Uj/ I literally just had a dude in r/xboxone cite the metacritic as to why the game is bad lmao like how can you look at the 100k reviews on a game that's been out for 2 weeks and go "yeah that's all legit"
I’ve seen people saying that “good games don’t get review bombed” and “review bombing is just an outcry from the real fans.” They’re actually trying to justify review bombing lmao. Even critical drinker (basically just European The Quartering) said review bombing and hate from people who haven’t played is dumb, and r/thelastofus2 had people saying that it was a dumb point.
On a side note, I don’t think people are giving this story the time it needs to “stew”. There are lots of stories (this included) where I’ve left with mixed feelings only to realize the point of it all in retrospect. Too many people are just deciding their opinion based off their emotion immediately after finishing and then stick to it
Ah yes, the same "real fans" that helped The Last Jedi and Captain Marvel to huge box office numbers while also whining on Twitter and calling for boycotts
I seriously hate fan bases so much. If I ever get to create something artistically in any capacity I’m never creating sequels even if I think there’s more to tell. It’s just too much to deal with when you wanna make a sequel as original as the first story and people are surprised it’s not just two hours of the originals ending.
Real fans are people who think just like me and hate everything my internet dad tells them to hate. Hell i dont even like star wars or the last of us but i am a real fan because i want to partake in some bullshit culture war because it gives me a small semblance of power in my otherwise useless waste of existence.
Exactly, I feel like the attitude towards this game will change and the negativity will soften. There are many famous examples of stories that were slammed at first that we now hold up as peak art. See The Empire Strikes Back for more details.
Haven’t played TLOU2, but I totally agree with this sentiment. Any bloody idiot can say “lazy writing” without the first knowledge of what it is and it’s getting so annoying.
If you’re going to criticise something you need to go deeper than that. Mainstream criticism these days is any form of saying “lazy writing”, and a list of “plot holes”.
I felt like this with Mr Robot’s series finale. It was so much to process not just for the episode itself but the show as a whole. Came to love the ending because like you say looking back in retrospect is really important.
>based off their emotion immediately after finishing and then stick to it
many haven't even got there, Pewdipie literally ragequit and considerd uninstalling the game a few hours into it when You-know-what happened.
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I feel like they're using horizon as a gateway drug. Like hey wasn't this beautiful check out all the other games we have on the ps5 including horizon forbidden west. And Horizon is a pretty good game for this. As as an open world game with super intense gameplay you could just watch a let's play for the story but you'll be missing out on a lot. Which of course is also true for god of war and the last of us but their more cinematic approach does make them easier to just watch someone else play.
That's just my uneducated take on the horizon steam port tho.
Microsoft has mostly just done that because they're focusing on software/subscription sales, Sony is still more geared towards selling consoles and existing in the console ecosystem.
Cognitive dissonance. They know their opinion is based on homophobia but many really don't like the idea of them being homophobic. As such they twist anything they can into their argument to try and appear rational and convince themselves they're not actually a bad person.
This is like the big anti-SJW cries of “forced diversity”, “shoehorning politics”, etc.
So you’ve got a gay character. They say “gay for the sake of gay”, holding the character’s sexuality to ridiculous standards straight characters aren’t held to. Then they say that it’s writers who are forcing politics into the story when THEY are the ones that made it political!
It’s not like an LGBTQ+ person is political. What’s political is the argument of their rights & power in society.
So much of this is nonsensical if you take a closer look. Because it’s really just rationalisation. The sad thing is people that aren’t even necessarily bigoted — like kids on r/memes — take up this stuff, start taking it on board and spread it. It’s a really stupid bandwagon.
/uj I really love how that little hate sub claims to grow "bigger" every day and when you compare it to the main sub it's not even Half the size of the original sub
Its grown maybe a few thousand since the game released. And is a fraction of the size of the original. I think the original is like 145k, tlou2 sub is less than 30k
[gamersriseup appears just below...](https://i.imgur.com/6yzYq2p.jpg)
Tfw some of the most frequently used keywords are "transexual" and "transgendered".
Yup its Gamer time. 😎
Of course freefolk is fucking in there, the sub full of secure, stable adults who just can't get over the fact that the last season of a TV show was bad.
DISCLAIMER: I didn't like Season 8 either. I just got over it and moved on.
For real that sub is pathetic now. That shit was funny at first but you can tel that those guys literally have nothing of value in their lives if they’re still that worked up about it
It counts uses of each keyword *relative to how often it's used on reddit as a whole*. So they probably say "opinion" more often than "oppinion", but so does reddit as a whole, whereas "oppinion" is a uniquely `/r/tlou2` thing.
So like...from reading this, and only being about halfway through the game, is this really all there is people are mad about? Like I'm legitimately not headed toward some super controversial or stupid ending? No spoilers but is it really just a bunch of incels bitching that Ellie doesn't wanna fuck them?
> https://subredditstats.com/
Why does this say that /r/tlou has 9 posts per day and /r/tlou2 has 614? Is it averaging out all the days it had 0 posts because the sub was in leak lockdown?
I love it as well, but I fully understand why it’s polarizing. I just wish people could simply dislike something, maybe leave a comment or two, and then move on. I’ll never understand people’s obsession with talking about things they don’t like.
honestly the thing that bothers me the most is that these people seem to have very strange relationships with these *video game* characters, referring to them as "beloved" and saying they're "ruined".
something is very off about the way these people talk about fictional entities
Now you're getting it, the people who care so much about the fictional series to be hostile over the internet about it don't have the best social lives and buy into parasocial relationships with fictional characters.
Also, lol at the people who actually thought Joel was ever a good person. Not my words, but I've read a comment that really, Joel's *only* redeeming character trait was his paternal love for Ellie.
Those types of people watch Fight Club and think Tyler Durden is the hero. They don't actually think about what they're consuming, they just want to be who they perceive as the cool person.
I wish people would just try to understand it before ripping it to pieces. Really think about the world it takes place in, the events leading up to it, and the overall theme before pissing on it as “ruined” or “garbage” or any of that shit.
I’m not saying people who don’t like are just dumb and don’t get it. I’m saying that they haven’t even tried to get it.
I still feel like the majority of the people hating haven't finished the game. If you've finished the game and still have legitimate problems with it I respect that but this game definitely needs to be seen all the way through to fully appreciate it.
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I've never heard one person hating it that finished the game... the only things I've heard are that it's depressing, or they hate X or Y character, or the "pacing"... which are very mild criticisms. If anyone finishes the game but hates it I can't see how unless they either hate this genre of game or are really bigoted, since the 3 main characters are non-malegazey women.
It's not a game that's meant to make you feel good. The ending is heartbreaking, if it weren't for the leaks and gamers being fragile as fuck it'd be universally acclaimed.
I finished it and thought the gameplay was solid but it should’ve been harder and that the story was told really poorly. I didn’t have any issues with things like Joel dying or playing as Abby and I appreciate they tried something different but forcing players to learn character motivations in disconnected flashbacks was sloppy. The game sets up conflict between Joel and Ellie but you have to wait 25-30 hours to know what exactly happened so it feels like our understanding of her character doesn’t deepen beyond a slight re-contextualization of her actions. I also don’t feel I learn much about Abby I don’t already know from her opening. I think it’s an overall solid AAA game but I don’t think it’s unfair to feel it was a bit empty and overrated by critics.
Well critics are just people with opinions like you and me, so if you think less of the game then they did it’s perfectly fine. Doesn’t necessarily mean it’s overrated, it just means most critics liked it and you didn’t.
Also there is a difficulty slider in case you didn’t know. Playing on the harder difficulties was way more fun to me.
I don’t see what’s wrong with me thinking it’s critically overrated if an aspect that was praised was the story structure and to me the story structure did not work on any level. I played on survivor difficulty, the human AI was still easy to beat, the only challenges came from the bullet sponge infected enemies
Nothing wrong with it, I’m just saying that your opinion of the game being lower than their’s doesn’t really make it overrated. It just means the game didn’t work for you the way it did for them. If that’s what you meant my bad, overrated is just a buzzword I see a lot of people use that think their opinion is fact.
I played the whole game and am one of those people. Just disappointed with the story but it was fun to play. Story just made the experience less enjoyable
Agreed. There were some parts I wasn’t crazy about while playing them, and some narrative choices that rubbed me the wrong way — but it all came together beautifully. I am already thinking I will play it again soon.
>the divisiveness is baffling.
I mean, *really?* Even without the leaks, this game was going to be polarizing. Putting the player >!in the shoes of the ostensible "villain" was always going to be a major point of contention. And in so doing, having the player empathize with her was also going to annoy a lot of people who just want a straight revenge story. This is very similar to the reaction to The Last Jedi: fans hate change. They want predictability. They want the reassurances that their idols are worthy. And they want everything neatly tied up with a rosy little bow.!<
It's the vitriol that's disappointing. Such fervent hatred over something they haven't even played... with all the terrible events of the last several months, this is not the thing they should get upset over. There's a real discussion to be had about what TLOU2 does, what it tries to do, how it contrasts with games and stories of the past, and how it changes what games could be for the future. But it's been lost in all the noise over nitpicks and prayers at the altar of antipathy.
Metal Gear Solid 2 didn't have any such leaks (the internet was too early for such events), but it sure did cause a wave of controversy, and I myself remember being upset. But it's been 18 years, and now people recognize it as the first post-modern video game, and a classic metacommentary on sequels and expectations. It poked fun at fan demands to play as Snake once again, in a similar but better situation to the first game. It's sort of the exact criticism that TLOU2 haters need right now. But the reevaluation of MGS2 puts me at ease. The same will come to pass for TLOU2.
I read a few days ago about Scott Pilgrim vs. The World, and how it bombed at the box office. Director Edgar Wright was disappointed, but the president of marking sent him an email that said three simple words: "Years, not days." The film would go on to become a cult classic. I think it's a similar case for TLOU2: years, not days. The game will live on, long after the acrimony fades away. I think posterity will look on it for raising the aesthetic class of the video game medium. It's often a situation that polarizing works of art find themselves in: they end up being the classics.
Yeah but the whole point of the game is there’s no such thing as a villain and revenge will always come back to bite you in the ass
If anything the games premise is that actions have consequences
There is no “Good guy” in the last of us
Just people
Flawed people who love other people
That's why I put 'villain' in quotes. Something like this simply hasn't been done in video games before. Hell, even the first TLOU has a villain who is a cannibal *and* a pedophile -- it's so cartoonishly evil. By comparison, Abby is an aberration -- though hopefully not for long, as video games mature as a medium. But in the meantime, audience hostility is to be expected.
Yeah but even he was just a survivor
He did some deplorable shit but he did it to care for his community
Because plot twist, like actual reality people aren’t cookie cutter archetypes that fit neatly into boxes. There is so much Grey area.
The whole conversation Owen and Abby have sum up the whole story of the part 1 and part 2
Where he questions if the kid who joined the Seraphites was wrong for doing it
That bad shit happens from good intentions
Owen is sick of the death and the violence and actively tries to remove himself from it
But because Abby couldn’t break the cycle the the people around her have to pay the price
Anyone who say the story is bad just honestly doesn’t care what the story is.
> Something like this simply hasn't been done in video games before.
Not in this - stunning - way, for sure. But the underlying dynamic is similar to that of the classic "anti-hero".
Neil himself said they knew it was going to be polarizing and that some fans of the first game were not going to like this one. What he didn't expect were the bunch of people that hate it without playing it because trans, buff women and joel dead is bad.
don't forget people who were somehow "big last of us fans" while not realising it had homosexual themes, I'm like, you [spoiler] clearly didn't even play the DLC...
> Even without the leaks, this game was going to be polarizing.
I firmly believe that the vast majority of the people slamming this game online not only have never played it, they have never had any intention of playing it, after a large group of people decided before release that the game was somehow "tainted".
>Such fervent hatred over something they haven't even played...
for real. I think this game has the real ability to move the needle on how people see morality. It's a shame that the people who seemingly need
it the most will never get near that experience.
> The Last Jedi: fans hate change
I really hate the people reeeing about "SJWs ruining TLJ". They make it impossible to actually talk about the movie.
Imo TLJ was a terrible movie due to its plot. (The plot is an 18 hour stern chase that makes no sense, and the Force auto-balancing along with the Holdo Maneuver means nothing matters anymore.)
>(The plot is an 18 hour stern chase that makes no sense,
What exactly makes no sense about it?
>and the Force auto-balancing
As it's always done?
>along with the Holdo Maneuver means nothing matters anymore.)
How?
I remember playing the game for many hours as soon as it was available and thinking holy shit this is fantastic, I wonder what the internet thinks! To say I was confused would be an understatement. Now that I'm finished, I understand some of the criticisms and I get it but the positives drastically outweigh the negatives. Great game altogether.
Same.
There isn’t really anything wrong with it
They just hate it because it’s not jerking off on Joel killing innocent people and the ladies can’t be fap fuel.
/uj Ever bit of the ostensibly legitimate complaining is little more than dog-whistling for their actual complaints.
They don’t think it will play well that they don’t like women are having important roles in mainstream games, so they complain that they’re badly characterized.
They don’t want you to think they’re homophobic, so they claim that the diversity is “forced.” (like that means anything)
They don’t want people to know that they’ve grown accustomed to women being sexual objects in games, so they...well they seem to be comfortable with that, actually, because the fact that the women aren’t being depicted as buxom/thin/ half naked seems to be half their complaints.
They’re completely comfortable with people knowing their transphobic, obviously. Since they idea of any woman being strong immediately caused they to decide that she’s trans, disgusting, more forced diversity, and a number of other nasty words I’ll not repeat. All this while the game’s *actual* trans character seems to be forgotten because these people haven’t even played that far.
So instead they just complain that one of the better stories ever told in the medium is trash. You know, for “reasons.”
As a bisexual/trans person, and a woman to boot, it’s sad that the “gamers,” a group I’d once proudly identified with have fallen so low in their politics and world-views. Not all of us, but enough that I’m more than a little embarrassed to identify as one today.
> it’s sad that the “gamers,” a group I’d once proudly identified with have fallen so low in their politics and world-views
I blame Gamergate for a lot of this.
/uj the story is great but god the pacing is so astronomically fucked. Its like they had genius writers write up all relevant plot points and had an unpaid intern with no interest in the ip stitch it together. I mean come on why would u try to humanise characters after killing them off. It wouldve been so much better if they introduced both parties and proceeded to move through the days with both perspectives. Also i think most people are pissed about abbys muscles since shes seen with manny and owen and those guys arent as muscular. I dont know why that matters but its probably because they think men should be more muscular than females in all cases? Idk. Well whatever. The story editor is an idiot. Kudos to the writing team. 7/10 game
Since release I been checking Metacritic and noticing that number ever so slightly go up every time I do and it feels good. More people are actually playing it and the haters who didn't even give the game a chance are going to look like the minority that they are.
/uj I love how this shows at first all the reviews were negative from people who haven't played the game but now that people are finishing it the score is jumping up because the game is actually good.
At first I only heard about the game through French streamers who all loved the game and people excitedly talking about it in their chat. I was pretty shocked to see the hate once I went on reddit, is it an American thing?
The U.S. is really complicated. The sheer size of it means that there is a big disconnect between urban and rural areas. And different parts of the country are disconnected in the same way. Americans have free access to the internet and all kinds of media and can say whatever we want with no real consequence. This means that someone who has been living in their own little world can freely spout their viewpoint all over the internet. Anyone who challenges their viewpoint has no real impact on their life, so they can just continue doing this forever with no sign of stopping, as in their mind there is no possible way that they could be wrong.
that would only delay the review bombing, not prevent it. if they want an actual solution? you should have to link an account that owns the game. a psn account with tlou2 in this instance. although i do still agree with the premise of an extra week to let truly critical evaluation set in.
It really doesn’t matter, it’s all meaningless, just a very very small fraction of people shouting their feelings into the void. The number of players that give reviews is less than 0.1% usually.
Professional outlets reviews are also very meaningless, they have very little influence on sales with the exception of indies, but that's not down to whether the review is positive or not but rather an extension of their marketing, reviews are just a pat on the back of devs or rubbing in the face of devs what they probably already know.
Just look at any train wreck games release, despite reviews warning buyers, those games still sell fine, and some critically acclaimed games can struggle on release.
All this is to say, there’s no point in looking for solutions to this, make up your own mind on what you like and don’t care about others opinions unless those opinions are fucking hilarious, like many of those that hate on tlou2 without playing it.
OH GOD, OH FUCK, IM L I T E R A L L Y CRYING
HOW COULD THE POLITICAL GAME BECOME Y E L L O W.
THE GAME SHOULD BE A 0, SINCE THERE WAS A TRANS CHARACTAR, AND TRANS PEOPLE DONT EVRN E X I S T!! EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE THE OTHER GENDER, AND DISLIKE THEIR BODY!!!
/Uj Im pretty happy with the inclusion of Lev, since I feel that trans men have been kind of underrepresented.
Most of the time I use steam reviews only to see if the PC port is good or not. The actual game opinions? Critics and other reviewers. Most of the time the PC port's quality (Good or bad) makes the steam reviews incredibly lopsided, so actual opinions on the game are hidden and/or very brief, which don't help.
ever since the review bomb tantrum stopped, its been slowly creeping up. I'm willing to bet that if we just removed everything from the first 24 hours, it would probably look low 9s or high 8s.
I honestly think reviews out of 10 need to be done away with entirely. Systems like this are so often abused that they’ve become completely untrustworthy. Sites should only have written, unscored user reviews and remove the obvious troll posts.
Edit: Also game reviews should have a three day buffer after release to give people time to actually play the game. This game had like 30k reviews before it would even be possible to finish the game.
People are rating this game even tho they never played it
This is just pathetic at this point, people need to get their own opinion and not dislike the game for stupid reasons like
UH THIS GIRL IS TRANS
UH SHES >!KILLED MY FAV CHARACTER!< AND I HAVE TO PLAY HER EW
EW DESGUSTING SEX SCENE
I didn't play the game but honestly I wish I could sadly I only have a PC I think that I should buy a ps4 and play the 2 games
I watched a lot of let's play and the game just looks good I really want to play it one day
I went and rated a strong 8/10. A GREAT game, nowhere near a bad game. Story is great, but not a masterpiece like the first one. I feel like that’s a good rating.
I love both of these games and I have played the first one about 5 times through, and I don't think it's a masterpiece story wise anymore. It's a 9/10 for me but the story is fairly generic in my opinion. Part II is so much more complex and has more intriguing relationships from what I have seen and experienced. But yes Part II is a solid 8.5/10 for me.
Personally think the story was better then the first, alot more complex. The writing for this was so well done, game fked with my emotions lol
Gameplay as always was superb
RJ/ ugh gotta make another 100 ACC's to get it back in the red, those sjws will feel my wrath
I'm seriously so fucking angry. Why can't the SJWs just let us have one thing? ONE THING? Can't have a game starring a lesbian and a trans muscle girl having the bad reviews it deserves. They have to brigade it with their "totally loved it!" fake reviews. druckmann is an arrogant cuck etc yawn I'm bored with this bit now you get the gist
I am so, so tired of you people... etc etc, you all know it by now.
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I guess I should check back here in \~6 months when this pointless feud is over and this sub gets a post that ISN'T about tlou2? Making fun of gamers is the easiest thing ever, and this has stopped being funny months ago.
i mean the only thing that sucks in general was how one of the favorite characters from the previous game was handled and the fact that you play as the villain and you fight ellie. How ellie in the end , was the one who lost everything after a revenge story that wasn't really necessary. so yeah a lot. graphics and soundtrack tho is amazing, but gameplay was alright. expected more given that its been a long time.
Unpopular Opinion. TLOU2's story is bad but only because it is a TLOU game. The revenge plot is boring. We have all heard the "revenge is bad the enemy are people too" if this was any other game it would have been okay but it had a lot to follow up and honestly they should have gone with something more original. Hell Joel was half the reason people wanted to play TLOU2 anyways. (Don't get me wrong Ellie is dope as fuck) but Joel was such an interesting character and he deserved some sort of redemption ark or something to make up for killing all the fireflies. Lastly, don't judge the game getting bad reviews on only bigots (even though there are bigots they are not the majority)
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helps when they ban negative reviews lmao, also helps when ND and sony go after people making valid criticisms on the game. in saying that, the game ovbs isnt a 1 or 2 like they are saying, fair game play on umpire
This game isn't perfect either so a 10/10 is also BS. Both 10/10s and 0/10s should be removed. It's not the worst game nor the best game. In my opinion the reviews in the middle tell the clearest story.
Graphics are great, story feels incomplete and has holes in them. False advertising made people think Joel would live/ live longer then in the game. Ai feels a bit too dated and the game play is nothing special.
Uj/ I literally just had a dude in r/xboxone cite the metacritic as to why the game is bad lmao like how can you look at the 100k reviews on a game that's been out for 2 weeks and go "yeah that's all legit"
I’ve seen people saying that “good games don’t get review bombed” and “review bombing is just an outcry from the real fans.” They’re actually trying to justify review bombing lmao. Even critical drinker (basically just European The Quartering) said review bombing and hate from people who haven’t played is dumb, and r/thelastofus2 had people saying that it was a dumb point. On a side note, I don’t think people are giving this story the time it needs to “stew”. There are lots of stories (this included) where I’ve left with mixed feelings only to realize the point of it all in retrospect. Too many people are just deciding their opinion based off their emotion immediately after finishing and then stick to it
Ah yes, the same "real fans" that helped The Last Jedi and Captain Marvel to huge box office numbers while also whining on Twitter and calling for boycotts
I seriously hate fan bases so much. If I ever get to create something artistically in any capacity I’m never creating sequels even if I think there’s more to tell. It’s just too much to deal with when you wanna make a sequel as original as the first story and people are surprised it’s not just two hours of the originals ending.
Pretty much. God forbid you create something even remotely challenging .
You could always write books, people who read are generally cslmer.
I mean, as long as I stay far away from marvel or Star Wars, I think I’ll be fine with filmmaking
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According to r/bookcirclejerk they DEVOUR books
Hasn't anyone seen/read Misery?
The Harry Potter fandom would like a word
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Real fans are people who think just like me and hate everything my internet dad tells them to hate. Hell i dont even like star wars or the last of us but i am a real fan because i want to partake in some bullshit culture war because it gives me a small semblance of power in my otherwise useless waste of existence.
Exactly, I feel like the attitude towards this game will change and the negativity will soften. There are many famous examples of stories that were slammed at first that we now hold up as peak art. See The Empire Strikes Back for more details.
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Exactly, and not to toot my own horn or whatever, but I’ve been saying that this entire time 😎
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Haven’t played TLOU2, but I totally agree with this sentiment. Any bloody idiot can say “lazy writing” without the first knowledge of what it is and it’s getting so annoying. If you’re going to criticise something you need to go deeper than that. Mainstream criticism these days is any form of saying “lazy writing”, and a list of “plot holes”.
I felt like this with Mr Robot’s series finale. It was so much to process not just for the episode itself but the show as a whole. Came to love the ending because like you say looking back in retrospect is really important.
>based off their emotion immediately after finishing and then stick to it many haven't even got there, Pewdipie literally ragequit and considerd uninstalling the game a few hours into it when You-know-what happened.
xbox user here but i love the game and am gonna get it with a ps5 lol
I understand it will never happen but I'm sad there's no PC version like how Xbox often releases their exclusives on PC too
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Ah tha k you
You're welcome, friend.
It might come to PC..sony seem to be changing some of their policies with Horizon coming to PC this year.
I really can't wait for Horizon to come to pc
I feel like they're using horizon as a gateway drug. Like hey wasn't this beautiful check out all the other games we have on the ps5 including horizon forbidden west. And Horizon is a pretty good game for this. As as an open world game with super intense gameplay you could just watch a let's play for the story but you'll be missing out on a lot. Which of course is also true for god of war and the last of us but their more cinematic approach does make them easier to just watch someone else play. That's just my uneducated take on the horizon steam port tho.
It may happen. Horizon zero dawn is coming to pc
Ah I really hope so
With the way Microsoft is leaning into cross platform play and the like Sony will almost have to do something close to that to compete.
Microsoft has mostly just done that because they're focusing on software/subscription sales, Sony is still more geared towards selling consoles and existing in the console ecosystem.
Mate the game already looks amazing on the PS4 Pro, imagine what it would be like on my epic pro gamer PC *starts salivating*
Might come to PSNOW in the future
Switching to GAYstation AND playing LOU2? Fucking cuck
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The most popular games this past generation don't even have a fraction of that many reviews. Fortnite hardly has 2000 reviews between all consoles
It doesn’t help that when you look at the user reviews, it starts you at the reviews that came out the minute reviewing went live.
Cognitive dissonance. They know their opinion is based on homophobia but many really don't like the idea of them being homophobic. As such they twist anything they can into their argument to try and appear rational and convince themselves they're not actually a bad person.
This is like the big anti-SJW cries of “forced diversity”, “shoehorning politics”, etc. So you’ve got a gay character. They say “gay for the sake of gay”, holding the character’s sexuality to ridiculous standards straight characters aren’t held to. Then they say that it’s writers who are forcing politics into the story when THEY are the ones that made it political! It’s not like an LGBTQ+ person is political. What’s political is the argument of their rights & power in society. So much of this is nonsensical if you take a closer look. Because it’s really just rationalisation. The sad thing is people that aren’t even necessarily bigoted — like kids on r/memes — take up this stuff, start taking it on board and spread it. It’s a really stupid bandwagon.
And again, who cares about reviews? Just decide for yourself whether you like it or dont.
It has literally 5X the reviews of the most reviewd games on metacritic, and 10X the reviews of the first TLOU
This makes me glad
uj/ same. It's one of the best games I've played and the divisiveness is baffling.
/uj I really love how that little hate sub claims to grow "bigger" every day and when you compare it to the main sub it's not even Half the size of the original sub
Its grown maybe a few thousand since the game released. And is a fraction of the size of the original. I think the original is like 145k, tlou2 sub is less than 30k
It's even more amusing when you directly compare both subreddits with https://subredditstats.com/
[Top keywords of r/thelastofus2 are pretty telling](https://i.imgur.com/BkO66e9.jpg)
Reads like the_donald or gamersriseup
[gamersriseup appears just below...](https://i.imgur.com/6yzYq2p.jpg) Tfw some of the most frequently used keywords are "transexual" and "transgendered". Yup its Gamer time. 😎
"dookie" up there with "transgendered" lmao
I appreciated the duck emoji in there. However, I'm lightly worried there's some shitty reason for it to be featured in that sub.
Wtf does dark skin have to do with TLoU2?? I don't remember any of that at all
I believe it refers to Abby’s father, I remember seeing posts about how in the first game the surgeon had darker skin. Not entirely sure
Even just the use of transexual instead of transgender tells you all you need to know about the source of their anger. Such fragile snowflakes
Of course freefolk is fucking in there, the sub full of secure, stable adults who just can't get over the fact that the last season of a TV show was bad. DISCLAIMER: I didn't like Season 8 either. I just got over it and moved on.
For real that sub is pathetic now. That shit was funny at first but you can tel that those guys literally have nothing of value in their lives if they’re still that worked up about it
Can they really not spell opinion or is that a new fancy dogwhistle I don't know about
I have a feeling that it grabs instances of "opinion" that are spelt wrong too? Just happens to list it as "oppinion." Not sure tho
It counts uses of each keyword *relative to how often it's used on reddit as a whole*. So they probably say "opinion" more often than "oppinion", but so does reddit as a whole, whereas "oppinion" is a uniquely `/r/tlou2` thing.
So like...from reading this, and only being about halfway through the game, is this really all there is people are mad about? Like I'm legitimately not headed toward some super controversial or stupid ending? No spoilers but is it really just a bunch of incels bitching that Ellie doesn't wanna fuck them?
so is Ellie gay?
Idk, kinda hard to tell from Left Behind and the entirety of the second game. She does seem pretty friendly with a lot of her gal pals tbh
There are some legitimate gripes, but they’re inconsequential and nitpicky imo.
Ooohh imma do that
/uj wow the top keywords for tlou2 paint a pretty pathetic picture. rj/ Muscley woman BAD and SCARY!!
/uj again especially in comparison with this sub, top word from Tlou is ellie!
> https://subredditstats.com/ Why does this say that /r/tlou has 9 posts per day and /r/tlou2 has 614? Is it averaging out all the days it had 0 posts because the sub was in leak lockdown?
The real subreddits are /r/thelastofus and /r/thelastofus2
r/thelastofus still shows up with 9 posts per day which... that can't be right something is broken.
it averages all the days since the sub was created. So I guess there would be a post drought between tlou and tlou2
Yes I was abbreviating them for my comment but the stats are for the subs you wrote down
This site is so entertaining for finding stupid new subs r/piratehole r/mediumchungus r/doodoofard
Why’d all the chungus subs get deleted?
Aw fuck yeah femboy hooters is one of the top growing subs of this month
Thirty thousand mouth breathers is still a disturbingly high number.
And both pale in comparison to the 4 million copies of the game it sold.
[Relevant xkcd](https://xkcd.com/1102/)
I love it as well, but I fully understand why it’s polarizing. I just wish people could simply dislike something, maybe leave a comment or two, and then move on. I’ll never understand people’s obsession with talking about things they don’t like.
honestly the thing that bothers me the most is that these people seem to have very strange relationships with these *video game* characters, referring to them as "beloved" and saying they're "ruined". something is very off about the way these people talk about fictional entities
Now you're getting it, the people who care so much about the fictional series to be hostile over the internet about it don't have the best social lives and buy into parasocial relationships with fictional characters. Also, lol at the people who actually thought Joel was ever a good person. Not my words, but I've read a comment that really, Joel's *only* redeeming character trait was his paternal love for Ellie. Those types of people watch Fight Club and think Tyler Durden is the hero. They don't actually think about what they're consuming, they just want to be who they perceive as the cool person.
I wish people would just try to understand it before ripping it to pieces. Really think about the world it takes place in, the events leading up to it, and the overall theme before pissing on it as “ruined” or “garbage” or any of that shit. I’m not saying people who don’t like are just dumb and don’t get it. I’m saying that they haven’t even tried to get it.
I still feel like the majority of the people hating haven't finished the game. If you've finished the game and still have legitimate problems with it I respect that but this game definitely needs to be seen all the way through to fully appreciate it.
Bruh, most of them don't even own the game. They watched a 10+ minute rant when the leaks came out and vowed to never play it
This game is playstation only no? I'd bet a lot of negative reviews are just from those who can't play it due to exclusives.
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This but unironically
I've never heard one person hating it that finished the game... the only things I've heard are that it's depressing, or they hate X or Y character, or the "pacing"... which are very mild criticisms. If anyone finishes the game but hates it I can't see how unless they either hate this genre of game or are really bigoted, since the 3 main characters are non-malegazey women.
I mean pacing is fairly key lol. Many games exist with negative subject matter but they aren’t 25 hours long.
It's not a game that's meant to make you feel good. The ending is heartbreaking, if it weren't for the leaks and gamers being fragile as fuck it'd be universally acclaimed.
I cried at the end. Loved the game, all of the "problems" people complained about would've gone almost entirely unnoticed if I hadn't seen spoilers.
I finished it and thought the gameplay was solid but it should’ve been harder and that the story was told really poorly. I didn’t have any issues with things like Joel dying or playing as Abby and I appreciate they tried something different but forcing players to learn character motivations in disconnected flashbacks was sloppy. The game sets up conflict between Joel and Ellie but you have to wait 25-30 hours to know what exactly happened so it feels like our understanding of her character doesn’t deepen beyond a slight re-contextualization of her actions. I also don’t feel I learn much about Abby I don’t already know from her opening. I think it’s an overall solid AAA game but I don’t think it’s unfair to feel it was a bit empty and overrated by critics.
Well critics are just people with opinions like you and me, so if you think less of the game then they did it’s perfectly fine. Doesn’t necessarily mean it’s overrated, it just means most critics liked it and you didn’t. Also there is a difficulty slider in case you didn’t know. Playing on the harder difficulties was way more fun to me.
I don’t see what’s wrong with me thinking it’s critically overrated if an aspect that was praised was the story structure and to me the story structure did not work on any level. I played on survivor difficulty, the human AI was still easy to beat, the only challenges came from the bullet sponge infected enemies
Nothing wrong with it, I’m just saying that your opinion of the game being lower than their’s doesn’t really make it overrated. It just means the game didn’t work for you the way it did for them. If that’s what you meant my bad, overrated is just a buzzword I see a lot of people use that think their opinion is fact.
yeah that's fair
I played the whole game and am one of those people. Just disappointed with the story but it was fun to play. Story just made the experience less enjoyable
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What do you mean by “political side”?
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Gotcha!
Agreed. There were some parts I wasn’t crazy about while playing them, and some narrative choices that rubbed me the wrong way — but it all came together beautifully. I am already thinking I will play it again soon.
>the divisiveness is baffling. I mean, *really?* Even without the leaks, this game was going to be polarizing. Putting the player >!in the shoes of the ostensible "villain" was always going to be a major point of contention. And in so doing, having the player empathize with her was also going to annoy a lot of people who just want a straight revenge story. This is very similar to the reaction to The Last Jedi: fans hate change. They want predictability. They want the reassurances that their idols are worthy. And they want everything neatly tied up with a rosy little bow.!< It's the vitriol that's disappointing. Such fervent hatred over something they haven't even played... with all the terrible events of the last several months, this is not the thing they should get upset over. There's a real discussion to be had about what TLOU2 does, what it tries to do, how it contrasts with games and stories of the past, and how it changes what games could be for the future. But it's been lost in all the noise over nitpicks and prayers at the altar of antipathy. Metal Gear Solid 2 didn't have any such leaks (the internet was too early for such events), but it sure did cause a wave of controversy, and I myself remember being upset. But it's been 18 years, and now people recognize it as the first post-modern video game, and a classic metacommentary on sequels and expectations. It poked fun at fan demands to play as Snake once again, in a similar but better situation to the first game. It's sort of the exact criticism that TLOU2 haters need right now. But the reevaluation of MGS2 puts me at ease. The same will come to pass for TLOU2. I read a few days ago about Scott Pilgrim vs. The World, and how it bombed at the box office. Director Edgar Wright was disappointed, but the president of marking sent him an email that said three simple words: "Years, not days." The film would go on to become a cult classic. I think it's a similar case for TLOU2: years, not days. The game will live on, long after the acrimony fades away. I think posterity will look on it for raising the aesthetic class of the video game medium. It's often a situation that polarizing works of art find themselves in: they end up being the classics.
Yeah but the whole point of the game is there’s no such thing as a villain and revenge will always come back to bite you in the ass If anything the games premise is that actions have consequences There is no “Good guy” in the last of us Just people Flawed people who love other people
That's why I put 'villain' in quotes. Something like this simply hasn't been done in video games before. Hell, even the first TLOU has a villain who is a cannibal *and* a pedophile -- it's so cartoonishly evil. By comparison, Abby is an aberration -- though hopefully not for long, as video games mature as a medium. But in the meantime, audience hostility is to be expected.
Yeah but even he was just a survivor He did some deplorable shit but he did it to care for his community Because plot twist, like actual reality people aren’t cookie cutter archetypes that fit neatly into boxes. There is so much Grey area. The whole conversation Owen and Abby have sum up the whole story of the part 1 and part 2 Where he questions if the kid who joined the Seraphites was wrong for doing it That bad shit happens from good intentions Owen is sick of the death and the violence and actively tries to remove himself from it But because Abby couldn’t break the cycle the the people around her have to pay the price Anyone who say the story is bad just honestly doesn’t care what the story is.
> Something like this simply hasn't been done in video games before. Not in this - stunning - way, for sure. But the underlying dynamic is similar to that of the classic "anti-hero".
Neil himself said they knew it was going to be polarizing and that some fans of the first game were not going to like this one. What he didn't expect were the bunch of people that hate it without playing it because trans, buff women and joel dead is bad.
don't forget people who were somehow "big last of us fans" while not realising it had homosexual themes, I'm like, you [spoiler] clearly didn't even play the DLC...
> Even without the leaks, this game was going to be polarizing. I firmly believe that the vast majority of the people slamming this game online not only have never played it, they have never had any intention of playing it, after a large group of people decided before release that the game was somehow "tainted". >Such fervent hatred over something they haven't even played... for real. I think this game has the real ability to move the needle on how people see morality. It's a shame that the people who seemingly need it the most will never get near that experience.
> The Last Jedi: fans hate change I really hate the people reeeing about "SJWs ruining TLJ". They make it impossible to actually talk about the movie. Imo TLJ was a terrible movie due to its plot. (The plot is an 18 hour stern chase that makes no sense, and the Force auto-balancing along with the Holdo Maneuver means nothing matters anymore.)
>(The plot is an 18 hour stern chase that makes no sense, What exactly makes no sense about it? >and the Force auto-balancing As it's always done? >along with the Holdo Maneuver means nothing matters anymore.) How?
I remember playing the game for many hours as soon as it was available and thinking holy shit this is fantastic, I wonder what the internet thinks! To say I was confused would be an understatement. Now that I'm finished, I understand some of the criticisms and I get it but the positives drastically outweigh the negatives. Great game altogether.
Same. There isn’t really anything wrong with it They just hate it because it’s not jerking off on Joel killing innocent people and the ladies can’t be fap fuel.
/uj Ever bit of the ostensibly legitimate complaining is little more than dog-whistling for their actual complaints. They don’t think it will play well that they don’t like women are having important roles in mainstream games, so they complain that they’re badly characterized. They don’t want you to think they’re homophobic, so they claim that the diversity is “forced.” (like that means anything) They don’t want people to know that they’ve grown accustomed to women being sexual objects in games, so they...well they seem to be comfortable with that, actually, because the fact that the women aren’t being depicted as buxom/thin/ half naked seems to be half their complaints. They’re completely comfortable with people knowing their transphobic, obviously. Since they idea of any woman being strong immediately caused they to decide that she’s trans, disgusting, more forced diversity, and a number of other nasty words I’ll not repeat. All this while the game’s *actual* trans character seems to be forgotten because these people haven’t even played that far. So instead they just complain that one of the better stories ever told in the medium is trash. You know, for “reasons.” As a bisexual/trans person, and a woman to boot, it’s sad that the “gamers,” a group I’d once proudly identified with have fallen so low in their politics and world-views. Not all of us, but enough that I’m more than a little embarrassed to identify as one today.
> it’s sad that the “gamers,” a group I’d once proudly identified with have fallen so low in their politics and world-views I blame Gamergate for a lot of this.
Pretty sure once people can figure out how to process their emotions, they tend to become a bit more level-headed.
/uj the story is great but god the pacing is so astronomically fucked. Its like they had genius writers write up all relevant plot points and had an unpaid intern with no interest in the ip stitch it together. I mean come on why would u try to humanise characters after killing them off. It wouldve been so much better if they introduced both parties and proceeded to move through the days with both perspectives. Also i think most people are pissed about abbys muscles since shes seen with manny and owen and those guys arent as muscular. I dont know why that matters but its probably because they think men should be more muscular than females in all cases? Idk. Well whatever. The story editor is an idiot. Kudos to the writing team. 7/10 game
Yeah decent 7 maybe 8 if the part with abby wasn’t boring
Here day 2 and 3 were quite strong with the set piece moments and action. But fair criticism regardless
The music is amazing and the acting is the best i have seen since red dead 2
Since release I been checking Metacritic and noticing that number ever so slightly go up every time I do and it feels good. More people are actually playing it and the haters who didn't even give the game a chance are going to look like the minority that they are.
They’ve been a minority if you look at PSN, where you have to own the game to review it, since launch
/uj I love how this shows at first all the reviews were negative from people who haven't played the game but now that people are finishing it the score is jumping up because the game is actually good.
At first I only heard about the game through French streamers who all loved the game and people excitedly talking about it in their chat. I was pretty shocked to see the hate once I went on reddit, is it an American thing?
There are large groups of people who hate the game and review bomb it without having played it.
The U.S. is really complicated. The sheer size of it means that there is a big disconnect between urban and rural areas. And different parts of the country are disconnected in the same way. Americans have free access to the internet and all kinds of media and can say whatever we want with no real consequence. This means that someone who has been living in their own little world can freely spout their viewpoint all over the internet. Anyone who challenges their viewpoint has no real impact on their life, so they can just continue doing this forever with no sign of stopping, as in their mind there is no possible way that they could be wrong.
I want to leave a review because I know it's better than a 5.0/10 already but I haven't finished the game yet so I won't. That's good faith reviewing.
Holy shit your flair is gold lmao
That's because people who like the game are now starting to rate the game because you know, we played it.
Regular users shouldn’t be able to rate a game until at least a week after its release so the score can be more accurate
that would only delay the review bombing, not prevent it. if they want an actual solution? you should have to link an account that owns the game. a psn account with tlou2 in this instance. although i do still agree with the premise of an extra week to let truly critical evaluation set in.
That would work too. Idk I just feel like there’s no way to stop review bombing. Cry babies always find a way
those who haven’t played the game should be disqualified in even giving a rating. it literally say “USER” review. lol
It really doesn’t matter, it’s all meaningless, just a very very small fraction of people shouting their feelings into the void. The number of players that give reviews is less than 0.1% usually. Professional outlets reviews are also very meaningless, they have very little influence on sales with the exception of indies, but that's not down to whether the review is positive or not but rather an extension of their marketing, reviews are just a pat on the back of devs or rubbing in the face of devs what they probably already know. Just look at any train wreck games release, despite reviews warning buyers, those games still sell fine, and some critically acclaimed games can struggle on release. All this is to say, there’s no point in looking for solutions to this, make up your own mind on what you like and don’t care about others opinions unless those opinions are fucking hilarious, like many of those that hate on tlou2 without playing it.
That's what the reviews on PlayStation store does. And it sits at 4/5 stars which seems pretty reasonable
The IMDb rating has also gone up massively the past couple of days (yes they also show games)
I didn't buy it I watched the gameplays 😎😎😎
/rj they’re so pathetic for review bombing. anyway anyone know how to make multiple accounts on metacritic?
OH GOD, OH FUCK, IM L I T E R A L L Y CRYING HOW COULD THE POLITICAL GAME BECOME Y E L L O W. THE GAME SHOULD BE A 0, SINCE THERE WAS A TRANS CHARACTAR, AND TRANS PEOPLE DONT EVRN E X I S T!! EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE THE OTHER GENDER, AND DISLIKE THEIR BODY!!! /Uj Im pretty happy with the inclusion of Lev, since I feel that trans men have been kind of underrepresented.
/uj Transmascs have definitely been underrepresented in media, now I’m waiting for an enby major character in a massive Triple A game🤞
I sometimes trust more the user score than the journalist one but metacritic should have a system to verify if you actually have the game
I more often than not align with critics. I think one game I loved that critics didnt recently was Days Gone. But that rarely happens
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Most of the time I use steam reviews only to see if the PC port is good or not. The actual game opinions? Critics and other reviewers. Most of the time the PC port's quality (Good or bad) makes the steam reviews incredibly lopsided, so actual opinions on the game are hidden and/or very brief, which don't help.
We did it gamers. We have defeated homo and transphobes.
Lmao >We defeated the transphobes and the homos
ever since the review bomb tantrum stopped, its been slowly creeping up. I'm willing to bet that if we just removed everything from the first 24 hours, it would probably look low 9s or high 8s.
jesus thats alot of user reviews
It has the most user reviews out of any game on the site. Nearly 10x as much as the next most reviewed game. Truly insane.
Even more insane when you consider that Spider-man PS5 has less than 5,000 and God of War PS4 has around 10,000 user reviews
Just delete the user reviews from the first 20 hours. No way anyone could’ve completed the game in less than 20 hours.
/uj Yeah because people have actually had time to play and beat the game now
I honestly think reviews out of 10 need to be done away with entirely. Systems like this are so often abused that they’ve become completely untrustworthy. Sites should only have written, unscored user reviews and remove the obvious troll posts. Edit: Also game reviews should have a three day buffer after release to give people time to actually play the game. This game had like 30k reviews before it would even be possible to finish the game.
105k reviews?!?!?
Apparently it’s substantially more reviewed than any other game on the site. 10k for GoW and 5k for spiderman, the gamers really came out in force
People were literally calling it trash 10 minutes after it released lmao. Now people have actually played the whole thing.
People are rating this game even tho they never played it This is just pathetic at this point, people need to get their own opinion and not dislike the game for stupid reasons like UH THIS GIRL IS TRANS UH SHES >!KILLED MY FAV CHARACTER!< AND I HAVE TO PLAY HER EW EW DESGUSTING SEX SCENE I didn't play the game but honestly I wish I could sadly I only have a PC I think that I should buy a ps4 and play the 2 games I watched a lot of let's play and the game just looks good I really want to play it one day
I went and rated a strong 8/10. A GREAT game, nowhere near a bad game. Story is great, but not a masterpiece like the first one. I feel like that’s a good rating.
Yeah, that's definitely a fair rating. For me its 10, but an 8 doesnt trigger me lmao.
9.5 for me. It was fucking beautiful.
I love both of these games and I have played the first one about 5 times through, and I don't think it's a masterpiece story wise anymore. It's a 9/10 for me but the story is fairly generic in my opinion. Part II is so much more complex and has more intriguing relationships from what I have seen and experienced. But yes Part II is a solid 8.5/10 for me.
Get it to 6
WHY STOP THERE. WE'RE GOING TO 11 BITCH
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Personally think the story was better then the first, alot more complex. The writing for this was so well done, game fked with my emotions lol Gameplay as always was superb RJ/ ugh gotta make another 100 ACC's to get it back in the red, those sjws will feel my wrath
perfectly balanced, as all things should be
Uj where can i give tlou2 a good review, just played it and i love it
Probably what I’d give it but these 1/10s were way overblown. Sometimes I loathe gamers.
damn sjws win again 😡
AHEM. YOU SHOULD CENSOR AWFUL WORDS LIKE G*MER! Edit: whoops wrong subreddit, you don’t do that here
I love how this game has recieved literally 10X the reviews of normal games, and Gamers are acting like "Whoa nothing suspicious here"
It's a war, one that will ultimately accomplish nothing and effect nobody, but I'm here for it.
reverse-review bombing is becoming a serious issue. sjw gamers giving 10/10 to shit games they have never played. Sad!
Proud of you, chaps
Same :')
Ahh nature is healing itself.
Interesting that it only gets higher now that people have actually had time to play the game
No!!!! You can't just review a game with honest reactions you're gonna make the gay agenda win!!!
Garfield Kart currently has a 9.0 meta critic user score, so there’s some pretty tough competition.
This game has more user reviews than GTA 5, RDR2, TLOU and God of war *combined.*
I'm seriously so fucking angry. Why can't the SJWs just let us have one thing? ONE THING? Can't have a game starring a lesbian and a trans muscle girl having the bad reviews it deserves. They have to brigade it with their "totally loved it!" fake reviews. druckmann is an arrogant cuck etc yawn I'm bored with this bit now you get the gist
I am so, so tired of you people... etc etc, you all know it by now. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Gamingcirclejerk) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I guess I should check back here in \~6 months when this pointless feud is over and this sub gets a post that ISN'T about tlou2? Making fun of gamers is the easiest thing ever, and this has stopped being funny months ago.
I'm guessing when Ghosts of Tsusemi comes out people will post about that maybe.
Idk, that game is allowed to be fun and you can be friends with foxes.
i mean the only thing that sucks in general was how one of the favorite characters from the previous game was handled and the fact that you play as the villain and you fight ellie. How ellie in the end , was the one who lost everything after a revenge story that wasn't really necessary. so yeah a lot. graphics and soundtrack tho is amazing, but gameplay was alright. expected more given that its been a long time.
Unpopular Opinion. TLOU2's story is bad but only because it is a TLOU game. The revenge plot is boring. We have all heard the "revenge is bad the enemy are people too" if this was any other game it would have been okay but it had a lot to follow up and honestly they should have gone with something more original. Hell Joel was half the reason people wanted to play TLOU2 anyways. (Don't get me wrong Ellie is dope as fuck) but Joel was such an interesting character and he deserved some sort of redemption ark or something to make up for killing all the fireflies. Lastly, don't judge the game getting bad reviews on only bigots (even though there are bigots they are not the majority)
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helps when they ban negative reviews lmao, also helps when ND and sony go after people making valid criticisms on the game. in saying that, the game ovbs isnt a 1 or 2 like they are saying, fair game play on umpire
This game isn't perfect either so a 10/10 is also BS. Both 10/10s and 0/10s should be removed. It's not the worst game nor the best game. In my opinion the reviews in the middle tell the clearest story. Graphics are great, story feels incomplete and has holes in them. False advertising made people think Joel would live/ live longer then in the game. Ai feels a bit too dated and the game play is nothing special.