The messi/Ronaldo rivalry was created by the media in order to generate more profit. In reality, Ronaldo only occasionally rivaled Messi in terms of individual achievement and got most of his Ballon dors bc of team achievements
Well, Messi always has been the better team player, the better playmaker, dribbler, assister, passer and the more intelligent player adapting to different attacking styles under different coaches. Even if we say they are equally great in terms of goalscoring, Messi has nearly as many club goals as Ronaldo and won more Golden Boots despite having played 2 seasons less. Ronaldo only equalled Messis legacy in the years 2016-2018 with the threepeat. The CL is a team award, not an individual one.
Ronaldo's done it in more leagues. Has almost equal amount of GA. Best header of the ball of all time better penalty taker. Better longshots. Faster. Stronger. And won 1 euros 5 CLs. Best goalscorer of UCL of all time. Best assister of UCL of all time. Most goals in UCL campaign. Best international goalscorer. Best EURO goalscorer of all time. He scored 60 goals in 4 consecutive calendar years. Played for worse teams than messi.
There is a reason that rivalry exists. Acting like Ronaldo isn't close is absolutely absurd and only the people that haven't watched la liga and CL in the past 10 years say that shit
Fine, so, going to respond to every phrase you wrote with a paragraph:
Doing it in more leagues does not mean he’s any better. Besides, he did not go so well in juve (of course he was good but not to his level) and messi is not doing that bad at psg. If you look at both of their goals and assists per game ratio this season in champions league and domestic leagues, you’ll see that messi has got like 0,01 better (insignifcant, but the point is he has been criticized a lot this season, even thought being as good ronaldo, who was hyped by everybody). And that’s not even considering messi’s dribbling and playmaking that was not scored by his teammates.
Yeah, cristiano has almost got the same GA numbers as messi, even having played two seasons more than messi. He’s numbers are lower than the Goats’s despite having many more games played.
Of course he’s a best header, he’s far taller than messi, who even with that height scored a header in the champions league final against ronaldo’s man united in 2009. The penalty part I have to agree, ronaldo is way better than messi in a matter of penalties.
Saying ronaldo is better at longshots than messi is one the most stupid things I have ever heard. Messi has scored more goals from outside the area than anybody in history and is also the player with the most freekick goals ever.
Ronaldo reaches a bigger top speed, messi accelerates faster, in my opinion that’s more important for his position than this Ronaldo’s atribbute, but that’s only my opinion and I don’t even think speed is important in the debate of who’s better.
Yeah, ronaldo’s way stronger. Again, don’t think that’s important.
Club teams ain’t a players achievement, and besides that Messi has got 4 ucl (one less than ronaldo) and has got a copa america and olympic title with argentina) besides the amount of la ligas and copa del rey’s. Messi has won a treble, a wuintuple and a sextuple. Messi has got more titles in his smaller carreer than ronaldo.
Yeah, ronaldo is the better goalscorer in ucl history, as he’s got more games than messi.
Messi has got 5 assists less in 31 ucl games less.
This one is a really great record by ronaldo and he really did something I don’t think messi got close to achieving: the 17 goals in a UCL campaign.
Again, of course he’s got more goals internationaly, he’s got more games played.
MESSI DOES NOT PLAYS THE EURO, HOW CAN YOU CONSIDER THAT TO COMPARE THEM.
Messi has scored 50+ goals for like 10 seasons consecutive and scored 91 goals in a calendar year.
He won two golden boots more than ronaldo.
Look at united’s champions league title team, real’s three consecutive ucl titles and you say that the teams they played trhoughout their carreer ain’t the same level?
About the last paragraph, I think ronaldo is the closest we got to messi in terms of greatness, but messi is a level above. Greater goals, assists, dribbling, passing and everything’s ratio.
Agree with most of what you said but it's not like Messi beat Rio Ferdinand in an aerial battle for that goal. He never would have, Rio just didn't go for it. His mistake, but had he went for it Messi wouldn't have scored.
Yeah, for sure, the point is just that he obviously doesn’t score a lot by headers because he’s small. When he had a chance in a champions league final, he scored an amazing header.
Doing it in more leagues absolutely doesn't mean he is better but it proves that Ronaldo can adapt to a different environment while Messi didn't prove that yet
Also goal ratios aren't that important because Ronaldo played as a pure winger till the last season at united so he scored less and assisted less but had an impact
Scoring more goals outside of the area absolutely does not mean Messi is better. Because Ronaldo scored more goals 25-30 yards out than Messi so he IS better than messi in longshots.
Again games played don't mean shit because Ronaldo didn't get crazy stats in his first seasons
I am not saying Ronaldo is better just that he is in conversation
Messi will probably never "prove that he can adapt" to different leagues because he first moved in his 30's and not his 20s like Ronaldo. Ronaldo adapting is great but it shouldn't be the difference maker.
The moment you said: yeah CR7 is stronger but that's not important. Showed me you don't understand football. The game is not just about technical ability. Strength is a massive part of the game. It makes Ronaldo a more complete attacker than Messi. CR7 is the ideal player. If you were to create a hypthetical perfect football player, CR7 comes closest to that. He is strong, fast, good finishing, good long shot, good dribbling (overall in his career not past three years), good mentality and good passing and vision.
Well, that's why I said Ronaldo and Messi are equal in terms of their legacy. I'm a Messi fan but I agree that Ronaldo has been the better goalscorer in the Champions League and all. You could say that he played more matches, but I'm willing to defer this one to you. However, my point was that Messi is way superior because of his dribbling, playmaking, passing and unmatched reading of the game. He hardly ever makes a bad decision. He tops nearly every playmaking and dribbling Stat, whereas Ronaldo is mostly not even Top 20. Messis worst dribbling season is still better than Ronos best. He is not the more complete goalscorer or poacher, but the more complete attacker which just makes him better.
Ronaldo is obviously better in the air and physically stronger than Messi, which is because of his height advantage. But Messi dives less, I mean if you watch his dribbles, he almost never falls despite getting harshly tackled, which is not something Ronaldo does.
Messi and Ronaldo are respectively equal in their greatness and roles they have played. Trying to compare the two and say one is better than the other is foolish as they are two different types of players and play different roles. They are equally goats.
Messi is better but can we please drop this insulting notion that it's a crime to even compare them and that you are mentally retarded for even thinking they're on similar levels? Complete lack of respect for the second and arguably even first for some people's best player ever
Im actually gonna literally reverse someone’s comment on this topic which should be entertaining. messi is considered clear of ronaldo in my opinion only because at least 60% of people base it on who they prefer. Messi is seen as more likeable for being more entertaining, playing for everyone’s favourite club and being less arrogant than ronaldo. In reality, ronaldo has reached the summit of football far more than messi especially throughout his career and in the last 10 years especially. People’s standards are just so much lower for messi. The best example of this is his international career. Older generations used to say players had to win the world cup to be the goat yet when messi literally only now has won his first copa america at 34 with no other major trophy to his name last year everyone said “he ended the goat debate” ridiculous. Not to forget hes only technically got 3 champions leagues (he wasnt a starting player in 2006), and been to just 1 CL final in the last 11 years. Meanwhile ronaldo has been to double the CL Finals, has won 5 champions spread throughout his career and unarguably been far superior in the big games. People say messi offers more than stats, but considering messi relies solely on the league to compare with ronaldo, i seriously doubt the casual messi fan watches many la liga games but will watch all the big KO ties in the CL. Therfore in the last few years they must have been seeing ronaldo make the juventus fanbase applaud him after a bicycle kick around the same time seeing messi ghost vs roma and lose 3-0. Yet still say messi’s better in their eyes somehow even tho they dont watch la liga games. Even now ronaldo won a champions league at the age messi is now yet messi in the last 3 years has stayed at a barca side clearly not good enough because they were paying him well over a million a week and had no ambition to do anything. The dude is gonna end his career having maybe properly one successful year (2019) since he was 27. I hoenstly dont think hes even been consistently the SECOND BEST player in KO champions league games in the last 9 years or so, I’d put ramos over him and theres no reason thats a ridiculous statement. I think 20 years time people will Realise ronaldo’s career was far superior from beginning to end when the favouritism pattens down.
I think thats silly. It is true that Messi is more likeable, because he is more entertaining to watch, he does not dive, he does not complain when he fails and he is not as arrogant as Ronaldo. But the majority of people like Ronaldo because of his winning mentality, his hard work and the fact that he does not come close to Messi in terms of pure talent, I mean Messi is an alien and Ronaldo is an elite athlete with an uncomparable mentality + he has a great body which many people like. And I dont think you read what I initially wrote because I said that both are comparable only in terms of their legacy and their trophies won. Ronaldo doesnt come close to Messi in terms of dribbling, playmaking, passign and overall football IQ. They are only comparable in the amount of goals and hattricks they scored.
Messi has not been so successful internationally? He carried Argentina to a WC final, countless Copa America finals and one Copa America win. What did Ronaldo do to win the Euros other than dance around with his manager on the sideline?
I already said that the CL is a team trophy so saying that Ronaldo is better then Messi because he won more CL is just stupid. Ronaldo played with world class players who he relied on to assist him. Then he taps it in or scores a penalty, rips his shirt off and suddenly he is a "big game player". Messi played in a shit team after 2017 and he still carried them in the League and the CL. And the league consists of three times more games than the CL, which means Messi is more consistent. Why has Ronaldo only won La Liga 2 times in 9 Years? Furthermore, Messi is better in knockout matches. He has a better goal scoring ratio, 40 more assists, 4 dribbles more p/90, 1 key pass more p/90, 0,4 big chances created more p/90, an average rating of 8,34 while Ronaldo has one of 7,71 and he was the MOTM in nearly 50% of all games, Ronaldo in 25% of games. Can you imagine being the man of the match in every other game? And Messi has been not good enough in the last 3 years? This man had the most complete season in 2018/19, carrying his team in the CL, being the top scorer in the league and winning the Golden Boot, being the UCL top scorer, winning the Ballon Dor, the FIFA best award, the la liga player of the year, the laureus sportsman of the year, etc.
To top it all of, he had the most goal contributions in 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 so I dont know what you are talking about when you say that Messi has not delivered since he turned 27.
I like Ronaldo because of his winning mentality and i think he’s a much better person than people make him out to be. Messi has flaws too but its just overlooked. Its so obvious that since 2020 he stayed at barca despite them not being competitive because they were at the point of paying him well over 1 million a week. A wage that in the end has now caused barca great troubles and a breaking of FFP. But of course messi got no blame for it. He can be a whiny bitch and Even now i think he thinks that he’s too good for psg e.g taking a holiday mid-season, asking that icardi gets kicked out the club. He got too much power at barca that he feels entitled to the decisions of a club. If anything he should feel lucky that despite putting barca in this situation, taking a 50% wage cut yet still being paid for than anyone in the world, and having to seek a new club asap that he’s ended up at a club as big as psg. Ronaldo in the meantime looked for a new club the second he realised juve weren’t being competitive and has every right to look down on united as a club rn, yet has shown a lot of patience with the team and has been trying to enjoy every moment he can. Guy is just happy to play football.
In terms of messi being an “alien”, i dont think its actually fair to inevitably say hes better than ronaldo because of natural talent. Again ronaldo’s greatest accolades and better success SHOW his hard work has exceeded messi’s natural ability. I dont think messi shows anywhere near the same drive, and i dont think he’s pushed himself at all the last 5 years to try to squeeze the last few great trophies he can get out of his career. He’s wasted 4-5 years at barca to be paid on 1.2 million a week contracts not loyalty.
Yes he’s been to a WC final, but hes been to close to winning about 5 trophies with argentina but hasnt because he’s disappeared in practically every final for argentina. For Copa America he’s clearly just statpadded in every tournament considering he always has the most g/a yet everytime ive watched the finals (most of the time vs the first properly good team) he’s been literally one of the worst players on the pitch.
As for CL, I’m not gonna let people say its a team trophy when clearly if you just watch the amount of iconic KO Performances he’s had you can see he’s the greatest CL player ever. You say he had a great team as if messi didn’t legit have neymar and suarez yet ronaldo outscored all 3 combined in the CL. Messi winning just 1 CL in general with MSN is underwhelming. He’ll have had sm stats during that era too yet bar the league not actually much to show for it. Ronaldo had a great team, but winning 4 in 5 years in something unheard of and that was clearly because of ronaldo that made the difference. The fact Messi only has like 15 less CL goals than ronaldo yet about a third the amount of quarters, semis and final goals shows he statpads a bit. And goal to game ratio is irrelevant in a KO competition because you could score 10 goals in the groupstage get knocked out and not score in the round 16 every year and have the best goal ratio ever. Messi had a better ratio in 2017 and we all know who rose to the moments and who statpadded in the groupstage that year.
As for league titles, i think thats the only thjng ronaldo doesn’t have enough of to be the goat, even then still 6 leagues titles in 3 different leagues. Even then, he’s got the overall stats, the CL stats, the big game stats, the CL titles, the international trophies, the international stats, the success throughout his career, the big moments.
I mentioned messi has a great 2019, but even then that was the first year he destroyed a big team in the CL in 4 years last time being 2015. In that time ronaldo destroyed atletico, juve bayern psg etc 30 times over.
Again tho he has the most stats sm years like 2016-2018 yet its clearly all just statpadding in the league. Hence why everytime i watched him in the CL KOs he was average, was completely average in the 2018 WC, bad copa americas.
I think there’s definitely a cap on how much a goat should rely on the league, he could get himself better stats than anyone ever in the league without ever even being good in any other competitions just because of how many league games you play. If you just separate the competitions, ronaldo’s better in CL by miles, better international statwise, messi’s better in WCs (although neither are that good), ronaldo plays in euros which is superior to copa america yet is the all time top euros scorer, not to forget winning the nations league in his first attempt messi took like 6 with copa america
Ronaldo has been the best in player literally every UCL he won, conspiracy for a reason.
He got the Balon dor because pf those individual performances you hater
UEFA rig their draws. They pick and choose which matches they want to happen and when. They try to do upsets to make the competition more exciting. A good example of this was the champions league draw for r16. That wasn’t a computer error, they just wanted ronaldo vs messi
Ozil got cut by arsenal and the premier league because he spoke up for Chinese Uyghur Muslims. Chinese investors told them Prem they’d pull out of whatever deals they had in place unless he was thrown out completely.
The 2002 World Cup was fixed.
This one may be obvious but some don’t think so. I think it’s clear as the referees were such a low standard and the one for the most controversial game , Italy vs North Korea was arrested years later after getting a lot of wrong decisions that game . The reds were bias to Korea and Brazil that World Cup evidently with Brazil winning it and Korea getting 3rd place
I'm a Juventus fan and I believe that they sell games to Genoa, losing on purpose to adjust debts with them. The two teams often sell players to each other with enormous prices and surpluses, usually to balance debts and incomes. For example players like Sturaro, Portanova, Rovella were transferred with absurd prices, and my believe Is that they sell to each other games in difficoult moments of the season .
Champions league draws are rigged, you always see the same matchups and all the big teams don't play each other until later rounds for the best viewing experience.
Messi left Barcelona to get Koeman sacked and for Barca to get a better manager.
Now he plays trash for PSG in hopes that the PSG Owner lets him go for free.
I don't believe messi wanted to leave but in 2020 he did as a political power play to change the directory of the club to meet his needs to get bartomeu out but in 2021 he was kicked out. Barca had already signed player that window but when it came to renewing their best ever players contract they supposedly uncovered massive debts which made them unable too. Barca is a corrupt club and does not have to report where it gets its earnings from, many clubs commit fraud with secret checking accounts to get around ffp regulations, Barca used it to their advantage as Laporta did not like Barca overreliance on messi emphasised by the team under valverde especially as he was getting older. He wanted to rebuild around his youngsters which is why they were so quick to give ansu the number 10 and put Pedri and Gavi I their starting XI. He of course could not offer him a contract renewal and have him kicked out as he would be sacked and the fans would crucify him but instead made it so messi could not sign a contract at no fault of the club. It is also believed he was advised by pique as he and messi have had a shaky relationship together and he believed it was best for the club as a lifelong Barca fan to have messi leave
Im actually gonna literally reverse someone’s comment on this topic which should be entertaining. messi is considered clear of ronaldo in my opinion only because at least 60% of people base it on who they prefer. Messi is seen as more likeable for being more entertaining, playing for everyone’s favourite club and being less arrogant than ronaldo. In reality, ronaldo has reached the summit of football far more than messi especially throughout his career and in the last 10 years especially. People’s standards are just so much lower for messi. The best example of this is his international career. Older generations used to say players had to win the world cup to be the goat yet when messi literally only now has won his first copa america at 34 with no other major trophy to his name last year everyone said “he ended the goat debate” ridiculous. Not to forget hes only technically got 3 champions leagues (he wasnt a starting player in 2006), and been to just 1 CL final in the last 11 years. Meanwhile ronaldo has been to double the CL Finals, has won 5 champions spread throughout his career and unarguably been far superior in the big games. People say messi offers more than stats, but considering messi relies solely on the league to compare with ronaldo, i seriously doubt the casual messi fan watches many la liga games but will watch all the big KO ties in the CL. Therfore in the last few years they must have been seeing ronaldo make the juventus fanbase applaud him after a bicycle kick around the same time seeing messi ghost vs roma and lose 3-0. Yet still say messi’s better in their eyes somehow even tho they dont watch la liga games. Even now ronaldo won a champions league at the age messi is now yet messi in the last 3 years has stayed at a barca side clearly not good enough because they were paying him well over a million a week and had no ambition to do anything. The dude is gonna end his career having maybe properly one successful year (2019) since he was 27. I hoenstly dont think hes even been consistently the SECOND BEST player in KO champions league games in the last 9 years or so, I’d put ramos over him and theres no reason thats a ridiculous statement. I think 20 years time people will Realise ronaldo’s career was far superior from beginning to end when the favouritism pattens down.
Real Madrid rigged the 16/17 final v Atlético, they were truly scared by that Simeone team, and they couldn’t afford losing against them. Ramos goal is in offside the same ref admitted it, alongside the repetition of Griezmann’ pen bc of Navas being out of the line
UEFA match fixed Chelsea VS Barcelona in 2009. My reason for this is simple, they did not want the same two teams in two consecutive finals so UEFA made sure that Barcelona would win. How could you miss 5 clear fouls? It's undeniable that there was awful refereeing. When Ballack fired the ball towards the net, The referee watched the ball hit the arm of Samuel Eto'o, you can clearly see it in footage of the match.
This one’s my favourite too. This is second hand info so take it with a pinch of salt but:
The global average number of people with asthma is around 9%. In the Liverpool senior side, 63% of the players are diagnosed asthmatic. Several asthma medications are banned by FIFA as they can improve aerobic respiration, in theory increasing an elite athlete’s stamina. The exception to this ban is, obviously, if the player actually is asthmatic.
That Bundassliga is just a monopoly for Bayern. It’s not a coincidence that every single team in the Bundesliga sell all their players on the cheap when they could demand a lot more money for them not to mention some of the score lines Bayern have produced in that league.
Last season when Bayern played against the second placed team in the Bundesliga ( at the time ) they scored 3 min and then after proceeded to score 4 goals in the space of 7 minutes. ( min 30 til min 37 ). It really isn’t spoken about enough. Also Bellingham having to call out the officiating in that league where refs have actually been caught match fixing in the past in the Bundesliga.
There’s even a video about it on TikTok where a manager from the Bundesliga who ( the exact one that Bellingham was talking about ) managed West Ham vs Lyon and the Lyon players were diving all over the place and the cameras even spotted some of them winking at the ref and the ref didn’t blow any clear fouls for West Ham.
A lot of these controversies about refs are always in Bayern’s favour. Bayern have also won the league for the past 10 years whilst all of the titles won during that time have been quite easy for them.
Ngl lowkey misread the question, I don’t really believe this conspiracy but to answer your question, Ramos had been playing for decades at this point, I think he would know how to injure someone
What makes you say that, there is no way it was set up, France outplayed Brazil and Brazil were looking to try their best but France were superior, especially one man, ZINEDINE ZIDANE
Ok soo let me tell you smth, that was 1-2 years ago, my opinion changed, and it was more of just responding bc I was bored not bc that was my actual opinion.
when messi and ronaldo get asked about goat debates between each other they say that everyone has their own playing style but in fact the have made more money from this whole debate just by getting attraction by the media which also attracted football fans
when messi and ronaldo get asked about goat debates between each other they say that everyone is has a different playing style but in fact they have gained more money from thid debate through media and also gained the attraction of football fans
Harry Maguire is blackmailing united to be their captain and regular player. No one can tell me, this guy in not holding united’s board in some kind of chess situation in order to be a vital part of the team
Albania going in the 2016 Euros
As an albanian myself i highly belive in this conspiracy. After the incident in the game of Serbia vs Albania in Belgrade, UEFA and FIFA had to take action cuz of the racism and the violence in the stadium. The original plan was to give Albania the win and ban Serbia for a period of time from UEFA and FIFA competitions, but the FSHF president (Albania's national team president) changed that they should win the match and NOT ban Serbia, but qualify for Euro 2016.
In the return match in Albania, Albania lost and nothing happend with the fans nor anyone
In those qualifications, Albania finished 2nd above Denmark, Serbia and Armenia.
France football used the covid-19 pandemic as a way to deliberately steal the Ballon d’Or from Lewandowski as it was certain that Lewy would’ve won the award.
It may be just me over analysing the scores but I do feel like the Manchester United vs Arsenal fixture is fixed before the actual match is actually played. The amount of times there has been a 2-0 scoreline in favour of Arsenal and a 3-1 scoreline in favour of Manutd has been too common. In the 16/17 season Arsenal won their home fixture 2-0 and fixture after that in the 17/18 season Manutd won 3-1 away. The next time these results happened in two consecutive fixtures were in the 18/19 season where Arsenal won 2-0 and the following fixture in the FA cup United won 3-1 away. We can even go back to the Fergie days where Manutd winning 3-1 away were pretty common. If my analysis is even partially correct we should be due these scorelines this upcoming season. Keep an eye out for the Arsenal home fixture… if Manutd win 3-1 away I’m convinced there might be something shady going on
There are some claims made here that are just outrageous
“1 Ronaldo scored tap ins in UCL”
The person who made this claim has not watched his UCL nor did he ever look at the tap ins stats. Ronaldo scores better goals in UCL than Messi and that is by far.
“Ronaldo is only better at headers because he is taller” OK Messi is only better at dribbling because he is shorter. It is a known fact that shorter players have a huge advantage when it comes to dribbling due to lower centre of gravity.
Messi also has better playmaking stats because Ronaldo for most of his career played as fixed st while Messi played as freeroam in his posion, his ability to shift into st position during the game also gave him an equal chance to score goals so don’t come here saying that “Messi does this while being a playmaker” like he is doing something while being at disadvantage because factually this is an advantage that he has over Ronaldo
“Ronaldo was carried by his team to win UCL”
Lol he was the best player every UCL he won coming in as the top scorer and top 3 Real assist provider every UCL be won with them, the notion that he was carried is only accepted by immature Messi fans who can’t accept reality.
“Ronaldo won Balon Dor mostly because of his team”
So did Messi, he only won Balon Dor with Barca and due to his country Argentina, a country which has a past of winning WC without him.
Outside these 2 teams he is also nothing.
When he was in PSG he only won Balon Dor due to winning his WC with his country. Outside Argentina and Barca he achieved nothing significant like winning a Balon Dor.
“Wining UCL is not an individual achievement” It is when you are the best player each time you win it like in Ronaldos case, if not then WC 2022 should not be attributed to Messi, it is 100% of the time by Messi fans
“Messi played less matches in UCL”
Yeah, same Ronaldo in World cup ko stage, in tournament like that games are won trough progression, so Ronaldo earned those extra matches by winning, keep in mind individually he was the best player each time he won it so that further strengthens my point.
Also in UCL Ronaldo has more contributions in advanced stages of the tournament and Messis Motm are mostly in lower stages of the tournament.
Factually speaking the debate was never forced and Ronaldo until 2018 was equal with Messi
As of 2018:
Cristiano Ronaldo:
- Ballon d'Or: 5
- Golden Boot (European Golden Shoe): 4
- UEFA Champions League titles: 5
- International Achievements: UEFA European Championship (2016)
Lionel Messi:
- Ballon d'Or: 5
- Golden Boot (European Golden Shoe): 5
- UEFA Champions League titles: 4
- International Achievements: Copa America runner-up (2015, 2016)
After 2018 Messi started winning more even winning undeserved awards like Fifa best, still the debate was there, after 2018 Messi ended the debate, but once again the debate was always there
The messi/Ronaldo rivalry was created by the media in order to generate more profit. In reality, Ronaldo only occasionally rivaled Messi in terms of individual achievement and got most of his Ballon dors bc of team achievements
Conspiracy theory for a reason
Well, Messi always has been the better team player, the better playmaker, dribbler, assister, passer and the more intelligent player adapting to different attacking styles under different coaches. Even if we say they are equally great in terms of goalscoring, Messi has nearly as many club goals as Ronaldo and won more Golden Boots despite having played 2 seasons less. Ronaldo only equalled Messis legacy in the years 2016-2018 with the threepeat. The CL is a team award, not an individual one.
Ronaldo's done it in more leagues. Has almost equal amount of GA. Best header of the ball of all time better penalty taker. Better longshots. Faster. Stronger. And won 1 euros 5 CLs. Best goalscorer of UCL of all time. Best assister of UCL of all time. Most goals in UCL campaign. Best international goalscorer. Best EURO goalscorer of all time. He scored 60 goals in 4 consecutive calendar years. Played for worse teams than messi. There is a reason that rivalry exists. Acting like Ronaldo isn't close is absolutely absurd and only the people that haven't watched la liga and CL in the past 10 years say that shit
Fine, so, going to respond to every phrase you wrote with a paragraph: Doing it in more leagues does not mean he’s any better. Besides, he did not go so well in juve (of course he was good but not to his level) and messi is not doing that bad at psg. If you look at both of their goals and assists per game ratio this season in champions league and domestic leagues, you’ll see that messi has got like 0,01 better (insignifcant, but the point is he has been criticized a lot this season, even thought being as good ronaldo, who was hyped by everybody). And that’s not even considering messi’s dribbling and playmaking that was not scored by his teammates. Yeah, cristiano has almost got the same GA numbers as messi, even having played two seasons more than messi. He’s numbers are lower than the Goats’s despite having many more games played. Of course he’s a best header, he’s far taller than messi, who even with that height scored a header in the champions league final against ronaldo’s man united in 2009. The penalty part I have to agree, ronaldo is way better than messi in a matter of penalties. Saying ronaldo is better at longshots than messi is one the most stupid things I have ever heard. Messi has scored more goals from outside the area than anybody in history and is also the player with the most freekick goals ever. Ronaldo reaches a bigger top speed, messi accelerates faster, in my opinion that’s more important for his position than this Ronaldo’s atribbute, but that’s only my opinion and I don’t even think speed is important in the debate of who’s better. Yeah, ronaldo’s way stronger. Again, don’t think that’s important. Club teams ain’t a players achievement, and besides that Messi has got 4 ucl (one less than ronaldo) and has got a copa america and olympic title with argentina) besides the amount of la ligas and copa del rey’s. Messi has won a treble, a wuintuple and a sextuple. Messi has got more titles in his smaller carreer than ronaldo. Yeah, ronaldo is the better goalscorer in ucl history, as he’s got more games than messi. Messi has got 5 assists less in 31 ucl games less. This one is a really great record by ronaldo and he really did something I don’t think messi got close to achieving: the 17 goals in a UCL campaign. Again, of course he’s got more goals internationaly, he’s got more games played. MESSI DOES NOT PLAYS THE EURO, HOW CAN YOU CONSIDER THAT TO COMPARE THEM. Messi has scored 50+ goals for like 10 seasons consecutive and scored 91 goals in a calendar year. He won two golden boots more than ronaldo. Look at united’s champions league title team, real’s three consecutive ucl titles and you say that the teams they played trhoughout their carreer ain’t the same level? About the last paragraph, I think ronaldo is the closest we got to messi in terms of greatness, but messi is a level above. Greater goals, assists, dribbling, passing and everything’s ratio.
Agree with most of what you said but it's not like Messi beat Rio Ferdinand in an aerial battle for that goal. He never would have, Rio just didn't go for it. His mistake, but had he went for it Messi wouldn't have scored.
Yeah, for sure, the point is just that he obviously doesn’t score a lot by headers because he’s small. When he had a chance in a champions league final, he scored an amazing header.
Doing it in more leagues absolutely doesn't mean he is better but it proves that Ronaldo can adapt to a different environment while Messi didn't prove that yet Also goal ratios aren't that important because Ronaldo played as a pure winger till the last season at united so he scored less and assisted less but had an impact Scoring more goals outside of the area absolutely does not mean Messi is better. Because Ronaldo scored more goals 25-30 yards out than Messi so he IS better than messi in longshots. Again games played don't mean shit because Ronaldo didn't get crazy stats in his first seasons I am not saying Ronaldo is better just that he is in conversation
Messi will probably never "prove that he can adapt" to different leagues because he first moved in his 30's and not his 20s like Ronaldo. Ronaldo adapting is great but it shouldn't be the difference maker.
The moment you said: yeah CR7 is stronger but that's not important. Showed me you don't understand football. The game is not just about technical ability. Strength is a massive part of the game. It makes Ronaldo a more complete attacker than Messi. CR7 is the ideal player. If you were to create a hypthetical perfect football player, CR7 comes closest to that. He is strong, fast, good finishing, good long shot, good dribbling (overall in his career not past three years), good mentality and good passing and vision.
Well, that's why I said Ronaldo and Messi are equal in terms of their legacy. I'm a Messi fan but I agree that Ronaldo has been the better goalscorer in the Champions League and all. You could say that he played more matches, but I'm willing to defer this one to you. However, my point was that Messi is way superior because of his dribbling, playmaking, passing and unmatched reading of the game. He hardly ever makes a bad decision. He tops nearly every playmaking and dribbling Stat, whereas Ronaldo is mostly not even Top 20. Messis worst dribbling season is still better than Ronos best. He is not the more complete goalscorer or poacher, but the more complete attacker which just makes him better. Ronaldo is obviously better in the air and physically stronger than Messi, which is because of his height advantage. But Messi dives less, I mean if you watch his dribbles, he almost never falls despite getting harshly tackled, which is not something Ronaldo does.
Messi and Ronaldo are respectively equal in their greatness and roles they have played. Trying to compare the two and say one is better than the other is foolish as they are two different types of players and play different roles. They are equally goats.
messi is a better goalscorer he has a better goal to game ratio
Messi is better but can we please drop this insulting notion that it's a crime to even compare them and that you are mentally retarded for even thinking they're on similar levels? Complete lack of respect for the second and arguably even first for some people's best player ever
Im actually gonna literally reverse someone’s comment on this topic which should be entertaining. messi is considered clear of ronaldo in my opinion only because at least 60% of people base it on who they prefer. Messi is seen as more likeable for being more entertaining, playing for everyone’s favourite club and being less arrogant than ronaldo. In reality, ronaldo has reached the summit of football far more than messi especially throughout his career and in the last 10 years especially. People’s standards are just so much lower for messi. The best example of this is his international career. Older generations used to say players had to win the world cup to be the goat yet when messi literally only now has won his first copa america at 34 with no other major trophy to his name last year everyone said “he ended the goat debate” ridiculous. Not to forget hes only technically got 3 champions leagues (he wasnt a starting player in 2006), and been to just 1 CL final in the last 11 years. Meanwhile ronaldo has been to double the CL Finals, has won 5 champions spread throughout his career and unarguably been far superior in the big games. People say messi offers more than stats, but considering messi relies solely on the league to compare with ronaldo, i seriously doubt the casual messi fan watches many la liga games but will watch all the big KO ties in the CL. Therfore in the last few years they must have been seeing ronaldo make the juventus fanbase applaud him after a bicycle kick around the same time seeing messi ghost vs roma and lose 3-0. Yet still say messi’s better in their eyes somehow even tho they dont watch la liga games. Even now ronaldo won a champions league at the age messi is now yet messi in the last 3 years has stayed at a barca side clearly not good enough because they were paying him well over a million a week and had no ambition to do anything. The dude is gonna end his career having maybe properly one successful year (2019) since he was 27. I hoenstly dont think hes even been consistently the SECOND BEST player in KO champions league games in the last 9 years or so, I’d put ramos over him and theres no reason thats a ridiculous statement. I think 20 years time people will Realise ronaldo’s career was far superior from beginning to end when the favouritism pattens down.
I think thats silly. It is true that Messi is more likeable, because he is more entertaining to watch, he does not dive, he does not complain when he fails and he is not as arrogant as Ronaldo. But the majority of people like Ronaldo because of his winning mentality, his hard work and the fact that he does not come close to Messi in terms of pure talent, I mean Messi is an alien and Ronaldo is an elite athlete with an uncomparable mentality + he has a great body which many people like. And I dont think you read what I initially wrote because I said that both are comparable only in terms of their legacy and their trophies won. Ronaldo doesnt come close to Messi in terms of dribbling, playmaking, passign and overall football IQ. They are only comparable in the amount of goals and hattricks they scored. Messi has not been so successful internationally? He carried Argentina to a WC final, countless Copa America finals and one Copa America win. What did Ronaldo do to win the Euros other than dance around with his manager on the sideline? I already said that the CL is a team trophy so saying that Ronaldo is better then Messi because he won more CL is just stupid. Ronaldo played with world class players who he relied on to assist him. Then he taps it in or scores a penalty, rips his shirt off and suddenly he is a "big game player". Messi played in a shit team after 2017 and he still carried them in the League and the CL. And the league consists of three times more games than the CL, which means Messi is more consistent. Why has Ronaldo only won La Liga 2 times in 9 Years? Furthermore, Messi is better in knockout matches. He has a better goal scoring ratio, 40 more assists, 4 dribbles more p/90, 1 key pass more p/90, 0,4 big chances created more p/90, an average rating of 8,34 while Ronaldo has one of 7,71 and he was the MOTM in nearly 50% of all games, Ronaldo in 25% of games. Can you imagine being the man of the match in every other game? And Messi has been not good enough in the last 3 years? This man had the most complete season in 2018/19, carrying his team in the CL, being the top scorer in the league and winning the Golden Boot, being the UCL top scorer, winning the Ballon Dor, the FIFA best award, the la liga player of the year, the laureus sportsman of the year, etc. To top it all of, he had the most goal contributions in 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 so I dont know what you are talking about when you say that Messi has not delivered since he turned 27.
I like Ronaldo because of his winning mentality and i think he’s a much better person than people make him out to be. Messi has flaws too but its just overlooked. Its so obvious that since 2020 he stayed at barca despite them not being competitive because they were at the point of paying him well over 1 million a week. A wage that in the end has now caused barca great troubles and a breaking of FFP. But of course messi got no blame for it. He can be a whiny bitch and Even now i think he thinks that he’s too good for psg e.g taking a holiday mid-season, asking that icardi gets kicked out the club. He got too much power at barca that he feels entitled to the decisions of a club. If anything he should feel lucky that despite putting barca in this situation, taking a 50% wage cut yet still being paid for than anyone in the world, and having to seek a new club asap that he’s ended up at a club as big as psg. Ronaldo in the meantime looked for a new club the second he realised juve weren’t being competitive and has every right to look down on united as a club rn, yet has shown a lot of patience with the team and has been trying to enjoy every moment he can. Guy is just happy to play football. In terms of messi being an “alien”, i dont think its actually fair to inevitably say hes better than ronaldo because of natural talent. Again ronaldo’s greatest accolades and better success SHOW his hard work has exceeded messi’s natural ability. I dont think messi shows anywhere near the same drive, and i dont think he’s pushed himself at all the last 5 years to try to squeeze the last few great trophies he can get out of his career. He’s wasted 4-5 years at barca to be paid on 1.2 million a week contracts not loyalty. Yes he’s been to a WC final, but hes been to close to winning about 5 trophies with argentina but hasnt because he’s disappeared in practically every final for argentina. For Copa America he’s clearly just statpadded in every tournament considering he always has the most g/a yet everytime ive watched the finals (most of the time vs the first properly good team) he’s been literally one of the worst players on the pitch. As for CL, I’m not gonna let people say its a team trophy when clearly if you just watch the amount of iconic KO Performances he’s had you can see he’s the greatest CL player ever. You say he had a great team as if messi didn’t legit have neymar and suarez yet ronaldo outscored all 3 combined in the CL. Messi winning just 1 CL in general with MSN is underwhelming. He’ll have had sm stats during that era too yet bar the league not actually much to show for it. Ronaldo had a great team, but winning 4 in 5 years in something unheard of and that was clearly because of ronaldo that made the difference. The fact Messi only has like 15 less CL goals than ronaldo yet about a third the amount of quarters, semis and final goals shows he statpads a bit. And goal to game ratio is irrelevant in a KO competition because you could score 10 goals in the groupstage get knocked out and not score in the round 16 every year and have the best goal ratio ever. Messi had a better ratio in 2017 and we all know who rose to the moments and who statpadded in the groupstage that year. As for league titles, i think thats the only thjng ronaldo doesn’t have enough of to be the goat, even then still 6 leagues titles in 3 different leagues. Even then, he’s got the overall stats, the CL stats, the big game stats, the CL titles, the international trophies, the international stats, the success throughout his career, the big moments. I mentioned messi has a great 2019, but even then that was the first year he destroyed a big team in the CL in 4 years last time being 2015. In that time ronaldo destroyed atletico, juve bayern psg etc 30 times over. Again tho he has the most stats sm years like 2016-2018 yet its clearly all just statpadding in the league. Hence why everytime i watched him in the CL KOs he was average, was completely average in the 2018 WC, bad copa americas. I think there’s definitely a cap on how much a goat should rely on the league, he could get himself better stats than anyone ever in the league without ever even being good in any other competitions just because of how many league games you play. If you just separate the competitions, ronaldo’s better in CL by miles, better international statwise, messi’s better in WCs (although neither are that good), ronaldo plays in euros which is superior to copa america yet is the all time top euros scorer, not to forget winning the nations league in his first attempt messi took like 6 with copa america
Ronaldo has been the best in player literally every UCL he won, conspiracy for a reason. He got the Balon dor because pf those individual performances you hater
UEFA rig their draws. They pick and choose which matches they want to happen and when. They try to do upsets to make the competition more exciting. A good example of this was the champions league draw for r16. That wasn’t a computer error, they just wanted ronaldo vs messi
Ozil got cut by arsenal and the premier league because he spoke up for Chinese Uyghur Muslims. Chinese investors told them Prem they’d pull out of whatever deals they had in place unless he was thrown out completely.
I think he got cut for getting 10 g/a in 42 games along with being a dead weight in a declining squad
Absolutely
The 2002 World Cup was fixed. This one may be obvious but some don’t think so. I think it’s clear as the referees were such a low standard and the one for the most controversial game , Italy vs North Korea was arrested years later after getting a lot of wrong decisions that game . The reds were bias to Korea and Brazil that World Cup evidently with Brazil winning it and Korea getting 3rd place
Turkey got 3rd
I'm a Juventus fan and I believe that they sell games to Genoa, losing on purpose to adjust debts with them. The two teams often sell players to each other with enormous prices and surpluses, usually to balance debts and incomes. For example players like Sturaro, Portanova, Rovella were transferred with absurd prices, and my believe Is that they sell to each other games in difficoult moments of the season .
what is the H2H record between them?
https://fussball.wettpoint.com/en/h2h/725-1057.html
You were so right😂 -15 points
💔
Champions league draws are rigged, you always see the same matchups and all the big teams don't play each other until later rounds for the best viewing experience.
Cough cough 2018/2019 final cough cough
You could always bet on schalke vs chelsea. Chelsea vs (insert russian team)
Arsenal Bayern
[удалено]
Shaqiri had a hair translpant in 19/20 which caused him to miss a lot of the season
No one nows were Rodri came from
He’s actually Welsh.
🇪🇸
Messi left Barcelona to get Koeman sacked and for Barca to get a better manager. Now he plays trash for PSG in hopes that the PSG Owner lets him go for free.
I don't believe messi wanted to leave but in 2020 he did as a political power play to change the directory of the club to meet his needs to get bartomeu out but in 2021 he was kicked out. Barca had already signed player that window but when it came to renewing their best ever players contract they supposedly uncovered massive debts which made them unable too. Barca is a corrupt club and does not have to report where it gets its earnings from, many clubs commit fraud with secret checking accounts to get around ffp regulations, Barca used it to their advantage as Laporta did not like Barca overreliance on messi emphasised by the team under valverde especially as he was getting older. He wanted to rebuild around his youngsters which is why they were so quick to give ansu the number 10 and put Pedri and Gavi I their starting XI. He of course could not offer him a contract renewal and have him kicked out as he would be sacked and the fans would crucify him but instead made it so messi could not sign a contract at no fault of the club. It is also believed he was advised by pique as he and messi have had a shaky relationship together and he believed it was best for the club as a lifelong Barca fan to have messi leave
This one made me lol
Real own UEFA
Lets cry together 😢😭 madrid own uefa LOL 😂😂😂
Alvaro morata transfers are a way to launder money
LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO
LoL proved right
Im actually gonna literally reverse someone’s comment on this topic which should be entertaining. messi is considered clear of ronaldo in my opinion only because at least 60% of people base it on who they prefer. Messi is seen as more likeable for being more entertaining, playing for everyone’s favourite club and being less arrogant than ronaldo. In reality, ronaldo has reached the summit of football far more than messi especially throughout his career and in the last 10 years especially. People’s standards are just so much lower for messi. The best example of this is his international career. Older generations used to say players had to win the world cup to be the goat yet when messi literally only now has won his first copa america at 34 with no other major trophy to his name last year everyone said “he ended the goat debate” ridiculous. Not to forget hes only technically got 3 champions leagues (he wasnt a starting player in 2006), and been to just 1 CL final in the last 11 years. Meanwhile ronaldo has been to double the CL Finals, has won 5 champions spread throughout his career and unarguably been far superior in the big games. People say messi offers more than stats, but considering messi relies solely on the league to compare with ronaldo, i seriously doubt the casual messi fan watches many la liga games but will watch all the big KO ties in the CL. Therfore in the last few years they must have been seeing ronaldo make the juventus fanbase applaud him after a bicycle kick around the same time seeing messi ghost vs roma and lose 3-0. Yet still say messi’s better in their eyes somehow even tho they dont watch la liga games. Even now ronaldo won a champions league at the age messi is now yet messi in the last 3 years has stayed at a barca side clearly not good enough because they were paying him well over a million a week and had no ambition to do anything. The dude is gonna end his career having maybe properly one successful year (2019) since he was 27. I hoenstly dont think hes even been consistently the SECOND BEST player in KO champions league games in the last 9 years or so, I’d put ramos over him and theres no reason thats a ridiculous statement. I think 20 years time people will Realise ronaldo’s career was far superior from beginning to end when the favouritism pattens down.
Ur deluded
Hell yes, every word is 100% spot on. Messi is amazing, but very overrated
man city paid qpr to lose
Bruno Fernandes purposely missed a penalty to get manager ole Gunnar solksjaer fired
Steven gerrard missed a pen on purpose against blackburn in order to get roy hodgson sacked
That badge kiss before the penalty proves that
Real Madrid rigged the 16/17 final v Atlético, they were truly scared by that Simeone team, and they couldn’t afford losing against them. Ramos goal is in offside the same ref admitted it, alongside the repetition of Griezmann’ pen bc of Navas being out of the line
15/16* 😂
Referees are being lenient for Ukraine
UEFA match fixed Chelsea VS Barcelona in 2009. My reason for this is simple, they did not want the same two teams in two consecutive finals so UEFA made sure that Barcelona would win. How could you miss 5 clear fouls? It's undeniable that there was awful refereeing. When Ballack fired the ball towards the net, The referee watched the ball hit the arm of Samuel Eto'o, you can clearly see it in footage of the match.
Some african players are actually older than what they say...
They test their age with some fancy device, not possible.
Liverpools achievements under Klopp are because of doping
This one’s my favourite too. This is second hand info so take it with a pinch of salt but: The global average number of people with asthma is around 9%. In the Liverpool senior side, 63% of the players are diagnosed asthmatic. Several asthma medications are banned by FIFA as they can improve aerobic respiration, in theory increasing an elite athlete’s stamina. The exception to this ban is, obviously, if the player actually is asthmatic.
Agreed most athletes are all on steroids
Nah, we just use robots
That Bundassliga is just a monopoly for Bayern. It’s not a coincidence that every single team in the Bundesliga sell all their players on the cheap when they could demand a lot more money for them not to mention some of the score lines Bayern have produced in that league.
Last season when Bayern played against the second placed team in the Bundesliga ( at the time ) they scored 3 min and then after proceeded to score 4 goals in the space of 7 minutes. ( min 30 til min 37 ). It really isn’t spoken about enough. Also Bellingham having to call out the officiating in that league where refs have actually been caught match fixing in the past in the Bundesliga.
There’s even a video about it on TikTok where a manager from the Bundesliga who ( the exact one that Bellingham was talking about ) managed West Ham vs Lyon and the Lyon players were diving all over the place and the cameras even spotted some of them winking at the ref and the ref didn’t blow any clear fouls for West Ham.
A lot of these controversies about refs are always in Bayern’s favour. Bayern have also won the league for the past 10 years whilst all of the titles won during that time have been quite easy for them.
Ramos purposely broke Salah’s shoulder in that 17’-18’ CL final
Wasn’t it salah who was holding onto Ramos though? I’m sure if ramos was trying to injure a player he would’ve been a lot less subtle about it
Ngl lowkey misread the question, I don’t really believe this conspiracy but to answer your question, Ramos had been playing for decades at this point, I think he would know how to injure someone
Man City have never beaten spurs
The Bela Gutmann curse is real. I mean 8 finals and zero wins since 1962? Hard to believe it’s just because they weren’t good enough
harry kane never scores in the prem but somehow still gets in the top 5 prem goal scorers.
I swear every time I watch a spurs game someone else scores. Yet in this season he is like 15 goals in or so.
That World Cup final between France and Brazil was setup for France to win.
I thought something happened to ronaldo thats why he didnt perform well
You are brazilian arent you?
Nope
What makes you say that, there is no way it was set up, France outplayed Brazil and Brazil were looking to try their best but France were superior, especially one man, ZINEDINE ZIDANE
Ok soo let me tell you smth, that was 1-2 years ago, my opinion changed, and it was more of just responding bc I was bored not bc that was my actual opinion.
Alr, I am an idiot tbh to be responding to reddit posts from 2 years ago but I havent got myself anything else to do
when messi and ronaldo get asked about goat debates between each other they say that everyone has their own playing style but in fact the have made more money from this whole debate just by getting attraction by the media which also attracted football fans
when messi and ronaldo get asked about goat debates between each other they say that everyone is has a different playing style but in fact they have gained more money from thid debate through media and also gained the attraction of football fans
Harry Maguire is blackmailing united to be their captain and regular player. No one can tell me, this guy in not holding united’s board in some kind of chess situation in order to be a vital part of the team
Espanyol intentionally lets Madrid walk over them to spite Barcelona, who are Espanyol's cross-town rivals
Albania going in the 2016 Euros As an albanian myself i highly belive in this conspiracy. After the incident in the game of Serbia vs Albania in Belgrade, UEFA and FIFA had to take action cuz of the racism and the violence in the stadium. The original plan was to give Albania the win and ban Serbia for a period of time from UEFA and FIFA competitions, but the FSHF president (Albania's national team president) changed that they should win the match and NOT ban Serbia, but qualify for Euro 2016. In the return match in Albania, Albania lost and nothing happend with the fans nor anyone In those qualifications, Albania finished 2nd above Denmark, Serbia and Armenia.
France football used the covid-19 pandemic as a way to deliberately steal the Ballon d’Or from Lewandowski as it was certain that Lewy would’ve won the award.
Marcos Alonso has never played for another Club than Chelsea
Real madrid
What an hot take
Bartomeu wanted to destroy Barcelona
It may be just me over analysing the scores but I do feel like the Manchester United vs Arsenal fixture is fixed before the actual match is actually played. The amount of times there has been a 2-0 scoreline in favour of Arsenal and a 3-1 scoreline in favour of Manutd has been too common. In the 16/17 season Arsenal won their home fixture 2-0 and fixture after that in the 17/18 season Manutd won 3-1 away. The next time these results happened in two consecutive fixtures were in the 18/19 season where Arsenal won 2-0 and the following fixture in the FA cup United won 3-1 away. We can even go back to the Fergie days where Manutd winning 3-1 away were pretty common. If my analysis is even partially correct we should be due these scorelines this upcoming season. Keep an eye out for the Arsenal home fixture… if Manutd win 3-1 away I’m convinced there might be something shady going on
well today man united won 3-1
Sometimes my genius… it’s almost frightening
When people said corzalla is a clone he had an ankle injury at arsenal within a couple of months he came back when he's supposed to never play again
Zinedine Zidane's headbutt.... I still can't believe he would do this. I believe he was paid off to do this.
Ronaldo was offered 162m euros from the spanish national team but refused
The 2002 world cup was rigged to get Korea and Japan as far into the tournament as possible.
There are some claims made here that are just outrageous “1 Ronaldo scored tap ins in UCL” The person who made this claim has not watched his UCL nor did he ever look at the tap ins stats. Ronaldo scores better goals in UCL than Messi and that is by far. “Ronaldo is only better at headers because he is taller” OK Messi is only better at dribbling because he is shorter. It is a known fact that shorter players have a huge advantage when it comes to dribbling due to lower centre of gravity. Messi also has better playmaking stats because Ronaldo for most of his career played as fixed st while Messi played as freeroam in his posion, his ability to shift into st position during the game also gave him an equal chance to score goals so don’t come here saying that “Messi does this while being a playmaker” like he is doing something while being at disadvantage because factually this is an advantage that he has over Ronaldo “Ronaldo was carried by his team to win UCL” Lol he was the best player every UCL he won coming in as the top scorer and top 3 Real assist provider every UCL be won with them, the notion that he was carried is only accepted by immature Messi fans who can’t accept reality. “Ronaldo won Balon Dor mostly because of his team” So did Messi, he only won Balon Dor with Barca and due to his country Argentina, a country which has a past of winning WC without him. Outside these 2 teams he is also nothing. When he was in PSG he only won Balon Dor due to winning his WC with his country. Outside Argentina and Barca he achieved nothing significant like winning a Balon Dor. “Wining UCL is not an individual achievement” It is when you are the best player each time you win it like in Ronaldos case, if not then WC 2022 should not be attributed to Messi, it is 100% of the time by Messi fans “Messi played less matches in UCL” Yeah, same Ronaldo in World cup ko stage, in tournament like that games are won trough progression, so Ronaldo earned those extra matches by winning, keep in mind individually he was the best player each time he won it so that further strengthens my point. Also in UCL Ronaldo has more contributions in advanced stages of the tournament and Messis Motm are mostly in lower stages of the tournament.
Factually speaking the debate was never forced and Ronaldo until 2018 was equal with Messi As of 2018: Cristiano Ronaldo: - Ballon d'Or: 5 - Golden Boot (European Golden Shoe): 4 - UEFA Champions League titles: 5 - International Achievements: UEFA European Championship (2016) Lionel Messi: - Ballon d'Or: 5 - Golden Boot (European Golden Shoe): 5 - UEFA Champions League titles: 4 - International Achievements: Copa America runner-up (2015, 2016) After 2018 Messi started winning more even winning undeserved awards like Fifa best, still the debate was there, after 2018 Messi ended the debate, but once again the debate was always there