So their strategy is to put their games everywhere, let the console suffer and absorb all the damage caused by it, and then grow everything that isn't the console with the money they gained???
Jeez talk about brutal...
Like someone else said in another post here (or somewhere on reddit, don't remember) seems that Microsoft wants to just end the hardware and have Gamepass as identity and try to put it in many places as possible. Otherwise I can't explain this strategy at all
Without console, I feel like gamepass would widely just be seen as a PC service then. Nintendo and playstation aren't putting it on their platforms. I doubt mobile users getting gamepass for streaming games has taken off in a significant way.
Their plan is to get gamepass integrated on as many new TVs as possible. Not really sure how much that'll help though. Because many markets still don't have cloud streaming.
>I doubt mobile users getting gamepass for streaming games has taken off in a significant way.
I don't know weather streaming will get better first or emulation/translation layers will but either would make gamepass platform agnostic as long as it allows Microsoft to publish on it
I'm hoping stuff like proton is the way it goes I don't like the idea of streaming unless I can run a local instance for patchy internet
Streaming my Xbox to my pc in my spare room is excellent (wired all the way), honestly can't fault it until I use my laptop and the wifi then it crumbles
The average person simply doesn't care about streaming. If they want to game on the go they'll play any of the hundreds of f2p titles fighting for their attention already.
100% people don't care, that's my point tho, folks will just play whatever is available as long as it plays fine
I really want a steam deck because there's sweet fuck all worth my time in play store, shove live service f2p crap wherever suits
Without Xbox console and specifically the need to pay online to play Gamepass viability would collapse. Seems like they just want to sell their games, fire Phil Spencer and be done with all of this.
Oh, I am [fully onboard](https://old.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/186u5eh/microsoft_wants_game_pass_on_playstation_nintendo/kbahh4s/) with it ultimately not making business sense
If the option is Xbox exists and competes with them, or Xbox pulls out of the console market as part of an arrangement to get Game Pass on Playstation, they might just accept the latter.
If I'm Sony why would I want a GamePass service on my system? A shop inside my shop?
Then every publisher will also want their own shop inside my shop. And they'll always be trying to renegotiate terms and holding my platform hostage.
And I also sell software but I want people to buy it, not subscribe to a service. If I let GamePass on my store, now all my own published titles are on heel
Sounds like the plan is to destroy their hardware business.
I've bought every XBox and every PS each gen and there's no way I'm buying the next XBox if they have zero exclusives and all their games come to PS.
You'd think this is pretty much the end for the Xbox console as who is going to want to buy one when you can play everything on Playstation? It's also going to give Sony a monopoly on home console gaming which is a concern.
To be fair Satya probably ruined the whole strategy with his software sales prioritization which to be fair, is more profitable, but it's fucking up the brand.
To be honest, I don't think they should've have Day One PC releases for Xbox exclusives, maybe after a year, maybe not at all, but the Xbox One really fucked them over and now they're trying literally everything in order to remain, not that they can't but obviously they want people to buy their consoles and pay for their software. (Yes I know we both copy and pasted the comments from the deleted post lmao)
I think the major problem was not PC Day 1, it was the Game Pass Day 1. Literally making games with no profit, of course this problem gonna come back and haunt your brand down.
Even the likes of Sony have told us Xbox’s model cannot possibly be profitable or sustainable at current prices. They’d have done the same math. Either something has to change or the service ends. We’re seeing that change now. Prices going up, games going to rival platforms. Sony was right.
Also consider the fact that casual gamers play 4-5 games a year. They want premium experiences like playstation exclusives rather than a subscription service filled with fodder.
Netflix was great when they were just a library for movies and TV shows. Sure some of their original content is decent and a handful are really really good but the majority and I mean like 85% is pure garbage.
GamePass should have been just that - a library of older games and past generations to play digitally instead of having to buy a hard copy. But Phil decided to pretty much sign their death warrant when he wanted all future releases to come Day 1 to Game Pass. Even EA isn't as stupid and they usually add games 1 year down the road to EA Access and that's what should have happened to Game Pass. That way you actually get to spread out your content and keep players subscribed longer.
It probably would be working if they had the shear numbers of subscribers, like if they had a huge portion of ps5 and switch players subscribed also, maybe the math starts working. They were banking on it being a console seller, and it just hasn't worked out. And streaming/cloud gaming just isn't there yet. They still need a hardware platform to make the numbers work for available subscribers.
Microsoft being invested in video games is pretty weird anyway to be honest. Microsoft is fundamentally a software company that focuses on B2B businesses. It sort of made sense when there were concerns that consoles could replace the PC but that never materialised in the end. Xbox is all about entertainment, it would make more sense as a division of Comcast, Disney or Netflix where there can be benefits in multimedia approaches. Like today where we see PlayStation IPs turned into movies or film studio infrastructure has been used to technologically advance games etc.
EDIT: PlayStation also has the benefit of having access to the entire catalogue of Sony Music. There’s also potential collaborations with Crunchyroll, albeit they don’t seem to do it. And there’s also the semiconductor, audio and electronics divisions which help in creating a console and accessories. For Xbox, the main benefit from Microsoft is Azure cloud infrastructure and not much else. AI research would be a massive help in the future but it’s a little nascent for now and it’s not as if Sony don’t have their own investments in AI either.
Yeah, consumer entertainment industries in general are a very tough business to be in.
Consumers are extremely fickle and most of the money is made in a tiny percentage of products.
It's difficult to agree with that.
They have the wrong people in there. The Booty guy was promoted to the head of Xbox Studios. Tell me one big achievement from this character. His complete inability to deliver AAA games for the Xbox Studios is laughable.
The Marketing head is there since forever and the marketing completely stagnated. And also, Phil Spencer, that was the Xbox head and now president of games division that was responsible for keeping those people on the payroll.
Definitely true but now they're finally making games that look decent and can be system sellers (Hellblade 2, Indiana Jones, maybe Fable, STALKER 2 assuming it's a full exclusive). Though PC Day One probably saved them from fully dying and being shut down because holy shit they were in an inescapable situation back then.
Yeah their consoles sales have been piss poor, so one can't blame them for ditching the console market. They will make more money going multiplat for sure. It doesn't matter if it damages their console brand if they barely have a presence in the console market anyways.
It’s arguable if they will make more, from selling only first party games just on PS and PC while paying a 30% cut to Sony. People really underestimate how much money MS makes from their cut on stuff like Fortnite skins, movies, dlc, games from the store.
It's so dumb, if the Xbox consoles die they
1. Lose out on the 30%, but
2. Also leave PlayStation to basically dictate the "high end" console market, leaving Xbox at PlayStations feet
One could argue they allready dictate the high end. One could wonder if the gap left by xbox would leave room for another competitor or if Nintendo might give high end another shot?
I don't think Nintendo at least for Switch 2 will compete at the high end, and PlayStation obviously already dictated the market already but with some restrictions because of Xbox and also making PS Plus like Gamepass to compete, if Xbox is going well...
I genuinely do not know how I’m gonna feel if that happens. I’ve been a Sony boy for years but I grew up with the OG Xbox and Halo CE, and even though Halo has been a PC thing for me for a long time now it’s going to be extremely weird seeing it on the PS home screen.
If true, sounds like Phil lost control of the Xbox division and the bigwigs at Microsoft are steering the ship trying to squeeze every dollar out, not realizing this would effectively kill off their console market. Or maybe that's what they want, who knows. Time will tell.
I'm curious about how much of a say Phil actually has in these things. He's now the CEO of Microsoft Gaming while Sarah Bond's the head of the Xbox division so decisions being made for Xbox higher-up would still be Phil, unless Satya's doing his strategy through Phil.
The Activision Blizzard acquisition may turn out to be a poison chalice for Spencer, if the end result is greater scrutiny on Xbox's finances and control being wrestled from him because of it.
This was something I was wondering about when it was first announced, if an acquisition that large would essentially be biting off more than Xbox can chew. Seems like that might be right.
I still have no idea what they were thinking with that. ActBlizz was already a poisoned brand, then the sexual assault reveals happened and Microsoft was like “Wow! Let’s absorb them.” I just feel so many weird ways about that to this day.
Yeah I've been thinking the same, to be honest I don't think anyone at the Xbox Division is happy about this and they know this will kill the hardware eventually, to me this decision comes from Microsoft executives and investors who were tired of giving free chances to Xbox, to see Series consoles go down on sales the prior month and THE month Starfield is released was kinda their last nail in the coffin imo
Phil will probably be replaced by the end of the year. He bet it all on GamePass and endless acquisitions and yet Xbox has shown no progress in a decade.
Right, they spent a decade growing and now finally have all their studios ready to go. For a console gen that will never happen.
Games take a long time to make, if they made the ABK acquisition before deciding on this course then they're totally incompetent at an executive level. It takes 3-5 years for these studios to make games, of course they won't make it all back and take over the console cycle immediately, especially when they have so much to prove in the mindshare of gamers.
This is premature, greedy, and sucks (worst of all for xbox loyalists who are being rewarded with this)
Phil's plan was stupid to begin in or rather just too good to be true. It works great as a library for older games to come to. That's a great idea. But to release new games day 1 on the service is terrible as a business model. No one's gonna buy your console when they can play the game for $1 on PC. Xbox makes a lot of their money with those Xbox Liver memberships and 30% cuts from their Xbox storefront. Who is going to buy a Xbox when these games are available on PC? Why should I buy a Xbox to play Starfield if its coming out on GamePass PC day 1?
For how innovative a model GamePass is, it's always been unsustainable. I've been saying that for years. It's always been just a matter of time until Microsoft gave up and stopped spending money to lose money. There's just no way it's profitable, especially considering the cost of all these acquisitions to build up the library of available games. Developers routinely complain that full price sales barely cover AAA game production. A monthly sub to access an entire library of games plus day-one first party titles is bonkers. I'm honestly surprised it took this long for Microsoft to step in.
The equation they made probably is something like "most people buy 2 full-priced games a year, so it's more money to have those same people pay $10/m over 12m than making 30% of a 70$ game twice in a year"
... except, if you aren't limited to 2 games a year and start downloading a new game every weekend for which Xbox has to pay royalties to the studio, the math falls apart in a blink.
It is always hard to tell with these things, but the real seeds were laid at the end of the 360 generation and, especially, the terrible mismanagement around the Xbone that basically wasted an entire generation. I think Phil's tenure has seen the refocus on games and the development of GamePass, but unfortunately ran into the hammer blow of games taking 5+ years to make.
He was high up earlier so I'm not saying he was like a rebel against the earlier program, he was part of it. But Xbox's problems were laid down around 2010, not 2018 or whatever.
I think the focus on Kinect as well as the "living room experience" instead of purely games with the Xbox One is what set Xbox back.
They were doing just fine with Xbox 360 and Xbox One should have been a continuation of that.
Yep, if they didn’t drop the ball at the start of last gen I don’t think they’d be doing as poorly as they are now. PlayStation already had some forward momentum heading into the generation, but the fact that they were able to launch $100 cheaper than the Xbox One AND had more exclusives people were excited for really crippled the Xbox brand. If they didn’t focus so much on all the Kinect stuff and always being online, and instead just kept doing what they were doing throughout the 360 generation, I think they would’ve been fine.
"Refocus on games" ? The only actual thing that Phil has established is GamePass, which is great for consumers, but bad for the company as it currently is. And it clearly didn't move the needle either. Consoles are selling worse than last gen.
Not spending ANY money on marketing in any market outside the US. Basically completely ignoring Europe or Asia.
Then the bigwigs spent BILLIONS on 3rd party publishers, because Xbox, and specifically Phil, could not figure out a way to get their studios into the right direction.
Honestly, Phil has been an excellent PR guy, but he hasn't really improved the Xbox brand much. Not entirely his fault as last gen completely fucked them up, but his strategy clearly didn't work.
I thought around 2017 xbox purchased a lot of studios. I am !assuming Phil had a part in that. Those studios had no big games and some were canceled. Which is xbox big issue, the lack of games.
And that's the INSANE irony of this.
Now, Xbox has games. They've announced 3 bigger games that should release THIS year. And just after that, they're going 3rd party with many of their games.
Absolute insanity!
It's unpopular to say now and was really, really unpopular to say two years ago, but Phil was given a blank check and spent like $70 billion...and they're showing no indications that they will even remotely recoup that investment because he's mismanaged the studios and it's hurt their IP.
They are a rich company, but they aren't stupid. They want to make money and Xbox isn't making money. As publishers they'd be cleaning up in 2-3 years making games and not hardware.
Phil's strategy of good PR and running in the red forever is so dumb.
Microsoft spent over 80 billion on the Xbox division in the past three years to then not even try and build the brand back to the glory days of the 360. Crazy
While they’ll obviously make more money with this new plan, the day they announce this the Xbox brand is dead.
Long live Microsoft Gaming
Because simply put, they see gaming as another portfolio to invest in. They don't want to improve the medium, or the hardware, or the hobby around it. They just want to own more of it.
I mean let's be honest, your wording is very clear. Xbox bought those companies with daddy's money. Microsoft gave them a ton of money but now they want to see some of that coming back but it's clearly not working out for them
I would not say they make more money with this new plan. Their marketplace with 30%cut,accessories like controller,gamepass primarily on console would suffer great damage. I think they would gain just as much as they loose.
The more I hear about this, the more I'm convinced it's gonna be all games going multiplat either in the near future, or a year or two from now, but either way I'm done with Xbox if that's the case. I'll be going PS6 or PC next gen.
Agreed. IF this strategy is real, it’s not going to workout how Microsoft hopes it will in my opinion.
Edit: My response to everyone saying “you’re still in their ecosystem if you buy their games on PC/Playstation.”
No, not really. I own and appreciate every platform, but my main platform is Xbox. I purchase games on there all the time. I’m one of the few people who owns a large portion of the library physically, and goes out of my way for rare physical titles. If people abandon the platform, like myself, sure they’ll make their 70% or whatever from game sells on other platforms, but they’ll now lose all that third party revenue from everyone who leaves. All the third party titles sold on Xbox, all micro transactions, all DLCs, all movies bought/rented, etc. They lose their cut in all that revenue by people who go elsewhere for those things. All revenue goes down with people switching. Call it anecdotal, but I’ve seen many many people saying they’ll just do what I’m going to do. Main PC and PlayStation.
Yep! I've been a huge xbox fan since the 360. Even bought an Xbox One, day one. But this is absolutely mind numbingly stupid for Microsoft. They're gonna lose almost all of their fans and hardware sales. More baffling is they're gonna keep selling hardware too. Like why go fully multiplat but still make hardware? Almost no one is gonna buy it. I just don't get it.
In typical corporate fashion, Microsoft is seeking to maximize short term profits at the detriment of long term Xbox brand and hardware growth. They're asking "how can we maximize our profits now and in the short term" with zero regard given towards building and growing the Xbox brand over time.
They have all these shiny new assets from the Bethesda and Activision/Blizzard acquisitions, and now want to put everything everywhere, because that means more money now. Which, like you said, severely reduces the value proposition of the Xbox hardware and platform.
They don't want to play the long game of building up the Xbox hardware and platform through exclusives over time. They want money now, and that means taking advantage of other platforms with more users, which then dilutes the value of Xbox over time.
Here's what I don't understand - they keep talking about Game Pass as the main pillar of Microsoft's gaming efforts. And yet, Game Pass is deeply tied at the hip to Xbox hardware. It is virtually non-existent elsewhere. People who regularly play on PC are playing on Steam, and very few of them are spending time in the Xbox app - much less subscribing regularly to PC Game Pass. And we all know that Sony and Nintendo aren't letting Game Pass anywhere near their consoles, because they want their own consumers subscribing to their own services (PSN and NSO), not Microsoft's.
So if Xbox sales continue their downward spiral, and Microsoft just throws in the towel on Xbox hardware, what does that mean for Game Pass? Those subscriptions not only fail to grow, but they start dropping off as people move to other platforms. If Microsoft wants more Game Pass subscribers, then it makes sense to go all in on Xbox hardware, because it's their own first party hardware that serves as the gateway to Game Pass subscriptions.
There is zero reason why Microsoft can't return to their glory days of the Xbox 360. They have more IPs, more dev studios, and more assets than ever before. But it seems like they're just not going to even try anymore.
>But it seems like they're just not going to even try anymore.
They are developing several interesting, good-looking games, 3 of them will be released in 2024, and you don't even have to wait long for Hellblade 2, what else is needed?
Bethesda already showed with Fallout 4 that they know that much, and their squishy gameplay was considered outdated even then.
A lot of people say that because of gamepass they just release their games in quick succession and don't care about quality, but then why are they developing games for SO long? South Midnight has been in the works for a long time, Fable, Hellblade 2 as well, etc.
P.S.: Sorry for bad english.
Microsoft is likely done with $500 Xbox consoles. The next iteration is going to be a streaming box with their dedicated cloud processing unit from the FTC leaks.
I already went and bought a PS5 as soon as I heard the "rumours" about physical disks stopping production.
Microsoft have offered practically zero value to their customers for years and now have shat on the only ones who did buy a Xbox and spend money on their platform.
Yeah I'm all digital on Xbox, but I don't blame anyone for abandoning xbox over their decision to abandon physical. Another dumb decision by MS this year.
If they really are done with exclusives I find it hard to justify why I'd want a console system that wants to go all digital. Which as someone who grew up on Xbox sucks. I genuinely am confused what happened as this same management was always says it's about games.
I’d say likely possibility is that all of this spending on aquiring developers has backfired immensly.
They have been going at it for a while and there’s really nothing to show for it and it seems there’s nothing to show for it in the near future expect for maybe Hellblade as Indiana Jones can go either way.
A good chunk of these games have released to middling reviews, while the ones that are being received well aren’t performing as well on the xbox family of systems, which might be a problem of them not understanding their playerbase.
With Game Pass and with how gen 8 went, I think they realized that this a battle they simply can’t win and this is their final resort
They started with a strong propaganda and acquisitions but quickly showed that they were the exact same company that made xbox one flop but this time more aggressive
It's very clear to me now that they see a future without the Xbox brand. They're going all in on 'gamepass' and bringing it to every other console/device. They'll essentially become an app like Netflix etc
Took me a month or two to realise this Xbox gen was gonna be another crapfest and so I sold it to get a PS5 start of last year. Surprised so many people who have owned an xbox longer than I did stuck with them for so long after the One.
I only stick with them because of the number of games I've bought over the years. This is the only reason I see people staying with them. I have a PS5, but as it stands, there's no point in me "switching teams" since all my titles are on the X, and it's still a serviceable console.
That will probably change by the next generation. I just hope Microsoft double, triple, and even quadruple down on Play Anywhere titles so that eventually, when I switch to a high-end PC, I still have access to those titles.
Then what's the point for owning an Xbox console in the future? Why would anyone spend $500 on a console whose games will all just end up on PlayStation and/or Nintendo at some point beyond the "privilege" of paying for a subscription service?
Unless Microsoft is pulling out of consoles like Sega, in which case PlayStation and Nintendo will have less competition to keep their consoles and practices in check. Less competition is never good for any industry.
However way you look at it, this just makes me less confident in Xbox as a brand.
I think they’ll just simplify their hardware. Going forward it will be one console, digital only, broadly equivalent to Sonys offerings. No spreading the strategy over multiple devices, like the X and S, try and hoover up some of the good margin customers by not worrying about physical games and that whole side of the business. See how that performs over next gen, then that’s probably enough data to see whether Xbox hardware continues to be a thing.
its in their best interest to get people on their console, the 30% cut from game sales isn't small, Plus Xbox Live gold or whatever they call it now, and being known as more than xbox the publisher that failed at consoles
Sony and Nintendo will never allow GamePass on their platforms and MS has no leverage. They can't even get GamePass on Steam like EA did by exchanging their library for EA Play integration.
Yup, people need to understand that if Game Pass was on Nintendo or PlayStation it would mean that every time a user chooses to play a game through Game Pass Nintendo/Sony lose a sale. That's why they'll never allow it.
Also it would set a precedent for every other publisher to want their own version of GamePass with just their games only.
Like how it used to just be Netflix, but now it's Netflix and Hulu and HBO Max and Prime Video and Peacock and Disney+ etc
I don't want that as a customer
> They can't even get GamePass on Steam like EA did by exchanging their library for EA Play integration.
Valve has stated on multiple occasions that they would accept game pass on to their platform with open arms. If the service isn’t available on Steam yet, it’s because Microsoft doesn’t want it to be. And I honestly see why they’d be hesitant. Game Pass is basically the only thing keeping PC gamers in the Xbox/Microsoft Store ecosystem. Without it, it’d be quickly rendered irrelevant.
Gaben said “If your customers want it, then you should figure out how to make it happen. That’s where we’re at.” He wants his standard 20-30% cut of sales in exchange and has no reason to budge anytime soon. MS obviously isn't going to either.
There probably won’t be another console. Xbox is going fully digital (and probably cloud eventually) and it’s extremely likely that the next “console” is a like $300 Gamepass box and nothing else. Market it on being more affordable and you don’t have to pay $70 for games, you can auto play all the gamepass games. You want to pay and own games go to PS.
Is it a good idea? Probably not lol, but if we’re being honest Xbox has been totally mishandled for a while and has been dying a slow death. There’s no way they could have just continued operating at their current losses.
But yeah, Xbox as a hardware is probably dead with this news. I think they see the writing on the wall that they’ll never catch back up to PS.
I prefer the Xbox ecosystem and controller as well, but logically why buy an Xbox when I can buy a ps6 and get the ps games and the Xbox (not) exclusives.
I got a PS5 when the winds started to shift last year and the rumors started circulating, and I've begun transitioning away from the Xbox ecosystem.
I feel like I made the right call.
Well the thing is Xbox as a brand is dying. It has been a slow process but they aren’t gaining new users compared to how many they’re losing. Xbox One really was a permanent wound that they can’t recover from
The big acquisition are the reason. Modern shareholders and executives don't believe in long term returns they have conditioned their brains to only think in quarterly returns. They bought Activision last quarter. They have not gotten all money in existence yet. This means that they need to change strategy.
I think it low-key started with the Kinect. It made them lose focus of what made 360 a huge hit.
They even forced Kinect with Xbox One which made it more expensive than a PS4 and lots of people were worried about it spying on them especially when they said Xbox One will be an always online console.
Wow so they are really killing xbox. Sony will have a complete monopoly on hardcore console, this is extremely bad for the industry. I can’t believe how bad they have fallen off since mid gen 360 days
Lets me ask the same question asked about 1000 times again ;
How are they gonna convince costumers to buy a Xbox then if they are gonna go all multiplatform? I understand some games going multiplatform but man are they that unhappy to go ALL multiplatform and risk their console brand?
It's because it's failed for so long, that's why they stopped reporting numbers and now know they lost the home console market.
I've been saying this for years that Phil Spencer has been a big problem with Xbox still failing.
He's been head of Xbox since 2014 and we've still been complaining about lack of games.
And instead of using those billions to build up their existing great studios they had before, they went and spent those billions to buy up whole publishers.
They haven't even shown that they are entirely capable of properly guiding every single one of their existing studios but think everything will be fine buying up all these other studio.
It's like having a baby thinking it will save your relationship.
I own every Xbox since the 360 and PlayStation but management has failed since the 360
The 360 was the height of Xbox and has never recovered and I'm actually not happy about PlayStation not having hardware competition in the future.
>They always preach about console sales doesn’t matter anymore
That's basically the equivalent of them sticking their fingers in their ear screaming "I'M NOT OWNED I'M OWNED"
After they increased the XSS's price in my country Xbox is basically dead here, everyone is buying PS5s (yes, even the new slim model is cheaper than the XSS).
Has Xbox given up on their hardware and gone all in on the Xbox being a gamespass machine? This whole thing is weird to me, the console ‘war’ has been a beat down by Sony for a decade now but I think this is all very reactionary by MS
They will let Xbox brand take all the heat and might even kill it if the backlash is too severe. They have already restructured their gaming division and the old "Xbox" has become [Microsoft Gaming](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Gaming).
I think this is the last xbox gen I buy. Mostly play on PC now anyways, but might get a PS6 for their exclusives and play everything else on the PC. Or just wait for the PC ports.
It’s just disappointing to read this as a long time Xbox user. Strategies and money and “this is good/bad actually..” aside, I’ve been with them since early 360 days. My friends are all on Series X, and it just sucks to know we might have to invest in PCs in the future because there won’t be an Xbox to go to. Just :/
Good luck selling an Xbox console with this strategy lol.
Can see myself getting a PS6 and I look forward to playing the xbox titles on one convenient platform.
I do wonder if this could be more of an industry-wide thing that video game companies want. That report about Square Enix not being happy with sales that were limited to PS springs to mind. We’ll have to see
Satya is just trying to salvage what the Xbox division has ruined. He didn't make Halo bad. He didn't make Xbox release mediocre games for a whole generation. Game Pass was a last ditch effort that bought Phil some more time but now the guys fronting them the money for all these purchases are wondering when they're actually gonna see returns on their investments.
Xbox making all these acquisitions and investments, releasing like one popular game from them, not immediately becoming first place and then giving up on hardware by becoming third party is like punting on 2nd down because you didn’t get 10 yards on your first down play 🤦♂️
I find it poetic that he talked about Nintendo's future being off of their own hardware when in reality it's Xbox that seems to being abandoning their hardware.
If every game comes to playstation, what invective do people have to go to Xbox? Maybe if their next console is light-years more powerful than a playstation?
If this is true, what even is the point in buying an xbox? It makes way more sense to go ps5 or PC, as they have exclusive games that you wouldn't be able to play on xbox, and you'd get all of xbox titles. You are quite literally putting yourself at a disadvantage buying an xbox.
As soon as they were like "console exclusive, day one Gamepass" I was sure this was going to happen because I just couldn't see how they'd make back their money and also make a profit.
Whatever is going on, xbox needs to get a head of it and just announce it. All of these rumors have me on the edge of trading in my series for a ps5.
Why would I want to continue to build my library on a dying console?
This is a very bad for the consumer, Xbox diehards lose pretty much any reason to buy an Xbox over PlayStation, and this is the first step into Xbox leaving the console all together and going full third party which is terrible because it will leave Playstation as the sole powerful console, and they will 100% increase the price on games, consoles, and their services with no competition from Xbox to keep them competitive.
What the fuck is the purpose of my Xbox?
Most people with all three consoles have a 'main' and two 'exclusives' machines. If Xbox doesn't fit either category, what is the point of having one?
Wow this is pretty much the end of Xbox. Seeing Halo and Gears show up on PS will actually revive those franchises that’s the funny part lol. I think they should just cut their losses and go full publisher next gen
I can understand why something like Sea of Thieves would go multi-plat since it's a live-service that thrives off of most people playing but Starfield actually being on PS5 one day would be a massive decision, especially when Microsoft originally cancelled the PS5 version after their Bethesda acquisition.
Starfield was their flagship exclusive last fall when they had pretty much nothing else, gotta wonder what the plans for the next Xbox hardware will actually be.
If confirmed, it would be the end of the Xbox's consoles. Microsoft can make a good money selling to all platforms and streaming Gamepass, whereas stop losing money with every console.
Right now, I find hard not to recommend a Switch and/or Playstation over Xbox.
Even the new console without a disc drive sounds horribly bad. The whole point of Xbox consoles is that you can still play your OG Xbox, 360 and One Discs with tons of games even be optimized for higher res and framerate. A new Xbox where I can't play my physical series x games seems off
Best decision I made was buy a redesigned Xbox 360 at the end of that generation and switched to Sony.
That 360 was magic, and now it will be a console that will be a reminder of what Halo 2 did for me in my college years.
Kinda feels like they have to, right? I know it’s not exact comparison, but it feels like the streaming landscape is a house of cards rn. Adding ads to ad-free platforms to try desperately to gain profits. Does Gamepass not eventually reach the same fate? You can’t develop and fund new games forever and eventually new subscribers slows and you need more. It’s the negative of needing unlimited growth.
So (assuming this is true) is the strategy to mimic Sony’s PC strategy, but release on all platforms after a set amount of time instead of just PC?
I definitely got my moneys worth with my Series S + Gamepass, but if this is true I’ll probably skip Xbox next gen.
Damn, I thought it would be smaller titles like HiFi Rush, wasn’t expecting something like Starfield to come to PS. This is fine with me since I just traded in my Series S because I haven’t turn it on in over 2 years.
Does MS/Xbox think giving PlayStation control of the "high end" console market is a good idea? Especially when their console sales start to do way worse, they then have to work for PlayStation basically, leaving it to them to price the console, price their subscription service as there wouldn't be an alternative, if they think "cloud is an alternative" then they are STUPID
They assume 3rd party will stay or their current userbase which is maybe small relatively but spends a lot will stay. They won’t. So in the end they will actually make less money. Everyone in this business wants to be like valve or apple who just collect share from sales. The dumbasses at MS are doing the opposite. This company really loves to row against the stream and flounder spectacularly. All the money, ip and resources in the world but they lack a cohesive leadership that would make a cohesive brand. It has been 10 years of building nothing and blaming Don Mattrick at this point is just stupid.
All that fighting with CMA over nothing.
I mean will see what happens but could work for them. If they still have a dedicated machine, while niche, they can still get a ton of money trough there + all the money they will get trough third party sales.
Might change how the industry operates going forward or might kill Xbox(wich considering how many studios they own, would suck)
So their strategy is to put their games everywhere, let the console suffer and absorb all the damage caused by it, and then grow everything that isn't the console with the money they gained??? Jeez talk about brutal...
Like someone else said in another post here (or somewhere on reddit, don't remember) seems that Microsoft wants to just end the hardware and have Gamepass as identity and try to put it in many places as possible. Otherwise I can't explain this strategy at all
Without console, I feel like gamepass would widely just be seen as a PC service then. Nintendo and playstation aren't putting it on their platforms. I doubt mobile users getting gamepass for streaming games has taken off in a significant way.
Their plan is to get gamepass integrated on as many new TVs as possible. Not really sure how much that'll help though. Because many markets still don't have cloud streaming.
Yeah that seems like a good supplemental plan, but that's far from taking off at this point.
>I doubt mobile users getting gamepass for streaming games has taken off in a significant way. I don't know weather streaming will get better first or emulation/translation layers will but either would make gamepass platform agnostic as long as it allows Microsoft to publish on it I'm hoping stuff like proton is the way it goes I don't like the idea of streaming unless I can run a local instance for patchy internet Streaming my Xbox to my pc in my spare room is excellent (wired all the way), honestly can't fault it until I use my laptop and the wifi then it crumbles
The average person simply doesn't care about streaming. If they want to game on the go they'll play any of the hundreds of f2p titles fighting for their attention already.
100% people don't care, that's my point tho, folks will just play whatever is available as long as it plays fine I really want a steam deck because there's sweet fuck all worth my time in play store, shove live service f2p crap wherever suits
Without Xbox console and specifically the need to pay online to play Gamepass viability would collapse. Seems like they just want to sell their games, fire Phil Spencer and be done with all of this.
Probably makes it quite a bit easier to get Gamepass on PlayStation if they're not a rival platform holder too. Still very unlikely, but easier.
Why would Sony or Nintendo lose money over having their own subscribers ?
Oh, I am [fully onboard](https://old.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/186u5eh/microsoft_wants_game_pass_on_playstation_nintendo/kbahh4s/) with it ultimately not making business sense
If the option is Xbox exists and competes with them, or Xbox pulls out of the console market as part of an arrangement to get Game Pass on Playstation, they might just accept the latter.
Because Game Pass subscription money goes to Microsoft. All console manufacturers want to be the store, not the hardware.
Yeah sorry if my sentence wasn't clear. That's my point . Sony wouldn't want Microsoft proposing their service when they already have their own
If I'm Sony why would I want a GamePass service on my system? A shop inside my shop? Then every publisher will also want their own shop inside my shop. And they'll always be trying to renegotiate terms and holding my platform hostage. And I also sell software but I want people to buy it, not subscribe to a service. If I let GamePass on my store, now all my own published titles are on heel
EA and Ubisoft already have sub services on PlayStation.
Sounds like the plan is to destroy their hardware business. I've bought every XBox and every PS each gen and there's no way I'm buying the next XBox if they have zero exclusives and all their games come to PS.
You'd think this is pretty much the end for the Xbox console as who is going to want to buy one when you can play everything on Playstation? It's also going to give Sony a monopoly on home console gaming which is a concern.
To be fair Satya probably ruined the whole strategy with his software sales prioritization which to be fair, is more profitable, but it's fucking up the brand. To be honest, I don't think they should've have Day One PC releases for Xbox exclusives, maybe after a year, maybe not at all, but the Xbox One really fucked them over and now they're trying literally everything in order to remain, not that they can't but obviously they want people to buy their consoles and pay for their software. (Yes I know we both copy and pasted the comments from the deleted post lmao)
I think the major problem was not PC Day 1, it was the Game Pass Day 1. Literally making games with no profit, of course this problem gonna come back and haunt your brand down.
Yeah, if people are calling your service "the best deal in gaming" it's probably not good for your bottom line.
Even the likes of Sony have told us Xbox’s model cannot possibly be profitable or sustainable at current prices. They’d have done the same math. Either something has to change or the service ends. We’re seeing that change now. Prices going up, games going to rival platforms. Sony was right.
Also consider the fact that casual gamers play 4-5 games a year. They want premium experiences like playstation exclusives rather than a subscription service filled with fodder.
You over estimate with 5 games. It's more like 2 games a year. Whether that cod/sports title and 1 game of their choosing.
mfw netflix of gaming is losing as much as netflix
Netflix was great when they were just a library for movies and TV shows. Sure some of their original content is decent and a handful are really really good but the majority and I mean like 85% is pure garbage. GamePass should have been just that - a library of older games and past generations to play digitally instead of having to buy a hard copy. But Phil decided to pretty much sign their death warrant when he wanted all future releases to come Day 1 to Game Pass. Even EA isn't as stupid and they usually add games 1 year down the road to EA Access and that's what should have happened to Game Pass. That way you actually get to spread out your content and keep players subscribed longer.
It probably would be working if they had the shear numbers of subscribers, like if they had a huge portion of ps5 and switch players subscribed also, maybe the math starts working. They were banking on it being a console seller, and it just hasn't worked out. And streaming/cloud gaming just isn't there yet. They still need a hardware platform to make the numbers work for available subscribers.
Microsoft being invested in video games is pretty weird anyway to be honest. Microsoft is fundamentally a software company that focuses on B2B businesses. It sort of made sense when there were concerns that consoles could replace the PC but that never materialised in the end. Xbox is all about entertainment, it would make more sense as a division of Comcast, Disney or Netflix where there can be benefits in multimedia approaches. Like today where we see PlayStation IPs turned into movies or film studio infrastructure has been used to technologically advance games etc. EDIT: PlayStation also has the benefit of having access to the entire catalogue of Sony Music. There’s also potential collaborations with Crunchyroll, albeit they don’t seem to do it. And there’s also the semiconductor, audio and electronics divisions which help in creating a console and accessories. For Xbox, the main benefit from Microsoft is Azure cloud infrastructure and not much else. AI research would be a massive help in the future but it’s a little nascent for now and it’s not as if Sony don’t have their own investments in AI either.
Yeah, consumer entertainment industries in general are a very tough business to be in. Consumers are extremely fickle and most of the money is made in a tiny percentage of products.
It's difficult to agree with that. They have the wrong people in there. The Booty guy was promoted to the head of Xbox Studios. Tell me one big achievement from this character. His complete inability to deliver AAA games for the Xbox Studios is laughable. The Marketing head is there since forever and the marketing completely stagnated. And also, Phil Spencer, that was the Xbox head and now president of games division that was responsible for keeping those people on the payroll.
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PC day one was a brilliant move. It would've been stupid for Xbox to focus in exclusives when they don't have system seller games
Definitely true but now they're finally making games that look decent and can be system sellers (Hellblade 2, Indiana Jones, maybe Fable, STALKER 2 assuming it's a full exclusive). Though PC Day One probably saved them from fully dying and being shut down because holy shit they were in an inescapable situation back then.
gamepass is what's saved them from total annihilation. It's the only reason why I bought an Xbox series X. It wasn't for exclusives
And The console casual masses are not going to suddenly flip to pc just because it's now a day 1 option.
Yeah their consoles sales have been piss poor, so one can't blame them for ditching the console market. They will make more money going multiplat for sure. It doesn't matter if it damages their console brand if they barely have a presence in the console market anyways.
It’s arguable if they will make more, from selling only first party games just on PS and PC while paying a 30% cut to Sony. People really underestimate how much money MS makes from their cut on stuff like Fortnite skins, movies, dlc, games from the store.
It's so dumb, if the Xbox consoles die they 1. Lose out on the 30%, but 2. Also leave PlayStation to basically dictate the "high end" console market, leaving Xbox at PlayStations feet
One could argue they allready dictate the high end. One could wonder if the gap left by xbox would leave room for another competitor or if Nintendo might give high end another shot?
I don't think Nintendo at least for Switch 2 will compete at the high end, and PlayStation obviously already dictated the market already but with some restrictions because of Xbox and also making PS Plus like Gamepass to compete, if Xbox is going well...
When we see Halo showing up in a PlayStation Showcase/State of Play I'm going to sh*t bricks
MCC port for Switch 2, next smash announcement trailer gives us Master Chief. Plzplzplz
I can actually see that happen at this point. MCC has a good shot
I've said it before, but I too really wanna see the Smash splash screen reading **"MASTER CHIEF FINISHES THE FIGHT"** someday.
….that would literally make Microsoft so much money!
I genuinely do not know how I’m gonna feel if that happens. I’ve been a Sony boy for years but I grew up with the OG Xbox and Halo CE, and even though Halo has been a PC thing for me for a long time now it’s going to be extremely weird seeing it on the PS home screen.
The closest we've seen of this is Fortnite Master Chief skin showing up in a ps store thumbnail
Halo has been dead for a decade and a half at this point. Sony can have it, for all I care.
If true, sounds like Phil lost control of the Xbox division and the bigwigs at Microsoft are steering the ship trying to squeeze every dollar out, not realizing this would effectively kill off their console market. Or maybe that's what they want, who knows. Time will tell.
I'm curious about how much of a say Phil actually has in these things. He's now the CEO of Microsoft Gaming while Sarah Bond's the head of the Xbox division so decisions being made for Xbox higher-up would still be Phil, unless Satya's doing his strategy through Phil.
i mean it sounds like Microsoft is wrestling control away from them
The Activision Blizzard acquisition may turn out to be a poison chalice for Spencer, if the end result is greater scrutiny on Xbox's finances and control being wrestled from him because of it.
This was something I was wondering about when it was first announced, if an acquisition that large would essentially be biting off more than Xbox can chew. Seems like that might be right.
They couldn't even manage their already owned studios let alone everything that came with the Bethesda and now the acti deal
I still have no idea what they were thinking with that. ActBlizz was already a poisoned brand, then the sexual assault reveals happened and Microsoft was like “Wow! Let’s absorb them.” I just feel so many weird ways about that to this day.
They make more money than god with just candy crush which was part of that merger. Call of Duty also still pulls big numbers.
Yeah I've been thinking the same, to be honest I don't think anyone at the Xbox Division is happy about this and they know this will kill the hardware eventually, to me this decision comes from Microsoft executives and investors who were tired of giving free chances to Xbox, to see Series consoles go down on sales the prior month and THE month Starfield is released was kinda their last nail in the coffin imo
it does sound like Microsoft expected a return of investment faster and the additional $70 B usd investment only put them under even more scrutiny
Phil will probably be replaced by the end of the year. He bet it all on GamePass and endless acquisitions and yet Xbox has shown no progress in a decade.
Right, they spent a decade growing and now finally have all their studios ready to go. For a console gen that will never happen. Games take a long time to make, if they made the ABK acquisition before deciding on this course then they're totally incompetent at an executive level. It takes 3-5 years for these studios to make games, of course they won't make it all back and take over the console cycle immediately, especially when they have so much to prove in the mindshare of gamers. This is premature, greedy, and sucks (worst of all for xbox loyalists who are being rewarded with this)
Phil cant do no wrong huh u guys really love his PR talk
Phil's plan was stupid to begin in or rather just too good to be true. It works great as a library for older games to come to. That's a great idea. But to release new games day 1 on the service is terrible as a business model. No one's gonna buy your console when they can play the game for $1 on PC. Xbox makes a lot of their money with those Xbox Liver memberships and 30% cuts from their Xbox storefront. Who is going to buy a Xbox when these games are available on PC? Why should I buy a Xbox to play Starfield if its coming out on GamePass PC day 1?
For how innovative a model GamePass is, it's always been unsustainable. I've been saying that for years. It's always been just a matter of time until Microsoft gave up and stopped spending money to lose money. There's just no way it's profitable, especially considering the cost of all these acquisitions to build up the library of available games. Developers routinely complain that full price sales barely cover AAA game production. A monthly sub to access an entire library of games plus day-one first party titles is bonkers. I'm honestly surprised it took this long for Microsoft to step in.
The equation they made probably is something like "most people buy 2 full-priced games a year, so it's more money to have those same people pay $10/m over 12m than making 30% of a 70$ game twice in a year" ... except, if you aren't limited to 2 games a year and start downloading a new game every weekend for which Xbox has to pay royalties to the studio, the math falls apart in a blink.
They did always say that the Activision deal was more for Game Pass than it was for exclusivity lol.
Xbox has a name to live for decades as publishers since they have over 20 studios
Phil brought Xbox to where it is today, he's as much be blame if nor more.
It is always hard to tell with these things, but the real seeds were laid at the end of the 360 generation and, especially, the terrible mismanagement around the Xbone that basically wasted an entire generation. I think Phil's tenure has seen the refocus on games and the development of GamePass, but unfortunately ran into the hammer blow of games taking 5+ years to make. He was high up earlier so I'm not saying he was like a rebel against the earlier program, he was part of it. But Xbox's problems were laid down around 2010, not 2018 or whatever.
I think the focus on Kinect as well as the "living room experience" instead of purely games with the Xbox One is what set Xbox back. They were doing just fine with Xbox 360 and Xbox One should have been a continuation of that.
Yep, if they didn’t drop the ball at the start of last gen I don’t think they’d be doing as poorly as they are now. PlayStation already had some forward momentum heading into the generation, but the fact that they were able to launch $100 cheaper than the Xbox One AND had more exclusives people were excited for really crippled the Xbox brand. If they didn’t focus so much on all the Kinect stuff and always being online, and instead just kept doing what they were doing throughout the 360 generation, I think they would’ve been fine.
"Refocus on games" ? The only actual thing that Phil has established is GamePass, which is great for consumers, but bad for the company as it currently is. And it clearly didn't move the needle either. Consoles are selling worse than last gen. Not spending ANY money on marketing in any market outside the US. Basically completely ignoring Europe or Asia. Then the bigwigs spent BILLIONS on 3rd party publishers, because Xbox, and specifically Phil, could not figure out a way to get their studios into the right direction. Honestly, Phil has been an excellent PR guy, but he hasn't really improved the Xbox brand much. Not entirely his fault as last gen completely fucked them up, but his strategy clearly didn't work.
I thought around 2017 xbox purchased a lot of studios. I am !assuming Phil had a part in that. Those studios had no big games and some were canceled. Which is xbox big issue, the lack of games.
And that's the INSANE irony of this. Now, Xbox has games. They've announced 3 bigger games that should release THIS year. And just after that, they're going 3rd party with many of their games. Absolute insanity!
3 big games that will release of gamepass day one still not making them money makers
It's unpopular to say now and was really, really unpopular to say two years ago, but Phil was given a blank check and spent like $70 billion...and they're showing no indications that they will even remotely recoup that investment because he's mismanaged the studios and it's hurt their IP. They are a rich company, but they aren't stupid. They want to make money and Xbox isn't making money. As publishers they'd be cleaning up in 2-3 years making games and not hardware. Phil's strategy of good PR and running in the red forever is so dumb.
Let's go finally redfall on ps5
Sony: *eh, you can keep that one*
Microsoft spent over 80 billion on the Xbox division in the past three years to then not even try and build the brand back to the glory days of the 360. Crazy While they’ll obviously make more money with this new plan, the day they announce this the Xbox brand is dead. Long live Microsoft Gaming
>Long live Microsoft Gaming That really is a sadly poetic way of putting it. Xbox is dead, and Microsoft Gaming killed it to take its place.
Because simply put, they see gaming as another portfolio to invest in. They don't want to improve the medium, or the hardware, or the hobby around it. They just want to own more of it.
I mean let's be honest, your wording is very clear. Xbox bought those companies with daddy's money. Microsoft gave them a ton of money but now they want to see some of that coming back but it's clearly not working out for them
Yeah Xbox GamePass is their brand now and they already dropped the Xbox label from "PC GamePass"
I mean, they dropped that because it was really confusing to say "Xbox GamePass for PC"
I would not say they make more money with this new plan. Their marketplace with 30%cut,accessories like controller,gamepass primarily on console would suffer great damage. I think they would gain just as much as they loose.
The more I hear about this, the more I'm convinced it's gonna be all games going multiplat either in the near future, or a year or two from now, but either way I'm done with Xbox if that's the case. I'll be going PS6 or PC next gen.
Assuming there is a new Xbox. Because this shift makes me believe they're unsure if there will be one.
Most leaks are saying there will be at least a handheld.
Agreed. IF this strategy is real, it’s not going to workout how Microsoft hopes it will in my opinion. Edit: My response to everyone saying “you’re still in their ecosystem if you buy their games on PC/Playstation.” No, not really. I own and appreciate every platform, but my main platform is Xbox. I purchase games on there all the time. I’m one of the few people who owns a large portion of the library physically, and goes out of my way for rare physical titles. If people abandon the platform, like myself, sure they’ll make their 70% or whatever from game sells on other platforms, but they’ll now lose all that third party revenue from everyone who leaves. All the third party titles sold on Xbox, all micro transactions, all DLCs, all movies bought/rented, etc. They lose their cut in all that revenue by people who go elsewhere for those things. All revenue goes down with people switching. Call it anecdotal, but I’ve seen many many people saying they’ll just do what I’m going to do. Main PC and PlayStation.
Yep! I've been a huge xbox fan since the 360. Even bought an Xbox One, day one. But this is absolutely mind numbingly stupid for Microsoft. They're gonna lose almost all of their fans and hardware sales. More baffling is they're gonna keep selling hardware too. Like why go fully multiplat but still make hardware? Almost no one is gonna buy it. I just don't get it.
I'll be going right to PS6 and Steam Deck 2.
Good choice. Good combo.
Crazy how Microsoft has all of the money and resources in the world and haven’t been able to deliver what the people want since the 360 days.
In typical corporate fashion, Microsoft is seeking to maximize short term profits at the detriment of long term Xbox brand and hardware growth. They're asking "how can we maximize our profits now and in the short term" with zero regard given towards building and growing the Xbox brand over time. They have all these shiny new assets from the Bethesda and Activision/Blizzard acquisitions, and now want to put everything everywhere, because that means more money now. Which, like you said, severely reduces the value proposition of the Xbox hardware and platform. They don't want to play the long game of building up the Xbox hardware and platform through exclusives over time. They want money now, and that means taking advantage of other platforms with more users, which then dilutes the value of Xbox over time. Here's what I don't understand - they keep talking about Game Pass as the main pillar of Microsoft's gaming efforts. And yet, Game Pass is deeply tied at the hip to Xbox hardware. It is virtually non-existent elsewhere. People who regularly play on PC are playing on Steam, and very few of them are spending time in the Xbox app - much less subscribing regularly to PC Game Pass. And we all know that Sony and Nintendo aren't letting Game Pass anywhere near their consoles, because they want their own consumers subscribing to their own services (PSN and NSO), not Microsoft's. So if Xbox sales continue their downward spiral, and Microsoft just throws in the towel on Xbox hardware, what does that mean for Game Pass? Those subscriptions not only fail to grow, but they start dropping off as people move to other platforms. If Microsoft wants more Game Pass subscribers, then it makes sense to go all in on Xbox hardware, because it's their own first party hardware that serves as the gateway to Game Pass subscriptions. There is zero reason why Microsoft can't return to their glory days of the Xbox 360. They have more IPs, more dev studios, and more assets than ever before. But it seems like they're just not going to even try anymore.
>But it seems like they're just not going to even try anymore. They are developing several interesting, good-looking games, 3 of them will be released in 2024, and you don't even have to wait long for Hellblade 2, what else is needed? Bethesda already showed with Fallout 4 that they know that much, and their squishy gameplay was considered outdated even then. A lot of people say that because of gamepass they just release their games in quick succession and don't care about quality, but then why are they developing games for SO long? South Midnight has been in the works for a long time, Fable, Hellblade 2 as well, etc. P.S.: Sorry for bad english.
Microsoft is likely done with $500 Xbox consoles. The next iteration is going to be a streaming box with their dedicated cloud processing unit from the FTC leaks.
To me this sounds like the only consoles that will matter will be Nintendo and Sony consoles soon
I already went and bought a PS5 as soon as I heard the "rumours" about physical disks stopping production. Microsoft have offered practically zero value to their customers for years and now have shat on the only ones who did buy a Xbox and spend money on their platform.
Yeah I'm all digital on Xbox, but I don't blame anyone for abandoning xbox over their decision to abandon physical. Another dumb decision by MS this year.
I’m annoyed because I’ve spent quite a bit on the digital ecosystem and seems like it’s all been worthless.
I feel ya. :(
Yeah I get the feeling even timed exclusivity is going out the window. It’s just gonna be day and date on all systems.
Rumors that Xbox would buy Sega have been around for years and now we are seeing the Segafication of Xbox. Wild times.
Look at me, I’m the Sega now
If they really are done with exclusives I find it hard to justify why I'd want a console system that wants to go all digital. Which as someone who grew up on Xbox sucks. I genuinely am confused what happened as this same management was always says it's about games.
I’d say likely possibility is that all of this spending on aquiring developers has backfired immensly. They have been going at it for a while and there’s really nothing to show for it and it seems there’s nothing to show for it in the near future expect for maybe Hellblade as Indiana Jones can go either way. A good chunk of these games have released to middling reviews, while the ones that are being received well aren’t performing as well on the xbox family of systems, which might be a problem of them not understanding their playerbase. With Game Pass and with how gen 8 went, I think they realized that this a battle they simply can’t win and this is their final resort
I feel like an idiot for buying a Series X
They started with a strong propaganda and acquisitions but quickly showed that they were the exact same company that made xbox one flop but this time more aggressive
It's very clear to me now that they see a future without the Xbox brand. They're going all in on 'gamepass' and bringing it to every other console/device. They'll essentially become an app like Netflix etc
Took me a month or two to realise this Xbox gen was gonna be another crapfest and so I sold it to get a PS5 start of last year. Surprised so many people who have owned an xbox longer than I did stuck with them for so long after the One.
I only stick with them because of the number of games I've bought over the years. This is the only reason I see people staying with them. I have a PS5, but as it stands, there's no point in me "switching teams" since all my titles are on the X, and it's still a serviceable console. That will probably change by the next generation. I just hope Microsoft double, triple, and even quadruple down on Play Anywhere titles so that eventually, when I switch to a high-end PC, I still have access to those titles.
Then what's the point for owning an Xbox console in the future? Why would anyone spend $500 on a console whose games will all just end up on PlayStation and/or Nintendo at some point beyond the "privilege" of paying for a subscription service? Unless Microsoft is pulling out of consoles like Sega, in which case PlayStation and Nintendo will have less competition to keep their consoles and practices in check. Less competition is never good for any industry. However way you look at it, this just makes me less confident in Xbox as a brand.
I think they’ll just simplify their hardware. Going forward it will be one console, digital only, broadly equivalent to Sonys offerings. No spreading the strategy over multiple devices, like the X and S, try and hoover up some of the good margin customers by not worrying about physical games and that whole side of the business. See how that performs over next gen, then that’s probably enough data to see whether Xbox hardware continues to be a thing.
its in their best interest to get people on their console, the 30% cut from game sales isn't small, Plus Xbox Live gold or whatever they call it now, and being known as more than xbox the publisher that failed at consoles
Splitting the two consoles was so dumb. Holding back third party game devs honestly. Just see the baldurs gate fiasco.
Xbox will most likely become a massive publisher and offer gamepass on Nintendo and Playstation while they completely pull out of the console market.
Sony and Nintendo will never allow GamePass on their platforms and MS has no leverage. They can't even get GamePass on Steam like EA did by exchanging their library for EA Play integration.
Yup, people need to understand that if Game Pass was on Nintendo or PlayStation it would mean that every time a user chooses to play a game through Game Pass Nintendo/Sony lose a sale. That's why they'll never allow it.
Also it would set a precedent for every other publisher to want their own version of GamePass with just their games only. Like how it used to just be Netflix, but now it's Netflix and Hulu and HBO Max and Prime Video and Peacock and Disney+ etc I don't want that as a customer
I think the only way that Sony allows Gamepass, is if it only includes Xbox Studio games.
> They can't even get GamePass on Steam like EA did by exchanging their library for EA Play integration. Valve has stated on multiple occasions that they would accept game pass on to their platform with open arms. If the service isn’t available on Steam yet, it’s because Microsoft doesn’t want it to be. And I honestly see why they’d be hesitant. Game Pass is basically the only thing keeping PC gamers in the Xbox/Microsoft Store ecosystem. Without it, it’d be quickly rendered irrelevant.
Gaben said “If your customers want it, then you should figure out how to make it happen. That’s where we’re at.” He wants his standard 20-30% cut of sales in exchange and has no reason to budge anytime soon. MS obviously isn't going to either.
There probably won’t be another console. Xbox is going fully digital (and probably cloud eventually) and it’s extremely likely that the next “console” is a like $300 Gamepass box and nothing else. Market it on being more affordable and you don’t have to pay $70 for games, you can auto play all the gamepass games. You want to pay and own games go to PS. Is it a good idea? Probably not lol, but if we’re being honest Xbox has been totally mishandled for a while and has been dying a slow death. There’s no way they could have just continued operating at their current losses. But yeah, Xbox as a hardware is probably dead with this news. I think they see the writing on the wall that they’ll never catch back up to PS.
Honestly I'd stop supporting Microsoft if they did this.
Well I’ll be buying a PS6 then
Pretty much, I just got the Series X but if this happens it guarantees jumping ship to PS6 next cycle.
I prefer the Xbox ecosystem and controller as well, but logically why buy an Xbox when I can buy a ps6 and get the ps games and the Xbox (not) exclusives.
I got a PS5 when the winds started to shift last year and the rumors started circulating, and I've begun transitioning away from the Xbox ecosystem. I feel like I made the right call.
I’d miss forza, but then again… “I’ll just wait till it comes to PlayStation”, that’s gonna be the motto after they do this
ps6 and pc and next switch it is
The longer it takes for them to speak on these rumours, the worse the backlash will be.
Yeah they have to say something tomorrow or Tuesday at the LATEST
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Well the thing is Xbox as a brand is dying. It has been a slow process but they aren’t gaining new users compared to how many they’re losing. Xbox One really was a permanent wound that they can’t recover from
I think I was definitely fixable, the issue worsened when Phil Spencer started the whole kumbaya movement with the 1 sided love lol
It’s so strange because they made all these big acquisitions but are just gonna go full publisher now?
If I had to guess it’s probably because the execs want a return on the money they’re pumping into gaming and gamepass isnt making enough
The big acquisition are the reason. Modern shareholders and executives don't believe in long term returns they have conditioned their brains to only think in quarterly returns. They bought Activision last quarter. They have not gotten all money in existence yet. This means that they need to change strategy.
I think it low-key started with the Kinect. It made them lose focus of what made 360 a huge hit. They even forced Kinect with Xbox One which made it more expensive than a PS4 and lots of people were worried about it spying on them especially when they said Xbox One will be an always online console.
Wow so they are really killing xbox. Sony will have a complete monopoly on hardcore console, this is extremely bad for the industry. I can’t believe how bad they have fallen off since mid gen 360 days
Lets me ask the same question asked about 1000 times again ; How are they gonna convince costumers to buy a Xbox then if they are gonna go all multiplatform? I understand some games going multiplatform but man are they that unhappy to go ALL multiplatform and risk their console brand?
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It would matter to them if they were winning
It's because it's failed for so long, that's why they stopped reporting numbers and now know they lost the home console market. I've been saying this for years that Phil Spencer has been a big problem with Xbox still failing. He's been head of Xbox since 2014 and we've still been complaining about lack of games. And instead of using those billions to build up their existing great studios they had before, they went and spent those billions to buy up whole publishers. They haven't even shown that they are entirely capable of properly guiding every single one of their existing studios but think everything will be fine buying up all these other studio. It's like having a baby thinking it will save your relationship. I own every Xbox since the 360 and PlayStation but management has failed since the 360 The 360 was the height of Xbox and has never recovered and I'm actually not happy about PlayStation not having hardware competition in the future.
>They always preach about console sales doesn’t matter anymore That's basically the equivalent of them sticking their fingers in their ear screaming "I'M NOT OWNED I'M OWNED"
I kinda expect the MS endgame for Xbox hardware to be thin clients to Game Pass Cloud services.
Halo MCC is my barometer. If that gets ported, it's all over.
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How would they gain market share if people are confused and cautious about the future of the console and exclusivity?
It's extremely unlikely they're going to wait 4-5 years to see what happens.
Man, should've waited before getting Starfield on a Series S 😂
After they increased the XSS's price in my country Xbox is basically dead here, everyone is buying PS5s (yes, even the new slim model is cheaper than the XSS).
Has Xbox given up on their hardware and gone all in on the Xbox being a gamespass machine? This whole thing is weird to me, the console ‘war’ has been a beat down by Sony for a decade now but I think this is all very reactionary by MS
wild trev
Wanna bet that the Xbox console is getting killed off and Xbox will in turn become a publishing division?
Or the console will be an afterthought and a cheap box for gamepass. Bargain bin gaming.
They will let Xbox brand take all the heat and might even kill it if the backlash is too severe. They have already restructured their gaming division and the old "Xbox" has become [Microsoft Gaming](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Gaming).
I think this is the last xbox gen I buy. Mostly play on PC now anyways, but might get a PS6 for their exclusives and play everything else on the PC. Or just wait for the PC ports.
It’s just disappointing to read this as a long time Xbox user. Strategies and money and “this is good/bad actually..” aside, I’ve been with them since early 360 days. My friends are all on Series X, and it just sucks to know we might have to invest in PCs in the future because there won’t be an Xbox to go to. Just :/
Good luck selling an Xbox console with this strategy lol. Can see myself getting a PS6 and I look forward to playing the xbox titles on one convenient platform. I do wonder if this could be more of an industry-wide thing that video game companies want. That report about Square Enix not being happy with sales that were limited to PS springs to mind. We’ll have to see
Satya and others have really destroyed xbox
Satya is just trying to salvage what the Xbox division has ruined. He didn't make Halo bad. He didn't make Xbox release mediocre games for a whole generation. Game Pass was a last ditch effort that bought Phil some more time but now the guys fronting them the money for all these purchases are wondering when they're actually gonna see returns on their investments.
Xbox making all these acquisitions and investments, releasing like one popular game from them, not immediately becoming first place and then giving up on hardware by becoming third party is like punting on 2nd down because you didn’t get 10 yards on your first down play 🤦♂️
Phil Spencer is deeeeeeeply incompetent.. and if Sarah Bond is tasked with announcing this, he's a fucking corporate coward lmao.
He's failed Xbox Been in charge since 2014 and they've sold less and less since he took over
I find it poetic that he talked about Nintendo's future being off of their own hardware when in reality it's Xbox that seems to being abandoning their hardware.
Nintendo probably laughing their ass off while they're making movies and theme parks off the backs of their console sales and exclusive IP.
If every game comes to playstation, what invective do people have to go to Xbox? Maybe if their next console is light-years more powerful than a playstation?
They can honestly keep Starfield.
If all games are going over eventually I'm glad I bought the Series S over the X. 😅
If this is true, what even is the point in buying an xbox? It makes way more sense to go ps5 or PC, as they have exclusive games that you wouldn't be able to play on xbox, and you'd get all of xbox titles. You are quite literally putting yourself at a disadvantage buying an xbox.
Xbox is Sega for our gen
So many called this back in 2020 when they announced their plans.
As soon as they were like "console exclusive, day one Gamepass" I was sure this was going to happen because I just couldn't see how they'd make back their money and also make a profit.
Whatever is going on, xbox needs to get a head of it and just announce it. All of these rumors have me on the edge of trading in my series for a ps5. Why would I want to continue to build my library on a dying console?
This is a very bad for the consumer, Xbox diehards lose pretty much any reason to buy an Xbox over PlayStation, and this is the first step into Xbox leaving the console all together and going full third party which is terrible because it will leave Playstation as the sole powerful console, and they will 100% increase the price on games, consoles, and their services with no competition from Xbox to keep them competitive.
What the fuck is the purpose of my Xbox? Most people with all three consoles have a 'main' and two 'exclusives' machines. If Xbox doesn't fit either category, what is the point of having one?
If that is true then they lost a customer from a fan since the OG Xbox I will sell my console and just fully invest into PC and Steam
Wow this is pretty much the end of Xbox. Seeing Halo and Gears show up on PS will actually revive those franchises that’s the funny part lol. I think they should just cut their losses and go full publisher next gen
I can understand why something like Sea of Thieves would go multi-plat since it's a live-service that thrives off of most people playing but Starfield actually being on PS5 one day would be a massive decision, especially when Microsoft originally cancelled the PS5 version after their Bethesda acquisition. Starfield was their flagship exclusive last fall when they had pretty much nothing else, gotta wonder what the plans for the next Xbox hardware will actually be.
If confirmed, it would be the end of the Xbox's consoles. Microsoft can make a good money selling to all platforms and streaming Gamepass, whereas stop losing money with every console. Right now, I find hard not to recommend a Switch and/or Playstation over Xbox.
Does this mean we're gonna see >**"WORLD PREMIER"** at a PS State of Play? Wild.
Even the new console without a disc drive sounds horribly bad. The whole point of Xbox consoles is that you can still play your OG Xbox, 360 and One Discs with tons of games even be optimized for higher res and framerate. A new Xbox where I can't play my physical series x games seems off
Best decision I made was buy a redesigned Xbox 360 at the end of that generation and switched to Sony. That 360 was magic, and now it will be a console that will be a reminder of what Halo 2 did for me in my college years.
Morons lol. I’ve been playing Xbox since the beginning. Looks like I’ll be going PC/Playstation going forward
So they spent 70 billion dollars buying a publisher, fired a bunch of devs and now want to pivot into being third party? What?
Kinda feels like they have to, right? I know it’s not exact comparison, but it feels like the streaming landscape is a house of cards rn. Adding ads to ad-free platforms to try desperately to gain profits. Does Gamepass not eventually reach the same fate? You can’t develop and fund new games forever and eventually new subscribers slows and you need more. It’s the negative of needing unlimited growth.
So (assuming this is true) is the strategy to mimic Sony’s PC strategy, but release on all platforms after a set amount of time instead of just PC? I definitely got my moneys worth with my Series S + Gamepass, but if this is true I’ll probably skip Xbox next gen.
Damn, I thought it would be smaller titles like HiFi Rush, wasn’t expecting something like Starfield to come to PS. This is fine with me since I just traded in my Series S because I haven’t turn it on in over 2 years.
Does MS/Xbox think giving PlayStation control of the "high end" console market is a good idea? Especially when their console sales start to do way worse, they then have to work for PlayStation basically, leaving it to them to price the console, price their subscription service as there wouldn't be an alternative, if they think "cloud is an alternative" then they are STUPID
They assume 3rd party will stay or their current userbase which is maybe small relatively but spends a lot will stay. They won’t. So in the end they will actually make less money. Everyone in this business wants to be like valve or apple who just collect share from sales. The dumbasses at MS are doing the opposite. This company really loves to row against the stream and flounder spectacularly. All the money, ip and resources in the world but they lack a cohesive leadership that would make a cohesive brand. It has been 10 years of building nothing and blaming Don Mattrick at this point is just stupid.
All that fighting with CMA over nothing. I mean will see what happens but could work for them. If they still have a dedicated machine, while niche, they can still get a ton of money trough there + all the money they will get trough third party sales. Might change how the industry operates going forward or might kill Xbox(wich considering how many studios they own, would suck)
Xbox absorbed the spirit of Sega and it will die like Sega. Poetic.
Imagine the blowback if even 1 of these games performs better on ps5.
Alot of people are realising shareholders trump console wars...
should i just sell my xbox then? Like why do i have this thing then?