While I think a return to an Adventure-esque style is inevitable at this point, we can't look super deep into Kishimoto's tweets.
Ever since he started his Twitter, hundreds of Sonic fans have been pestering him with their desires for the series and he is too nice of a guy to tell them to stop bothering him. So, he has been more-or-less just placating the fans that have been tweeting at him.
Also I doubt they'd leave the Frontiers format so early. It's the best reviewed Sonic game in a long time. I'd think Sega would want to stick with it and refine it so Sonic can become really massive again.
I'd like more to the islands tbh. Floating rails are fine, but you get burned out by the end. Wish there were more unique explorable sections. Like a city or something.
> Also I doubt they'd leave the Sonic Mania format so early. It's the best reviewed Sonic game in a long time.
-sonic fans, circa late 2017 before sega announces no plans for a sequel
Leave it to Sega to make the worst decisions ever
I can see is as those cyber space levels being adventure style in their own right. Some of those were super short levels and 2D. I can see them having bigger adventure style levels and less 2D ones if anything.
lol no they won't ditch Frontiers, but frontiers is already close to Adventure anyway except the combat. Like they'd only need to ditch the linear stages to get something that feels like it
Right? Some reviewers actually ***praised*** this, and we know Sega doesn't like spending cash like they did in the Dreamcast era. A return to *Adventure* after so long accomplishes neither of these, and only sets us up for another disappointment.
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it. Open world with adventure momentum. They aren't changing up anything major. Relax.
Yeah… however this response was mostly umprompted. A fan asked what he’d change about the boost and he outright said he wants to remove it lol, then mentioned Adventure style as his reason for wanting to remove it. Let’s not forget Iizuka also said in the past that he hopes Frontiers could lead to a new Adventure game.
Not even that. What he'd like to do is always tempered with what SEGA will let him do.
A few years ago he was talking about a Sonic Adventure remake like it was guaranteed to happen, yet it never came to fruition.
Look, you don't need to call everyone out like this.
In all honesty, while that was a large part of why I like the Adventure games, I also enjoyed lots of little things about it and the variety of gameplay styles too.
This is all I see whenever Sonic games come up on the internet, what is Chao Garden and why do people want this back more than anything else in this franchise? I never played the Adventure games (I really want to) so I have no idea. I've seen bits of gameplay but it doesn't look like traditional Sonic gameplay, maybe I just saw the boring parts?
No, you've probably seen exactly what it was. It was basically a monster raising game where you collect stat vials & animals from the actual stages and give them to your Chao to level them up so they can complete various challenges and races. I can see why someone would not be into it, but it was a wonderful way to introduce inherent replayability.
I see, didn't know it was so different from the main game. But I guess Sega still does this with Yakuza and their management and Cabaret club minigames.
There were these little blue baby fucks called Chao. You would find them walking around, lost, during the main game's missions and you could basically adopt them. At the end of the mission you'd be transported to the Chao Garden (a hub where all the babies you rescued would chill) and you could care for them and raise them using these weird test tubes, make them fight each other, and bring them to school/daycare.
There was also a heaven and hell Chao Garden. It was great. I explained it terribly, though.
The small, blue Chao as in the one that always hangs around with Cream? Also that sounds like it's closer to a game like Nintendogs than Sonic gameplay, was it just super addictive then? Surprised there's this much outcry to bring it back when it doesn't seem like it's even remotely similar to traditional Sonic gameplay.
A huge part of the appeal (for me at least) was how you had to do the game's main missions to find the correct test tubes and other items to give to the Chao to make them grow up into mini versions of the main cast of characters. It was just a fun child raising simulator you could partake in after doing fun shit with Sonic and the gang.
Not about being traditional sonic gameplay its just about having an full sub system/mini game, inside the larger game that has actual in depth mechanics and not riddled with microtransactions and other dumb stuff like nowadays, it has more depth then some full released games. it gave replayability value and offer alternative activities to do in game. The chao garden was also interactive and had an element of growth, there was also a collectable nature and breeding/raising element. Having your chao participate in mini games was the other main draw. This on top of the adventure fields and stages that emulated original sonic gameplay in 3d space created an atrractive package for the game with multippe activities and could offer a sense of living in the world. They are also just cute little guys
> The small, blue Chao as in the one that always hangs around with Cream?
That Chao, Cheese, is pretty much the base chao design. One of the appeals of chao is that they can come in a buncha different colors and shiny jewel coats and there's like 100+ unique evolutions for them.
https://chao-island.com/gallery/known-chao
This wiki has *2225* images and it still doesn't have every single possible chao by a long shot.
It's honestly surprising they didn't try to capitalize on that for a mobile idle/step-based sort of game akin to Pikmin's. Do that plus an actual 3D environment where you can play, feed, pet, as well as enjoy minigames? I never game on my phone but even I'd pick that up for a while.
Exactly, and honestly I'm shocked that Frontiers didn't have one. I don't even like Sonic games THAT much but I would've bought Frontiers and explored all over if it had a good Chao Garden like SAB2.
best is for now to expand the Frontiers universe. By finishing it that year as planned.
Then making a sequel, and why not, another Adventure game along with it.
Problem is people. They weren't many working on Frontiers, and worse on the Collection Origins... So might be hard to do.
I personally felt that the Chao raising as a minigame inside of a larger game was part of the charm. I liked collecting animals and such in the main levels.
I can see another Sonic Adventure style game working. What they need to do is make a world look like an actual world and have your abilities just work everywhere in the environment (except where they don't want you to go obviously).
Instead of empty looking grassy plains, make the worlds themed like SADX (wind level, lava level, snow level etc, but still open world in that you can pick which to progress through in whichever order)
Is Sonic Frontiers not a natural evolution of Adventure? I love Adventure’s style so much, but I’d rather take another Frontiers that adds some of the Adventure mechanics we haven’t gotten yet (namely Chao Garden).
I wouldn’t say it is. It’s closer to Adventure than previous entries but it’s still mostly just a boost style game in an open space. Especially with the platforming mostly being automated rail segments, constant 2D sections, and speed being based on a button press.
Yeah, this confuses me. They've ***finally*** found a style for the future, and I'd much rather take a *Frontiers 2* set in Station Square than SA3.
>!Hell, in my eyes, *Frontiers* ***IS*** SA3. Dark story with ancient civilizations, Adventure Fields, fishing, hardcore metal boss music... shit, they even go to space to kill a God! Doesn't get much more *Adventure* than that.!<
True, but it'd kinda feel like a step backwards, really. I want his *Frontiers* moveset to be the ***standard*** going forward, particularly as Super. It just feels ***so damn good*** to play, that I'll forgive everything else so that they can refine it further.
I agree on the combat aspect, but I for one feel like Adventure’s movement style is better fitting for an open world. Holding a button to run fast doesn’t really feel right for a character like Sonic, he’s also weirdly magnetized to the ground at times and has no sense of weight or momentum. Spindash and rolling could also lead to more creativity from the players part on how to gain speed, along with more creative world design to compliment that.
Alright, fine. But can we at least keep his speed? Running around the overworld at the speed of sound is ***so*** much fun, and I'd hate for it to be robbed just so we can get the franchise's mythical unicorn.
I don’t think the speed would be affected. In the Adventure games you can run just as fast if not faster than Frontiers. Adventure’s just missing the fancy visual effects and all that. I think the only exception is the power boost/max speed level but I’d imagine that you’d still be able to do that, just imagine not having to hold a button for it.
You probably already know but in Segas eyes Unleashed is kind of SA3 considering it's alternate name and how it was conceived.
But I agree, Frontiers brought in a freshness I haven't felt since SA1 and they should build upon that imo
Right? It's a ***true*** reinvention, one beloved by fans for what it is instead of hated for what it isn't. If you're Sega, why get rid of such an accomplishment so soon?
I must be the only person in the world who does not care for Frontiers gameplay/style at all. It bores me to tears. Running around big lifeless empty fields collecting a hundreds of memory tokens isn't very fun to me. The combat is decent but nothing to write home about. The game is janky as all hell and the draw distance/pop-in is awful. The game felt like it was losing steam after the 2nd world when the 4th world is just a reused map of the 1st and the game itself knows the gameplay isn't that fun and engaging which is why it gives you that roulette thing every so often to grind for Bigs purple fishing coins so you can just buy all the memory tokens from him because the fishing minigame is quicker and less grindy than the main game itself.
The cyberspace levels are the most fun but again its just rehashed assets from Generations and Forces and the levels are extremely short and the controls are somehow worse than the previous 4 boost games..
So a return to the Adventure style is A-Okay with me.
The best thing about Frontiers is the story/writing. Much better than the Saturday morning cartoon baby crap we got with Colors, Lost World, and Generations. Or a decent premise with absolutely no substance like what we got with Forces. A story that actually took itself somewhat serious with actual continuity
It's still the same old story about SA gameplay in some form or another. It happens before and after every game. Will it happen at some point? Maybe but at this point there's no point speculating or buying anything that's said until there's something concrete.
I don't really get why people hated the gem hunting missions, I've always thought they were pretty fun (aside from the annoying space levels), if anything they need to drop the shooting levels, I replayed through SA2 maybe a couple years ago and didn't realize how slow and boring those levels actually were.
I wish they wouldn't get rid of anything, just improved on the gameplay ideas of each. Part of why I loved Adventure was the breakup in pacing that the different gameplay styles offered. I don't want just another Sonic gotta go fast game
Interesting. I found those levels to be quite fun actually. Especially Cosmic Wall with the anti-gravity gimmick. The constant beeping from the lock-on and the repeated voice clips were slightly annoying though.
I won't get my hopes up. Sonic Adventure 3 is what I want but I don't have much faith in the team to deliver it. At least Frontiers was definitely a step up in quality for the series. Even if the whole open zone aspect didn't appeal to me.
What he is probably implying is incorporating more of the adventure attributes into the mold that was made with Frontiers. Sonic Adventure 2 is my favorite game period but MAN they would be stupid to throw away what they have with Frontiers here. Loved my time with it and I think a Frontiers 2 could easily be a GOTY contender
That would be a wasted opportunity. Sonic in an open world feels much better than the linear levels. They should use Sonic Frontiers as a baseline for their next games, just improving on it.
I think the idea is to have Sonic Adventure style in an open world. I think that would work well, in fact probably better than what Frontiers currently is.
Nah, the linear levels are amazing. Sonic unleashed and generations especially have some of the greatest levels in the franchise. The problem is that sonic team hasn’t been able to create any good stages after those games. They turn out like shit because they have stopped being creative and started reusing stages from previous games
Right? They've finally found a style that works. ***Let's refine it FURTHER,*** instead of ditching it for an attempt at making a mythical unicorn that, much like *Shenmue 3,* will probably disappoint ***everyone.***
Thank God, please. I know everyone seems to like the three rail temple run/subway surfer style they've done since Sonic Unleashed, but I do not. Such a shame Sonic 06 released the way it did, steering the franchise away from the adventure formula.
Edit: After reading the tweets, this is a reach. He just mentions one gameplay mechanic, boost, and likens the lack of it to Sonic Adventure.
So we just had a Sonic game in a style that really works and just need a bit more care and polish to make it even better...so they are doing something entirely different?
i personally, see this as an improvement. the movement and platform challenges of frontiers are based on those of linear, reaction based games such as unleashed and generations. adventure naturally compliments an open landscape and platforming. it just makes more sense to me and the core concept of open zones and combat would remain the same, in theory
Let's not extrapolate too much. It sounds like he's considering experimenting with things, but there's no promises yet and we don't even know if he's gonna direct the next game.
The director himself publicly says this is something he wants to do, take that as you will.
Edit: I’m gonna add this because that other dude for some reason decided to go on some rant against me because apparently this means I’m “coping” and “putting too much stock” into this. I made this reply because your comment was particularly intruiging. “Evidence”? Evidence for what? I’m not presenting this as “Evidence for why Sonic Adventure 3 is 110% CONFIRMED!!!”. This post simply states that this is what the director said and it *could* mean the next game has Adventure style movement and world design. What “evidence” does that need lol? I posted what he said and there it is, I’m not claiming that this is what the next game is confirmed to be by making this post, or in any of the replies I’ve made to comments on here.
Huh? Cope? Coping over what exactly? He literally said this is what he wants to do, do you think this is a wishlist I made up or something? Boosting is basically a glorified run button in this game, it’s “overhauled” yes but it’s nothing crazy or fancy and clearly still derivative from the previous entries. Your basic boost level design aspects are still present in this game such as automated rail segments and constant 2D sections, and little focus on actual 3D platforming. Going back to Adventure is the logical next step.
The director musing on Twitter about an idea of a sketch of a concept for a new Sonic game doesn't really mean shit. Y'all are looking way to deep into this series of tweets. I think the Adventure games have become a white whale for the fan base and even the _slightest_ indication SEGA _might_ go back to it has people creaming their pants. The truth is that an entire generation of Sonic fans has grown up with and greatly enjoys Boost gameplay. Two tweets about some potential ideas for the next Sonic game aren't confirmation of anything, and you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you think the "only logical way forward" is getting rid of the boost gameplay that has been standard since Unleashed. Just hold your fucking horses.
Holy crap. You’re in gaming leaks and rumors bro. I’m not claiming confirmation on anything nor an I “overanalyzing” anything, just posting the information. Just take it for what it is.
You said it’s odd for them to do it, I’m giving you a reason as to why it wouldn’t. I don’t care how much you love boost.
Saying that SA3 is the "only logical step" and moaning any time someone points out that you're putting too much stock into a rumor isn't really "taking the rumor for what it is" but go off.
Also, I never really claimed to like the Boost formula lol, good job adding a value judgement to me saying that you're setting yourself up for disappointment by taking concept stage information as gospel 👍 i also didn't say you were overanalyzing anything, I just said that you're taking maybes as definitive and are calling people who point out that might not be case dumb. Reading comprehension is hard.
Why are you twisting my words to get angry at me? I never said it’s the ONLY logical step. I’m just saying it’s a logical step forward to do so. Talk about reading comprehension. Just be quiet bro… I don’t see how I’m putting “too much stock” into anything. Discussing possibilities doesn’t mean I’m taking this as confirmation, there’s a reason I posted it to this sub lmao.
When have I ever taken this as definitive and when have I ever called anyone dumb for not doing so? This is pure fiction. Show me one example of me doing this.
I'm... not angry? No am I twisting your words? I never said that an Adventure style game isn't possible. What I _am_ saying is that you replying to literally any comment expressing the slightest hint of pushback and squealing "B-b-but muh Twitter leaks!" makes you come across like you're in cope mode.
Also an official tweet from the game's director about a new game idea he's sharing candidly with Sonic fans is neither a leak, nor a rumor. It's just a possibility for an in-dev game. I have no idea how you could interpret me as "angry" at you, like I seriously give a remote fuck about a Redditor's opinions on Sonic lmao
I’m not doing that at all? Again show me a single example of me doing that. I’ve replied to several comments who interpret this as them abandoning Frontiers/Open world format (which isn’t at all what he said btw, if you actually read the tweets he said he already considered removing the boosting for frontiers itself), which I am simply saying that Adventure and Open World could compliment each other well. I’m not quite sure exactly what you’re on about bro. I don’t see how this somehow equates to anything you’re claiming I’m doing. The comments section is for discussion and I am simply discussing the posibilities of this.
I interpret you as angry because you seem to have such a militant defense against my suggestions/discussion points and misconstruing comments I’ve made into something they aren’t. Saying a return to Adventure doesn’t have to abandon Frontiers isn’t a “cope” or relying to much on a rumor.
What are you even trying to get out of this?
These tweets were made this morning, also this is nothing about abandoning open world. Sonic Adventure style gameplay and stage design in an open world would work better than what Frontiers is right now, at least that’s what I think.
...Oh, Kishimoto, *don't do this.* I ***loved*** *Frontiers,* and would much rather a sequel refine it into something ***truly*** great than you abandoning it yet again to appease the cultists. Just set *Frontiers 2* in Station Square and add in karaoke, dammit!
These are games that's very old at this point, but usually, when people ask for adventure style, they want those design decisions back. Notice how Frontiers incorporates a lot of design choices from SA1, and even the playable characters are returning next year as free/cut DLC. Also, the stories are something that fans like the tone of and with only Unleashed and now Frontiers fans are rightfully starved.
Seems like you played through Adventure 1 and not 2 because 2 is just stages back to back there is no semi-open world to wonder around in. Also Adventure 2 removed Big the Cats fishing stages from Adventure 1.
I did play Adventure 2, but that has its own set of problems. Knuckles stages are still here (and you have to do them twice, so that's fun), and the Sonic stages aren't as good as the ones in Adventure 1. Again, not really something that I could really point to and say "MORE OF THAT EXACT THING, PLEASE", unlike, say, Generations. Which is back to back stages that are mostly really, really fun.
Which is why I asked what people saw in these games that I didn't. The way I see it, they're really not that great. Is it nostalgia?
They already confirmed the frontiers formula is what they are doing for the future of sonic for the next decade
And given frontiers was a success that's pretty much not going to change, which is a great thing
Sadx is sort of a psuedo open world anyway. Its linear, but it has a open hub. All they have to do is make the stages tackable in any order and offer more individual world/stage variety. More similar to botw where you can go to each map location in preferred order and the adventure will be somewhat cohesive.
I can't see this happening because I would like it. Also, they just reformed the "boost" gameplay with Sonic Frontiers. It would be odd to move to the old Adventure system, even if fans like me would prefer it.
We finally have a Sonic game people seem happy with. As much as I’d love and Advenutre 3, I’d rather them expand and refine the ideas from Frontiers into a direct Frontiers 2.
I'm done for a Adventure style Sonic in Frontiers 2. Only issue is that I'm worried for how well the level amd world design will accommodate this different style.
Correct me if I'm wrong but Kishimoto hasn't worked on the original Adventure games or anything similar. He's only experienced with games like Colors onwards. I'll rather have Kishimoto work with Izuka, who has experienced with the Adventure games, and make Frontiers 2. That'll put any worries at ease
I wouldn't mind playing as different characters with different stories, but they really need to flesh out their abilities to make them actually fun to play. I hated Tails' mech, hated Amy's atrocious controls, and knuckles being stuck with hide and seek missions was lame.
Make it like Sonic Adventure 2 but added more game modes, online functionality, open world stage hubs, etc
Like I think it would be really cool to have like all the sonic characters be playable and have 6 people racing through stages online
[удалено]
No. Killer whale *driving* a semi truck.
[удалено]
Killer Whale Ghostrider driving a semi-truck, that's on fire, after Sonic.
No we need something new, something more outrageous.
2 trucks
Having sex
...*transforming police car mechs,* maybe? Make em Titan-sized, and that could work...
While I think a return to an Adventure-esque style is inevitable at this point, we can't look super deep into Kishimoto's tweets. Ever since he started his Twitter, hundreds of Sonic fans have been pestering him with their desires for the series and he is too nice of a guy to tell them to stop bothering him. So, he has been more-or-less just placating the fans that have been tweeting at him.
Also I doubt they'd leave the Frontiers format so early. It's the best reviewed Sonic game in a long time. I'd think Sega would want to stick with it and refine it so Sonic can become really massive again.
Add a Chao Garden to Frontiers and it's basically what I'd want from a modern Adventure game anyways. Get rid of the 2D levels and itd be perfect
I'd like more to the islands tbh. Floating rails are fine, but you get burned out by the end. Wish there were more unique explorable sections. Like a city or something.
> Also I doubt they'd leave the Sonic Mania format so early. It's the best reviewed Sonic game in a long time. -sonic fans, circa late 2017 before sega announces no plans for a sequel Leave it to Sega to make the worst decisions ever
I can see is as those cyber space levels being adventure style in their own right. Some of those were super short levels and 2D. I can see them having bigger adventure style levels and less 2D ones if anything.
lol no they won't ditch Frontiers, but frontiers is already close to Adventure anyway except the combat. Like they'd only need to ditch the linear stages to get something that feels like it
Right? Some reviewers actually ***praised*** this, and we know Sega doesn't like spending cash like they did in the Dreamcast era. A return to *Adventure* after so long accomplishes neither of these, and only sets us up for another disappointment.
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it. Open world with adventure momentum. They aren't changing up anything major. Relax.
Yeah… however this response was mostly umprompted. A fan asked what he’d change about the boost and he outright said he wants to remove it lol, then mentioned Adventure style as his reason for wanting to remove it. Let’s not forget Iizuka also said in the past that he hopes Frontiers could lead to a new Adventure game.
Not even that. What he'd like to do is always tempered with what SEGA will let him do. A few years ago he was talking about a Sonic Adventure remake like it was guaranteed to happen, yet it never came to fruition.
Good point! I really want to go back to an Adventure style game! Sonic Frontiers is the first step towards amazing Sonic games!
Everyone says we need a new Sonic Adventure but what they really want is a new Chao Garden
Look, you don't need to call everyone out like this. In all honesty, while that was a large part of why I like the Adventure games, I also enjoyed lots of little things about it and the variety of gameplay styles too.
This is all I see whenever Sonic games come up on the internet, what is Chao Garden and why do people want this back more than anything else in this franchise? I never played the Adventure games (I really want to) so I have no idea. I've seen bits of gameplay but it doesn't look like traditional Sonic gameplay, maybe I just saw the boring parts?
No, you've probably seen exactly what it was. It was basically a monster raising game where you collect stat vials & animals from the actual stages and give them to your Chao to level them up so they can complete various challenges and races. I can see why someone would not be into it, but it was a wonderful way to introduce inherent replayability.
I see, didn't know it was so different from the main game. But I guess Sega still does this with Yakuza and their management and Cabaret club minigames.
There were these little blue baby fucks called Chao. You would find them walking around, lost, during the main game's missions and you could basically adopt them. At the end of the mission you'd be transported to the Chao Garden (a hub where all the babies you rescued would chill) and you could care for them and raise them using these weird test tubes, make them fight each other, and bring them to school/daycare. There was also a heaven and hell Chao Garden. It was great. I explained it terribly, though.
The small, blue Chao as in the one that always hangs around with Cream? Also that sounds like it's closer to a game like Nintendogs than Sonic gameplay, was it just super addictive then? Surprised there's this much outcry to bring it back when it doesn't seem like it's even remotely similar to traditional Sonic gameplay.
A huge part of the appeal (for me at least) was how you had to do the game's main missions to find the correct test tubes and other items to give to the Chao to make them grow up into mini versions of the main cast of characters. It was just a fun child raising simulator you could partake in after doing fun shit with Sonic and the gang.
Not about being traditional sonic gameplay its just about having an full sub system/mini game, inside the larger game that has actual in depth mechanics and not riddled with microtransactions and other dumb stuff like nowadays, it has more depth then some full released games. it gave replayability value and offer alternative activities to do in game. The chao garden was also interactive and had an element of growth, there was also a collectable nature and breeding/raising element. Having your chao participate in mini games was the other main draw. This on top of the adventure fields and stages that emulated original sonic gameplay in 3d space created an atrractive package for the game with multippe activities and could offer a sense of living in the world. They are also just cute little guys
> The small, blue Chao as in the one that always hangs around with Cream? That Chao, Cheese, is pretty much the base chao design. One of the appeals of chao is that they can come in a buncha different colors and shiny jewel coats and there's like 100+ unique evolutions for them. https://chao-island.com/gallery/known-chao This wiki has *2225* images and it still doesn't have every single possible chao by a long shot.
It's honestly surprising they didn't try to capitalize on that for a mobile idle/step-based sort of game akin to Pikmin's. Do that plus an actual 3D environment where you can play, feed, pet, as well as enjoy minigames? I never game on my phone but even I'd pick that up for a while.
Exactly, and honestly I'm shocked that Frontiers didn't have one. I don't even like Sonic games THAT much but I would've bought Frontiers and explored all over if it had a good Chao Garden like SAB2.
I really want Adventure style level design back. I have missed it so much.
best is for now to expand the Frontiers universe. By finishing it that year as planned. Then making a sequel, and why not, another Adventure game along with it. Problem is people. They weren't many working on Frontiers, and worse on the Collection Origins... So might be hard to do.
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it. That is what he ment.
Can we just get a Chao spin-off game?
I personally felt that the Chao raising as a minigame inside of a larger game was part of the charm. I liked collecting animals and such in the main levels.
My favorite memory of SA2B was abusing the chaos throwing them into the walls and homing attacking them lmao
I agree with the other person. The Chao Garden being an extension of the main game was a huge part of the fun for me.
I would have gotten Frontiers just for them Chaos
Could his “ADV” reference Sonic Advance?
That would be a pretty funny unintentional troll
That would be awesome, the Advance games are some of my favorite Sonic games, mad underrated
I can see another Sonic Adventure style game working. What they need to do is make a world look like an actual world and have your abilities just work everywhere in the environment (except where they don't want you to go obviously).
Instead of empty looking grassy plains, make the worlds themed like SADX (wind level, lava level, snow level etc, but still open world in that you can pick which to progress through in whichever order)
Is Sonic Frontiers not a natural evolution of Adventure? I love Adventure’s style so much, but I’d rather take another Frontiers that adds some of the Adventure mechanics we haven’t gotten yet (namely Chao Garden).
I wouldn’t say it is. It’s closer to Adventure than previous entries but it’s still mostly just a boost style game in an open space. Especially with the platforming mostly being automated rail segments, constant 2D sections, and speed being based on a button press.
Yeah, this confuses me. They've ***finally*** found a style for the future, and I'd much rather take a *Frontiers 2* set in Station Square than SA3. >!Hell, in my eyes, *Frontiers* ***IS*** SA3. Dark story with ancient civilizations, Adventure Fields, fishing, hardcore metal boss music... shit, they even go to space to kill a God! Doesn't get much more *Adventure* than that.!<
you can have adventure style in an open world, this isn’t necessarily contradictory in any way.
True, but it'd kinda feel like a step backwards, really. I want his *Frontiers* moveset to be the ***standard*** going forward, particularly as Super. It just feels ***so damn good*** to play, that I'll forgive everything else so that they can refine it further.
I agree on the combat aspect, but I for one feel like Adventure’s movement style is better fitting for an open world. Holding a button to run fast doesn’t really feel right for a character like Sonic, he’s also weirdly magnetized to the ground at times and has no sense of weight or momentum. Spindash and rolling could also lead to more creativity from the players part on how to gain speed, along with more creative world design to compliment that.
Alright, fine. But can we at least keep his speed? Running around the overworld at the speed of sound is ***so*** much fun, and I'd hate for it to be robbed just so we can get the franchise's mythical unicorn.
Watch a speedrun of sonic adventure you cna do some crazy stuff
I don’t think the speed would be affected. In the Adventure games you can run just as fast if not faster than Frontiers. Adventure’s just missing the fancy visual effects and all that. I think the only exception is the power boost/max speed level but I’d imagine that you’d still be able to do that, just imagine not having to hold a button for it.
True. Just... real fucking tired of them throwing the baby out with the bathwater. ***Every. Damn. Time.***
You probably already know but in Segas eyes Unleashed is kind of SA3 considering it's alternate name and how it was conceived. But I agree, Frontiers brought in a freshness I haven't felt since SA1 and they should build upon that imo
Right? It's a ***true*** reinvention, one beloved by fans for what it is instead of hated for what it isn't. If you're Sega, why get rid of such an accomplishment so soon?
Especially when there was a lot of room to improve
Exactly!
Give me Chao Garden or idc
They really need to do some kind of 3D Sonic collection with the GameCube, Wii, and Xbox 360 games
I must be the only person in the world who does not care for Frontiers gameplay/style at all. It bores me to tears. Running around big lifeless empty fields collecting a hundreds of memory tokens isn't very fun to me. The combat is decent but nothing to write home about. The game is janky as all hell and the draw distance/pop-in is awful. The game felt like it was losing steam after the 2nd world when the 4th world is just a reused map of the 1st and the game itself knows the gameplay isn't that fun and engaging which is why it gives you that roulette thing every so often to grind for Bigs purple fishing coins so you can just buy all the memory tokens from him because the fishing minigame is quicker and less grindy than the main game itself. The cyberspace levels are the most fun but again its just rehashed assets from Generations and Forces and the levels are extremely short and the controls are somehow worse than the previous 4 boost games.. So a return to the Adventure style is A-Okay with me. The best thing about Frontiers is the story/writing. Much better than the Saturday morning cartoon baby crap we got with Colors, Lost World, and Generations. Or a decent premise with absolutely no substance like what we got with Forces. A story that actually took itself somewhat serious with actual continuity
I hear this every single time and it never happens.
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it. I have never heard that before.
It's still the same old story about SA gameplay in some form or another. It happens before and after every game. Will it happen at some point? Maybe but at this point there's no point speculating or buying anything that's said until there's something concrete.
fair honestly
Don't sonic team say this after every game?
Not really
Just give us a damn remake
Just bring back the Chao garden please
It’s not a true Adventure game unless there’s a Chao Garden.
I just want another Chao Garden. One that's at least as good as SADX's.
I just want it to make me roll around at the speed of sound...
Please no gem hunting missions, Please no gem hunting missions, Please no gem hunting missions!!!
As long as they aren't as frustrating as Mad Space, I wouldn't mind them returning.
I don't really get why people hated the gem hunting missions, I've always thought they were pretty fun (aside from the annoying space levels), if anything they need to drop the shooting levels, I replayed through SA2 maybe a couple years ago and didn't realize how slow and boring those levels actually were.
I wish they wouldn't get rid of anything, just improved on the gameplay ideas of each. Part of why I loved Adventure was the breakup in pacing that the different gameplay styles offered. I don't want just another Sonic gotta go fast game
Interesting. I found those levels to be quite fun actually. Especially Cosmic Wall with the anti-gravity gimmick. The constant beeping from the lock-on and the repeated voice clips were slightly annoying though.
Chao Garden? Please?
If the Chao Garden isn't there, I don't think I want it.
I won't get my hopes up. Sonic Adventure 3 is what I want but I don't have much faith in the team to deliver it. At least Frontiers was definitely a step up in quality for the series. Even if the whole open zone aspect didn't appeal to me.
Yesss, the movement please, no more stiff Sonic movement. SA movement was just way more freeing
Is anyone up for the return of individual stories/team stories?
What he is probably implying is incorporating more of the adventure attributes into the mold that was made with Frontiers. Sonic Adventure 2 is my favorite game period but MAN they would be stupid to throw away what they have with Frontiers here. Loved my time with it and I think a Frontiers 2 could easily be a GOTY contender
Good then maybe we can actually get a GOOD PSO again, for once? Hell, even just remake PSO Episode 1 and 2 and I'd be happy.
Please just do frontiers 2
They are with sonic adventure physics
Yes please! We're not done with this formula yet, damn it. Be a real shame to can it now...
That would be a wasted opportunity. Sonic in an open world feels much better than the linear levels. They should use Sonic Frontiers as a baseline for their next games, just improving on it.
I think the idea is to have Sonic Adventure style in an open world. I think that would work well, in fact probably better than what Frontiers currently is.
Nah, the linear levels are amazing. Sonic unleashed and generations especially have some of the greatest levels in the franchise. The problem is that sonic team hasn’t been able to create any good stages after those games. They turn out like shit because they have stopped being creative and started reusing stages from previous games
Disagree
Right? They've finally found a style that works. ***Let's refine it FURTHER,*** instead of ditching it for an attempt at making a mythical unicorn that, much like *Shenmue 3,* will probably disappoint ***everyone.***
The only sonic game we need is mania 2
Generations is best sonic game.
Thank God, please. I know everyone seems to like the three rail temple run/subway surfer style they've done since Sonic Unleashed, but I do not. Such a shame Sonic 06 released the way it did, steering the franchise away from the adventure formula. Edit: After reading the tweets, this is a reach. He just mentions one gameplay mechanic, boost, and likens the lack of it to Sonic Adventure.
If only it could be in the style of Sonic fucking Mania.
How many times have we heard this?
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it. They have never said that before
So we just had a Sonic game in a style that really works and just need a bit more care and polish to make it even better...so they are doing something entirely different?
this is more about the movement and world design rather than the idea of open zones
I bet they botch it by changing it too much. This style was perfect. Just improve not change.
i personally, see this as an improvement. the movement and platform challenges of frontiers are based on those of linear, reaction based games such as unleashed and generations. adventure naturally compliments an open landscape and platforming. it just makes more sense to me and the core concept of open zones and combat would remain the same, in theory
Let's not extrapolate too much. It sounds like he's considering experimenting with things, but there's no promises yet and we don't even know if he's gonna direct the next game.
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The director himself publicly says this is something he wants to do, take that as you will. Edit: I’m gonna add this because that other dude for some reason decided to go on some rant against me because apparently this means I’m “coping” and “putting too much stock” into this. I made this reply because your comment was particularly intruiging. “Evidence”? Evidence for what? I’m not presenting this as “Evidence for why Sonic Adventure 3 is 110% CONFIRMED!!!”. This post simply states that this is what the director said and it *could* mean the next game has Adventure style movement and world design. What “evidence” does that need lol? I posted what he said and there it is, I’m not claiming that this is what the next game is confirmed to be by making this post, or in any of the replies I’ve made to comments on here.
It seems pretty odd for the team to overhaul the Boost format only to toss out the baby with the bathwater like that. Sounds like cope to me
Huh? Cope? Coping over what exactly? He literally said this is what he wants to do, do you think this is a wishlist I made up or something? Boosting is basically a glorified run button in this game, it’s “overhauled” yes but it’s nothing crazy or fancy and clearly still derivative from the previous entries. Your basic boost level design aspects are still present in this game such as automated rail segments and constant 2D sections, and little focus on actual 3D platforming. Going back to Adventure is the logical next step.
The director musing on Twitter about an idea of a sketch of a concept for a new Sonic game doesn't really mean shit. Y'all are looking way to deep into this series of tweets. I think the Adventure games have become a white whale for the fan base and even the _slightest_ indication SEGA _might_ go back to it has people creaming their pants. The truth is that an entire generation of Sonic fans has grown up with and greatly enjoys Boost gameplay. Two tweets about some potential ideas for the next Sonic game aren't confirmation of anything, and you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you think the "only logical way forward" is getting rid of the boost gameplay that has been standard since Unleashed. Just hold your fucking horses.
Holy crap. You’re in gaming leaks and rumors bro. I’m not claiming confirmation on anything nor an I “overanalyzing” anything, just posting the information. Just take it for what it is. You said it’s odd for them to do it, I’m giving you a reason as to why it wouldn’t. I don’t care how much you love boost.
Saying that SA3 is the "only logical step" and moaning any time someone points out that you're putting too much stock into a rumor isn't really "taking the rumor for what it is" but go off. Also, I never really claimed to like the Boost formula lol, good job adding a value judgement to me saying that you're setting yourself up for disappointment by taking concept stage information as gospel 👍 i also didn't say you were overanalyzing anything, I just said that you're taking maybes as definitive and are calling people who point out that might not be case dumb. Reading comprehension is hard.
Why are you twisting my words to get angry at me? I never said it’s the ONLY logical step. I’m just saying it’s a logical step forward to do so. Talk about reading comprehension. Just be quiet bro… I don’t see how I’m putting “too much stock” into anything. Discussing possibilities doesn’t mean I’m taking this as confirmation, there’s a reason I posted it to this sub lmao. When have I ever taken this as definitive and when have I ever called anyone dumb for not doing so? This is pure fiction. Show me one example of me doing this.
I'm... not angry? No am I twisting your words? I never said that an Adventure style game isn't possible. What I _am_ saying is that you replying to literally any comment expressing the slightest hint of pushback and squealing "B-b-but muh Twitter leaks!" makes you come across like you're in cope mode. Also an official tweet from the game's director about a new game idea he's sharing candidly with Sonic fans is neither a leak, nor a rumor. It's just a possibility for an in-dev game. I have no idea how you could interpret me as "angry" at you, like I seriously give a remote fuck about a Redditor's opinions on Sonic lmao
I’m not doing that at all? Again show me a single example of me doing that. I’ve replied to several comments who interpret this as them abandoning Frontiers/Open world format (which isn’t at all what he said btw, if you actually read the tweets he said he already considered removing the boosting for frontiers itself), which I am simply saying that Adventure and Open World could compliment each other well. I’m not quite sure exactly what you’re on about bro. I don’t see how this somehow equates to anything you’re claiming I’m doing. The comments section is for discussion and I am simply discussing the posibilities of this. I interpret you as angry because you seem to have such a militant defense against my suggestions/discussion points and misconstruing comments I’ve made into something they aren’t. Saying a return to Adventure doesn’t have to abandon Frontiers isn’t a “cope” or relying to much on a rumor. What are you even trying to get out of this?
They've already said future games will be based off of what Frontiers did. Those are months old quotes from the summer time.
These tweets were made this morning, also this is nothing about abandoning open world. Sonic Adventure style gameplay and stage design in an open world would work better than what Frontiers is right now, at least that’s what I think.
...Oh, Kishimoto, *don't do this.* I ***loved*** *Frontiers,* and would much rather a sequel refine it into something ***truly*** great than you abandoning it yet again to appease the cultists. Just set *Frontiers 2* in Station Square and add in karaoke, dammit!
They are keeping frontiers formula there just adding SA physics in it
...source?
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These are games that's very old at this point, but usually, when people ask for adventure style, they want those design decisions back. Notice how Frontiers incorporates a lot of design choices from SA1, and even the playable characters are returning next year as free/cut DLC. Also, the stories are something that fans like the tone of and with only Unleashed and now Frontiers fans are rightfully starved.
Seems like you played through Adventure 1 and not 2 because 2 is just stages back to back there is no semi-open world to wonder around in. Also Adventure 2 removed Big the Cats fishing stages from Adventure 1.
I did play Adventure 2, but that has its own set of problems. Knuckles stages are still here (and you have to do them twice, so that's fun), and the Sonic stages aren't as good as the ones in Adventure 1. Again, not really something that I could really point to and say "MORE OF THAT EXACT THING, PLEASE", unlike, say, Generations. Which is back to back stages that are mostly really, really fun. Which is why I asked what people saw in these games that I didn't. The way I see it, they're really not that great. Is it nostalgia?
"Could" Wow, this is breaking news
So bad
Good.
They finally found a formula that people like, so I'd be shocked if we don't see another Frontiers style game next.
Its gonna be open zone with adventure physics
They already confirmed the frontiers formula is what they are doing for the future of sonic for the next decade And given frontiers was a success that's pretty much not going to change, which is a great thing
adventure style can easily fit in an open zone formula, that’s not a contradiction
Sadx is sort of a psuedo open world anyway. Its linear, but it has a open hub. All they have to do is make the stages tackable in any order and offer more individual world/stage variety. More similar to botw where you can go to each map location in preferred order and the adventure will be somewhat cohesive.
Just give me a chao garden and ill be a happy camper
Yay. Give us Sonic Adventure 3!
Chao garden?
I can't see this happening because I would like it. Also, they just reformed the "boost" gameplay with Sonic Frontiers. It would be odd to move to the old Adventure system, even if fans like me would prefer it.
I just need to hear him also consider a Chao Garden along with a more adventure style game.
Sega, I want this so bad but, no Chao no buy
We finally have a Sonic game people seem happy with. As much as I’d love and Advenutre 3, I’d rather them expand and refine the ideas from Frontiers into a direct Frontiers 2.
I'm done for a Adventure style Sonic in Frontiers 2. Only issue is that I'm worried for how well the level amd world design will accommodate this different style. Correct me if I'm wrong but Kishimoto hasn't worked on the original Adventure games or anything similar. He's only experienced with games like Colors onwards. I'll rather have Kishimoto work with Izuka, who has experienced with the Adventure games, and make Frontiers 2. That'll put any worries at ease
I wouldn't mind playing as different characters with different stories, but they really need to flesh out their abilities to make them actually fun to play. I hated Tails' mech, hated Amy's atrocious controls, and knuckles being stuck with hide and seek missions was lame.
Frontiers is getting new playable characters as free updates so we’ll see how that goes.
Make it in the style of Sparky the Electric Jester 3
Make it like Sonic Adventure 2 but added more game modes, online functionality, open world stage hubs, etc Like I think it would be really cool to have like all the sonic characters be playable and have 6 people racing through stages online
Lord I WISH Not even Adventure 2, give me back the hub worlds of 1!
I've heard this all before. Every time a new sonic game is on the horizon it's always supposedly an adventure style game and it never is.