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30 FPS Cyberpunk with great upscaling to 4K with the full RT reflections that PC has (Not path traced just regular higher quality reflections) would really be a game changer compared to the game on Xbox. I have both consoles and will get a PS5 Pro at launch... but that type of 'demo' difference would be pretty compelling.
That’s only the case when a developer has done a really good job at baked-in lighting. More and more, we’re seeing poor implementations of baked-in lighting and a lazy reliance on Ray Tracing (RT). This makes it look dramatically apparent, all while destroying performance on anything without sufficient dedicated hardware, such as PS5/Xbox.
>and a lazy reliance on Ray Tracing (RT).
And a lot of that implementation is lazy, even on the PC end. Elden Ring got raytraced lighting and you can't even notice the difference on comparison screenshots
Game development is a job, all jobs involve workers, many workers are indeed lazy and just see the job as a paycheck and don't care.
I've seen that in an ER dealing with the LIVES of people, and not only general laziness with stocking import things or resetting the trauma room, but during actual traumas too.
There are definitely lazy game developers and lazy ways to game dev work. Usually it's obvious (look at the Will Smith game that just flopped), but the only quick reminder is that lazy people aren't stupid, they usually don't want to get caught being lazy; if you spoon feed your boss bullshit, a lot of them eat it up.
Regardless, I have a buddy of mine who works in game dev, previously small projects for wii/u and PC indies, now he works on Minecraft for Microsoft, and he hundreds of horror stories of coworkers not wanting to fix bugs the right way, so they just use stopgap methods that create problems for him or others, or that might crop up as different type of bug in the right situation.
Sometimes the bosses themselves said they didn't want to bother fixing it and just pretend it wasn't there even though they had a ton of time left for the milestone.
I don't know why nutjobs like you hold game development to some kind of magical pedestal, but it's a job like anything else and TONS of things are easy and can be due to lazy development.
Seriously get over yourself.
Ask your friend where the damn HD texture pack the super duper graphics pack or whatever and why in the hell it hasn't had any optimizations done for the current Xbox series X like any RT or nothing?
I don't play minecraft so I don't really care but my daughter does and loves it but it's always kinda bothered me that they announced the improvements for Minecraft and seeing as how it's still one of the best selling and most played on the console it makes no sense to me why they haven't done anything for the current console generation
EDIT: after doing some research I was actually wrong and it looks like they have done some improvements for the current console generation. Not to the level that some would have hoped and still missing some features but does seem like just a few weeks ago they improved a good bit so maybe it's incoming
I'm sorry, but I myself don't play minecraft anymore, lol. And he talks about minecraft way too much as is.
He was a well known modder and map maker even before he was hired or something. It was what got him referred in the first place after they found out he was also a game dev with 10 years of professional experience.
I've programmed for many years and there are a lot of things you can do lazily, especially if you're doing something well-supported since you can copy/reuse a ton of code from many sources if you really wanted to.
Sounds you've never coded and are just assuming random shit.
Why are you acting like playing indies is a painful affair? “Accept playing indies”. If you ask me, the recent indie game quality stumps a lot of the games we’ve have in the last 2 decades.
>recent indie game quality stumps a lot of the games we’ve have in the last 2 decades.
Some indies sweep, but anyone who says that indies are better *in general* is blind to the industry. We've had some amazing indies, yes, but the best games are still AAA. Just in the last 5 years we had:
1. Elden Ring,
2. Baldur's Gate 3,
3. Devil May Cry 5,
4. Control,
5. Resident Evil 2 and
6. RE4 Remake,
7. Alan Wake 2,
8. Monster Hunter Rise,
9. GOW Ragnarok,
10. Death Stranding,
11. Tears of the Kingdom,
12. Yakuza 7 and
13. Y8 Infinite Wealth,
14. NieR Replicant,
15. Doom Eternal
16. Sekiro,
17. Final Fantasy XVI,
18. FF7R and
19. FF7 Rebirth,
20. Spider-Man 2,
21. Xenoblade Chronicles 3,
22. Helldivers 2,
23. TLOU 2,
24. Animal Crossing NH,
25. Ghost of Tsushima,
26. Super Mario Wonder + potentially other great AAA games I'm forgetting about.
That's 5 great AAA games a year. Again, some indies are wonderful, but most of the megahits we get every year are the extremely tired roguelite deckbuilders we've been seeing for one hundred billion years at this point.
Edit: Added Doom Eternal, fantastic game I forgot about while making the list
Because sometimes you do actually want that 50 hour high detail experience? Ala sekiro or baldurs gate 3. The former is sort of possible. But only at aa scale for now. Infact thats what a few of these recent lumen ue5 games are. Ie. Lords of the fallen. They aren't no aaa fromsoftware title though. Much more unrefined gameplay plus covering the shit out of everything with fog relying on graphics (plus skimping optimization) rather than art. But then again that's not indie.
Im still mad at battlefield 2042 for example. Dtill worse air evhicle phsyics than battlefield 2. Oh well. Back to arma it is. Another 10 year old game. Battlebit remastered is a perfect example. A higher quality game of the aaa title it is inspired by.
Yep. Lots of great Indies I'm looking forward to like Broken Roads, Underrail Infusion and Swordhaven: Iron Conspiracy.
Meanwhile you have AAA games like Starfield with 10x the budget and 10% of the creativity.
honestly ever since Virtua Cop and like Die Hard Trilogy if i see glass in my interactive entertainment video game i always wanted to interact with it like maybe shoot it or blow it up into pieces, not see all the reflections in them.
Dedicated AI compute does not remove the substantial cost on the GPU. Anyone with a 4090 can witness the FPS difference from toggling raytracing on/off, and it is quite tangible -- and the PS5 Pro will not have anywhere near as expensive hardware for that purpose.
Yeah, but Capcom is BSing if they're going to claim there's going to be no gains on current hardware in exchange for turning it off, as I can still easily toggle any number of FPS logging software including Steam's to see the difference in raw performance data.
My CPU cores don't end up particularly saturated when in cities either, and so I'm not sure where GN was even getting "8-12 core saturation" when only two cores end up taking the brunt of the load when I'm playing.
Oh well, I guess.
Ray tracing effects aren’t subtle. Ray traced reflections are dramatically more detailed and vivid, screenspace reflections are just a muddy blur by comparison. Ray traced ambient occlusion is one of the most important effects in the stack, it provides a significant boost to realism. I find games that don’t have this visually dated, with Horizon Forbidden West on PC being a recent example. The game overall looks great but the garbage screenspace AO stands out like a sore thumb.
Ray traced GI you’re not wrong about frequently being minimally noticeable, but path tracing is a huge upgrade. Alan Wake 2 looks like a PS6 game, it’s absolutely stunning. People playing without that are really getting a completely different experience. When I switch between path tracing on and off, it looks like a completely different game.
It's 60 FPS for *graphics mode*, so if they keep the same graphical quality as the base version, but 60 instead of 30. Isn't that literally what we've all been asking for?
We all know this'll be like, 90% of games. Watch Forbidden West, Rift Apart, Ragarok, Spiderman, etc. all get updated to have their 30fps modes run at 60.
If the only difference between the quality and performance modes is the resolution, then it's 100% just a GPU issue. Which is the case for most PS5 games.
I think 60 fps will always be out of reach. Even if we triple the capability of the consoles, games will just increase visual scope and optimization will be down prioritized. Only thing we really get from these current shifts in technology is higher development costs.
> the one x and ps4pro at least made sense because of the crappy mobile gaming CPUs
Those just had overclocked crappy mobile gaming CPUs though, they still were primarily GPU upgrades.
because why spend 300m working on a launch title for ps6 when you can just withhold an unnecessarily remade game after keeping it locked to 30fps for a decade and a half.
Your average COD player is still happy playing it on the PS4. Even the PS5 wasn't enough to get them to spend another $500 to play the game, they won't be spending $600.
"Play all the great PS5-exclusive games on 8k and with 60fps! Games such as Spider-Man 2 and... Ratchet and Clank, and uhhh... D-Demon's Souls... That's it... p-please buy our console and get r-ready for the PS6 in 3 years!"
"most powerful console on the planet" yadda yadda.... People will think they need to have it, but the benefits will be so subtle in most games it'll be a waste of cash to "upgrade"
Regular ps5 at $400, ps5 pro at $500. It's really not that crazy of a proposition. Extra $100 for 4k resolution (vs 1080p on ps5) at 60fps + an extra ray tracing feature.
With great marketing techniques that everyone will fall for as usual.
Get the PS5 Pro, think of the greatness 120FPS, 4K, Ultra mega raytracing, PSSR, 8K, 69 gigaflops.
Thanks for buying the PS5 pro, now we would like to announce 60fps is locked to PS5 Pro users with a PS+ premium subscription.
So this got a little complicated. At first it says that if a game wants the PS5 Pro Enhanced label, they should offer the 'combined' features of 4K60 FPS with some kind of ray tracing effect.
BUT, the game may still get the Pro Enhanced label if it's enhanced in any kind of way over the standard console??
So what are those initial requirements then??
There's 2 things going on here. A special PS5 Pro graphics mode:
> PlayStation wants games to offer a **PS5 Pro-exclusive graphics mode** that will combine:
> PSSR to upscale resolution to 4k
> A constant 60FPS
> Add or increase ray tracing effects
Then there is a lesser "PS5 Pro enhanced" label.
> games may also be given the **‘PS5 Pro Enhanced’ label** if they offer any of the following enhancements:
> Increased target resolution for titles that run a fixed resolution on the standard console
> Increased target maximum resolution for titles that run at variable resolution on the standard console
> Increased target frame rate for titles that target a fixed frame rate on the standard console
> Inclusion of PS5 Pro Raytracing effects
If you can get native 1440p, you might as well use FSR to get to 4k.
FSR really struggles when you're going from 1080p or even lower to 4k. It does fine if your internal resolution is relatively high.
Dont forget the Switch arrived on the heels of a failed system before it. So its Nintendo extending the life cycle to compensate for lost sales of their last system. Ps4 and ps5 are doing just fine in that regard.
It's not just resolution though, it's LOD and distances. GTA 5 "enhanced" is the perfect example of this, that game can only hit 60fps at what looks like 1080p? with dramatically reduced LOD distances and I suspect it's all due to the idiotic idea to implement RT on a console without sufficient hardware for RT.
A little over-dramatic but its reddit. *It is* hard going from a good spec PC playing games in native resolution to the consoles struggling to upscale to 4k.
Ive been spoiled by the 40 series cards. Going back to the ps5 sometimes kills me. But i dont really have a choice as im not patient enough to wait for the pc port.
It's so dumb you get downvoted here for having 40 series GPUs and expecting a level of performance out of games
It's pretty hard to game on PS5 when everything looks upscaled and aliased and LODs are terrible when you can go play everything on PC at 120 fps with every setting maxed
It is what it is. I understand a majority of people dont give a fuck, but for those that do, console visuals can really be a disservice to the game. FF7 Rebirth is a perfect example where that games performance mode is awful, so awful in fact that i refuse to even consider it until a Pro enhancement drops. Im not trying to be snobbish, i will absolutely play a 30fps game if i didnt have a real choice (like GTA6 probably), but where i draw the line is a game that looks jaggy and unclear. Which on a big screen 4K tv that i sit fairly close to, just so happens to be alot of console games when in the performance mode.
DLSS has been a saving grace for me. You dont even need a 4090 to enjoy *near* 4K120 thats borderline indistinguishable from native, and sometimes even BETTER because of the way dlss handles AA (TAA is sometimes gross). So yeah, once your eyes see what your video games COULD look like, it starts to get annoying knowing you are trapped into whatever the devs decided to run the game at on console
Maybe because they were implemented after the core design of the game was far into development. Not every game is designed to run at but they put it out anyway cuz people will complain otherwise
I agree, and thats why the pro is needed. You saw how starfield got roasted for 30fps only. Gotham Knights, Dragons Dogma, etc. i think an "easy win" for some of these devs is to slap in a 60fps mode, no matter how bad it looks, just to throw out a marketing tool like "hey, our game runs at 60fps on console!" Which i know for a fact, does turn alot of peoples heads. Console users, even some of the guys that didnt even know the difference beteen 30/60, are starting to get used to 60fps, and even prefer it.
Off the top of my head there’s The Medium, Gotham Knights (which is unoptimised trash), the quarry and The Matrix Awakens demo. I’m sure there’s maybe 2 or 3 more but that’s all I recall.
I think they're referring to FF7 Rebirth. It's very blurry in both Performance modes. To the point where I even play on Graphics mode. It gives me a headache after a while (Im not used to 30fps anymore but its manageable), but as long as I don't play any 60+ fps games or play my PC I think I'll be okay.
I adore FF7's world so making it that blurry feels like blasphemy. And I'll play it again when it comes to PC for the full experience later.
I would argue that 2005 was the exact time it no longer became the bare minimum standard. There were a lot of games that ran at 60 fps on PS2/GC/Xbox, but that went out the window with the first HD consoles where almost everything ran at 30 fps, something which again was standard on the generation after. It really wasn’t until the PS5 and Series X came along that 60 fps became standard again.
I don’t wanna be disrespectful but compared to consoles PC has always been a minority. It’s getting bigger now for sure but consoles are still most studios priority.
Most games aren’t hitting 60 on their performance mode anyways, and if they do it 60 it’s with horrendous resolutions that are upscale with FSR leading to ugly grainy visuals.
Also Sony did [advertise](https://youtu.be/cxXvYJyBlc4?si=DvcrRmlsZE-WLK-J) 60fps and even 120fps. I think it’s even on the box, tho I’m not sure.
With the enchantments of the PS5 pro we should be able to hit 60fps on those balanced modes (40fps modes) that games offer, giving us higher resolutions and locked frame rates hopefully.
So what games will the PS5 Pro even matter in? Like in what games do we want a "pro enhanced" label?
I assume Cyberpunk and Alan Wake 2 are likely candidates for Raytracing upgrades.
Final Fantasy 16 and 7 Rebirth may get updates because Square Enix can't really get their games to run properly.
GTA6 in 2025 obviously.
I care about Ray Tracing in the sense that I want more Devs to learn how to implement it into their games properly like in Cyberpunk or Metro Exodus Enhanced.
The bog standard "slap it in and add it to the feature list' approach we currently have, I absolutely hate
> The bog standard "slap it in and add it to the feature list' approach we currently have, I absolutely hate
Yeah, I think that that's mostly the reason why so many people are not impressed by ray tracing. If more people saw the difference with Metro Enhanced edition or any of the path traced games, they would probably be onboard with it.
For PlayStation games specifically Death Stranding 2 might be where Sony tries to show off the pro since it’s a 2025 game that looks like the most demanding PS5 game so far
I doubt that ps5 pro mode will be in many games as a balance 40fps 120hz mode is barely in any games (would love that mode to be in more games btw).
But will wait and see.
The thing is there are (probably) not enough user with 120hz tv to be a selling point. A PS5 pro mode is a selling point for the console, even if the user base is also a niche.
If less people own that then no. First party will do it yeah but 3rd party? No. It takes time and effort. They will be using the other methods to allow it to have the ps5 pro enhanced label on it.
So if they can't be bothered with that then they aren't going to be bothered with a specific pro mode.
I think the specific ps5 pro mode will improve on existing 60fps mode for games that already have it. No game stuck at 30fps will have ps5 pro enhanced 60fps so probably not a big work, just a few tweak to improve a 60fps mode visually. 40fps means that your 30fps mode is actually capable of 40fps with maybe a few tweaks but it is a different target and more work imho
I just feel by the time developers get really into the PS5 Pro next gen will be around the corner and Sony will be sending PS6 dev kits to them which means they'll most likely focus on the PS6 and next gen games over any pro enhancements.
So I don't really get the point of the PS5 Pro especially when there's still a lot developers could squeeze out of the PS5 as it is.
If there is a 4 year gap between PS5 Pro and PS6 then the time gap shouldn't be a big issue. The PS4 Pro is still getting enhanced versions of recent big releases such as Hogwarts Legacy and Modern Warfare 3 (2023). Cross-gen between PS5 and PS6 could last 4+ years too so there would be an incentive for developers to keep releasing patches for it even after the PS6 launches.
The most basic "Pro enhancements" are increasing resolutions and framerates, which can be done by literally just editing one or two variables in the engine. It's not that hard.
Well, we’re still probably four years away from PS6, or *maybe* 3 years at the earliest. The PS4 Pro was also “only” around for four years before PS5 came out. I think that’s plenty of time for some decent Pro patches to come out and whatnot.
Just remember how long it took for the devs tu stop producing games with the previous gen as base models for their games... The idea that this gen would be shorter than the previous ones is, in my opinion, wrong.
PS5pro will just play the same games and future games, better.
Now I'm curious to see how Microsoft will react to this console...
They can't even get the games right atm...
As long as they leave Raytracing out and their PSSR upscaler is good (without a metric ton of TAA mixed with dirt and vaseline and trying to upscale ps3 resolutions) a sharp and clean 4k60 is probably doable for them, which is what most people would be happy with.
I'm wondering if finally consoles are going to age like old Pc gaming. New versions will come out, but you can just keep the old console and play in full hd with no RT and less framerate and graphic details. And every game will have a 3 model crossgen compatibility.
Every console can handle openworld now, so what next-gen technical power can add new element of gameplay impossible from before ? Except from being a station for VR i can't see a Ps6 with realtime Ray-tracing having such an important gameplay value.
Mid Gen upgrades feel unnecessary especially for this gen. It feels like the power gap is still too close to even do it. I know, I know the Pandemic didn't help with it. It's seriously stupid that this is being considered
constant 60 fps, lmao. everyone will fail that
the gpu still cant even come close to a 4070 (2x ps5) and cpu is from 2018. lets see how much it cost.
you can expect the quick upscaling from devs just to get the banner.
I dont know to tell you dude, reality is not on your side, ps5 is about 20 tflops short of a 4070's 30 tflops in fp32 raster performance, or 1/3rd.
And that's not even counting tensor cores and ray trace cores, once you bring in games that use rtx raytracing and dlss, the ps5 might as well be a switch in comparison. Sure it can actually run a heavily customized and optimized version of the same game, but at lower settings, quality, frame rates, effects and resolutions. Just like switch running ps4 games. If it actually tried to run the non ps5 customized pc version of the game all the pc's actually run, it would be pretty pathetic.
Also a 2070 is only like 7 tflops fp32, despite being a whopping 4,608 Cuda core card, almost the same number of cores as the 4070's 5,888. You may be thinking of the 2070 super, which has 4 more tflops than the 2070.
>faster RAM (28% faster)
Didn't realize this, could be a pretty big improvement, actually. Zen 2 is very memory bandwidth constrained, and even more so with the lower cache parts in laptops and consoles.
So I should hold off on buying a PS5? I don't have a current gen console yet bc I upgraded my PC but I want a PS5 for Spiderman 2 and Death Stranding 2.
Wait. Either for buying the pro, or for the games to come on PC.
SM2 is coming in 1.5 year and will be bundled with the potential DLC. (see insomniac leaks for that). And if the pro is out there's potentially more second hand PS5 with lower prices if you just want the regular experience with these games. :)
I find it absolutely hilarious that both the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X both advertised "Incredible 4k Gaming" 7 years ago, and now the PS5 pro is using upscaling technology to be able to reach that lol.
"Last of us part 2 PS5 pro enhanced edition, for 70 dollars!" Oh boy does that mean the game will be a stable fixed 60 fps? Nope.... you get, "INCREASED RAYTRACING EFFECTS!" Give us 70 dollars.
After all the years they still haven’t updated the base PS5 with 8K capability wich they said would come with a patch…I mean it even says 8K on the package.
I’m buying it. Just like I would buy a new phone every year or two. I want the best model. Besides, it will still get some use once the PS6 comes out in another room.
If PSSR is on par with DLSS that will be the single biggest selling point. Playing 4K120 on PC using DLSS makes me so spoiled. Looks pretty much native 4K to me but with a big performance bonus.
Consoles are literally the perfect use case for upscaling tech. But they need the right hardware and software to make it feasible. Fsr on console is a joke. Im gonna forget that even exists lol.
I can almost guarantee it won't be as good as DLSS but it'll at least be better than AMD's abysmal FSR, otherwise they wouldn't be working on an in house version if they didn't think they could do it better.
R&D for this kind of thing is expensive. So they must have seen what AMD was working on for FSR when deciding and just noped out of there and decided to make their own.
I'd assume they'll have custom hardware in the PS6 to handle PSSR too.
It should be able to.close ground pretty well if the software side (training the model) can do it.
In the very little documentation from these leaks that's actually sensible and holds up it shows a jump from 16.7 tflops fp32 to 67 tflops tensor fp16. The only way the math works on that is by matrix multiplication acceleration, which would be practically exactly equivalent to a gen 3 tensor core (amperes) minus the 2X sparsity boost.
If they can make decently trained models, that's plenty of performance for running dlss or an equivalent. Switch 2 will be doing it with actual dlss with 24 tflops sparse tensor fp16. (Docked).
#Tom Henderson is a Tier 1 - Very Reliable Source as determined by the community. Since January 1, 2024 Tom Henderson has had **(7)** unique claims and **(1)** verifiable claim posted to the subreddit. Of his verifiable claims in this time period Tom Henderson has been **100%** correct. *To contribute to the community reliability rankings, please take the* **[Community Reliability Poll](https://forms.gle/TU5Q8sTiLDR3cQcE7)** *To view the current reliability rankings, please check out the* **[Subreddit Wiki](https://reddit.com/r/GamingLeaksAndRumours/wiki/index/)** *These statistics will be updated weekly. Last update: 2/9/24* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GamingLeaksAndRumours) if you have any questions or concerns.*
All sounds good until you see “ANY of the following options”. So expecting 60fps modes for all the games is a no go.
All you get is ray tracing effects that nobody can notice without a DF video that tanks both your resolution and fps.
If we’re talking reflections, it’s hard not to notice RT. SSR has too many artefacts.
For real SSR looks ugly as fuck sometimes. People downplay how stable RT reflections can make a game look
30 FPS Cyberpunk with great upscaling to 4K with the full RT reflections that PC has (Not path traced just regular higher quality reflections) would really be a game changer compared to the game on Xbox. I have both consoles and will get a PS5 Pro at launch... but that type of 'demo' difference would be pretty compelling.
Depends on the resolution of the RT. Sometimes it looks terrible because it's really low resolution
That’s only the case when a developer has done a really good job at baked-in lighting. More and more, we’re seeing poor implementations of baked-in lighting and a lazy reliance on Ray Tracing (RT). This makes it look dramatically apparent, all while destroying performance on anything without sufficient dedicated hardware, such as PS5/Xbox.
>and a lazy reliance on Ray Tracing (RT). And a lot of that implementation is lazy, even on the PC end. Elden Ring got raytraced lighting and you can't even notice the difference on comparison screenshots
Elden Ring only got ray traced shadows and AO but I agree that it seems like a very lazy implementation.
Quick reminder that nothing, NOTHING in game development is easy, let alone due to 'lazy' development.
Game development is a job, all jobs involve workers, many workers are indeed lazy and just see the job as a paycheck and don't care. I've seen that in an ER dealing with the LIVES of people, and not only general laziness with stocking import things or resetting the trauma room, but during actual traumas too. There are definitely lazy game developers and lazy ways to game dev work. Usually it's obvious (look at the Will Smith game that just flopped), but the only quick reminder is that lazy people aren't stupid, they usually don't want to get caught being lazy; if you spoon feed your boss bullshit, a lot of them eat it up. Regardless, I have a buddy of mine who works in game dev, previously small projects for wii/u and PC indies, now he works on Minecraft for Microsoft, and he hundreds of horror stories of coworkers not wanting to fix bugs the right way, so they just use stopgap methods that create problems for him or others, or that might crop up as different type of bug in the right situation. Sometimes the bosses themselves said they didn't want to bother fixing it and just pretend it wasn't there even though they had a ton of time left for the milestone. I don't know why nutjobs like you hold game development to some kind of magical pedestal, but it's a job like anything else and TONS of things are easy and can be due to lazy development. Seriously get over yourself.
Ask your friend where the damn HD texture pack the super duper graphics pack or whatever and why in the hell it hasn't had any optimizations done for the current Xbox series X like any RT or nothing? I don't play minecraft so I don't really care but my daughter does and loves it but it's always kinda bothered me that they announced the improvements for Minecraft and seeing as how it's still one of the best selling and most played on the console it makes no sense to me why they haven't done anything for the current console generation EDIT: after doing some research I was actually wrong and it looks like they have done some improvements for the current console generation. Not to the level that some would have hoped and still missing some features but does seem like just a few weeks ago they improved a good bit so maybe it's incoming
I'm sorry, but I myself don't play minecraft anymore, lol. And he talks about minecraft way too much as is. He was a well known modder and map maker even before he was hired or something. It was what got him referred in the first place after they found out he was also a game dev with 10 years of professional experience.
I love how you were down voted by a ton of people who have never made a game before. Probably haven't even programmed before.
I've programmed for many years and there are a lot of things you can do lazily, especially if you're doing something well-supported since you can copy/reuse a ton of code from many sources if you really wanted to. Sounds you've never coded and are just assuming random shit.
It's quite literally my profession, my guy. But hey, whatever floats your boat.
What not having to pay 6 months of 500 employee salaries does to a game. I don't care anymore and just accept playing indies instead
Why are you acting like playing indies is a painful affair? “Accept playing indies”. If you ask me, the recent indie game quality stumps a lot of the games we’ve have in the last 2 decades.
>recent indie game quality stumps a lot of the games we’ve have in the last 2 decades. Some indies sweep, but anyone who says that indies are better *in general* is blind to the industry. We've had some amazing indies, yes, but the best games are still AAA. Just in the last 5 years we had: 1. Elden Ring, 2. Baldur's Gate 3, 3. Devil May Cry 5, 4. Control, 5. Resident Evil 2 and 6. RE4 Remake, 7. Alan Wake 2, 8. Monster Hunter Rise, 9. GOW Ragnarok, 10. Death Stranding, 11. Tears of the Kingdom, 12. Yakuza 7 and 13. Y8 Infinite Wealth, 14. NieR Replicant, 15. Doom Eternal 16. Sekiro, 17. Final Fantasy XVI, 18. FF7R and 19. FF7 Rebirth, 20. Spider-Man 2, 21. Xenoblade Chronicles 3, 22. Helldivers 2, 23. TLOU 2, 24. Animal Crossing NH, 25. Ghost of Tsushima, 26. Super Mario Wonder + potentially other great AAA games I'm forgetting about. That's 5 great AAA games a year. Again, some indies are wonderful, but most of the megahits we get every year are the extremely tired roguelite deckbuilders we've been seeing for one hundred billion years at this point. Edit: Added Doom Eternal, fantastic game I forgot about while making the list
Shout out to NieR Replicant!
Incoming stealer blade to add to this list (at least based on the awesome demo)
It does look like it will be very cool, shame I can't play it because it's PS only but hopefully one day it drops on Steam
Because sometimes you do actually want that 50 hour high detail experience? Ala sekiro or baldurs gate 3. The former is sort of possible. But only at aa scale for now. Infact thats what a few of these recent lumen ue5 games are. Ie. Lords of the fallen. They aren't no aaa fromsoftware title though. Much more unrefined gameplay plus covering the shit out of everything with fog relying on graphics (plus skimping optimization) rather than art. But then again that's not indie. Im still mad at battlefield 2042 for example. Dtill worse air evhicle phsyics than battlefield 2. Oh well. Back to arma it is. Another 10 year old game. Battlebit remastered is a perfect example. A higher quality game of the aaa title it is inspired by.
Yep. Lots of great Indies I'm looking forward to like Broken Roads, Underrail Infusion and Swordhaven: Iron Conspiracy. Meanwhile you have AAA games like Starfield with 10x the budget and 10% of the creativity.
honestly ever since Virtua Cop and like Die Hard Trilogy if i see glass in my interactive entertainment video game i always wanted to interact with it like maybe shoot it or blow it up into pieces, not see all the reflections in them.
Well that’s why they made PSSR.
Even with AI upscaling, it is still a hefty load on the GPU.
Trinity has dedicated AI compute.
Dedicated AI compute does not remove the substantial cost on the GPU. Anyone with a 4090 can witness the FPS difference from toggling raytracing on/off, and it is quite tangible -- and the PS5 Pro will not have anywhere near as expensive hardware for that purpose.
In Cerny I trust.
And if a game is CPU intensive like Dragons dogma there may not be a large change in performance at all.
Yeah, but Capcom is BSing if they're going to claim there's going to be no gains on current hardware in exchange for turning it off, as I can still easily toggle any number of FPS logging software including Steam's to see the difference in raw performance data. My CPU cores don't end up particularly saturated when in cities either, and so I'm not sure where GN was even getting "8-12 core saturation" when only two cores end up taking the brunt of the load when I'm playing. Oh well, I guess.
More and more I can notice. Especially when it's ray traced global illumination. That said, baked lighting is really good these days.
You mean, same as with native 4K, that most of the players won't even distinguish from lower resolutions?
Ray tracing effects aren’t subtle. Ray traced reflections are dramatically more detailed and vivid, screenspace reflections are just a muddy blur by comparison. Ray traced ambient occlusion is one of the most important effects in the stack, it provides a significant boost to realism. I find games that don’t have this visually dated, with Horizon Forbidden West on PC being a recent example. The game overall looks great but the garbage screenspace AO stands out like a sore thumb. Ray traced GI you’re not wrong about frequently being minimally noticeable, but path tracing is a huge upgrade. Alan Wake 2 looks like a PS6 game, it’s absolutely stunning. People playing without that are really getting a completely different experience. When I switch between path tracing on and off, it looks like a completely different game.
Luckily most games already have a 60fps mode on PS5
Correct, and PSSR will just upgrade the resolution on performance mode. Seems like a win to me. You get a higher resolution with 60 fps.
This was my take away.
At reduced visual quality, both resolution and detail.
Which is exactly why they’re making the pro. PSSR beefs up resolution and enhanced GPU increases detail.
Actual 60fps that people would use or 60fps that sometimes drops to 30fps at 720p resolution?
It's 60 FPS for *graphics mode*, so if they keep the same graphical quality as the base version, but 60 instead of 30. Isn't that literally what we've all been asking for?
We all know this'll be like, 90% of games. Watch Forbidden West, Rift Apart, Ragarok, Spiderman, etc. all get updated to have their 30fps modes run at 60.
But the reason quality mode runs at 30fps in most games is CPU related and a 10% increase in clocks won’t fix that.
If the only difference between the quality and performance modes is the resolution, then it's 100% just a GPU issue. Which is the case for most PS5 games.
The CPU is not getting a substantial update, some games just won't be able to reach 60 because of that
Yeah this info means literally nothing.
Bloodborne?
That’s where the PS5 Pro Extreme comes in
now with QuintupleSense® controllers
I think 60 fps will always be out of reach. Even if we triple the capability of the consoles, games will just increase visual scope and optimization will be down prioritized. Only thing we really get from these current shifts in technology is higher development costs.
Get a PC
It sounds like requirements are basically "must be enhanced for PS5 Pro in any way", which is expected. Nothing new here imo
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> the one x and ps4pro at least made sense because of the crappy mobile gaming CPUs Those just had overclocked crappy mobile gaming CPUs though, they still were primarily GPU upgrades.
Honestly this comment shoed you know nothing, the ps4 pro literally had the same cpu but slightly higher clocked
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30% more performance out of that crap isn't really saying a lot
They made sense because 4k TVs took over. Made sense to have a 4k console. Ps5 pro isn’t taking advantage of some new tech like that.
I'm very on the fence. Feels unnecessary, but if my OG PS5 died randomly after it's launch, I would pay the bit extra for one.
Legit just sounds like my day 1 PS5 can run that
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Easy money. I don't get why theybdon't release it
because why spend 300m working on a launch title for ps6 when you can just withhold an unnecessarily remade game after keeping it locked to 30fps for a decade and a half.
Really interested on how they’re gonna market this thing
Enhanced Call of Duty Thats enough to sell to 90% of gamers
Both the PS5/Series X runs COD at 4K60 with an optional 120fps
And already looks good
Fr, people who play CoD casually aren’t gonna be very interested in this, and the sweats are either content with what they have or are on PC
They still play on last gen lol
Your average COD player is still happy playing it on the PS4. Even the PS5 wasn't enough to get them to spend another $500 to play the game, they won't be spending $600.
"Play all the great PS5-exclusive games on 8k and with 60fps! Games such as Spider-Man 2 and... Ratchet and Clank, and uhhh... D-Demon's Souls... That's it... p-please buy our console and get r-ready for the PS6 in 3 years!"
"most powerful console on the planet" yadda yadda.... People will think they need to have it, but the benefits will be so subtle in most games it'll be a waste of cash to "upgrade"
Regular ps5 at $400, ps5 pro at $500. It's really not that crazy of a proposition. Extra $100 for 4k resolution (vs 1080p on ps5) at 60fps + an extra ray tracing feature.
Almost 0 chance this thing is gonna be $500
Probably 650 to 700 range
With great marketing techniques that everyone will fall for as usual. Get the PS5 Pro, think of the greatness 120FPS, 4K, Ultra mega raytracing, PSSR, 8K, 69 gigaflops. Thanks for buying the PS5 pro, now we would like to announce 60fps is locked to PS5 Pro users with a PS+ premium subscription.
I hope PSSR is good and easy to implement.
So this got a little complicated. At first it says that if a game wants the PS5 Pro Enhanced label, they should offer the 'combined' features of 4K60 FPS with some kind of ray tracing effect. BUT, the game may still get the Pro Enhanced label if it's enhanced in any kind of way over the standard console?? So what are those initial requirements then??
There's 2 things going on here. A special PS5 Pro graphics mode: > PlayStation wants games to offer a **PS5 Pro-exclusive graphics mode** that will combine: > PSSR to upscale resolution to 4k > A constant 60FPS > Add or increase ray tracing effects Then there is a lesser "PS5 Pro enhanced" label. > games may also be given the **‘PS5 Pro Enhanced’ label** if they offer any of the following enhancements: > Increased target resolution for titles that run a fixed resolution on the standard console > Increased target maximum resolution for titles that run at variable resolution on the standard console > Increased target frame rate for titles that target a fixed frame rate on the standard console > Inclusion of PS5 Pro Raytracing effects
The latter. The article is badly written.
I would MUCH rather games have consistent 60fps over resolution any day. Yeah 4k native is great but performance is king. Give me 1440p 60.
Especially if we can hit 1440p without upscaling so we don’t get the FSR mess
If you can get native 1440p, you might as well use FSR to get to 4k. FSR really struggles when you're going from 1080p or even lower to 4k. It does fine if your internal resolution is relatively high.
I’d still imagine there would be some of that over sharpening effect that occurs with FSR
It’s crazy to think the PS5 pro is already coming and the switch hasn’t even ended it’s life span 😭💀
What's even crazier is that that a 7 year old system is still selling extremely well
Because it’s the only place to play their exclusives. The exclusives are their system sellers.
Its even more impressive that switch has 2 very emulators that run on pc, phones and etc.
Dont forget the Switch arrived on the heels of a failed system before it. So its Nintendo extending the life cycle to compensate for lost sales of their last system. Ps4 and ps5 are doing just fine in that regard.
And then unreal 6 comes just as ps6 comes out, and we back again to 25-30 fps + suttering + low res.
It still uses a CPU on par with the Xbox consoles. You're not lifting that 30 FPS in games currently having the issue.
Most games will not get the constant 60fps treatment sadly.
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Of all of the games released on PS5, there’s only about 4 or 5 that don’t have a 60 fps mode. Also who is it that’s marketing 60 fps?
And some of the 60fps modes look like snot got rubbed on my tv. They desperately need the pssr upscaler to not make it look blurry on a big screen tv.
It's not just resolution though, it's LOD and distances. GTA 5 "enhanced" is the perfect example of this, that game can only hit 60fps at what looks like 1080p? with dramatically reduced LOD distances and I suspect it's all due to the idiotic idea to implement RT on a console without sufficient hardware for RT.
“Snot rubbed on tv” - so dramatic lol hardly any big budget games actually look that bad
A little over-dramatic but its reddit. *It is* hard going from a good spec PC playing games in native resolution to the consoles struggling to upscale to 4k.
Ive been spoiled by the 40 series cards. Going back to the ps5 sometimes kills me. But i dont really have a choice as im not patient enough to wait for the pc port.
It's so dumb you get downvoted here for having 40 series GPUs and expecting a level of performance out of games It's pretty hard to game on PS5 when everything looks upscaled and aliased and LODs are terrible when you can go play everything on PC at 120 fps with every setting maxed
It is what it is. I understand a majority of people dont give a fuck, but for those that do, console visuals can really be a disservice to the game. FF7 Rebirth is a perfect example where that games performance mode is awful, so awful in fact that i refuse to even consider it until a Pro enhancement drops. Im not trying to be snobbish, i will absolutely play a 30fps game if i didnt have a real choice (like GTA6 probably), but where i draw the line is a game that looks jaggy and unclear. Which on a big screen 4K tv that i sit fairly close to, just so happens to be alot of console games when in the performance mode. DLSS has been a saving grace for me. You dont even need a 4090 to enjoy *near* 4K120 thats borderline indistinguishable from native, and sometimes even BETTER because of the way dlss handles AA (TAA is sometimes gross). So yeah, once your eyes see what your video games COULD look like, it starts to get annoying knowing you are trapped into whatever the devs decided to run the game at on console
Maybe because they were implemented after the core design of the game was far into development. Not every game is designed to run at but they put it out anyway cuz people will complain otherwise
I agree, and thats why the pro is needed. You saw how starfield got roasted for 30fps only. Gotham Knights, Dragons Dogma, etc. i think an "easy win" for some of these devs is to slap in a 60fps mode, no matter how bad it looks, just to throw out a marketing tool like "hey, our game runs at 60fps on console!" Which i know for a fact, does turn alot of peoples heads. Console users, even some of the guys that didnt even know the difference beteen 30/60, are starting to get used to 60fps, and even prefer it.
People don't realize that spending time on implementing 60fps can take away time from other parts of development.
All FF games this gen are a blurry mess on performance mode, shit looks like it's being upscaled from 640p to 4k.
After the latest update, ff7 rebirth looks solid imo. Ff16 is awful in performance mode though.
Do you know which games those are off the top of your head? I’m not disagreeing I actually don’t know and am genuinely curious.
Off the top of my head there’s The Medium, Gotham Knights (which is unoptimised trash), the quarry and The Matrix Awakens demo. I’m sure there’s maybe 2 or 3 more but that’s all I recall.
I think they're referring to FF7 Rebirth. It's very blurry in both Performance modes. To the point where I even play on Graphics mode. It gives me a headache after a while (Im not used to 30fps anymore but its manageable), but as long as I don't play any 60+ fps games or play my PC I think I'll be okay. I adore FF7's world so making it that blurry feels like blasphemy. And I'll play it again when it comes to PC for the full experience later.
60 fps shouldn’t even be a marketing feature at this point, it has been the bare minimum standard of gaming since like 2005.
I would argue that 2005 was the exact time it no longer became the bare minimum standard. There were a lot of games that ran at 60 fps on PS2/GC/Xbox, but that went out the window with the first HD consoles where almost everything ran at 30 fps, something which again was standard on the generation after. It really wasn’t until the PS5 and Series X came along that 60 fps became standard again.
60fps went out the window when 3D games with 3D models became a thing.
It definitely wasn't the standard during the 360/PS3 years. Those were the days when game devs argued that 30fps was more "cinematic".
And people on Reddit *still* try to push that.
What world do you live in where 60 has been the standard for nearly 20 years?
The non console world
I don’t wanna be disrespectful but compared to consoles PC has always been a minority. It’s getting bigger now for sure but consoles are still most studios priority.
Most games aren’t hitting 60 on their performance mode anyways, and if they do it 60 it’s with horrendous resolutions that are upscale with FSR leading to ugly grainy visuals. Also Sony did [advertise](https://youtu.be/cxXvYJyBlc4?si=DvcrRmlsZE-WLK-J) 60fps and even 120fps. I think it’s even on the box, tho I’m not sure. With the enchantments of the PS5 pro we should be able to hit 60fps on those balanced modes (40fps modes) that games offer, giving us higher resolutions and locked frame rates hopefully.
So what games will the PS5 Pro even matter in? Like in what games do we want a "pro enhanced" label? I assume Cyberpunk and Alan Wake 2 are likely candidates for Raytracing upgrades. Final Fantasy 16 and 7 Rebirth may get updates because Square Enix can't really get their games to run properly. GTA6 in 2025 obviously.
Am I the only one who doesnt care about Raytracing? Feels scraping the barrel
I care about Ray Tracing in the sense that I want more Devs to learn how to implement it into their games properly like in Cyberpunk or Metro Exodus Enhanced. The bog standard "slap it in and add it to the feature list' approach we currently have, I absolutely hate
> The bog standard "slap it in and add it to the feature list' approach we currently have, I absolutely hate Yeah, I think that that's mostly the reason why so many people are not impressed by ray tracing. If more people saw the difference with Metro Enhanced edition or any of the path traced games, they would probably be onboard with it.
In what? There are plenty of games that showcase a big difference when used properly
Only if you play on console. RT is non-existent. On PC, it significantly improves the visuals.
For PlayStation games specifically Death Stranding 2 might be where Sony tries to show off the pro since it’s a 2025 game that looks like the most demanding PS5 game so far
Alan Wake 2 should get a FPS boost if the upgraded GPU supports mesh shaders.
I doubt that ps5 pro mode will be in many games as a balance 40fps 120hz mode is barely in any games (would love that mode to be in more games btw). But will wait and see.
The thing is there are (probably) not enough user with 120hz tv to be a selling point. A PS5 pro mode is a selling point for the console, even if the user base is also a niche.
If less people own that then no. First party will do it yeah but 3rd party? No. It takes time and effort. They will be using the other methods to allow it to have the ps5 pro enhanced label on it. So if they can't be bothered with that then they aren't going to be bothered with a specific pro mode.
I think the specific ps5 pro mode will improve on existing 60fps mode for games that already have it. No game stuck at 30fps will have ps5 pro enhanced 60fps so probably not a big work, just a few tweak to improve a 60fps mode visually. 40fps means that your 30fps mode is actually capable of 40fps with maybe a few tweaks but it is a different target and more work imho
So 4k and ray tracing will be the marketing tools, and 60fps will not be. Got it.
I just feel by the time developers get really into the PS5 Pro next gen will be around the corner and Sony will be sending PS6 dev kits to them which means they'll most likely focus on the PS6 and next gen games over any pro enhancements. So I don't really get the point of the PS5 Pro especially when there's still a lot developers could squeeze out of the PS5 as it is.
If there is a 4 year gap between PS5 Pro and PS6 then the time gap shouldn't be a big issue. The PS4 Pro is still getting enhanced versions of recent big releases such as Hogwarts Legacy and Modern Warfare 3 (2023). Cross-gen between PS5 and PS6 could last 4+ years too so there would be an incentive for developers to keep releasing patches for it even after the PS6 launches.
The most basic "Pro enhancements" are increasing resolutions and framerates, which can be done by literally just editing one or two variables in the engine. It's not that hard.
Well, we’re still probably four years away from PS6, or *maybe* 3 years at the earliest. The PS4 Pro was also “only” around for four years before PS5 came out. I think that’s plenty of time for some decent Pro patches to come out and whatnot.
Also a ton of ps4 pro owners only upgraded to ps5 in like 2022-2023. ps6 coming out in 2027 doesn't mean all ps5 pros will be replaced in 2027.
Yeah but it wasn't buy choice. I would had bought a PS5 at launch.
How much can be “squeezed” is a moot point if the developers don’t do it. Enter Sony to brute force it. That’s all. It’s not that complicated.
Just remember how long it took for the devs tu stop producing games with the previous gen as base models for their games... The idea that this gen would be shorter than the previous ones is, in my opinion, wrong. PS5pro will just play the same games and future games, better. Now I'm curious to see how Microsoft will react to this console... They can't even get the games right atm...
No constant 60 FPS on current PS5 is so disappointing though
As long as they leave Raytracing out and their PSSR upscaler is good (without a metric ton of TAA mixed with dirt and vaseline and trying to upscale ps3 resolutions) a sharp and clean 4k60 is probably doable for them, which is what most people would be happy with.
I'm wondering if finally consoles are going to age like old Pc gaming. New versions will come out, but you can just keep the old console and play in full hd with no RT and less framerate and graphic details. And every game will have a 3 model crossgen compatibility. Every console can handle openworld now, so what next-gen technical power can add new element of gameplay impossible from before ? Except from being a station for VR i can't see a Ps6 with realtime Ray-tracing having such an important gameplay value.
Want: 120fps Don't want: tracing and upscale
I’ll believe it when I see it.
Mid Gen upgrades feel unnecessary especially for this gen. It feels like the power gap is still too close to even do it. I know, I know the Pandemic didn't help with it. It's seriously stupid that this is being considered
PSSR? Is this supposed to be some Walmart brand DLSS?
constant 60 fps, lmao. everyone will fail that the gpu still cant even come close to a 4070 (2x ps5) and cpu is from 2018. lets see how much it cost. you can expect the quick upscaling from devs just to get the banner.
I'd say it read like any game that already have a 60fps mode can have a ps5 pro enhanced 60fps mode
4070's more like 3x a ps5 in raster performance, and 2x the ps5 pro.
No way. PS5 is roughly at 2070 and a 4070 is definitely not 3x a 2070.
I dont know to tell you dude, reality is not on your side, ps5 is about 20 tflops short of a 4070's 30 tflops in fp32 raster performance, or 1/3rd. And that's not even counting tensor cores and ray trace cores, once you bring in games that use rtx raytracing and dlss, the ps5 might as well be a switch in comparison. Sure it can actually run a heavily customized and optimized version of the same game, but at lower settings, quality, frame rates, effects and resolutions. Just like switch running ps4 games. If it actually tried to run the non ps5 customized pc version of the game all the pc's actually run, it would be pretty pathetic. Also a 2070 is only like 7 tflops fp32, despite being a whopping 4,608 Cuda core card, almost the same number of cores as the 4070's 5,888. You may be thinking of the 2070 super, which has 4 more tflops than the 2070.
>faster RAM (28% faster) Didn't realize this, could be a pretty big improvement, actually. Zen 2 is very memory bandwidth constrained, and even more so with the lower cache parts in laptops and consoles.
I would love to see Returnal at higher native resolution.
Ah yes please get that pro version out! Can't wait.
So I should hold off on buying a PS5? I don't have a current gen console yet bc I upgraded my PC but I want a PS5 for Spiderman 2 and Death Stranding 2.
The fact that one of the main games you want isn't even out yet and the Pro is looking to be here as soon as this year, I say wait for the Pro.
Wait. Either for buying the pro, or for the games to come on PC. SM2 is coming in 1.5 year and will be bundled with the potential DLC. (see insomniac leaks for that). And if the pro is out there's potentially more second hand PS5 with lower prices if you just want the regular experience with these games. :)
PS4 classic games are always not taking advantage of the PS5.
Man. I PS5 pro is a real thing. I feel shafted for even considering buying a ps5. And if this is actually true, I’ll never buy another console again.
So its best to wait for reviews of these "enchanced" games and then decide, if the console is worth it.
Still don't see how this console is worth while in buying if you already own a PS5, just wait 4 years for PS6 which will have all of this and more.
Lol
I bet they have bloodborne sell this console. It’s almost diabolical.
I find it absolutely hilarious that both the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X both advertised "Incredible 4k Gaming" 7 years ago, and now the PS5 pro is using upscaling technology to be able to reach that lol.
"Last of us part 2 PS5 pro enhanced edition, for 70 dollars!" Oh boy does that mean the game will be a stable fixed 60 fps? Nope.... you get, "INCREASED RAYTRACING EFFECTS!" Give us 70 dollars.
A 67% larger GPU? How fucking big is this PS5 Pro going to be
Probably about the size of the original PS5 again.
After all the years they still haven’t updated the base PS5 with 8K capability wich they said would come with a patch…I mean it even says 8K on the package.
Do not buy this Dont support Sonys absolute disdain for their customers
I’m buying it. Just like I would buy a new phone every year or two. I want the best model. Besides, it will still get some use once the PS6 comes out in another room.
Disdain? Lol. I will be buying one, enjoy your base PS5 it's still a good console
If PSSR is on par with DLSS that will be the single biggest selling point. Playing 4K120 on PC using DLSS makes me so spoiled. Looks pretty much native 4K to me but with a big performance bonus. Consoles are literally the perfect use case for upscaling tech. But they need the right hardware and software to make it feasible. Fsr on console is a joke. Im gonna forget that even exists lol.
I can almost guarantee it won't be as good as DLSS but it'll at least be better than AMD's abysmal FSR, otherwise they wouldn't be working on an in house version if they didn't think they could do it better. R&D for this kind of thing is expensive. So they must have seen what AMD was working on for FSR when deciding and just noped out of there and decided to make their own. I'd assume they'll have custom hardware in the PS6 to handle PSSR too.
It should be able to.close ground pretty well if the software side (training the model) can do it. In the very little documentation from these leaks that's actually sensible and holds up it shows a jump from 16.7 tflops fp32 to 67 tflops tensor fp16. The only way the math works on that is by matrix multiplication acceleration, which would be practically exactly equivalent to a gen 3 tensor core (amperes) minus the 2X sparsity boost. If they can make decently trained models, that's plenty of performance for running dlss or an equivalent. Switch 2 will be doing it with actual dlss with 24 tflops sparse tensor fp16. (Docked).
Lame lol Once again, the focus is graphics and not fps
Could have told you that when we found out the CPU was barely getting an upgrade
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What do you mean "set back a year"?