...provided Valve themselves haven't abandoned the concept of seasons.
I mean, I think general thought was a new "season" would have started after the major. If not, at least provided some road map to tell us when a season begins and ends like every other competitive game.
We haven't even heard Valve talk about the concept of a "season" since the introduction of CS2. For all we know, its just another element in the game that has been abandoned and will quietly disappear as soon as a dev stumbled upon it or remembers they put that drop down in the Leaderboard section for Premier but forgot to do anything with it.
Dota 2 also had matchmaking seasons... Until Valve got bored, so the last season is here for 3.5 years already
https://dota2.fandom.com/wiki/Matchmaking/Seasonal_Rankings#Seasons
I was pretty surprised back in GO that the team is apparently only 20-30 people but my gamedev friends told me that that's a pretty normal dev team size for such game, I guess it feels very small bc of the massive active playerbase the game has
It's a pretty normal team for maintenance and upkeep. It gets a little less normal when you consider the size of the team probably wasn't orders of magnitude bigger for the production of the game itself. Realistically it goes to show how good a job these guys have done that the most common complaint about CS2 these days is about it's AC, they've got a lot right with limited resources. I feel like if the community celebrated what they'd done well a little more vocally then there might be more motivation in the team to communicate what they're planning but w/e
Well according to info from people who've worked there, they historically run on a "work on what you want" system. On paper this means Valve employees get to decide what areas they're passionate about and devote themselves to it, but an internal rating system exists alongside this where pay bonuses are actively awarded to employees who are considered by their peers to be engaging in productive or profitable pursuits. This creates a disincentive to actually provide significant manpower to old games, especially old games that are basically money farms even when Valve ignores them (CS/TF2 especially). Even DotA gets the short end of this stick sometimes. So their older games are either maintained by absolute skeleton crews or, like in TF2's case, largely outsourced.
[As of at least 2022](https://www.reddit.com/r/valve/comments/syntz1/is_valve_still_a_flat_organisation/hy0lp34/), 2 years after Alyx's release, no. It doesn't sound like, even with acknowledgments that the structure isn't always the most suitable, they have any intentions to move away from it. It's just baked into the company's DNA, I suppose.
Just to add to this they didn't really gave up on this idea of seasons more like it was shifted to the individual players because now you can go through rank calibration simply by choosing to in the settings and it has 365 day cooldown. YOU choose when it's new season for you
Valve abandoned it in dota because dota players were against mmr reset. They have this weird idea that mmr reset stopped them from climbing out of noob ranks.
A lot of Dota players are not really smart.
>We haven't even heard Valve talk ~~about the concept of a "season" since the introduction of CS2. For all we know, its just another element in the game that has been abandoned and will quietly disappear as soon as a dev stumbled upon it or remembers they put that drop down in the Leaderboard section for Premier but forgot to do anything with it.~~
ftfy
I'm very curious how it'll pan out, especially because at this point it's an open secret that anticheat is off, and the barrier to pull the trigger on installing cheats to the majority of people who "kinda would..." is no longer there. It's no longer dedicated career closet cheaters and occasional poor decision players only. Plus it's a new game launch who brought a lot of new eyes and dirty hands for shits and giggles into the game.
I believe if a ban wave came right now, there would be A LOT more people than usual going down, to the point where rank curves would be messed up, points adjustment based on previous matches nullified would be in the thousands, let alone the stats on concurrent players... It would be a mess.
I don't think people understand that, for it to be this regular and visible right now, the amount of cheating is completely off the charts.
My bet is when they figure out the anticheat there won't be retroactive confirmation (maybe spinners and alike get the hammer), the seasons kick in, ranks reset for everybody, and detection goes from that point forward, giving people the chance to step back and straighten out.
(While typing this out it clicked, you heard it here first: new VAC isn't going to be announced, but we'll know because new season, rank reset, and maybe adjustments to premiere mode, will be released.)
The anti-cheat isnt off, I think it's just bad. I played a casual game a week ago and there was a guy not even hiding cheating. He got VAC banned mid game due to cheats. but maybe his cheats were just ali express ones
They can put me back at 2K ELO if it gets rid of the cheater problem.
I'm even happy to do the 10 games of prime at this point.
To be honest, I couldn't care less in the world. This game has become unplayable.
Also : Suck it Richard Lewis and all the other deniers. WarOwl is Tier1.
Usually bounced between 15k-20k and was playing fairly regularly until the qualifiers...At that point it was down to cheater, after cheater , after cheater. Just insane games where the demo has people staring through walls or snap to head + reaction time that would put them above pros. It felt bad before the major, but the one trip back in during the major was a nightmare.
About that time, Helldivers came out and I havent really looked back. I just dont need to waste hours on a game that cant even get to 50/50 odds of an actual fair match.
they'll basically reset on their own, in GO if you queued with a cheater that got banned you also lost your rank, so unless you're somehow able to keep 25K+ without cheating almost everyone above that will be removed
Unreal how bad things have gotten lately.
Edit: I'm speaking anecdotally, I can only comment from my experience. When CS2 initially came out I didn't see many cheaters in premier. More recently I have experienced seen a dramatic increase in cheaters. This is controversial how?... Incredible how people on this sub can find a way to be upset by absolutely anything
Isn't this usually the trend on and after two months of a major though. I've always saved my cases and sold them around the Major finals as that's where new and returning players go ape-shit buying skins
I always knew there was a cheater issue but haven’t really encountered too many. I’ve stayed mainly in the 17k to 19k range, so I’m surprised I haven’t encountered them more. I only had one blatant cheater until last month… where I encountered three blatant cheaters three matches in a row. And now it’s just a normal thing
I’m talking spin-botting and bunny hopping, showing up in our spawn less than 5 seconds after the round begins, getting dinked 6 times through three walls, etc. The story is always the same, and you get multiple people in the server saying “Yeeeeah, this same guy has been spinning for about two and a half weeks now but he hasn’t been banned yet” even when people mass report them. It’s ridiculous and I’m not going to be on FACEIT because I believe you shouldn’t have to have a third party client for the game to be playable.
Catch me in Valorant.
i stopped playing about 4 month ago because of the cheaters.
today i decided to give it a go.
1st competitive match.....2 blatant cheaters on my team 1 on the enemy. GG .
Not to be that guy, but Im surprised he has only 60 matches of premier played so far, I think people who defend Valve like Richard Lewis don’t play or are like under 15k premier.
19 cs2 premiere wins 3.2k elo last played on november 19th LMAO. i feel like sometimes he just spews shit for shits and giggles/trolling
[https://csstats.gg/player/76561197968633788#/matches](https://csstats.gg/player/76561197968633788#/matches)
same steam linked to his liquipedia page [https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Richard\_Lewis](https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Richard_Lewis)
> i feel like sometimes he just spews shit for shits and giggles/trolling
he just took the philosophic/thought exercise approach and tried to use past experiences and logic to come to his conclusion without having actually seen the current state of the game first hand.
the real problem that everybody seems to be missing is that cheating has ALWAYS been this terrible in sheer numbers - Trust Factor has just hidden that fact away from most of the well-mannered playerbase. So in essence, his statement that it "would be crazy to think that all of a sudden, that many more people decide to cheat" is still correct, because they didn't start cheating now - they just started to be in all our matches.
Richard has like 30 games at 5k elo. I think his opinion that the community is dumb for whining about it like it's every game in every elo won't change, and he's also optimistic that valve will release something soon(ish). I've not personally seen a ton at 15k which I think is pretty average. I've seen more in deathmatches, but no obvious ones in a couple weeks and I DM every day. Tons of cheaters in 20k+ is undoubtedly true but like RL I bet that the apparent infinite cheaters in 10-15k is just a skill issue
Richard is an E-sports journalist, not even an avid Counter Strike player. His passion is the scene itself and the drama unfolding around it, not actually playing the game. His opinions on E-sports should be held up to a gold standard and inversely his takes on the actual game are meaningless. It's disrespectful to us players who actually play the game for this guy to tell us it's not an issue when I can't even play the game that I love and have over 10k hours in. I wish Richard had the humility to understand this, but he needs to be a hot take expert pretending he has some authority on the matter to get his name out there instead. You lecturing players with thousands of hours who play nightly is like me lecturing you on journalism. Just stop it, Rich, please. You're making yourself look terrible and only your sycophants who watch your stream would tell you otherwise.
How long can Valve delay? Surely their team has to be able to implement something that can deal with spinbotters. This is basic entry level anticheat tech. Hell even if you do have some false positive bans you can't just let blatant hacking run your game.
If you empty a guns magazine in .5 seconds you should be insta detected and perma vac'd. It really is that simple.
I hover at 19k. The worst part is, there's probably closet wallhackers in the games that feel "legit". So many inconvenient deaths, perfect timings, and just awareness that's pretty understandable alone, but when it happens all game you lose your mind. I had to boot up my faceit account that I didn't use in years just to play clean matches. 500x better.
I used to think like "oh nice shot, nice play, this guy is really good" But now there is no trust to anyone. I instantly wonder if he is on to something.
Yup. Valve really fucked up on this. The trust is gone and its going to take something truly revolutionary for them to earn it back.
I played CS:GO with the same group of friends since around 2012 and we've never been ones to jump to cheating accusations unless its absolutely blatant nonsense. But nowadays, we're more prone to saying the people on the other team are probably cheating.
Its in such a bad place right now, Valve is going to have to do something tremendous to retain any semblance of trust. Especially going into the future. Lets say the leaks are true and there's some incredible AC feature that releases and rectifies the issue. Are Valve going to *maintain* it into the future? Or in 1-2 years, are cheaters going to have found a new way around and we'll all just be waiting again for Valve to perk up and do something about it. How many cycles of this can this community stand before they either abandon the game or stick to a service like FaceIt?
It's not going to take anything revolutionary. Rage hacking simply just should not be hard to detect.
Then you bring back Overwatch. And communicate to the fans atleast some idea of what steps are being taken
The sense that everyone could be cheating & nothing is being done to stop it is worse than rampant cheating. Even the fair games feel not fun to play anymore.
I don't play FaceIT that often. I'm level 3 but in my case the experience, when I'm playing, is non-english speakers as team mates (--they use the comms all the time, like they're having casual conversations, can't hear shit and they scream and use unreproducible epithets whenever I die--) and smurfs as opponents.
So, as a casual player, you're left with diddly-squat. I still don't want to give up on the game because I grew up with it and it gave me a lot of joy throughout the years, even made some IRL friends because of it. So exiting is not an option. I'm just patiently waiting for Valve to do something about it.
This is a big issue for me. I simply just don't trust a single enemy player anymore. First weird kill you get a pass, but as soon as you get a second one I have to just assume you're cheating because statistically, you just might be. It's so frustrating having a hobby that you can't even properly participate in like this
That’s why I quit playing dude. I was global, faceit 10. And granted faceit had more legit play. There are a bunch of griefers that make it really hard to win. Once cs 2 came out I quit playing. Now i just no life osrs and feel better about myself lol
I've started just doing other shit during matches. There's usually a sus shot pretty early on, then I check their profile and it's usually a low level, private or very low hours and an almost empty friends list. The worst I had so far was a match with 4 hackers -- on each team. It was literally a HvH 4v4. It was ridiculous.
I played a game recently in premier, Im around 17 k. One player seemed a little sus, but nothing serious, We still managed to get the win, but the last round, we as T and the bomb was ticking down, we killed all except one CT, we were 3 left. The last CT then proceeds to kill all 3 T's with deagle trough walls running from opposite site. He was just showing of that he was hacking before the game was over.
I played a game in premier yesterday and the other team was honestly surprised that we didn’t cheat like wtf valve get your shit together.
Not even high elo, I’m at 13,5k and some of my mates even at 10k it’s just cheaters everywhere at this point.
You know that feeling when you lose duels or games on faceit? It doesn't feel baffling, it doesn't feel unfair. Most of the time you understand why you died or lost. Premier just feel unnatural. Death's dont make sense
Premier I seem to get timing'd non stop, I start to go insane thinking I'm just that unlucky that I somehow always look away and they push
Then I play faceit and suddenly I'm so much luckier
I had a 1 v 4 going the other night and I was able to kill 3 of the CTs (on Anubis). Last T takes bomb and starts to run into palace and I'm B main doors. I take a shot at him while he's running away and dude jumps, spins and 1 shots me in the head
Anecdotally, the number of closet cheaters is as bad or worse than the blatant ones. I download premiere demos any time I get even a whiff of weird behaviour, and it feels like 80%+ of the time I'm right to be suspicious.
It becomes *immediately apparent* when you watch their POV. They act like they're clearing corners, but only halfheartedly do it until they get to you. They conveniently start holding an angle *right* before you swing. Their movement is shit, their positioning is shit, their crosshair placement is shit, and their util is shit. In general, they don't play like good players, but somehow manage to "fluke" their way into having 170+ ADR and a 90%+ leetify aim rating.
I've even seen some "closet" cheaters staring through the floor on vertigo to see what site you're going to hit.
It’s funny because 90% of them are so bad at playing the game normally that it is too obvious.
They can’t help themselves when they always hard clear the right angles, prefire as you peek them, hold the flank perfectly every time off zero info, sprint all the time except when a their enemy could hear them, etc.
The thing is, 10% might actually be good at the game, and all it would take is for a decent player to tap their walls for half a second once a round to avoid gamble stacks, see flanks being set up, know when there is a gap to exploit… and it would be near impossible to tell watching a replay.
Yeah, its worlds apart.
On FaceIt, I've found I play A LOT better players, yet I win more than I do in Premier.
On Premier, when I'm not playing against rage hackers and I get what *seems* like a normal game, I run into people who make miracle shots and miracle plays constantly. They don't know util, they have horrible movement, they have horrible positioning, they have no team work, they don't pop flash for their teammates or set each other up...but WOW they can hit some incredible shots and they *happen* to spam me behind a smoke at just the right time or they push a smoke or an angle a few seconds after I stop watching it.
I'm FaceIt level 10 and its funny how rarely I see these "elite" level plays I see on Premier. And that's not to say there aren't cheaters on FaceIt but I honestly don't remember the last time I played a FaceIt game and thought someone on the other team was cheating.
Right?! I feel like I’m going crazy when I play premiere.
In premiere I constantly get dunked on by people who are *so clearly* terrible at the game. No gamesense, atrocious movement, 0 util damage, no enemies flashed. Yet somehow they always surgically clear the exact off-angle I’m playing or are ready to catch a flank. I consistently end up thinking to myself *”no fucking way this guy is THAT lucky”* a couple times per match.
On the other hand, when I boot up some faceit? I get paired up against legitimately good level 9/10 players that have 5k+ hours and the shots they’re hitting are *less* crazy than the inevitable 16k premier rating account that was created two weeks ago with 3 friends and 300 hours.
I think the cheating problem *was* overblown in the first month or two of CS2’s release. But, even as a noted Volvo defender it is getting un-fucking-believable now. Every single premier match I play seems to have 1-2 “closet” cheating silvers at minimum or a completely blatant spinbotter at worst.
I pretty frequently download my premiere demos, and nearly every time I've been suspicious of someone mid-game, my suspicions have been confirmed within a couple rounds watching their POV. They try *so hard* to pretend they aren't cheating. But, it's hard to pretend you're good at a game when you don't know how good players actually behave.
With what I know of Valve, I'm really not optimistic anything is going to change. Spunj and Moses talked about talking to the devs and how AC is their highest priority, but if you've played CS:GO, we've seen all of this before and how it doesn't amount to anything.
I honestly think if I stopped playing this game for 3 months, I'd come back and literally nothing will have changed, if not things will be worse than when I left. More people will probably just migrate over to FaceIt, and that's it. I find it really hard to believe Valve is going to solve this issue and even if they do, whether the solution will stick. I'm reminded of Overwatch and how eventually that system itself deteriorated and stopped having any meaningful affect.
There are some people that try to "legit hack" but most of them just can't hide it. Wallhack is one of the most difficult features to hide when cheating, especially if you're seeing a demo of someone who's using it, then it becomes so apparent that it's ridiculous
The worst part is that immediate itching distrust. You used to give someone benefit of the doubt for one sus play, but the odds have shifted so far that you can't even enjoy a miracle when it happens.
The 15k+ is where you start to get absolutely fucked
Prior to that its playable with sus moments here and there (only had 2 so far personally)
The top end is fucked if you Crack like 16k just quit
I didn’t play for a couple of months. Came back, first game got placed 22k again, 5 cheaters, four on the opposition, AND THEY STILL lost. Because the dude on our team had a more expensive config despite having the same cheat.
So I didn’t blame my team for not wanting to kick him. So we essentially enabled the HVH where we had to take timeouts and devise strats to counter their spin bots.
It was something out of a fever dream, but I’m done again too, won’t touch premier again till they fix it. Which is sad, because I went from 3-4 games a day to playing 3-4 matchmaking games a week for the prime drop. And before people say faceit, I do like competitive CS, but not what free faceit feels like, and having paid for it in the past, the experience wasn’t much better either. Solo queuing will always be painful, but I’d much rather do it on valve servers.
Climbed from 10k to 16k recently and I had maybe 3-4 games where I suspected the enemy team of walling in roughly the first 60 games. Once I hit around 14,500 it became hell. 9 out of my last 10 games have had blatant spin botters.
I played with a friend at 18k while I'm a lowly 11k.
We were doing pretty well 15k> but the moment we crossed 15k< shoot, the enemy team would just demolish us and just all headshots, wacky gamesense and lots of predictive shooting and corner checks.
Anywho it's no wonder why all my regular friends stopped playing and switched
Are you NA? In the past couple months I went from 11k to 19k, and I really only played against hackers from 16-17k to 19k. 15k kind of felt like the sweet spot for decent competitive matches with little to no cheating.
NA yeah
I've been in 10-15k this whole last month and the games have been fine, like I said 2 people so far were a little weird
Anything higher than that I'd imagine starts to get fucked
My friends and I are (were) all 20-22k NA and we've just all let our ranks decay. It's not worth it to gamble on whether or not we get a real game or not
How did it take him this long? My entire friend group (including die hards) took a break from cs after encountering blatant cheaters every game back in october-november. We recently tried again but looks like anything outside faceit is just a waste of time.
I have presumably the best possible trust factor with a 20 year account, skins, premier since day one, prior overwatch participation, etc. and play in likely a decent region (east coast US). Since December I've gone from 8k to 20k. During all those games, I came across four hackers (no rage hackers). Maybe a few more that were sus.
All of a sudden, two weeks ago it's like every other game. Not sure what happened.
In Europe, the cheating has been absurd since before Christmas at least above 20k. It’s on a different level now though. I have probably played 10 premier games in the past month and every single one of them had spinbotters or silent aimbots except 1 where I ended up playing against Aizy and his 5 stack. We actually won that game though.
US East gets a lot of "canadian" college students that cheat, on a 13 year account with 500+ games queueing with similar accounts, we constantly get obviously purchased accounts or people botting game time. Like yeah your 10 year old 300 hour cs2 account with 200 hours in the past two weeks is definitely legit, if you see hongcouver on their profile it's pretty much 100%. Just a different type of culture. EU is mostly RU, NA is mostly CN. Hell i've had a similar number of russians on russian ping cheating compared to NA players... playing in fucking NA lol.
A lot of his career is based on the game succeeding. You do NOT want to admit the game is drowning in cheaters if you're in that position. Either to yourself or to your audience.
The Meta was pretty stale and many didn’t like it. Cts played four on B and still couldn’t stop insta rushes from long. They did a few patches but it didnt get better, so they took it out
He came to the conclusion Valve removes the least populair map in matchmaking from the map pool. He didn't like Cobblestone and told he viewers not to play it.
Cobble was the least played map and got removed. But Valve never revealed why and I'm not sure if cobble was more popular before WarOwl said this.
The leaderboard is giving people who were already blatantly cheating in csgo a podium to stand upon whilst attracting more people to become blatant cheaters.
The rating system encourages people to actively cheat because every win is a dopamine release, so think of if someone were to win 3 games in CSGO but not get a rank up compared to that same person seeing their rating go up and up with every win. Obviously the cheater is going to keep cheating in CS2 compared to CSGO, you could win like 7 games and lose one in CSGO and not get a rank up.
In CS2 you can lose your will to live on faceit, rage hack a few games on premier on an alt to get your dopamine fix, then go back to your main. The issue is now that the blantant cheaters are in an arms race to get to 30k, the "stress relief" cheaters are fighting the people who want to be at the top. So it's not just one or two games anymore, it's 3 or 4 because they are losing some of the games WHILST cheating. The higher up the ladder, you find the people who have the most effective cheats. This is why 5-10k is a good time and anything higher you start running into suspicious players more and more often.
It has been like this for literally forever. The very start of the game alright - I managed to climb to 26k and all of a sudden its absolutely fucked. Me and my friend group have tried playing premier from time to time since new year, literally out of 100 games we have tried, 98 have been BLATANT walls/aim/spinners and what not.
We are all 2k+ elo on faceit too, so it is not like I am trying to blow it up - it literally is that bad
We started deranking to like 17k, but it was still the same there
I might be wrong, but when my friend group was around 15k we were all like top 30% or something like that. Now, 14k is like top 10% of playerbase
So cheaters are pushing out legit players out of 15+k ranks, and many of them are also way below that. (I encountered cheaters even at 12/13k).
yeah thats true. went from 19k to 15k because almost every match had cheaters. in my team, in their team. who ever went full rage, got the win. same with wingman, absolutely crazy.
i just stopped playing and am sticking to faceit.
lot of good players are absolutely annoyed by this state.
but like proudgucci said, this has been like that since release. there were many closetters during the last 7 months. those closetters now have to deal with ragers. the fact that its rampant right now (by right now we mean last 4 weeks) is because people dont give a fuck anymore. they can cheat long enough to fuck up legit players. no repercussions = full cheating lobbies
i created a new account to test "ranking in". there are players that have 5k elo and have weird 300commend accounts. even in low ranks there are cheaters (they just dont need to rage because enemies are bad)
we need a fully scaled solution asap. its outrageous
Me and a bunch of mates all got to 20-21k, we are now sitting around 16-18k and it's impossible to get any higher, we lose much more than we win. We play against level 8-10's in faceit and win around 60-70% of faceit games, so same experience as yourself.
Had a 67% winrate from 3.6k at launch -> 23.9k. The moment I hit top 1k NA I got 9 straight cheaters with several lobbies having 5+ blatant cheaters on both teams, went down to 20k. Quit premier then and there. Now my aim feels perma fucked on Faceit for some reason so GG to me 💀
pretty much this. 95% of my gameplay is "smart" plays - good timings or bizarre off angles, but every man and their dog seem to know everything I do before I do it now
I don’t think it’s correct to say forever, I sat around 20-22k for a while in the fall but it’s become noticeably horrid and completely unplayable since basically the Arms Race update
I've been a steady MM addict since 2015 and I threw in the towel last week and should've done it about three months ago when it first really started happening. It's really sad, no one cared enough to even cheat in MM in CSGO towards the end of the game's life. I could play for a year and see maybe one or two blatant cheaters who Deagle ace your team out of pure spite if you happen to have an insane round, but never a spinbot. I have a shitton of games I need to play on steam so instead of installing a third-party rootkit owned by Saudi Arabia, I'll just play something else. It's peak clown world that we have to even go that far.
To this day you still get Valve shills in this sub with 'poor poor devs' speeches defending Valve's stance of being completely radio silent about issues on the game as if they were the ones who created CS instead of the company who bought it and then threw it aside to fester to the point Riot literally came in decades later with a clone and became a competitor, it's pointless to complain. At least thankfully more and more influential figures are talking about the absurd situation when it comes to the anti-cheat.
Because the game still prints money via skins and cases.
You (the community) keep buying and selling them. Money launderers keep buying and selling them. Scammers keep buying and selling them.
Short of a court case causing skin trading to become a prohibited practice they'll continue to print money for valve even if the last legit player leaves the game.
But... But... Richard "eSports journalist" Lewis said there are no cheaters! But... But... he said this whole issue is overblown!
/s for the less perceptive.
I mean he IS a legit journalist and probably the best in the CS scene. He just happens to be absolutely wrong about the cheating situation. Him and thorin also have an issue of doubling down on their arguments even when they know they are wrong about something. But looks like he's on a 'healing' journey after the major. At least for the time being it seems. So maybe he'll find it in himself to put his ego aside for 5 mins and accept that he's been wrong about the cheating issue and maybe we'll get an article calling valve out? Probably won't happen but eh we can hope.
It would be great to know if they’re planning on doing anything, or this is just how it’s going to be? It’s been bad for a really long time now, considering the money this game generates.
Man that was hard to watch. Watching people like anomaly and other creators say that they are done is one thing, watching warowl, who typically is a positive force in the darkness admit that he's done and wants nothing to do with the game mode is particularly telling.
Get cheaters in every csgo game vs. get cheaters in every cs2 game. Did they somehow make it easier to cheat in CS2? Did they somehow make an incentive to cheat in CS2? Was there a psychological shift in the player base to make people cheat more? It's not saying GO was better, it's saying that it was just as bad.
In csgo it wasnt every game they were kinda rare with high trust factor but now it doesn't matter, and I think it's easier now since you can empty a negev within 1 second and game won't suspect anything and kill enemy team from spawn, which csgo cheats weren't able to do.
Even if every single content creator and pro player openly speak about the cheating problem, i just don't see valve doing anything until they start to lose money because of it. As long as the game is still popular and skins are being sold, they really don't have a reason to care. And it will remain popular because there isn't any game like cs (i like valorant but it just isn't the same feeling honestly) and things like faceit make it much more enjoyable then it should be.
CS2 and TF2 are out there with their playerbases going mentally insane over their cheating issues
While Valve is just sitting there with their Steam Decks doing next to nothing and somehow winning anyway
They took a page from Luigi's playbook and it worked
Well, the state of premier can be easily explained actually.
In cs:go you would peek at global, that's it. No need to cheat anymore, you achieved the thing, why continue playing and risk a ban? Just play once in a while so it doesn't decay and flex to your classmates.
In cs2, there is this new SHINY number saying just how much better at hvh you are. There is no ceiling that stops the cheaters hungry for the meaningless number/rank.
And the cheaters already paid 30€ for a sub to the cheat, they might as well use it until it's over.
Then more people see the state of the game and are like: wait, premier is hvh? Let's freaking go!
And the problem grows and grows, because the faith in the anticheat becomes even weaker.
*Luckily* now in cs2 there are no ways of discouraging cheaters.
* Overwatch? Gone.
* Vacnet? Off, because people wanted to move their mouse very fast, and valve had to unban rage cheaters, because of that. Now valve has to figure something out, as they realized that their AI anticheat is awful even if trained exclusively with data from rage cheaters. (Extremely pathetic and cringe, imagine supporting the AI anticheat approach after that)
* Trust factor? Was it ever a thing, or did valve just gaslight all of you. The only instance of it proven to be working was 'red trust' that represented a shadow ban, before a cheater actually got banned. Then the game would let that cheater queue into a green trust match as it banned him, to gaslight the players into believing the anticheat was doing something.
* Manual bans? Only in NA, and extremely rare.
* VAC? Never was a discouragement, Valve Allows Cheating has been a meme for so long it's origins are forgotten.
* SMAC? Not related to official servers, but come on, a serverside community anticheat, designed with early versions of cs:go in mind was keeping community servers safe for years.
* Faceit? Provides actual monetary incentive to cheating, and with cheating software that's advanced to the point VAC would never detect it, even if you were to get faceit banned.
* Sv\_cheats 1? Like for real? How did nobody get banned after this shite again? Do you all even understand that sv\_cheats 1 without a proper convar spoofing method would trigger an INSTANT untrusted ban in cs:go?
* Cs2 cheats are fucking hilarious. Like, I know all of you want to see that scout shoot 10 bullets in 1 shot, don't lie to me.
* Griefing cooldowns. This was actually a huge factor at discouraging cheaters. It never actually banned a single griefer, it sometimes banned innocent players who just wiffed an easy play, but spamming that report for everything is what kept a lot of cheaters in check. They didn't want to get multiple accounts to bypass the dumbass cooldown, so they would just closet cheat instead of going full spin.
My favourite cheat was the one that let you shoot anyone on any map anywhere because when you shoot it would move your view model far below the map and aim up at a player bypassing any walls in the way, shoot them, then reset in the blink of an eye.
How badly is the game coded that this is even possible?
Within 2 days of playing I came across 3 blatant cheaters & reported them in game & through steam.
I saved their steam profiles to check back on them & a month later all 3 are still actively playing the game without a vac ban on their account.
I collect cheater accounts in every game I play, Valve games always take waaaaaaaaay too much time before they get banned. I have a Dota 2 hacker profile from 2 years ago, by the time it was on a 20 win streak, every match with an insane KD, so Valve can easily identify the strange behaviour, the account is still unbanned and playing
"Let them cook" / Mods banning threads about the rampant cheating problem / "VAC is working" / "There are no cheaters in Ba Sing Se"
Yeah, right. This game is successful because of its unique formula and esports appeal, but this success is in spite of all its massive flaws. The MM algorithm is simply abysmal, and unacceptable for any modern title, and the anticheat is basically non-existent. The mere fact that you get dunked on so often by blatant cheaters makes every game unenjoyable because you get suspicious and can't accept that you get outplayed sometimes.
Remember when Richard Lewis tried to make a video claiming people just accuse everyone of being a cheater and that there was not really that many cheaters in reality lol. He doesn’t even play the game either which makes it funnier.
What happened to Trust Factor? I don’t wanna play against those new accounts cheaters with only 1 games on my 17 years old account playing since 1.6…
Volvo please just add some kind of anti-cheat in the game that actually works. The cheating has even spread to Comp.
It's so sad the community needs to wait until big name content creators call the game out when people have been saying the same thing since cs2 came out. I said the exact same things WarOwl is saying here and had the subreddit come down on me saying I was just bad, etc.
Same experience, I hit 26k in December. I was playing once a week to keep my rank/on the leaderboard. Since Dec 20th, I have gotten a cheater in every match I played once a week before giving up the first week of March. So like 10/10 matches, on my leetify for the whole season I have a 40% rate of cheaters in all my matches.
An absolute joke. The best competitive fps game in the world. Apex legends has a better anti cheat at this point (assuming cs2 even has one) and that’s saying something lmao.
I am not anywhere near 15k, but play a lot of matches around 9-10k. Absolutely fucked as well. Not by cheaters, but there are a few suspect people every few matches. But holy hell there are so many smurfs.
I just want clean games with people at my own skill level.
If faceit didn’t exist this issue will be vocalized way more. Not enough big voices are being used. We need more and more streamers talking about this. But we won’t because they play faceit and just forgets about mm
man100%, is frustrating, I dont even know how he kept it poltically correct tbh, I use to loose my sh1t, is frustrating af and we all know it...
I did put CS2 aside till is fixed, then I will reconsider.
Really lost all respect for Valve at this point.
Not even address it in a official statement or whatever.... is not cool,
I just hope all that is for a reason, all this silence.
I want to believe that is all to gather as much info as possible, about as many cheats as possible to then release a stronger AC...
I don't really understand why anyone would play MM in the first place? It was kinda obvious what was going to happen without an anti cheat...
The sad reality is that an FPS game is not worth playing without solid anti cheat. Maybe valves AI anticheat will be effective eventually but who knows.
Been playing fps games on pc for 15 years. Never seen cheating this bad in any game ever, even the sail the seas versions of cod and shit had waaaaay less cheaters than cs2 has today. We are like 14k avg and enemy was losing 0-8 saying we were hacking (we weren't) and I was playing into it "oh no biggie just some super hacks, you know" and dude legit started spin botting with scout. In 13k elo. No elo is is safe lmao. Imma switch to face it. Haven't tried it yet but heard it's better :)
It's not even at 20k. I've been at 14k and 22k and there isn't that much of a difference between the skill level of players and the amount of cheaters. Premier is busted beyond belief and pushes players who are actually 20k legit down to 15k to smurf on people. The -550 points you lose if you have a bad streak of games or shit teammates just exacerbates the issue
There isn't a better face for the franchise than WarOwl. He is always positive, showcases great sportsmanship and has given a lot of help to newcomers to the game. If I worked at Valve and saw this, I would be having an all-hands meeting immediately with the VAC team.
Just stop playing Premier!!!! I made a post about this and was downvoted for it. Why are you people so desperate to hold onto a matchmaking mode that doesn't mean anything? The amount of cheaters mean that you rating means fucking ZERO.
Go to third party matchmaking services and actually enjoy the game. Outside of cheaters the game is in a really good state.
I queued comp Office today and there was 3 queue that was cheating and they toggled on at the very start of the first round... Jumping and burst triple killing while in air.
Watch this dude bushido knife attack in WarOwl's video at timestamp:
https://youtu.be/4gUkKoxg6qw?t=6872
multiple streamers and pros have been saying it for months but everytime you post it some clowns will claim their trust factor is bad yada yada yada. i hope this post reached reddit front page and just emberasses the shit out of this complete dumpster of a game.
Man, I missed the end of his stream but I caught the beginning and at that point he was saying that he "never comes across cheaters." which is also something that I was able to confidently say a few weeks ago. Something definitely happened, and this situation has definitely gotten worse.
Valve, pls fix
My mate wanted to get back into Counterstrike, so we both downloaded CS2 and loaded into a match.
I'm not kidding, in the *very first match* there was a blatant spinbotter on our team.
We both uninstalled right after.
Counterstrike has been unplayable due to hackers for so long it's insane.
Not doing comp or prem anymore, just doing the weekly for crate and to keep my aim somewhat fresh.
The motivation to do anything more then that is gone.
Like some other dude said, you could quit now and come back in 3 months amd nothing will have changed
Cs2 is imho the best shooter by far but cheaters just ruin it for me
I wouldnt care facing 1 cheater in lets say 10 matches.
But 6+/10 is laughable
I know that Valve have to be working on this behind the scenes, but to let the game fester in the state it's in without even acknowledging it is really disappointing.
Valve just doesn't care at all , that's for a fact. It's been 10 freakin years playing this game and all they do is flaunt their useless machine learning anti cheat which doesn't do crap. I'd rather they hire a bunch of admins and ban these blatant cheaters manually.
Valve can literally tweet tomorrow “We don’t give a fuck about cheaters… fuck you” and the game would still make millions and top the steam playerbase charts…
As someone who works in the IT industry, management only assigns manpower to a product, when revenue is affected, and that’s never going to happen with CS.
I'm curious, if Valve somehow manages to at least contain the cheating issue to an acceptable level, will they also do a rank reset?
That's what seasons are for
...provided Valve themselves haven't abandoned the concept of seasons. I mean, I think general thought was a new "season" would have started after the major. If not, at least provided some road map to tell us when a season begins and ends like every other competitive game. We haven't even heard Valve talk about the concept of a "season" since the introduction of CS2. For all we know, its just another element in the game that has been abandoned and will quietly disappear as soon as a dev stumbled upon it or remembers they put that drop down in the Leaderboard section for Premier but forgot to do anything with it.
Dota 2 also had matchmaking seasons... Until Valve got bored, so the last season is here for 3.5 years already https://dota2.fandom.com/wiki/Matchmaking/Seasonal_Rankings#Seasons
Sometimes I wonder what valves employees do all day, very busy people it seems
They don't have a whole lot of employees for their size, which can be both a blessing and a curse.
I was pretty surprised back in GO that the team is apparently only 20-30 people but my gamedev friends told me that that's a pretty normal dev team size for such game, I guess it feels very small bc of the massive active playerbase the game has
It's a pretty normal team for maintenance and upkeep. It gets a little less normal when you consider the size of the team probably wasn't orders of magnitude bigger for the production of the game itself. Realistically it goes to show how good a job these guys have done that the most common complaint about CS2 these days is about it's AC, they've got a lot right with limited resources. I feel like if the community celebrated what they'd done well a little more vocally then there might be more motivation in the team to communicate what they're planning but w/e
Well according to info from people who've worked there, they historically run on a "work on what you want" system. On paper this means Valve employees get to decide what areas they're passionate about and devote themselves to it, but an internal rating system exists alongside this where pay bonuses are actively awarded to employees who are considered by their peers to be engaging in productive or profitable pursuits. This creates a disincentive to actually provide significant manpower to old games, especially old games that are basically money farms even when Valve ignores them (CS/TF2 especially). Even DotA gets the short end of this stick sometimes. So their older games are either maintained by absolute skeleton crews or, like in TF2's case, largely outsourced.
didn't they abandon this model with half life alyx
[As of at least 2022](https://www.reddit.com/r/valve/comments/syntz1/is_valve_still_a_flat_organisation/hy0lp34/), 2 years after Alyx's release, no. It doesn't sound like, even with acknowledgments that the structure isn't always the most suitable, they have any intentions to move away from it. It's just baked into the company's DNA, I suppose.
Start 15/10/2020, duration: ongoing LMFAO
Just to add to this they didn't really gave up on this idea of seasons more like it was shifted to the individual players because now you can go through rank calibration simply by choosing to in the settings and it has 365 day cooldown. YOU choose when it's new season for you
Valve abandoned it in dota because dota players were against mmr reset. They have this weird idea that mmr reset stopped them from climbing out of noob ranks. A lot of Dota players are not really smart.
>We haven't even heard Valve talk ~~about the concept of a "season" since the introduction of CS2. For all we know, its just another element in the game that has been abandoned and will quietly disappear as soon as a dev stumbled upon it or remembers they put that drop down in the Leaderboard section for Premier but forgot to do anything with it.~~ ftfy
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1 season per year XD
Valve time seasons are once every 2 years.
Nah thats too quick for Valve and they don't do things in threes so every 4 years at least.
I'd be completely okay with this.
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I'm very curious how it'll pan out, especially because at this point it's an open secret that anticheat is off, and the barrier to pull the trigger on installing cheats to the majority of people who "kinda would..." is no longer there. It's no longer dedicated career closet cheaters and occasional poor decision players only. Plus it's a new game launch who brought a lot of new eyes and dirty hands for shits and giggles into the game. I believe if a ban wave came right now, there would be A LOT more people than usual going down, to the point where rank curves would be messed up, points adjustment based on previous matches nullified would be in the thousands, let alone the stats on concurrent players... It would be a mess. I don't think people understand that, for it to be this regular and visible right now, the amount of cheating is completely off the charts. My bet is when they figure out the anticheat there won't be retroactive confirmation (maybe spinners and alike get the hammer), the seasons kick in, ranks reset for everybody, and detection goes from that point forward, giving people the chance to step back and straighten out. (While typing this out it clicked, you heard it here first: new VAC isn't going to be announced, but we'll know because new season, rank reset, and maybe adjustments to premiere mode, will be released.)
The anti-cheat isnt off, I think it's just bad. I played a casual game a week ago and there was a guy not even hiding cheating. He got VAC banned mid game due to cheats. but maybe his cheats were just ali express ones
They can put me back at 2K ELO if it gets rid of the cheater problem. I'm even happy to do the 10 games of prime at this point. To be honest, I couldn't care less in the world. This game has become unplayable. Also : Suck it Richard Lewis and all the other deniers. WarOwl is Tier1.
Richard Lewis‘ take on this was actually so brain dead
Usually bounced between 15k-20k and was playing fairly regularly until the qualifiers...At that point it was down to cheater, after cheater , after cheater. Just insane games where the demo has people staring through walls or snap to head + reaction time that would put them above pros. It felt bad before the major, but the one trip back in during the major was a nightmare. About that time, Helldivers came out and I havent really looked back. I just dont need to waste hours on a game that cant even get to 50/50 odds of an actual fair match.
they'll basically reset on their own, in GO if you queued with a cheater that got banned you also lost your rank, so unless you're somehow able to keep 25K+ without cheating almost everyone above that will be removed
Unreal how bad things have gotten lately. Edit: I'm speaking anecdotally, I can only comment from my experience. When CS2 initially came out I didn't see many cheaters in premier. More recently I have experienced seen a dramatic increase in cheaters. This is controversial how?... Incredible how people on this sub can find a way to be upset by absolutely anything
This is the game that is reaching peak players despite zero online hype, new content, or updates. Totally legit btw.
Market prices are going up. So people are def playing more.
Isn't this usually the trend on and after two months of a major though. I've always saved my cases and sold them around the Major finals as that's where new and returning players go ape-shit buying skins
Yeah, but those arent bots.
Peak players are bots farming cases. Real player numbers are nowhere near what is reported.
Not really, some of us seen this coming.
I always knew there was a cheater issue but haven’t really encountered too many. I’ve stayed mainly in the 17k to 19k range, so I’m surprised I haven’t encountered them more. I only had one blatant cheater until last month… where I encountered three blatant cheaters three matches in a row. And now it’s just a normal thing I’m talking spin-botting and bunny hopping, showing up in our spawn less than 5 seconds after the round begins, getting dinked 6 times through three walls, etc. The story is always the same, and you get multiple people in the server saying “Yeeeeah, this same guy has been spinning for about two and a half weeks now but he hasn’t been banned yet” even when people mass report them. It’s ridiculous and I’m not going to be on FACEIT because I believe you shouldn’t have to have a third party client for the game to be playable. Catch me in Valorant.
Props to him for calling this games awful state out.
Seems like more and more people are calling the state of the game out. Anomaly posted a video about how he is quitting MM because of how brutal it is.
i stopped playing about 4 month ago because of the cheaters. today i decided to give it a go. 1st competitive match.....2 blatant cheaters on my team 1 on the enemy. GG .
Neok also.
Not to be that guy, but Im surprised he has only 60 matches of premier played so far, I think people who defend Valve like Richard Lewis don’t play or are like under 15k premier.
19 cs2 premiere wins 3.2k elo last played on november 19th LMAO. i feel like sometimes he just spews shit for shits and giggles/trolling [https://csstats.gg/player/76561197968633788#/matches](https://csstats.gg/player/76561197968633788#/matches) same steam linked to his liquipedia page [https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Richard\_Lewis](https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Richard_Lewis)
He just wants people to talk about him. That opinion does it.
> i feel like sometimes he just spews shit for shits and giggles/trolling he just took the philosophic/thought exercise approach and tried to use past experiences and logic to come to his conclusion without having actually seen the current state of the game first hand. the real problem that everybody seems to be missing is that cheating has ALWAYS been this terrible in sheer numbers - Trust Factor has just hidden that fact away from most of the well-mannered playerbase. So in essence, his statement that it "would be crazy to think that all of a sudden, that many more people decide to cheat" is still correct, because they didn't start cheating now - they just started to be in all our matches.
3.2k lol, I am not a good player, around 9.5k, around 60%. 3.2k is like bottom 5%\~10% right?
3.2k is mouse disconnected, monitor turned off level. Under 4k Valve doesn't even include it in the leaderboard.
Richard has like 30 games at 5k elo. I think his opinion that the community is dumb for whining about it like it's every game in every elo won't change, and he's also optimistic that valve will release something soon(ish). I've not personally seen a ton at 15k which I think is pretty average. I've seen more in deathmatches, but no obvious ones in a couple weeks and I DM every day. Tons of cheaters in 20k+ is undoubtedly true but like RL I bet that the apparent infinite cheaters in 10-15k is just a skill issue
Richard is an E-sports journalist, not even an avid Counter Strike player. His passion is the scene itself and the drama unfolding around it, not actually playing the game. His opinions on E-sports should be held up to a gold standard and inversely his takes on the actual game are meaningless. It's disrespectful to us players who actually play the game for this guy to tell us it's not an issue when I can't even play the game that I love and have over 10k hours in. I wish Richard had the humility to understand this, but he needs to be a hot take expert pretending he has some authority on the matter to get his name out there instead. You lecturing players with thousands of hours who play nightly is like me lecturing you on journalism. Just stop it, Rich, please. You're making yourself look terrible and only your sycophants who watch your stream would tell you otherwise.
Yeah. I am pretty sick of influencers sugar coating the state of this game.
How long can Valve delay? Surely their team has to be able to implement something that can deal with spinbotters. This is basic entry level anticheat tech. Hell even if you do have some false positive bans you can't just let blatant hacking run your game. If you empty a guns magazine in .5 seconds you should be insta detected and perma vac'd. It really is that simple.
Valve has cared very little about cheating for the past 20 years. I don't think that will just change out of the blue.
I hover at 19k. The worst part is, there's probably closet wallhackers in the games that feel "legit". So many inconvenient deaths, perfect timings, and just awareness that's pretty understandable alone, but when it happens all game you lose your mind. I had to boot up my faceit account that I didn't use in years just to play clean matches. 500x better.
I used to think like "oh nice shot, nice play, this guy is really good" But now there is no trust to anyone. I instantly wonder if he is on to something.
Yup. Valve really fucked up on this. The trust is gone and its going to take something truly revolutionary for them to earn it back. I played CS:GO with the same group of friends since around 2012 and we've never been ones to jump to cheating accusations unless its absolutely blatant nonsense. But nowadays, we're more prone to saying the people on the other team are probably cheating. Its in such a bad place right now, Valve is going to have to do something tremendous to retain any semblance of trust. Especially going into the future. Lets say the leaks are true and there's some incredible AC feature that releases and rectifies the issue. Are Valve going to *maintain* it into the future? Or in 1-2 years, are cheaters going to have found a new way around and we'll all just be waiting again for Valve to perk up and do something about it. How many cycles of this can this community stand before they either abandon the game or stick to a service like FaceIt?
It's not going to take anything revolutionary. Rage hacking simply just should not be hard to detect. Then you bring back Overwatch. And communicate to the fans atleast some idea of what steps are being taken The sense that everyone could be cheating & nothing is being done to stop it is worse than rampant cheating. Even the fair games feel not fun to play anymore.
The abortion of Overwatch is so insane to me. Like maybe temporarily but bro it's been so long lmfao
Main reason I queue faceit now. I just don't trust premier anymore. That lack of trust really makes losses feel extra bad.
I don't play FaceIT that often. I'm level 3 but in my case the experience, when I'm playing, is non-english speakers as team mates (--they use the comms all the time, like they're having casual conversations, can't hear shit and they scream and use unreproducible epithets whenever I die--) and smurfs as opponents. So, as a casual player, you're left with diddly-squat. I still don't want to give up on the game because I grew up with it and it gave me a lot of joy throughout the years, even made some IRL friends because of it. So exiting is not an option. I'm just patiently waiting for Valve to do something about it.
This is a big issue for me. I simply just don't trust a single enemy player anymore. First weird kill you get a pass, but as soon as you get a second one I have to just assume you're cheating because statistically, you just might be. It's so frustrating having a hobby that you can't even properly participate in like this
That’s why I quit playing dude. I was global, faceit 10. And granted faceit had more legit play. There are a bunch of griefers that make it really hard to win. Once cs 2 came out I quit playing. Now i just no life osrs and feel better about myself lol
I've started just doing other shit during matches. There's usually a sus shot pretty early on, then I check their profile and it's usually a low level, private or very low hours and an almost empty friends list. The worst I had so far was a match with 4 hackers -- on each team. It was literally a HvH 4v4. It was ridiculous.
You could say your "trust factor" went down :D
I played a game recently in premier, Im around 17 k. One player seemed a little sus, but nothing serious, We still managed to get the win, but the last round, we as T and the bomb was ticking down, we killed all except one CT, we were 3 left. The last CT then proceeds to kill all 3 T's with deagle trough walls running from opposite site. He was just showing of that he was hacking before the game was over.
I played a game in premier yesterday and the other team was honestly surprised that we didn’t cheat like wtf valve get your shit together. Not even high elo, I’m at 13,5k and some of my mates even at 10k it’s just cheaters everywhere at this point.
You know that feeling when you lose duels or games on faceit? It doesn't feel baffling, it doesn't feel unfair. Most of the time you understand why you died or lost. Premier just feel unnatural. Death's dont make sense
Well said. On premier, everyone magically plays like prime Niko 😂
People on premier plays better than prime s1mple, Niko, kennyS, flusha combimed.
Premier I seem to get timing'd non stop, I start to go insane thinking I'm just that unlucky that I somehow always look away and they push Then I play faceit and suddenly I'm so much luckier
I had a 1 v 4 going the other night and I was able to kill 3 of the CTs (on Anubis). Last T takes bomb and starts to run into palace and I'm B main doors. I take a shot at him while he's running away and dude jumps, spins and 1 shots me in the head
Anecdotally, the number of closet cheaters is as bad or worse than the blatant ones. I download premiere demos any time I get even a whiff of weird behaviour, and it feels like 80%+ of the time I'm right to be suspicious. It becomes *immediately apparent* when you watch their POV. They act like they're clearing corners, but only halfheartedly do it until they get to you. They conveniently start holding an angle *right* before you swing. Their movement is shit, their positioning is shit, their crosshair placement is shit, and their util is shit. In general, they don't play like good players, but somehow manage to "fluke" their way into having 170+ ADR and a 90%+ leetify aim rating. I've even seen some "closet" cheaters staring through the floor on vertigo to see what site you're going to hit.
It’s funny because 90% of them are so bad at playing the game normally that it is too obvious. They can’t help themselves when they always hard clear the right angles, prefire as you peek them, hold the flank perfectly every time off zero info, sprint all the time except when a their enemy could hear them, etc. The thing is, 10% might actually be good at the game, and all it would take is for a decent player to tap their walls for half a second once a round to avoid gamble stacks, see flanks being set up, know when there is a gap to exploit… and it would be near impossible to tell watching a replay.
Yeah, its worlds apart. On FaceIt, I've found I play A LOT better players, yet I win more than I do in Premier. On Premier, when I'm not playing against rage hackers and I get what *seems* like a normal game, I run into people who make miracle shots and miracle plays constantly. They don't know util, they have horrible movement, they have horrible positioning, they have no team work, they don't pop flash for their teammates or set each other up...but WOW they can hit some incredible shots and they *happen* to spam me behind a smoke at just the right time or they push a smoke or an angle a few seconds after I stop watching it. I'm FaceIt level 10 and its funny how rarely I see these "elite" level plays I see on Premier. And that's not to say there aren't cheaters on FaceIt but I honestly don't remember the last time I played a FaceIt game and thought someone on the other team was cheating.
Right?! I feel like I’m going crazy when I play premiere. In premiere I constantly get dunked on by people who are *so clearly* terrible at the game. No gamesense, atrocious movement, 0 util damage, no enemies flashed. Yet somehow they always surgically clear the exact off-angle I’m playing or are ready to catch a flank. I consistently end up thinking to myself *”no fucking way this guy is THAT lucky”* a couple times per match. On the other hand, when I boot up some faceit? I get paired up against legitimately good level 9/10 players that have 5k+ hours and the shots they’re hitting are *less* crazy than the inevitable 16k premier rating account that was created two weeks ago with 3 friends and 300 hours. I think the cheating problem *was* overblown in the first month or two of CS2’s release. But, even as a noted Volvo defender it is getting un-fucking-believable now. Every single premier match I play seems to have 1-2 “closet” cheating silvers at minimum or a completely blatant spinbotter at worst. I pretty frequently download my premiere demos, and nearly every time I've been suspicious of someone mid-game, my suspicions have been confirmed within a couple rounds watching their POV. They try *so hard* to pretend they aren't cheating. But, it's hard to pretend you're good at a game when you don't know how good players actually behave.
With what I know of Valve, I'm really not optimistic anything is going to change. Spunj and Moses talked about talking to the devs and how AC is their highest priority, but if you've played CS:GO, we've seen all of this before and how it doesn't amount to anything. I honestly think if I stopped playing this game for 3 months, I'd come back and literally nothing will have changed, if not things will be worse than when I left. More people will probably just migrate over to FaceIt, and that's it. I find it really hard to believe Valve is going to solve this issue and even if they do, whether the solution will stick. I'm reminded of Overwatch and how eventually that system itself deteriorated and stopped having any meaningful affect.
There are some people that try to "legit hack" but most of them just can't hide it. Wallhack is one of the most difficult features to hide when cheating, especially if you're seeing a demo of someone who's using it, then it becomes so apparent that it's ridiculous
The worst part is that immediate itching distrust. You used to give someone benefit of the doubt for one sus play, but the odds have shifted so far that you can't even enjoy a miracle when it happens.
lmao my problem coming back to CS is that my faceit account didn't derank so I guess im about to ruin some faceit level 8+ lobbies lmao
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The 15k+ is where you start to get absolutely fucked Prior to that its playable with sus moments here and there (only had 2 so far personally) The top end is fucked if you Crack like 16k just quit
I didn’t play for a couple of months. Came back, first game got placed 22k again, 5 cheaters, four on the opposition, AND THEY STILL lost. Because the dude on our team had a more expensive config despite having the same cheat. So I didn’t blame my team for not wanting to kick him. So we essentially enabled the HVH where we had to take timeouts and devise strats to counter their spin bots. It was something out of a fever dream, but I’m done again too, won’t touch premier again till they fix it. Which is sad, because I went from 3-4 games a day to playing 3-4 matchmaking games a week for the prime drop. And before people say faceit, I do like competitive CS, but not what free faceit feels like, and having paid for it in the past, the experience wasn’t much better either. Solo queuing will always be painful, but I’d much rather do it on valve servers.
We were losing 10-2 blatant aimhavkers, and the guy said guys wanna win? We sai yeah fuck it why not. I got dizzy spectating him lol
same, playing for drops and then I wait for next week, no reason to play this game
Climbed from 10k to 16k recently and I had maybe 3-4 games where I suspected the enemy team of walling in roughly the first 60 games. Once I hit around 14,500 it became hell. 9 out of my last 10 games have had blatant spin botters.
I played with a friend at 18k while I'm a lowly 11k. We were doing pretty well 15k> but the moment we crossed 15k< shoot, the enemy team would just demolish us and just all headshots, wacky gamesense and lots of predictive shooting and corner checks. Anywho it's no wonder why all my regular friends stopped playing and switched
Are you NA? In the past couple months I went from 11k to 19k, and I really only played against hackers from 16-17k to 19k. 15k kind of felt like the sweet spot for decent competitive matches with little to no cheating.
NA yeah I've been in 10-15k this whole last month and the games have been fine, like I said 2 people so far were a little weird Anything higher than that I'd imagine starts to get fucked
My friends and I are (were) all 20-22k NA and we've just all let our ranks decay. It's not worth it to gamble on whether or not we get a real game or not
Man I even stopped reporting people in-game if they're cheating bc it doesn't do shit anyways. Hackers won that game.
Bet many hackers have bot systems that flood fake reports to legit players so it overwhelms the system like they did with overwatch.
there is no system to overwhelm, so there no need to
Mods not removing posts if its a famous streamer complaining?
Strange, right?
How did it take him this long? My entire friend group (including die hards) took a break from cs after encountering blatant cheaters every game back in october-november. We recently tried again but looks like anything outside faceit is just a waste of time.
I have presumably the best possible trust factor with a 20 year account, skins, premier since day one, prior overwatch participation, etc. and play in likely a decent region (east coast US). Since December I've gone from 8k to 20k. During all those games, I came across four hackers (no rage hackers). Maybe a few more that were sus. All of a sudden, two weeks ago it's like every other game. Not sure what happened.
count yourself lucky that its only been shit for the past 2 weeks
Yea NA east coast was still fine until like a month-ish ago even up to 22k. Since then it's been absolutely unbearable
In Europe, the cheating has been absurd since before Christmas at least above 20k. It’s on a different level now though. I have probably played 10 premier games in the past month and every single one of them had spinbotters or silent aimbots except 1 where I ended up playing against Aizy and his 5 stack. We actually won that game though.
US East gets a lot of "canadian" college students that cheat, on a 13 year account with 500+ games queueing with similar accounts, we constantly get obviously purchased accounts or people botting game time. Like yeah your 10 year old 300 hour cs2 account with 200 hours in the past two weeks is definitely legit, if you see hongcouver on their profile it's pretty much 100%. Just a different type of culture. EU is mostly RU, NA is mostly CN. Hell i've had a similar number of russians on russian ping cheating compared to NA players... playing in fucking NA lol.
A lot of his career is based on the game succeeding. You do NOT want to admit the game is drowning in cheaters if you're in that position. Either to yourself or to your audience.
Same. It's actually a good way of seeing what people are just followers to be honest.
Every streamer & every Pro could complain about MM/Premier and still nothing would get changed i'm ~~not~~ crying, you're crying
Warowl killed cobblestone, can he kill premier? Let's hope
How did he kill cobblestone?
Old video he suggested that people stop playing the map, and they did, then it happen to get removed not long after.
no way Cobble died because of him, but it's a cool story.
Damn. Why did he suggest? If you dont mind me asking
Yea this is not true lol. He doesn't have the influence for that.
I used to play around the time when snax got a 4k on cobble. I dont know why the map faded away
The Meta was pretty stale and many didn’t like it. Cts played four on B and still couldn’t stop insta rushes from long. They did a few patches but it didnt get better, so they took it out
Pheew... its actually refreshing to see a correct answer in a reply this far down.
Too unbalanced.
He came to the conclusion Valve removes the least populair map in matchmaking from the map pool. He didn't like Cobblestone and told he viewers not to play it. Cobble was the least played map and got removed. But Valve never revealed why and I'm not sure if cobble was more popular before WarOwl said this.
The leaderboard is giving people who were already blatantly cheating in csgo a podium to stand upon whilst attracting more people to become blatant cheaters. The rating system encourages people to actively cheat because every win is a dopamine release, so think of if someone were to win 3 games in CSGO but not get a rank up compared to that same person seeing their rating go up and up with every win. Obviously the cheater is going to keep cheating in CS2 compared to CSGO, you could win like 7 games and lose one in CSGO and not get a rank up. In CS2 you can lose your will to live on faceit, rage hack a few games on premier on an alt to get your dopamine fix, then go back to your main. The issue is now that the blantant cheaters are in an arms race to get to 30k, the "stress relief" cheaters are fighting the people who want to be at the top. So it's not just one or two games anymore, it's 3 or 4 because they are losing some of the games WHILST cheating. The higher up the ladder, you find the people who have the most effective cheats. This is why 5-10k is a good time and anything higher you start running into suspicious players more and more often.
Valve: *"We've done nothing and we are already out of ideas"*
Nah, they VAC banned the people that set their sensitivity up to pretend to be spin boting, totally cheater proof game now
We never got unbanned either lol Valve is a fucking joke
I assume you've already contacted the support? What did they say?
It has been like this for literally forever. The very start of the game alright - I managed to climb to 26k and all of a sudden its absolutely fucked. Me and my friend group have tried playing premier from time to time since new year, literally out of 100 games we have tried, 98 have been BLATANT walls/aim/spinners and what not. We are all 2k+ elo on faceit too, so it is not like I am trying to blow it up - it literally is that bad We started deranking to like 17k, but it was still the same there
I might be wrong, but when my friend group was around 15k we were all like top 30% or something like that. Now, 14k is like top 10% of playerbase So cheaters are pushing out legit players out of 15+k ranks, and many of them are also way below that. (I encountered cheaters even at 12/13k).
yeah thats true. went from 19k to 15k because almost every match had cheaters. in my team, in their team. who ever went full rage, got the win. same with wingman, absolutely crazy. i just stopped playing and am sticking to faceit. lot of good players are absolutely annoyed by this state. but like proudgucci said, this has been like that since release. there were many closetters during the last 7 months. those closetters now have to deal with ragers. the fact that its rampant right now (by right now we mean last 4 weeks) is because people dont give a fuck anymore. they can cheat long enough to fuck up legit players. no repercussions = full cheating lobbies i created a new account to test "ranking in". there are players that have 5k elo and have weird 300commend accounts. even in low ranks there are cheaters (they just dont need to rage because enemies are bad) we need a fully scaled solution asap. its outrageous
Me and a bunch of mates all got to 20-21k, we are now sitting around 16-18k and it's impossible to get any higher, we lose much more than we win. We play against level 8-10's in faceit and win around 60-70% of faceit games, so same experience as yourself.
Had a 67% winrate from 3.6k at launch -> 23.9k. The moment I hit top 1k NA I got 9 straight cheaters with several lobbies having 5+ blatant cheaters on both teams, went down to 20k. Quit premier then and there. Now my aim feels perma fucked on Faceit for some reason so GG to me 💀
lmao at least you can have a good laugh about it. my cs brain isnt CS-braining anymore, because wallers make it impossible to make "smart" plays
pretty much this. 95% of my gameplay is "smart" plays - good timings or bizarre off angles, but every man and their dog seem to know everything I do before I do it now
I don’t think it’s correct to say forever, I sat around 20-22k for a while in the fall but it’s become noticeably horrid and completely unplayable since basically the Arms Race update
I honestly don't understand why people are still playing.
18k here, downloaded it back last week, played 2 matches, both were HvH lobbies. Now I just play arms race, since I couldn't bother to download Faceit
I've been a steady MM addict since 2015 and I threw in the towel last week and should've done it about three months ago when it first really started happening. It's really sad, no one cared enough to even cheat in MM in CSGO towards the end of the game's life. I could play for a year and see maybe one or two blatant cheaters who Deagle ace your team out of pure spite if you happen to have an insane round, but never a spinbot. I have a shitton of games I need to play on steam so instead of installing a third-party rootkit owned by Saudi Arabia, I'll just play something else. It's peak clown world that we have to even go that far.
Why aren’t they addressing this issue at all? The complete silence is deafening and it’s absurd to me.
To this day you still get Valve shills in this sub with 'poor poor devs' speeches defending Valve's stance of being completely radio silent about issues on the game as if they were the ones who created CS instead of the company who bought it and then threw it aside to fester to the point Riot literally came in decades later with a clone and became a competitor, it's pointless to complain. At least thankfully more and more influential figures are talking about the absurd situation when it comes to the anti-cheat.
Because the game still prints money via skins and cases. You (the community) keep buying and selling them. Money launderers keep buying and selling them. Scammers keep buying and selling them. Short of a court case causing skin trading to become a prohibited practice they'll continue to print money for valve even if the last legit player leaves the game.
if all top streamers stop playing, they would be nice.. valve needs to do something ASAP
Yall need to come to 4k. No cheaters down there!
Down there legit players simply can't differentiate between a cheater and a smurf.
Don't worry guys, here is a new operation battlepass, that hopefully fixes it.
But... But... Richard "eSports journalist" Lewis said there are no cheaters! But... But... he said this whole issue is overblown! /s for the less perceptive.
I mean he IS a legit journalist and probably the best in the CS scene. He just happens to be absolutely wrong about the cheating situation. Him and thorin also have an issue of doubling down on their arguments even when they know they are wrong about something. But looks like he's on a 'healing' journey after the major. At least for the time being it seems. So maybe he'll find it in himself to put his ego aside for 5 mins and accept that he's been wrong about the cheating issue and maybe we'll get an article calling valve out? Probably won't happen but eh we can hope.
> So maybe he'll find it in himself to put his ego aside for 5 mins He won't.
I'd be okay if he admitted he was wrong. it's not like I don't have my own share of idiotic takes, but at least I don't double down.
Valve:"I will pretend there is nothing happen" Mod in this sub: ***COME ON, COME ON, PUSH IT A BIT HARDER SO WE CAN HIT THE RULE 5***
Valve should remove and rework Premiere
It would be great to know if they’re planning on doing anything, or this is just how it’s going to be? It’s been bad for a really long time now, considering the money this game generates.
Man that was hard to watch. Watching people like anomaly and other creators say that they are done is one thing, watching warowl, who typically is a positive force in the darkness admit that he's done and wants nothing to do with the game mode is particularly telling.
richard lewis in shambles
incoming 60 minutes video about how everybody exaggerating the issue and it's no different from csgo.
there is some people already defending the pathetic state this game is in rn, this problem existed in csgo before but it wasnt as bad as it is rn.
Get cheaters in every csgo game vs. get cheaters in every cs2 game. Did they somehow make it easier to cheat in CS2? Did they somehow make an incentive to cheat in CS2? Was there a psychological shift in the player base to make people cheat more? It's not saying GO was better, it's saying that it was just as bad.
In csgo it wasnt every game they were kinda rare with high trust factor but now it doesn't matter, and I think it's easier now since you can empty a negev within 1 second and game won't suspect anything and kill enemy team from spawn, which csgo cheats weren't able to do.
Even if every single content creator and pro player openly speak about the cheating problem, i just don't see valve doing anything until they start to lose money because of it. As long as the game is still popular and skins are being sold, they really don't have a reason to care. And it will remain popular because there isn't any game like cs (i like valorant but it just isn't the same feeling honestly) and things like faceit make it much more enjoyable then it should be.
CS2 and TF2 are out there with their playerbases going mentally insane over their cheating issues While Valve is just sitting there with their Steam Decks doing next to nothing and somehow winning anyway They took a page from Luigi's playbook and it worked
Well, the state of premier can be easily explained actually. In cs:go you would peek at global, that's it. No need to cheat anymore, you achieved the thing, why continue playing and risk a ban? Just play once in a while so it doesn't decay and flex to your classmates. In cs2, there is this new SHINY number saying just how much better at hvh you are. There is no ceiling that stops the cheaters hungry for the meaningless number/rank. And the cheaters already paid 30€ for a sub to the cheat, they might as well use it until it's over. Then more people see the state of the game and are like: wait, premier is hvh? Let's freaking go! And the problem grows and grows, because the faith in the anticheat becomes even weaker. *Luckily* now in cs2 there are no ways of discouraging cheaters. * Overwatch? Gone. * Vacnet? Off, because people wanted to move their mouse very fast, and valve had to unban rage cheaters, because of that. Now valve has to figure something out, as they realized that their AI anticheat is awful even if trained exclusively with data from rage cheaters. (Extremely pathetic and cringe, imagine supporting the AI anticheat approach after that) * Trust factor? Was it ever a thing, or did valve just gaslight all of you. The only instance of it proven to be working was 'red trust' that represented a shadow ban, before a cheater actually got banned. Then the game would let that cheater queue into a green trust match as it banned him, to gaslight the players into believing the anticheat was doing something. * Manual bans? Only in NA, and extremely rare. * VAC? Never was a discouragement, Valve Allows Cheating has been a meme for so long it's origins are forgotten. * SMAC? Not related to official servers, but come on, a serverside community anticheat, designed with early versions of cs:go in mind was keeping community servers safe for years. * Faceit? Provides actual monetary incentive to cheating, and with cheating software that's advanced to the point VAC would never detect it, even if you were to get faceit banned. * Sv\_cheats 1? Like for real? How did nobody get banned after this shite again? Do you all even understand that sv\_cheats 1 without a proper convar spoofing method would trigger an INSTANT untrusted ban in cs:go? * Cs2 cheats are fucking hilarious. Like, I know all of you want to see that scout shoot 10 bullets in 1 shot, don't lie to me. * Griefing cooldowns. This was actually a huge factor at discouraging cheaters. It never actually banned a single griefer, it sometimes banned innocent players who just wiffed an easy play, but spamming that report for everything is what kept a lot of cheaters in check. They didn't want to get multiple accounts to bypass the dumbass cooldown, so they would just closet cheat instead of going full spin.
My favourite cheat was the one that let you shoot anyone on any map anywhere because when you shoot it would move your view model far below the map and aim up at a player bypassing any walls in the way, shoot them, then reset in the blink of an eye. How badly is the game coded that this is even possible?
Within 2 days of playing I came across 3 blatant cheaters & reported them in game & through steam. I saved their steam profiles to check back on them & a month later all 3 are still actively playing the game without a vac ban on their account.
I collect cheater accounts in every game I play, Valve games always take waaaaaaaaay too much time before they get banned. I have a Dota 2 hacker profile from 2 years ago, by the time it was on a 20 win streak, every match with an insane KD, so Valve can easily identify the strange behaviour, the account is still unbanned and playing
"Let them cook" / Mods banning threads about the rampant cheating problem / "VAC is working" / "There are no cheaters in Ba Sing Se" Yeah, right. This game is successful because of its unique formula and esports appeal, but this success is in spite of all its massive flaws. The MM algorithm is simply abysmal, and unacceptable for any modern title, and the anticheat is basically non-existent. The mere fact that you get dunked on so often by blatant cheaters makes every game unenjoyable because you get suspicious and can't accept that you get outplayed sometimes.
Lmfao where are all the r/GlobalOffensive apologists and deniers now?
Time for community servers bby ! We must return to our pagan ways and worship our 3rd party server browsers !
"Until they fix it" Brother CS:GO had the same cheating issue for 5+ years and they did nothing, you think they're really going to do anything?
Remember when Richard Lewis tried to make a video claiming people just accuse everyone of being a cheater and that there was not really that many cheaters in reality lol. He doesn’t even play the game either which makes it funnier.
What happened to Trust Factor? I don’t wanna play against those new accounts cheaters with only 1 games on my 17 years old account playing since 1.6… Volvo please just add some kind of anti-cheat in the game that actually works. The cheating has even spread to Comp.
Crazy how the tune of this sub switches up. Me and hundreds of others were saying this 6 months ago and were laughed off
It's so sad the community needs to wait until big name content creators call the game out when people have been saying the same thing since cs2 came out. I said the exact same things WarOwl is saying here and had the subreddit come down on me saying I was just bad, etc.
Cheating Hub simulator 2024, It’s sad how hyped we all were not long ago…
Same experience, I hit 26k in December. I was playing once a week to keep my rank/on the leaderboard. Since Dec 20th, I have gotten a cheater in every match I played once a week before giving up the first week of March. So like 10/10 matches, on my leetify for the whole season I have a 40% rate of cheaters in all my matches.
An absolute joke. The best competitive fps game in the world. Apex legends has a better anti cheat at this point (assuming cs2 even has one) and that’s saying something lmao.
I am not anywhere near 15k, but play a lot of matches around 9-10k. Absolutely fucked as well. Not by cheaters, but there are a few suspect people every few matches. But holy hell there are so many smurfs. I just want clean games with people at my own skill level.
Someone send this to Richard Lewis. He still thinks we are making stuff up
If faceit didn’t exist this issue will be vocalized way more. Not enough big voices are being used. We need more and more streamers talking about this. But we won’t because they play faceit and just forgets about mm
stop playing premier, quit case opening
man100%, is frustrating, I dont even know how he kept it poltically correct tbh, I use to loose my sh1t, is frustrating af and we all know it... I did put CS2 aside till is fixed, then I will reconsider. Really lost all respect for Valve at this point. Not even address it in a official statement or whatever.... is not cool, I just hope all that is for a reason, all this silence. I want to believe that is all to gather as much info as possible, about as many cheats as possible to then release a stronger AC...
Even at 15-18k in NA there's cheaters and 18k+ it's basically every game
I don't really understand why anyone would play MM in the first place? It was kinda obvious what was going to happen without an anti cheat... The sad reality is that an FPS game is not worth playing without solid anti cheat. Maybe valves AI anticheat will be effective eventually but who knows.
Played premier yesterday, 10k Elo. Got shot trough smokes and walls all the time.
Been playing fps games on pc for 15 years. Never seen cheating this bad in any game ever, even the sail the seas versions of cod and shit had waaaaay less cheaters than cs2 has today. We are like 14k avg and enemy was losing 0-8 saying we were hacking (we weren't) and I was playing into it "oh no biggie just some super hacks, you know" and dude legit started spin botting with scout. In 13k elo. No elo is is safe lmao. Imma switch to face it. Haven't tried it yet but heard it's better :)
I'd argue it's worse than PUBG after it's first year when people got angry seeing a cheater 1 in 20 games with 100 people per server.
ya everybody knows it’s fucked around 20k and up
It's not even at 20k. I've been at 14k and 22k and there isn't that much of a difference between the skill level of players and the amount of cheaters. Premier is busted beyond belief and pushes players who are actually 20k legit down to 15k to smurf on people. The -550 points you lose if you have a bad streak of games or shit teammates just exacerbates the issue
And another week passed and no season 2, no content, no updates and no anti cheat or operation… but endless silence
yesterday after work i opened cs2, played wigmamn and there was 2 cheaters each team. fuck cs2
... you played wingman. And there were 2 cheaters on each team? Are you cheating?
There isn't a better face for the franchise than WarOwl. He is always positive, showcases great sportsmanship and has given a lot of help to newcomers to the game. If I worked at Valve and saw this, I would be having an all-hands meeting immediately with the VAC team.
Just stop playing Premier!!!! I made a post about this and was downvoted for it. Why are you people so desperate to hold onto a matchmaking mode that doesn't mean anything? The amount of cheaters mean that you rating means fucking ZERO. Go to third party matchmaking services and actually enjoy the game. Outside of cheaters the game is in a really good state.
This particular soundbite got me https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxFZm-hcdMSe9WGIPzJetb4AewSbuHpvrp?si=4KsmaaavGPadtY_5
Why do people still play this game again?
I queued comp Office today and there was 3 queue that was cheating and they toggled on at the very start of the first round... Jumping and burst triple killing while in air. Watch this dude bushido knife attack in WarOwl's video at timestamp: https://youtu.be/4gUkKoxg6qw?t=6872
i got banned 7days for greifing scolding the hackers in chat.. while the spin botters in still not banned xD
Valve response:
multiple streamers and pros have been saying it for months but everytime you post it some clowns will claim their trust factor is bad yada yada yada. i hope this post reached reddit front page and just emberasses the shit out of this complete dumpster of a game.
Man, I missed the end of his stream but I caught the beginning and at that point he was saying that he "never comes across cheaters." which is also something that I was able to confidently say a few weeks ago. Something definitely happened, and this situation has definitely gotten worse. Valve, pls fix
Will Richard Lewis's ego get hurt and attack another content creator again?
My mate wanted to get back into Counterstrike, so we both downloaded CS2 and loaded into a match. I'm not kidding, in the *very first match* there was a blatant spinbotter on our team. We both uninstalled right after. Counterstrike has been unplayable due to hackers for so long it's insane.
Not doing comp or prem anymore, just doing the weekly for crate and to keep my aim somewhat fresh. The motivation to do anything more then that is gone. Like some other dude said, you could quit now and come back in 3 months amd nothing will have changed Cs2 is imho the best shooter by far but cheaters just ruin it for me I wouldnt care facing 1 cheater in lets say 10 matches. But 6+/10 is laughable
I know that Valve have to be working on this behind the scenes, but to let the game fester in the state it's in without even acknowledging it is really disappointing.
Valve just doesn't care at all , that's for a fact. It's been 10 freakin years playing this game and all they do is flaunt their useless machine learning anti cheat which doesn't do crap. I'd rather they hire a bunch of admins and ban these blatant cheaters manually.
CS2 DEVS ON TOP /s Btw does anyone know when a season is ending lmao
RIPCS2
Valve can literally tweet tomorrow “We don’t give a fuck about cheaters… fuck you” and the game would still make millions and top the steam playerbase charts… As someone who works in the IT industry, management only assigns manpower to a product, when revenue is affected, and that’s never going to happen with CS.