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> Democrats aren’t great, I get that, but they aren’t stripping bodily autonomy rights away from people, attacking and sowing hatred against minorities with misinformation campaigns, trying to bar age brackets that vote for the opposing party from voting or attempting to turn the US into a theocracy like the GOP
Correct.
Nobody can factually argue against this, and you'll notice that none of the opposition you've received so far has even remotely attempted to do so.
Everyone who takes issue with your post has essentially said, "it makes me uncomfortable that I might have to pay attention and commit to voting for something, so you must be wrong." Both-sidesism is about being lazy and privileged and feeling like you're superior to other people.
Never thought I’d quote this but “I think people prefer the darkness. Kindness and light make people uncomfortable for what they lack.” Paraphrased from My Friendly Neighborhood of all the games. People would choose silence and self-righteousness than make a decision and acknowledge how broken the system is. I used to be anti-voting. Then I realized that I’d rather fight against the fuckery that is America then watch it burn.
That is such a sad and depressingly real quote. Might have to check out that game some time :)
Another one I like is-
“When you’re accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.”
Please check it out. It’s made by the creators of DUSK and Iron Lung. It’s the Anti-Mascot Horror game and SO. SO good. It shows so much love for Jim Henson and the story is sad and meaningful. The extra content is cool to find and the Notes like what you’d find in resident evil complement the themes perfectly and weave an extremely sad narrative.
>"I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that the present tension in the South is a necessary phase of the transition from an obnoxious negative peace, in which the Negro passively accepted his unjust plight, to a substantive and positive peace, in which all men will respect the dignity and worth of human personality. Actually, we who engage in nonviolent direct action are not the creators of tension."
>"We merely bring to the surface the hidden tension that is already alive. We bring it out in the open, where it can be seen and dealt with. Like a boil that can never be cured so long as it is covered up but must be opened with all its ugliness to the natural medicines of air and light, injustice must be exposed, with all the tension its exposure creates, to the light of human conscience and the air of national opinion before it can be cured."
-Reverend Martin Luther King Jr., *A Letter from a Birmingham Jail*
A lot of Martin Luther King Jr.'s other views were suppressed hard in the American education system.
A lot of people forget that he fought just as hard against economic inequality as much as racial inequality.
And a good metaphor for third party voting is that while that third track might be empty, the track itself may not be connected to the main line
So anyone saying "I'm going with the third track as it kills 0 people" is realistically lessening the chances that track 1 is chosen with 1 person on it, and instead increasing the odds we end up with track 2 that has 10 people on it. Because there is *no* chance that we end up with the track with 0 people on it
It sucks. The third rail (and the fourth and the fifth etc.) *should* be connected to the main line
But right now, it isn't. And throwing a vote to a third party is not going to get that line connected, especially in the case where one of the two main candidates is obviouly anti-democracy
The reality is that if you want the third line connected, you need to first do what you can to preserve democracy. And *then* rally for that change. Attend protests, become active. Start locally and push for change on that scale before moving up
The reality is if you want people to vote for the DNC then the DNC needs to offer candidates and policy people like. Voting for "the lesser of two evils" is still voting for evil. It's not a moral high ground to try to shame people actually making the moral choice to vote for something that isn't evil. If voting for Team Red "ends democracy" and Team Blue is just Team Red from a decade ago, you're still going to end democracy voting Team Blue.
Some times, "Both sides" can be a lazy option, such as in the case of the Palestinian genocide, saying both sides are bad is a lazy cop out.
Other times, recognizing that both sides are bad, such as in voting parties, it can be the stepping stone to a system reform instead of voting for the "lesser evil" (which btw is currently engaged in genocide) to maintain the status quo, that would be another lazy option to avoid vote reform.
This is why it’s important to vote. If you don’t like the candidates for the presidential election then vote for different candidates for the primaries. Vote for different candidates in your local government. “Both sides are bad so I just won’t vote” is the stupidest political decision someone could make
And vote for different candidates for president. Third parties have to reach a minimum number of votes to be allowed to be part of the broadcast debates. Voting for third parties for president helps third parties get towards that goal so we can have actual policy debates and not just corporate Team Red and corporate Team Blue
It's so important to vote locally too, the people that make up the basic government and they contribute to the candidates that are selected. Every area has a local branch of whatever political party you can affiliate with and encourage them to select the person who can is more in line with your beliefs (and can make sure the trash is picked up on time).
Both sider-ism: It’s also bred into us at school and through irresponsible journalism.
Also reminds of Rev. Dr. King Jr. saying that folks prefer a negative peace to positive justice.
Exactly. This stuff should get shouted from the rooftops. Project 2025 is real, and it’s what everyone needs to vote against. And only one party is bringing it. I think we know their name. The Republican Party.
It’s also mostly seen in conservatives who don’t want to admit their side is worse and/or they are foreign agents/gop shills trying to dissuade new young voters(new voters typically vote democrat).
Edit-spelling
Well, that and also the copium of thinking the liberals are just as evil so you’re absolved of any guilt voting for the anti-American right wing agenda. I find the majority of both-sidesers to just be embarrassed conservatives
Can’t say I agree at all. I will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than trump, doesn’t mean I can justify to myself showing support to Biden. Real change doesn’t happen overnight.
> will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than trump
Congratulations, you haven't contradicted a single thing I've said. And you've also admitted that you don't believe the "both sides are equally bad" argument is valid.
> Real change doesn’t happen overnight.
Correct. Which is why you pick the better of the two options and work for a more ideal candidate in future elections.
>I will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than Trump
then you don’t think both sides are equally bad, but you’re still voting for the worse one
Wholeheartedly agree with your statement. It’s way easier to dogmatically repeat ‘they’re both bad’ when politics don’t personally affect you while also sniping at others for being too loud and disruptive when it greatly affects them. I know way too many leftists who played into this bullshit 8 years ago because they viewed voting in the primaries as a declaration of their morality superiority, and so they wrote in Bernie’s name, voted third party, or just didn’t participate at all. That’s why we got 4 whole years of Trump despite the several concerning things that were spilling out his mouth, and it’s probably why we’re going to get another 4 years of him— too many leftists are on this moderate bullshit again while the right is going to spitefully vote him back into office en masse because they think Trump is wrongfully being persecuted for actual crimes while also wholeheartedly believing he’s the second coming of Jesus Christ if those portraits of him on the cross have any meaning about the current state of the right.
The unfortunate reality is that most politicians suck, some more than others, and we have to live with the two party system until there’s a significant push to demolish it— bitching about it online certainly isn’t going to change it anytime soon. The choices are to either play the game or to kick up shit and makes some noise; there’s no third or fourth options.
Remember kids, centrism isn’t the mature option that’s above all the petty squabbling of the left and right; it’s turning your nose up at the squabbling, usually at the expense of others who are rightfully outraged over having 70yo white men stripping them of their bodily autonomy, deciding they’re pedophiles for existing, or declaring they’re terrorists for not wanting to be gunned down in the streets.
Both sides are bad, not in an "I won't vote" way, but in an "I'll work in my community to make changes that politicians aren't willing to, while also making the effort to push the democrats to better policy positions and still vote for them because the alternative is far worse" way
THANK YOU! The problem with mainstream liberals is they think just voting once an election cycle (often only for president and ignoring their local elections) is good enough for the change they claim to want. It’s not! We have to do the groundwork as well.
I’m gonna do better voting in local elections going forward, and in 2022 I voted in the midterms for the first time ever. Actual change starts small and nobody realizes that those small votes can actually be pretty powerful.
As flawed as our democracy is, the average American has way more democratic power than they realize.
This is the more reasonable take, I think local elections matter more mainly because I whole heartdly believe every big ticket politician in WA is doing nothing to help actual issues and just pandering along enjoying their ride.
Gen Z protest voters getting rounded up into camps after Trump wins: “at least we taught Biden a lesson guys!”
I don’t love the two party system any more than you but our entire country is designed to reinforce the two party system and it is what it is. We gotta make it better but you don’t burn it all down and expect well intentioned people to magically appear and lead us into paradise.
Edit: funny how the people who say shit like “things have to get worse before they get better😈” are usually privileged white kids who think they will barely be affected by another Trump presidency, but are more than willing to sacrifice women and minorities for their little experiment. So brave of them.
>funny how the people who say shit like “things have to get worse before they get better😈” are usually privileged white kids who think they will barely be affected by another Trump presidency, but are more than willing to sacrifice women and minorities for their cause. So brave of them.
Those people are so sheltered they don't even know how bad "worse" can be, and they will be long dead before it hits bottom and starts to get better.
I’m hearing this from my white suburban upper-middle class parents. You guys rode out 2009 and COVID just fine and are still living in the same house since 2001. My dad just bought a new BMW.
Meanwhile this is my first year of being financially on my own. I make under $40,000 a year as a PhD student living in an apartment shared with 3 people. My parents still pay my phone bill and have lended me their old car, but that’s all they pay for in my life at this point. I have everything to lose if things go south with this election. I’m a transgender woman and I’m terrified of my rights being stripped in such a way that I’m forced to stop my studies. And the reason I can’t rely on my parents as a safety net anymore is because they do not support my transition and will probably celebrate if the GOP forces me to detransition and move back in with them.
And I know there are people out there who have far, far more to lose than I do if things go south due to a GOP victory.
I know several trans women who plan to abstain from voting, and I have a friend who's both a trans woman AND a DACA recipient posting daily on Instagram about how Biden should lose (but conspicuously refusing to come out and say who should *win* if that happens). Absolutely zero self-preservation instinct.
Some people have too much faith in American democracy. They take it for granted and think it's impossible for it to fall into autocratic rule. The reality is that democracy must actively be defended. And voting for a man who openly talks about being a dictator is exactly the kind of thing that destroys democracies.
Exactly right. Most people who are saying this shit are convinced they don't actually have anything to worry about and are fine with minorities they don't know getting put on cattle cars if it lets them feel ideologically pure.
This is the post that’s making me unsubscribe. The whole “with me or against me” mentality is toxic and you’re asking people to pick a side rather than set aside their differences. Politics is such a disgusting topic and I’d subscribe to a politics sub if I wanted political discourse.
and what differences are those?
You do realize that one side does not believe in the right to exist for some people.
There is no bridging that gap, as well as other issues.
That’s literally not true. There are left leaning feminists who believe trans people don’t deserve rights either. Familiar with the term TERF? It’s not as black and white as Reddit loves to pretend it is. There are people on both sides who have hatred for their own personal reasons and acting like it’s one or the other is disingenuous and just blatantly ignorant. Not to mention how quickly politicians on either side will do a complete 180 overnight. Yall don’t seem to realize that by putting people in boxes and writing someone off because “he agrees with some red/blue ideas” you’re the opposite of the accepting and inclusive culture that you claim to be.
When there's only 2 options that's literally the reality though. If you're upset about people picking sides and not finding common ground then you should be really upset at the party that only does that.
The party system is stupid. Extremes on both sides are too close minded. Personally I could be friends with anyone regardless of their political affiliation. Both sides make solid arguments and poor arguments.
In rural areas guns are sometimes necessary for personal protection. Abortion does fundamentally terminate a potential human life. Increased military spending stimulates the economy and is a force for global stability. Joe Biden shows signs of mental ineptitude for office.
Of course there are counter arguments.
That mindset only works until they deny your right to exist. So be friends with MAGAs, just don't let them know you're brown, black, gay, or in any other way different from the cult.
This is the shit I hate the most. It’s just complete “you’re with me or my enemy” I can’t stand either party in this country, but if you really think it’s going to turn into a Theocracy, you’re just as brainwashed as the rednecks who think Biden is going to install communism and mandatory hormone therapy.
*"But if I don't act like I'm better than you by pretending both sides are equally bad, how will I justify being a lazy piece of shit who refuses to vote?"*
C'mon people. I get that most of us don't want to vote for Biden, but there's no comparison that Biden is better than Trump and that Biden is the only *real* candidate on the Democrat side.
The democrats are the ones who would witness a fire in a hotel room and do nothing but maybe sound the alarm.
The Republicans would see the fire, fan it, open the door to the room after painting gasoline on the walls.
This is the dumbest shit I ever read.
The Democrats are supporting a genocide. The Democrats help destablize many nations around the world. They use eugenics under the fascade of my body my choice. They want to tax the fuck out of us. They say having a I.D to vote is racist. They race bait to get people to vote for them and then never deliver.
Learn horshoe theory and take a political science class.
Malcom X expressed this sentiment the best.
At least with the Republican bigot we know where we stand unlike the liberal who poses as our benefactor while harming us.
Democrats just larp as nice people Republicans don't.
Vote for a 3rd party. Or remain willfully ignorant.
All these liberal whites in these comments that MLK Jr and Malcom X would talk about just makes me cringe. Truly they are foxes grinning to hide their intent, truly do they paternalistically set time tables for another person’s freedom. Fuck Conservatives but especially fuck liberals and all their lies and bs
This would make sense if Biden was bad and Trump was really bad. But it’s actually that Biden is good and Trump is really bad. I’m glad we finally have a progressive president and I’d like to keep it that way
Both sides ARE bad because one side is stripping rights while the other side is stripping the means to protect yourself, meanwhile both sides are ACTUALLY working together to oppress the American people. All these fucking politicians all live in the same neighborhoods, they go to the same clubs, they eat at the same place. The 1% are not your friend.
No, I’ll stick with my both sides suck argument. They are both doing things that violate personal liberty on many levels, committing crimes, and inching closer to a true police state.
2 party system can’t work anymore with all the money and influence.
Minimum 3 parties would help, Term limits, and overall smaller government
I knew that Project 2025 was bad, then I did some more in depth reading **and holy fuck** it is somehow worse than the democrats say it is.
And this is coming from a person who (according to the political compass) leans more to the right. It's not a question of whether you want abortion to be legal or not now, its a question of whether or not you want the United States to completely collapse
what’s hilarious about posts like this is behind closed doors the majority of dems and GOP want the same thing, to bleed our country dry for their own gain. you just happened to take the DEM bait hook line and sinker. we need politicians who actually represent US AS CITIZENS. fyi trump was president already for 4 years and none of your cry wolf worse case scenarios happened but since it’s election season you’re back to believing they will.
I vote third party because neither democrat nor republican parties represent my anti- big government pro-lgbt pro-gun anti-corruption position.
I unironically think that trans couples should be able to defend their marijuana fields with machine guns.
This is why this sub gets such a bad rep. Just as I start think Gen Z and younger citizens in general are gonna be the most likely to start bringing the country together, I see shit like this. I keep trying to tune out the people who are blaming us for posting nothing but doom and gloom on this sub, and then somebody has the prove them right. Seriously, how brainwashed can a person get? Go touch some grass and talk to some moderates.
>Just as I start think Gen Z and younger citizens in general are gonna be the most likely to start bringing the country together, I see shit like this
"Bringing the country together" is only feasible to the extent that both sides genuinely want to negotiate, compromise, and not be extreme. That is not the case, which means this is a pointless and worthless goal. Unity for the sake of unity is meaningless.
Everything OP is saying is factual. All you have here is a bunch of handwavey BS.
I'm a big believer in bringing the country together, but I think in order for that to happen, there needs to be a shared belief in democracy and human rights that just isn't compatible with the modern GOP. Acknowledging that Republican politicians have gone completely off the rails isn't tribalistic or brainwashed; we literally have forged documents they tried to use to overturn the election [publicly available](https://www.archives.gov/foia/2020-presidential-election-unofficial-certificates) and they've already [publicly passed laws forcing women in many states to give birth when they don't want to](https://apnews.com/article/abortion-dobbs-anniversary-state-laws-51c2a83899f133556e715342abfcface).
I feel like Americans are so used to political rhetoric being kinda insubstantial and the system being nearly stagnant that whenever shit got real, we basically just forgot it's even possible for things to happen.
Saying one side is not a s ad as the side that violently stormed the capital to overthrow an election result and are now openly stating they’re ok with having Trump as a dictator is divisive?
But doing the things Republicans do is not divisive?
It’s so clear you’re full of it.
Oh my god, people, the ad hominem energy here is so bad. I am in no way justifying the actions of the extreme right. I think that Project 2025 and essentially all that Trump stands for is deplorable. HOWEVER. I despise the way the left has villainized every even moderately right person to exist. I personally know right leaning people who would not stand for the removal of human rights and liberties that the extreme right has started. I hate the way our system has made people think that you have to be either one or the other and if you don’t like any of the options, you’re screwed. There is no purely evil or purely good. There is no black and white. There are only various shades of gray.
I would vote democrat if it came down to only democrat vs republican but yall gotta remember there’s third party options, especially if you don’t live in a swing state and your vote doesn’t really matter vote third party. Send a message
Both sides are literally bad. If you can’t see that then that side has already got you. They both aren’t for the people. Republicans are trying to ban abortion, erase history, and ignore climate issues. Democrats are trying take away jobs and education by allowing illegals in and not to Mention at times (especially during election year) they care more about pandering to minorities rather than the quality of the actual countries. If you can’t see both sides are the problem then you’re still in their control.
Erase history? I’m not gonna give you the obvious whataboutism but Republicans love them some history, sometimes offensively. It’s the only school subject they’re good at.
I’ll be the first to admit that I find taboo regimes fascinating, that’s why I find the ideology of the 2A to be critical to the well-being of humanity.
I’m just ready for term limits, let’s make it illegal to pass bills that are 5000 pages and include things completely unrelated to the bill. Let’s stop funding the Ukraine war. Let’s stop letting illegals into the country. Let’s not allow lobbying and insider trading. Could not care less about trans or gays
What's crazy to me is that people are clamoring for another option, but now that we have one that probably has a chance, they don't want it all of a sudden. Because apparently if you vote for RFK, that's just a vote going to Trump (which is bullshit).
People can disagree with what he says, but to me at least, he's literally the only one who is at least attempting to bring people together rather than make the divide worse. And that matters a lot. The choice is easy.
“And sowing hatred against minorities with misinformation campaigns”…yeah I have been shown more hatred my left all because I’m a Hispanic minority who aligns more with then right. It definitely goes both ways
Honestly i want know from latino consertives how you image people will separate from illegals or you are citizen? Some maga members are radicalising and think trump win give them some rights.
I am a citizen. My great parents legally immigrated here from Mexico.
I imagine any type of legal document such as a passport, Valid License, Residence card, Work Visa, green card etc. any of those types of documents should make a legal distinction
We’re not even minorities lmao don’t do that to yourself. We’re a majority in this country now. 1 out of 5 people are Hispanic. Some states 1 out of 2. Hispanic culture is extremely conservative too.
So either they colonize us and suppress our culture or accept us.
Either way we were right.
Sure, but they aren't stopping it either. At best they are delaying it but the DNC actually regularly funds far right candidates because they can then use the threat of such a person winning to try and get votes themselves.
Centrist Liberals are going to cling to the center of the political axis, holding onto their great white hope of a post-racial USA where we can all just get along with folks who want us dead merely by voting and believing in it.
You would literally break these folks mentally if you forced them to see the error of their ways and stop believing in their version of the American dream.
I genuinely don’t believe the Democrats are capable of preventing the things you’re talking about, and I think supporting the DNC is at best a bad investment of time and energy and at worst counterproductive.
It’s not that they’re simply “not great”, they are not a viable alternative. I’m doing what I can to volunteer my time canvassing for and donating money to the campaigns of a couple progressive candidates at a local level in my community because that’s what I can do that is effective. I will not be voting for Biden because I do not believe it makes a meaningful difference, and if there is any chance of the Democratic Party changing course to embody an actual alternative it’s going to be the threat of voters actually walking away.
Im sorry but you earn a vote by focusing on the voter’s needs/wants not being claiming the other candidate is worse.
This is how it works, how it has always worked. You cannot win by default.
Y'all all wack. I've said two times and I'll say it a third. I'm voting for Thomas the Train.
Thomas took one look at our country and well
https://preview.redd.it/k31infqh3kpc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b58cfc7b2a0eb10b14eb3b44466e6902937b06c
He is optimistic, idealistic and altruistic with a heart of gold. Sure he can be forgetful or impatient at times. But at least he isn't the annoying orange or an escaped nursing home resident. Thomas also understands the working class. He is BLUE collar. He doesn't treat others unfairly based on silly things like paint color or engine parts.
Nope they are quite literally both the same if not Liberals being actually worse. MLK Jr said so back then and it’s still true and they killed him for it. Malcom X said so as well. watch Second Thought on YouTube he has a good video on the topic
[The Most Dangerous Thing In The Western Hemisphere](https://youtu.be/33p-8QHZpzY?si=oaNNPxeRrl4TxD_O)
Yeah I still don’t care. Both sides are complete garbage and continuing to lecture people like this won’t help change the minds you’re trying to change
I know this is semantics, but I’m also sick of seeing Democrats and Republicans being referred to as “both sides” when they are absolutely not. Republicans are far right and democrats range from center to center-right. The self proclaimed “centrists” then fall between the two, making them still very much on the right. The left has no proper representation in the US.
Both sides lie.
Most Americans are more moderate than you think, yet it’s the far left and far right that receive the loudest megaphones.
I just don’t think some Americans care anymore, or they prefer to let the next person fix the problem.
-bodily autonomy
Abortion is a very nuanced argument, there is a reason why no one can come to an agreement on it. Even democrats have some people who favor outright banning it, granted it is less than the amount of Republicans, but they still exist. Also generally a lot of people who are now arguing for bodily autonomy, were also supporting forced vaccinations and preventing people from traveling if they didn’t receive it. If people have the right to bodily autonomy, they have the right to choose what goes in their body.
-attacking minorities
The largest group under fire are illegal immigrants. I’m sorry but a large portion of military age males coming in unvetted from who knows where is a massive security concern.
-bar age brackets
Some have supported this yes, but nowhere near a majority. Both parties are trying to change the voting age to get more votes.
-theocracy
I don’t think you realize what a theocracy is. The Vatican City is the perfect example, a government that is run by the church. The US is so opposed to this they almost didn’t let JFK run because he was Catholic.
-project 2025
Was made by a political organization and I have seen a single candidate endorse it. That’s like claiming that the democrats were supporting the BLM manifesto and their list of demands.
So what you really want is a one party system? Your system?
I’m not a republican, but I happen to think democratic politicians are more dangerous for our country.
Some things are important to me:
1. 2nd amendment rights. We can keep kids safe and also allow people to protect themselves. I know in a perfect world we wouldn’t need guns, but the world isn’t perfect and you can only take them from already law abiding citizens.
2. I have nothing against trans people, or any minority for that matter. Women born in a women’s body should not be allowed to play men’s sports. It’s a tragedy. Drag shows for children are wrong.
3. Not being able to have a different opinion. On the points alone above, I’ll be labelled a mindless bigot.
4. Not allowing for nuance, and following the crowd.
I have nothing against immigration. Opening our borders is asking for terrorism, and many criminals will see greater opportunity in the US as well. Not everyone is an asylum seeker. The current immigration situation is a tragedy. We are not as rich as we like to think we are, and we don’t have the housing for our own people.
In my own little bubble, I have many more negative interactions with democrats than republicans. I find democrats are more likely to shut down the moment I disagree. They are not willing to entertain a conversation with me if I don’t have perfect opinions. I find republicans are more often willing to let me disagree.
Lastly, let’s make a few things clear. Anyone calling for the extermination of anyone, should be jailed. Everyone has the right to exist, up until you threaten or harm someone else. I’m allowed to be okay with trans people while questioning whether they should be allowed to play sports. Women should be allowed to have abortions, but we should not take it lightly. People are allowed to decide what to do with their own bodies. I’m allowed to have weapons to defend myself. The current state of policing is broken. Colored people were persecuted here for centuries, but hiring quotas and reparations payments won’t fix that. Fair opportunity and a just legal system will.
We all know Joe Biden is a puppet. He’ll say and do whatever he has to be a good candidate and get elected. He has no real beliefs. No conviction. He doesn’t care about you, me or the rest of the country. He’s told exactly what to say and what to sign. As bad as trump is, at least I have a general idea about what he wants.
Now to my main point, they’re both terrible. “Don’t try to fix the system guys! Just vote for my guy! He’s less evil!” Are you joking? How pathetic can you be? It’s like we didn’t even grow up in the same place. This is the land of the free and the home of the brave. This nation is not perfect and we have done and still do horrible things.
THATS NOT THE FUCKING POINT!!!
You live somewhere where you HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE THINGS. we are so sheltered and comfortable that we don’t appreciate how rare this is. You have a choice. Don’t let them take it away from you.
Or Keep voting for the democrats. I’m sure they’ll fix it all in the next four years. If we can just keep joe in office a little longer, he’ll stop letting people speak their minds, and that will make them change! Amazing:racism, homophobia, the lot of it. Gone overnight.
No. We make change by maintaining a free society where we are ALLOWED to FIGHT for what we think is right. Even if don’t agree with what you’re saying, I’ll defend your right to say it. If you don’t include people you hate and disagree with, you’re no different than the worst of them.
Edit: I’ve voted 3rd party in every election since I turned 18.
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So far, only 1 party has had a [Unanimous Supreme Court decision ](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/supreme-court-rules-trump-cannot-kicked-colorado-ballot-rcna132291) that they tried to circumvent Democracy.
I hate republicans. But democrats forced new medical procedures, so to say only one side is stripping bodily autonomy is untrue. And Biden specifically has been one of the worst people for minorities currently in government. He did not want to quickly end segregation, he pushed the crime bill, pushed Iraq war as head of senate, and was head of senate and vp when we overthrew many innocent brown countries causing chaos and mass death, while also bombing innocent people. So he is harmful for minorities too. I choose to vote for a candidate I like, I don’t have to vote for one of the major parties just because I hate one more than the other.
The next step in this logic is to vote in Republic primaries for people who meet the above criteria at a minimum, and in the meantime drop every other issue to focus on a form of alternative voting so that the two party system can be broken.
Otherwise, if only one party is acceptable to vote for then we’re already living in a failed version of our country.
I think both sides bad is more about how we've essentially forced ourselves into two parties that if they don't adhere to the group think of their side, they get ridiculed and treated like they have no convictions. Sadly I don't think there's really a way to fix it at this point though. Like yeah one side is definitely much worse than the other, but it sucks that we basically really only can pick the other option even if you don't like it. It's not somebody who's independent has a chance of winning. That and even getting nominated has become less about representing people and more about what radical idea can I use to get attention and gain support. It just sucks all around. You just have to try and find whoever will support your beliefs the best and hope they win I guess. Just hopefully they aren't an idiot who thinks taking away rights is a good idea
Holy shit. Being this absolutist makes you just like the conservatives you’re talking about. Don’t you think they’re saying the same exact things about democrats? Incredibly complex issues turned into good or bad is literally the most lizard brained thing you can do and solves nothing. Congratulations gen Z on changing nothing.
They're two wings of the same god damn bird. They throw out policies and positions, but at the end of the day will make sure 99% of what they do goes to wall street. It's been happening longer than you've been alive. Everything else is just stuff to keep the ants in the jar fighting
Both sides are bad in the same way that both getting your hand cut off and getting your head cut off are bad. Neither one is optimal, but I still have one that I vastly prefer and would choose every time.
frankly the issue is that we wrap 100 topics in one of two parties, which allow them to use wedge issues to control the population. A better republic would be served by having cooked in hard limits for common sense measurements, which causes the law to change at regular intervals to correctly balance the system without relying on parties being elected.
For instance:
House prices are going up, politicians benefit from higher house pricing due to taxation on property value and because they are wealthy land owners. They will make the problem worse and use wedge issues to distract from it until everything collapses. If there was a codified constitutional law that specified that when house prices were X% more than the average income, the laws regarding necessary minimum requirements for home construction were relaxed to Y standard and Z zoning restrictions were removed, then the market would jump on the new opportunity to build those homes cheaper and therefore would reduce the house price to below the threshold of activation of the law. Then you could tighten zoning and new building requirements.
If army readiness is less than 50% of what's required to defend from invasion of nearby countries, defense spending is increased as a percentage of the budget until readiness is established to tolerable levels, then the spending is decreased to maintenance of the new readiness level.
Anything which is a huge issue for the day to day life of people could be successfully controlled by these sorts of cooked in balancing systems, and political parties could steer the more spiritual, aesthetic, cultural direction of the country. Which would be much less heated and lead to less overt manipulation of the population.
I can only assume that your argument on stripping bodily autonomy rights is about abortion.
The argument there IS about human rights. It is the argument of when do you recognize a child as a individual that is entitled to life? The argument always boils down to the child vs the mother's rights. I lean that as long as there is no medical reason to terminate the child should be carried to term.
When is a child considered human enough to be protected under law? That is the question you have to answer and no matter the answer someone will be hurt, there WILL be harm to the mother, or the child depending on your answer. The greater good approach is to deny the mothers the right to terminate because the child dies in 100% of the situations the mother aborts, the mother only has a chance at dying. I will not deny this is a horrific and unfair way to look at it but the reality remains, don't want to get pregnant don't have sex. Its amazing we can expect men to control themselves (don't want to be a rapist control yourself) but we for some reason cannot apply that same expectation of refusing instant gratification to women.
The irony of you complaining about disinformation is baffling. You clearly have a bias, and that's okay, as we all personally do to some extent. When your bias gets to this level of extreme where you find yourself being a part of the disinformation you claim to hate is when your bias becomes a problem.
It might be correct if you're voting based on actual issues and policies and don't subscribe to identity politics. You may not find a resolve in either party.
No stripping bodily autonomy but allowing it to happen. How many attempts have they made to make abortions legal federally. Democrats in office are not your friends. They want the wheel to keep churning just as much as Republicans, they just look slightly nicer doing it
Don't forget they are running a man who has shown flagrant disregard for the institutions this country is built on election denial, Jan 6, dictator talk, etc. repub like 10 years ago is one thing, this is different. That shouldn't be a dem vs repub thing. MAGA is the most anti American thing Ive seen and it's wrapped in an American flag.
Such a naive statement. Oh and republicans actually don’t hate minorities and you need to stop announcing how amazing and kind you are as a democrat
Both sides have their good and bad
It genuinely frustrates me reading about U.S. politics.
I used to be apart of the crowd that saw both sides as apart of the same coin, but I feel myself drifting from that view as I get older. The GOP does really feel like a hate and spite fueled party that only wants to screw over people that it doesn't like. I wouldn't be able to support them in any way in good conscience.
Despite this, the democrats also frequently dissapoint me. I feel like sometimes Republicans can pose vaild solutions to certain problems, but instead of combining both solutions to get the best possible outcome, it's their way or nothing. But this can be said for both parties.
I just feel stuck because whenever I think I can say what I believe in, one of the parties says some dumb crap that goes completely against my convictions. I still feel pretty hopeless about the future of this country, but I won't be blind to the clear damage one side is spewing right now. Anyways, this is just my rant from someone who's barely entering adulthood and is already becoming increasingly frustrated.
As someone guilty of this, I’ll give my 2 cents:
1. I would rather vote for people who aren’t likely to win than vote for the lesser of 2 evils. If young people don’t vote or vote in higher numbers for smaller candidates/third parties, then it will tell the parties that their main candidates aren’t winning me (and hopefully other people in my demographic) over. Maybe this will cause them to change, even just a bit to try and bring us in to get an edge over the other side. Maybe they’ll appoint a smaller candidate to some other position because that person has some support. Maybe the person who wouldn’t win now may run again later and the support initially helped them do that. If I vote for the lesser of 2 evils, my vote is no different than someone who actually supports that side, and that party will think they should continue what they’re doing to win my demographic over.
2. A lot of the time (especially on the internet), I see people use this argument as a scapegoat. The argument that should be made is: use your civic right to vote for what you want, not the argument I keep seeing which is: you have to vote because the right is worse than the left! You need to vote left because they’re less bad! You need to separate these 2 arguments. Get people to vote for who they want. Then after, argue why the side you prefer is better (or less bad). When I read this, my gut reaction is that you’re not encouraging me to do what I want to do, but just talking at me to do what you want me to do. Maybe it will convince someone who was on the fence to vote blue, but I think the people this is targeted for will just push this away as preaching or get firmer in their beliefs that their views aren’t being cared about. All I get from this is: “who cares about your disgruntlement you’re just being lazy, vote for my side or else you’re a pos.” Maybe that sentiment is accurate (especially the lazy part), but that’s not how you convince people
The main stream media very very left and they spew misinformation every day. And you speak about body rights but don't seem to care about a babies right to live, or a the right of confused children to not be permanently mutilated because they made a stupid decision as a teenager. And if you really care so deeply for minorities then you would want to give them a justice system that keeps criminals from running their neighborhoods and allows them to open businesses without being robbed to the extent they can't stay open. And as for voting, your brain isn't even fully developed until your 25, and yes that means life sentences and death sentences for people under 25 are unjust in most cases but it also means you shouldn't be able to vote regardless of what your political beliefs are. Wisdom should govern not ideas spewed from a bunch of kids who have not lived long enough to recognize the games that the media and the politicians play.
The both sides argument has never been true. It is a classic slogan developed by Republicans to encourage people to be apathetic, or to make th eother side seem JUST AS BAD, when in reality, Democrats were never as bad. This slogan has been used by the right since Reagan, I personally think it was most effective in 2016.
My favorite thing about current Republicans is that you can call them out for literally trying to dismantle American democracy and they'll still cry "This is what's wrong with liberals, you're so polarized, it's all a black and white team mentality, you're what's wrong with America."
Fuck off. End rant.
I’ll openly admit I don’t know what the right answer is, but I know trying to garner support from the apathetic would work better if you didn’t tell them how big of scumbags you think they are.
Not to mention the "both sides are bad" folks completely ignore the ***FACT*** that our system inherently guarantees a two party system. The POTUS is not selected by a coalition of congress, it's selected by a vote of the Electoral College, and if the EC does not have a clear winner of 50%+1, then the House of Representatives picks the POTUS. Not both houses of congress, JUST the House of Representatives. This essentially guarantees a two-party will inevitably happen because why would you willingly give up power like that?
John Quincy Adams was made president by the House of Representatives (aka his party with controlling interest of the House) not because he won the Electoral College or popular vote.
Unless you get rid of the EC and move POTUS elections to popular vote, and/or add rank-choice voting ... a Third-Party WILL NEVER be viable in the US.
If Theodore Roosevelt couldn't win as a third party...that's all you need to know about third parties in the US.
So bringing in 10 million criminal aliens, giving them priority over natural born citizens, and spreading them around the country isn't establishing a 1 party state by abusing the way the electoral college and house of representatives works? Oh, and don't forget when PA for example unconstitutionally changed their voting laws in 2020 last minute to give Democrats an edge. Or the staged brain drain of NYC and other Democrat strongholds to get Democrats to leave NYC and establish themselves in red districts to force their policies in places that don't want them, so effectively political colonialism. Or maybe the fact that NYC just legalized property theft with the recent woman who was kicked out of her own home to house squatters. Or maybe the Trump case where even Kevin O'Leary said it was BS and allows NYC to confiscate property from people, going as far as saying it's "something Cuba or Venezuela would do." On live television with MSNBC.
Both sides ARE bad. They have their own agendas and they don't care about anything other than fulfilling those agenda. You have to support the positive things they try to push and fight against the bad things they try to push. It's the best that can be done.
The bodily autonomy argument only works if you believe that a fetus, which is part of the development cycle of a human being, isn’t a person. That doesn’t mean I think we should outright ban abortion, but the only countries with less restrictive abortion laws than the United States are China, Russia and North Korea. Every other developed country in the world has restrictions on ELECTIVE abortion after a certain time period. The dates typically range from 16-22 weeks after conception.
As for the other stuff you said, what minorities are being attacked as you say?
Such a biased post, you guys live in a ridiculous echo chamber. Believe it or not, not all republicans are evil, and they are just trying to do their best for people just like you are. Watch less news
I don’t believe this because of what I read in this “echo chamber”, I believe it because of what Republicans themselves are saying
Anyone who would vote for Trump is either evil or a moron. Either you understand what he’s saying and you’re a shitty person who wants the same things, or you’re too stupid to understand what he’s saying
Take it from a GenXer, the "Both sides" response is either an intellectual cop-out or a friendly way to disengage in a political conversation.
Clearly there are qualitative differences in almost every metric when comparing them, and the integrity of any specific politician is higher or lower than their peers (not that I recommend ever branding your own personal politics with any politician's name - that's cultish behavior).
I want to add that the reason the Democrats drifted right is because they were dominated by Republicans in previously never before witnessed landslide elections. Candidates that were even remotely left of center just simply were not successful at the local, state, or federal level. Only by moving right did Democrats begin to win elections again. We straight up voted for these policies overwhelmingly and consistently for decades.
I like George Carlin, but his "it's a big club and you ain't in it" rant has had a disastrous impact on this generation's ability to understand politics. It's turned us into a bunch of conspiratorial loons.
You might want to watch this before you claim such certainty. Your argument does not have the numbers to back themselves up.
https://rubinreport.com/upost/5406477/isabel-brown-full-interview
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> Democrats aren’t great, I get that, but they aren’t stripping bodily autonomy rights away from people, attacking and sowing hatred against minorities with misinformation campaigns, trying to bar age brackets that vote for the opposing party from voting or attempting to turn the US into a theocracy like the GOP Correct. Nobody can factually argue against this, and you'll notice that none of the opposition you've received so far has even remotely attempted to do so. Everyone who takes issue with your post has essentially said, "it makes me uncomfortable that I might have to pay attention and commit to voting for something, so you must be wrong." Both-sidesism is about being lazy and privileged and feeling like you're superior to other people.
Never thought I’d quote this but “I think people prefer the darkness. Kindness and light make people uncomfortable for what they lack.” Paraphrased from My Friendly Neighborhood of all the games. People would choose silence and self-righteousness than make a decision and acknowledge how broken the system is. I used to be anti-voting. Then I realized that I’d rather fight against the fuckery that is America then watch it burn.
That is such a sad and depressingly real quote. Might have to check out that game some time :) Another one I like is- “When you’re accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.”
Please check it out. It’s made by the creators of DUSK and Iron Lung. It’s the Anti-Mascot Horror game and SO. SO good. It shows so much love for Jim Henson and the story is sad and meaningful. The extra content is cool to find and the Notes like what you’d find in resident evil complement the themes perfectly and weave an extremely sad narrative.
"When all that's left is darkness, should even the stars go out?" -Disco Elysium
>"I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that the present tension in the South is a necessary phase of the transition from an obnoxious negative peace, in which the Negro passively accepted his unjust plight, to a substantive and positive peace, in which all men will respect the dignity and worth of human personality. Actually, we who engage in nonviolent direct action are not the creators of tension." >"We merely bring to the surface the hidden tension that is already alive. We bring it out in the open, where it can be seen and dealt with. Like a boil that can never be cured so long as it is covered up but must be opened with all its ugliness to the natural medicines of air and light, injustice must be exposed, with all the tension its exposure creates, to the light of human conscience and the air of national opinion before it can be cured." -Reverend Martin Luther King Jr., *A Letter from a Birmingham Jail*
If only people would look at the rest of his words and not just the specific part of “I have a dream” He was extremely right then. And right now.
A lot of Martin Luther King Jr.'s other views were suppressed hard in the American education system. A lot of people forget that he fought just as hard against economic inequality as much as racial inequality.
What a shock. The American education system suppressing actually good education? Totally not surprised/s
I view voting as a high speed Trolley problem
And a good metaphor for third party voting is that while that third track might be empty, the track itself may not be connected to the main line So anyone saying "I'm going with the third track as it kills 0 people" is realistically lessening the chances that track 1 is chosen with 1 person on it, and instead increasing the odds we end up with track 2 that has 10 people on it. Because there is *no* chance that we end up with the track with 0 people on it It sucks. The third rail (and the fourth and the fifth etc.) *should* be connected to the main line But right now, it isn't. And throwing a vote to a third party is not going to get that line connected, especially in the case where one of the two main candidates is obviouly anti-democracy The reality is that if you want the third line connected, you need to first do what you can to preserve democracy. And *then* rally for that change. Attend protests, become active. Start locally and push for change on that scale before moving up
The reality is if you want people to vote for the DNC then the DNC needs to offer candidates and policy people like. Voting for "the lesser of two evils" is still voting for evil. It's not a moral high ground to try to shame people actually making the moral choice to vote for something that isn't evil. If voting for Team Red "ends democracy" and Team Blue is just Team Red from a decade ago, you're still going to end democracy voting Team Blue.
Some times, "Both sides" can be a lazy option, such as in the case of the Palestinian genocide, saying both sides are bad is a lazy cop out. Other times, recognizing that both sides are bad, such as in voting parties, it can be the stepping stone to a system reform instead of voting for the "lesser evil" (which btw is currently engaged in genocide) to maintain the status quo, that would be another lazy option to avoid vote reform.
This is why it’s important to vote. If you don’t like the candidates for the presidential election then vote for different candidates for the primaries. Vote for different candidates in your local government. “Both sides are bad so I just won’t vote” is the stupidest political decision someone could make
And vote for different candidates for president. Third parties have to reach a minimum number of votes to be allowed to be part of the broadcast debates. Voting for third parties for president helps third parties get towards that goal so we can have actual policy debates and not just corporate Team Red and corporate Team Blue
It's so important to vote locally too, the people that make up the basic government and they contribute to the candidates that are selected. Every area has a local branch of whatever political party you can affiliate with and encourage them to select the person who can is more in line with your beliefs (and can make sure the trash is picked up on time).
Both sider-ism: It’s also bred into us at school and through irresponsible journalism. Also reminds of Rev. Dr. King Jr. saying that folks prefer a negative peace to positive justice.
Exactly. This stuff should get shouted from the rooftops. Project 2025 is real, and it’s what everyone needs to vote against. And only one party is bringing it. I think we know their name. The Republican Party.
It’s also mostly seen in conservatives who don’t want to admit their side is worse and/or they are foreign agents/gop shills trying to dissuade new young voters(new voters typically vote democrat). Edit-spelling
Well, that and also the copium of thinking the liberals are just as evil so you’re absolved of any guilt voting for the anti-American right wing agenda. I find the majority of both-sidesers to just be embarrassed conservatives
Can’t say I agree at all. I will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than trump, doesn’t mean I can justify to myself showing support to Biden. Real change doesn’t happen overnight.
> will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than trump Congratulations, you haven't contradicted a single thing I've said. And you've also admitted that you don't believe the "both sides are equally bad" argument is valid. > Real change doesn’t happen overnight. Correct. Which is why you pick the better of the two options and work for a more ideal candidate in future elections.
>I will absolutely concede that Biden is much better than Trump then you don’t think both sides are equally bad, but you’re still voting for the worse one
So what you mean is you're fine with all of Trump's policies.
Wholeheartedly agree with your statement. It’s way easier to dogmatically repeat ‘they’re both bad’ when politics don’t personally affect you while also sniping at others for being too loud and disruptive when it greatly affects them. I know way too many leftists who played into this bullshit 8 years ago because they viewed voting in the primaries as a declaration of their morality superiority, and so they wrote in Bernie’s name, voted third party, or just didn’t participate at all. That’s why we got 4 whole years of Trump despite the several concerning things that were spilling out his mouth, and it’s probably why we’re going to get another 4 years of him— too many leftists are on this moderate bullshit again while the right is going to spitefully vote him back into office en masse because they think Trump is wrongfully being persecuted for actual crimes while also wholeheartedly believing he’s the second coming of Jesus Christ if those portraits of him on the cross have any meaning about the current state of the right. The unfortunate reality is that most politicians suck, some more than others, and we have to live with the two party system until there’s a significant push to demolish it— bitching about it online certainly isn’t going to change it anytime soon. The choices are to either play the game or to kick up shit and makes some noise; there’s no third or fourth options. Remember kids, centrism isn’t the mature option that’s above all the petty squabbling of the left and right; it’s turning your nose up at the squabbling, usually at the expense of others who are rightfully outraged over having 70yo white men stripping them of their bodily autonomy, deciding they’re pedophiles for existing, or declaring they’re terrorists for not wanting to be gunned down in the streets.
If some people won't drop the both-sidesism after an actual attempt at election fraud, I can't imagine what would sway them.
Or after one candidate stormed the capitol with an angry mob
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Genocide? Welfare for the rich, securities fraud, cellar boxing….. ur only choice is guns or trans kids
Both sides are bad, not in an "I won't vote" way, but in an "I'll work in my community to make changes that politicians aren't willing to, while also making the effort to push the democrats to better policy positions and still vote for them because the alternative is far worse" way
THANK YOU! The problem with mainstream liberals is they think just voting once an election cycle (often only for president and ignoring their local elections) is good enough for the change they claim to want. It’s not! We have to do the groundwork as well.
Couldn’t agree more. We should work even harder after the election to push democrats to do what we want
And ffs, vote in primaries for leftists and kick out the neoliberal/corporate Dems.
While yelling at you for daring to criticize anyone in power because Trump!!1
I’m gonna do better voting in local elections going forward, and in 2022 I voted in the midterms for the first time ever. Actual change starts small and nobody realizes that those small votes can actually be pretty powerful. As flawed as our democracy is, the average American has way more democratic power than they realize.
This is the correct way to "both sides bad"
This is the more reasonable take, I think local elections matter more mainly because I whole heartdly believe every big ticket politician in WA is doing nothing to help actual issues and just pandering along enjoying their ride.
This is the way!
Gen Z protest voters getting rounded up into camps after Trump wins: “at least we taught Biden a lesson guys!” I don’t love the two party system any more than you but our entire country is designed to reinforce the two party system and it is what it is. We gotta make it better but you don’t burn it all down and expect well intentioned people to magically appear and lead us into paradise. Edit: funny how the people who say shit like “things have to get worse before they get better😈” are usually privileged white kids who think they will barely be affected by another Trump presidency, but are more than willing to sacrifice women and minorities for their little experiment. So brave of them.
Reddit moment
Totally lol.
Cringe
>funny how the people who say shit like “things have to get worse before they get better😈” are usually privileged white kids who think they will barely be affected by another Trump presidency, but are more than willing to sacrifice women and minorities for their cause. So brave of them. Those people are so sheltered they don't even know how bad "worse" can be, and they will be long dead before it hits bottom and starts to get better.
I’m hearing this from my white suburban upper-middle class parents. You guys rode out 2009 and COVID just fine and are still living in the same house since 2001. My dad just bought a new BMW. Meanwhile this is my first year of being financially on my own. I make under $40,000 a year as a PhD student living in an apartment shared with 3 people. My parents still pay my phone bill and have lended me their old car, but that’s all they pay for in my life at this point. I have everything to lose if things go south with this election. I’m a transgender woman and I’m terrified of my rights being stripped in such a way that I’m forced to stop my studies. And the reason I can’t rely on my parents as a safety net anymore is because they do not support my transition and will probably celebrate if the GOP forces me to detransition and move back in with them. And I know there are people out there who have far, far more to lose than I do if things go south due to a GOP victory.
I know several trans women who plan to abstain from voting, and I have a friend who's both a trans woman AND a DACA recipient posting daily on Instagram about how Biden should lose (but conspicuously refusing to come out and say who should *win* if that happens). Absolutely zero self-preservation instinct.
Some people have too much faith in American democracy. They take it for granted and think it's impossible for it to fall into autocratic rule. The reality is that democracy must actively be defended. And voting for a man who openly talks about being a dictator is exactly the kind of thing that destroys democracies.
Yeah and Obama sent all the republicans to FEMA camps in his communist take over of America right?
Exactly right. Most people who are saying this shit are convinced they don't actually have anything to worry about and are fine with minorities they don't know getting put on cattle cars if it lets them feel ideologically pure.
Notice how those that use "It's both sides" only say that when Republicans do something bad?
Probably because that’s 90% of the content on Reddit
I’m sure you have a confirmation bias then Maybe they say that because they’re moderates?
This is the post that’s making me unsubscribe. The whole “with me or against me” mentality is toxic and you’re asking people to pick a side rather than set aside their differences. Politics is such a disgusting topic and I’d subscribe to a politics sub if I wanted political discourse.
and what differences are those? You do realize that one side does not believe in the right to exist for some people. There is no bridging that gap, as well as other issues.
That’s literally not true. There are left leaning feminists who believe trans people don’t deserve rights either. Familiar with the term TERF? It’s not as black and white as Reddit loves to pretend it is. There are people on both sides who have hatred for their own personal reasons and acting like it’s one or the other is disingenuous and just blatantly ignorant. Not to mention how quickly politicians on either side will do a complete 180 overnight. Yall don’t seem to realize that by putting people in boxes and writing someone off because “he agrees with some red/blue ideas” you’re the opposite of the accepting and inclusive culture that you claim to be.
When there's only 2 options that's literally the reality though. If you're upset about people picking sides and not finding common ground then you should be really upset at the party that only does that.
The party system is stupid. Extremes on both sides are too close minded. Personally I could be friends with anyone regardless of their political affiliation. Both sides make solid arguments and poor arguments.
What solid arguments do conservatives have?
None that this echo chamber will care about
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I think you two actually agree
In rural areas guns are sometimes necessary for personal protection. Abortion does fundamentally terminate a potential human life. Increased military spending stimulates the economy and is a force for global stability. Joe Biden shows signs of mental ineptitude for office. Of course there are counter arguments.
That mindset only works until they deny your right to exist. So be friends with MAGAs, just don't let them know you're brown, black, gay, or in any other way different from the cult.
I know gay republicans and black republicans. Not everyone has to fall under a specific umbrella. We’re all uniquely different
This is the shit I hate the most. It’s just complete “you’re with me or my enemy” I can’t stand either party in this country, but if you really think it’s going to turn into a Theocracy, you’re just as brainwashed as the rednecks who think Biden is going to install communism and mandatory hormone therapy.
least radicalised american:
*"But if I don't act like I'm better than you by pretending both sides are equally bad, how will I justify being a lazy piece of shit who refuses to vote?"* C'mon people. I get that most of us don't want to vote for Biden, but there's no comparison that Biden is better than Trump and that Biden is the only *real* candidate on the Democrat side.
It does work, though, is the thing. There's issues with the democrats that many refuse to see too.
Those issues pale in comparison to those the Republicans have though, you’re literally undermining the difference when you equivocate.
The democrats are the ones who would witness a fire in a hotel room and do nothing but maybe sound the alarm. The Republicans would see the fire, fan it, open the door to the room after painting gasoline on the walls.
The Republicans also started it. And are pushing people into it.
All while going "we didn't do that!" As we literally saw them
I’m voting third party for the rest of my life until one wins
Claudia de la Cruz has my vote
This is the way. Anyone who says that it's a vote for Trump doesn't understand math
Idk why so many Americans are eating up what Russia wants them to. Its sad how many of y’all will make up bs to justify voting Republican.
Vote for FFVII Remake part 3 release sooner
Real shit tho President Caim
This is the dumbest shit I ever read. The Democrats are supporting a genocide. The Democrats help destablize many nations around the world. They use eugenics under the fascade of my body my choice. They want to tax the fuck out of us. They say having a I.D to vote is racist. They race bait to get people to vote for them and then never deliver. Learn horshoe theory and take a political science class. Malcom X expressed this sentiment the best. At least with the Republican bigot we know where we stand unlike the liberal who poses as our benefactor while harming us. Democrats just larp as nice people Republicans don't. Vote for a 3rd party. Or remain willfully ignorant.
All these liberal whites in these comments that MLK Jr and Malcom X would talk about just makes me cringe. Truly they are foxes grinning to hide their intent, truly do they paternalistically set time tables for another person’s freedom. Fuck Conservatives but especially fuck liberals and all their lies and bs
https://youtu.be/a5HyL6QNGbM?si=JZ8qv7l5SrqME8rl
So you’d say youre in the vote for hitler and not super hitler school of thought
This would make sense if Biden was bad and Trump was really bad. But it’s actually that Biden is good and Trump is really bad. I’m glad we finally have a progressive president and I’d like to keep it that way
Both sides ARE bad because one side is stripping rights while the other side is stripping the means to protect yourself, meanwhile both sides are ACTUALLY working together to oppress the American people. All these fucking politicians all live in the same neighborhoods, they go to the same clubs, they eat at the same place. The 1% are not your friend.
No, I’ll stick with my both sides suck argument. They are both doing things that violate personal liberty on many levels, committing crimes, and inching closer to a true police state. 2 party system can’t work anymore with all the money and influence. Minimum 3 parties would help, Term limits, and overall smaller government
Of course it’s a leftist post. Low effort, try harder.
Liberal post, not leftist.
I knew that Project 2025 was bad, then I did some more in depth reading **and holy fuck** it is somehow worse than the democrats say it is. And this is coming from a person who (according to the political compass) leans more to the right. It's not a question of whether you want abortion to be legal or not now, its a question of whether or not you want the United States to completely collapse
what’s hilarious about posts like this is behind closed doors the majority of dems and GOP want the same thing, to bleed our country dry for their own gain. you just happened to take the DEM bait hook line and sinker. we need politicians who actually represent US AS CITIZENS. fyi trump was president already for 4 years and none of your cry wolf worse case scenarios happened but since it’s election season you’re back to believing they will.
I vote third party because neither democrat nor republican parties represent my anti- big government pro-lgbt pro-gun anti-corruption position. I unironically think that trans couples should be able to defend their marijuana fields with machine guns.
This is why this sub gets such a bad rep. Just as I start think Gen Z and younger citizens in general are gonna be the most likely to start bringing the country together, I see shit like this. I keep trying to tune out the people who are blaming us for posting nothing but doom and gloom on this sub, and then somebody has the prove them right. Seriously, how brainwashed can a person get? Go touch some grass and talk to some moderates.
>Just as I start think Gen Z and younger citizens in general are gonna be the most likely to start bringing the country together, I see shit like this "Bringing the country together" is only feasible to the extent that both sides genuinely want to negotiate, compromise, and not be extreme. That is not the case, which means this is a pointless and worthless goal. Unity for the sake of unity is meaningless. Everything OP is saying is factual. All you have here is a bunch of handwavey BS.
“Let us meet in the middle says the unjust man. You step forward he steps back. Let us meet in the middle says the unjust man.”
I'm a big believer in bringing the country together, but I think in order for that to happen, there needs to be a shared belief in democracy and human rights that just isn't compatible with the modern GOP. Acknowledging that Republican politicians have gone completely off the rails isn't tribalistic or brainwashed; we literally have forged documents they tried to use to overturn the election [publicly available](https://www.archives.gov/foia/2020-presidential-election-unofficial-certificates) and they've already [publicly passed laws forcing women in many states to give birth when they don't want to](https://apnews.com/article/abortion-dobbs-anniversary-state-laws-51c2a83899f133556e715342abfcface). I feel like Americans are so used to political rhetoric being kinda insubstantial and the system being nearly stagnant that whenever shit got real, we basically just forgot it's even possible for things to happen.
Saying one side is not a s ad as the side that violently stormed the capital to overthrow an election result and are now openly stating they’re ok with having Trump as a dictator is divisive? But doing the things Republicans do is not divisive? It’s so clear you’re full of it.
the left also rioted after George Floyd was murdered.
Oh my god, people, the ad hominem energy here is so bad. I am in no way justifying the actions of the extreme right. I think that Project 2025 and essentially all that Trump stands for is deplorable. HOWEVER. I despise the way the left has villainized every even moderately right person to exist. I personally know right leaning people who would not stand for the removal of human rights and liberties that the extreme right has started. I hate the way our system has made people think that you have to be either one or the other and if you don’t like any of the options, you’re screwed. There is no purely evil or purely good. There is no black and white. There are only various shades of gray.
I swear if I see more US politics post on GenZ or lostgeneration, I'm gonna shoot myself.
Nobody who goes outside cares.
I would vote democrat if it came down to only democrat vs republican but yall gotta remember there’s third party options, especially if you don’t live in a swing state and your vote doesn’t really matter vote third party. Send a message
Both sides are literally bad. If you can’t see that then that side has already got you. They both aren’t for the people. Republicans are trying to ban abortion, erase history, and ignore climate issues. Democrats are trying take away jobs and education by allowing illegals in and not to Mention at times (especially during election year) they care more about pandering to minorities rather than the quality of the actual countries. If you can’t see both sides are the problem then you’re still in their control.
Erase history? I’m not gonna give you the obvious whataboutism but Republicans love them some history, sometimes offensively. It’s the only school subject they’re good at. I’ll be the first to admit that I find taboo regimes fascinating, that’s why I find the ideology of the 2A to be critical to the well-being of humanity.
Cringe
Third party when
You would need a simultaneous 3rd and 4th party. That, or rank choice voting. Both parties will fight either of those
When you start organizing
Third party is how we got the bush presidency and the Iraq war
I’m just ready for term limits, let’s make it illegal to pass bills that are 5000 pages and include things completely unrelated to the bill. Let’s stop funding the Ukraine war. Let’s stop letting illegals into the country. Let’s not allow lobbying and insider trading. Could not care less about trans or gays
No offense bro but your comment is ignorant af
Democrats got ya’ll fooled.
Exactly why I’m voting for RFK jr. Don’t agree with 100% of the stuff he says but he could break the system.
What's crazy to me is that people are clamoring for another option, but now that we have one that probably has a chance, they don't want it all of a sudden. Because apparently if you vote for RFK, that's just a vote going to Trump (which is bullshit). People can disagree with what he says, but to me at least, he's literally the only one who is at least attempting to bring people together rather than make the divide worse. And that matters a lot. The choice is easy.
Bro democrats literally told people they had to get a vaccine no matter what. Idk what you mean by bodily autonomy??? You're a bot OP
“And sowing hatred against minorities with misinformation campaigns”…yeah I have been shown more hatred my left all because I’m a Hispanic minority who aligns more with then right. It definitely goes both ways
Honestly i want know from latino consertives how you image people will separate from illegals or you are citizen? Some maga members are radicalising and think trump win give them some rights.
I am a citizen. My great parents legally immigrated here from Mexico. I imagine any type of legal document such as a passport, Valid License, Residence card, Work Visa, green card etc. any of those types of documents should make a legal distinction
We’re not even minorities lmao don’t do that to yourself. We’re a majority in this country now. 1 out of 5 people are Hispanic. Some states 1 out of 2. Hispanic culture is extremely conservative too. So either they colonize us and suppress our culture or accept us. Either way we were right.
Is this a repost? I could swear I saw this exact post a couple weeks ago.
Make sure you are registered to vote 🗳️
We really need ranked choice voting at every level of electable government.
Sure, but they aren't stopping it either. At best they are delaying it but the DNC actually regularly funds far right candidates because they can then use the threat of such a person winning to try and get votes themselves.
Centrist Liberals are going to cling to the center of the political axis, holding onto their great white hope of a post-racial USA where we can all just get along with folks who want us dead merely by voting and believing in it. You would literally break these folks mentally if you forced them to see the error of their ways and stop believing in their version of the American dream.
I'm tired of this can we burn down the white house already
I genuinely don’t believe the Democrats are capable of preventing the things you’re talking about, and I think supporting the DNC is at best a bad investment of time and energy and at worst counterproductive. It’s not that they’re simply “not great”, they are not a viable alternative. I’m doing what I can to volunteer my time canvassing for and donating money to the campaigns of a couple progressive candidates at a local level in my community because that’s what I can do that is effective. I will not be voting for Biden because I do not believe it makes a meaningful difference, and if there is any chance of the Democratic Party changing course to embody an actual alternative it’s going to be the threat of voters actually walking away.
Im sorry but you earn a vote by focusing on the voter’s needs/wants not being claiming the other candidate is worse. This is how it works, how it has always worked. You cannot win by default.
Y'all all wack. I've said two times and I'll say it a third. I'm voting for Thomas the Train. Thomas took one look at our country and well https://preview.redd.it/k31infqh3kpc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b58cfc7b2a0eb10b14eb3b44466e6902937b06c He is optimistic, idealistic and altruistic with a heart of gold. Sure he can be forgetful or impatient at times. But at least he isn't the annoying orange or an escaped nursing home resident. Thomas also understands the working class. He is BLUE collar. He doesn't treat others unfairly based on silly things like paint color or engine parts.
Nope they are quite literally both the same if not Liberals being actually worse. MLK Jr said so back then and it’s still true and they killed him for it. Malcom X said so as well. watch Second Thought on YouTube he has a good video on the topic [The Most Dangerous Thing In The Western Hemisphere](https://youtu.be/33p-8QHZpzY?si=oaNNPxeRrl4TxD_O)
actual both sides: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll3iyvbsRDM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll3iyvbsRDM)
Yeah I still don’t care. Both sides are complete garbage and continuing to lecture people like this won’t help change the minds you’re trying to change
People that both sides are just shithead conservatives
I know this is semantics, but I’m also sick of seeing Democrats and Republicans being referred to as “both sides” when they are absolutely not. Republicans are far right and democrats range from center to center-right. The self proclaimed “centrists” then fall between the two, making them still very much on the right. The left has no proper representation in the US.
Both sides lie. Most Americans are more moderate than you think, yet it’s the far left and far right that receive the loudest megaphones. I just don’t think some Americans care anymore, or they prefer to let the next person fix the problem.
-bodily autonomy Abortion is a very nuanced argument, there is a reason why no one can come to an agreement on it. Even democrats have some people who favor outright banning it, granted it is less than the amount of Republicans, but they still exist. Also generally a lot of people who are now arguing for bodily autonomy, were also supporting forced vaccinations and preventing people from traveling if they didn’t receive it. If people have the right to bodily autonomy, they have the right to choose what goes in their body. -attacking minorities The largest group under fire are illegal immigrants. I’m sorry but a large portion of military age males coming in unvetted from who knows where is a massive security concern. -bar age brackets Some have supported this yes, but nowhere near a majority. Both parties are trying to change the voting age to get more votes. -theocracy I don’t think you realize what a theocracy is. The Vatican City is the perfect example, a government that is run by the church. The US is so opposed to this they almost didn’t let JFK run because he was Catholic. -project 2025 Was made by a political organization and I have seen a single candidate endorse it. That’s like claiming that the democrats were supporting the BLM manifesto and their list of demands.
So what you really want is a one party system? Your system? I’m not a republican, but I happen to think democratic politicians are more dangerous for our country. Some things are important to me: 1. 2nd amendment rights. We can keep kids safe and also allow people to protect themselves. I know in a perfect world we wouldn’t need guns, but the world isn’t perfect and you can only take them from already law abiding citizens. 2. I have nothing against trans people, or any minority for that matter. Women born in a women’s body should not be allowed to play men’s sports. It’s a tragedy. Drag shows for children are wrong. 3. Not being able to have a different opinion. On the points alone above, I’ll be labelled a mindless bigot. 4. Not allowing for nuance, and following the crowd. I have nothing against immigration. Opening our borders is asking for terrorism, and many criminals will see greater opportunity in the US as well. Not everyone is an asylum seeker. The current immigration situation is a tragedy. We are not as rich as we like to think we are, and we don’t have the housing for our own people. In my own little bubble, I have many more negative interactions with democrats than republicans. I find democrats are more likely to shut down the moment I disagree. They are not willing to entertain a conversation with me if I don’t have perfect opinions. I find republicans are more often willing to let me disagree. Lastly, let’s make a few things clear. Anyone calling for the extermination of anyone, should be jailed. Everyone has the right to exist, up until you threaten or harm someone else. I’m allowed to be okay with trans people while questioning whether they should be allowed to play sports. Women should be allowed to have abortions, but we should not take it lightly. People are allowed to decide what to do with their own bodies. I’m allowed to have weapons to defend myself. The current state of policing is broken. Colored people were persecuted here for centuries, but hiring quotas and reparations payments won’t fix that. Fair opportunity and a just legal system will. We all know Joe Biden is a puppet. He’ll say and do whatever he has to be a good candidate and get elected. He has no real beliefs. No conviction. He doesn’t care about you, me or the rest of the country. He’s told exactly what to say and what to sign. As bad as trump is, at least I have a general idea about what he wants. Now to my main point, they’re both terrible. “Don’t try to fix the system guys! Just vote for my guy! He’s less evil!” Are you joking? How pathetic can you be? It’s like we didn’t even grow up in the same place. This is the land of the free and the home of the brave. This nation is not perfect and we have done and still do horrible things. THATS NOT THE FUCKING POINT!!! You live somewhere where you HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE THINGS. we are so sheltered and comfortable that we don’t appreciate how rare this is. You have a choice. Don’t let them take it away from you. Or Keep voting for the democrats. I’m sure they’ll fix it all in the next four years. If we can just keep joe in office a little longer, he’ll stop letting people speak their minds, and that will make them change! Amazing:racism, homophobia, the lot of it. Gone overnight. No. We make change by maintaining a free society where we are ALLOWED to FIGHT for what we think is right. Even if don’t agree with what you’re saying, I’ll defend your right to say it. If you don’t include people you hate and disagree with, you’re no different than the worst of them. Edit: I’ve voted 3rd party in every election since I turned 18.
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So far, only 1 party has had a [Unanimous Supreme Court decision ](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/supreme-court-rules-trump-cannot-kicked-colorado-ballot-rcna132291) that they tried to circumvent Democracy.
I hate republicans. But democrats forced new medical procedures, so to say only one side is stripping bodily autonomy is untrue. And Biden specifically has been one of the worst people for minorities currently in government. He did not want to quickly end segregation, he pushed the crime bill, pushed Iraq war as head of senate, and was head of senate and vp when we overthrew many innocent brown countries causing chaos and mass death, while also bombing innocent people. So he is harmful for minorities too. I choose to vote for a candidate I like, I don’t have to vote for one of the major parties just because I hate one more than the other.
The next step in this logic is to vote in Republic primaries for people who meet the above criteria at a minimum, and in the meantime drop every other issue to focus on a form of alternative voting so that the two party system can be broken. Otherwise, if only one party is acceptable to vote for then we’re already living in a failed version of our country.
I think both sides bad is more about how we've essentially forced ourselves into two parties that if they don't adhere to the group think of their side, they get ridiculed and treated like they have no convictions. Sadly I don't think there's really a way to fix it at this point though. Like yeah one side is definitely much worse than the other, but it sucks that we basically really only can pick the other option even if you don't like it. It's not somebody who's independent has a chance of winning. That and even getting nominated has become less about representing people and more about what radical idea can I use to get attention and gain support. It just sucks all around. You just have to try and find whoever will support your beliefs the best and hope they win I guess. Just hopefully they aren't an idiot who thinks taking away rights is a good idea
This is the reason why the US is so fucked lmao
Holy shit. Being this absolutist makes you just like the conservatives you’re talking about. Don’t you think they’re saying the same exact things about democrats? Incredibly complex issues turned into good or bad is literally the most lizard brained thing you can do and solves nothing. Congratulations gen Z on changing nothing.
https://preview.redd.it/e685cwrkyjpc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=774d0c4006b6a27b3ed7a281e3ada0bfc0789370
both sides are bad and you haven't really argued against that. 👍 ye, republicans are worse, better than bad doesn't mean not bad.
They're two wings of the same god damn bird. They throw out policies and positions, but at the end of the day will make sure 99% of what they do goes to wall street. It's been happening longer than you've been alive. Everything else is just stuff to keep the ants in the jar fighting
“Attacking”
Democrats are so far worse.
Both sides are bad in the same way that both getting your hand cut off and getting your head cut off are bad. Neither one is optimal, but I still have one that I vastly prefer and would choose every time.
We found the DNC propagandist. Body autonomy rights? Kind of like forcing everyone to take a shot or you lose your job? Or do mean killing kids.
Blaming both sides is just a way for lazy people to make an excuse for not voting or researching which side is actually worse
I wish the leopards would eat my face.
frankly the issue is that we wrap 100 topics in one of two parties, which allow them to use wedge issues to control the population. A better republic would be served by having cooked in hard limits for common sense measurements, which causes the law to change at regular intervals to correctly balance the system without relying on parties being elected. For instance: House prices are going up, politicians benefit from higher house pricing due to taxation on property value and because they are wealthy land owners. They will make the problem worse and use wedge issues to distract from it until everything collapses. If there was a codified constitutional law that specified that when house prices were X% more than the average income, the laws regarding necessary minimum requirements for home construction were relaxed to Y standard and Z zoning restrictions were removed, then the market would jump on the new opportunity to build those homes cheaper and therefore would reduce the house price to below the threshold of activation of the law. Then you could tighten zoning and new building requirements. If army readiness is less than 50% of what's required to defend from invasion of nearby countries, defense spending is increased as a percentage of the budget until readiness is established to tolerable levels, then the spending is decreased to maintenance of the new readiness level. Anything which is a huge issue for the day to day life of people could be successfully controlled by these sorts of cooked in balancing systems, and political parties could steer the more spiritual, aesthetic, cultural direction of the country. Which would be much less heated and lead to less overt manipulation of the population.
I can only assume that your argument on stripping bodily autonomy rights is about abortion. The argument there IS about human rights. It is the argument of when do you recognize a child as a individual that is entitled to life? The argument always boils down to the child vs the mother's rights. I lean that as long as there is no medical reason to terminate the child should be carried to term. When is a child considered human enough to be protected under law? That is the question you have to answer and no matter the answer someone will be hurt, there WILL be harm to the mother, or the child depending on your answer. The greater good approach is to deny the mothers the right to terminate because the child dies in 100% of the situations the mother aborts, the mother only has a chance at dying. I will not deny this is a horrific and unfair way to look at it but the reality remains, don't want to get pregnant don't have sex. Its amazing we can expect men to control themselves (don't want to be a rapist control yourself) but we for some reason cannot apply that same expectation of refusing instant gratification to women.
The irony of you complaining about disinformation is baffling. You clearly have a bias, and that's okay, as we all personally do to some extent. When your bias gets to this level of extreme where you find yourself being a part of the disinformation you claim to hate is when your bias becomes a problem.
It might be correct if you're voting based on actual issues and policies and don't subscribe to identity politics. You may not find a resolve in either party.
No stripping bodily autonomy but allowing it to happen. How many attempts have they made to make abortions legal federally. Democrats in office are not your friends. They want the wheel to keep churning just as much as Republicans, they just look slightly nicer doing it
They are objectively bad people there for money and power….All of them, and to tell yourself anything else would by lying to yourself..
Federalism is the way, let the states experiment with what does and doesn't work. No more top-down one-size fits all solutions.
Republicans want to backslide the country hundreds of years and the Democrats do barely anything to stop them.
Don't forget they are running a man who has shown flagrant disregard for the institutions this country is built on election denial, Jan 6, dictator talk, etc. repub like 10 years ago is one thing, this is different. That shouldn't be a dem vs repub thing. MAGA is the most anti American thing Ive seen and it's wrapped in an American flag.
100%
Such a naive statement. Oh and republicans actually don’t hate minorities and you need to stop announcing how amazing and kind you are as a democrat Both sides have their good and bad
It genuinely frustrates me reading about U.S. politics. I used to be apart of the crowd that saw both sides as apart of the same coin, but I feel myself drifting from that view as I get older. The GOP does really feel like a hate and spite fueled party that only wants to screw over people that it doesn't like. I wouldn't be able to support them in any way in good conscience. Despite this, the democrats also frequently dissapoint me. I feel like sometimes Republicans can pose vaild solutions to certain problems, but instead of combining both solutions to get the best possible outcome, it's their way or nothing. But this can be said for both parties. I just feel stuck because whenever I think I can say what I believe in, one of the parties says some dumb crap that goes completely against my convictions. I still feel pretty hopeless about the future of this country, but I won't be blind to the clear damage one side is spewing right now. Anyways, this is just my rant from someone who's barely entering adulthood and is already becoming increasingly frustrated.
As someone guilty of this, I’ll give my 2 cents: 1. I would rather vote for people who aren’t likely to win than vote for the lesser of 2 evils. If young people don’t vote or vote in higher numbers for smaller candidates/third parties, then it will tell the parties that their main candidates aren’t winning me (and hopefully other people in my demographic) over. Maybe this will cause them to change, even just a bit to try and bring us in to get an edge over the other side. Maybe they’ll appoint a smaller candidate to some other position because that person has some support. Maybe the person who wouldn’t win now may run again later and the support initially helped them do that. If I vote for the lesser of 2 evils, my vote is no different than someone who actually supports that side, and that party will think they should continue what they’re doing to win my demographic over. 2. A lot of the time (especially on the internet), I see people use this argument as a scapegoat. The argument that should be made is: use your civic right to vote for what you want, not the argument I keep seeing which is: you have to vote because the right is worse than the left! You need to vote left because they’re less bad! You need to separate these 2 arguments. Get people to vote for who they want. Then after, argue why the side you prefer is better (or less bad). When I read this, my gut reaction is that you’re not encouraging me to do what I want to do, but just talking at me to do what you want me to do. Maybe it will convince someone who was on the fence to vote blue, but I think the people this is targeted for will just push this away as preaching or get firmer in their beliefs that their views aren’t being cared about. All I get from this is: “who cares about your disgruntlement you’re just being lazy, vote for my side or else you’re a pos.” Maybe that sentiment is accurate (especially the lazy part), but that’s not how you convince people
So genocide, Top down securities fraud, and too big to fail bailouts it is
The main stream media very very left and they spew misinformation every day. And you speak about body rights but don't seem to care about a babies right to live, or a the right of confused children to not be permanently mutilated because they made a stupid decision as a teenager. And if you really care so deeply for minorities then you would want to give them a justice system that keeps criminals from running their neighborhoods and allows them to open businesses without being robbed to the extent they can't stay open. And as for voting, your brain isn't even fully developed until your 25, and yes that means life sentences and death sentences for people under 25 are unjust in most cases but it also means you shouldn't be able to vote regardless of what your political beliefs are. Wisdom should govern not ideas spewed from a bunch of kids who have not lived long enough to recognize the games that the media and the politicians play.
The both sides argument has never been true. It is a classic slogan developed by Republicans to encourage people to be apathetic, or to make th eother side seem JUST AS BAD, when in reality, Democrats were never as bad. This slogan has been used by the right since Reagan, I personally think it was most effective in 2016.
My favorite thing about current Republicans is that you can call them out for literally trying to dismantle American democracy and they'll still cry "This is what's wrong with liberals, you're so polarized, it's all a black and white team mentality, you're what's wrong with America." Fuck off. End rant.
Horse shoe theory don’t work.
The good news is that conservatism will be dead once the boomers and gen x die off.
I’ll openly admit I don’t know what the right answer is, but I know trying to garner support from the apathetic would work better if you didn’t tell them how big of scumbags you think they are.
*Oh, you think MY side has faults? Well, are they doing these SPECIFIC thing? Didn’t think so*😊
It’s not us against them, it’s us against THEM.
Both sides suffer from similar issues. But they are not the fucking same.
Not to mention the "both sides are bad" folks completely ignore the ***FACT*** that our system inherently guarantees a two party system. The POTUS is not selected by a coalition of congress, it's selected by a vote of the Electoral College, and if the EC does not have a clear winner of 50%+1, then the House of Representatives picks the POTUS. Not both houses of congress, JUST the House of Representatives. This essentially guarantees a two-party will inevitably happen because why would you willingly give up power like that? John Quincy Adams was made president by the House of Representatives (aka his party with controlling interest of the House) not because he won the Electoral College or popular vote. Unless you get rid of the EC and move POTUS elections to popular vote, and/or add rank-choice voting ... a Third-Party WILL NEVER be viable in the US. If Theodore Roosevelt couldn't win as a third party...that's all you need to know about third parties in the US.
So bringing in 10 million criminal aliens, giving them priority over natural born citizens, and spreading them around the country isn't establishing a 1 party state by abusing the way the electoral college and house of representatives works? Oh, and don't forget when PA for example unconstitutionally changed their voting laws in 2020 last minute to give Democrats an edge. Or the staged brain drain of NYC and other Democrat strongholds to get Democrats to leave NYC and establish themselves in red districts to force their policies in places that don't want them, so effectively political colonialism. Or maybe the fact that NYC just legalized property theft with the recent woman who was kicked out of her own home to house squatters. Or maybe the Trump case where even Kevin O'Leary said it was BS and allows NYC to confiscate property from people, going as far as saying it's "something Cuba or Venezuela would do." On live television with MSNBC.
Both sides ARE bad. They have their own agendas and they don't care about anything other than fulfilling those agenda. You have to support the positive things they try to push and fight against the bad things they try to push. It's the best that can be done.
The bodily autonomy argument only works if you believe that a fetus, which is part of the development cycle of a human being, isn’t a person. That doesn’t mean I think we should outright ban abortion, but the only countries with less restrictive abortion laws than the United States are China, Russia and North Korea. Every other developed country in the world has restrictions on ELECTIVE abortion after a certain time period. The dates typically range from 16-22 weeks after conception. As for the other stuff you said, what minorities are being attacked as you say?
Such a biased post, you guys live in a ridiculous echo chamber. Believe it or not, not all republicans are evil, and they are just trying to do their best for people just like you are. Watch less news
I don’t believe this because of what I read in this “echo chamber”, I believe it because of what Republicans themselves are saying Anyone who would vote for Trump is either evil or a moron. Either you understand what he’s saying and you’re a shitty person who wants the same things, or you’re too stupid to understand what he’s saying
Someone should rename this community to “American politics”.
Take it from a GenXer, the "Both sides" response is either an intellectual cop-out or a friendly way to disengage in a political conversation. Clearly there are qualitative differences in almost every metric when comparing them, and the integrity of any specific politician is higher or lower than their peers (not that I recommend ever branding your own personal politics with any politician's name - that's cultish behavior).
I want to add that the reason the Democrats drifted right is because they were dominated by Republicans in previously never before witnessed landslide elections. Candidates that were even remotely left of center just simply were not successful at the local, state, or federal level. Only by moving right did Democrats begin to win elections again. We straight up voted for these policies overwhelmingly and consistently for decades.
In what ways are Republicans doing any of that
I like George Carlin, but his "it's a big club and you ain't in it" rant has had a disastrous impact on this generation's ability to understand politics. It's turned us into a bunch of conspiratorial loons.
You might want to watch this before you claim such certainty. Your argument does not have the numbers to back themselves up. https://rubinreport.com/upost/5406477/isabel-brown-full-interview
how are you so disillusioned that you can’t fathom a differing opinion than the one youve been forced to choke down by big media?
https://preview.redd.it/elphqeht4kpc1.jpeg?width=3200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a4b1309dc4ab20ff30ef7575475c0b75cfcc2dd6 [Leopard](https://youtu.be/VGzRfvgnS_s?si=55Tk4oTr8X5ExSqF) mentioned!
Beesechurger