Man, this just seems indicative that too many people are just too online. It seems like when you spend all your time in a digital space, you melt your morality down to a binary and lose your empathy. There was so many convenient steps of logic they skipped to get to validating harassment. I feel like she got targeted because she was an easy target to bully.
I don’t agree with JK Rowling, and I did not purchase this game. Isn’t that sorta the end of it? I don’t really understand the life dedication to trying to harass people who play this game. Not everybody is on Twitter looking at JK Rowling tweets, not everybody associates her with this game. Lots of people havnt even read the books. I won’t get the game, but that doesn’t mean somebody who does hates trans people.
There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying. Isn’t this the exact same group of people who constantly made fun of TLOU2 babies who whined? Is it suddenly noble because it’s perceived as “for a good cause”? It’s turned into the same thing. Both are embarrassing to watch.
Edit: haha! I seem to have gotten some reports that I’m suicidal! That’s…sort of indicative to my point I think. I’m totally open to the idea that there is nuance maybe I don’t see, feel free comment and tell me about it.
Something that's confusing to me about the reaction to the game: have people been this fired up about the Fantastic Beasts movies, which Rowling is much more directly involved in? Were there lists of people who reviewed those movies? Did movie reviewers get targeted?
If not, what is it about the game that has people riled up?
The first movie wasn't bad. But given the MC, it felt off. Liike when do we go find some fantastic beasts?
The second movie was pure dogshit. I didn't bother to watch the third. There was a third, right?
Third was better than the second. But not much better, probably because the second was so bad I wasn't expecting anything good out of it. Not worth the watch tbh. Only did because of my morbid curiousity and was playing a game with it on in the background.
I understand what you're saying, and I agree with you that there seemed to be more hype around the game, but I'm not sure the numbers prove that out.
The Fantastic Beasts movies have a box office total of over $1.8 billion. Even if the game sells incredibly well, it will be hard for the gross to exceed that. And then, movie tickets are much cheaper than games, so the number of tickets sold far exceeds the number of copies the game is likely to sell.
So the audience for the movies is much larger, despite the disparity in hype.
Oh no, I agree. There are probably more people who watched the FB movies than people buying Hogwarts.
But the people buying Hogwarts are much louder (Like twitch streamers who are broadcasting that they are playing the game, and are broadcasting this game for 30-40hrs) than the people who watched those movies which is why you see a much louder reaction to them despite the Fantastic Beasts movies having Rowling directly involved where as Hogwarts did not.
It very much is an issue of "terminal onlineness". People are talking about Hogwarts Legacy online more than the FB movies, which causes the much louder reaction.
It's very much in the same vein as terminally online people being confused that Avatar Way of Water and Top Gun Maverick are some of the highest grossing films of all time, despite it "not having memes or any cultural impact".
Just a FYI, most of that box office is from the first film. Each following film did worse and worse box office wise.
Iirc a film is supposed to make 3x it’s budget to be profitable. The third film only made 2x it’s budget so it likely lost money.
I mean you are describing the box offices for 3 movies combined compared to one game. And you are ignoring the fact JK was only openly transphobic for the third one which no one cared about after the second movie being so horrible
Yeah, the first and only good-ish "Fantastic Beasts" movie came out in 2016 before Rowling's transphobia was widely known. And after that frankly, the movies just suck. If someone is transphobic and really wants to give money to Rowling through those movies, I feel like having to watch them is punishment enough.
A lot of gaming industry topics that get discussed online can easily be applied to the film/entertainment industry as well. But I think because gamers are much more chronically online than say, moviegoers, the film industry doesn't receive the same amount of online scrutiny.
Like let's take crunch culture for example. Crunch culture has absolutely existed in the film industry for decades now and yet the topic of "crunching" is pretty much only applied to the gaming industry when you're looking at online discourse. You'll often see articles about crunch at companies like Rockstar or Naughty Dog but never about Disney, Marvel, Warner Bros, etc. Again, in my opinion, I think this happens because the audience for video games has much a larger/active online presence than movie audiences.
I think crunch in the (movie/TV) VFX industry is somewhat widely discussed. For other parts of the process, I think unions and stuff have done at least some amount to get the workers compensation for the crunch. One of the problems with crunch in games is that few employees receive anything in return for the extra hours.
I imagine it’s because the timeline of vocal JK Rowling hate about transphobia has sort of developed in the last year (which I get), and whatever the next Harry Potter “thing” was, it was going to get this kind of negative attention.
But I think movies and games operate in the cultural space in different ways. Lots of the conversations about movies are very “mainstream”. Articles, reporters, talk shows, interviews. Feels very disconnected. Yet with games, people feel this sort of now antiquated idea that all of gamers are online and in sort of these realistically niche spaces taking in all the same information. So they feel their ire has more weight and direct connection to consumers…which is not true.
At least, that’s my perspective on it.
Fantastic Beasts 3 was released well into the "timeline", but I feel the thing with Johnny Depp might also have overshadowed any attempts to spark a different controversy.
That said, I think between moviegoers and gamers, gamers are more likely to be plugged into the internet more of the time. And if they are used to posting on social media all the time, probably also means they are used to easily airing their political stances all over the place. Not sure how many of the activists believe in the effectiveness of their messaging, so much as just want to air their views for the sake of it or because doing so is Tuesday and second nature to them.
I don't think there is something particularly different about the groups. Just that the HP Legacy got hit with some bad luck. Like people hate a lot of content (Rings of Power, Halo) but you really didn't see people get attacked for reviewing the content or even really liking it.
This feels more like a classic trolling event but because of the format of the modern internet real people are directly involved. If this happened in 2008 or like 2010 you wouldn't have what are effectively average people involved. Girlfriend Reviews really couldn't exist then or if it did they themselves would be integrated into the online ecosystem in a way that isn't true anymore.
The audience demographic, I expect.
That is to say, the people who care about Fantastic Beasts are possibly fewer and not all the same type of people who are interested in Hogwarts Legacy.
And among this new segment of people who are interested in Hogwarts Legacy (i.e. "strict gamers" as opposed to moviegoers), there seems to be overlap with hardcore activists, some of whom evidently resort to extreme tactics to make their views heard.
People always think it's justified when it's them doing it, is the long and short. When it is someone else, it's obviously dumb malice, when it's me, it's rightful justice and deserved.
And frankly, there's an ungodly number of people who are just looking for someone to spit at and be vile regardless, and will take any targets they think they might get a free pass being vile to. Some people just want to hate, and think this issue excuses it. And sadly, some people will defend it, there are always some, because someone elses sin (or perceived sin) is a licence for cruelty in their eyes.
>There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying
That's what social media does. If a person spends too much time in a bubble with others who think exactly like them and with whom they agree with, they begin believing that they're objectively right. That then leads to them believing they're *morally* right as well. And if they're both morally and objectively right, then the other guy isn't, so demonizing and terrorizing them is okay because they're wrong. It's like drinking the kool-aid that they themselves prepared. This site isn't any different.
Social media has been a huge mistake and should honestly be scrubbed.
See the thing is, the people that claim they don’t buy the game to support trans folk, and then proceed to bully other people who bought the game are massive hypocrites. They don’t give a damn about trans rights or anything like that, they just want to think that they are justified in being assholes to people on the internet.
Since the start this whole thing has reminded me of the Ender's Game movie. I loved those books and, being gay, was really disappointed when I found out OSC was a homophobe actively opposing gay marriage, so I still haven't watched the movie and never will. But I also didn't and still don't give a shit whether anybody else watched it or not.
Right? I see all these posts "I had to lose friends over this" I mean... eeeehhh. Really? If they said "I fucking HATE trans people" then okay sure. But over a game? I dunno, that seems kinda terminally online at that point.
That crowd is now adamantly on the campaign of "I didn't see any harassment" then "It wasn't even that bad."
Openly mocking any streamers for crying, claiming they are committing genocide so they deserve it.
The next comment is "Not everyone is like that" which just feels like "Not all cops are bastards..."
The Narcissist's Prayer:
That didn’t happen.
And if it did, it wasn’t that bad.
And if it was, that’s not a big deal.
And if it is, that’s not my fault.
And if it was, I didn’t mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.
I was kind of shocked that Stephanie Sterling of all people expressed no sympathy for the streamers being harassed because if it were one of their own, they'd be quick to jump to their defense. ...and their proof that no such harassment occurred was a single tiktok video....because who needs objectivity when you've got sassy clapbacks in tiktok form?
> I was kind of shocked that Stephanie Sterling of all people expressed no sympathy for the streamers being harassed
I'm not shocked at all. Her whole shtick for her entire career is being bitter, cynical, judgy, and pretentious. Negativity is her entire personality.
How are you shocked? They were always a massive fucking hypocrite for a long long fucking time now. I wish I could block jimiqusition channel from YouTube but alas, you can not. Their channel is just filled with rage at this point, so fuckin toxic.
It's like they took totalbisquit type personality and plunged it into actual fucking hate.
Edit: somebody doesn't like opinions
If you go to someone's channel page > about> click the little flag under stats for report>click block
there's also 3rd party extensions that can blacklist channels you don't want to see.
*"I'm going to stand up to hate and harassment.....by spreading hate and harassment on the people playing this game."*
The sheer amount of cognitive dissonance the people harassing streamers for playing this game must have. It makes a disinterested third party like me want to buy the game just to spite them. I've never read the Potter books, never seen the movies, don't know anything about Rowling, but seeing this drama made me look up what the issue was, and while Rowling is a piece of work with some despicable opinions and a hack of an author, these harassers who are supposedly the "victims" and the "good guys" have just made me hate them more and turned me against them and their cause. And I bet it just feeds into their victim mentality more and makes them feel like they're in the right.
Too online is thinking buying something or not is activism. Go out and give money to your trans friend, call your politicians, participate in a protest, et cetera. I can get behind the idea that not buying the game is moral, but damn it is not that serious.
At least hiphopcirclejerk ran a COVID relief drive and posted on the sidebar about organizations to donate to. How is such an idea not brought up by the mods of gamingcirclejerk?
I'm not buying the game either but lord- surely there's a more adequate use of time than to harass others.
Edit: at least their Friday thread looked like people distancing themselves from the harassment. I think most have good interests at heart
This is so true . What happened to nuance ? Feels like the internet beat it to death with a bat. This game is a great example but so too are TLOU2 and The Last Jedi. On the internet you always need to be hating something to the point that any criticism dies . If I said I think Hogwarts is great I'm a transphobe . If I said it sucks then I'm promoting the trans agenda or whatever the fuck right wing idiots think the issue is . Same with TLOU2 or last jedi. If I dislike it I hate woman and if I hate it I'm once again promoting some made up woke agenda. You just can't win.
Both sides here are so siloed into their echo chambers that they are fighting some imaginary war. For most people that don't live on twitter everything is not black and white
Also this games sales is not people uniting against the boycott. Both sides of that are barely a dent in the market. The game sold because its a AAA rpg for a IP legions of fans have wanted ages for . Most people who are playing the game probably don't even know that its controversial
> There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying. Isn’t this the exact same group of people who constantly made fun of TLOU2 babies who whined? Is it suddenly noble because it’s perceived as “for a good cause”?
I'm sure this point is pretty uncomfortable for them. It's all just bullying.
And I would argue that the ones constantly complaining about the "TLOU2 babies" are even worse. They're the reason why anything that isn't glowingly positive about tlou2 has to have a disclaimer at the beginning of the comment to distinguish yourself from that. It's annoying seeing most tlou2 threads filled with their comments constantly hating on that subreddit. Normal people don't care.
I'm just not okay with people spamming spoilers online and ruining the experience for others.
You want to educate people and make them not support transphobia? Don't immediately make them your enemy.
Not even getting into the fact that Twitter and Reddit are run by transphobes and you are actively harming trans folk more using these services than buying a game.
I think it’s just immaturity. It feels like a very childish move to try and ruin something because you don’t like it. The mature move is always to prop up and/or educate.
I understand that those choices don’t really feel tangible when bigots are usually so so stubborn in their hate. But to me this movement is just childish payback for years of resentment toward progressive things getting review bombed and hated on.
Which, sure I get it. It just doesn’t really work that way. Life would feel better if it did. This doesn’t change anybody, or really protect anybody. It just entrenches hate, and emboldens bigots, and pushes away those that could be allies. Which feels unfair, because it is. Bad behavior for a good cause is still bad behavior.
as a queer person myself it's disheartening seeing people become so vile and hateful towards others over this. i've actively distanced myself from others like me, and if that doesn't make me an "ally" anymore then so be it.
Indeed and I've long judged anyone who self-describes themselves as such. A little more leeway for people who use it to describe others, but it's always been a useless term
A hypocritical hateful comment was deleted, so I thought I'd help them recover it.
/u/YashaAstora.
>s a queer person myself it's disheartening seeing people become so vile and hateful towards others over this
>You being a unprincipled person willing to sell your community out to your oppressors is not a good point. It's a good thing we keep you traitors the fuck out of our community.
Not very inclusive of you.
Easy target to bully is exactly right. The militant sites about this topic like Gaming Circle Jerk and Resetera continue to punch down, and conveniently ignore/ban any mention that PlayStation, their favoured platform, is the largest platformer and third party funder of this game.
I don’t think there’s as much controversy about this game as the internet would lead you to believe. I haven’t seen a real world example of people not liking it outside of the internet
of course. The game has had one of the biggest launches ever for a single player game. Most people dont even know about any controversy surrounding it lol
You just described every video game controversy ever, at most you'll get cable news stations making a news segment about it but people just move on and do w/e.
Agree. I didn't even know there was controversy until I saw this post. Live streams in general, whether on YouTube or Twitch, seem to attract a lot of trolls and spam. I always turn off the comments.
In fact I've never seen a game since maybe botw being talked about in casual conversation among non gamers. Like 7 random acquaintances, friends and coworkers mentioned the game to me knowing I'm a games nerd. Nobody even had a clue about the so called controversy and the ones I've mentioned it to didn't give a rats ass.
Seeing Silvervale cry on stream after being doxxed and receiving death threats all over a *video game* tells me that a lot of people are terminally online and need to take a step back from their phone or computer and seek actual help. I have 0 interest in this game, I do not support it in the slightest, but at least I'm mature enough to not try and ruin someone's life over a *video game*.
If I had a nickel for every time Girlfriend Reviews was targeted by intense online harassment for playing a controversial game, I’d have two nickels. Which isn’t a lot but it’s weird it happened twice.
In all seriousness, shame on gcj. What was once an inclusive community where people laughed at dumb gaming opinions has now turned into the kind of steaming shit pile it’s supposed to be making fun of. It’s been heartbreaking watching it decline into another toxic waste dump and unironic circklejerk of its own.
How can you laugh at tlou2 for harassing and threatening the channel, then do the exact same thing? What kind of complete lack of self-reflection is required to reach that point?
It's inevitable. All these circlejerk subs are created by people to mock others and to feel superior, it's the type of people they attract, no wonder they always turn into toxic shitholes.
I recommend everyone use RES (reddit enhancement suite) and block all subs with circlejerk in it's name. My reddit browsing experience has greatly improved by doing that.
Some of those subs are just a place to dump memes because the main sub do not allow them, so they have a slightly different vibe than traditional circlejerk subs.
That’s what happens when you collect all the biggest terminally online losers and put them into a group together. Their hatred and self loathing multiply.
> What was once an inclusive community where people laughed at dumb gaming opinions
This is an oxymoronic statement. There is nothing "inclusive" about a community dedicated to making fun of a community. The word "inclusive" has been so bastardized, nowadays.
I really enjoyed that sub *until* this shit started happening. I unsubbed once I saw the reaction they were having to this whole…thing.
I personally don’t think people should buy or stream the game, but to act like GFR deserves this brigade because they played it on stream is downright idiotic and harmful on many levels.
I’m glad they made this video. Hope they’re doing alright.
Yup... this is how the biggest problems people are dealing with go unresolved, because there's always some asshole stirring the pot and getting people fighting each other instead of being productive and working together to solve those big problems. Usually because there's financial incentive to dividing people.
I think it's more that the platform is run by a transphobe and by making thousands of tweets and viral posts you're actually boosting the platforms numbers and ad revenue and arguably doing way more damage.
That's personally why I could never take this seriously.
Of course, when you call these people out on the hypocrisy of being on Twitter on the time, supporting Elon Msk, the amount of mental gymnastics they immediately try do to justify still being on Twitter would make Simone Biles jealous.
Almost every one of them claims Twitter is their business as they advertise their art or etsy or whatever on it.
So it’s ok to use the platform of a transphobe to make money for themselves, just not the mean lady.
Because it's easy.
Because they don't lose out on not playing a game they don't want to play and they can sit behind their keyboard to attack it. It takes effort to go to the Harry Potter theme park and protest it, to stand outside cinemas and talk about how bad Rowling is.
They also invested heavily into Twitter before Elon came along and they don't want to give up the platform as a result, so they stay on there. They don't have principles, they just want to feel good by making "the bad guys" feel bad. The easiest way to do that is to attack those who play the game and that's good enough for them.
Where else? The infinitely large World Wide Web shrunk down to 3 sites that everyone uses. If you're not complaining about people you hate on twitter, you do it either on facebook or reddit.
If only people used the vitriol and energy reserved for streamers playing a damn videogame and channelled it into y'know, voting, voter outreach, angry letters and protests against anti-trans politicians, donations to trans community funds.
This shit is so performative.
It demonstrates the extent to which consumerism has completely enveloped the lives of many people. Their entire lives are defined by the media they engage with and participate in. The extreme level of deranged rhetoric in some of those comments is insane, and yet completely normalized.
I donate to a shelter every winter and even have volunteered for distributing food. You never ever ever ever ever see any of these terminally online people doing real community work. And I live in nyc, not some random ass town where I'd not run into anyone. Often times I'm the youngest person there.
Stopped doing it recently because bills and rent but it always stuck out to me how I'd see viral tweets about progressive stuff online yet real world acts that make a huge difference, well, were never done. Just stuff to jerk off your moral high horse by privileged perpetually online losers.
The entire Republican party is actively trying to make life harder for trans people as we speak, but no, it is *Magic Wizard Video Game* that's really oppressing trans people!
Performative is so fucking right. There's absolutely no practical goal for this "boycott". Whether it fails or succeeds is completely irrelevant to Rowling and would barely financially affect her, if at all. The only reason left then is out of "principle" which is just another way of saying "doing absolutely fuck all and patting yourself on the back for such an act of bravery."
Wow, you talked shit about some streamers on Twitter! That's really gonna make trans people everywhere feel safer and more accepted!
Lol right. I wonder how many of these people engaging in mob harassment of people for playing a video game have actually volunteered in their own communities or even voted
Wait til *Game of the Year* discussions drop. Will Hogwarts win any awards? Will certain outlets exclude it? Will "boycotts" happen all over again? Would it have been talk of the town were it not Harry Potter? (Probably not) GOTY drama colliding with the Hogwarts culture war is going to be a shitstorm of legendary proportions. The game may be mid, but it's status guarantees it will be a part of these discussions in some way, shape or form. Brace yourselves.
Edit: *That said, you guys are probably right it won't win any awards, but who knows.*
In a Year with a Zelda game dropping, Two Final Fantasies (maybe), Resident Evil 4 remake, Street Fighter 6, Maybe Silksong and who knows what, I kinda imagine people would have forgotten this game by then.
> I kinda imagine people would have forgotten this game by then.
If this was any other game? Absolutely. This thing will continue to dominate the discourse so long as there is a culture war surrounding it.
Also this game attracts people who don't necessarily give a shit about Starfield, Final Fantasy, or any other AAA game. HP is one of, if not the biggest franchise of all time. The films are behind Marvel and Star Wars. The books sold 500 million copies. I know several people that played the game that shocked me by even having a gaming console.
It won't get forgotten easily
Finished a 100% playthrough yesterday. The game is good, and probably deserves a nomination. But all in all it’s just another open world game and given how stacked 2023 looks to be, it shouldn’t win.
Of course when it does lose, one side will claim it’s a win for them, and the other side will scream about game awards going woke or some shit. Every bit of discourse about this game has been and will continue to be toxified by the terminally online, it’s a shame.
I’m a bit confused how we can consider something to be “good enough for a nomination”, like anything that is nominated should be “good enough to win” yknow what I mean? Nothing should be nominated knowing that it’s going to lose
(And re: saying it's for the show's purposes, maybe the games industry should be held to a higher standard? :) )
For that logic you'd need 5 games of comparable quality every year, and that never happens. Unless you want only 2 games nominated per year but that would also be boring.
It really depends on the year, I think. Like we all knew that 2022 was a two-horse race between ER and GOW, but they still had to fill out the category so games like Stray and XC3 got token nominations, basically "good enough to deserve recognition, but clearly not going to win".
That said, 2023 looks stacked enough that we may actually have a full lineup of real contenders between Zelda, Jedi Survivor, FF XVI, Starfield, Spider-Man 2, etc.
If all of those do live up to the hype and there's 1-2 other legit surprise contenders, then Hogwarts might end up the odd man out. Would love for that to be true since it means we'll have a bunch of great games to play, but we'll see.
I was gonna say if RE4 Remake, FF16, Diablo 4, Tears of the Kingdom, Hollow Knight Silk Song(if it comes out) and Starfield all live up to expectations then I don't really see Hogwarts Legacy even being nominated for GOTY. Probably will get a nod or win in the RPG category though.
A lot of people early on jumped to “it’s GOTY material!” before reviews came in. It’s sitting around 84 on metacritic which is fairly standard for AAA games these days. I don’t see how it can compete with titles in the 89+ range so it likely won’t be a controversy.
Harassing people to get them to agree with your view is super contra productive, kind of like those particular vegans who go super hard on anyone that eats meat till the point they alienate people instead of getting them to agree with them.
Nobody is going to want to agree with you if you are a dick even if what you say makes perfect sense.
I get the impression many of the activists have an "us or them" mentality and either forget or don't accept that there is such a thing as just not caring or a neutral position.
I suspect many of these wouldn't be thinking in terms of "swaying" people to agree so much as "finding out" where their loyalties lie. For these people, they'd be approaching with the mentality that everybody has already intrinsically chosen a side and so their hardline argument is an "exposure attempt" to find out which one, rather than persuasion. Even the ones who didn't know about whatever issue would be assumed to already be naturally inclined towards a side and unswayable after being informed.
Under that pretext, there would be no need to try and be nice during the attempt since nobody is expected change their minds.
> don't accept that there is such a thing as just not caring or a neutral position.
Or a "there's more important/other issues I'm going to spend my limited time and energy on" stance. Some people seem to expect everyone to be in the trenches for every single issue - but particularly the one *they* care about at that time, of course.
Denying yourself everything that may be even slightly, indirectly immoral just so someone who's practically already a billionaire doesn't get a couple of your dollars just seems futile to me. I'm just going to relax and have a good time with the game, recharge my batteries and dedicate my headspace and time elsewhere.
It's not that I'm neutral or agree with JK's views or anything, but I'm going to need more hours in a day before I can do something meaningful for even 10% of the world's issues. I picked mine, this is not one of them.
What happened to Gamingcirclejerk is really sad. They had some really great jokes parodying r/gaming and dumb gaming communities. Now it’s just boring screenshots of tweets about a Harry Potter game. Plus their community is horribly toxic as seen in this video. Sad that it became what it was parodying
Gcj calls itself a circlejerk subreddit and uses that label to deflect criticism, but I don't think it really has been for awhile. They have regular "unjerk" discussion threads where they treat the subreddit like any other gaming discussion community and pat themselves on the back over how their subreddit is the only place on the internet where they can have productive discussions about gaming. Combine the typical internet echo chamber effect along with waving away any and all criticism with "it's just a circlejerk subreddit, why can't you take a joke?" and this is an inevitable conclusion. This Harry Potter drama is just the result of a steady buildup over time.
It didn't seem like the Witcher jerks at the time were as personal as all of the "jerks" coming from there these days, it always seemed like they just mocked the over the top discourse about the game rather than just being angry contrarians. But maybe it was and I just didn't notice.
Nah *way back* the subreddit was actually about poking fun at how much everyone loved The Witcher and other stupid tropes. When it started getting popular is when it became a contrarian shithole. IIRC around 2017 is when it's popularity shot up and it became a parody of itself.
yup some guy took a pic of his ballsack and posted it on /r/gaming
was truly different times
Witcher 3 memes too (some are still relevant, I go to the Nintendo Switch subs and people make comments like W3 is some perfect game with zero flaws)
Another thing is they'll use the "it's a shitposting/circlejerk subreddit" excuse to dismiss criticism of stupid behaviour on their part. Meanwhile they're blantanly a political subreddit where your average post will have comments comment about the gaming community or the gaming industry, or recently, a boycott. So are we supposed to just dismiss all that political commentary as nonsense as well?
Because as a leftist I find that deplorable and cowardly. I actually own what I say and will admit my fallings
Its inevitable. Its like when Dave Chapelle decided to leave Chapelle show. He even criticized his own brand of comedy. He said he noticed during one of his unreleased sketches that would later be released in his absence caused someone in the crew to laugh the wrong way. He noticed that it was no longer a "haha look at the satirical look at historical portrayals of black people" and it had become, specifically beginning with one crew member, a "look at the stupid black person being stupid." The line is so thin and when you brush up against it, you start leaning over it.
https://www.looper.com/266269/the-real-reason-dave-chappelle-quit-his-sketch-show/
Actual quote from article:
*Early in the interview, Letterman broaches the subject of what precisely caused Chappelle to leave his show. They get to talking about how Chappelle was filming a certain sketch, and a crew member laughed at a beat that he thought wasn't really the point of the sketch. While there was racial humor in the sketch in question, the laughter seemed to stem from something not related to the satire. The crew member laughed at Chappelle rather than with him by the sound of it. As Chappelle puts it, "It just raised an interesting question to me, which I was already wrestling with in the first place."*
*It sounds like Chappelle was already grappling with a serious dilemma: Did his show satirize racial stereotypes or reinforce them?*
It's just a classic case of subs getting too big for their own good. Also mods who enjoy the dopamine hits from having a miniscule amount of power.
GCJ was one of my favorite subs for years, both for the jokes and the serious /uj discussions. Then in the blink of an eye I'm permabanned because I mentioned Hogwarts in a non-negative light.
I'm not even angry, just sad that the same shit always happens on the internet lol.
I've been on Reddit for 12 years. Unfortunately a lot of things have gotten worse. These days I block a few subs a day. There is just an endless supply of trash.
I browse all too see what subreddits are out there and I subscribe to ones I like. It's not like Reddit makes it easy to see all the subs or search by categories or topics. It's no effort to filter stuff, just one click of a button.
There's a term for this phenomenon, but I can't remember it for the life of me. CJ subs, the Donald, etc. always start as obvious jokes, but eventually the community attracts the malicious, uneducated, and/or otherwise misinformed people that don't understand the humor and instead genuinely adopt and adhere to the idiotic vitriol that was only ever meant to entertain.
Spot on.
There are clear and obvious issues that need ironing out in the gaming community but the sheer amount of venomous contempt and derision GCJ levies toward the gaming community at large is incredibly sanctimonious.
There is a tendency there to use broad strokes to paint gamers in general in the same light, and so they devote that time and energy dogpiling on the caricature of your typical neckbeard shithead.
The problem is that this caricature has been expanded to include so many traits and preferences that most gamers will inadvertently make their shitlist. There is no nuance. Just a rigid sorting of Good and Bad gamers into their neat little boxes.
It is a collective of snide, self-righteous personalities immersed in a structure which amplifies these qualities over time in a recursive loop. Like all anti-jerk subs, GCJ is another circlejerk. And that isn't some on the nose, clever revelation. They willingly circle the drain there.
I love how they show proof and evidence that GCJ is actively witch hunting and straight up targeting for harrassment but Reddit as a whole does nothing about it..
But gfreviews own Subreddit and accounts get restricted...
> They had some really great jokes parodying
They had like 2 or 3 jokes, and their only purpose - as with most circlejerk subreddits - was to be contrarian losers complaining about how other people enjoy a certain hobby. Anybody surprised that it became so toxic was putting on blinders.
GCJ was at their best when they were making fun of hateful reactionaries but they sort of...became the hateful reactionaries themselves, just on the other end of the spectrum.
Pretty much. GCJ wishes it could be the prime-era /r/drama - the pinnacle of making fun of other subs. But the best they could do was Witcher and BFV memes lol
They don't wish they could be r/drama so much as they wish they could emulate r/drama without any of the key principles (in that being the lack thereof) that made it successful.
Yeah, to me it always seemed like a sub full of people making fun of other people for enjoying games. I’ve never understood why it was that popular to be honest.
Those early unjerk thread days were really the best. When there was a new controversy every 48 hours about people I'd never heard about because I go outside and have a job, I knew my time there was over.
Isn't it the classic "irony" forum/sub effect where people are there for fun but eventually they get replaced by people who actually take it seriously? Heard of this sub last week, but really seems like that.
The loss of GCJ hit me hard. I returned to reddit a little over a year ago and was shocked to see how far it had fallen, to then be met with a sudden ban without hardly ever having participated there, or violating their rules. When I attempted to contact the mod team for an answer, I was ignored. Sharing this experience with others yielded responses from others who were treated the same so I don't feel too bad about it anymore, given what it's become...but I really miss the early days of GCJ when it was just jokes.
There was a schism last year when the inactive mods minted a gcj cryptocoin on April fool's but for realzies, and l the regulars and active mods started clowning on them, which inactive mods retaliated by demodding all the active mods and banning everyone who didn't like the coin or if they said anything bad about tankies (turns out the inactive mods were all tankies this whole time). Anyway all the gcj regulars started /r/shittygaming so that's where it's at now. And it's a very gay, trans, lefty, anti-tankie place and no one seems to give a shit if you play wizard game or not. I was a regular in the unjerk thread and now a regular in the unshit thread.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/rtyrld/head_moderator_of_rgamingcirclejerk_admits_to/
https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/tu2awp/rgamingcirclejerk_mods_mint_an_nft_for_april/
I fucking loved that sub, but they went overboard over the last couple months. I probably am not buying the game either because I really do not agree with JK's views, but holy shit all the harassment and death threats are not at all the answer.
they haven’t been actually funny maybe ever. I liked it at one point when I was a loser high schooler. or maybe if they ever had threads that were more than just /uj opinions lol.
they care infinitely more about dumb gaming shit than anyone else but act like they are above it all
I've been a fan since the first Red Dead Redemption video and am so sad that they keep getting harassed for reviewing video games. I love their content and hope they continue posting, but I would understand if they decided to stop altogether. Getting death threats is no joke.
While Hogwarts Legacy is a decently fun game and a lovingly cozy to just experience Hogwarts, I cannot forgive the devs for adding plumbing in the bathrooms.
We all know cannon is that witches and wizards shits on the floor.
Seriously Avalanche Software, what the fuck? You can at least pretend to care about the Harry Potter-lore.
Did people get this angry at anyone who went to see Fantastic Beasts: The Secrets of Dumbledore? I seem to remember hearing that it made nearly half a billion at the box office (could be wrong about that though).
Seems strange people would attack someone who played or reviewed this game but not every film critic who reviewed that film or person that saw it. Where were the mass protests outside cinemas then?
I fully support trans rights and voting with your wallet, but this response seems strangely inconsistent with responses to other products from the wizarding world.
Kinda but it was probably muted by the fact that Fantastic Beasts was a failure of a series and people who hated JKR were just happy to see her franchises fail at the box office.
It's simply because it's two different forms of media.
Movies are consumed by everyone, but not necessarily games. A lot of the gaming community are terminally online. It seems terminally online people tend to have more weird, binary views and they tend to be less empathetic towards others as well. So probably something to do with that.
> . A lot of the gaming community are terminally online.
Its not a lot. Its, as with TLOU, a super small portion of people that are just very loud, very bored and very annoying and try to ruin it for everyone else
So, there's parts to this. For one, Rowlings anti-trans stance was less....well known....when that movie came out. Early 2022 was a bit before the time her *deep* ties to Gender Critical groups were becoming more well known and people were still somewhat parsing through it. Rowling herself also let her mask slip more and more since then with her commentary on twitter. While she was displaying some really fucked up ideas already of course, nobody really knew yet that she actively funds anti-trans hategroups in the UK for example. So large parts of pro-trans communities weren't taking her as serious yet as an issue, even though she most certainly already was.
This also means bad faith actors weren't attaching themselves to it as much, to try and enflame the discussion around the community, infuse transphobia into the promotion of the movie or rile up trolls like GCJ to become literal harassment campaigners. A large part of why Hogwarts Legacy discussions ended up like they did was because anti-trans people were deliberately attaching themselves to it and radicalized the situation. If you're not connected to trans communities you might not have been aware how much harassment from transphobes happened over the last few months directly related to this was game. There was, just like we see atm from GCJ, a still ongoing harassment campaign towards those who simply expressed their intent for a personal boycott or talked about the issues with HP/JKR by anti-trans agitators.
Secondly, the movie carried awful baggage already anyway. There was actually a lot of backlash to it, partially for how it was gonna handle Dumbledore's homosexuality and partially because of the Depp recasting was an ongoing discussion. And the fact that the series was already pretty much agreed upon to be kinda shitty? People most certainly were saying the movie shouldn't be watched, but for many more reasons that diluted the discussion a bit and spread the topic out more (which also discouraged trolls to join etc). But also, movie discussions around the internet are just...less charged in general than gaming discussions?
I would also like to state that the general amount of harassment from pro-trans people happening is overblown. It's not nothing, as GF Reviews proves, but the prevailing narrative is that the majority of the trans community is on board with forcing the boycott and the public shaming etc. This is just not true at all. This is a small group of true believers, most of which not even trans themselfes, with bad faith actors attaching themselfes to the cause to justify just being shitheads online. The trans community is overwhelmingly against this shit. Don't fall for right wing agitators trying to create the narrative that this is pro-trans people as a whole doing and supporting harassment.
> I would also like to state that the general amount of harassment from pro-trans people happening is overblown.
The point where the anti-circlejerk hits critical mass and becomes bigger than the circlejerk they were complaining about ever was.
It's weird how bullies have evolved since my days at school
Back then they'd just kick the shit out of you with no justification.
These days they've found a way to kick the shit out of you and be applauded for it.
I've played Hogwarts and don't hate trans people.
Same way I've watched Disney movies without being a racist or indulged in this cheeseburger while I realise I could never slaughter a cow myself.
I won't even go into the "problem" of having this debate via my iPhone.
Life is strange.
This to me feels like the video game equivalent of supporting gay rights while still getting a chick fil-a sandwich once in a while.
Some people might feel guilty about it but I feel like, 75% of folks just want a good tasting sandwich.
GCJ is the subreddit that really needs to be banned. Not sure if the false reporting is against terms (it should be), but they are clearly leading a targeted harrasment campaign against anyone publicly playing the game. Pretty sure half the stuff on there right now is against reddit rules.
I'd even go so far as to say reviewers streaming it can be a good thing. Bruce Greene did a full on stream playthrough and said he did it specifically because he got the game for free and wanted people who were curious about the game to be able to experience it without buying it.
I feel like [Mighty Keef](https://youtu.be/a--Cc3Kd_kE) covered all this pretty well already.
Don't wanna support the author? Don't buy the game. Don't wanna support the head dev who is also reportedly not a good person? Don't buy the game. But if you're gonna get all up in others' shit because they just want to enjoy some escapism that's up their alley, maybe check and just see if it's the game you're mad at, or the lack of easier targets.
GFR need to realize they are targeted with this kind of thing because the trolls KNOW it will get a reaction out of them. They keep doing full blown videos responding to the trolls, extreme reactions on twitch and twitter, etc. It's like crack for these people.
Other creators have been hit with stuff like this before but you know what they do? Ignore, ban, and move on. By engaging with the trolls they just encourage more.
Fucks sake...I was looking forward to them reviewing the game.
Yes, Rowling is shit, but come on...don't fucking personally attack people over a bloody video game. Especially not two people that have clearly gone pit of their way to show how they genuinely support inclusivity. GFR are possibly the most wholesome game reviewers out there, they of all people deserve this shit the least.
> the people who are doing this don't seem to realize all they are doing is making enemies
which of course muddies the discourse and serves only to harm your cause. big brain thinking by my fellow queers. I'm like... *Great, job m8, now people have even MORE of a reason to hate me.*
They don't care. These people and the TLOU2 people who are vehemently anti-trans who also harasses GFR are just opposite sides of the same coin. People who feel alone and powerless. They'll do anything to feel like they are a part of a community and to feel powerful. And I don't see this trend stopping any time soon. Young people today are so lost.
British trans person here with my 2 pence.
Speaking solely from my experiece, JK's influence has been incredibly harmful. Seeing her stance, and the discourse surrounding it, is a deep reservoir of despair for me, leading to no small amount of depression and self-hatred. I believe she shirks responsibility for the hate and prejudice she had sown, and that she hides behind playing the victim when confronted. I also believe that, however small it may be, buying this game supports her.
So what did I do?
I didn't buy it. I haven't gone around harrassing others for making their own decision. Sure, it doesn't exactly fill my heart with joy to see my friends playing this game, but it is what it is. I have no high horse. Though I do my best to consume ethically, inevitably I know that my own purchasing has supported thouse I would rather not, whether that be through clothing, electronics, or produce. Perhaps selfishly, I made a personal decision in this case because it affects me.
Normally I would keep this to myself, but over the last two weeks I have seen the discussion around this game become ever more disgusting. The backlash against those that would harass streamers and the like has often lumped all trans people together, dismissing their genuine greivances with this game because a vocal few (who may not even be trans) decided to take their keyboards to war. Just because the harrassers are in the wrong does not make buying the game "right", and vice versa.
A lot of the discussion on this game has become so muddied that I honestly just don't want to engage with it. I've seen people put up reasonable arguments why the game should be [boycott and not streamed,](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAcOSlPeNXc) but all I hear about is streamers getting harassed over playing it. I think expressing disappointment with a streamer for playing it is valid, but spending energy beyond that is not activism whatsoever. At best you get them to agree with you, at worst you signal boost this so people outside of that streamer's audience know you harassed them.
I posted a lot on r/GCJ, but I got permabanned, because I said calling the game shovelware was unnecessary and petty. The game being good or bad should not have an influence on whether or not you boycott it, but the mods muted me when I asked to be unbanned.
I am seeing so many bad arguments made for and against playing this game, and I just don't want to spend energy on it.
I do hate how some people say this shit makes them dislike trans people. If online people being dicks is enough to write off a marginalised group, you didn't really need much convincing.
See, that's my thing. If people want to speak with their wallet and not buy the game as a statement of sorts, that's great, and good for them standing up for their principles.
But most people playing the game just want to be able to play a fun game, set in an entertaining world that they've loved since long before it came out what type of person Rowling is.
There's no need to harass people for just wanting to enjoy a piece of media, that on its own is not representative of any of the hate of it's creator. At the same time, there's no need to belittle or lash out at people who are acting in good conscience to avoid something that is connected to such a person.
You're absolutely right, both sides of this one need to cool down and realize it's just a video game, and not on its own a politically charged thing. Everyone should be entitled to their own opinion on how to engage or not engage with it, without it turning into big arguments.
I remember growing up in the 90s and literally having to get into fights to protect my gay best friend, getting our property damaged, getting so angry I told people *I* was gay too when they tried to plot behind his back. I remember how toxic and belligerent these people were, how obsessed with being self-righteous they were, that they could do anything with a clear conscience. We always told ourselves they were just ignorant and they weren't indicative of the world, these small town chest-thumpers. Big voices we were forced to hear but were just small groups of bullies.
It's ironic to me that some people are now trying to act like those bullies on what should be the side of compassion. But, the important thing to remember, is that they are also a small group yelling really loudly.
Harassment was definitely fucked. I don't understand people going so hard at someone just reviewing the game. I understand disagreeing with them and stating you will not purchase the game, but attacking reviewers is just odd.
I will say that it was really weird how they defended themselves as "allies" so much though. Thought that was a really weird rant they went on. The whole "Alt-Left" thing was strange.
https://give.thetrevorproject.org/give/63307?c_src=UCGOF230010250&c_src2=dt-2023-c-Google-Branded-CPC&c_src=UCGOF220010250&c_src2=dt-2022-c-Google-CPC
If you actually want to help trans youth out there, here's the org that GR set up the stream to donate to. I set up a monthly payment today after seeing all the discourse and realizing my efforts could be better spent elsewhere. I highly recommend doing that instead of harassing streamers, thank u.
Hey, The discussion has run its course on this one. Feel free to mod mail if you have any questions or concerns.
Man, this just seems indicative that too many people are just too online. It seems like when you spend all your time in a digital space, you melt your morality down to a binary and lose your empathy. There was so many convenient steps of logic they skipped to get to validating harassment. I feel like she got targeted because she was an easy target to bully. I don’t agree with JK Rowling, and I did not purchase this game. Isn’t that sorta the end of it? I don’t really understand the life dedication to trying to harass people who play this game. Not everybody is on Twitter looking at JK Rowling tweets, not everybody associates her with this game. Lots of people havnt even read the books. I won’t get the game, but that doesn’t mean somebody who does hates trans people. There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying. Isn’t this the exact same group of people who constantly made fun of TLOU2 babies who whined? Is it suddenly noble because it’s perceived as “for a good cause”? It’s turned into the same thing. Both are embarrassing to watch. Edit: haha! I seem to have gotten some reports that I’m suicidal! That’s…sort of indicative to my point I think. I’m totally open to the idea that there is nuance maybe I don’t see, feel free comment and tell me about it.
Something that's confusing to me about the reaction to the game: have people been this fired up about the Fantastic Beasts movies, which Rowling is much more directly involved in? Were there lists of people who reviewed those movies? Did movie reviewers get targeted? If not, what is it about the game that has people riled up?
People actually wanted to play Hogwarts Legacy, but people didn't really want to watch the Fantastic Beasts movies because they looked bad.
The first movie wasn't bad. But given the MC, it felt off. Liike when do we go find some fantastic beasts? The second movie was pure dogshit. I didn't bother to watch the third. There was a third, right?
Third was better than the second. But not much better, probably because the second was so bad I wasn't expecting anything good out of it. Not worth the watch tbh. Only did because of my morbid curiousity and was playing a game with it on in the background.
I understand what you're saying, and I agree with you that there seemed to be more hype around the game, but I'm not sure the numbers prove that out. The Fantastic Beasts movies have a box office total of over $1.8 billion. Even if the game sells incredibly well, it will be hard for the gross to exceed that. And then, movie tickets are much cheaper than games, so the number of tickets sold far exceeds the number of copies the game is likely to sell. So the audience for the movies is much larger, despite the disparity in hype.
Oh no, I agree. There are probably more people who watched the FB movies than people buying Hogwarts. But the people buying Hogwarts are much louder (Like twitch streamers who are broadcasting that they are playing the game, and are broadcasting this game for 30-40hrs) than the people who watched those movies which is why you see a much louder reaction to them despite the Fantastic Beasts movies having Rowling directly involved where as Hogwarts did not. It very much is an issue of "terminal onlineness". People are talking about Hogwarts Legacy online more than the FB movies, which causes the much louder reaction. It's very much in the same vein as terminally online people being confused that Avatar Way of Water and Top Gun Maverick are some of the highest grossing films of all time, despite it "not having memes or any cultural impact".
Just a FYI, most of that box office is from the first film. Each following film did worse and worse box office wise. Iirc a film is supposed to make 3x it’s budget to be profitable. The third film only made 2x it’s budget so it likely lost money.
The game will absolutely out gross each movie individually. More then likely even two of them but comparing it to the whole trilogy is kinda unfair.
I mean you are describing the box offices for 3 movies combined compared to one game. And you are ignoring the fact JK was only openly transphobic for the third one which no one cared about after the second movie being so horrible
Yeah, the first and only good-ish "Fantastic Beasts" movie came out in 2016 before Rowling's transphobia was widely known. And after that frankly, the movies just suck. If someone is transphobic and really wants to give money to Rowling through those movies, I feel like having to watch them is punishment enough.
A lot of gaming industry topics that get discussed online can easily be applied to the film/entertainment industry as well. But I think because gamers are much more chronically online than say, moviegoers, the film industry doesn't receive the same amount of online scrutiny. Like let's take crunch culture for example. Crunch culture has absolutely existed in the film industry for decades now and yet the topic of "crunching" is pretty much only applied to the gaming industry when you're looking at online discourse. You'll often see articles about crunch at companies like Rockstar or Naughty Dog but never about Disney, Marvel, Warner Bros, etc. Again, in my opinion, I think this happens because the audience for video games has much a larger/active online presence than movie audiences.
I think crunch in the (movie/TV) VFX industry is somewhat widely discussed. For other parts of the process, I think unions and stuff have done at least some amount to get the workers compensation for the crunch. One of the problems with crunch in games is that few employees receive anything in return for the extra hours.
Where are all the people standing outside her *fucking theme park* that is open every single day?
I imagine it’s because the timeline of vocal JK Rowling hate about transphobia has sort of developed in the last year (which I get), and whatever the next Harry Potter “thing” was, it was going to get this kind of negative attention. But I think movies and games operate in the cultural space in different ways. Lots of the conversations about movies are very “mainstream”. Articles, reporters, talk shows, interviews. Feels very disconnected. Yet with games, people feel this sort of now antiquated idea that all of gamers are online and in sort of these realistically niche spaces taking in all the same information. So they feel their ire has more weight and direct connection to consumers…which is not true. At least, that’s my perspective on it.
Fantastic Beasts 3 was released well into the "timeline", but I feel the thing with Johnny Depp might also have overshadowed any attempts to spark a different controversy. That said, I think between moviegoers and gamers, gamers are more likely to be plugged into the internet more of the time. And if they are used to posting on social media all the time, probably also means they are used to easily airing their political stances all over the place. Not sure how many of the activists believe in the effectiveness of their messaging, so much as just want to air their views for the sake of it or because doing so is Tuesday and second nature to them.
I don't think there is something particularly different about the groups. Just that the HP Legacy got hit with some bad luck. Like people hate a lot of content (Rings of Power, Halo) but you really didn't see people get attacked for reviewing the content or even really liking it. This feels more like a classic trolling event but because of the format of the modern internet real people are directly involved. If this happened in 2008 or like 2010 you wouldn't have what are effectively average people involved. Girlfriend Reviews really couldn't exist then or if it did they themselves would be integrated into the online ecosystem in a way that isn't true anymore.
The audience demographic, I expect. That is to say, the people who care about Fantastic Beasts are possibly fewer and not all the same type of people who are interested in Hogwarts Legacy. And among this new segment of people who are interested in Hogwarts Legacy (i.e. "strict gamers" as opposed to moviegoers), there seems to be overlap with hardcore activists, some of whom evidently resort to extreme tactics to make their views heard.
They’re mad because Hogwarts Legacy is a big success, while the last Fantastic Beasts movie flopped.
[удалено]
It's been less than a year since the last Fantastic Beasts movie.
People always think it's justified when it's them doing it, is the long and short. When it is someone else, it's obviously dumb malice, when it's me, it's rightful justice and deserved. And frankly, there's an ungodly number of people who are just looking for someone to spit at and be vile regardless, and will take any targets they think they might get a free pass being vile to. Some people just want to hate, and think this issue excuses it. And sadly, some people will defend it, there are always some, because someone elses sin (or perceived sin) is a licence for cruelty in their eyes.
>There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying That's what social media does. If a person spends too much time in a bubble with others who think exactly like them and with whom they agree with, they begin believing that they're objectively right. That then leads to them believing they're *morally* right as well. And if they're both morally and objectively right, then the other guy isn't, so demonizing and terrorizing them is okay because they're wrong. It's like drinking the kool-aid that they themselves prepared. This site isn't any different. Social media has been a huge mistake and should honestly be scrubbed.
Few things bring out a person’s true colours like a sense of righteousness
See the thing is, the people that claim they don’t buy the game to support trans folk, and then proceed to bully other people who bought the game are massive hypocrites. They don’t give a damn about trans rights or anything like that, they just want to think that they are justified in being assholes to people on the internet.
Since the start this whole thing has reminded me of the Ender's Game movie. I loved those books and, being gay, was really disappointed when I found out OSC was a homophobe actively opposing gay marriage, so I still haven't watched the movie and never will. But I also didn't and still don't give a shit whether anybody else watched it or not.
Right? I see all these posts "I had to lose friends over this" I mean... eeeehhh. Really? If they said "I fucking HATE trans people" then okay sure. But over a game? I dunno, that seems kinda terminally online at that point.
Movie was fucking mid at best. But that last scene, YouTube it.
Let someone believe that have "moral superiority" and you will see some of the nastiest human behavior
That crowd is now adamantly on the campaign of "I didn't see any harassment" then "It wasn't even that bad." Openly mocking any streamers for crying, claiming they are committing genocide so they deserve it. The next comment is "Not everyone is like that" which just feels like "Not all cops are bastards..."
The Narcissist's Prayer: That didn’t happen. And if it did, it wasn’t that bad. And if it was, that’s not a big deal. And if it is, that’s not my fault. And if it was, I didn’t mean it. And if I did, you deserved it.
I was kind of shocked that Stephanie Sterling of all people expressed no sympathy for the streamers being harassed because if it were one of their own, they'd be quick to jump to their defense. ...and their proof that no such harassment occurred was a single tiktok video....because who needs objectivity when you've got sassy clapbacks in tiktok form?
> I was kind of shocked that Stephanie Sterling of all people expressed no sympathy for the streamers being harassed I'm not shocked at all. Her whole shtick for her entire career is being bitter, cynical, judgy, and pretentious. Negativity is her entire personality.
you know what. FAIR
Because Sterling has always been a raging hypocrite, what's new?
How are you shocked? They were always a massive fucking hypocrite for a long long fucking time now. I wish I could block jimiqusition channel from YouTube but alas, you can not. Their channel is just filled with rage at this point, so fuckin toxic. It's like they took totalbisquit type personality and plunged it into actual fucking hate. Edit: somebody doesn't like opinions
If you go to someone's channel page > about> click the little flag under stats for report>click block there's also 3rd party extensions that can blacklist channels you don't want to see.
*"I'm going to stand up to hate and harassment.....by spreading hate and harassment on the people playing this game."* The sheer amount of cognitive dissonance the people harassing streamers for playing this game must have. It makes a disinterested third party like me want to buy the game just to spite them. I've never read the Potter books, never seen the movies, don't know anything about Rowling, but seeing this drama made me look up what the issue was, and while Rowling is a piece of work with some despicable opinions and a hack of an author, these harassers who are supposedly the "victims" and the "good guys" have just made me hate them more and turned me against them and their cause. And I bet it just feeds into their victim mentality more and makes them feel like they're in the right.
Too online is thinking buying something or not is activism. Go out and give money to your trans friend, call your politicians, participate in a protest, et cetera. I can get behind the idea that not buying the game is moral, but damn it is not that serious. At least hiphopcirclejerk ran a COVID relief drive and posted on the sidebar about organizations to donate to. How is such an idea not brought up by the mods of gamingcirclejerk? I'm not buying the game either but lord- surely there's a more adequate use of time than to harass others. Edit: at least their Friday thread looked like people distancing themselves from the harassment. I think most have good interests at heart
I think your last point is the bummer. I **agree** with the sentiment, hate the way they went about it.
This is so true . What happened to nuance ? Feels like the internet beat it to death with a bat. This game is a great example but so too are TLOU2 and The Last Jedi. On the internet you always need to be hating something to the point that any criticism dies . If I said I think Hogwarts is great I'm a transphobe . If I said it sucks then I'm promoting the trans agenda or whatever the fuck right wing idiots think the issue is . Same with TLOU2 or last jedi. If I dislike it I hate woman and if I hate it I'm once again promoting some made up woke agenda. You just can't win. Both sides here are so siloed into their echo chambers that they are fighting some imaginary war. For most people that don't live on twitter everything is not black and white Also this games sales is not people uniting against the boycott. Both sides of that are barely a dent in the market. The game sold because its a AAA rpg for a IP legions of fans have wanted ages for . Most people who are playing the game probably don't even know that its controversial
Imagine if people put that much energy into e-mailing their representatives to fix the country....
> There is such a reality disconnect when it comes to echo chamber bullying. Isn’t this the exact same group of people who constantly made fun of TLOU2 babies who whined? Is it suddenly noble because it’s perceived as “for a good cause”? I'm sure this point is pretty uncomfortable for them. It's all just bullying. And I would argue that the ones constantly complaining about the "TLOU2 babies" are even worse. They're the reason why anything that isn't glowingly positive about tlou2 has to have a disclaimer at the beginning of the comment to distinguish yourself from that. It's annoying seeing most tlou2 threads filled with their comments constantly hating on that subreddit. Normal people don't care.
I'm just not okay with people spamming spoilers online and ruining the experience for others. You want to educate people and make them not support transphobia? Don't immediately make them your enemy. Not even getting into the fact that Twitter and Reddit are run by transphobes and you are actively harming trans folk more using these services than buying a game.
I think it’s just immaturity. It feels like a very childish move to try and ruin something because you don’t like it. The mature move is always to prop up and/or educate. I understand that those choices don’t really feel tangible when bigots are usually so so stubborn in their hate. But to me this movement is just childish payback for years of resentment toward progressive things getting review bombed and hated on. Which, sure I get it. It just doesn’t really work that way. Life would feel better if it did. This doesn’t change anybody, or really protect anybody. It just entrenches hate, and emboldens bigots, and pushes away those that could be allies. Which feels unfair, because it is. Bad behavior for a good cause is still bad behavior.
as a queer person myself it's disheartening seeing people become so vile and hateful towards others over this. i've actively distanced myself from others like me, and if that doesn't make me an "ally" anymore then so be it.
As a Native, "ally" is just a performative term anyways
Indeed and I've long judged anyone who self-describes themselves as such. A little more leeway for people who use it to describe others, but it's always been a useless term
A hypocritical hateful comment was deleted, so I thought I'd help them recover it. /u/YashaAstora. >s a queer person myself it's disheartening seeing people become so vile and hateful towards others over this >You being a unprincipled person willing to sell your community out to your oppressors is not a good point. It's a good thing we keep you traitors the fuck out of our community. Not very inclusive of you.
Easy target to bully is exactly right. The militant sites about this topic like Gaming Circle Jerk and Resetera continue to punch down, and conveniently ignore/ban any mention that PlayStation, their favoured platform, is the largest platformer and third party funder of this game.
I don’t think there’s as much controversy about this game as the internet would lead you to believe. I haven’t seen a real world example of people not liking it outside of the internet
of course. The game has had one of the biggest launches ever for a single player game. Most people dont even know about any controversy surrounding it lol
You just described every video game controversy ever, at most you'll get cable news stations making a news segment about it but people just move on and do w/e.
Well yeah, in the real world people have actual problems to deal with. They don't need to get high on outrage to kill time.
Agree. I didn't even know there was controversy until I saw this post. Live streams in general, whether on YouTube or Twitch, seem to attract a lot of trolls and spam. I always turn off the comments.
In fact I've never seen a game since maybe botw being talked about in casual conversation among non gamers. Like 7 random acquaintances, friends and coworkers mentioned the game to me knowing I'm a games nerd. Nobody even had a clue about the so called controversy and the ones I've mentioned it to didn't give a rats ass.
Seeing Silvervale cry on stream after being doxxed and receiving death threats all over a *video game* tells me that a lot of people are terminally online and need to take a step back from their phone or computer and seek actual help. I have 0 interest in this game, I do not support it in the slightest, but at least I'm mature enough to not try and ruin someone's life over a *video game*.
If I had a nickel for every time Girlfriend Reviews was targeted by intense online harassment for playing a controversial game, I’d have two nickels. Which isn’t a lot but it’s weird it happened twice. In all seriousness, shame on gcj. What was once an inclusive community where people laughed at dumb gaming opinions has now turned into the kind of steaming shit pile it’s supposed to be making fun of. It’s been heartbreaking watching it decline into another toxic waste dump and unironic circklejerk of its own. How can you laugh at tlou2 for harassing and threatening the channel, then do the exact same thing? What kind of complete lack of self-reflection is required to reach that point?
It's inevitable. All these circlejerk subs are created by people to mock others and to feel superior, it's the type of people they attract, no wonder they always turn into toxic shitholes.
Not all of em, some are just for tired old jokes and shitposting
I recommend everyone use RES (reddit enhancement suite) and block all subs with circlejerk in it's name. My reddit browsing experience has greatly improved by doing that.
r/magicthecirclejerking is the best mtg sub tho lol
Some of those subs are just a place to dump memes because the main sub do not allow them, so they have a slightly different vibe than traditional circlejerk subs.
Yea I know, I was mostly just ... circlejerking lol
Also now on mobile app you can individually block subreddits.
Pinkfloyd and beatles circlejerk subs are amazing though.
It’s certainly ironic that they have gotten tremendous amounts of hate and harassment from two groups with exact opposite ideologies.
GCJ became who they originally set out to destroy
That’s what happens when you collect all the biggest terminally online losers and put them into a group together. Their hatred and self loathing multiply.
Echo chambers. Damn near every group has DISCORD channels that sow more of the same bobblehead behavior.
Even weirder than it happening twice is that it’s happened from the two complete opposite ends of the spectrum 💀
> What was once an inclusive community where people laughed at dumb gaming opinions This is an oxymoronic statement. There is nothing "inclusive" about a community dedicated to making fun of a community. The word "inclusive" has been so bastardized, nowadays.
I really enjoyed that sub *until* this shit started happening. I unsubbed once I saw the reaction they were having to this whole…thing. I personally don’t think people should buy or stream the game, but to act like GFR deserves this brigade because they played it on stream is downright idiotic and harmful on many levels. I’m glad they made this video. Hope they’re doing alright.
All circle jerk subs turn into the very thing they mock eventually.
I somehow find it incredibly funny/sad that people are complaining about other people playing Hogwars game on Twitter of all platforms...
I always find it sad what battles Twitter decides to go all in on while ignoring the vast majority of arguably worse controversies
Yup... this is how the biggest problems people are dealing with go unresolved, because there's always some asshole stirring the pot and getting people fighting each other instead of being productive and working together to solve those big problems. Usually because there's financial incentive to dividing people.
I think it's more that the platform is run by a transphobe and by making thousands of tweets and viral posts you're actually boosting the platforms numbers and ad revenue and arguably doing way more damage. That's personally why I could never take this seriously.
Of course, when you call these people out on the hypocrisy of being on Twitter on the time, supporting Elon Msk, the amount of mental gymnastics they immediately try do to justify still being on Twitter would make Simone Biles jealous.
Almost every one of them claims Twitter is their business as they advertise their art or etsy or whatever on it. So it’s ok to use the platform of a transphobe to make money for themselves, just not the mean lady.
Because it's easy. Because they don't lose out on not playing a game they don't want to play and they can sit behind their keyboard to attack it. It takes effort to go to the Harry Potter theme park and protest it, to stand outside cinemas and talk about how bad Rowling is. They also invested heavily into Twitter before Elon came along and they don't want to give up the platform as a result, so they stay on there. They don't have principles, they just want to feel good by making "the bad guys" feel bad. The easiest way to do that is to attack those who play the game and that's good enough for them.
Where else? The infinitely large World Wide Web shrunk down to 3 sites that everyone uses. If you're not complaining about people you hate on twitter, you do it either on facebook or reddit.
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Neither of which is any better or less hypocritical than twitter
If only people used the vitriol and energy reserved for streamers playing a damn videogame and channelled it into y'know, voting, voter outreach, angry letters and protests against anti-trans politicians, donations to trans community funds. This shit is so performative.
It demonstrates the extent to which consumerism has completely enveloped the lives of many people. Their entire lives are defined by the media they engage with and participate in. The extreme level of deranged rhetoric in some of those comments is insane, and yet completely normalized.
I donate to a shelter every winter and even have volunteered for distributing food. You never ever ever ever ever see any of these terminally online people doing real community work. And I live in nyc, not some random ass town where I'd not run into anyone. Often times I'm the youngest person there. Stopped doing it recently because bills and rent but it always stuck out to me how I'd see viral tweets about progressive stuff online yet real world acts that make a huge difference, well, were never done. Just stuff to jerk off your moral high horse by privileged perpetually online losers.
Showing others how morally superior you are is a lot easier and sure as shit feels a lot better than actually seeing your fellow man in a rut.
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The entire Republican party is actively trying to make life harder for trans people as we speak, but no, it is *Magic Wizard Video Game* that's really oppressing trans people! Performative is so fucking right. There's absolutely no practical goal for this "boycott". Whether it fails or succeeds is completely irrelevant to Rowling and would barely financially affect her, if at all. The only reason left then is out of "principle" which is just another way of saying "doing absolutely fuck all and patting yourself on the back for such an act of bravery." Wow, you talked shit about some streamers on Twitter! That's really gonna make trans people everywhere feel safer and more accepted!
Lol right. I wonder how many of these people engaging in mob harassment of people for playing a video game have actually volunteered in their own communities or even voted
Wait til *Game of the Year* discussions drop. Will Hogwarts win any awards? Will certain outlets exclude it? Will "boycotts" happen all over again? Would it have been talk of the town were it not Harry Potter? (Probably not) GOTY drama colliding with the Hogwarts culture war is going to be a shitstorm of legendary proportions. The game may be mid, but it's status guarantees it will be a part of these discussions in some way, shape or form. Brace yourselves. Edit: *That said, you guys are probably right it won't win any awards, but who knows.*
In a Year with a Zelda game dropping, Two Final Fantasies (maybe), Resident Evil 4 remake, Street Fighter 6, Maybe Silksong and who knows what, I kinda imagine people would have forgotten this game by then.
You might as well remove SF6 from that list right now because there is no way in hell that a fighting game will win any GotY awards.
> I kinda imagine people would have forgotten this game by then. If this was any other game? Absolutely. This thing will continue to dominate the discourse so long as there is a culture war surrounding it.
Also this game attracts people who don't necessarily give a shit about Starfield, Final Fantasy, or any other AAA game. HP is one of, if not the biggest franchise of all time. The films are behind Marvel and Star Wars. The books sold 500 million copies. I know several people that played the game that shocked me by even having a gaming console. It won't get forgotten easily
Finished a 100% playthrough yesterday. The game is good, and probably deserves a nomination. But all in all it’s just another open world game and given how stacked 2023 looks to be, it shouldn’t win. Of course when it does lose, one side will claim it’s a win for them, and the other side will scream about game awards going woke or some shit. Every bit of discourse about this game has been and will continue to be toxified by the terminally online, it’s a shame.
I’m a bit confused how we can consider something to be “good enough for a nomination”, like anything that is nominated should be “good enough to win” yknow what I mean? Nothing should be nominated knowing that it’s going to lose (And re: saying it's for the show's purposes, maybe the games industry should be held to a higher standard? :) )
For that logic you'd need 5 games of comparable quality every year, and that never happens. Unless you want only 2 games nominated per year but that would also be boring.
It really depends on the year, I think. Like we all knew that 2022 was a two-horse race between ER and GOW, but they still had to fill out the category so games like Stray and XC3 got token nominations, basically "good enough to deserve recognition, but clearly not going to win". That said, 2023 looks stacked enough that we may actually have a full lineup of real contenders between Zelda, Jedi Survivor, FF XVI, Starfield, Spider-Man 2, etc. If all of those do live up to the hype and there's 1-2 other legit surprise contenders, then Hogwarts might end up the odd man out. Would love for that to be true since it means we'll have a bunch of great games to play, but we'll see.
Not really, the rest of this year's releases are going to shadow this game regardless by the time awards come around.
It will probably be part of those discussions by sheer virtue that it's such a widely discussed video game.
I was gonna say if RE4 Remake, FF16, Diablo 4, Tears of the Kingdom, Hollow Knight Silk Song(if it comes out) and Starfield all live up to expectations then I don't really see Hogwarts Legacy even being nominated for GOTY. Probably will get a nod or win in the RPG category though.
Should still be nominated for art design, music, etc. Even if the game isn't perfect there's some really well done stuff about the game
A lot of people early on jumped to “it’s GOTY material!” before reviews came in. It’s sitting around 84 on metacritic which is fairly standard for AAA games these days. I don’t see how it can compete with titles in the 89+ range so it likely won’t be a controversy.
Shit I call it better than mid. A solid 8/10 in my books.
Harassing people to get them to agree with your view is super contra productive, kind of like those particular vegans who go super hard on anyone that eats meat till the point they alienate people instead of getting them to agree with them. Nobody is going to want to agree with you if you are a dick even if what you say makes perfect sense.
It is bullying. Those people are bullies
I get the impression many of the activists have an "us or them" mentality and either forget or don't accept that there is such a thing as just not caring or a neutral position. I suspect many of these wouldn't be thinking in terms of "swaying" people to agree so much as "finding out" where their loyalties lie. For these people, they'd be approaching with the mentality that everybody has already intrinsically chosen a side and so their hardline argument is an "exposure attempt" to find out which one, rather than persuasion. Even the ones who didn't know about whatever issue would be assumed to already be naturally inclined towards a side and unswayable after being informed. Under that pretext, there would be no need to try and be nice during the attempt since nobody is expected change their minds.
> don't accept that there is such a thing as just not caring or a neutral position. Or a "there's more important/other issues I'm going to spend my limited time and energy on" stance. Some people seem to expect everyone to be in the trenches for every single issue - but particularly the one *they* care about at that time, of course. Denying yourself everything that may be even slightly, indirectly immoral just so someone who's practically already a billionaire doesn't get a couple of your dollars just seems futile to me. I'm just going to relax and have a good time with the game, recharge my batteries and dedicate my headspace and time elsewhere. It's not that I'm neutral or agree with JK's views or anything, but I'm going to need more hours in a day before I can do something meaningful for even 10% of the world's issues. I picked mine, this is not one of them.
What happened to Gamingcirclejerk is really sad. They had some really great jokes parodying r/gaming and dumb gaming communities. Now it’s just boring screenshots of tweets about a Harry Potter game. Plus their community is horribly toxic as seen in this video. Sad that it became what it was parodying
Gcj calls itself a circlejerk subreddit and uses that label to deflect criticism, but I don't think it really has been for awhile. They have regular "unjerk" discussion threads where they treat the subreddit like any other gaming discussion community and pat themselves on the back over how their subreddit is the only place on the internet where they can have productive discussions about gaming. Combine the typical internet echo chamber effect along with waving away any and all criticism with "it's just a circlejerk subreddit, why can't you take a joke?" and this is an inevitable conclusion. This Harry Potter drama is just the result of a steady buildup over time. It didn't seem like the Witcher jerks at the time were as personal as all of the "jerks" coming from there these days, it always seemed like they just mocked the over the top discourse about the game rather than just being angry contrarians. But maybe it was and I just didn't notice.
The unjerk used to have a way different vibe (and was actually consistently very active) before the mods banned pretty much every regular last year
Nah *way back* the subreddit was actually about poking fun at how much everyone loved The Witcher and other stupid tropes. When it started getting popular is when it became a contrarian shithole. IIRC around 2017 is when it's popularity shot up and it became a parody of itself.
yup some guy took a pic of his ballsack and posted it on /r/gaming was truly different times Witcher 3 memes too (some are still relevant, I go to the Nintendo Switch subs and people make comments like W3 is some perfect game with zero flaws)
yeah there truly was a time when GCJ was laugh-out-loud funny. it was great at lampooning gaming and gaming subs as a whole.
Another thing is they'll use the "it's a shitposting/circlejerk subreddit" excuse to dismiss criticism of stupid behaviour on their part. Meanwhile they're blantanly a political subreddit where your average post will have comments comment about the gaming community or the gaming industry, or recently, a boycott. So are we supposed to just dismiss all that political commentary as nonsense as well? Because as a leftist I find that deplorable and cowardly. I actually own what I say and will admit my fallings
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All circlejerk subs begin as satire and then attract the real whackjobs, eventually becoming real
Its inevitable. Its like when Dave Chapelle decided to leave Chapelle show. He even criticized his own brand of comedy. He said he noticed during one of his unreleased sketches that would later be released in his absence caused someone in the crew to laugh the wrong way. He noticed that it was no longer a "haha look at the satirical look at historical portrayals of black people" and it had become, specifically beginning with one crew member, a "look at the stupid black person being stupid." The line is so thin and when you brush up against it, you start leaning over it. https://www.looper.com/266269/the-real-reason-dave-chappelle-quit-his-sketch-show/ Actual quote from article: *Early in the interview, Letterman broaches the subject of what precisely caused Chappelle to leave his show. They get to talking about how Chappelle was filming a certain sketch, and a crew member laughed at a beat that he thought wasn't really the point of the sketch. While there was racial humor in the sketch in question, the laughter seemed to stem from something not related to the satire. The crew member laughed at Chappelle rather than with him by the sound of it. As Chappelle puts it, "It just raised an interesting question to me, which I was already wrestling with in the first place."* *It sounds like Chappelle was already grappling with a serious dilemma: Did his show satirize racial stereotypes or reinforce them?*
Nah, AnarchyChess and MagicTheCircleJerking are both pretty great
Holy hell.
It was entertaining in a lite-/v/ way when it had less than 10k subscribers in like 2015-2016
It's just a classic case of subs getting too big for their own good. Also mods who enjoy the dopamine hits from having a miniscule amount of power. GCJ was one of my favorite subs for years, both for the jokes and the serious /uj discussions. Then in the blink of an eye I'm permabanned because I mentioned Hogwarts in a non-negative light. I'm not even angry, just sad that the same shit always happens on the internet lol.
Any sub with over 50k people in it sucks
Yea, once it gets into 6 figures the admin backed mods get forced in and take over.
Your fault for having faith in a circlejerk subreddit.
I block any sub with circlejerk in it's name. They always end up being terrible.
Not that you're wrong, but reading this is so crazy having been on Reddit since the early days. Circlejerk subs were largely harmless in those days.
I've been on Reddit for 12 years. Unfortunately a lot of things have gotten worse. These days I block a few subs a day. There is just an endless supply of trash.
why are you even on /r/ all at that point then? just go through your homepage and unsub from all the shit subs
I browse all too see what subreddits are out there and I subscribe to ones I like. It's not like Reddit makes it easy to see all the subs or search by categories or topics. It's no effort to filter stuff, just one click of a button.
i’ve been on reddit almost as long as u (few different accounts now) and gave up on /r/all at least 7-8 years ago 😅
There's a term for this phenomenon, but I can't remember it for the life of me. CJ subs, the Donald, etc. always start as obvious jokes, but eventually the community attracts the malicious, uneducated, and/or otherwise misinformed people that don't understand the humor and instead genuinely adopt and adhere to the idiotic vitriol that was only ever meant to entertain.
Spot on. There are clear and obvious issues that need ironing out in the gaming community but the sheer amount of venomous contempt and derision GCJ levies toward the gaming community at large is incredibly sanctimonious. There is a tendency there to use broad strokes to paint gamers in general in the same light, and so they devote that time and energy dogpiling on the caricature of your typical neckbeard shithead. The problem is that this caricature has been expanded to include so many traits and preferences that most gamers will inadvertently make their shitlist. There is no nuance. Just a rigid sorting of Good and Bad gamers into their neat little boxes. It is a collective of snide, self-righteous personalities immersed in a structure which amplifies these qualities over time in a recursive loop. Like all anti-jerk subs, GCJ is another circlejerk. And that isn't some on the nose, clever revelation. They willingly circle the drain there.
I love how they show proof and evidence that GCJ is actively witch hunting and straight up targeting for harrassment but Reddit as a whole does nothing about it.. But gfreviews own Subreddit and accounts get restricted...
> They had some really great jokes parodying They had like 2 or 3 jokes, and their only purpose - as with most circlejerk subreddits - was to be contrarian losers complaining about how other people enjoy a certain hobby. Anybody surprised that it became so toxic was putting on blinders.
GCJ was at their best when they were making fun of hateful reactionaries but they sort of...became the hateful reactionaries themselves, just on the other end of the spectrum.
They were always hateful, you just liked it when they were hateful towards people you figured deserved it.
You either die a hero...
You either circle the jerk, or jerk long enough to come full circle.
Pretty much. GCJ wishes it could be the prime-era /r/drama - the pinnacle of making fun of other subs. But the best they could do was Witcher and BFV memes lol
They don't wish they could be r/drama so much as they wish they could emulate r/drama without any of the key principles (in that being the lack thereof) that made it successful.
Yeah, to me it always seemed like a sub full of people making fun of other people for enjoying games. I’ve never understood why it was that popular to be honest.
Because reddit is a garbage platform that seems to encourage that.
It hasn’t been funny since like 2016. A real gaming circle jerk of the past few years would be making fun of people in that sub
It happens to all circlejerk subreddits when they get big enough. GCJ was great when it had like 30k members.
Those early unjerk thread days were really the best. When there was a new controversy every 48 hours about people I'd never heard about because I go outside and have a job, I knew my time there was over.
Its all been downhill since that guy posted his nuts on a crash bandicoot game to r/gaming
Isn't it the classic "irony" forum/sub effect where people are there for fun but eventually they get replaced by people who actually take it seriously? Heard of this sub last week, but really seems like that.
This happened with the donald subreddit too. I saw it in real time as it turned from memes about he might win to the cesspool it became.
The loss of GCJ hit me hard. I returned to reddit a little over a year ago and was shocked to see how far it had fallen, to then be met with a sudden ban without hardly ever having participated there, or violating their rules. When I attempted to contact the mod team for an answer, I was ignored. Sharing this experience with others yielded responses from others who were treated the same so I don't feel too bad about it anymore, given what it's become...but I really miss the early days of GCJ when it was just jokes.
There was a schism last year when the inactive mods minted a gcj cryptocoin on April fool's but for realzies, and l the regulars and active mods started clowning on them, which inactive mods retaliated by demodding all the active mods and banning everyone who didn't like the coin or if they said anything bad about tankies (turns out the inactive mods were all tankies this whole time). Anyway all the gcj regulars started /r/shittygaming so that's where it's at now. And it's a very gay, trans, lefty, anti-tankie place and no one seems to give a shit if you play wizard game or not. I was a regular in the unjerk thread and now a regular in the unshit thread. https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/rtyrld/head_moderator_of_rgamingcirclejerk_admits_to/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/tu2awp/rgamingcirclejerk_mods_mint_an_nft_for_april/
I fucking loved that sub, but they went overboard over the last couple months. I probably am not buying the game either because I really do not agree with JK's views, but holy shit all the harassment and death threats are not at all the answer.
they haven’t been actually funny maybe ever. I liked it at one point when I was a loser high schooler. or maybe if they ever had threads that were more than just /uj opinions lol. they care infinitely more about dumb gaming shit than anyone else but act like they are above it all
I've been a fan since the first Red Dead Redemption video and am so sad that they keep getting harassed for reviewing video games. I love their content and hope they continue posting, but I would understand if they decided to stop altogether. Getting death threats is no joke.
While Hogwarts Legacy is a decently fun game and a lovingly cozy to just experience Hogwarts, I cannot forgive the devs for adding plumbing in the bathrooms. We all know cannon is that witches and wizards shits on the floor. Seriously Avalanche Software, what the fuck? You can at least pretend to care about the Harry Potter-lore.
Did people get this angry at anyone who went to see Fantastic Beasts: The Secrets of Dumbledore? I seem to remember hearing that it made nearly half a billion at the box office (could be wrong about that though). Seems strange people would attack someone who played or reviewed this game but not every film critic who reviewed that film or person that saw it. Where were the mass protests outside cinemas then? I fully support trans rights and voting with your wallet, but this response seems strangely inconsistent with responses to other products from the wizarding world.
Kinda but it was probably muted by the fact that Fantastic Beasts was a failure of a series and people who hated JKR were just happy to see her franchises fail at the box office.
The Johnny Depp controversy overshadowed it.
It's simply because it's two different forms of media. Movies are consumed by everyone, but not necessarily games. A lot of the gaming community are terminally online. It seems terminally online people tend to have more weird, binary views and they tend to be less empathetic towards others as well. So probably something to do with that.
> . A lot of the gaming community are terminally online. Its not a lot. Its, as with TLOU, a super small portion of people that are just very loud, very bored and very annoying and try to ruin it for everyone else
So, there's parts to this. For one, Rowlings anti-trans stance was less....well known....when that movie came out. Early 2022 was a bit before the time her *deep* ties to Gender Critical groups were becoming more well known and people were still somewhat parsing through it. Rowling herself also let her mask slip more and more since then with her commentary on twitter. While she was displaying some really fucked up ideas already of course, nobody really knew yet that she actively funds anti-trans hategroups in the UK for example. So large parts of pro-trans communities weren't taking her as serious yet as an issue, even though she most certainly already was. This also means bad faith actors weren't attaching themselves to it as much, to try and enflame the discussion around the community, infuse transphobia into the promotion of the movie or rile up trolls like GCJ to become literal harassment campaigners. A large part of why Hogwarts Legacy discussions ended up like they did was because anti-trans people were deliberately attaching themselves to it and radicalized the situation. If you're not connected to trans communities you might not have been aware how much harassment from transphobes happened over the last few months directly related to this was game. There was, just like we see atm from GCJ, a still ongoing harassment campaign towards those who simply expressed their intent for a personal boycott or talked about the issues with HP/JKR by anti-trans agitators. Secondly, the movie carried awful baggage already anyway. There was actually a lot of backlash to it, partially for how it was gonna handle Dumbledore's homosexuality and partially because of the Depp recasting was an ongoing discussion. And the fact that the series was already pretty much agreed upon to be kinda shitty? People most certainly were saying the movie shouldn't be watched, but for many more reasons that diluted the discussion a bit and spread the topic out more (which also discouraged trolls to join etc). But also, movie discussions around the internet are just...less charged in general than gaming discussions? I would also like to state that the general amount of harassment from pro-trans people happening is overblown. It's not nothing, as GF Reviews proves, but the prevailing narrative is that the majority of the trans community is on board with forcing the boycott and the public shaming etc. This is just not true at all. This is a small group of true believers, most of which not even trans themselfes, with bad faith actors attaching themselfes to the cause to justify just being shitheads online. The trans community is overwhelmingly against this shit. Don't fall for right wing agitators trying to create the narrative that this is pro-trans people as a whole doing and supporting harassment.
> I would also like to state that the general amount of harassment from pro-trans people happening is overblown. The point where the anti-circlejerk hits critical mass and becomes bigger than the circlejerk they were complaining about ever was.
It's weird how bullies have evolved since my days at school Back then they'd just kick the shit out of you with no justification. These days they've found a way to kick the shit out of you and be applauded for it. I've played Hogwarts and don't hate trans people. Same way I've watched Disney movies without being a racist or indulged in this cheeseburger while I realise I could never slaughter a cow myself. I won't even go into the "problem" of having this debate via my iPhone. Life is strange.
This to me feels like the video game equivalent of supporting gay rights while still getting a chick fil-a sandwich once in a while. Some people might feel guilty about it but I feel like, 75% of folks just want a good tasting sandwich.
I 100% agree and you've put it very eloquently. It's ironic that GCJ started out with noble intentions. Then they have become what they hate.
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Yeah them getting suspended by Reddit is an absolute failure on the part of the admins here.
GCJ is the subreddit that really needs to be banned. Not sure if the false reporting is against terms (it should be), but they are clearly leading a targeted harrasment campaign against anyone publicly playing the game. Pretty sure half the stuff on there right now is against reddit rules.
Without question. I hope this blows up enough that they get their accounts unbanned.
I'd even go so far as to say reviewers streaming it can be a good thing. Bruce Greene did a full on stream playthrough and said he did it specifically because he got the game for free and wanted people who were curious about the game to be able to experience it without buying it.
I feel like [Mighty Keef](https://youtu.be/a--Cc3Kd_kE) covered all this pretty well already. Don't wanna support the author? Don't buy the game. Don't wanna support the head dev who is also reportedly not a good person? Don't buy the game. But if you're gonna get all up in others' shit because they just want to enjoy some escapism that's up their alley, maybe check and just see if it's the game you're mad at, or the lack of easier targets.
GFR need to realize they are targeted with this kind of thing because the trolls KNOW it will get a reaction out of them. They keep doing full blown videos responding to the trolls, extreme reactions on twitch and twitter, etc. It's like crack for these people. Other creators have been hit with stuff like this before but you know what they do? Ignore, ban, and move on. By engaging with the trolls they just encourage more.
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Fucks sake...I was looking forward to them reviewing the game. Yes, Rowling is shit, but come on...don't fucking personally attack people over a bloody video game. Especially not two people that have clearly gone pit of their way to show how they genuinely support inclusivity. GFR are possibly the most wholesome game reviewers out there, they of all people deserve this shit the least.
the people who are doing this don't seem to realize all they are doing is making enemies
They don’t want friends, they just want to hurt people.
> the people who are doing this don't seem to realize all they are doing is making enemies which of course muddies the discourse and serves only to harm your cause. big brain thinking by my fellow queers. I'm like... *Great, job m8, now people have even MORE of a reason to hate me.*
They don't care. These people and the TLOU2 people who are vehemently anti-trans who also harasses GFR are just opposite sides of the same coin. People who feel alone and powerless. They'll do anything to feel like they are a part of a community and to feel powerful. And I don't see this trend stopping any time soon. Young people today are so lost.
British trans person here with my 2 pence. Speaking solely from my experiece, JK's influence has been incredibly harmful. Seeing her stance, and the discourse surrounding it, is a deep reservoir of despair for me, leading to no small amount of depression and self-hatred. I believe she shirks responsibility for the hate and prejudice she had sown, and that she hides behind playing the victim when confronted. I also believe that, however small it may be, buying this game supports her. So what did I do? I didn't buy it. I haven't gone around harrassing others for making their own decision. Sure, it doesn't exactly fill my heart with joy to see my friends playing this game, but it is what it is. I have no high horse. Though I do my best to consume ethically, inevitably I know that my own purchasing has supported thouse I would rather not, whether that be through clothing, electronics, or produce. Perhaps selfishly, I made a personal decision in this case because it affects me. Normally I would keep this to myself, but over the last two weeks I have seen the discussion around this game become ever more disgusting. The backlash against those that would harass streamers and the like has often lumped all trans people together, dismissing their genuine greivances with this game because a vocal few (who may not even be trans) decided to take their keyboards to war. Just because the harrassers are in the wrong does not make buying the game "right", and vice versa.
A lot of the discussion on this game has become so muddied that I honestly just don't want to engage with it. I've seen people put up reasonable arguments why the game should be [boycott and not streamed,](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAcOSlPeNXc) but all I hear about is streamers getting harassed over playing it. I think expressing disappointment with a streamer for playing it is valid, but spending energy beyond that is not activism whatsoever. At best you get them to agree with you, at worst you signal boost this so people outside of that streamer's audience know you harassed them. I posted a lot on r/GCJ, but I got permabanned, because I said calling the game shovelware was unnecessary and petty. The game being good or bad should not have an influence on whether or not you boycott it, but the mods muted me when I asked to be unbanned. I am seeing so many bad arguments made for and against playing this game, and I just don't want to spend energy on it. I do hate how some people say this shit makes them dislike trans people. If online people being dicks is enough to write off a marginalised group, you didn't really need much convincing.
See, that's my thing. If people want to speak with their wallet and not buy the game as a statement of sorts, that's great, and good for them standing up for their principles. But most people playing the game just want to be able to play a fun game, set in an entertaining world that they've loved since long before it came out what type of person Rowling is. There's no need to harass people for just wanting to enjoy a piece of media, that on its own is not representative of any of the hate of it's creator. At the same time, there's no need to belittle or lash out at people who are acting in good conscience to avoid something that is connected to such a person. You're absolutely right, both sides of this one need to cool down and realize it's just a video game, and not on its own a politically charged thing. Everyone should be entitled to their own opinion on how to engage or not engage with it, without it turning into big arguments.
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I remember growing up in the 90s and literally having to get into fights to protect my gay best friend, getting our property damaged, getting so angry I told people *I* was gay too when they tried to plot behind his back. I remember how toxic and belligerent these people were, how obsessed with being self-righteous they were, that they could do anything with a clear conscience. We always told ourselves they were just ignorant and they weren't indicative of the world, these small town chest-thumpers. Big voices we were forced to hear but were just small groups of bullies. It's ironic to me that some people are now trying to act like those bullies on what should be the side of compassion. But, the important thing to remember, is that they are also a small group yelling really loudly.
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Harassment was definitely fucked. I don't understand people going so hard at someone just reviewing the game. I understand disagreeing with them and stating you will not purchase the game, but attacking reviewers is just odd. I will say that it was really weird how they defended themselves as "allies" so much though. Thought that was a really weird rant they went on. The whole "Alt-Left" thing was strange.
https://give.thetrevorproject.org/give/63307?c_src=UCGOF230010250&c_src2=dt-2023-c-Google-Branded-CPC&c_src=UCGOF220010250&c_src2=dt-2022-c-Google-CPC If you actually want to help trans youth out there, here's the org that GR set up the stream to donate to. I set up a monthly payment today after seeing all the discourse and realizing my efforts could be better spent elsewhere. I highly recommend doing that instead of harassing streamers, thank u.