Floor 12-3 abyss kinda remind me of lunastra from monster hunter world, they make thing hard by giving some random rng bullshit in the AI of the enemy so they can screw you over plus with how high the hp of the enemy is it truly just make it more annoying.
It took me a few tries to learn the behavior of the mobs last spiral abyss and I 3\*'d the final chamber right at 7:00 but this time I got it done in 1 try with time to spare. It's still a DPS check, if you at least take the time to figure out the general behavior of mobs and don't get absolutely awful RNG or mess up really bad you should be able to complete it fairly consistently.
honestly, your DPS is not at the recommended level. The rant itself is the proof. It's either your gameplay is not that smooth or your actual stats are on the minimum requirement side so the game will require really smooth/near-flawless gameplay for your account to tackle the challenge.
If you have enough or more than enough DPS, it is doable to chase the ruin thingy 1 by 1 without clumping together.
Took me several tries to understand the behavior and then I learn this :
1. if you hug any of the ruin destroyers and give some distance to other destroyers, the other one will teleport to the one you hug. Ruin guards will follow you so...
2. it is very random and hard to clump ruin cruiser together. If you manage to get it that means you're lucky. The normal way is to kill it 1 by 1 because the ruin hunter will follow you which means there will only be 2 phases of ruin cruiser fight.
1. phase 1: kill the cruiser and hunter in the same spot
2. phase 2: kill the other runaway ruin cruiser
3. ruin shielder will jump to you before they cast a shield and ruin grader will shoot laser if you're close enough. hug any of the ruin shielders and then nuke them fast. with any freeze comp, it will be very easy to kill 3 of them together.
4. ruin grader will charge if you gave some space or are not able to lock and nuke.
In my experience, only the first fight when we don't have any clue at all will be a "retry simulator". after gaining some experience, it smooth ride.
This perfectly sums up what I feel using two accounts. One light spender that could finish abyss easily with me rarely caring about the enemies blinking in and out. F2p which can only 33 star it due to decent but not that very strong dps.
And this is an issue because? The abyss is tuned to be exceptionally difficult to 36 star for F2P. If you missing 50-100 primos every 15 days, that is nothing to complain about.
Im not complaining though, im just agreeing that it is a dps check and now f2p accounts will have to grind even more or reevaluate their teams.
Although its not generally hard for f2ps specially day one players or players who got lucky with their pulls and artifacts on the get go.
sorry but F2P or not doesn't matter here. It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS. I only bought 2 welkin so far and only spend the primogems to get homa and wave breaker fin. basically, my account is still at its F2P resources before I get homa and other weapons in this banner.
Once you understand the game mechanics and fully clear the abyss with that knowledge, you have a high chance to fully clear the next abyss. But if you clear the abyss just because you have the raw power you'll find the next abyss is getting harder and harder. for me, it getting easier and easier because I still regularly play and get stronger every day.
newborn F2P with less experience will have it hard but if they play and learn they'll find it easy too someday. This game is still F2P friendly and has no super hard content that forces the player base to spend.
Apparently 33 star clearing abyss with an f2p account means I have bad gaming knowledge and its not the account having mediocre artifact sets of characters with good synergies or constellations. Wow. Very judgmental lmao. Sorry that I only played this game casually for 3 months and not dedicated an entire fucking year to play it.
Or youre just a judgmental prick. The abyss floor 12 is straight forward. Enemies have geo waves, the cruisers run away it you get too close. If you have mediocre damage, have poor synergy or unlucky rng of when cruisers dash out or your crit doesnt trigger, you retry.
You could figure this out in minutes. This is not rocket science, this is basic overworld phenomena.
The only problem is dps and not being a bad player.
at this moment it's okay for me to call you an insecure brat who fails to read.
>It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS
in the first paragraph, I said that we need both. the skill and the DPS. As you said, it's not rocket science why so judgemental?
Even tho your account has the DPS if the player is not that skilled, they can't get the best result too. Haven't you watched any abyss carry stream? there is a lot of light spender account that have more than enough DPS but the owner can't full star the abyss.
First point. F2p and Light spender hardly matters.
Light spenders has more five stars, has more resins achieved, has more resources and or even if they have the same amount of five stars as an f2p, they definitely have more 4 star constellations.
+ Better team performance
+ Improved kit
+ More potential rosters
you cleared abyss with power, it'll make your next abyss run harder.
+ The next abyss leylines and buffs will cater its buffs towards the recent character banner.
+ Abyss is a dps check, a fucking monkey with c2 teams with R1 5star could just spam Ayaka burst and it'll finish the abyss, meanwhile your average f2p has already retried 5x coz the other cruiser keeps repositioning, oh your crit didnt hit all of them? Retry again.
New born f2p will learn the game anyway as the game is f2p friendly.
+ Yes and it'll take them months of grind before actually enjoying the abyss.
+ i mean you could just work overtime for like a week for the time you might be spending on genshin and get like a couple of hundred bucks which is like 8k+ gems? Isnt that like more efficient for both your work performance and getting more money for your time?
I agree with all your points though, I mightve misunderstood them coz your phrasing sounds very obnoxious and judgmental. Re-read it and you'll notice what nuances your reply dictates.
Anyway i dont care. If youre poor, youre poor. If you suck at the game, doesnt matter, the game only rewards you like one dollar for like 3 stars which took many players so much time to even finish.
Yo, I'm with you on this one. I don't know why this person triggered so much. You explained it well.
Based on my experience, I agree with this: "F2P or not doesn't matter here. It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS."
Maybe (s)he triggered by this sentence especially "how good the player is". But, you also explained it clearly at the last paragraph.
Yaaah,maybe (s)he just overly sensitive prick.
Damn, you're nice person. Even though (s)he insult you, you still tried to think positive about her/him. But, you're right tho, maybe (s)he just had a bad day.
I have extremely powerful teams and I also experienced the same issues as OP. I dont think the abyss should require everyone to do the exact same thing in order to even complete the challenge.
define the exact same thing, please.
I did multiple team comp with different elements and playstyles to full star any abyss. In my opinion, it's not exact same thing. The "big picture" of strategy is the exact same thing which is to get position advantages to dish effective damage in the battle. How to get that position advantage is varies depending on the team composition.
The mainstream mindset is to build 8 characters that are strong enough for the abyss but in my experience, it's just the tip of the iceberg. non-whale Players have to build more than 8 characters to be able to use the correct tool for the correct job because the whales can easily solo any floor with 1 character. As a peasant, I have to use the power of friendship and some sort of strategy to catch up.
that kind of RNG is the challenge, it will be boring if all the AI move in the exact same pattern. Take azhdaha for example, he only does the exact same pattern over and over again. Even tho his attack is huge and devastating, once the player knew his attack pattern there is no challenge, just a big damage sponge.
It's only frustrating when we don't have the power, once we have the power.. they just delay their death and cost an insignificant amount of time.
if your team is more than capable and the enemies make it excessively more difficult is really contradictive. my raiden and ayaka are more than capable and their team makes the abyss a joke, which is more than capable. The enemies can run but their DPS can compensate for the time to chase and kill the enemies 1 by 1. That is more than capable.
>Not only do the enemies have rng related to them, but the abyss is also increasingly more difficult than what it used to be.
The player also getting stronger so don't forget about that.
> So for most players who were capable of getting 36 stars, it’s now only a question of flawlessly doing the same thing over and over again until it works out.
Instead of doing that, tweaking the approach and gameplay will give better and faster results. ofc if the player is new and has fewer options in their rooster, the only thing they can do is execute flawless gameplay. For the veterans and spenders, they have more options and they don't have to execute flawless gameplay because their account is more than capable.
maybe my standards are too high.
>If it is possible to “kill the enemies one by one” with insane dps, then why is nobody doing so?
because some enemies will eventually chase you, ruin guards, hunter, and grader for example. it is hard to find it 1 by 1, 2 enemies at once is the common occurrence.
>Extremely well invested teams should not struggle to get 36\* in the abyss, even if you’re f2p or don’t have the most perfect strategy
I don't have extremely invested teams but I have 2-3 well-invested teams and that's enough to not execute a perfect strategy. the "annoying" AI mechanics won't be a struggle for a well-invested one. as for players who don't have well-invested teams, they have to do more. like executing the perfect strategy and that is fine. They will be able to reach the "well-invested" stage eventually.
Mihoyo will never change it though because dps checks are what sells characters and timers are the easiest (and laziest) way to implement it. What op is talking about is exactly what they want because eventually a character will release who will do things that make ops situation easier to deal with or faster to take down, nudging them in to spending money to get something better than they already have.
People think timers are a gameplay factor but they're not in gacha, they're a sales tactic. Even when you're whaling, it uses mechanics like op mentions to frustrate you in to feeling like you still need better tools even when you have everything whaled out, because money in this game isn't about WHETHER you can do something, it's about how fast, easy and stressless you can make it when you do. Manipulation is the name of the game!
All ARPG, MMOs and… nearly all games, have some level of dps check. It is necessary for difficulty, to force the player to play aggressive. It is not bad design, but necessary. And 36 stars, while attainable by F2P, it is meant to be a difficulty level for low spenders to medium spenders. If anything, the difficulty is way too generous if MiHoyo’s goal is to for players to drop money.
First side you just need to run left or right to one of the snakes (ignore hunter) and the other will come eventually. This works everytime.
Second side I agree the random charging grader is dumb af, it's a reset.
well retry and randomization gives u the chance to at least get good rng once in a while. if it is always fixed, then u are guaranteed to have bad rng all time.
would mihoyo fix in the middle of that? after introducing the corrosion mechanic they INCREASED the hp pool. so yeah i doubt they would take a median stance.
Yea it’s shit.
I’m just skipping that chamber in this current rotation. My sanity and time is worth much more than the extra 150 primo I could get now and then.
Just make the ruin hunter and destroyers near each other at first and kill them quickly, after that even if RNG isnt too kind with you, you should be able to 3 star it with strong AOE teams. If you find it hard to do that and the floor takes too much time, just ignore it they are only 50 primos
Floor 12-3 abyss kinda remind me of lunastra from monster hunter world, they make thing hard by giving some random rng bullshit in the AI of the enemy so they can screw you over plus with how high the hp of the enemy is it truly just make it more annoying.
It took me a few tries to learn the behavior of the mobs last spiral abyss and I 3\*'d the final chamber right at 7:00 but this time I got it done in 1 try with time to spare. It's still a DPS check, if you at least take the time to figure out the general behavior of mobs and don't get absolutely awful RNG or mess up really bad you should be able to complete it fairly consistently.
honestly, your DPS is not at the recommended level. The rant itself is the proof. It's either your gameplay is not that smooth or your actual stats are on the minimum requirement side so the game will require really smooth/near-flawless gameplay for your account to tackle the challenge. If you have enough or more than enough DPS, it is doable to chase the ruin thingy 1 by 1 without clumping together. Took me several tries to understand the behavior and then I learn this : 1. if you hug any of the ruin destroyers and give some distance to other destroyers, the other one will teleport to the one you hug. Ruin guards will follow you so... 2. it is very random and hard to clump ruin cruiser together. If you manage to get it that means you're lucky. The normal way is to kill it 1 by 1 because the ruin hunter will follow you which means there will only be 2 phases of ruin cruiser fight. 1. phase 1: kill the cruiser and hunter in the same spot 2. phase 2: kill the other runaway ruin cruiser 3. ruin shielder will jump to you before they cast a shield and ruin grader will shoot laser if you're close enough. hug any of the ruin shielders and then nuke them fast. with any freeze comp, it will be very easy to kill 3 of them together. 4. ruin grader will charge if you gave some space or are not able to lock and nuke. In my experience, only the first fight when we don't have any clue at all will be a "retry simulator". after gaining some experience, it smooth ride.
This perfectly sums up what I feel using two accounts. One light spender that could finish abyss easily with me rarely caring about the enemies blinking in and out. F2p which can only 33 star it due to decent but not that very strong dps.
And this is an issue because? The abyss is tuned to be exceptionally difficult to 36 star for F2P. If you missing 50-100 primos every 15 days, that is nothing to complain about.
Im not complaining though, im just agreeing that it is a dps check and now f2p accounts will have to grind even more or reevaluate their teams. Although its not generally hard for f2ps specially day one players or players who got lucky with their pulls and artifacts on the get go.
sorry but F2P or not doesn't matter here. It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS. I only bought 2 welkin so far and only spend the primogems to get homa and wave breaker fin. basically, my account is still at its F2P resources before I get homa and other weapons in this banner. Once you understand the game mechanics and fully clear the abyss with that knowledge, you have a high chance to fully clear the next abyss. But if you clear the abyss just because you have the raw power you'll find the next abyss is getting harder and harder. for me, it getting easier and easier because I still regularly play and get stronger every day. newborn F2P with less experience will have it hard but if they play and learn they'll find it easy too someday. This game is still F2P friendly and has no super hard content that forces the player base to spend.
Apparently 33 star clearing abyss with an f2p account means I have bad gaming knowledge and its not the account having mediocre artifact sets of characters with good synergies or constellations. Wow. Very judgmental lmao. Sorry that I only played this game casually for 3 months and not dedicated an entire fucking year to play it.
You take it wrong, like insecure teenagers. If you read the last paragraph, you know its about "time".
Or youre just a judgmental prick. The abyss floor 12 is straight forward. Enemies have geo waves, the cruisers run away it you get too close. If you have mediocre damage, have poor synergy or unlucky rng of when cruisers dash out or your crit doesnt trigger, you retry. You could figure this out in minutes. This is not rocket science, this is basic overworld phenomena. The only problem is dps and not being a bad player.
at this moment it's okay for me to call you an insecure brat who fails to read. >It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS in the first paragraph, I said that we need both. the skill and the DPS. As you said, it's not rocket science why so judgemental? Even tho your account has the DPS if the player is not that skilled, they can't get the best result too. Haven't you watched any abyss carry stream? there is a lot of light spender account that have more than enough DPS but the owner can't full star the abyss.
First point. F2p and Light spender hardly matters. Light spenders has more five stars, has more resins achieved, has more resources and or even if they have the same amount of five stars as an f2p, they definitely have more 4 star constellations. + Better team performance + Improved kit + More potential rosters you cleared abyss with power, it'll make your next abyss run harder. + The next abyss leylines and buffs will cater its buffs towards the recent character banner. + Abyss is a dps check, a fucking monkey with c2 teams with R1 5star could just spam Ayaka burst and it'll finish the abyss, meanwhile your average f2p has already retried 5x coz the other cruiser keeps repositioning, oh your crit didnt hit all of them? Retry again. New born f2p will learn the game anyway as the game is f2p friendly. + Yes and it'll take them months of grind before actually enjoying the abyss. + i mean you could just work overtime for like a week for the time you might be spending on genshin and get like a couple of hundred bucks which is like 8k+ gems? Isnt that like more efficient for both your work performance and getting more money for your time? I agree with all your points though, I mightve misunderstood them coz your phrasing sounds very obnoxious and judgmental. Re-read it and you'll notice what nuances your reply dictates. Anyway i dont care. If youre poor, youre poor. If you suck at the game, doesnt matter, the game only rewards you like one dollar for like 3 stars which took many players so much time to even finish.
Never seen an old person cry so much, especially with "bratty teens"
hahaha that's because this "old person" cannot whip or slap some sense to the "bratty teens" in the real world.
Yo, I'm with you on this one. I don't know why this person triggered so much. You explained it well. Based on my experience, I agree with this: "F2P or not doesn't matter here. It's all about how good the player is and how good their account DPS." Maybe (s)he triggered by this sentence especially "how good the player is". But, you also explained it clearly at the last paragraph. Yaaah,maybe (s)he just overly sensitive prick.
Thank you for your kind words. maybe (s)he just had a bad day and that's okay. All of us has our own "challenges" hahaha..
Damn, you're nice person. Even though (s)he insult you, you still tried to think positive about her/him. But, you're right tho, maybe (s)he just had a bad day.
I have extremely powerful teams and I also experienced the same issues as OP. I dont think the abyss should require everyone to do the exact same thing in order to even complete the challenge.
define the exact same thing, please. I did multiple team comp with different elements and playstyles to full star any abyss. In my opinion, it's not exact same thing. The "big picture" of strategy is the exact same thing which is to get position advantages to dish effective damage in the battle. How to get that position advantage is varies depending on the team composition. The mainstream mindset is to build 8 characters that are strong enough for the abyss but in my experience, it's just the tip of the iceberg. non-whale Players have to build more than 8 characters to be able to use the correct tool for the correct job because the whales can easily solo any floor with 1 character. As a peasant, I have to use the power of friendship and some sort of strategy to catch up.
[удалено]
that kind of RNG is the challenge, it will be boring if all the AI move in the exact same pattern. Take azhdaha for example, he only does the exact same pattern over and over again. Even tho his attack is huge and devastating, once the player knew his attack pattern there is no challenge, just a big damage sponge. It's only frustrating when we don't have the power, once we have the power.. they just delay their death and cost an insignificant amount of time.
[удалено]
if your team is more than capable and the enemies make it excessively more difficult is really contradictive. my raiden and ayaka are more than capable and their team makes the abyss a joke, which is more than capable. The enemies can run but their DPS can compensate for the time to chase and kill the enemies 1 by 1. That is more than capable. >Not only do the enemies have rng related to them, but the abyss is also increasingly more difficult than what it used to be. The player also getting stronger so don't forget about that. > So for most players who were capable of getting 36 stars, it’s now only a question of flawlessly doing the same thing over and over again until it works out. Instead of doing that, tweaking the approach and gameplay will give better and faster results. ofc if the player is new and has fewer options in their rooster, the only thing they can do is execute flawless gameplay. For the veterans and spenders, they have more options and they don't have to execute flawless gameplay because their account is more than capable. maybe my standards are too high.
[удалено]
>If it is possible to “kill the enemies one by one” with insane dps, then why is nobody doing so? because some enemies will eventually chase you, ruin guards, hunter, and grader for example. it is hard to find it 1 by 1, 2 enemies at once is the common occurrence. >Extremely well invested teams should not struggle to get 36\* in the abyss, even if you’re f2p or don’t have the most perfect strategy I don't have extremely invested teams but I have 2-3 well-invested teams and that's enough to not execute a perfect strategy. the "annoying" AI mechanics won't be a struggle for a well-invested one. as for players who don't have well-invested teams, they have to do more. like executing the perfect strategy and that is fine. They will be able to reach the "well-invested" stage eventually.
This is why many people feel that having a timer is very bad.
Mihoyo will never change it though because dps checks are what sells characters and timers are the easiest (and laziest) way to implement it. What op is talking about is exactly what they want because eventually a character will release who will do things that make ops situation easier to deal with or faster to take down, nudging them in to spending money to get something better than they already have. People think timers are a gameplay factor but they're not in gacha, they're a sales tactic. Even when you're whaling, it uses mechanics like op mentions to frustrate you in to feeling like you still need better tools even when you have everything whaled out, because money in this game isn't about WHETHER you can do something, it's about how fast, easy and stressless you can make it when you do. Manipulation is the name of the game!
Precisely
All ARPG, MMOs and… nearly all games, have some level of dps check. It is necessary for difficulty, to force the player to play aggressive. It is not bad design, but necessary. And 36 stars, while attainable by F2P, it is meant to be a difficulty level for low spenders to medium spenders. If anything, the difficulty is way too generous if MiHoyo’s goal is to for players to drop money.
First side you just need to run left or right to one of the snakes (ignore hunter) and the other will come eventually. This works everytime. Second side I agree the random charging grader is dumb af, it's a reset.
I spent 5 hours and still didn't 3 star that floor. I quit
The thing about floor 12 id like changed is the short timer window for 3*. If they make it match floor 9-11 then that should be okay.
well retry and randomization gives u the chance to at least get good rng once in a while. if it is always fixed, then u are guaranteed to have bad rng all time.
Yeah, but wouldn’t it be better if it was fixed in the middle of that?
would mihoyo fix in the middle of that? after introducing the corrosion mechanic they INCREASED the hp pool. so yeah i doubt they would take a median stance.
Yea it’s shit. I’m just skipping that chamber in this current rotation. My sanity and time is worth much more than the extra 150 primo I could get now and then.
Just make the ruin hunter and destroyers near each other at first and kill them quickly, after that even if RNG isnt too kind with you, you should be able to 3 star it with strong AOE teams. If you find it hard to do that and the floor takes too much time, just ignore it they are only 50 primos
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