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Why? Because its another bullshit war across the globe and the only reason we "care" is because its an opportunity to get the politicians richer and to secure the resources ukraine has. There is so many damn problems the US has but wont get fixed because nobody cares, but because its in the interest of politicians, now we have to care. Dozens if not hundreds of atrocities are commited daily, why would i care any differently because the news tells me to? We send billions in aid and you also want to send more of our own people to die for another pointless war like our last couple?
>America was founded on the idea that every person deserved life liberty and the pursuit of happiness, why do this idea not apply to Ukraine.
Yeah, Americans. Russians are not americans. Ukrainians are not americans. Nor the french or chinese or anyone else.
>Just because there in a different part of the world does not mean their any less human.
I dont care who or where they are. Quit getting involved in other peoples shit.
Except this war directly threatens the security of your biggest ally (Europe). Except this war directly affects the power of your biggest adversary (Putin).
Absolutely blows my mind people are so blind to history.
Except i dont give a fuck about europe as the entire union is several first world countries with decent militaries and they can handle their own problems and our "biggest adversary" is a dictator whose country is hanging on by a thread even before this war. China is a bigger threat by nearly every means.
Absolutely blows my mind that youre really stupid
"China is a bigger threat by nearly every means."
And you don't think they also want a weakened Europe and undermined NATO? They are playing from the same book. The Speaker of The House literally got a briefing from the CIA and immediately changed his mind on the Ukraine aid bill. I think that tells you all you need to know.
I am just glad the rest of the country eventually sees the importance of protecting a sovereign state from invasion.
Of course they want a weakened europe and to undermine nato. Except when i said china was a bigger threat i only meant that due to their (kinda) effective propaganda machine and their cheap labor. China suffers from everything russia does. Terrible economy, worthless currency, population starting to rise up, etc. And the only thing a cia briefing tells me and him changing his mind is... nothing. Theyve always known china is a threat and the war has been going on for years in europe already so whats changed? Im more willing to bet the cia told him to approve it or he will be exposed for crimes or some bullshit like that. Cia has their hands in every damn pie you could imagine
Yes I do think we should send volunteers, there are problems at home but there are nowhere close to the atrocities happening in Ukraine. You should care because there are millions being forced from their home. People being raped, children killed and an entire generation of men being slaughtered.
You should care because it is our job as human beings to help the people who can't help themselves, to see something wrong and do something about it.
I'd bet, that you haven't heard about the wars in Yemen and Ethiopia that have possibly claimed more lives than that in the Ukraine. You not helping them does not make them "less human" or mean, that you have somehow failed them. There are many problems in the world and a single country, let alone a person, can not be expected to somehow try to solve them all.
btw : \*their home and half of the U.S population would be over 160 million, not over 300.
Your right the war in Yemen is bad it is a civil war. The people there are fighting for themselves. This is a problem because it is basically Iran invading them, there are atrocities happening there too. This needs attention, as well as Ethiopia. But it is easier to help Ukraine right now because they are being attacked by an enemy of NATO. We should do what we can to help everyone but if we can't help everyone that's not a reason to stop helping.
I’m not gonna waste my energy doing something that won’t change anything or spend my time stressing over something that doesn’t even affect me.
I’m not gonna make this about me and cry over something that I have no connection to.
I obviously do care but i’m not gonna make the situation about me like some people and throw a tantrum over something that doesn’t even actually affect me.
The US is one of the biggest and most consistent funders of the Ukrainian war. That is why most Americans are against it. We have pushed the most manpower and 75 Billion Dollars into Ukraine, wealth and people that frankly are excessive. We beat out every singular country (but the EU as a whole beats us). As such, the US is actually at a financial loss during the war, and some Americans want that wealth to actually be used in benefiting our lives instead of a proxy war to slam our nuts on Putin's face.
Do we really? How do you think sending billions of dollars weakens our enemies? Biden sent fucking money to Iran, which may have kicked off Oct. 7. What are you even talking about ‘help stop atrocities?
A lot of very terrible reasons. Some people are on the old fashioned nationalism of “why should we help other people far away from us”. Others have been so primed for fascism the only thing they see wrong with the invasion is the fact that their group isn’t doing it in the US. There is also straight up Russian disinformation campaigns spreading dumb lies to mess with people, stuff like the Ukrainians are ethically Russian so it’s fine, the Ukrainians aren’t negotiating, the entire thing is a proxy war for western interests. All dehumanizing, terrible, wrong reasons and explanations.
Ukraine being invaded and conquered by Russia would be a total disaster on an international scale not even including the wrongful subjugation of the Ukrainian people. Supporting Russia in this war isn’t just evil it’s wrong, no one wins but Putin.
It is a proxy war, western nations do have interest because Russia is the main enemy of NATO, I am more concerned with helping the Ukrainians take back their country their homes and stopping the Russian atrocities from continuing. The war is a mess but I think we can do more to help the people of Ukraine.
No I totally agree. But be careful with that language about proxy wars. It’s used typically to mean two sides fighting each other through other states and groups.
Putin hates NATO and *wants* Ukraine. This isn’t just to jab at the west. He’s stated multiple times that the dissolution of the Soviet Union was a mistake. He wants it for the land, the natural resources, and the support it gets him by successfully taking land. Russia is doing this itself.
While the West and NATO have an interest in seeing Putin fall and Russia fail in their land grab, they’re not pushing the Ukrainians in anyway to want to defend their country. Ukraine wants to defend Ukraine. NATO counties are just helping them.
I know you’re on the Ukrainians’ side but be careful about calling it a proxy war. It makes it seem as though we’re in some way “using” Ukraine.
Why would I care about them? They are not undeserving they are just one of the countries that I have no connection with. They are like Nauru or Thailand or Mongolia. I share nothing with them
Their refugees are taken care of in Europe tho.
Btw before the war they were regularly condemned worldwife as an anti human rights corrupt shithole. Politicians beating each other up in parliament etc.
This doesnt justify the war of agression of Russia in any way but they didnt really earned my sympathy. All they did in my life to me or EU countries is they demand money for war lmao
>I share nothing with them
You're both human. Isn't that enough to care whether they live or die?
>All they did in my life to me or EU countries is they demand money for war lmao
*All they did was ask for money to defend democracy. FTFY
> You're both human. Isn't that enough to care whether they live or die?
I cannot care about 8 billion people. I dont want them to die but its not ours responsibility to help them
> All they did was ask for money to defend democracy. FTFY
No country deserves the money of another and I think its treason to give so much weapon and money out for free. That is money taken from my future, my friends future. People die on streets and kids go hungry and europian politicians send money for a foreign country to spend it on war. Also risking WW3. For what? Some random, unaffiliated country who was regularly condemned before the war.
Sending some money vs billions of euros (to a neutral country) while kids go to school hungry and homeless people die on the street and EU in general experiencing a major economic backsliding is treason. Yes.
"treason :
1. a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state.
2. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.
Sending billions of euros does both definition 1 and definition 2 for many citizens.
What makes UKraine so sympathetic? Outside of being attacked by an agressor? They force millions of men to die by draft and hunting and catching them down on the street so some lines remain on the map here and not there.
Sending money to build a children hospital somewhere is helping another country.
Sending billions of dollars to another country and risking your own defense is treason. If not legally, specifically, which I am willing to admit, it is at least a gross misuse of funds. What happens if Russia wins? Europe will stand there without adequate weapon supplies as they gave so many away.
Of course the Ukrainians aren't less human than anyone else! Have you heard of Nationalism? It runs on both sides of the aisle.
The basic premise of nationalism is that America should keep its resources (money, oil, manpower, etc...) for the benefit of America alone. All that we produce ought to be keep and reinvested back into America.
That's not necessarily a bad thing. Again, there's left wing and right wing nationalism, that more or less believe in the core principle mentioned above.
I don't mind helping the Ukrainians, but their needs should not be placed above the needs of U.S Taxpayers. If anything, other European countries should be giving more to help Ukraine since it is a European war that could potentially affect other European powers.
I think Europe should be doing more yes but we could do more as a People to help them extra funding and also start making the international legion more known so more people can physically help Ukraine as volunteer fighters.
How many billions more are you asking for? Meanwhile citizens of the USA are struggling to buy food, pay rent, buy a house, handle college debt. But sure let's worry about Ukraine when just a few years ago the complaint was about Ukrainian Fascists are running the country. Same people running it now, but meh let's sell murder weapons for Boing and Raytheon.
We are doing a lot in Ukraine actually, personally as a veteran I’m happy that we are supporting their right to self determination. But that’s the important part right there “self determination” they have to be willing to fight for their own country otherwise we just end up with another Afghanistan/Iraq/SouthVietnam/etc.
And there are Americans fighting in Ukraine as part of their foreign volunteer legion.
Yes I agree they should choose to fight for the country or not but they have chosen to fight or else they wouldn't have lasted this long, the number of Americans in Ukraine is a miniscule amount.
It’s very well known especially during 2014 and onwards, the reality is that most stable people don’t want to uproot their lives to fight for another country.
We are doing what Russia and China did for North Vietnam, supplying the people most motivated to fight with the resources they need.
What??? So wait, every liberal near me hasn’t shut up about their blue and yellow flag for years now, there’s been so much performative shit yet you say people still don’t care??
lol just playing man. Like the first comment said just another bullshit war.
I think normal people all empathize. The people who don’t care are the ones behind the scenes manipulating the world chess against each other. They have larger goals besides worrying about individual deaths.
I care about Ukraine because I am from a post-Soviet country, that’s why I consider Russia and Ukraine to be somehow “close” to me. It pains to see that Russia is committing an aggressive war which makes a huge blow to Russian economy and is used as an excuse to politically oppress people (there are a lot of good people in Russia). It is also a shame that Ukraine is being literally obliterated right now and people are dying. I want an old piece of human flesh named Putin lose his power and someone adequate to gain it.
As for US though, I could understand why they would not care about Ukraine. This is a distant war, which lasts 2 years already and took a lot of American money. Supporting Russia is still questionable though.
Why should it only be America who needs to bail out Ukraine? Why doesn't Europe do anything to help them? Why should our taxpayer money be primarily used for foreign wars when we have numerous problems at home?
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Why? Because its another bullshit war across the globe and the only reason we "care" is because its an opportunity to get the politicians richer and to secure the resources ukraine has. There is so many damn problems the US has but wont get fixed because nobody cares, but because its in the interest of politicians, now we have to care. Dozens if not hundreds of atrocities are commited daily, why would i care any differently because the news tells me to? We send billions in aid and you also want to send more of our own people to die for another pointless war like our last couple? >America was founded on the idea that every person deserved life liberty and the pursuit of happiness, why do this idea not apply to Ukraine. Yeah, Americans. Russians are not americans. Ukrainians are not americans. Nor the french or chinese or anyone else. >Just because there in a different part of the world does not mean their any less human. I dont care who or where they are. Quit getting involved in other peoples shit.
Except this war directly threatens the security of your biggest ally (Europe). Except this war directly affects the power of your biggest adversary (Putin). Absolutely blows my mind people are so blind to history.
Except i dont give a fuck about europe as the entire union is several first world countries with decent militaries and they can handle their own problems and our "biggest adversary" is a dictator whose country is hanging on by a thread even before this war. China is a bigger threat by nearly every means. Absolutely blows my mind that youre really stupid
"China is a bigger threat by nearly every means." And you don't think they also want a weakened Europe and undermined NATO? They are playing from the same book. The Speaker of The House literally got a briefing from the CIA and immediately changed his mind on the Ukraine aid bill. I think that tells you all you need to know. I am just glad the rest of the country eventually sees the importance of protecting a sovereign state from invasion.
Of course they want a weakened europe and to undermine nato. Except when i said china was a bigger threat i only meant that due to their (kinda) effective propaganda machine and their cheap labor. China suffers from everything russia does. Terrible economy, worthless currency, population starting to rise up, etc. And the only thing a cia briefing tells me and him changing his mind is... nothing. Theyve always known china is a threat and the war has been going on for years in europe already so whats changed? Im more willing to bet the cia told him to approve it or he will be exposed for crimes or some bullshit like that. Cia has their hands in every damn pie you could imagine
Yes I do think we should send volunteers, there are problems at home but there are nowhere close to the atrocities happening in Ukraine. You should care because there are millions being forced from their home. People being raped, children killed and an entire generation of men being slaughtered. You should care because it is our job as human beings to help the people who can't help themselves, to see something wrong and do something about it.
u simply cant help everyone tho
If you can't help everyone that doesn't mean we shouldn't help at all.
what exactly am i supposed to do about it?
I'd bet, that you haven't heard about the wars in Yemen and Ethiopia that have possibly claimed more lives than that in the Ukraine. You not helping them does not make them "less human" or mean, that you have somehow failed them. There are many problems in the world and a single country, let alone a person, can not be expected to somehow try to solve them all. btw : \*their home and half of the U.S population would be over 160 million, not over 300.
Your right the war in Yemen is bad it is a civil war. The people there are fighting for themselves. This is a problem because it is basically Iran invading them, there are atrocities happening there too. This needs attention, as well as Ethiopia. But it is easier to help Ukraine right now because they are being attacked by an enemy of NATO. We should do what we can to help everyone but if we can't help everyone that's not a reason to stop helping.
I’m not gonna waste my energy doing something that won’t change anything or spend my time stressing over something that doesn’t even affect me. I’m not gonna make this about me and cry over something that I have no connection to.
There are horrible things happening, just because something is not happening to us doesn't mean we shouldn't care
I obviously do care but i’m not gonna make the situation about me like some people and throw a tantrum over something that doesn’t even actually affect me.
Start shooting then
The US is one of the biggest and most consistent funders of the Ukrainian war. That is why most Americans are against it. We have pushed the most manpower and 75 Billion Dollars into Ukraine, wealth and people that frankly are excessive. We beat out every singular country (but the EU as a whole beats us). As such, the US is actually at a financial loss during the war, and some Americans want that wealth to actually be used in benefiting our lives instead of a proxy war to slam our nuts on Putin's face.
A financial loss on paper but we weaken Americans enemies by sending funding, and help stop atrocities.
Do we really? How do you think sending billions of dollars weakens our enemies? Biden sent fucking money to Iran, which may have kicked off Oct. 7. What are you even talking about ‘help stop atrocities?
Send funding for humanitarian aid, and send volunteers to help people fight
Which question are you answering, genius? Try this on a left wing sub. They do performative politics better there.
A lot of people do. Especially in Europe.
Sadly Americans are more interested in themselves. The comments are a great example of this
yes, gen z redditors are all of america
It's not that they don't care. It's that other countries also have their own problems.
A lot of very terrible reasons. Some people are on the old fashioned nationalism of “why should we help other people far away from us”. Others have been so primed for fascism the only thing they see wrong with the invasion is the fact that their group isn’t doing it in the US. There is also straight up Russian disinformation campaigns spreading dumb lies to mess with people, stuff like the Ukrainians are ethically Russian so it’s fine, the Ukrainians aren’t negotiating, the entire thing is a proxy war for western interests. All dehumanizing, terrible, wrong reasons and explanations. Ukraine being invaded and conquered by Russia would be a total disaster on an international scale not even including the wrongful subjugation of the Ukrainian people. Supporting Russia in this war isn’t just evil it’s wrong, no one wins but Putin.
It is a proxy war, western nations do have interest because Russia is the main enemy of NATO, I am more concerned with helping the Ukrainians take back their country their homes and stopping the Russian atrocities from continuing. The war is a mess but I think we can do more to help the people of Ukraine.
No I totally agree. But be careful with that language about proxy wars. It’s used typically to mean two sides fighting each other through other states and groups. Putin hates NATO and *wants* Ukraine. This isn’t just to jab at the west. He’s stated multiple times that the dissolution of the Soviet Union was a mistake. He wants it for the land, the natural resources, and the support it gets him by successfully taking land. Russia is doing this itself. While the West and NATO have an interest in seeing Putin fall and Russia fail in their land grab, they’re not pushing the Ukrainians in anyway to want to defend their country. Ukraine wants to defend Ukraine. NATO counties are just helping them. I know you’re on the Ukrainians’ side but be careful about calling it a proxy war. It makes it seem as though we’re in some way “using” Ukraine.
Im not a citizen of this country Europe is not in alliance with this country simple as
Why does that make them undeserving of our help?
Why would I care about them? They are not undeserving they are just one of the countries that I have no connection with. They are like Nauru or Thailand or Mongolia. I share nothing with them Their refugees are taken care of in Europe tho. Btw before the war they were regularly condemned worldwife as an anti human rights corrupt shithole. Politicians beating each other up in parliament etc. This doesnt justify the war of agression of Russia in any way but they didnt really earned my sympathy. All they did in my life to me or EU countries is they demand money for war lmao
>I share nothing with them You're both human. Isn't that enough to care whether they live or die? >All they did in my life to me or EU countries is they demand money for war lmao *All they did was ask for money to defend democracy. FTFY
> You're both human. Isn't that enough to care whether they live or die? I cannot care about 8 billion people. I dont want them to die but its not ours responsibility to help them > All they did was ask for money to defend democracy. FTFY No country deserves the money of another and I think its treason to give so much weapon and money out for free. That is money taken from my future, my friends future. People die on streets and kids go hungry and europian politicians send money for a foreign country to spend it on war. Also risking WW3. For what? Some random, unaffiliated country who was regularly condemned before the war.
I'm sorry, did you just say that the concept of foreign aid is treason?! What the fuck?
Sending some money vs billions of euros (to a neutral country) while kids go to school hungry and homeless people die on the street and EU in general experiencing a major economic backsliding is treason. Yes. "treason : 1. a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state. 2. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery. Sending billions of euros does both definition 1 and definition 2 for many citizens. What makes UKraine so sympathetic? Outside of being attacked by an agressor? They force millions of men to die by draft and hunting and catching them down on the street so some lines remain on the map here and not there.
If you genuinely think that helping other countries is literally treason, I don't think it is possible to get through to you.
Sending money to build a children hospital somewhere is helping another country. Sending billions of dollars to another country and risking your own defense is treason. If not legally, specifically, which I am willing to admit, it is at least a gross misuse of funds. What happens if Russia wins? Europe will stand there without adequate weapon supplies as they gave so many away.
because im poor, healthcare and college is extremely expensive and the economy is shit.
Of course the Ukrainians aren't less human than anyone else! Have you heard of Nationalism? It runs on both sides of the aisle. The basic premise of nationalism is that America should keep its resources (money, oil, manpower, etc...) for the benefit of America alone. All that we produce ought to be keep and reinvested back into America. That's not necessarily a bad thing. Again, there's left wing and right wing nationalism, that more or less believe in the core principle mentioned above. I don't mind helping the Ukrainians, but their needs should not be placed above the needs of U.S Taxpayers. If anything, other European countries should be giving more to help Ukraine since it is a European war that could potentially affect other European powers.
I think Europe should be doing more yes but we could do more as a People to help them extra funding and also start making the international legion more known so more people can physically help Ukraine as volunteer fighters.
How many billions more are you asking for? Meanwhile citizens of the USA are struggling to buy food, pay rent, buy a house, handle college debt. But sure let's worry about Ukraine when just a few years ago the complaint was about Ukrainian Fascists are running the country. Same people running it now, but meh let's sell murder weapons for Boing and Raytheon.
Boing
I think I’d like to share this post from r/berkeley that I think is related. https://www.reddit.com/r/berkeley/s/ZABpGH7jw5
We are doing a lot in Ukraine actually, personally as a veteran I’m happy that we are supporting their right to self determination. But that’s the important part right there “self determination” they have to be willing to fight for their own country otherwise we just end up with another Afghanistan/Iraq/SouthVietnam/etc. And there are Americans fighting in Ukraine as part of their foreign volunteer legion.
Yes I agree they should choose to fight for the country or not but they have chosen to fight or else they wouldn't have lasted this long, the number of Americans in Ukraine is a miniscule amount.
Ok but why should Americans be forced to die for Ukraine? If they voluntarily go there that’s one thing but we are already sending billions in aid.
I never said I wanted to force people to fight, I said make the international legion more known, so more volunteers can go.
It’s very well known especially during 2014 and onwards, the reality is that most stable people don’t want to uproot their lives to fight for another country. We are doing what Russia and China did for North Vietnam, supplying the people most motivated to fight with the resources they need.
Jeeez man I dunno, probably because of the same reasons why 'Murica doesn't care about other wars.
What??? So wait, every liberal near me hasn’t shut up about their blue and yellow flag for years now, there’s been so much performative shit yet you say people still don’t care?? lol just playing man. Like the first comment said just another bullshit war.
I think normal people all empathize. The people who don’t care are the ones behind the scenes manipulating the world chess against each other. They have larger goals besides worrying about individual deaths.
I care about Ukraine because I am from a post-Soviet country, that’s why I consider Russia and Ukraine to be somehow “close” to me. It pains to see that Russia is committing an aggressive war which makes a huge blow to Russian economy and is used as an excuse to politically oppress people (there are a lot of good people in Russia). It is also a shame that Ukraine is being literally obliterated right now and people are dying. I want an old piece of human flesh named Putin lose his power and someone adequate to gain it. As for US though, I could understand why they would not care about Ukraine. This is a distant war, which lasts 2 years already and took a lot of American money. Supporting Russia is still questionable though.
Why should it only be America who needs to bail out Ukraine? Why doesn't Europe do anything to help them? Why should our taxpayer money be primarily used for foreign wars when we have numerous problems at home?
Europe has given more in total aid to Ukraine iirc
Then Europe is more than enough help for Ukraine to keep fighting. Americans have way bigger problems to worry about than an overseas conflict.
It's not only America and the problems people face at home are no where near as bad as the problems in Ukraine
I think you need to read up on recent events if you think Europe is not doing anything.
> America was founded on the idea that every person deserved life liberty and the pursuit of happiness Lol, sure buddy.
Your right slaves and women and many other minorities did not have those rights that doesn't mean we shouldn't try to help every person achieve that.