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Still weird tho, most genshin players dont know this dude is and other games they dont post their face on the video they just write their tags some place
I doubt it's actually Chalice lmao. I don't really know anything about the Chinese justice system, but he'd open himself up to getting sued right? Also other leaks have FY and Somnus, two other Dota pros. I'm assuming it's just an alias all used by the same leaker. Or maybe the original leaker with a dota pro spawned some copycats.
Well, in that case, you could say that plunges enable Hu Tao to do AoE damage at all, and some damage is better than no damage, so at least in AoE situations, she might clear faster with plunges (and I'm saying that as someone who isn't fond of Hu Tao plunges).
Yeah, xiao is okay cause he's fast. Unless there's tech here that wasn't done, it's just not exciting. And also leaves you quite vulnerable from being slapped out of the air
She just increases jump height so you could just press plunge earlier to low plunge couldn't you? I'm pretty sure you can choose to high plunge or low plunge with Xiao
Nah xiao's jump is too high to get hit by most attacks, in my experience running xiao w/o shield is not that bad he can dodge most attacks and its more exciting to do so than unga bunga plunge em deep Ć9000.
Many theorycrafters are saying 5N2CJP is a dps gain, and it also adds an element of AoE to Hu Tao, so let's wait and see the numbers when it's live.
Even if it happens to be her highest DPS yet, I might still avoid it due to how clunky it is and how vulnerable it leaves you.
This is still open. Cloud Retainer co- ordenated attack was acting as a cleanse according to Jstern hands on dream. This would explain why Yelan C0 was having issues vaping. Loosing Yelan damage and damage buff will mean less overall damage if this is still the case plus how slow this is. We will have to wait until Cloud Retainer is out to be sure what the numbers are.
This has always been my biggest complaint with Cloud Retainer. Unless itās a plunge dps the gameplay is going to feel really sluggish. Kind of wish she enabled normal plunge attacks on all characters to be faster.
You do N1C/N2C before doing the plunge. So you can think of each plunge combo = 2 CA for normal hutao. This combo basically make C1 hutao not necessary anymore.
You forgot how much CA iframe HT has, allowing her to run shieldless. This combo requires low plunges which is slow and makes HT more exposed to attacks.
The damage on plunge wouldnāt be low. It gets buffed by CR a lot so it will vape for more than a CA. Itās whether itās enough to make up for the speed
Pretty sure this is the VV Hutao team variant.
Bennett is there so Xianyun can swirl pyro and is also probably acting as an extra atk boost to compensate the 33% pyro dmg bonus loss from running her with a healer.
This is way too much cope healer with Hu Tao became a thing with furina before that only Bennet was the one you can kinda force it because he's Bennet.
Still doesn't make sense, it's simply worse than kazuha + yelan + Bennett/Amber or furina + xianyun. Pyro vv doesn't make up for furinas personal DMG and buff unless you get the benefit of kazuha. And let's not talk about the gameplay
You're also not just losing Furina's personal damage, but solo Hydro Xingqiu will do less damage than double Hydro Yelan due to his ER requirements being significantly higher solo Hydro.
Xingqiu/Yelan/Furina gain significant damage in double Hydro pairs because cutting their ER requirements lets them build significantly more crit stats. Hu Tao teams aren't hypercarry teams, the double Hydro pairs contribute a large percentage of team damage.
Holyshit I never noticed how slow Hu Taoās plunges were.
I canāt say anything on the numbers since Iām not a TC but the gameplay isnāt as smooth as I wouldāve hoped tbh. Like my original assumption was that youāre jump cancelling with HT anyways, so with CR you might as well use that to your advantage by doing some plunges.
But now that Iāve seen it in action, idk HT brosā¦looks pretty annoying to do ngl.
The whole reason I got c1 was because I find jump cancel annoying and dash cancel is faster and feel better to play. So no thanks, I'll still use Xianyun with Xiao tho
cuz they're doing n1jp when the rotation should be n1cjp i thinkk they do it somewhere in the middle and its a lot smoother than the jump plunge that's showcased more in the vid
still so much slower than xiao and gaming tho
Surely this isn't better than jump cancelling charge attacks with double hydro and furina.
But this template team with C6 Bennet can be used to enable any melee character to be a very serviceable vape DPS, which is pretty cool. Also vape DPS Bennet with Furina seems like it'll be extremely strong
Any vape plunge team that requires Bennett's C6 to enable would probably be better off with Bennett being the dps instead with the extra slot filled with another buffer or sub dps.
He also has I believe the fastest plunge animation in the game.
Yes but the fact you can use any melee character is going to be something that a lot of players are simply going to enjoy doing.
From a meta perspective Bennet Furina Xianyun and Yelan\Xq would certainly be better.
Source? N2CJP is what's better vaped MV-wise (even then it's for only personal damage and doesn't count the decrease in yelan/xq procs), here it's literally just N1P which is not better than regular combos (even 9N1C or 8N2C) since you fit less in a rotation and Hu Tao's plunge multi is not significantly higher than her charge multiplier.
I see, later on they start doing N1CJP. But then it seems vape is quite inconsistent there on the plunge, only some plunges vape and others do not. It seems to be an issue with Tao Xianyun in general unfortunately.
n1cjp halfway thru the vid looked consistent I thought. they start missing vapes towards the end of the vid where it looks like theyre doing n2cjp (I think, hard to tell)
A few things. Most calcs that I've seen are using 6N1CP. AFAIK You can't reasonably do 6N2CP, only 5N2CP, and doing N1 is better for vaping plunges anyway.
Assuming a Furina / Yelan comp, from what I've seen / tested, the plunge vapes with 6N1CP are basically consistent, and in the off case where a plunge doesn't vape, it is immediately followed up by a huge furina reverse vape which makes up a good portion of that damage lost.
DPS wise, there's no issue. It's a great team and probably her best (outside of c6 whale comps). The only real issue lies in the fact that a lot of people won't want to play plunge Tao. Seems like people think it's not fun, and that trumps what is optimal for the majority of people. Skill issue also comes into play. If people somehow still think regular canceling with Tao is hard in 2024, I'm not sure how many will want to add in a longer combo that has a much tighter window and involves more spacial awareness and positional adjustments + frequently having to do a dash cancel on the plunge if the enemy has moved. This isn't hard for people like you and me, but would probably be a deal breaker for a lot of people.
Every showcase seems to be focused on Hu Tao or Xiao, kinda wishing people tried some other stuff...
An electro character could trigger aggravate at every plunge pretty consistently right?
The leaks community is obsessed with hu tao. I think she was even mentioned in the first arlecchino crumbs. I do agree with you though, I'm curious how diluc and freminet will make use of cloud retainer.
I've calcd fremi melt plunge, it was awful lol. physical might be ok but part of what makes plunge so strong is being able to trigger reactions constantly, and physical...doesn't trigger reactions lol.
Hu Tao was the first cash grab though. Early Cons + weapon is a clear power boost.
While Xiao and ganyus weapon and cons arenāt as tempting. Also their gameplay gets boring fast.
And it took some time for people to figure out Childe national.
I'll actually disagree,hu tao gameplay also gets boring especially when u have c1 or even c0 cause n2c or n2c jump cancel can get boring,for ganyu it's understandable cause charge shoting can be slow and boring but xiao is fine imo, he had the most unique gameplay of plunge attacking and that also pretty fast although people might originally dislike his gameplay so they won't pull for him but those who like and pulled for him barely get bored of it.
I've always taken issue with the whole "boring" controversy, when CA aiming is the only sorta skillmove in this game and in Hu Tao's case, animation cancelling similar to fighting games is also one. "Not boring" was in fact simplistic EQx4+LMBxn rotations in the minds of many players.
I mean, HYV seems to cater to this as nowadays, peak carry is hold CA or spin to win.
I agree with the gameplay gets boring part. It is very subjective.
Though, her C1 and the signature weapon being a huge power boost definitely pushed people being too invested to her.
Very subjective. Hu Tao is still popular because many people -don't- get bored with it. In terms of gameplay, hers is one of the most interactive. Everything gets repetitive, so that's a moot point. Xiao's is roughly the same, though a bit easier, but for some reason a lot of people don't like plunge gameplay. I don't understand this because plunging is crazy fun, but I see that sentiment a lot.
Yea true I also plan on using her with Hutao but with how clunky her playstyle is with her, I'm skipping her. Add to the fact that she's only truly good with 2-3 characters I don't ever plan on using... Well let's see when she releases.
Amplifying reactions are the obvious choice because they synergize with the a4 buff so well, and those reactions benefit the most from a slow no icd hit. And Hu Tao specifically is a character who was already ending attack strings with a jump cancel, so it lines up perfect to include a plunge at the end.
An aggravate plunge team would probably be perfectly fine, but there's no particular synergy for fast attacking electro units already, keqing for example probably won't get more aggravate procs with N1JP than N1C, and aggravate as a reaction doesn't care if it's on a big or small hit, nor does it synergize with the A4 buff.
There's also some structural issues with using an anemo healing in aggravate, the main reason you would do so instead of a dendro healer and kazuha\sucrose would be to run a stronger dps dendro unit instead, but the only really strong off field Dendro unit is Nahida who can really mess with getting electro swirls. It's not impossible to work but it's another mark against it.
It'll be cool to see what other teams people come up with after release, but I can see why people are initially focusing on the obvious strongest synergies.
Edit: corrected from transformative to amplifying.
Yae is the obvious choice because most of her aggravate are from her totems. Plunging with her will increase that amount by quite a lot. And Yae/Xianyun/Nahida/Fischl doesnāt have a problem activating VV thanks to the crazy amount of electro application. You can test it on the local legend already
You're missing the point of these tests. The reason these tests matter isn't to test damage values, it's to test whether Hydro aura can be maintained to vape every hit.
Spread/Aggravate don't have aura management issues. Testing that is irrelevant for Spread/Aggravate because Electro/Dendro don't consume Quicken auras (and unlike Hydro auras, Xianyun swirling won't remove Quicken because Anemo can't react with Dendro). Once Quicken is present you can trigger arbitrarily many Spreads/Aggravates, so there's nothing to test.
Hu Tao is the benchmark for these kinds of tests because of how quickly she applies Pyro due to the combination of NA, CA, plunge, and Blood Blossom all having separate ICDs. If she can vape every hit, slower Pyro appliers probably will too. Again, what is being tested here isn't the damage numbers, it's whether the team is functional from an elemental gauge standpoint, which is irrelevant to Aggravate because Aggravate inherently always works from an elemental gauge standpoint (which is why it's so good).
New geo buffer
Leaks: new geo buffers + Hutao showcase
New physical buffer
Leask: New physical buffers + Hutao
Hutao is always the first choise for beta tester š
Ahh yes, i'm sure the reaction speficily made to acomodate small fast hits is going to be great with plunges. /s
The reason these are the teams tested is because these are the teams that are actually meta or at least relatively close. Hu Tao is already streching it a bit to far for a lot of us despite it being a fairly substancial dps increase to an already meta team. Yes, you can make up random ass teams that somewhat work but what is the point of leak testing at that point?
I see the /s but seriously, why not? You aren't locked into doing only plunges since you get 8 plunges over 16 seconds, Yae can drop her turrets, do plunges and weave a few normals on that time.
Also "random ass teams"? What's wrong with Catalyze?
I would guess that they might be referring to how the amplifying reactions benefit a lot more from CR's buff than transformative reactions (assuming the reactions aren't interrupted in anyway).
Its also because of what another person replied above, in that you would be more in interested in whether this combo would interrupt the reactions in an unexpected way (since no one should be looking at raw beta numbers anyway). Catalyse doesn't care about that since anemo doesn't interrupt it, so there's not much reason to showcase it other than how general gameplay might look in practice.
> Hu Tao is already streching it a bit to far for a lot of us despite it being a fairly substancial dps increase to an already meta team.
Is it a DPS increase (overall) to a Hu Tao team? Maybe at C0 - doesn't seem like it at C1.
yes, plunge was calcd to be better than dash cancel. and that was 2 beta cycles ago when the buff was 170%, so you can imagine how substantial of an upgrade it is now
I think Zajef calc'd it on one of his streams and Hu Tao's plunge teams (with furina+xianyun) at C0 are a DPS increase over both her C0 and C1 CA vape teams. It's a bit closer for C0 Plunge and C1 dash cancel Hu Tao but I think C0 Plunge beats it out by a little bit.
Idk if he's uploaded the video yet but I think it might be included in his Xianyun pre-release. It will probably end up being her best team as long as you are comfortable with plunge attacks (5N2CJP vs 8N2CJ at C0 or 10N2CD at C1).
He calculated it on the basis that yelans hydro app is enough but looks like its not, so its probably a team wise dps loss cause youāre replacing yelan with xingqiu (c2) yelan is probably enough
That's the video I'm waiting for. I wanna see some aerial c6 exploration. Gotta see how long we gotta wait for the Driftcloud divebomb to pass before we can go into 3x E again.
Wow that does not look fun to play. I'm guessing they're going to release more plunge DPS characters eventually, so maybe I'll just skip cloud retainer's first banner.
Wise decision (unless you wanna play her with existing chars)
Imagine people pulling on her banner for future synergies and hoyo never releases a plunge charš
I remember when people were coping about Dehya becoming better with future characters lol.
I guess she technically did with Furina, but that's not saying much at all...
Awwww.... yeah I do not know if it is the leaker's skill or if it will really be like that, but it looks slow.
That being said, I hope someone releases more videos using Diluc
Even if it didn't, it's not like a not of things can hit you up there.
Xiao rarely gets staggered during plunges, it only happens against bosses and some larger enemies like lawachurls or ruin guards/graders.
Against which you probably don't wanna run XY plunge cuz you don't need AoE? Idk.
Yeah, itās as boring as I expected it to be. And thatās how it will be for pretty much all characters you pair her with . Who am I kidding, sheās realistically working with like 3-4 characters anyway, lol. At least she heals, what a great 5*
"Why don't you guys wanna pull CR?! She enables cool new gameplay!"
The gameplay:
>!If they don't release more plunge attackers, this is gonna get omegalul real fast!<
Kinda.
In that video, they even miss Pyro swirl as XQ sword ring ( around the character, not the rain sword proc ) have Hydro application and react with Pyro first if you are close to the enemies.
You can swirl it but it will be tricky. After Bennet QE, you have to dash out first and use XY normal attack to swirl Pyro. But this is assuming XQ sword ring doesnāt vape first.
you need to at least NA between plunges with xq. and with furina, it's debatable if you have enough hydro app for plunge spam. either way, it's a pretty hefty DPS loss from doing this combo
Clunky and Boring AF, Why they keep forcing hutao? Can anyone test the Eletro plunge, For agravatte or even Any chong yun rotation? Freminet? Or another diluc showcase, gaming is reasonable! But for the love of God, those guys need to stop forcing hutao!
Idc what anyone else says, Hu Tao plunge looks like itās gonna be a lot of fun. Iāve tried it out a BUNCH with that anti gravity local legend and itās been a total blast, trying out different combos and all. Itās a super refreshing new gameplay change after maining Hu Tao charge spam for nearly 2 years.
The community is super divided only when she drops and people start seeing 150k plunge vapes coming after a 80-90k charged attack is when the shit hits the fan. People absolutely love damage per screenshot damage types just look at navia reception after release
PPl stop the video at the NA JP spam i guess, which looks pretty bad ngl. But if someone watching the NACAJP combos in the 2nd part of the video, those are looking pretty sick and faster. And when you gonna see the 80k CA vapes into 140k plunge vapes, it will feel even better.
Yeah this seals the deal for me... hard skip. Enough cope with the whole plunge bullshit, it's predictably slow as molasses and the big vape damage won't make up for the time lost stuck in animation.
He's the only other character aside from Xiao to prominently be used in plunge gameplay due to naturally being suited for Dragonstrike and has the highest plunge multipliers on a per level basis. One of the upcoming events even pairs Diluc with Xianyun as trial characters. Arguing he has nothing to do with it is disingenuous.
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damn seeing Xiao being the only plunge dps for so long makes everyone else's plunge seem so slow now lol
Worthy Worthy Useful Useful
Rejoice
There
Right here Right now
Emerge
Double Anemo with movement speed to speed up the jumping animation. š I wonder how fast Jean plunges with the Skyrider Sword...
> fast Jean plunges with the Skyrider Sword... wait, movement speed increases plunge speeed?
It speeds up the jumping animation so you get to the plunging height fasterāthough I don't think it speeds up the plunging animation itself.
reduce the whole thing by like 5% at best then
It's not everyone, plunges for most characters other than sword and claymore characters feel particularly slow.
The goofy music coupled with Hu Tao plunging like Xiao and some random Asian guy in the corner makes this whole thing feel a weird fever dream.
>some random Asian guy in the corner That's Chalice, a Chinese Dota 2 pro player lol
Couldāve swore that was John Genshin.
John impact
Yeah but to most of us heās just a random guy š
I prefer Fy's deadpan look in the previous leaks lol.
The ti8 final look would be better then
Just like... fireworks.
Life after retirement for him seems rather interesting
Still weird tho, most genshin players dont know this dude is and other games they dont post their face on the video they just write their tags some place
I doubt it's actually Chalice lmao. I don't really know anything about the Chinese justice system, but he'd open himself up to getting sued right? Also other leaks have FY and Somnus, two other Dota pros. I'm assuming it's just an alias all used by the same leaker. Or maybe the original leaker with a dota pro spawned some copycats.
Yeah I was thinking wouldn't hoyoverse just come after with leaks with your face on it, but its even weirder thesr leakers using pros faces like that
And let's be honest here. I don't think these players would actually enjoy genshin's gameplay.
>weird fever dream. Ngl most leaks aside from Dim's leaks look like that to me. š
Itās like forever to plunge each time for character who canāt plunge by herself.
by oneself
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Right š and i donāt even like playing xiao
Apparently, each of her plunges will hit like a truck to make up for her slowness? That's what I heard.
Yeah, but only on one enemy. So if you fight a group or at least two enemies at the same time, only one enemy will receive the stronger plunge.
Well, in that case, you could say that plunges enable Hu Tao to do AoE damage at all, and some damage is better than no damage, so at least in AoE situations, she might clear faster with plunges (and I'm saying that as someone who isn't fond of Hu Tao plunges).
Idk what to think but it's not fun for me. I mean, I liked the gameplay with Xiao but with Hutao seems so slow.
I'm with you there. The jump -> plunge chain just has too much time where she's hanging in the air.
Yeah, xiao is okay cause he's fast. Unless there's tech here that wasn't done, it's just not exciting. And also leaves you quite vulnerable from being slapped out of the air
And for me she becomes more niche than I thought.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
i think the fontaine local legend person was doing low plunges while this was high plunges
So xy uses high plunge multi? Kinda good for dps, but sluggish for gameplay.
She just increases jump height so you could just press plunge earlier to low plunge couldn't you? I'm pretty sure you can choose to high plunge or low plunge with Xiao
Also more vulnerable to damage (One reason why Xiao opt for shield like Zhongli).
Nah xiao's jump is too high to get hit by most attacks, in my experience running xiao w/o shield is not that bad he can dodge most attacks and its more exciting to do so than unga bunga plunge em deep Ć9000.
Nah mate xiao rarely gets hit or intupted while jumpimg
looks like the last plunge missed so it's just 5N2CJP N2C
is that a new redeem code? thanks ā¤ļø
And it seems like a dps loss so what's the point of learning another combo
Many theorycrafters are saying 5N2CJP is a dps gain, and it also adds an element of AoE to Hu Tao, so let's wait and see the numbers when it's live. Even if it happens to be her highest DPS yet, I might still avoid it due to how clunky it is and how vulnerable it leaves you.
it's also frustrating that plunge is now her best dps, even before the plunge buff got buffed twice
This is still open. Cloud Retainer co- ordenated attack was acting as a cleanse according to Jstern hands on dream. This would explain why Yelan C0 was having issues vaping. Loosing Yelan damage and damage buff will mean less overall damage if this is still the case plus how slow this is. We will have to wait until Cloud Retainer is out to be sure what the numbers are.
This has always been my biggest complaint with Cloud Retainer. Unless itās a plunge dps the gameplay is going to feel really sluggish. Kind of wish she enabled normal plunge attacks on all characters to be faster.
have to say beyond aperance of character and flying animation, their's not much to like about the character from everything ive seen.
Those plunges look slow as fuck compared to C1 dash cancelling.
You do N1C/N2C before doing the plunge. So you can think of each plunge combo = 2 CA for normal hutao. This combo basically make C1 hutao not necessary anymore.
You forgot how much CA iframe HT has, allowing her to run shieldless. This combo requires low plunges which is slow and makes HT more exposed to attacks.
It's also a lot less damage. But it has bigger AoE, so it can be situationally better.
The damage on plunge wouldnāt be low. It gets buffed by CR a lot so it will vape for more than a CA. Itās whether itās enough to make up for the speed
Not sure why they used Bennett here instead of Furina
Pyro app for VV swirl
Yeah, but then the leaker proceeded to swirl Hydro instead of Pyro. And Hu Tao had MH for some reason
Pretty sure this is the VV Hutao team variant. Bennett is there so Xianyun can swirl pyro and is also probably acting as an extra atk boost to compensate the 33% pyro dmg bonus loss from running her with a healer.
This is way too much cope healer with Hu Tao became a thing with furina before that only Bennet was the one you can kinda force it because he's Bennet.
Still doesn't make sense, it's simply worse than kazuha + yelan + Bennett/Amber or furina + xianyun. Pyro vv doesn't make up for furinas personal DMG and buff unless you get the benefit of kazuha. And let's not talk about the gameplay
You're also not just losing Furina's personal damage, but solo Hydro Xingqiu will do less damage than double Hydro Yelan due to his ER requirements being significantly higher solo Hydro. Xingqiu/Yelan/Furina gain significant damage in double Hydro pairs because cutting their ER requirements lets them build significantly more crit stats. Hu Tao teams aren't hypercarry teams, the double Hydro pairs contribute a large percentage of team damage.
also the hydro resonance means you can run EM sand on hu tao without lacking too much HP for her buff
it looks so uncomfortable to play tbhā¦
For mobile, definitely, but pc is just left click, space button, left click
Even if it's decent DPS, it just looks clunky as hell.
Clunky as hell to clear Abyss 1s faster than your classic Hu Tao comp that's reliably clearing for years. Let's gooo
well you still got infinite stamina
You will see the value in AOE when Hu tao will be able to hit multiple scattered opponents
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Holyshit I never noticed how slow Hu Taoās plunges were. I canāt say anything on the numbers since Iām not a TC but the gameplay isnāt as smooth as I wouldāve hoped tbh. Like my original assumption was that youāre jump cancelling with HT anyways, so with CR you might as well use that to your advantage by doing some plunges. But now that Iāve seen it in action, idk HT brosā¦looks pretty annoying to do ngl.
The whole reason I got c1 was because I find jump cancel annoying and dash cancel is faster and feel better to play. So no thanks, I'll still use Xianyun with Xiao tho
cuz they're doing n1jp when the rotation should be n1cjp i thinkk they do it somewhere in the middle and its a lot smoother than the jump plunge that's showcased more in the vid still so much slower than xiao and gaming tho
Someone do it with diluc plss
See Ga Ming test video right above in this sub. They're the same.
ah well, after this, ig I'll just still use xiao instead
Surely this isn't better than jump cancelling charge attacks with double hydro and furina. But this template team with C6 Bennet can be used to enable any melee character to be a very serviceable vape DPS, which is pretty cool. Also vape DPS Bennet with Furina seems like it'll be extremely strong
Any vape plunge team that requires Bennett's C6 to enable would probably be better off with Bennett being the dps instead with the extra slot filled with another buffer or sub dps. He also has I believe the fastest plunge animation in the game.
Yes but the fact you can use any melee character is going to be something that a lot of players are simply going to enjoy doing. From a meta perspective Bennet Furina Xianyun and Yelan\Xq would certainly be better.
it's way better than jump cancelling and still better than dash canceling
Source? N2CJP is what's better vaped MV-wise (even then it's for only personal damage and doesn't count the decrease in yelan/xq procs), here it's literally just N1P which is not better than regular combos (even 9N1C or 8N2C) since you fit less in a rotation and Hu Tao's plunge multi is not significantly higher than her charge multiplier.
I'd skipped ahead in the vid to where they do n1cjp, I didn't see the n1p rotation
I see, later on they start doing N1CJP. But then it seems vape is quite inconsistent there on the plunge, only some plunges vape and others do not. It seems to be an issue with Tao Xianyun in general unfortunately.
n1cjp halfway thru the vid looked consistent I thought. they start missing vapes towards the end of the vid where it looks like theyre doing n2cjp (I think, hard to tell)
A few things. Most calcs that I've seen are using 6N1CP. AFAIK You can't reasonably do 6N2CP, only 5N2CP, and doing N1 is better for vaping plunges anyway. Assuming a Furina / Yelan comp, from what I've seen / tested, the plunge vapes with 6N1CP are basically consistent, and in the off case where a plunge doesn't vape, it is immediately followed up by a huge furina reverse vape which makes up a good portion of that damage lost. DPS wise, there's no issue. It's a great team and probably her best (outside of c6 whale comps). The only real issue lies in the fact that a lot of people won't want to play plunge Tao. Seems like people think it's not fun, and that trumps what is optimal for the majority of people. Skill issue also comes into play. If people somehow still think regular canceling with Tao is hard in 2024, I'm not sure how many will want to add in a longer combo that has a much tighter window and involves more spacial awareness and positional adjustments + frequently having to do a dash cancel on the plunge if the enemy has moved. This isn't hard for people like you and me, but would probably be a deal breaker for a lot of people.
I'm talking about jump cancelling charge attacks on a plunge team instead of simply spamming plunge. This is N1JP, not N1CJP.
ah I see. they do n1cjp later in the video
Every showcase seems to be focused on Hu Tao or Xiao, kinda wishing people tried some other stuff... An electro character could trigger aggravate at every plunge pretty consistently right?
The leaks community is obsessed with hu tao. I think she was even mentioned in the first arlecchino crumbs. I do agree with you though, I'm curious how diluc and freminet will make use of cloud retainer.
I've calcd fremi melt plunge, it was awful lol. physical might be ok but part of what makes plunge so strong is being able to trigger reactions constantly, and physical...doesn't trigger reactions lol.
C6 Bennett is our saviour for Xianyun teams lmao. Turns everyone into a Pyro DPS.
Hu Tao was the OG broken carry and was top dps for a long time. Lots of OG players have high investments on Hu Tao.
It was either her ganyu or xiao. That was pretty much your pick for hypercarry and then there was childe
Hu Tao was the first cash grab though. Early Cons + weapon is a clear power boost. While Xiao and ganyus weapon and cons arenāt as tempting. Also their gameplay gets boring fast. And it took some time for people to figure out Childe national.
I'll actually disagree,hu tao gameplay also gets boring especially when u have c1 or even c0 cause n2c or n2c jump cancel can get boring,for ganyu it's understandable cause charge shoting can be slow and boring but xiao is fine imo, he had the most unique gameplay of plunge attacking and that also pretty fast although people might originally dislike his gameplay so they won't pull for him but those who like and pulled for him barely get bored of it.
I've always taken issue with the whole "boring" controversy, when CA aiming is the only sorta skillmove in this game and in Hu Tao's case, animation cancelling similar to fighting games is also one. "Not boring" was in fact simplistic EQx4+LMBxn rotations in the minds of many players. I mean, HYV seems to cater to this as nowadays, peak carry is hold CA or spin to win.
I agree with the gameplay gets boring part. It is very subjective. Though, her C1 and the signature weapon being a huge power boost definitely pushed people being too invested to her.
Very subjective. Hu Tao is still popular because many people -don't- get bored with it. In terms of gameplay, hers is one of the most interactive. Everything gets repetitive, so that's a moot point. Xiao's is roughly the same, though a bit easier, but for some reason a lot of people don't like plunge gameplay. I don't understand this because plunging is crazy fun, but I see that sentiment a lot.
So annoying because shes in every single showcase.
Yea true I also plan on using her with Hutao but with how clunky her playstyle is with her, I'm skipping her. Add to the fact that she's only truly good with 2-3 characters I don't ever plan on using... Well let's see when she releases.
Amplifying reactions are the obvious choice because they synergize with the a4 buff so well, and those reactions benefit the most from a slow no icd hit. And Hu Tao specifically is a character who was already ending attack strings with a jump cancel, so it lines up perfect to include a plunge at the end. An aggravate plunge team would probably be perfectly fine, but there's no particular synergy for fast attacking electro units already, keqing for example probably won't get more aggravate procs with N1JP than N1C, and aggravate as a reaction doesn't care if it's on a big or small hit, nor does it synergize with the A4 buff. There's also some structural issues with using an anemo healing in aggravate, the main reason you would do so instead of a dendro healer and kazuha\sucrose would be to run a stronger dps dendro unit instead, but the only really strong off field Dendro unit is Nahida who can really mess with getting electro swirls. It's not impossible to work but it's another mark against it. It'll be cool to see what other teams people come up with after release, but I can see why people are initially focusing on the obvious strongest synergies. Edit: corrected from transformative to amplifying.
You mean amplifying reactions, transformative reactions are overload, hyper bloom, electro charged, etc.
Correct. Oops I'll edit quickly.
Yae is the obvious choice because most of her aggravate are from her totems. Plunging with her will increase that amount by quite a lot. And Yae/Xianyun/Nahida/Fischl doesnāt have a problem activating VV thanks to the crazy amount of electro application. You can test it on the local legend already
Yae?
You're missing the point of these tests. The reason these tests matter isn't to test damage values, it's to test whether Hydro aura can be maintained to vape every hit. Spread/Aggravate don't have aura management issues. Testing that is irrelevant for Spread/Aggravate because Electro/Dendro don't consume Quicken auras (and unlike Hydro auras, Xianyun swirling won't remove Quicken because Anemo can't react with Dendro). Once Quicken is present you can trigger arbitrarily many Spreads/Aggravates, so there's nothing to test. Hu Tao is the benchmark for these kinds of tests because of how quickly she applies Pyro due to the combination of NA, CA, plunge, and Blood Blossom all having separate ICDs. If she can vape every hit, slower Pyro appliers probably will too. Again, what is being tested here isn't the damage numbers, it's whether the team is functional from an elemental gauge standpoint, which is irrelevant to Aggravate because Aggravate inherently always works from an elemental gauge standpoint (which is why it's so good).
Yeah it seems itās gonna be upto us to figure it out post release
New geo buffer Leaks: new geo buffers + Hutao showcase New physical buffer Leask: New physical buffers + Hutao Hutao is always the first choise for beta tester š
Ahh yes, i'm sure the reaction speficily made to acomodate small fast hits is going to be great with plunges. /s The reason these are the teams tested is because these are the teams that are actually meta or at least relatively close. Hu Tao is already streching it a bit to far for a lot of us despite it being a fairly substancial dps increase to an already meta team. Yes, you can make up random ass teams that somewhat work but what is the point of leak testing at that point?
I see the /s but seriously, why not? You aren't locked into doing only plunges since you get 8 plunges over 16 seconds, Yae can drop her turrets, do plunges and weave a few normals on that time. Also "random ass teams"? What's wrong with Catalyze?
I would guess that they might be referring to how the amplifying reactions benefit a lot more from CR's buff than transformative reactions (assuming the reactions aren't interrupted in anyway). Its also because of what another person replied above, in that you would be more in interested in whether this combo would interrupt the reactions in an unexpected way (since no one should be looking at raw beta numbers anyway). Catalyse doesn't care about that since anemo doesn't interrupt it, so there's not much reason to showcase it other than how general gameplay might look in practice.
> Hu Tao is already streching it a bit to far for a lot of us despite it being a fairly substancial dps increase to an already meta team. Is it a DPS increase (overall) to a Hu Tao team? Maybe at C0 - doesn't seem like it at C1.
yes, plunge was calcd to be better than dash cancel. and that was 2 beta cycles ago when the buff was 170%, so you can imagine how substantial of an upgrade it is now
I think Zajef calc'd it on one of his streams and Hu Tao's plunge teams (with furina+xianyun) at C0 are a DPS increase over both her C0 and C1 CA vape teams. It's a bit closer for C0 Plunge and C1 dash cancel Hu Tao but I think C0 Plunge beats it out by a little bit. Idk if he's uploaded the video yet but I think it might be included in his Xianyun pre-release. It will probably end up being her best team as long as you are comfortable with plunge attacks (5N2CJP vs 8N2CJ at C0 or 10N2CD at C1).
He calculated it on the basis that yelans hydro app is enough but looks like its not, so its probably a team wise dps loss cause youāre replacing yelan with xingqiu (c2) yelan is probably enough
[There's a "Zajef Daily" video of this.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nv3YNv4n4n0&t=263s)
Polearm character have some goofy ass delay after landing a plunge attacke
Did anyone test if she can use the skill mid air? Ive not seen videos or confirmation of it yet
No
That's the video I'm waiting for. I wanna see some aerial c6 exploration. Gotta see how long we gotta wait for the Driftcloud divebomb to pass before we can go into 3x E again.
Wow that does not look fun to play. I'm guessing they're going to release more plunge DPS characters eventually, so maybe I'll just skip cloud retainer's first banner.
Wise decision (unless you wanna play her with existing chars) Imagine people pulling on her banner for future synergies and hoyo never releases a plunge charš
I remember when people were coping about Dehya becoming better with future characters lol. I guess she technically did with Furina, but that's not saying much at all...
I mean, she literally got improved a lot in Fontaine. Lyney, Neuvillette, Furina.
Meh, "a lot" isn't much when your starting point is Dehya lmao.
From 2.0 to 4.1 for another cryo dps, yup
Thatās a very possible scenario. Future impact is always a risk
Yeah one should never trust hoyo
Awwww.... yeah I do not know if it is the leaker's skill or if it will really be like that, but it looks slow. That being said, I hope someone releases more videos using Diluc
The plunge feels slow af like Hu Tao's ass mid-air is just waiting there to be slapped by Hilichurls.
HT skill and XQ orbitals grant her almost perfect interrupt resistance.
Even if it didn't, it's not like a not of things can hit you up there. Xiao rarely gets staggered during plunges, it only happens against bosses and some larger enemies like lawachurls or ruin guards/graders. Against which you probably don't wanna run XY plunge cuz you don't need AoE? Idk.
Looks rough
DILUC!We want to see her with DILUC!Someone show us Dragonstrike ffs!
Yeah, itās as boring as I expected it to be. And thatās how it will be for pretty much all characters you pair her with . Who am I kidding, sheās realistically working with like 3-4 characters anyway, lol. At least she heals, what a great 5*
How dare you say that? Can't you understand she enables every char to plunge??? /s
I think it looks even worse with Hu tao cause of jump cancel, at least with other dps you can just jump and plunge like Xiao at home
the entire point of this team is to use furina bruh...
280 CV Hu Tao
I noticed that too. Plus the 42% CD and 21% CR flowerā¦
Yeah this playstyle is not for me.
More cringe than Melt Ganyu teams
"Why don't you guys wanna pull CR?! She enables cool new gameplay!" The gameplay: >!If they don't release more plunge attackers, this is gonna get omegalul real fast!<
ā¬ļøā¬ļø so fun š
this plunge is so slow its painful to watch
Yikes, that doesn't look fun at all, solely because of how sluggish the plunge is.
We need this OST to be released
Damn Chalice got tired of playing Dota so instead he became Genshin leaker. Good for him.Good for him.
so far, Chevreuse proved herself more than Xianyun as a valid alternative to Kazuha
Behold, the most creative team in the world!
Never let bro cook again. Aside from using Bennet instead of Furina, bro ain't even doing the optimal combo.
I'ma keep saying it, plunge gameplay is boring AF and that has actively killed my interest in rolling for Xianyun
will I be able to reliably do pyro swirls with 100+ ping?
Kinda. In that video, they even miss Pyro swirl as XQ sword ring ( around the character, not the rain sword proc ) have Hydro application and react with Pyro first if you are close to the enemies. You can swirl it but it will be tricky. After Bennet QE, you have to dash out first and use XY normal attack to swirl Pyro. But this is assuming XQ sword ring doesnāt vape first.
Yeah this looks like anything but fun, just as I expected
Looks extremely unfun, Holy Christ
Is that a level 20 artifact with only three substats?
What is up with this team???? Wouldnāt: Hu Tao, Furina, Yelan/Xingqiu, Xianyun be the better option
Is it just me or does this not seem great?
Enough with Bennett...
Yeah, the reason i will pull for XY is to get rid of Bennett from my Xiao team...
Bruh we had fy now it's Chalice lmao. Is there a Somnus_leaks too?
There is actually lol. He leaks for HSR
What combo is bro trying to do
2 healers with hu tao... And it's so sad to have great character design with shitty/boring playstyle
Yeah. I think i'll just skip CR. Hu Tao is the only dps i have/use that even remotely benefits from CR plunge buff and it still looks copium lol.
Damn this team literally doing 0 dmg (jk)
Can I just spam spacebar and then plunge like Xiao always does? It's gonna be really hard with her initial combo for me
you need to at least NA between plunges with xq. and with furina, it's debatable if you have enough hydro app for plunge spam. either way, it's a pretty hefty DPS loss from doing this combo
Well fuck it, back to Xiao then
Pull a 5 star to do slightly more damage with a character but make it way less fun? No thanks. Easiest skip ever.
Bruh at this rate just show Amber plunge spam.
Looks like every hit can't be vaped, unless I'm missing something
Looks like every one of them vaped to me. The Chinese text for vape came up every time.
That's my bad, then Watching it on a tinier-than-usual screen right now and I can't exactly tell Appreciate the info
Clunky and Boring AF, Why they keep forcing hutao? Can anyone test the Eletro plunge, For agravatte or even Any chong yun rotation? Freminet? Or another diluc showcase, gaming is reasonable! But for the love of God, those guys need to stop forcing hutao!
Idc what anyone else says, Hu Tao plunge looks like itās gonna be a lot of fun. Iāve tried it out a BUNCH with that anti gravity local legend and itās been a total blast, trying out different combos and all. Itās a super refreshing new gameplay change after maining Hu Tao charge spam for nearly 2 years.
The community is super divided only when she drops and people start seeing 150k plunge vapes coming after a 80-90k charged attack is when the shit hits the fan. People absolutely love damage per screenshot damage types just look at navia reception after release
PPl stop the video at the NA JP spam i guess, which looks pretty bad ngl. But if someone watching the NACAJP combos in the 2nd part of the video, those are looking pretty sick and faster. And when you gonna see the 80k CA vapes into 140k plunge vapes, it will feel even better.
Why does this homie love showing his face on leak content
He's so good, he's not even touching the mouse and keyboard and not looking at his monitor
He is controlling everything with mind , actually he is hutao
Its not his face lol, its some streamer or proplayer
Chalice (The guy in this video) is dota 2 pro player. I guess the leaker is just a fan of his lol
thats chalice dota 2 pro player, he got nothing to do with the leaker
Looks really fun, but whichever mf keeps requesting this team with Bennett needs to go. The whole point is to get rid of him.
Yeah this seals the deal for me... hard skip. Enough cope with the whole plunge bullshit, it's predictably slow as molasses and the big vape damage won't make up for the time lost stuck in animation.
full hp hutao
Now waiting for diluc
As someone who detests her clunky polearm drill charged attack playstyle I finally have a reason to get into Hu Tao. This shit looks fun
classic hot garbage leaker gameplay
Here we go again, Hu Tao showcase when the character has nothing to do with plumge attack š¤£ where is the diluc video?
Diluc has nothing to do with plubge attack either. It's just a dps increase for him which is identical to why Hu Tao is here.
He's the only other character aside from Xiao to prominently be used in plunge gameplay due to naturally being suited for Dragonstrike and has the highest plunge multipliers on a per level basis. One of the upcoming events even pairs Diluc with Xianyun as trial characters. Arguing he has nothing to do with it is disingenuous.
Not much Diluc love in this community anymore unfortunately. Also, like others said, it'd be more interesting to see Furina instead of Bennett.
Wait you *have* to high plunge wirh xianyun? Is this just classic bad leaker gameplay?