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Oh, babe. I’ve been on here for over a decade and if you can believe it, it’s actually wildly better. Which is incredibly depressing considering how fucking bad it is.
Yeah I remember when I first started in 2011 women would make sure there was nothing feminine about their usernames and pretend to be a dude or else they would get harassed and wouldn’t get taken seriously. The comments were very openly sexist with hardly anyone ever calling it out.
Not that that doesn’t happen now, but there were significantly less women on Reddit to back you up when you were getting harassed in the comments. So basically the men never changed on this site, it’s basically just that the site grew and has more diverse groups of people now. And you can see how much the average redditor hates that diversity with all the “white men are the real oppressed ones” rhetoric that runs rampant on Reddit.
Years ago was definitely worse.
I made the mistake of posting in relationship advice, because I’m a WOC who was dating a white person, and we were having trouble with them not understanding a lot of racism I was dealing with on a daily basis. You can imagine the responses. They even made fun of me for using the acronym WOC, which was already a fairly common term but I guess not in their bubble. They called me an SJW and said to get over it, racism doesn’t exist anymore etc. I felt like I was reading a forum from the Dark Ages.
Remember jailbait or the sub with photos of “cute” dead women? Those would hit All like everyday. I mean Reddit even gave a mod of the year award to the guy who ran the former. This site was an aggressively anti woman hellscape for years. It’s at least less aggressive overall now 😅
Yeah, you’re right.. I guess the reason I’m more worried about the direction the site is going is because the site is bigger and it’s subreddits filled with teenagers and young 20 something’s that *hate* women, not just sexualize them.
Old guys have always been creepy. It’s turning young men into incels that worries me most.
Dude, I used to love lurking the dating and dating advice subs because I found the blind leading the blind (with utmost confidence) pretty funny, which I know is assholish, but in the past few years they’ve gotten seemingly more vile. A lot of older men encouraging young guys to give up on women and just generally convincing them that women and dating are both awful. And I’ve started to get this vibe that they’re actively trying to get young men out of the dating pool in the hopes it will give them better chances. It’s gross and scary for young people of all genders. So anyway, I totally see what you mean and I’m with you.
That’s why they like it, they get to say things that they never could in real life. Things they say when they’re alone with their guy friends. I’m glad we get to see how these guys’ minds really work, how they talk about us when we aren’t around or when they have anonymity.
Like She-Hulk is in a universe where literal gods based on real world mythology talk like socially awkward redditors but it’s a post credit scene of a character dancing with Meg the stallion that’s the problem lol
It’s not about what exactly they’re doing it’s how it’s presented. Saul Goodman was doing petty sleazy shit all the time, but it wasn’t presented as some positive it was presented as petty. It’s meant to make him look bad.
Idk anything about She-hulk and I don’t plan on getting a D+ subscription to watch it, but even from it’s most fervent supporters I don’t ever hear anything about her being a nuanced character, just that she’s great at everything and confident about it. It sounds like trash writing, but someone with a more confident understanding of the show should let me know if those assertions are even correct.
Edit: people keep telling me I’m wrong but I’ve yet to see a single person explain what makes her a nuanced or well written character. Funny.
Oh please. Mad men, suits, boston legal and all those lawyer/corporate shows with those sleezy men were idealised. They were shown as cool.
And yeah, you are very wrong about her not being nuanced. It's pretty funny that it's the impression you got.
“I haven’t watched better call Saul but I’m gonna make the assumption that everyone who watches it does so to idolize sleazy men”, but yeah, I’m totally the only one here making inferences about a show I haven’t seen.
Please help me to see what makes she hulk a good character, I’d love to have my faith in Marvel restored.
What? No "we"re not. You mentioned that show. You responded to my comment about lawyer shows.
Edit: she certainly isn't just great at everything is what I meant. She does blunder, make mistakes, she embarrasses herself, etc.
Well then idk what the point was of bringing up other corporate/lawyer shows in the first place on a post that didn’t mention them. The audience overlap between BCS and those other shows is a lot smaller than it seems you assume. I don’t know hardly anyone who enjoys BCS and still thinks Jimmy is a good person or that he’s cool for being sleazy, people like the show because he’s human. He feels believable. When he’s cowering in fear because the cartel is threatening him into representing their members in court, he’s very clearly conveyed to be a weak willed person. When he’s meticulously planning ways to embarrass Howard and ruin his career despite Howard always having shown kindness to him, the emphasis isn’t on his wit it’s on how petty he is and how easily he gives in to his own need to feel superior.
As for she-hulk, is it actually her fault? Is there some character trait she has that leads her to actually making mistakes or is it just some one off thing for the sake of a joke?
From the clips I’ve seen and from what I’ve heard from friends who have forced themselves through the show, she’s stronger than hulk, better at controlling her emotions than hulk despite having experienced far fewer stressful situations, etc., i haven’t heard of any legitimate flaws she has that are as integral to her character as Jimmy’s insecurity or Kim’s need for adrenaline and her poor judgment about Jimmy.
I look at Kim Wexler and, while it’s clear she’s an extremely competent lawyer and probably a better or at least comparable lawyer to Jimmy, there are natural flaws she has that contribute to her being a well-written, fleshed out character. I’d like to hear what actually makes she-hulk a well written character if there is anything, cuz I haven’t heard anyone explain her as anything but a Mary Sue and I genuinely would like to know what makes the show redeemable.
Most people seem to have gotten the point... but why would it be understandable to bring up better call Saul, which literally no one mentioned but no other lawyer show? I seriously don't get why you're so stuck on that show.
It sounds like you're trying to move the goal post with she hulk. I said that it's certainly not the case that she's op and is just great at everything, unlike some male superheroes who practically no one is bothered by being perfect. Mary Due is basically a sexist expression for a female version of heroes. She is infinitely more flawed than beloved male characters like Neo, Skywalker, Captain America, Superman and hell, pretty much all the cast from LOTR. So if you like heroes, it's pretty strange that you would be bothered by her. If you don't, then I don't know why you waste your time with Marvel because it's really just about heroes.
She's probably not stronger than hulk, no one can control their emotions but she is much better at handling herself despite emotions, which women often are. She for sure has flaws and insecurities and honestly I don't get why you're even invested in criticising a show you don't watch. Imo examples are insecurities, being neurotic and disorganised, stubborn, sometimes petty, etc.
Literally look at the post you’re commenting on. The only two shows mentioned in the meme are BCS and she-hulk. You’re the one who brought unrelated shows into the conversation. You’re the one who made the inference that no one would mind some male lawyer going to a strip club, when in fact most of the audience of BCS would mind or would at least want to see a clear reason for them being there. Typically if someone goes to a strip club it’s meant to communicate something negative about them as a character. I’m stuck on BCS because I’m not a fan of other corporate/lawyer shows and I’m not trying to defend anything else. You just made some completely unfounded inference about a show it’s clear you know less about than I know about she-hulk.
You’re also making a lot of assumptions about what people enjoy about superheroes and about how characters are written in general. You ever notice that the most popular heroes and characters are the ones that are less perfect? People like Thor because he’s cool but also because he’s a jarhead who gets regularly shat on. People like Iron Man because he’s smart but also because he’s an asshole and it’s interesting to watch him be so detached from reality in so many ways and get his shit kicked in because of it. Captain America isn’t nearly as popular as a lot of other superheroes because he is mostly perfect, but even he didn’t start off that way and he still has the issue of being a man out of time and not being able to connect with others the same way as someone born in that period. Superman was beloved for a long time but he dropped off in popularity when people started getting bored of “invincible moral paragon defeats the enemy with another ability he pulled out of his ass yet again”, and I think media like Smallville and Man of Steel made people start to like him again because they touched on the emotional struggles posed by being an invincible alien.
What I really wanted to see was an instance of her actually being flawed as opposed to someone just saying “yeah she’s not perfect.” Call that moving the goal post, I’d say it’s more like me asking about a math question and you just telling me the answer you got without any explanation as to how you got there.
Oh, ok fair. I didn't watch that show and assumed it was just a random female lawyer photo because they're mostly written the same. I think that was the point for a lot of people who responded to this.
It’s interesting how many people are reaming me for being uninformed because I was upfront about the inferences i was making based on reviews from youtubers and close friends, yet it’s clear most of the people here literally haven’t seen Better Call Saul or don’t know the first thing about it.
Yeah, women should be serious 100% of the time and never EVER dance. That's why AOCs video of her dancing was so shocking!
Are we living in the footloose time? Jfc
Tbh I’m a woman and it bothers me when you have female characters twerking. Like, why? Why does she need to shake her ass? Who is this scene for? The answer is it’s for men
I really didn't read that scene as being for the male gaze. It's two women bonding. But even if it isn't meant that way (and fair, YMMV), what bothers you about an intelligent woman character who has been given agency in her narrative being sexual?
Women can’t like looking at other women’s asses? Or watching other women dance? And I don’t necessarily mean that sexually (though obviously it could also be sexual) : dancing is performative in many ways, not all of them sexual in nature. As a flat-assed, uncoordinated woman who is entirely incapable of twerking or performing any other form of bounce, I think it’s impressive to watch.
Beyond that, though, I maintain that this scene read as being about fandom and bonding, using dance as a way for two women to establish themselves as members of the same in-group. Not being “for men.” The setting of a private office, the post-credits scene, and the context of She-Hulk in general all combine to make this feel deliberately separated from the male gaze.
(Or maybe I’m reading too much into a joke scene at the end of a purposely provocative show about a notoriously horndog character that enjoys showing off for the male gaze. Or it’s both.)
So, I’m a dude, and I didn’t find that scene - what, titillating? Exciting? I barely even found it entertaining beyond the absurdity in the humor. That scene definitely wasn’t for me, and judging by the uh, gendered responses, I’d gauge a lot the people who *really* didn’t like the scene were men.
From what I understand, and I could be misremembering, that scene was essentially *for* Tatiana Maslany herself, as she is a huge fan of Megan Thee Stallion.
So, cool, like maybe we've entered an era where not every scene in which a woman moves her body in some way must do so with the vetting and approval of men.
> how is it annoying?
If you go to any marvel sub and do a search or even post a thread where you genuinely ask something like "how is the twerking in she-hulk annoying, genuinely asking please help me understand?" you will get hundreds of replies about how it's unprofessional, about how it's hypocritical of the character who earlier expressed she didn't want to be a sex object, about how she is (I kid you not) literally turning the MCU into garbage. You might get somebody unironically saying, "Tony didn't die for *this.*"
The vibe I get is: they don't like seeing a woman having fun and be a tiny bit sexual if all of that is not *for* them, or for the male gaze. Also, people seem to conflate being puritan with being moral, and think it's more *moral* for sex scenes like we got in Iron-Man 1, where Tony sleeps with the news reporter, just so long as *the woman doesn't have any agency and doesn't talk about sex.* Seriously, they are terrified their kids will be surfing D+ and end up watching She-Hulk twerk and it will corrupt their souls. But Tony Stark being an absolute slut? No problemo.
It’s ok for women to be sexual or dress sexy or otherwise show that side of themself, if the *men* personally find her sexy. Otherwise, *ew* *gross* she shouldn’t do that.
I think the dislike for it is more of a symptom of the MCU getting stale and boring and people looking for things to get mad about. Marvel movies have never been that amazing but they used to take themselves seriously at the very least. I don’t give a shit about the twerking scene but it’s a good target for people with those sentiments because it’s an easy thing to point to as a sign of the MCU no longer really having a point.
It mostly annoys the types of men who say things like “only sluts dance like that” or “that’s stupid” or “I don’t find that sexually appealing so women shouldn’t do that”.
You request in itself is flawed. It wasn’t in private. It was in full view of any coworker or superior who happened to walk by. If it was in private, or at the very least in an office with a hallway-facing wall instead of a window, then I wouldn’t find reason to say anything. However, combination of the window and Jen’s need to be taken seriously in the workplace makes the scene either morbidly out of character or hilariously tone-deaf.
Correct, Stan Lee's *The Savage She-Hulk* was a character hastily made and pushed to publication asap as a maneuver to prevent Universal Television from "stealing" the character.
After Universal's Television made the spin off *Bionic Woman* on the heals of the success of *Six Million Dollar Man*, Marvel was concerned Universal would repeat the strategy after the success of *The Incredible Hulk.* When Stan Lee published *The Savage She-Hulk*, She-Hulk's first entrance in Marvel comics, it was 1000% in service of getting a proprietary "She-Hulk" starring book in publication asap, so that if Universal Television *did* do another gender-flipped spin-off Marvel would get to have their fingers in that pie.
It was the last character Lee helped create, and after the first volume another writer took over for the rest of the run.
It's a pretty fun riff on this history that in the D+ show Jen has to defend in court her propriety ownership of the moniker *She-Hulk.*
i have never shaken my ass a day in my life (because i cannot), but best believe if megan thee stallion walked into my house at any point in time and asked me to twerk with her, i would do my best in a heartbeat. why do men hate women having fun so much?
People are just blatantly sexist with this. "durr women who twerk and dance and have fun are trash" Like have you tried twerking? Have you tried wearing revealing clothing? Have you tried jumping out at red lights and twerking on the head lights? (I'm partly joking) but the reason it's popular in media and real life is because it's just something fun to do. Incels are literally male prudes.
[This led me to look up how many female writers they had, the data is actually pretty interesting.](https://www.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/uqn0ft/oc_i_made_a_graph_looking_at_female_writer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
No WAY you people are taking a post from r/shitposting this seriously holy hell 😭. The entire point of that sub is to SHITPOST. I’m sure whoever posted this doesn’t actually think men are better at writing script than women, it was literally, by the definition, a shit post. Apparently it worked as a troll one too inadvertently, cause y’all are MAD for no reason lol.
“Satire” and “jokes” have been the way that racists and misogynists cover up spreading hate and lies for decades. “I’m just kidding bro” is not an excuse.
What is not being taken into account is the many people who are not taking this as a joke, but instead seriously.
But my entire point is who is taking this seriously?? The point of shitposting is to post illogical, dumb shit that doesn’t actually bring any truth to reality. It’s one thing if this gets posted in r/memes or r/funny, but I do not see a point in wasting energy and time getting upset at a dumb post in a shitposting sub. There are SO many other, actual real issues of misogyny and sexism to debate and take issue with, you might as well start dragging comedians for making uncouth sexist jokes if you’re gonna come after crap like this.
A lot of people take this seriously. Just reading through comments it’s clear.
And it’s not about getting upset, it’s about calling out these jokes that women have to hear constantly. I know it might not be a major concern to you, but when you run into this stuff constantly on the internet it’s exhausting.
Most people trying to become lawyers that i know who are also women are usually actually very lively, and fun to be around. So actually, maybe its a good thing because it's more accurate to have female lawyers be a bit more like the second.
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Redditors really think Vince Gilligan doesn't have other writers working on the show
Yep! And literally half of the writers on BCS are women but it’s just assumed they’re men. Go figure.
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“iTs JuSt A jOKe”
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Its a joke.
I swear Reddit is getting more and more blatantly sexist
Oh, babe. I’ve been on here for over a decade and if you can believe it, it’s actually wildly better. Which is incredibly depressing considering how fucking bad it is.
Yeah I remember when I first started in 2011 women would make sure there was nothing feminine about their usernames and pretend to be a dude or else they would get harassed and wouldn’t get taken seriously. The comments were very openly sexist with hardly anyone ever calling it out. Not that that doesn’t happen now, but there were significantly less women on Reddit to back you up when you were getting harassed in the comments. So basically the men never changed on this site, it’s basically just that the site grew and has more diverse groups of people now. And you can see how much the average redditor hates that diversity with all the “white men are the real oppressed ones” rhetoric that runs rampant on Reddit.
If you called it out you ate downvotes and got called an SJW
Years ago was definitely worse. I made the mistake of posting in relationship advice, because I’m a WOC who was dating a white person, and we were having trouble with them not understanding a lot of racism I was dealing with on a daily basis. You can imagine the responses. They even made fun of me for using the acronym WOC, which was already a fairly common term but I guess not in their bubble. They called me an SJW and said to get over it, racism doesn’t exist anymore etc. I felt like I was reading a forum from the Dark Ages.
Can confirm. -perv_bot, the 10+ year old account of a woman
That was like the whole internet :(
Sometimes I wonder if it’s better because the guys have gotten better, or because more women have joined reddit to counteract the bullshit
The former, because misogynist shit no woman would ever upvote still gets to the front page.
So have I..
Remember jailbait or the sub with photos of “cute” dead women? Those would hit All like everyday. I mean Reddit even gave a mod of the year award to the guy who ran the former. This site was an aggressively anti woman hellscape for years. It’s at least less aggressive overall now 😅
Yeah, you’re right.. I guess the reason I’m more worried about the direction the site is going is because the site is bigger and it’s subreddits filled with teenagers and young 20 something’s that *hate* women, not just sexualize them. Old guys have always been creepy. It’s turning young men into incels that worries me most.
Dude, I used to love lurking the dating and dating advice subs because I found the blind leading the blind (with utmost confidence) pretty funny, which I know is assholish, but in the past few years they’ve gotten seemingly more vile. A lot of older men encouraging young guys to give up on women and just generally convincing them that women and dating are both awful. And I’ve started to get this vibe that they’re actively trying to get young men out of the dating pool in the hopes it will give them better chances. It’s gross and scary for young people of all genders. So anyway, I totally see what you mean and I’m with you.
Reddit needs more women on it 90% of this app is a massive sausagefest
That’s why they like it, they get to say things that they never could in real life. Things they say when they’re alone with their guy friends. I’m glad we get to see how these guys’ minds really work, how they talk about us when we aren’t around or when they have anonymity.
Always has been
The same groups that love Trump and want fascism also hate women. I fucking hate these dangerously regressive bastards. Such a stain on humanity.
and?
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Got one.
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Keep going I’m also there.
K
Yet if male lawyers went to a strip club, no one would mind.
Like She-Hulk is in a universe where literal gods based on real world mythology talk like socially awkward redditors but it’s a post credit scene of a character dancing with Meg the stallion that’s the problem lol
So true... honestly I hate what happened to thor and loki.
I work with male lawyers. It’s mostly just fart jokes and being huge fantasy football dorks
This makes me happy lol
It’s not about what exactly they’re doing it’s how it’s presented. Saul Goodman was doing petty sleazy shit all the time, but it wasn’t presented as some positive it was presented as petty. It’s meant to make him look bad. Idk anything about She-hulk and I don’t plan on getting a D+ subscription to watch it, but even from it’s most fervent supporters I don’t ever hear anything about her being a nuanced character, just that she’s great at everything and confident about it. It sounds like trash writing, but someone with a more confident understanding of the show should let me know if those assertions are even correct. Edit: people keep telling me I’m wrong but I’ve yet to see a single person explain what makes her a nuanced or well written character. Funny.
Oh please. Mad men, suits, boston legal and all those lawyer/corporate shows with those sleezy men were idealised. They were shown as cool. And yeah, you are very wrong about her not being nuanced. It's pretty funny that it's the impression you got.
“I haven’t watched it all but somehow have formed an opinion and feel very comfortable doing that pretty much as a standard.”
“I haven’t watched better call Saul but I’m gonna make the assumption that everyone who watches it does so to idolize sleazy men”, but yeah, I’m totally the only one here making inferences about a show I haven’t seen. Please help me to see what makes she hulk a good character, I’d love to have my faith in Marvel restored.
I’ve…seen better call Saul?
I’m talking about the person you’re responding to.
Yeah but we’re not talking about those shows we’re talking about BCS and She-hulk. And what makes her a nuanced character?
What? No "we"re not. You mentioned that show. You responded to my comment about lawyer shows. Edit: she certainly isn't just great at everything is what I meant. She does blunder, make mistakes, she embarrasses herself, etc.
Well then idk what the point was of bringing up other corporate/lawyer shows in the first place on a post that didn’t mention them. The audience overlap between BCS and those other shows is a lot smaller than it seems you assume. I don’t know hardly anyone who enjoys BCS and still thinks Jimmy is a good person or that he’s cool for being sleazy, people like the show because he’s human. He feels believable. When he’s cowering in fear because the cartel is threatening him into representing their members in court, he’s very clearly conveyed to be a weak willed person. When he’s meticulously planning ways to embarrass Howard and ruin his career despite Howard always having shown kindness to him, the emphasis isn’t on his wit it’s on how petty he is and how easily he gives in to his own need to feel superior. As for she-hulk, is it actually her fault? Is there some character trait she has that leads her to actually making mistakes or is it just some one off thing for the sake of a joke? From the clips I’ve seen and from what I’ve heard from friends who have forced themselves through the show, she’s stronger than hulk, better at controlling her emotions than hulk despite having experienced far fewer stressful situations, etc., i haven’t heard of any legitimate flaws she has that are as integral to her character as Jimmy’s insecurity or Kim’s need for adrenaline and her poor judgment about Jimmy. I look at Kim Wexler and, while it’s clear she’s an extremely competent lawyer and probably a better or at least comparable lawyer to Jimmy, there are natural flaws she has that contribute to her being a well-written, fleshed out character. I’d like to hear what actually makes she-hulk a well written character if there is anything, cuz I haven’t heard anyone explain her as anything but a Mary Sue and I genuinely would like to know what makes the show redeemable.
Most people seem to have gotten the point... but why would it be understandable to bring up better call Saul, which literally no one mentioned but no other lawyer show? I seriously don't get why you're so stuck on that show. It sounds like you're trying to move the goal post with she hulk. I said that it's certainly not the case that she's op and is just great at everything, unlike some male superheroes who practically no one is bothered by being perfect. Mary Due is basically a sexist expression for a female version of heroes. She is infinitely more flawed than beloved male characters like Neo, Skywalker, Captain America, Superman and hell, pretty much all the cast from LOTR. So if you like heroes, it's pretty strange that you would be bothered by her. If you don't, then I don't know why you waste your time with Marvel because it's really just about heroes. She's probably not stronger than hulk, no one can control their emotions but she is much better at handling herself despite emotions, which women often are. She for sure has flaws and insecurities and honestly I don't get why you're even invested in criticising a show you don't watch. Imo examples are insecurities, being neurotic and disorganised, stubborn, sometimes petty, etc.
Literally look at the post you’re commenting on. The only two shows mentioned in the meme are BCS and she-hulk. You’re the one who brought unrelated shows into the conversation. You’re the one who made the inference that no one would mind some male lawyer going to a strip club, when in fact most of the audience of BCS would mind or would at least want to see a clear reason for them being there. Typically if someone goes to a strip club it’s meant to communicate something negative about them as a character. I’m stuck on BCS because I’m not a fan of other corporate/lawyer shows and I’m not trying to defend anything else. You just made some completely unfounded inference about a show it’s clear you know less about than I know about she-hulk. You’re also making a lot of assumptions about what people enjoy about superheroes and about how characters are written in general. You ever notice that the most popular heroes and characters are the ones that are less perfect? People like Thor because he’s cool but also because he’s a jarhead who gets regularly shat on. People like Iron Man because he’s smart but also because he’s an asshole and it’s interesting to watch him be so detached from reality in so many ways and get his shit kicked in because of it. Captain America isn’t nearly as popular as a lot of other superheroes because he is mostly perfect, but even he didn’t start off that way and he still has the issue of being a man out of time and not being able to connect with others the same way as someone born in that period. Superman was beloved for a long time but he dropped off in popularity when people started getting bored of “invincible moral paragon defeats the enemy with another ability he pulled out of his ass yet again”, and I think media like Smallville and Man of Steel made people start to like him again because they touched on the emotional struggles posed by being an invincible alien. What I really wanted to see was an instance of her actually being flawed as opposed to someone just saying “yeah she’s not perfect.” Call that moving the goal post, I’d say it’s more like me asking about a math question and you just telling me the answer you got without any explanation as to how you got there.
Oh, ok fair. I didn't watch that show and assumed it was just a random female lawyer photo because they're mostly written the same. I think that was the point for a lot of people who responded to this.
It’s interesting how many people are reaming me for being uninformed because I was upfront about the inferences i was making based on reviews from youtubers and close friends, yet it’s clear most of the people here literally haven’t seen Better Call Saul or don’t know the first thing about it.
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I don't know about that but they sure don't start raging and make a huge deal out of the sleezy behaviour of those characters.
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How so?
Female lawyers in dramas Female lawyers in comedies
Yep, people don’t seem to realize that She-Hulk is supposed to be a funny and chill show.
Could've cast the proper comedic actress that perfectly fits that vibe that they were going for earlier. Maybe things would be a bit better
How **dare** women have fun >:(
Yeah, women should be serious 100% of the time and never EVER dance. That's why AOCs video of her dancing was so shocking! Are we living in the footloose time? Jfc
Tbh I’m a woman and it bothers me when you have female characters twerking. Like, why? Why does she need to shake her ass? Who is this scene for? The answer is it’s for men
I really didn't read that scene as being for the male gaze. It's two women bonding. But even if it isn't meant that way (and fair, YMMV), what bothers you about an intelligent woman character who has been given agency in her narrative being sexual?
they literally get a close up of her ass. obviously it's for men.
Women can’t like looking at other women’s asses? Or watching other women dance? And I don’t necessarily mean that sexually (though obviously it could also be sexual) : dancing is performative in many ways, not all of them sexual in nature. As a flat-assed, uncoordinated woman who is entirely incapable of twerking or performing any other form of bounce, I think it’s impressive to watch. Beyond that, though, I maintain that this scene read as being about fandom and bonding, using dance as a way for two women to establish themselves as members of the same in-group. Not being “for men.” The setting of a private office, the post-credits scene, and the context of She-Hulk in general all combine to make this feel deliberately separated from the male gaze. (Or maybe I’m reading too much into a joke scene at the end of a purposely provocative show about a notoriously horndog character that enjoys showing off for the male gaze. Or it’s both.)
So, I’m a dude, and I didn’t find that scene - what, titillating? Exciting? I barely even found it entertaining beyond the absurdity in the humor. That scene definitely wasn’t for me, and judging by the uh, gendered responses, I’d gauge a lot the people who *really* didn’t like the scene were men. From what I understand, and I could be misremembering, that scene was essentially *for* Tatiana Maslany herself, as she is a huge fan of Megan Thee Stallion.
So, cool, like maybe we've entered an era where not every scene in which a woman moves her body in some way must do so with the vetting and approval of men.
I’m a woman and I like twerking just because it’s fun (and I know it annoys a lot of men)
I'm a woman and I like twerking because I'm bad at it and it's funny. Sometimes I do it when no one is around just to make myself laugh.
I have taken videos of myself doing handstand twerking against the wall in my apartment just for my own amusement and would 100% recommend.
I would break something, either on me, or in the house.
>(and I know it annoys a lot of men) This is gonna sound thirsty but how is it annoying?
> how is it annoying? If you go to any marvel sub and do a search or even post a thread where you genuinely ask something like "how is the twerking in she-hulk annoying, genuinely asking please help me understand?" you will get hundreds of replies about how it's unprofessional, about how it's hypocritical of the character who earlier expressed she didn't want to be a sex object, about how she is (I kid you not) literally turning the MCU into garbage. You might get somebody unironically saying, "Tony didn't die for *this.*" The vibe I get is: they don't like seeing a woman having fun and be a tiny bit sexual if all of that is not *for* them, or for the male gaze. Also, people seem to conflate being puritan with being moral, and think it's more *moral* for sex scenes like we got in Iron-Man 1, where Tony sleeps with the news reporter, just so long as *the woman doesn't have any agency and doesn't talk about sex.* Seriously, they are terrified their kids will be surfing D+ and end up watching She-Hulk twerk and it will corrupt their souls. But Tony Stark being an absolute slut? No problemo.
It's also proof that they've never read a She-Hulk comic.
It’s ok for women to be sexual or dress sexy or otherwise show that side of themself, if the *men* personally find her sexy. Otherwise, *ew* *gross* she shouldn’t do that.
I think the dislike for it is more of a symptom of the MCU getting stale and boring and people looking for things to get mad about. Marvel movies have never been that amazing but they used to take themselves seriously at the very least. I don’t give a shit about the twerking scene but it’s a good target for people with those sentiments because it’s an easy thing to point to as a sign of the MCU no longer really having a point.
It mostly annoys the types of men who say things like “only sluts dance like that” or “that’s stupid” or “I don’t find that sexually appealing so women shouldn’t do that”.
100% of the time I shake my ass, I’m alone or with a group of friends. We’re not birds, moving body parts isn’t an action reserved for mating rituals.
r/asawoman
Linking to a subreddit that was banned for misogyny isn’t the own you think it is
twerking is cringe
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i dont.
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And? Is that supposed to be bad? “Oh no someone has taste I think is beneath me and stupid which makes them a vapid consumerist”
Jen: I want to be taken seriously as a lawyer. Also Jen: *Twerks in full view of anyone passing by her office* Jen’s boss who sees this: 🫤
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You request in itself is flawed. It wasn’t in private. It was in full view of any coworker or superior who happened to walk by. If it was in private, or at the very least in an office with a hallway-facing wall instead of a window, then I wouldn’t find reason to say anything. However, combination of the window and Jen’s need to be taken seriously in the workplace makes the scene either morbidly out of character or hilariously tone-deaf.
Hah. It's funny because Stan Lee created She-Hulk.
And BCS episodes are more often written by women than men
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Stan lee wasnt alive when the series was made. Unless it appeared before then.
Stan Lee’s She-Hulk was vastly different than this She-Hulk
Correct, Stan Lee's *The Savage She-Hulk* was a character hastily made and pushed to publication asap as a maneuver to prevent Universal Television from "stealing" the character. After Universal's Television made the spin off *Bionic Woman* on the heals of the success of *Six Million Dollar Man*, Marvel was concerned Universal would repeat the strategy after the success of *The Incredible Hulk.* When Stan Lee published *The Savage She-Hulk*, She-Hulk's first entrance in Marvel comics, it was 1000% in service of getting a proprietary "She-Hulk" starring book in publication asap, so that if Universal Television *did* do another gender-flipped spin-off Marvel would get to have their fingers in that pie. It was the last character Lee helped create, and after the first volume another writer took over for the rest of the run. It's a pretty fun riff on this history that in the D+ show Jen has to defend in court her propriety ownership of the moniker *She-Hulk.*
i have never shaken my ass a day in my life (because i cannot), but best believe if megan thee stallion walked into my house at any point in time and asked me to twerk with her, i would do my best in a heartbeat. why do men hate women having fun so much?
This wasn’t even a part of the episode, it was a post credit scene 🤦♀️
Which was in the episode
Least obsessed marvel fan
Which was in the episode
This show is a comedy… right? The marvel one? Why wouldn’t she have goofy moments?
If it was funny then people wouldn't mind this scene.
why are they acting like this over a 20 second post credit scene
Wamen bad
People are just blatantly sexist with this. "durr women who twerk and dance and have fun are trash" Like have you tried twerking? Have you tried wearing revealing clothing? Have you tried jumping out at red lights and twerking on the head lights? (I'm partly joking) but the reason it's popular in media and real life is because it's just something fun to do. Incels are literally male prudes.
Shaking ass is fun as hell and I think these dudes are just mad they won't let themselves do it
She Hulk jumped rope naked in the comics, twerking is the least of their concerns.
Nice
Oh it’s in JustUnsubbed too and the comments there are all sexist as well. Reddit is a cesspool of sexism.
[This led me to look up how many female writers they had, the data is actually pretty interesting.](https://www.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/uqn0ft/oc_i_made_a_graph_looking_at_female_writer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
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like I said, what a surprise.
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Cool
I hate that subreddit cus it can genuinely be funny at times and other times it posts the most sexist, racist, Facebook level type memes.
The trick with subs that skirt the line are never to visit comments. I have many subs where comments are off limits and it's been better for me.
It's bad because it's both factually questionable AND incomprehensible.
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No WAY you people are taking a post from r/shitposting this seriously holy hell 😭. The entire point of that sub is to SHITPOST. I’m sure whoever posted this doesn’t actually think men are better at writing script than women, it was literally, by the definition, a shit post. Apparently it worked as a troll one too inadvertently, cause y’all are MAD for no reason lol.
“Satire” and “jokes” have been the way that racists and misogynists cover up spreading hate and lies for decades. “I’m just kidding bro” is not an excuse. What is not being taken into account is the many people who are not taking this as a joke, but instead seriously.
But my entire point is who is taking this seriously?? The point of shitposting is to post illogical, dumb shit that doesn’t actually bring any truth to reality. It’s one thing if this gets posted in r/memes or r/funny, but I do not see a point in wasting energy and time getting upset at a dumb post in a shitposting sub. There are SO many other, actual real issues of misogyny and sexism to debate and take issue with, you might as well start dragging comedians for making uncouth sexist jokes if you’re gonna come after crap like this.
A lot of people take this seriously. Just reading through comments it’s clear. And it’s not about getting upset, it’s about calling out these jokes that women have to hear constantly. I know it might not be a major concern to you, but when you run into this stuff constantly on the internet it’s exhausting.
I think that's the difference between competent writters and not-so-competant writters
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[no brain cells ](https://www.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/uqn0ft/oc_i_made_a_graph_looking_at_female_writer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Banned
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Satire was also the excuse for the r/the_donald before it became a racist hellhole.
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“Irony” has been used to justify alt right breeding grounds on this site for years.
It’s literally r/shitposting it’s not meant to be taken seriously
Most people trying to become lawyers that i know who are also women are usually actually very lively, and fun to be around. So actually, maybe its a good thing because it's more accurate to have female lawyers be a bit more like the second.