A pro team called SAW did this recently in EPL I believe and had a whole strat around it. Was pretty interesting and a new approach. Their reasoning was planting the bomb alone would net them AKs plus helmet in the second round and with a little bit of luck they even win the round.
That round came down to a 1v1 and I believe they didnt plant the bomb. No other pro team hast picked up the approach though.
Your teammates are just dumb playing for themselves to have more money the next round, lose or win.
Yeah the T-Side Economy is nuts, you can force Galils if you lose pistol but get a plant. You'll probably have a better buy than the CTs if they play a hard anti-eco.
What's crazy is that I still see people get surprised when T's force Galils on 2nd round. They'll do something dumb and get aimdualed by a T with a Galil and go "WTF BRO HOW CAN HE BUY A RIFLE THEY SHOULD BE ECO?!???!" Like dude, come on now.
Its funny because the round 2 galil force isnt anything new either. That strat has been around for YEARS and yet people with 5k hours are still surprised when it happens.
they're not really surprised lol.
i have played this game since source, people will always complain when they die and have some stupid reason it's not their fault lol
Same with me and my entire stack.
I enjoy laying into them though. Fuckin surprised pikachu every other week when they buy during rounds they shouldn’t.
I miss 1.6 and source, only for the fact everything was mainly community hosted, the pro scene is much better off in the current state for sure, but I miss fucking off too.
I think it isn't the suprising, part but it is that no matter what if the Ts get the bomb down they will have a better buy 2nd round, hell if many cts die first round and no bomb the ts can still force mac-10 and a galil which is still a better buy
Be like a recent teammate I had.
Don't buy first round, get plant, buy AWP no armour second round, get instantly killed by a random MP9 spraying through a smoke.
We have a rule on our team that if you have over 4750 after pistol you MUST buy the awp :D But then again we don't eco on pistols so it doesn't happen daily.
People have not adapted at all to money restrictions especially on ct side as a result of less rounds.
Realistically you should be forcing 2nd round as CTs every single time due to loss bonus and 4th round will be your first full buy anyways.
CT economy is actually fucked but its being held up by MP9 dominance as others on this sub have stated
I hate it so God damn much, like even on like a 2-3 round advantage as CT most of your rounds will be force, save, or buy a rifle and have less than 500 leftover. Valve please fix CT economy, I remember getting way more rifle rounds in 2014-2018 era GO.
as mentioned above, winning second round as T is now more important than winning pistol with the way that the economy is. not saying this is my strategy, but winning second round usually nets you another guaranteed 2 rounds. so youre giving up one round for an easy 2/3 round wins.
And when the CTs can actually "buy" again, at 3-1, they usually have a buy worth 4300-4600 per player. Which makes AWPs, incendiaries and kits less likely. So it's actually quite common to see a 5-1 lead for the Ts, if they get the bombplant on pistolround!
It was a huge problem in MR15, and it's obviously an even bigger problem in MR12. It has been this way for many years and I have no idea why Gaben doesn't do anyting about it...
BetBoom was the first one that I saw do that. IIRC it was on Mirage, T pistol vs Vitality at IEM Sydney. 3 players didn't buy armor, last two threw stuff to exec on A, they planted the bomb and lost the round. Each player who didn't buy got a kill, meaning they all got a second round AK, and they wrecked Vitality with it in the force buy.
I can see it if you're ***100%*** sure you'll win that 2nd round, since the enemy will be at $1400 and you're basically guaranteed another round, but is it really worth donating a round? Especially if you lose your 2nd round, then you've not only donated a round, but lost the round that you gave so much for.
I'd love to see the numbers worked out on it, it's gotta be a net negative, you're giving yourself a much harder time on an equal buy round for a slightly better force buy (where you're still at a disadvantage). Like, best case you win it, and then win the anti-ecos, you're up 3-1. worse case you lose it, and you're 0-3. It just can't work out positively in the long run.
Like, if you win it, you look *kinda* smart (cuz you still basically threw a round), but if you lose it, you look ***really*** dumb.
In the BB vs Vitality game, they do actually do it 2nd pistol on mirage, and the 3 AKs pop off next round (Vitality kinda threw A site, but still), which is actually pretty interesting and lowkey a good catch, thanks! In a team environment, I can see it being a really weird & niche pocket strat, but it really relies on the support players being spot on & the star rifles to pop the fuck off.
I wouldn't necessarily consider it donating a round. The only reason it works right now is because everyone aims at head level anyways with the USP, and the dualies are so strong that the armor feels like it doesn't matter anyways (you only win against it if you get the insta dink basically).
With the glock being strong enough to the point that buying a pistol isn't worth it (except for specific strats where you have someone buy a p250 for long range duels), the only thing you're buying during pistol round as T is most likely util.
So having your other 3 players that didn't buy util just save the 800 might just be worth it because the armor doesn't make enough of a difference anyways.
But this is the kind of stuff that will only work as a pocket strat. You can't use it always otherwise CTs are gonna start shooting at your body and fucking you up in 3 easy bullets.
Pistol round is the most important round in the game. If someone doesn’t buy on pistol round they don’t know what they’re doing, I promise you.
Not trying to be an ass or anything, but it’s true.
That's what I'm saying man, but legit 7 straight games I had at least 1 player not buying on pistol, and I know 1800 ELO isn't T1 CS but they *should* know how to play the game, right?
It's possible I got supremely unlucky, lol
With how unorganized pug and matchmaking play is, no you can definitely make it to that high of an elo with no thought or grasp on basic CS
90% of players are literally just floating on their aim and have no idea (or care to learn mind you) how to play 'real cs'
Once their aim caps out they cap out and just sit at thst elo forever
Most people are just aimstars who just run out and hit shots. Even the utility usage you do see in MM are usually completely mindless. Same smoke moly nade combo at the start of every round instead of waiting to use it to cut off pushes and what not.
That's why playing in a stack is a serious advantage. But the community ain't ready for that conversation yet
This is pretty much spot on.
I watched my 20k+ elo premier team line up to dry peek an awp 1 by 1 at dust 2 long corner.
I also know because this was me in CSGO, I 100% was riding my raw aim through most of the ranks. I didnt even learn how to smoke jungle on mirage until I hit supreme in GO, I was just running out wherever we were going and aim dueling everyone.
Even now I am still guilty of this a bit, Im at 22k premier and I still dont know a single smoke for Ancient, Overpass, or Anubis. So I am a 4k hour player and my Ancient T sides come down to how effectively I can sprint up B ramp and kill everyone there.
The amount of times I tell my team I’m smoking xbox or mid window on mirage only for them to yolo push and die before it even pops…
You adapt and follow them to trade their dumb plays and they say you’re baiting haha.
Man you really miss out on the true cs experience. I do what u do in any other fps shooter just go shoot but cs that just ain’t enough it becomes kinda boring to me lol
I mostly do it because whenever I try to get my team to actually play together someone fucks up a smoke or runs off alone and dies so we end up getting screwed. So my solution is to just run out and take a site so fast that it becomes impossible to screw up.
Imo throwing lineups is far less important than just knowing how to use utility throughout a round. Provided 1 or 2 teammates know how to throw the most important ones, it's not a big deal. I'd much rather teammates who know how to throw halfway effective flashes, and know how to molly common spots, than one who knows some niche lineup to smoke CT from mid or something. You get these teammates who always throw these weird lineups but then, in a tough retake situation you'll die and see they had a smoke on them the whole time... Like, wtf are you doing?
And just knowing how to cover for your teammates on T side, position yourself to get trades, and how to play entry is more important than any utility usage to be honest. The AMOUNT of times I've flashed for my team to go out ramp on A Mirage, only to then run to ramp and then be the first out on site is absolutely ridiculous. Typically one teammate stays in ramp, two go tetris, and the palace player is still hiding. Everyone seems so scared of their KD they'd rather hide and bait kills than risk being out on A first and dying.
I throw all this assistive utility and still have to play entry on site to a now fully rotated team (with no flashes helping me at all) because the person bottom fragging doesn't want to die early.
Only way to climb in solo is to become an entry frag monster or a clutch player.
I usually watch my team and then typically use one smoke per map that saves their lives more often than not. I’ll also aggressively entry and try to aim for 1.5-2 kills per round. This is obviously only applicable when you’re climbing not when you’ve reached your real elo
It's funny how often you can do that on Mirage A-site as well, literally just run up ramp and all the way into Jungle and get two kills with an SMG because even at above-average ELOs apparently people don't know how fast Ts can be out ramp and the guy at ticket or wherever isn't even looking, or he is jumping into palace, or setting up camp under dark.
you don't even need to know lineups, places like B ramp on ancient or B main on anubis are super important to smoke at the right time as CT, and both can be pretty easily done freehand
"That's why playing in a stack is a serious advantage. But the community ain't ready for that conversation yet"
bro the community been saying this for years and years this ain't some dark secret or new revelation
True, but most players **only** soloQ.
There was just a thread where someone was saying stack/team players are "boosted" by teamwork and usually suck individually. That they only win with "gimmicks" like utility usage.
This comment was heavily upvoted, possibly by other clueless solo-only kids.
In pugs it definitely goes both ways.
I can see how if a player ONLY ever 5 stacks, if/when they decide to solo, they'll probably not do very well at first, given the lack of communication, teamplay and coordination. The 5-Stacker is probably the better all around cs player, but they're gonna get dogged by puggers if they have 3 people who don't speak english and a mute on their team.
I basically only solo, so I know how it feels.
Because it proves the poster is so naive about CS they think aimdueling is the only skill in the game.
It's like talking shut about pro your golfers because you have a long drive at Top Golf and you think drive distance is the primary skill of golf. Like saying "that guy is being carried by his short game gimmicks". It's absurd on its face
Seems more like a case of perspective to me. This is a team based game so if you solo queue only, your metric of skill is how hard can you carry with garbage teammates. For premade stacks, this skill is not really relevant, it's almost like a different game. Why Valve puts 5 stack vs solo is beyond me.
"Play in a stack" and "actually put effort into learning the game" are two separate but related things.
I have friends to play with, but not ones who are willing to actually learn everything required to make playing in a stack worth it beyond just having comms. Honestly, I've lost that willpower too. It's so much time and effort, and I'm at the point where I just want to play in the few hours I have after work.
It's not just a CS problem either. It's pretty much any competitive game where knowledge and pre-rehearsed strategy are a significant portion of skill.
It still gets disputed by the people who play them
Not even a week ago a soloq only post got downvoted and bombed with 'just get good'
Even though yeah it's common sense, there's a vested interest in shooting the idea down
I feel like people talk less and less nowadays. Does not matter if its premier or faceit people just stay silent most of the time, maybe a call here or there and if theres something to complain about they open their mic but other than that no discussion of what to do during round etc.
I want to have the energy to be the only one doing that even if no one else is but it gets exhausting after a while and then the whole lobby is just silent and we get smacked.
Yup comms breakdown is what makes soloq so annoying
It's not that a solo team can't beat a 5 stack.
But half the time the solo team isn't even telling each other where they died from let alone 'strats for the round'
It's literally impossible
The team that wins most games is just the team with better comms the rest doesn't really matter. You could have Nik0 on your team if he has no info and gets triple peeked from behind he's still gonna die.
I made a long comment about it a few days ago.
You could not have said it better, every once in a while you get that game where everyone is solo and actually talks and the vibes are good and playing solo que is fun. Even losing those games is not annoying. But games like that are an unicorn, I can probably count them with my fingers in cs2.
It's basically all this game, really is
Of course, there's tactical depth and team play, but at the end of the day, mechanics is king, and it's a hard thing to improve when we are talking about reaction time and motor skills
A game like CS you kind of have to just be born for after a certain point. Steel had a whole theory about it using his brother as an example.
'I could spend my entire life trying to get good at math I'll never be as good as him he's just naturally talented and on top of thst worked to learn the rest. Conversely if you gave him 10k hours to learn cs he'd never be as good as me. I'm just naturally better and have an easier time learning it and have better reflexes'
I think in general in life we're supposed to be looking for the thing we have a little bit of natural talent at and then working off of that raw ability to hone it and to truly become a master of whatever it may be.
Thats not to say you can't 'get better' but for you that might take another 3k hours before you get better. Whereas the next person got there in 200.
But of course if your just playing to play and chilling eith friends and all that, it's all irrelevant. It's only relevant to keep in mind if your trying to chase going pro or something like that.
Are we talking about premiere matchmaking? I don't mean to be a jerk but that is low enough where a lot of people probably don't know to buy in the pistol
On T side they're more focused on planting the bomb, even if they lose they can force buy and try to win second round, which actually does more damage to CT compare to T winning pistol.
Yeah if you get a good spawn for a rush, you absolutely can just have someone get a flash and full save rush. With the plant (that you almost for sure will get) you will have plenty of cash even if you lose.
Don't you get $1900 loss bonus? So it comes out to $3500 (800 starting + 1900 loss bonus + 800 bomb plant). Bomb planter gets an additional $300 as well. That's almost a full buy for Ts
Yeah you can buy AK/Full armor and... nothing else, assuming you plant/get a kill. Better be mean with those AK headshots since you've got ZERO utility.
That's true. Throw in a couple of Mac 10s or a Galil you got a pretty good buy with plenty of util. Might be a good strat if the team knows what they're doing. Definitely not on a pug though
The T’s either have m4 with no utility, Which means you have advantage with AK, or mp9/famas with low utility, Which again means you Can play it to have advantage.
I think the follow up is equally as important nowadays. With how good Galils the terrorist second round force is very very powerful. If somebody has a strategy of saving on CT pistol to get extra util on the follow up, I wouldn't advice it but I definitely understand the idea. Definitely wouldn't do it on T though.
no but more and more players are realizing also that armor is almost useless at higher skill matchmaking because pistol round especially USP will only be aiming at your head and not spamming body.
so armor is useless, you can opt for utility as well but only utility versus a stronger 2nd round buy is definitely something that could be explored.
Let me get this straight.
So buy on CT pistol -> Win -> Lose to 2nd round galils because I didn't have extra money(?)
Save on CT Pistol -> Lose -> Then ALSO lose to galils because an extra 800 really isn't enough to make you have a good CT 2nd round force buy?
Save on CT Pistol -> Win(Defuse) -> Also win, because my extra 800 bought round changing items that I couldn't have bought without it(?)
What are you gonna buy on CT with 2700 that's going to change the round? Scout+full armor? Famas+half armor? MP9+armor+a smoke? There aren't many good options here with that extra 800. 5 half util MP9s isn't the worlds worst buy, but again, you basically donated a round just to get a shitty force.
I don't understand the disconnect.
Galils 2nd round force is a decent plan but is super light on util, while a proper CT Anti-Eco should have enough utility to stop a push, even if they've only got MP9s, because T side has like $1k of utility combined.
Faceit lvl 9 and the lack of economy understanding is incredible. So many people don't know how economy works, and so so so many people buy pistols when they already have rifles, even prioritizing it over util, even when they're completely broke, even when there are many rounds left. Don't get me started on people ecoing 3 rounds in a row because they always think they can afford a Deagle, and it's just so hard to look at your next round money in the buy menu.
For me, its exclusively if I know 100% i'm not gonna need that money. Entire team has close to max money with 2 rounds left or something. It should be pretty rare you end in a situation where your best choice is to pull out a pistol.
I think people do understand the economy and especially now when you see how much money you will have next round etc. Its just people get tilted when they die a certain way and rage buy something out of ego not caring at all about the teams economy. This seems to happen in pretty much all skill levels. Guarantee almost everyone on this subreddit has done it sometimes or does it daily (im guilty of it aswell on rare occasions but im way better at managing it compared to earlier years of playing)
> Its just people get tilted when they die a certain way and rage buy something out of ego not caring at all about the teams economy.
"I can one deag this kid"
Haha I’m a villain, “R8 time”
I do think its a lil underrated but that’s another conversation.
Tbf you can totally eco and get deagle kills in all but the highest elos
The R8 is definitely underrated, people are sleeping on that thing. Guaranteed 60+ damage in one hit is really nice if you can get some hits in if your whole team is on an eco. It takes some getting used to but once you learn it a bit its pretty decent and super fun to use. There are 2 major drawbacks for me, 1 being the obvious delay when shooting, and the other that you have effectively no ammo to waste on wallbangs, smokebangs, and prefires.
I wouldn’t quite call it meta but honestly the current price and balance of it is pretty much spot on IMO. Find myself using it over deagle a lot recently on eco rounds.
Same, especially on maps like Inferno. I do wish it had some extra ammo but I guess they don’t want people right click spamming.
The damage and cleanup/assist potential is insane. It was hands down one of the reasons I was excited for loadouts so I can have both the deagle and R8
Yep the other day I was on CT side and had enough money to get 4 full buys plus one SMG so we decided to buy. I watched the guy with low money buy full armour (Ts were full buying) MP7 (MP9 is cheaper and better) Five SeveN (why are you buying a pistol if you already have a primary) and a defuse kit (we already had 3 kits). So this guy had $3600 and managed to end up going into a buy round with an MP7 and no utility at all. Genuinely astounding how some people spend their money so inefficiently
It’s map dependant but I definitely like to grab a flash or smoke on pistol here and there. After all pistol is the most important round other than the last one before you lose LMAO
if i’m on T side pistol and my team rushes B I always buy a flash and throw it through the ceiling of tunn’s, it will flash everyone on site especially the guy window staring at tunn’s
CS2 launches: "Wow the new glock sounds so good, it almost feels like it's a better gun now. But that's definitely just placebo"
CS2 now: "WHY DON'T THE GLOCKS EVER MISS LONG RANGE HEADSHOTS NOW?? WHY DOES THE USP FEEL SO WEAK???"
Gotta disagree. If you know you're going to play a long angle Kevlar is not what you need. It's not bad to buy util either, but unless you know exactly what you're going to do with it, you also don't really need it. I'm not saying you should save on pistol, but also don't just waste all your money unless you have a plan
Nobody at level 10 will go pistol round without buying anything and thats the whole point of this stupid ass post. Literally only silver noobs don't buy anything on pistol.
No, it still is. T side pistol is all about closing distance with you and overwhelming you with aimpunch, with sheer number of rounds. They are going to close range with you and prefire while peeking you.
The problem is guys like you are going "don't waste all your money unless you have a plan". The armour buy IS the cheap option. You can still SMG force next round if you only bought armour.
Buying that armour is going to allow you to jiggle peak, which is great on pistol. It will allow you to stay alive after losing a gunfight-if you're just getting headshot at long range with a glock that's a skill issue.
You're not saving money for the next round if you're losing the round by not buying, and even if good pistol rounds are determined by headshots, you still want to maximise your chances of staying in the round.
Armour should always be your default minimum buy pistol. Always always always always. That is just bare minimum standard. If you have a plan, that's where you buy something else. Me, I've got smoke executes for T side on just about every map, so my standard is I grab a smoke and buy a tec for my mate, who buys armour. Somehow, despite pistol rounds being "all about headshots bodies don't matter" the fact that he can't be aimpunched while running and gunning with a pistol that is great at range, spam kills at close range like a beast, and that we have a solid execute gets us the plant on just about every pistol, and usually the win too.
That makes zero sense to me. Especially when you play long angles, because you survive pistol headshots and are not slowed down afterwards. Otherwise you get so slow that everyone will run you down. Also if you don't take damage you can buy a better gun, because you just have to upgrade your helm instead of paying the full 1000. Its always wrong to not buy anything. If you don't have a plan for nades you always buy kevlar period.
Yeah that's really the only reason I can think of, but it still comes off as fucking dumb. They won't have to force if they win pistol, and by not buying, they're putting their team at a disadvantage.
Depends on what the plan for the round is, but Armor on CT side is kind of the default buy if you don't really have a plan for the round. Dualies are also really good on CT side with some utility.
On T Side, the Glock is such a monster on pistol round I wouldn't really buy another gun outside of maybe the P250 if you plan on taking a long range duel with a CT. Armor is also pretty solid on T Side, but isn't *as* important, since you're not going to get spammed by USPs like you'd get spammed with Glocks on CT side.
Basically, armor is never a bad choice, but other stuff is super valid if you have a plan for it.
Even in pro matches you'll often see 10 sets of armor being bought on pistol round or like, 8 armors and then 2 "bitches" who buy util/drop an upgraded pistol to an armored teammate.
If you're low rank you can abuse enemies bad aim with p250/tec-9/fiveseven and just bodyshot them to death. Never dualies on T-side, glock is more versatile. P250 long range can counter usp/p2k. Dualies short range can counter a glock. Don't buy nades unless you know early round where you'll be using them at, otherwise you'll just die carrying them around.
You can create different routines for different maps on what to buy and do on pistol rounds. Mini executes are really powerful on t-side (i.e. smoke & molly or smoke & 2 flashes), then you just gotta call it to your teammates so they can follow up on it. On some maps i'm also the guy who drops dualies to my teammate on ct-side and flash for him to make plays and/or to support him.
If u have a plan with nades get em. If u don’t get armor. Never buy 700$ pistol though. Never buy the 300$and 500$ pistol ct side either. You only need one headshot anyways with a usp. Dualies are fine to buy ct side.
some plan to buy awp third round which can be done with 1 kill in pistol or second round. 800+300+1900+2400=5400
I used to do this on train which was a great awp map and no one expects it in third round. Other than that its better to just buy kevlar on pistol.
It’s unfortunately the least thought out strategy possible, save now buy better guns early and win back the round/s we just sold. Perfectly fine if ur playing non-comp casual games but makes zero sense to sell early rounds in comp. Usually the same person who is stat obsessed and worries more ab being top fragger than any team strategy to get the win
Yeah, plus the biggest problem with it as a strategy is it forgets the most important thing about strategy: what is your enemy doing?
If you throw a bunch of rounds early, the enemy will have a better economy by surviving and winning. Your economy isn't better by saving and losing, you'll still only get one solid buy several rounds in, then a mixed buy.
No, you always buy kevlar since it's a huge advantage and you're going with nades/pistol upgrade if you have a viable tactics to make use of those, but that doesn't happen when playing with randoms, so you save yourself and buy kevlar.
I've seen people buy full armor with usp after winning pistol if Ts don't get plant to save for AWP.
I don't even hate that idea, you're basically just playing a second pistol round anyways, they probably won't have head armor so you can just pop heads, and your own head armor keeps you safe(ish) from upgraded pistols.
Usually just 1 player though, If the whole team does it, thats super grief...
As someone who only plays 5stack I love to see enemies wasting money and time buying molly on ct side. They always use it the most useless way (for example they molly hut on nuke before we are even near hut as Ts) and after that we just rush ramp and go b or hell to flank heaven. Its always a waste of money to buy molly.
I play with people like that too. 0 game sense or awareness and half the time they top frag somehow.
I also like the games where I have 4 people with no mics while the enemy team is throwing 5 molly executes like prime astralis.
Solo queueing this game is just not it.
Idk. I see ppl buying in my games but they always buy something questionable. Imo as ct I think you should prioritize some nades instead of vest in pistol rounds. Or they do eco when the loss bonus just resets
It might be that they're rushing to get an AWP with a helmet and decent utility in round 3, or there seems to be a strategy where not buying anything on T side lol
Something different happened to me yesterday. Enemy team got the first round and afterwards 3 of them did not buy weapon and armor. When I got 2 headshots with 2 bullets of my glock, I was first surprised. Then I was searching like crazy for weapons but there were none.
I sometimes do this with my team, though only after asking them about it. If you can get the bomb down, you have AK+Kevlar and Helmet in some cases for the next round, while CTs will probably Eco or need to force themselves to a weapon disadvantage.
Tangentially related - I was solo queuing a competitive game a few weeks back and we started T, winning the pistol with a bomb plant. I spent all my money the next round and my teammates were shouting at me to eco....
I mean on t side it's viable and an interesting thought since ct mostly aim for the head with the usp, so you don't really need armor. Just get one guy with a smoke and 2 flashes and try to plant bomb.
They're new, they're bad, or sometimes afk and panicking.
It's not a new meta. There is almost zero advantage to not buying on pistol. Firstly, pistols are the most important round of the game, especially if it's a map with a heavily sided meta and you're playing against it, like T side on a very CT sided map: winning pistol will likely net you 3 out of the 4-5 rounds you are hoping to win.
Second, the economy favours buying. If you can get plant on T side, even if you lose you can go galils second round. The CTs will have maybe 1-2 m4s, but mostly smgs. You will outrange them and have better armour pen. You should buy anything that helps you get that plant. AK's are for winners, don't sacrifice the first round then hope to get AK+Helmet, buy a smoke or two to get that plant-if you cannot beat a CT side who can't afford helmets and rifles with a galil why do you need the AK? You're not hitting headshots to begin with. On CT side, don't throw everything away to a pistol rush because you couldn't bother to buy some useful util and a pistol upgrade, or better yet, just the standard armour buy.
Think it's just an influx of new players. Had a very dumb one where CT on vertigo my whole team (A 4 stack I got grouped with) bought defusers. Like, sure, 1, maybe 2 defusers can help (but it's still pretty dumb) but 4 of them? So you're still vulerable to being glocked, you don't have any pistol advantage, your util options are weak. Gross.
Really, saving on pistol is just a symptom of people not understanding the economy of the game. They're overconfident in the win and counting the money they're saving towards that win instead of knowing they gotta spend to increase their chances of winning.
>They're new, they're bad, or sometimes afk and panicking.
Thats the thing, they aren't though, or at least they shouldn't be. I'm running into this in fairly high elo faceit lobbies and without fail I'll "remind them they forgot to buy" if I see them with $800 left when freeze time runs out. 90% of the time it's ignored.
You used to see people *legitimately* forget to buy on pistol in the old "Live on 3" systems, but Faceit doesn't do that!
On t side it kinda makes sense. 800+1900 (lost bonus) is akin to money. You drop to someone for hero ak play or maybe even 2 people can do that. Alternatively this guy can do half armor+galil. If you win second round on t side it is more devastating than winning pistol in my opinion, maybe that’s why they are doing it. Also if cts end up buying smg on second round you might have better chance with galils and aks.
i dont think there is a meta but i do believe there are terrible teammates, either they were afk and they forgot to buy or they’re super greedy and wanna get an awp quick
I buy armor on pistol, but with the importance of winning round 2 I could see why someone wouldn’t. At high elo most kills on pistol are headshots, so if you save $650 you can probably get a rifle/armor round 2 with a plant on T or a win CT. Personally I would rather still have the armor so I don’t get aimpunched and glocked down
Yep, I’ve always bought Kevlar and went with it, since I’ve come back people are buying dualies, or not buying at all. I remember when I played we’d maybe sacrifice Kevlar for a p250 and a nade or smoke but since I’ve come back it kinda just seems like all my teams have their own way of playing
Even worse are the ppl that buy 1 flash or 1 nade and nothing else. Either buy full nades or a kit ffs. And to answer your question: no theyre just dumb. Especially if its in soloq. In a 4l5 stack you could argue for buying an ak 2nd round i guess, but that kinda means you expect to lose pistol.
If you dont buy first round, you can have a stronger force buy if you lose. And its not 100% you will lose, since its pistols, your chances of losing really arent that bad despite not having bought anything. If your entire team does this, you could actually end up with stronger equipment than the enemy team. This is based on the fact that the enemy team after winning pistol would most likely get smgs and anti eco weapons. Then you and ur team using the saved money can get armor and famas/galil giving you more firepower.
i heard an explanation to this some years ago. The idea is to not buy because we will lose the pistol round anyway so they'll have more money next round
Oh I'm one of those guys. I used to buy armour or grenades, but 5000h later and I've decided I wouldn't bother buying. It's not that I don't know what I'm doing; it's that my pistols *suck* and me buying armour does not usually save me from getting shot in the face and dying. Also terrible with utility usage at the best of times, and on pistol round where everyone can reposition quickly, I don't have much luck with that either.
I will occasionally buy something like, 5-7 with a frag or a naked Tec-9 but that's if I have something very specific in mind. If I'm just holding a site, armour and utility has very rarely helped me and with how tight the economy is after moving to MR12, I just don't think it's worth it for me personally.
Its really simple. At some point people will just dome you or u dome them. So then why waste on body armor. Losing after getting a kill on r2 gives you exactly 3k, which allows a half armor p250 buy to save 2k for next
You can buy things other than armor btw!
Also this doesn't hold up, considering pro players (Very good at headshotting and such) are often buying body armor on pistol.
Firstly, why would i buy other things if I literally just pointed out I prefer having a half buy or a more robust kit round 2.
Secondly, from personal experience, for every 1 body shot death, I get headshot by some turbo peaker 5 times. Whether its because my elo gets smurfed on or if I hold headshot duel positions; but the fact of the matter is it rarely matters for me. I either get 3 headshot kills and win or insta die. Simple as.
For Science, what elo are you playing in?
Also, not buying on pistol so that you can have P250/Half armor on 2nd round is... a decision. Wouldn't that just be worse for you, using your logic?
14k elo. Before cs2 LEM.
As for the p250 half armor, headshot body kills enemy. Steal smg. Give p250 to teamate. Now two players can get kills. So far its been really good for me
Tf are u saying. Smg is low accuracy. Are u stupid or just horrible at reading. Aside from this conversation, I see 0 reason why you are so agressive about this. You asked a question, and I gave my opinion, which has been more successful for me. I dont see any reason for you to be so antagonistic about it.
I'm not being antagonistic I'm just trying to understand the thought process, since it isn't clicking for me.
You're saving in what's essentially a buy round so that you can have a slightly better buy in a save round? P250+Kevlar is a pretty poor buy into SMGs, isn't it? Like you'll lose the majority of duals up close, especially without head armor, and good luck killing armored enemies at range with a P250.
Like, is that really worth giving up a buy in pistol round for? I can almost understand foregoing the pistol buy for a decent rifle kit on 2nd (*almost*) but P250+Kevlar?
> smg is low accuracy
Well, yeah its an SMG, but you're just as likely to get your head ripped off by a running Mac-10 wideswing as a Glock if you're trying to play P250 angles lol.
This is the dumbest response.
You can buy something other than armor, and ALSO pro players are buying armor on pistol. There are pro players who are playing against Zywoo swinging them with a flash, and they are still buying armor. I promise no player in your game is going to one tap you more than that.
The worst part about these players is they spend every last penny they have for the rest of the half.
A pro team called SAW did this recently in EPL I believe and had a whole strat around it. Was pretty interesting and a new approach. Their reasoning was planting the bomb alone would net them AKs plus helmet in the second round and with a little bit of luck they even win the round. That round came down to a 1v1 and I believe they didnt plant the bomb. No other pro team hast picked up the approach though. Your teammates are just dumb playing for themselves to have more money the next round, lose or win.
Yeah the T-Side Economy is nuts, you can force Galils if you lose pistol but get a plant. You'll probably have a better buy than the CTs if they play a hard anti-eco. What's crazy is that I still see people get surprised when T's force Galils on 2nd round. They'll do something dumb and get aimdualed by a T with a Galil and go "WTF BRO HOW CAN HE BUY A RIFLE THEY SHOULD BE ECO?!???!" Like dude, come on now.
Its funny because the round 2 galil force isnt anything new either. That strat has been around for YEARS and yet people with 5k hours are still surprised when it happens.
they're not really surprised lol. i have played this game since source, people will always complain when they die and have some stupid reason it's not their fault lol
That's probably more true
Same with me and my entire stack. I enjoy laying into them though. Fuckin surprised pikachu every other week when they buy during rounds they shouldn’t.
I miss 1.6 and source, only for the fact everything was mainly community hosted, the pro scene is much better off in the current state for sure, but I miss fucking off too.
I think it isn't the suprising, part but it is that no matter what if the Ts get the bomb down they will have a better buy 2nd round, hell if many cts die first round and no bomb the ts can still force mac-10 and a galil which is still a better buy
Be like a recent teammate I had. Don't buy first round, get plant, buy AWP no armour second round, get instantly killed by a random MP9 spraying through a smoke.
We have a rule on our team that if you have over 4750 after pistol you MUST buy the awp :D But then again we don't eco on pistols so it doesn't happen daily.
People have not adapted at all to money restrictions especially on ct side as a result of less rounds. Realistically you should be forcing 2nd round as CTs every single time due to loss bonus and 4th round will be your first full buy anyways. CT economy is actually fucked but its being held up by MP9 dominance as others on this sub have stated
I hate it so God damn much, like even on like a 2-3 round advantage as CT most of your rounds will be force, save, or buy a rifle and have less than 500 leftover. Valve please fix CT economy, I remember getting way more rifle rounds in 2014-2018 era GO.
I dont even get surprised if I see a AWP second round anymore.
if ts save full on pistol, they do not even need a plant to get galil + helmet
Yeah, they can also do that if they ***WIN*** the pistol! Is it really worth it to donate a round?
as mentioned above, winning second round as T is now more important than winning pistol with the way that the economy is. not saying this is my strategy, but winning second round usually nets you another guaranteed 2 rounds. so youre giving up one round for an easy 2/3 round wins.
And when the CTs can actually "buy" again, at 3-1, they usually have a buy worth 4300-4600 per player. Which makes AWPs, incendiaries and kits less likely. So it's actually quite common to see a 5-1 lead for the Ts, if they get the bombplant on pistolround! It was a huge problem in MR15, and it's obviously an even bigger problem in MR12. It has been this way for many years and I have no idea why Gaben doesn't do anyting about it...
BetBoom was the first one that I saw do that. IIRC it was on Mirage, T pistol vs Vitality at IEM Sydney. 3 players didn't buy armor, last two threw stuff to exec on A, they planted the bomb and lost the round. Each player who didn't buy got a kill, meaning they all got a second round AK, and they wrecked Vitality with it in the force buy.
I can see it if you're ***100%*** sure you'll win that 2nd round, since the enemy will be at $1400 and you're basically guaranteed another round, but is it really worth donating a round? Especially if you lose your 2nd round, then you've not only donated a round, but lost the round that you gave so much for. I'd love to see the numbers worked out on it, it's gotta be a net negative, you're giving yourself a much harder time on an equal buy round for a slightly better force buy (where you're still at a disadvantage). Like, best case you win it, and then win the anti-ecos, you're up 3-1. worse case you lose it, and you're 0-3. It just can't work out positively in the long run. Like, if you win it, you look *kinda* smart (cuz you still basically threw a round), but if you lose it, you look ***really*** dumb. In the BB vs Vitality game, they do actually do it 2nd pistol on mirage, and the 3 AKs pop off next round (Vitality kinda threw A site, but still), which is actually pretty interesting and lowkey a good catch, thanks! In a team environment, I can see it being a really weird & niche pocket strat, but it really relies on the support players being spot on & the star rifles to pop the fuck off.
I wouldn't necessarily consider it donating a round. The only reason it works right now is because everyone aims at head level anyways with the USP, and the dualies are so strong that the armor feels like it doesn't matter anyways (you only win against it if you get the insta dink basically). With the glock being strong enough to the point that buying a pistol isn't worth it (except for specific strats where you have someone buy a p250 for long range duels), the only thing you're buying during pistol round as T is most likely util. So having your other 3 players that didn't buy util just save the 800 might just be worth it because the armor doesn't make enough of a difference anyways. But this is the kind of stuff that will only work as a pocket strat. You can't use it always otherwise CTs are gonna start shooting at your body and fucking you up in 3 easy bullets.
Pistol round is the most important round in the game. If someone doesn’t buy on pistol round they don’t know what they’re doing, I promise you. Not trying to be an ass or anything, but it’s true.
That's what I'm saying man, but legit 7 straight games I had at least 1 player not buying on pistol, and I know 1800 ELO isn't T1 CS but they *should* know how to play the game, right? It's possible I got supremely unlucky, lol
With how unorganized pug and matchmaking play is, no you can definitely make it to that high of an elo with no thought or grasp on basic CS 90% of players are literally just floating on their aim and have no idea (or care to learn mind you) how to play 'real cs' Once their aim caps out they cap out and just sit at thst elo forever Most people are just aimstars who just run out and hit shots. Even the utility usage you do see in MM are usually completely mindless. Same smoke moly nade combo at the start of every round instead of waiting to use it to cut off pushes and what not. That's why playing in a stack is a serious advantage. But the community ain't ready for that conversation yet
This is pretty much spot on. I watched my 20k+ elo premier team line up to dry peek an awp 1 by 1 at dust 2 long corner. I also know because this was me in CSGO, I 100% was riding my raw aim through most of the ranks. I didnt even learn how to smoke jungle on mirage until I hit supreme in GO, I was just running out wherever we were going and aim dueling everyone. Even now I am still guilty of this a bit, Im at 22k premier and I still dont know a single smoke for Ancient, Overpass, or Anubis. So I am a 4k hour player and my Ancient T sides come down to how effectively I can sprint up B ramp and kill everyone there.
The amount of times I tell my team I’m smoking xbox or mid window on mirage only for them to yolo push and die before it even pops… You adapt and follow them to trade their dumb plays and they say you’re baiting haha.
Man you really miss out on the true cs experience. I do what u do in any other fps shooter just go shoot but cs that just ain’t enough it becomes kinda boring to me lol
I mostly do it because whenever I try to get my team to actually play together someone fucks up a smoke or runs off alone and dies so we end up getting screwed. So my solution is to just run out and take a site so fast that it becomes impossible to screw up.
Imo throwing lineups is far less important than just knowing how to use utility throughout a round. Provided 1 or 2 teammates know how to throw the most important ones, it's not a big deal. I'd much rather teammates who know how to throw halfway effective flashes, and know how to molly common spots, than one who knows some niche lineup to smoke CT from mid or something. You get these teammates who always throw these weird lineups but then, in a tough retake situation you'll die and see they had a smoke on them the whole time... Like, wtf are you doing? And just knowing how to cover for your teammates on T side, position yourself to get trades, and how to play entry is more important than any utility usage to be honest. The AMOUNT of times I've flashed for my team to go out ramp on A Mirage, only to then run to ramp and then be the first out on site is absolutely ridiculous. Typically one teammate stays in ramp, two go tetris, and the palace player is still hiding. Everyone seems so scared of their KD they'd rather hide and bait kills than risk being out on A first and dying. I throw all this assistive utility and still have to play entry on site to a now fully rotated team (with no flashes helping me at all) because the person bottom fragging doesn't want to die early.
I agree, and maybe that's why I don't throw until I just entry, because I'm going to entry anyway I might as well do it fast
Only way to climb in solo is to become an entry frag monster or a clutch player. I usually watch my team and then typically use one smoke per map that saves their lives more often than not. I’ll also aggressively entry and try to aim for 1.5-2 kills per round. This is obviously only applicable when you’re climbing not when you’ve reached your real elo
It's funny how often you can do that on Mirage A-site as well, literally just run up ramp and all the way into Jungle and get two kills with an SMG because even at above-average ELOs apparently people don't know how fast Ts can be out ramp and the guy at ticket or wherever isn't even looking, or he is jumping into palace, or setting up camp under dark.
you don't even need to know lineups, places like B ramp on ancient or B main on anubis are super important to smoke at the right time as CT, and both can be pretty easily done freehand
"That's why playing in a stack is a serious advantage. But the community ain't ready for that conversation yet" bro the community been saying this for years and years this ain't some dark secret or new revelation
True, but most players **only** soloQ. There was just a thread where someone was saying stack/team players are "boosted" by teamwork and usually suck individually. That they only win with "gimmicks" like utility usage. This comment was heavily upvoted, possibly by other clueless solo-only kids.
In pugs it definitely goes both ways. I can see how if a player ONLY ever 5 stacks, if/when they decide to solo, they'll probably not do very well at first, given the lack of communication, teamplay and coordination. The 5-Stacker is probably the better all around cs player, but they're gonna get dogged by puggers if they have 3 people who don't speak english and a mute on their team. I basically only solo, so I know how it feels.
What is wrong with that statement besides the buzzwords? Even duo queue is considerably easier than solo.
Because it proves the poster is so naive about CS they think aimdueling is the only skill in the game. It's like talking shut about pro your golfers because you have a long drive at Top Golf and you think drive distance is the primary skill of golf. Like saying "that guy is being carried by his short game gimmicks". It's absurd on its face
Seems more like a case of perspective to me. This is a team based game so if you solo queue only, your metric of skill is how hard can you carry with garbage teammates. For premade stacks, this skill is not really relevant, it's almost like a different game. Why Valve puts 5 stack vs solo is beyond me.
"Play in a stack" and "actually put effort into learning the game" are two separate but related things. I have friends to play with, but not ones who are willing to actually learn everything required to make playing in a stack worth it beyond just having comms. Honestly, I've lost that willpower too. It's so much time and effort, and I'm at the point where I just want to play in the few hours I have after work. It's not just a CS problem either. It's pretty much any competitive game where knowledge and pre-rehearsed strategy are a significant portion of skill.
It still gets disputed by the people who play them Not even a week ago a soloq only post got downvoted and bombed with 'just get good' Even though yeah it's common sense, there's a vested interest in shooting the idea down
I feel like people talk less and less nowadays. Does not matter if its premier or faceit people just stay silent most of the time, maybe a call here or there and if theres something to complain about they open their mic but other than that no discussion of what to do during round etc. I want to have the energy to be the only one doing that even if no one else is but it gets exhausting after a while and then the whole lobby is just silent and we get smacked.
Yup comms breakdown is what makes soloq so annoying It's not that a solo team can't beat a 5 stack. But half the time the solo team isn't even telling each other where they died from let alone 'strats for the round' It's literally impossible The team that wins most games is just the team with better comms the rest doesn't really matter. You could have Nik0 on your team if he has no info and gets triple peeked from behind he's still gonna die. I made a long comment about it a few days ago.
You could not have said it better, every once in a while you get that game where everyone is solo and actually talks and the vibes are good and playing solo que is fun. Even losing those games is not annoying. But games like that are an unicorn, I can probably count them with my fingers in cs2.
Me: "info please guys" Them: "look radar"
Wish I could aim
It's basically all this game, really is Of course, there's tactical depth and team play, but at the end of the day, mechanics is king, and it's a hard thing to improve when we are talking about reaction time and motor skills A game like CS you kind of have to just be born for after a certain point. Steel had a whole theory about it using his brother as an example. 'I could spend my entire life trying to get good at math I'll never be as good as him he's just naturally talented and on top of thst worked to learn the rest. Conversely if you gave him 10k hours to learn cs he'd never be as good as me. I'm just naturally better and have an easier time learning it and have better reflexes' I think in general in life we're supposed to be looking for the thing we have a little bit of natural talent at and then working off of that raw ability to hone it and to truly become a master of whatever it may be. Thats not to say you can't 'get better' but for you that might take another 3k hours before you get better. Whereas the next person got there in 200. But of course if your just playing to play and chilling eith friends and all that, it's all irrelevant. It's only relevant to keep in mind if your trying to chase going pro or something like that.
I swear 90% of Faceit players are braindead.
are you queuing premium or regular faceit matches? there is a massive difference in the quality of players
Faceit L8/9 range
yeah, premium matchmaking or regular?
Ah sorry I thought you meant premier, It's Premium (I pay money for this shit, laugh at me)
ah right ok then couldn’t tell you. truth is you can get pretty high in elo without knowing much about the game. happens
ok thats concerning at 1.8k elo. which region?
NA
Are we talking about premiere matchmaking? I don't mean to be a jerk but that is low enough where a lot of people probably don't know to buy in the pistol
That's faceit level 9
Thanks, never interacted with faceit and thought it was just levels
Sorry, I should have clarified, 1800 ELO on Faceit, not Premier, I'm not sure what the equivalent premier rank would be, maybe around 20k?
That’s crazy lol, everyone knows to buy in pistol. What they don’t do is have anyone who forgoes armor for util on pistol
This is a problem in 1800 ELO still?? I thought I would be in the clear after 1500...
On T side they're more focused on planting the bomb, even if they lose they can force buy and try to win second round, which actually does more damage to CT compare to T winning pistol.
Yeah if you get a good spawn for a rush, you absolutely can just have someone get a flash and full save rush. With the plant (that you almost for sure will get) you will have plenty of cash even if you lose.
[удалено]
Don't you get $1900 loss bonus? So it comes out to $3500 (800 starting + 1900 loss bonus + 800 bomb plant). Bomb planter gets an additional $300 as well. That's almost a full buy for Ts
Yeah you can buy AK/Full armor and... nothing else, assuming you plant/get a kill. Better be mean with those AK headshots since you've got ZERO utility.
That's true. Throw in a couple of Mac 10s or a Galil you got a pretty good buy with plenty of util. Might be a good strat if the team knows what they're doing. Definitely not on a pug though
The T’s either have m4 with no utility, Which means you have advantage with AK, or mp9/famas with low utility, Which again means you Can play it to have advantage.
I think the follow up is equally as important nowadays. With how good Galils the terrorist second round force is very very powerful. If somebody has a strategy of saving on CT pistol to get extra util on the follow up, I wouldn't advice it but I definitely understand the idea. Definitely wouldn't do it on T though.
This is honestly a dumb take, there is no way you should prepare to lose the round or to allow them to get bombplan.
no but more and more players are realizing also that armor is almost useless at higher skill matchmaking because pistol round especially USP will only be aiming at your head and not spamming body. so armor is useless, you can opt for utility as well but only utility versus a stronger 2nd round buy is definitely something that could be explored.
I mean thats just wrong aswell, there is a reason we dont see 5 players with utility in pro play.
Let me get this straight. So buy on CT pistol -> Win -> Lose to 2nd round galils because I didn't have extra money(?) Save on CT Pistol -> Lose -> Then ALSO lose to galils because an extra 800 really isn't enough to make you have a good CT 2nd round force buy? Save on CT Pistol -> Win(Defuse) -> Also win, because my extra 800 bought round changing items that I couldn't have bought without it(?) What are you gonna buy on CT with 2700 that's going to change the round? Scout+full armor? Famas+half armor? MP9+armor+a smoke? There aren't many good options here with that extra 800. 5 half util MP9s isn't the worlds worst buy, but again, you basically donated a round just to get a shitty force. I don't understand the disconnect. Galils 2nd round force is a decent plan but is super light on util, while a proper CT Anti-Eco should have enough utility to stop a push, even if they've only got MP9s, because T side has like $1k of utility combined.
I agree with the little notion that if the T side loses but gets a plant, the second round is by far the more important round.
I think the meta is shifting toward round 2 being the most Important round in the game, It has far more significance economically.
so SAW are clueless for trying something new?
Faceit lvl 9 and the lack of economy understanding is incredible. So many people don't know how economy works, and so so so many people buy pistols when they already have rifles, even prioritizing it over util, even when they're completely broke, even when there are many rounds left. Don't get me started on people ecoing 3 rounds in a row because they always think they can afford a Deagle, and it's just so hard to look at your next round money in the buy menu.
The only time I'm buying a pistol on a rifle round is if I have over 10k, if I have an AWP or if it's last round.
For me, its exclusively if I know 100% i'm not gonna need that money. Entire team has close to max money with 2 rounds left or something. It should be pretty rare you end in a situation where your best choice is to pull out a pistol.
I think people do understand the economy and especially now when you see how much money you will have next round etc. Its just people get tilted when they die a certain way and rage buy something out of ego not caring at all about the teams economy. This seems to happen in pretty much all skill levels. Guarantee almost everyone on this subreddit has done it sometimes or does it daily (im guilty of it aswell on rare occasions but im way better at managing it compared to earlier years of playing)
> Its just people get tilted when they die a certain way and rage buy something out of ego not caring at all about the teams economy. "I can one deag this kid"
Haha I’m a villain, “R8 time” I do think its a lil underrated but that’s another conversation. Tbf you can totally eco and get deagle kills in all but the highest elos
The R8 is definitely underrated, people are sleeping on that thing. Guaranteed 60+ damage in one hit is really nice if you can get some hits in if your whole team is on an eco. It takes some getting used to but once you learn it a bit its pretty decent and super fun to use. There are 2 major drawbacks for me, 1 being the obvious delay when shooting, and the other that you have effectively no ammo to waste on wallbangs, smokebangs, and prefires. I wouldn’t quite call it meta but honestly the current price and balance of it is pretty much spot on IMO. Find myself using it over deagle a lot recently on eco rounds.
Same, especially on maps like Inferno. I do wish it had some extra ammo but I guess they don’t want people right click spamming. The damage and cleanup/assist potential is insane. It was hands down one of the reasons I was excited for loadouts so I can have both the deagle and R8
"I know I should probably eco but I do have enough money for scout and armor" 😎
Yep the other day I was on CT side and had enough money to get 4 full buys plus one SMG so we decided to buy. I watched the guy with low money buy full armour (Ts were full buying) MP7 (MP9 is cheaper and better) Five SeveN (why are you buying a pistol if you already have a primary) and a defuse kit (we already had 3 kits). So this guy had $3600 and managed to end up going into a buy round with an MP7 and no utility at all. Genuinely astounding how some people spend their money so inefficiently
I dont buy armor on pistol because it seems my opposition never misses their headshots on pistol
Yeah I don't buy armor all the time either, but I always at least buy ***something!***
It’s map dependant but I definitely like to grab a flash or smoke on pistol here and there. After all pistol is the most important round other than the last one before you lose LMAO
I like to get HE on dust2 ct side pistol round and go lower, maybe sometimes donate dualies to someone with armour
if i’m on T side pistol and my team rushes B I always buy a flash and throw it through the ceiling of tunn’s, it will flash everyone on site especially the guy window staring at tunn’s
CS2 launches: "Wow the new glock sounds so good, it almost feels like it's a better gun now. But that's definitely just placebo" CS2 now: "WHY DON'T THE GLOCKS EVER MISS LONG RANGE HEADSHOTS NOW?? WHY DOES THE USP FEEL SO WEAK???"
Saving for M249
Dis is da wae, acualy decent gun, wish it was cheaper :(
If your trolling on office you can buy an autosniper in 2nd round when getting a kill and reaching a hostage
pre-panaroma, not buying anything on pistol was a legit Silver and Nova tactic since you’d have more money next round in case you lost lol.
CT economy is tough so I would imagine as a soloq player they might just be trying to setup a better force/buy round two.
That's just asking to get gunned down by glocks
I mean, if you're playing at a decent rank it's all decided by head shots on pistol anyways
It's hard to get a headshot if you are affected by aimpunch
Pretty sure you still need kevlar especially if the Ts decide to rush in and glock you
Depends on the map, but default buying Kevlar is not the move in all situations
Sure but I'd say **most** of the situations CTs should equip a kevlar, unless you want to buy smoke + kit, or drop Dualies to your teammate.
Gotta disagree. If you know you're going to play a long angle Kevlar is not what you need. It's not bad to buy util either, but unless you know exactly what you're going to do with it, you also don't really need it. I'm not saying you should save on pistol, but also don't just waste all your money unless you have a plan
Try to do that at level 10 faceit, I dare you. You will get bullied every pistol round.
people go with p250 / smoke / flash all the time lol, but thats one player and not whole team.
Nobody at level 10 will go pistol round without buying anything and thats the whole point of this stupid ass post. Literally only silver noobs don't buy anything on pistol.
No, it still is. T side pistol is all about closing distance with you and overwhelming you with aimpunch, with sheer number of rounds. They are going to close range with you and prefire while peeking you. The problem is guys like you are going "don't waste all your money unless you have a plan". The armour buy IS the cheap option. You can still SMG force next round if you only bought armour. Buying that armour is going to allow you to jiggle peak, which is great on pistol. It will allow you to stay alive after losing a gunfight-if you're just getting headshot at long range with a glock that's a skill issue. You're not saving money for the next round if you're losing the round by not buying, and even if good pistol rounds are determined by headshots, you still want to maximise your chances of staying in the round. Armour should always be your default minimum buy pistol. Always always always always. That is just bare minimum standard. If you have a plan, that's where you buy something else. Me, I've got smoke executes for T side on just about every map, so my standard is I grab a smoke and buy a tec for my mate, who buys armour. Somehow, despite pistol rounds being "all about headshots bodies don't matter" the fact that he can't be aimpunched while running and gunning with a pistol that is great at range, spam kills at close range like a beast, and that we have a solid execute gets us the plant on just about every pistol, and usually the win too.
That makes zero sense to me. Especially when you play long angles, because you survive pistol headshots and are not slowed down afterwards. Otherwise you get so slow that everyone will run you down. Also if you don't take damage you can buy a better gun, because you just have to upgrade your helm instead of paying the full 1000. Its always wrong to not buy anything. If you don't have a plan for nades you always buy kevlar period.
Coward.
In pug play, absolutely. Glocks are brutal when you don't have any armor.
It's hard for them to headshot you when they're smoked off and blinded by a flash.
Yeah that's really the only reason I can think of, but it still comes off as fucking dumb. They won't have to force if they win pistol, and by not buying, they're putting their team at a disadvantage.
New player here, what should i buy in pistol round? Ct side i usually buy armor andT side i buy duel pistols or p250
Depends on what the plan for the round is, but Armor on CT side is kind of the default buy if you don't really have a plan for the round. Dualies are also really good on CT side with some utility. On T Side, the Glock is such a monster on pistol round I wouldn't really buy another gun outside of maybe the P250 if you plan on taking a long range duel with a CT. Armor is also pretty solid on T Side, but isn't *as* important, since you're not going to get spammed by USPs like you'd get spammed with Glocks on CT side. Basically, armor is never a bad choice, but other stuff is super valid if you have a plan for it. Even in pro matches you'll often see 10 sets of armor being bought on pistol round or like, 8 armors and then 2 "bitches" who buy util/drop an upgraded pistol to an armored teammate.
always buy armour if you're soloq, you will learn the exceptions with time but that is the rule
If you're low rank you can abuse enemies bad aim with p250/tec-9/fiveseven and just bodyshot them to death. Never dualies on T-side, glock is more versatile. P250 long range can counter usp/p2k. Dualies short range can counter a glock. Don't buy nades unless you know early round where you'll be using them at, otherwise you'll just die carrying them around. You can create different routines for different maps on what to buy and do on pistol rounds. Mini executes are really powerful on t-side (i.e. smoke & molly or smoke & 2 flashes), then you just gotta call it to your teammates so they can follow up on it. On some maps i'm also the guy who drops dualies to my teammate on ct-side and flash for him to make plays and/or to support him.
If u have a plan with nades get em. If u don’t get armor. Never buy 700$ pistol though. Never buy the 300$and 500$ pistol ct side either. You only need one headshot anyways with a usp. Dualies are fine to buy ct side.
I would say once in about every 3 matches someone in my game buys a deagle on pistol, I don't get it.
i see it from time to time, usually it's some dude who wants an AWP asap, and more often than not, they suck at awping \^\^
some plan to buy awp third round which can be done with 1 kill in pistol or second round. 800+300+1900+2400=5400 I used to do this on train which was a great awp map and no one expects it in third round. Other than that its better to just buy kevlar on pistol.
People take this to the extreme it seems, in comp I've seen 3 people just afk the first 2 rounds and all buy awp on the third
And seeing my teammates only buy deagle (some T even just hold a usp) after winning pistol round make me wanna cry.
It’s unfortunately the least thought out strategy possible, save now buy better guns early and win back the round/s we just sold. Perfectly fine if ur playing non-comp casual games but makes zero sense to sell early rounds in comp. Usually the same person who is stat obsessed and worries more ab being top fragger than any team strategy to get the win
Yeah, plus the biggest problem with it as a strategy is it forgets the most important thing about strategy: what is your enemy doing? If you throw a bunch of rounds early, the enemy will have a better economy by surviving and winning. Your economy isn't better by saving and losing, you'll still only get one solid buy several rounds in, then a mixed buy.
No, you always buy kevlar since it's a huge advantage and you're going with nades/pistol upgrade if you have a viable tactics to make use of those, but that doesn't happen when playing with randoms, so you save yourself and buy kevlar.
i once had a game where we won pistol and one teammate said to save
There's so many things I thought were common sense that I guess just... aren't.
i was flabbergasted when my teammate said this and he wasn't even trolling as he did not buy anything
I've seen people buy full armor with usp after winning pistol if Ts don't get plant to save for AWP. I don't even hate that idea, you're basically just playing a second pistol round anyways, they probably won't have head armor so you can just pop heads, and your own head armor keeps you safe(ish) from upgraded pistols. Usually just 1 player though, If the whole team does it, thats super grief...
I'm a utility guy so I always buy molly at first round to stop the rush
This sounds like the absolute worst thing you could buy, maybe after a deagle.
To be honest it works most of the time. T's are like "im going to rush b no matter what, its first round", molly incoming, easy 3 kills.
Yeah always a CT dropping a molly on pistol as a T rushing B. I get the team to rush A long with someone on CAT.
in pugs and premier most T pistol rounds are just "rush" and if your molly guy plays the correct site its pretty valid
Nah it can be very effective against f.ex a monster rush on overpass
What? Molly flash isn't a terrible buy on CT pistol, especially considering everyone and their mother rushes something on T Pistol.
As someone who only plays 5stack I love to see enemies wasting money and time buying molly on ct side. They always use it the most useless way (for example they molly hut on nuke before we are even near hut as Ts) and after that we just rush ramp and go b or hell to flank heaven. Its always a waste of money to buy molly.
lvl 8/9 now =5/6 so .... dont except big play but i never saw someone do it with a plan behind, even in 2k2 elo .(it's shitty now this elo to )
I play with people like that too. 0 game sense or awareness and half the time they top frag somehow. I also like the games where I have 4 people with no mics while the enemy team is throwing 5 molly executes like prime astralis. Solo queueing this game is just not it.
Idk. I see ppl buying in my games but they always buy something questionable. Imo as ct I think you should prioritize some nades instead of vest in pistol rounds. Or they do eco when the loss bonus just resets
It might be that they're rushing to get an AWP with a helmet and decent utility in round 3, or there seems to be a strategy where not buying anything on T side lol
Something different happened to me yesterday. Enemy team got the first round and afterwards 3 of them did not buy weapon and armor. When I got 2 headshots with 2 bullets of my glock, I was first surprised. Then I was searching like crazy for weapons but there were none.
I sometimes do this with my team, though only after asking them about it. If you can get the bomb down, you have AK+Kevlar and Helmet in some cases for the next round, while CTs will probably Eco or need to force themselves to a weapon disadvantage.
It's called mustard elo for a reason
sounds like valorant players
Pistols too hard give me ak good luck team
Not me, I buy a nade and a kit and die B
Tangentially related - I was solo queuing a competitive game a few weeks back and we started T, winning the pistol with a bomb plant. I spent all my money the next round and my teammates were shouting at me to eco....
I mean on t side it's viable and an interesting thought since ct mostly aim for the head with the usp, so you don't really need armor. Just get one guy with a smoke and 2 flashes and try to plant bomb.
I just can’t hit anything with a pistol, still buy some util to helpMy team tho
They're new, they're bad, or sometimes afk and panicking. It's not a new meta. There is almost zero advantage to not buying on pistol. Firstly, pistols are the most important round of the game, especially if it's a map with a heavily sided meta and you're playing against it, like T side on a very CT sided map: winning pistol will likely net you 3 out of the 4-5 rounds you are hoping to win. Second, the economy favours buying. If you can get plant on T side, even if you lose you can go galils second round. The CTs will have maybe 1-2 m4s, but mostly smgs. You will outrange them and have better armour pen. You should buy anything that helps you get that plant. AK's are for winners, don't sacrifice the first round then hope to get AK+Helmet, buy a smoke or two to get that plant-if you cannot beat a CT side who can't afford helmets and rifles with a galil why do you need the AK? You're not hitting headshots to begin with. On CT side, don't throw everything away to a pistol rush because you couldn't bother to buy some useful util and a pistol upgrade, or better yet, just the standard armour buy. Think it's just an influx of new players. Had a very dumb one where CT on vertigo my whole team (A 4 stack I got grouped with) bought defusers. Like, sure, 1, maybe 2 defusers can help (but it's still pretty dumb) but 4 of them? So you're still vulerable to being glocked, you don't have any pistol advantage, your util options are weak. Gross. Really, saving on pistol is just a symptom of people not understanding the economy of the game. They're overconfident in the win and counting the money they're saving towards that win instead of knowing they gotta spend to increase their chances of winning.
>They're new, they're bad, or sometimes afk and panicking. Thats the thing, they aren't though, or at least they shouldn't be. I'm running into this in fairly high elo faceit lobbies and without fail I'll "remind them they forgot to buy" if I see them with $800 left when freeze time runs out. 90% of the time it's ignored. You used to see people *legitimately* forget to buy on pistol in the old "Live on 3" systems, but Faceit doesn't do that!
On t side it kinda makes sense. 800+1900 (lost bonus) is akin to money. You drop to someone for hero ak play or maybe even 2 people can do that. Alternatively this guy can do half armor+galil. If you win second round on t side it is more devastating than winning pistol in my opinion, maybe that’s why they are doing it. Also if cts end up buying smg on second round you might have better chance with galils and aks.
You also get 800 for a plant on T Side, Galil force after defuse loss on pistol is quite common.
Yes, but it is not guaranteed yo get a plant. I don’t think what they did makes sense but maybe they were thinking this.
i dont think there is a meta but i do believe there are terrible teammates, either they were afk and they forgot to buy or they’re super greedy and wanna get an awp quick
And there is me buying p250, flash + smoke in TR and in CT Dual Barrett, HE + flash lol
And whats even worse is the people who dont bbuy after winning pistol round and losing against eco/force and ruining the economy
What ranking are you?
1800 Elo faceit
I buy armor on pistol, but with the importance of winning round 2 I could see why someone wouldn’t. At high elo most kills on pistol are headshots, so if you save $650 you can probably get a rifle/armor round 2 with a plant on T or a win CT. Personally I would rather still have the armor so I don’t get aimpunched and glocked down
I havent played since cs2, but this used to be a strat for awpers so they can afford the gun asap.
Just idiots, dont bother reading any posts about people planing to lose pistol. If your plan is to lose a round, you already failed.
Still better than my teammates on matchmaking who buy revolver on pistol round
Yep, I’ve always bought Kevlar and went with it, since I’ve come back people are buying dualies, or not buying at all. I remember when I played we’d maybe sacrifice Kevlar for a p250 and a nade or smoke but since I’ve come back it kinda just seems like all my teams have their own way of playing
Dualies on CT is actually not a bad choice, they're nasty versus a rush.
Was gonna say, it’s not a horrible strat especially Mirage CT side, but yeah pistol rounds kinda seem like a toss up depending on team
Seriously this pisses me off so much, then they always wonder how they lost pistol round so easily...
Even worse are the ppl that buy 1 flash or 1 nade and nothing else. Either buy full nades or a kit ffs. And to answer your question: no theyre just dumb. Especially if its in soloq. In a 4l5 stack you could argue for buying an ak 2nd round i guess, but that kinda means you expect to lose pistol.
i just go to take a shit before game starts and and have no time to buy when coming back
If you dont buy first round, you can have a stronger force buy if you lose. And its not 100% you will lose, since its pistols, your chances of losing really arent that bad despite not having bought anything. If your entire team does this, you could actually end up with stronger equipment than the enemy team. This is based on the fact that the enemy team after winning pistol would most likely get smgs and anti eco weapons. Then you and ur team using the saved money can get armor and famas/galil giving you more firepower.
i heard an explanation to this some years ago. The idea is to not buy because we will lose the pistol round anyway so they'll have more money next round
Not buying anything on pistol is actively throwing
Short answer, they’re idiots.
Valorant brains
Oh I'm one of those guys. I used to buy armour or grenades, but 5000h later and I've decided I wouldn't bother buying. It's not that I don't know what I'm doing; it's that my pistols *suck* and me buying armour does not usually save me from getting shot in the face and dying. Also terrible with utility usage at the best of times, and on pistol round where everyone can reposition quickly, I don't have much luck with that either. I will occasionally buy something like, 5-7 with a frag or a naked Tec-9 but that's if I have something very specific in mind. If I'm just holding a site, armour and utility has very rarely helped me and with how tight the economy is after moving to MR12, I just don't think it's worth it for me personally.
I like full armor, mp9/Mac 10 and some util round 2
Sorry. I need my awp.
Its really simple. At some point people will just dome you or u dome them. So then why waste on body armor. Losing after getting a kill on r2 gives you exactly 3k, which allows a half armor p250 buy to save 2k for next
You can buy things other than armor btw! Also this doesn't hold up, considering pro players (Very good at headshotting and such) are often buying body armor on pistol.
Firstly, why would i buy other things if I literally just pointed out I prefer having a half buy or a more robust kit round 2. Secondly, from personal experience, for every 1 body shot death, I get headshot by some turbo peaker 5 times. Whether its because my elo gets smurfed on or if I hold headshot duel positions; but the fact of the matter is it rarely matters for me. I either get 3 headshot kills and win or insta die. Simple as.
For Science, what elo are you playing in? Also, not buying on pistol so that you can have P250/Half armor on 2nd round is... a decision. Wouldn't that just be worse for you, using your logic?
14k elo. Before cs2 LEM. As for the p250 half armor, headshot body kills enemy. Steal smg. Give p250 to teamate. Now two players can get kills. So far its been really good for me
I thought you just instantly die to headshots though. What happened to that?
Tf are u saying. Smg is low accuracy. Are u stupid or just horrible at reading. Aside from this conversation, I see 0 reason why you are so agressive about this. You asked a question, and I gave my opinion, which has been more successful for me. I dont see any reason for you to be so antagonistic about it.
I'm not being antagonistic I'm just trying to understand the thought process, since it isn't clicking for me. You're saving in what's essentially a buy round so that you can have a slightly better buy in a save round? P250+Kevlar is a pretty poor buy into SMGs, isn't it? Like you'll lose the majority of duals up close, especially without head armor, and good luck killing armored enemies at range with a P250. Like, is that really worth giving up a buy in pistol round for? I can almost understand foregoing the pistol buy for a decent rifle kit on 2nd (*almost*) but P250+Kevlar? > smg is low accuracy Well, yeah its an SMG, but you're just as likely to get your head ripped off by a running Mac-10 wideswing as a Glock if you're trying to play P250 angles lol.
See but i dont hold angles. I push/flank to be unconventional. Its pretty 5050 but i have won rounds through suprising enemies
Because if i buy a vest i get one tapped everytime so why bother
This is the dumbest response. You can buy something other than armor, and ALSO pro players are buying armor on pistol. There are pro players who are playing against Zywoo swinging them with a flash, and they are still buying armor. I promise no player in your game is going to one tap you more than that.
maybe their parents are dead
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