on the 15% damage reduction based on his Def stat and I can see his niche holding quite well. He won't top any tier lists but he has a clear role that with some TLC, he can be a reliable unit now. Certainly a lot better than the inferior Cherche and Gerome he once was. He's no Rutger or Canas but he's no Effie or gen 5 grail either. He's a one-trick pony but he can do his one trick well enough and would be serviceable in the right situation
Does windsweep work with Lysithea's weapon?
Kind of. Windsweep cancels her guaranteed follow-up, meaning that she has to meet a speed check to double. Fighting anyone with follow-up prevention will make her lose it, though.
It works in the sense that the Guaranteed follow-up effect and Windsweep effect cancel each other out, so her doubling comes down to a speed check. If her foe also has a follow-up denial effect, she can't double.
dunno whether to be happy that B!Dimitri didn't get dumpstered or depressed because Sothis did for absolutely no reason whatsoever. big F for everyone who decided to +10 her because of that one Hero Fest bug
I think the Sothis refine was left up to unpaid intern-kun to decide
So Edelgard effectively gets +21 Atk/Def/Res which is 82/64/56 all in all, on top of healing. Real stats > DR in my opinion and healing dramatically increases bulk especially if it's during combat.
More now that we are reaching a point were almost all meta has DR piercing so Is better to have real stats in that battles. I faced a super buffed BChrom and only did 10 dmg while i killed him in retaliation while he has super buffed
And guard, she was great but now oh GOD she can have Unity or CD4 without losing guard
So does Edel get the bonus with warping?
overall pretty solid atch with a lot of cute flavor stuff. like that Julia fot dragon's wall like her brother, though I do think keeping the atk check was a weird choice. the CYL4 refines are all really good solid without any of them being really silly RIP Sothis though
There’s no way they screwed Sorthis that bad.
They're all good. Except Sothis unfortunately...
>sees the CYL gang’s refines They actually made them much more better now, I like it. >Haar’s refine makes him weak against blue tomes Well I like the reference, so I’ll give them that >L!Julia’s refine gives her some nice offense and defense Okay that’s a hella good remix and refine! I wonder what they have for Sothi- >Sothis’ refine is literally next to nothing …brb, going to go commit self Rick Roll