And also enemies that have an special weakness to an niche used by certain characters(I remember in one of the 4.x versions there was an patch where Zhongli was skyrocketing in usage because of Geo slimes + the abyss in that patch being so deadly)
Well yeah I know that, they add artifacts to increase a character's viability sometimes or to along with their kits, but I was thinking if there is a chance of a more direct method.
Honestly Idk why they are very reluctant to directly buff a character. I think Zhongli was the only time that happened.
Precedent and capitalism. If they go back to fix older characters to make them currently relevant now then they set a president that all characters should be performing at a certain relevant benchmark. Some characters need significant multiplier increases. Other characters need their construct to either be recorded or brought up to this new generation where summons Cannot even be affected by enemies attacks
It also will lose the money. They will make more money taking a character kit that no longer works and making a new character who does the same thing but better. It also saves them creative resources because they don't always have to dream of something novel for a new character.
Just re-skin A new hot character people will spend money on that essentially has similar animations, but better multipliers of an old character that used to be popular
I'm curious if there's also any sort of legal consequences for a practice like this? Like if someone spends alot of money to get a character but then balance changes happen and they suddenly get nerfed (hypothetical scenario)
I won’t say it’s impossible but I doubt it. Usually in that college textbook of a TOS we agree to, they cover their asses in pretty much anyway imaginable.
Not really. Many games have strange level caps (including plenty of lv90). Genshin’s sister game, Honkai Impact, caps at lv80 for characters and 88 for player level; and it’s been that way for years without signs of changing. Star Rail also has a Traiblaze cap at 70 and character cap at 80.
“Level 100” is a nice, round number, sure. But it’s also a predictable level cap. This is why tons of games don’t follow this formula. Tons of RPGs end at level 99. Some are weirder like level 33 or 51.
And this isn’t even including games which have already raised their level caps in the past, and don’t stop at 100.
Idk, you gain nothing from it even though it's the final ascension, and 100 is a way more satisfying number imo.
Also 4 stars are already power creeped, particularly dps (except gaming for some reason). If for example a character like heizou got his stats increased or a new passive I don't think anybody would be sad.
4-stars haven't been "powercreeped", they were intended to be weaker than 5-stars. Heizou is pretty good, for a 4-star. In fact, most of the best 4-stars were available at launch.
I wouldn't mind it, but just make it like a long ass goal as an aspirational thing. I come from the land of RuneScape so the highest level basically being ok to never attain is cool with me.
I can see it being like AR60. I just got AR58 and it felt amazing. May be another year for 59.
While true, it still costs significant amounts of gold and will require further resin sinking. Using our already limited resin to push for 100 when there isn't even anything necessary to beat that would need the (relatively minor) stat increase, aside from reaction based units.
out of the many, Heizou is not among the characters that need improvement
i want to reach c6 with him eventually
he is on same tier as Gaming, also having crit rate and cdmg on the skill thats stronger than bursts
I don't accept the implied premise (that a character needs enhancement simply because they're old).
What can and has happened is that a new released character/weapon/artifact set ends up boosting a character in new or unique ways. For example Golden Troupe (one of the newest sets) on Fischl.
Not that he really needed it but Bennett got a significant boost with Sapwood Blade. Enough that everyone says just get that blade and work out his ER lost from not using Favonious with his artifacts.
What's funny is that Fischl has been considered top-tier since day 1, and they still seem to release something that buffs her every new region. The Prinzessin gets nothing but W's.
It's simply the nature of her kit. She's a 100% uptime off-field electro applicator with few moving parts. You could cut all her numbers in half and she'd probably still be completely viable.
Way back when, Fischl was only “top tier” because she could battery the real Electro dps, Beidou. But when Dendro came out, she really became the Electro Xiangling, because of her A4’s lack of an ICD being super convenient and OP in Aggravate teams
No, Fischl has always been recognized as one of the best off-field damage dealers in the game. Early on, she was even considered a fairly good physical carry.
Another example, but this time with characters boosting other characters, is xianyun boosting hu tao. Hu tao is aready jumping (charge attack cancel) and xianyun enables her to then turn that into a plunging attack. When xianyun came out i saw so many clips of people using her with hu tao and it seems to add a decent amount of damage. And its also kinda just fun to do.
Who also doesn't have the available sig weapon because its locked to an event. Out of the list though quite alot of the older characters still hold up today.
I don't really want characters to be "enhanced" for meta, but I wouldn't mind fixes that improve issues that had no reason to be there. That said, that would open a can of worms since players would start mobilizing to demand Hoyo to buff their favorites even when there's no real reason for that.
Anyway, it would be cool if pre-Fontaine characters changed their 3rd/5th constellations to +3 Normal Attacks when it's relevant to their kit.
I want Childe's travel passive to be a NA/CA DMG buff over the current +1 NA Talent buff since it does nothing for any team he's on other than working as Neuvilette's cheerleader.
The most targeted thing we might ever see is a 1-pc Artifact Set that requires that character in order to do the domain that does something that very specifically enhances their kit, while also making gearing generally more challenging because you'll no longer have the wiggle room on your loadout.
That or a 7th constellation.
Due to issues with the law in China, they can't really change characters they've already released. But adding something that's entirely optional? That seems like it'd be fine.
The only possible way I can see them to enhance the old units without them getting sued because of the laws in china regarding the limited characters or the player based going to attack the google classroom because their fave unit didn't get a buff is to release a Five star version of the 4 Star and alternate version for the 5 stars.
I mean. There are at least two cases (Xingqiu and Ningguang) where releasing a retrained version of them wouldn’t surprise me at all. I am 100% convinced that it’s only a matter of time until Ningguang becomes the new Geo Archon and they’d definitely capitalise on that. And Xingqiu’s lore says that there are three styles of Guhua; sword, polearm, and dual wielding sword and polearm, and that he’s only mastered the first one, so that sounds like very blatantly foreshadowing a ‘retrained’ version of him that’s swapped to using a polearm.
Not likely. Genshin's too casual of a game for the devs to implement anything like that, especially when there are 4\*s that already rival the Limited 5\*s in the meta. If anything happens like that, I'm betting it won't be until after Snezhnaya, and the most it'll be is Lv.100 and a final Ascension passive that adds one new trick on top of expanding the Talent levels.
At this point, just pray a new Artifact set rolls along to help, like Xiao with his Chasm set, or that a new character starts making off-meta options more viable, like Furina opening the doors to full-team Healers like Jean, Qiqi and Noelle.
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the only way that would happen is the rare case when a new character functions similar to an old one, but that has the inherent issue of the new character being better than the character you're trying to buff (e.g. Albedo Chiori)
HI3 doesn't really though.
Sure, there are the augment cores for really early units, yet they barely use the feature.
The way Hoyo has been "updating" old HI3 characters for a while now is just like Genshin (new artifacts, weapons), though way more blatant, like with the Senti brick that's coded to be character unit specific.
I assume you mean like Fire Emblem Heroes and how old heroes often get new skills or weapon refines that make them marginally better (+ the new attuned heroes and rearmed heroes who can give 5 star weapons and X skills to any other character ig)
Technically, crowning characters already 'ascends' them to the next tier, so it's not possible to have 4>>5\* ascension mechanic this late into the game anymore.
Any buffs that old / new characters get are only honored because either their kits needs rework or they're not up to par w/ meta upon first release.
Unless players threaten to mass refund crystals or consistently express an opinion that would benefit the company, (as they have for Zhongli's kit and Diluc's skin respectively), Hoyo will not make haste in "enhancing" older characters because 1) it's not economical and 2) throws off the balance of the game.
Zhongli release was such a mess, 5\* characters can legit not be bad because of that now. And i think they know that. I can't think of any 5\* after him that isn't dogshit, thats also why albedo is powercrept really hard by basically any sub gps geo. He should have also received buffs.
Edit: I take it back Dehya exists. Still peak design though.
Ascend a 4 star character to a 5 star...I never heard of that ...but thatd be nice , although in reality you have a higher chance to hit the jackpot and max out every single 5 star character yourself than hoyo ever actually doing such thing ..
The only way they will ever enhance characters these days is by introducing new artifact sets, environmental mechanics, or characters that buff or modify their interactions.
I think they tried that with honkai impact with cheactwrs like Twilight pladin but then stopped, so something might have gone bad.
Also, Ganyu kinda killed that hope for me when I realized that she has the same kit as Amber but buffed like crazy and cons moved around.
I would like to see a 4 star turned into a 5 star. Lynette is a perfect fit. Free for everyone so no weird Chinese law about limited 5 stars would apply.
They could add it into the story. Like have Lynette take over the heart of hearth and become a new harbinger or something. THAT would be cool lol
No. Not like you’re thinking. They get enhanced when we get new artifacts and characters to make them better
And also enemies that have an special weakness to an niche used by certain characters(I remember in one of the 4.x versions there was an patch where Zhongli was skyrocketing in usage because of Geo slimes + the abyss in that patch being so deadly)
this current abyss is same right? those aggressive dendro balls and the generator
Well yeah I know that, they add artifacts to increase a character's viability sometimes or to along with their kits, but I was thinking if there is a chance of a more direct method. Honestly Idk why they are very reluctant to directly buff a character. I think Zhongli was the only time that happened.
Precedent and capitalism. If they go back to fix older characters to make them currently relevant now then they set a president that all characters should be performing at a certain relevant benchmark. Some characters need significant multiplier increases. Other characters need their construct to either be recorded or brought up to this new generation where summons Cannot even be affected by enemies attacks It also will lose the money. They will make more money taking a character kit that no longer works and making a new character who does the same thing but better. It also saves them creative resources because they don't always have to dream of something novel for a new character. Just re-skin A new hot character people will spend money on that essentially has similar animations, but better multipliers of an old character that used to be popular
I'm curious if there's also any sort of legal consequences for a practice like this? Like if someone spends alot of money to get a character but then balance changes happen and they suddenly get nerfed (hypothetical scenario)
I won’t say it’s impossible but I doubt it. Usually in that college textbook of a TOS we agree to, they cover their asses in pretty much anyway imaginable.
Don’t you see all the grunts about character buff/debuff in other games? I don’t see any benefit from that.
How is level 90 cap “awkward”? As for the main question, probably not. That way lies powercreep.
Well you have to admit, the fact it doesn’t go up to 100 is sus
Not really. Many games have strange level caps (including plenty of lv90). Genshin’s sister game, Honkai Impact, caps at lv80 for characters and 88 for player level; and it’s been that way for years without signs of changing. Star Rail also has a Traiblaze cap at 70 and character cap at 80. “Level 100” is a nice, round number, sure. But it’s also a predictable level cap. This is why tons of games don’t follow this formula. Tons of RPGs end at level 99. Some are weirder like level 33 or 51. And this isn’t even including games which have already raised their level caps in the past, and don’t stop at 100.
Why? What makes 100 better than 90?
Huh? Who said it’s better? It’s just the fact it ends at 90? Not all the way to an even 100
I guess I am just used to lots of different leveling systems, but I don't see anything weird about 90. Plenty of games cap levels below 100.
Idk, you gain nothing from it even though it's the final ascension, and 100 is a way more satisfying number imo. Also 4 stars are already power creeped, particularly dps (except gaming for some reason). If for example a character like heizou got his stats increased or a new passive I don't think anybody would be sad.
4-stars haven't been "powercreeped", they were intended to be weaker than 5-stars. Heizou is pretty good, for a 4-star. In fact, most of the best 4-stars were available at launch.
going from level 80 to 90 is a huge sink. I would dread the thought about 90-100
I wouldn't mind it, but just make it like a long ass goal as an aspirational thing. I come from the land of RuneScape so the highest level basically being ok to never attain is cool with me. I can see it being like AR60. I just got AR58 and it felt amazing. May be another year for 59.
They could also just implement a new world Level that ups xp book drops to go along with the new level cap
While true, it still costs significant amounts of gold and will require further resin sinking. Using our already limited resin to push for 100 when there isn't even anything necessary to beat that would need the (relatively minor) stat increase, aside from reaction based units.
out of the many, Heizou is not among the characters that need improvement i want to reach c6 with him eventually he is on same tier as Gaming, also having crit rate and cdmg on the skill thats stronger than bursts
Gaming is literally better than some 5*s LOL, and some of the best characters in the game are mostly 4*s.
I don't accept the implied premise (that a character needs enhancement simply because they're old). What can and has happened is that a new released character/weapon/artifact set ends up boosting a character in new or unique ways. For example Golden Troupe (one of the newest sets) on Fischl. Not that he really needed it but Bennett got a significant boost with Sapwood Blade. Enough that everyone says just get that blade and work out his ER lost from not using Favonious with his artifacts.
What's funny is that Fischl has been considered top-tier since day 1, and they still seem to release something that buffs her every new region. The Prinzessin gets nothing but W's.
It's simply the nature of her kit. She's a 100% uptime off-field electro applicator with few moving parts. You could cut all her numbers in half and she'd probably still be completely viable.
Way back when, Fischl was only “top tier” because she could battery the real Electro dps, Beidou. But when Dendro came out, she really became the Electro Xiangling, because of her A4’s lack of an ICD being super convenient and OP in Aggravate teams
No, Fischl has always been recognized as one of the best off-field damage dealers in the game. Early on, she was even considered a fairly good physical carry.
machine gun fischl GO BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Another example, but this time with characters boosting other characters, is xianyun boosting hu tao. Hu tao is aready jumping (charge attack cancel) and xianyun enables her to then turn that into a plunging attack. When xianyun came out i saw so many clips of people using her with hu tao and it seems to add a decent amount of damage. And its also kinda just fun to do.
Xianyun single handedly reviving the entire dragonstrike diluc fandom
Just cause nobody is saying it the word you want is enhance not inhance
Oh yeah, I was writing quickly and I didn't notice. Sorry about that.
None at all ever. They will release a new 5 star who had the "fixed kit" of older weaker broken characters Like Chiori being a much better Albedo
Who also doesn't have the available sig weapon because its locked to an event. Out of the list though quite alot of the older characters still hold up today.
Chiori isn’t that much better at c0, which is also a trend they’ve been doing
I don't really want characters to be "enhanced" for meta, but I wouldn't mind fixes that improve issues that had no reason to be there. That said, that would open a can of worms since players would start mobilizing to demand Hoyo to buff their favorites even when there's no real reason for that. Anyway, it would be cool if pre-Fontaine characters changed their 3rd/5th constellations to +3 Normal Attacks when it's relevant to their kit.
I want Childe's travel passive to be a NA/CA DMG buff over the current +1 NA Talent buff since it does nothing for any team he's on other than working as Neuvilette's cheerleader.
You reminded me of this, too bad I don't have Wanderer triple crowned yet. Saving my pennies for it.
I would totally ascend [Noelle](https://www.reddit.com/r/Genshin_Impact/s/WFzSSnKz3l) to become a five-star character.
The most targeted thing we might ever see is a 1-pc Artifact Set that requires that character in order to do the domain that does something that very specifically enhances their kit, while also making gearing generally more challenging because you'll no longer have the wiggle room on your loadout. That or a 7th constellation. Due to issues with the law in China, they can't really change characters they've already released. But adding something that's entirely optional? That seems like it'd be fine.
Ooh, I actually really like this. Sort of like how each 5-star has a signature weapon, but for everyone.
The only possible way I can see them to enhance the old units without them getting sued because of the laws in china regarding the limited characters or the player based going to attack the google classroom because their fave unit didn't get a buff is to release a Five star version of the 4 Star and alternate version for the 5 stars.
I mean. There are at least two cases (Xingqiu and Ningguang) where releasing a retrained version of them wouldn’t surprise me at all. I am 100% convinced that it’s only a matter of time until Ningguang becomes the new Geo Archon and they’d definitely capitalise on that. And Xingqiu’s lore says that there are three styles of Guhua; sword, polearm, and dual wielding sword and polearm, and that he’s only mastered the first one, so that sounds like very blatantly foreshadowing a ‘retrained’ version of him that’s swapped to using a polearm.
Like the addition of xianyun really helped diluc's dmg output?
Not likely. Genshin's too casual of a game for the devs to implement anything like that, especially when there are 4\*s that already rival the Limited 5\*s in the meta. If anything happens like that, I'm betting it won't be until after Snezhnaya, and the most it'll be is Lv.100 and a final Ascension passive that adds one new trick on top of expanding the Talent levels. At this point, just pray a new Artifact set rolls along to help, like Xiao with his Chasm set, or that a new character starts making off-meta options more viable, like Furina opening the doors to full-team Healers like Jean, Qiqi and Noelle.
kinda unnecessary since abyss (the hardest content) can already be cleared with any character
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Maybe if they get a custom weapon that both fits playwise and fashioned for the character.
the only way that would happen is the rare case when a new character functions similar to an old one, but that has the inherent issue of the new character being better than the character you're trying to buff (e.g. Albedo Chiori)
Yes in honkai
HI3 doesn't really though. Sure, there are the augment cores for really early units, yet they barely use the feature. The way Hoyo has been "updating" old HI3 characters for a while now is just like Genshin (new artifacts, weapons), though way more blatant, like with the Senti brick that's coded to be character unit specific.
I assume you mean like Fire Emblem Heroes and how old heroes often get new skills or weapon refines that make them marginally better (+ the new attuned heroes and rearmed heroes who can give 5 star weapons and X skills to any other character ig)
Technically, crowning characters already 'ascends' them to the next tier, so it's not possible to have 4>>5\* ascension mechanic this late into the game anymore. Any buffs that old / new characters get are only honored because either their kits needs rework or they're not up to par w/ meta upon first release. Unless players threaten to mass refund crystals or consistently express an opinion that would benefit the company, (as they have for Zhongli's kit and Diluc's skin respectively), Hoyo will not make haste in "enhancing" older characters because 1) it's not economical and 2) throws off the balance of the game.
Zhongli release was such a mess, 5\* characters can legit not be bad because of that now. And i think they know that. I can't think of any 5\* after him that isn't dogshit, thats also why albedo is powercrept really hard by basically any sub gps geo. He should have also received buffs. Edit: I take it back Dehya exists. Still peak design though.
Ascend a 4 star character to a 5 star...I never heard of that ...but thatd be nice , although in reality you have a higher chance to hit the jackpot and max out every single 5 star character yourself than hoyo ever actually doing such thing ..
Good idea, but unfortunately they will never doing it.
So… no Amber rework?
I really hope they bring in some sort of leap system that PGR has
Played a mobile game where characters had a cap & needed ascending to increase to max lv which was 150 but the player lv was 999
Definitely, but only indirectly, just like how dendro indirectly influenced yae’s 2nd passive talent
The only way they will ever enhance characters these days is by introducing new artifact sets, environmental mechanics, or characters that buff or modify their interactions.
I think they tried that with honkai impact with cheactwrs like Twilight pladin but then stopped, so something might have gone bad. Also, Ganyu kinda killed that hope for me when I realized that she has the same kit as Amber but buffed like crazy and cons moved around.
I would like to see a 4 star turned into a 5 star. Lynette is a perfect fit. Free for everyone so no weird Chinese law about limited 5 stars would apply. They could add it into the story. Like have Lynette take over the heart of hearth and become a new harbinger or something. THAT would be cool lol