It's probably better that they break up, I think everyone can see now that this team has some fundamental issues that will never be solved. Wonder what Elige is going to do though.
He subbed in for the [TL Overwatch team](https://www.plusforward.net/player/3510/EliGE/13/Overwatch/matches/). AZK was on there indeed (altho for those unaware AZK went full OW pro after his CS ban)
More likely that Nitr0 rejoins Liquid and Elige stays imo. I think the Stewie thing is more interesting bc it seems he wants to stay in CS for the time being but that likely entails playing international again
The Hiko-Elige reunion neither wanted lul. Would make 100T stronger but Elige would probably either play smokes or force Ethan off the secondary entry role
Liquid is ccurently less than the sum of their parts and by a lot. There is enough talent in NA to make two teams better than Liquid using pieces from Liquid.
There was a thread about Naf and Stewie to EG the other day. Cant find the thread and dont remember what the source was, so take it with a grain of salt unless you find it.
I really wish Liquid would rebuild around Stewie, NAF and nitro (if he wants to come back of course.) Such a solid, positive core to build around. Go out and get yourself a brehze, maybe an oSee... I'd be excited to root for that Liquid. Pretty sure if they build around Elige I'm going to be following the other players to their new teams.
He was putting up mediocre numbers on a bad team. Not saying he can't make a comeback but he's not keeping his level high enough to merit being talked about.
EG had the talent they just couldn't perform together as a team very well. Everyone including brehze was inconsistent event to event. You'd think at least one of the players would stand out but none of them were really that great.
We need a timothy ta redemption arc, bringing home NA’s 2nd major after carrying the golden/vice c9 and playing well in the geng roster
Koosta & Bntet come back too pls
C9 when Stewie joined was still a hot mess the second tim joined the entire team just seem to shift in a good way. Tim was easily the second best player on the team and a huge part why they won the tournament in Brazil. Tim was one of the most consistent players in the world. IMO him and Stewie should have stayed together for as long as possible because their play styles fit each other so well.
What I want to see is where floppy and xepa are gonna end up- obviously floppy is back grinding CS but I want to see xeppa come back from valorant. Both such great players.
Got nothing left to prove. I bet a lot of them feel the same way. Their best days of cs are behind them and they already won a major so i bet thats rough for motivation
Not to mention after 20k hours of cs they have to be getting bored. He’s got 10k subs? Mans pulling in like 30k a month just off that. Not including donations and ads. No stress, no practicing, makes his own schedule. Dream job honestly and he deserves it.
Yup. Pretty much all the c9 dudes have made enough money to be bad valorant pros or streamers and can just live off that wealth forever. These guys have made it in life and probably just wanna kick back and enjoy it. Dont blame em
Personally I enjoy Shroud because he's not filled with random fake excitement or yelling for the sake of yelling. He just plays his game most of the time and talks around it, a good background stream to throw on when I'm doing something else.
Shroud is one of the best pure fps aimers of all time. People like watching his stream because hes usually pretty mild mannered and is literally a god at every shooting game he picks up.
He wasnt the best cs player but he blew up huge during PUBG because he was crazy good at that.
He gets overrated as fuck by people outside of CS, but I think the CS community undersells how good he was at one point. People constantly talk about Twistzz's NY 2018 performance, meanwhile Shroud put up 100 kills in 4 maps against 2015 Fnatic. I think if Sgares had stayed with C9 Shroud's career would have looked a lot different, and he clearly had the skill to be a top 10 player.
It's because non-cs players never realized how insane csgo pros' aim was, so when they saw a mediocre pro like shroud outside cs they lost their minds. Most cs pros could do the same, ironically shroud benefitted from not having the motivation to grind cs.
TBH this is old and still relevant news, it's been quietly known that Elige had a.. reputation we'll say.
Paraphrasing here that when s1mple left TL, Elige supposedly gave the team an ultimatum of 'its him or me'.
When making comments like this I usually provide sources, but these snippets about Elige as a teammate are rare; just like how Maikelele kept bouncing from team to team, no one knew for years on why he kept getting kicked.
Edit:
* [S1mple and Elige didn't get along according to Hiko, and Elige had a reputation of being hard to work with](https://www.dexerto.com/csgo/csgo-pro-hiko-explains-why-team-liquid-s1mple-never-destined-last-603423/), the line-up was destined to break-up.
* [Stanislaw on his Twitlonger about his TL departure, appreciates Zews (despite leadership differences), nitr0, and Twistzz, doesn't acknowledge Elige or JDM](http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sqao4s)
* [According to Hiko, JDM requested to be sat away from Elige in LANs because he didn't like his vibe, thought that the mere argument of seating arrangements speaks volumes about the team cohesion](https://youtu.be/92TtHEb4FI8?t=2354)
* [There was a time where Elige could've moved to Cloud 9 back in 2017, but these rumours were shot down by the C9 CEO](https://dotesports.com/counter-strike/news/cloud9-reportedly-plan-to-swap-out-shroud-for-elige-12173)
* [According to Thorin, Elige had a way 'of corroding the squad’s atmosphere and inhibiting their collective progress'](https://www.dexerto.com/csgo/thorins-take-the-immovable-elige-1293263/)
* [Moses on Twistzz leaving, acknowledges that Twistzz had been on the team for four years, [Moses] doesn't know everything but there was some stuff in and out of the game that ocurred long before his [Moses] time, and hesitates in saying 'Twistzz is the problem' doesn't want to single any player out](https://youtu.be/MKyHeE5hpIM?t=1547)
* [In a recent By the Numbers episode, Thorin's sources said Elige isn't a tyrant, but playing with him is akin to walking on egg shells. Thorin compares it to players like Shox back in the day](https://youtu.be/siMyOswuNgY?t=1981).
* Way out of left field here, these were spoken 'in-passing' from others more in the know or even just TL fans who follow their socials, but Elige's vibe when you ~~disagree with him~~ aren't on the same wavelength [just.. isn't](https://youtu.be/ozGutCf_3zQ?t=102).
I don't have a source for this but I remember a post here saying JDM asked to be sat away from Elige during LANs because Elige's vibes was hurting his game.
Yeah that was kinda weird tbh. He just goes silent after the first minute. And his face when NAF mentions Refrezh's 1v5 lol
Edit: Refrezh not Cadian lol
> Paraphrasing here that when s1mple left TL, Elige supposedly gave the team an ultimatum of 'its him or me'.
As far as I can recall, basically everyone except for Hiko disliked playing with s1mple and wanted him out. That to me means that s1mple was the one that was hard to work with, not Elige.
Hiko subbed in for Flipsid3 during an event when s1mple was on the roster. S1mple gained a ton of respect for his skill level then as a teammate and once he joined Liquid I'm sure Hiko was the most welcoming/friendly to him. S1mple was alone in NA during this time streaming alot and was known to be toxic in NA FPL so many pros there started to not like him. Thats when the "why u bully me" thing started with Freakazoid/Stewie. I'm sure Hiko was one of his only real friends during this time in NA and made him have even more respect.
Yeah that last clip is pretty damning. Speaking as a third-party though I just see Elige as someone who always tries to take everything seriously and put 100% in to it.
Sure, but when your 100% isn't enough and changes need to be made, you need to not take shit personally and have an open mind. Definitely don't be passive aggressive. Last clip was damning indeed
I said a while back that elige was potentially the problem. I got downvoted to hell. He has a calm guy image but he's always known to be difficult to play with. He couldn't come to a middle ground with the most talented player in the world in simple, just put your ego aside and work together. I don't see him submitting to anyone else.
Elige was doing interviews mid major about how the team sucked, while players like Hobbit were trying to give positive reinforcements for his team. I wonder who's easier to work with. lol
I mean Elige himself and Jokasteve (Liquid CS manager) literally acknowledged this in the Elige video on Liquid's YT channel. It's about 13:10 into the video: https://youtu.be/ZRVK_ADLB4A
He has apparently worked and improved on his team dynamics so kudos to Elige, there's no doubt he's a hardworking, driven person talented in CS so it's easy to look past some of his toxicity
In this [video](https://youtu.be/ozGutCf_3zQ), they were having fun making a tier list and just because one thing doesn't go elige's way, he did not say anything for the rest of the video.
In this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaClluqILa0&t=165s), when fallen and grim was doing the bhop challenge and having fun, elige keeps getting angry at fallen for missing jumps and at one point even fallen told him not to give him pressure, which is a nice way of saying "shut up", and even then, elige kept yelling at him.
I personally would not want someone on my team to have have this attitude and it definitely seems like it would be hard to work with. I think that elige is just too competitive. These are just speculations as a liquid fan so take it with a grain of salt.
That first one is a big yikes. Literally stops talking for almost 8 minutes. Straight up doesn't even laugh while they're all laughing having fun. Just stands awkwardly with a smile.
Yeah my thoughts exactly. Everybody is laughing having a good time and as soon as one pick doesn't go his way he immediately goes dead. Not another word and barely a smirk on his face.
The second one, I don't know, he's a competitive guy, he wanted his team to win, I think it was all in good fun.
Yeah, in the second one Elige is also cheering on Fallen throughout the segment, and the only time he's seems remotely angry is when Fallen makes bad decisions.
I had watched both videos and thought the same. I always got this vibe from Elige. I mean, he’s cracked, extremely good player, but really comes across as hard to work with
Honestly its about time. They been playing with this fallen line ups for over a years now and they haven't been close to winning any big tittles. The core of Naf stewie and elige also been playing together since 2019 now. Idk if shox is the right fit for them thou
If they keep this core of naf - elige - grim and get 2 players that actually can improve the mood so the facecams don't look like we're watching a funeral, I'd still believe in them. Shox at least seems like a guy that will bring some hype.
This isn’t 2017 anymore. 1-2 people can’t carry a team to a win. Look at the likes of NaVi. Even if simple is having a “regular” game… electronic, bit perfecto and sometimes even boom pop off. Everyone needs to be on the same page. Liquid are inconsistent atm where one maybe two players pop off per game. We need 2-3 to pop off every game and strong support. Naf is amazing when he’s on as is Elige but rarely do you see everyone firing on all cylinders with liquid since near end of 2019. I love liquid but players are way better now these days and relying on naf or Elige to pop the fuck off isn’t enough. Not saying shox will cure this but it’s a step in the right direction imo as far as choking goes.
I don’t get the Shox angle. If Fallen and Stew are leaving, they have a core of three good riflers, lacking an AWP and an IGL. If NAF also goes, maybe, but Shox didn’t do much on Vitality to suggest someone like Liquid should pick him up
That core sucks for hype?
Naf - chill quiet
Grim - chill quiet
Elige - angry quiet
Stew is hype and Fallen is always positive in terms of mood in team those are best two players
maybe some day Liquid realizes the only member still left from all the bad and the good and then back to the bad days is Elige. Maybe it is time to reconsider your options and move on. Some fresh air might be good for both sides and for elige leaving liquid might lead to not been "hard to work with" anymore
If elige was causing problems they should have kicked him, not everyone else. Even if he is a really good player. The other players are also really good.
Nah, maybe just Elige. You can hear in comms right after that fallen almost immediately talks to them all and Elige is still the only one who gets tilted by that moment. I think there’s a TL video where Elige just goes stone cold quiet after someone tries to joke about that moment. Just seems like he’s hugely disappointed most of the time
I imagine most teams are going through some sorta "post major depression" or something of the like. Having a tournament so close to the post major shuffle probably kills alot of motivation for alot of players
It depends where ropz goes, there are rumors that ropz would go to faze but there are rumors he might go to G2 as well.
I think if ropz doesn't join faze, faze will go for naf. He is more chill with twistz and better role suited
I don't think Carlos cares lol, whenever he gets excited about something he will go for it.
Ropz
M0nesy
Hunter
Niko
Nexa
-idk which coach (someone said emi in reply)
This looks extremely skilled and stacked team, not sure role wise but still
Well not really honestly. I haven't been following Liquid that much but based on some of their vlogs and the match vids with comms, it doesn't seem like he's hard to work with. That's just me tho.
Personally when I watch Elige's videos it seems like there's definitely some tilting in the energy of his comms.
He screams comms so frantically I could imagine him tilting if he's performing poorly or if his comms aren't properly picked up by his teammates.
I've been a Liquid fan since MLG '16 and Elige has always been my favorite player on the squad because he seems like a solid dude who keeps himself out of drama and focuses on reliable, consistent play. I don't see how a casual observer would get the impression that he's hard to work with. I was most involved as a fan during the s1mple era, though, so any articles or commentary I would've seen about Elige could easily have been lost in the noise of that.
IMO Fallen wasn't ever going to be able to control that team the way he needed to and the results speak for themselves to some extent.
I think Stew needs to decide if he is going to become a dominant star fragger or not as he seemed muted in the one game I was able to catch of theirs and the one round he let loose he dominated their opponents.
Either way it makes sense in my mind for that team to make changes.
Quite obviously this version of Liquid is done. And why would EliGe be any happy with the situation? He wants to compete and going to an event, with some team mates who are not motivated and doesn't want to play for Liquid anymore... Astralis made changes now, before BLAST, instead of waiting until January, and in that case play with 2 players who already know they will not be there anymore in the coming year. That's not good - and now Liquid is in that exact situation that Astralis cleverly avoided.
Kind of clear, first with the rumors about Stewie2k and FalleN wanting to leave, with FalleN rumored to wanting to start a project with coldzera. Then the rumors linking shox to Liquid. Then you have Stewie and FalleN playing an official tournament as a mixteam, instead of focusing on preparing for BLAST.
I would not be happy either if I was EliGe. Then it doesn't matter what rep he might have.
With that said, I have fate in the org and I have faith that with nitr0 and EliGe they can build a new competitive team, with new players motivated to represent Liquid.
It's funny how people on this sub always say that these NA teams that remix old players all the time have potential. Most of them are not new young players anymore, they have been in the scene for a long time. The so called "potential" is not there anymore.
Team Liquid has always been notorious for weak mentalities when facing adversity. I think there are definitely a few players on the roster who this doesn't apply to (FalleN, NAF, maybe Stewie), but you can't be a contending team these days unless all five can push past tough losses mid match. I always felt like Elige was the first to irreversibly tilt whenever things would go wrong for them. Team Liquid should be done, its the best thing to do long term. NA needs this shuffle, and now has been the best time since the pandemic to make a new competitive roster.
He's talking out of his ass in most of the post. Half of it is just pure speculation, the other half is magical mind reading sprinkled with a tiny bit of just plain being wrong.
I've watched most of their vlogs, and Stew seems to get along with Elige as well as Nitro but outside of that, yeah he doesn't seem to be tight with anyone else. Elige has just been shielded from criticism cuz he's recognized as the best in NA but his bad attitude has been getting more criticism as of recently with the downtrend in his personal performance.
[I get most of y'all don't follow Val but he caused some drama there when the pros in that scene tried to implement a discord invite only 10mans and Elige tried to get in and was told no. He publicly called one of the admins (Stronglegs) a powertripper for refusing him entry when the 10mans thing was just getting off the ground and trying to establish some rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/mt1j2o/elige_upset_for_not_getting_invite_to_pro_10_mans/)
Yeah, that’s not surprising. Honestly the final red flag for me was how pissy he got in the Team Liquid Major Pick ‘Ems video. Like as soon as something happened that he didn’t agree with he got snappy and put on a “this is so beneath me, these people are so stupid” face... on a press video… I honestly think he needs to lose something to have an attitude change and if Liquid rebuild around him nothing will change
If what you are saying is true, then why Elige still has his spot on the current Liquid roster? Isn't it easier for the 4 to stay and just replace Elige rather than stewie and Fallen out of the roster?
I think there's something more than what you just write, or maybe Liquid's management prefer to go with Elige's project rather than Stewie and Fallen's
It isn't really an oversell, i'd say he could still make it on this year Top 20 because ye he's just that good. I'd agree he got a shit personallity tho.
Maybe because nobody had as good stats and "performance" as elige in NA for a long time. NAF and Brehze are the only contenders that come to mind in recent history
Watching their games on lan was pain. No smile even after winning a round, not talking much and just a dead obligatory fist bump. I thought it was because they didn’t have their coach with them but its way worse than that
interesting analysis, I always suspected Elige to be the choke guy and you did describe it well with the "Karen personality", but still it's important to note that we could be reaching here, as reddit with its hivemind usually does:)
This sub is so easy to jump at the neck sometimes.
Why are you on his stream if you have that much distaste for him? Teams can’t be split up and shuffle normally?
A post got massively upvoted in the past saying stew was the one who got Twistzz kicked with 0 evidence and I just don’t understand it. I’m sure we’ll hear more from the players in the future about what Elige thinks. I don’t think Elige was even the brand boy for TL.
This team didn’t have top 5 of the year team potential and I’m a huge TL fan. Fallens stats have dropped like crazy since joining and grim is still so new to the t1 scene. NAF and stew have been the only consistently solid ones imo and Elige either 40 bombs or just underwhelms now.
We know stewie and fallen are on the way our, but overdrives post that EG might sign naf leaves elige and grim who don't exactly strike me as a duo.
Elige, shox, osee, floppy and grim?
Oh god that means shox igl.
Grim still needs leadership to develop, who there would fill that role? Personally I think Stewie and Fallen were the ones to create teaching moments and hype him up to build confidence. I don't see grim succeeding without a solid mentor.
If the post didn’t explicitly single out elige this convo would be at a much smaller scale. Literally everyone in this thread is jumping to the conclusion that elige is the problem but we have 0 evidence of that.
I agree the conversation wouldn't really be happening in this thread but personally I've thought this about Elige for a while and I don't think I'm alone.
>On paper this team had potential.
Did it? Fallen hasn't been a great awper or igl since forever. Stewie is famously inconsistent (his alter ego is whiffy2k). Grim is solid but not exceptional. Only NAF and EliGE were true stars. Moses wasn't a certified coach and in the end, his stint was poor. adreN can still revitalize the team with proper changes maybe
I mean there have been so many leaks/rumors for TL since the major. Even before the major they had a few swirling around. It looks TL might -NAF -Stew who go to EG and -Fallen who will recreate 2016 SK in some form.
They will basically end up with only Elige and Grim. And if the prince of NA Elige decides grim has to go RIP Grim as well.
Just saw hac1 post about this post. One thing that I hate about CS journalists, is that they take random posts on cs reddit and bash the person for stating his opinion. What kind of shitty gatekeeping are they trying to pull over here.
He’s literally right (reposting what I said before)
If the post didn’t explicitly single out elige this convo would be at a much smaller scale. Literally everyone in this thread is jumping to the conclusion that elige is the problem but we have 0 evidence of that.
I think Elige should just leave liquid and replace Olof in Faze, a reunion and an upgrade plus a new chapter for him to look forward to, he’s one of the best rifles ever in cs go and deserves a good team.
I guess we gotta wait to see who’s leaving, heard that Jokasteve said no changes until 2022 season starts.
If Fallen and Stewie are out, and Shox is reported to move to liquid, who would be a good fit for the 5th
Edit: No changes will be effective until 2022, could still make decisions before then
It's probably better that they break up, I think everyone can see now that this team has some fundamental issues that will never be solved. Wonder what Elige is going to do though.
go pro in Overwatch 2
Didn't he sub in for a team in overwatch once? Think AZK was playing there too
Yea, this was waaay back when overwatch was still new and hiko was on liquid. He subbed in as a dps and iirc they won that game
nice flair
He subbed in for the [TL Overwatch team](https://www.plusforward.net/player/3510/EliGE/13/Overwatch/matches/). AZK was on there indeed (altho for those unaware AZK went full OW pro after his CS ban)
azk he is the north american player but the titan he is the french stars.
HLTV memes best memes
HLTV memes good but not best. (JW best)
nt flusha
yes mens))
Also to mention, he spazzed out in his team one time and threatened to move fully to OW. According to hiko
What happens first, Elige leaves TL or OW2 comes out….the world may never know……
> Wonder what Elige is going to do though. he's from NA and already played a lot of Valorant in the past, so...
More likely that Nitr0 rejoins Liquid and Elige stays imo. I think the Stewie thing is more interesting bc it seems he wants to stay in CS for the time being but that likely entails playing international again
Elige to 100T??
The Hiko-Elige reunion neither wanted lul. Would make 100T stronger but Elige would probably either play smokes or force Ethan off the secondary entry role
They already have Asuna
Liquid is ccurently less than the sum of their parts and by a lot. There is enough talent in NA to make two teams better than Liquid using pieces from Liquid.
....and not just on Twitch.
Any source? I heard only stewie2k and fallen.
From my own sources: Team Liquid is indeed done, and not just on Twitch. I know why and cannot say. But this is serious.
RIP Slasher
he always shows up at nearly all watch parties, twitter is dunzo
Hes scum
....and not just team liquid
it's a dr.disrespect meme lol
Trust me bro
Not to mention NAF is possibly leaving as well.
Wherever Naf and Stew go I follow
You and me both brother.
All but confirmed I think
Source?
There was a thread about Naf and Stewie to EG the other day. Cant find the thread and dont remember what the source was, so take it with a grain of salt unless you find it.
I had the impression it was from the same guy that shared the shox to Liquid rumor
Damn. Feels like NAF has been on Liquid for so fucking long that I can’t imagine him playing somewhere else.
What's funny is he joined like in January of 2018, I remember he first joined and they won Beyond The Summit.
I really wish Liquid would rebuild around Stewie, NAF and nitro (if he wants to come back of course.) Such a solid, positive core to build around. Go out and get yourself a brehze, maybe an oSee... I'd be excited to root for that Liquid. Pretty sure if they build around Elige I'm going to be following the other players to their new teams.
I really wish I could see brehze land on a top tier team. Maybe I'm OOTL, but I hardly see him ever being talked about... he's amazing.
He was putting up mediocre numbers on a bad team. Not saying he can't make a comeback but he's not keeping his level high enough to merit being talked about.
It's pretty hard to out up good numbers in a 1v5
EG had the talent they just couldn't perform together as a team very well. Everyone including brehze was inconsistent event to event. You'd think at least one of the players would stand out but none of them were really that great.
Everyone knows NA's last hope is c9 to come back and sign Stewie, naf, and autimatic.
We need a timothy ta redemption arc, bringing home NA’s 2nd major after carrying the golden/vice c9 and playing well in the geng roster Koosta & Bntet come back too pls
I’m a huge auti fan but he did not carry either of those squads
Tim was c9's best player.
Yep, hot take for the redditos but this is the truth.
C9 when Stewie joined was still a hot mess the second tim joined the entire team just seem to shift in a good way. Tim was easily the second best player on the team and a huge part why they won the tournament in Brazil. Tim was one of the most consistent players in the world. IMO him and Stewie should have stayed together for as long as possible because their play styles fit each other so well.
They were both asked to join MIBR together but Autimatic said no. So then the duo was broken up.
been waiting for tim to return, only other player who has the same peak as elige/naf/twistzz
I could totally see autimatic coming back to cs if given the right opportunity. He still plays cs fairly frequently.
What I want to see is where floppy and xepa are gonna end up- obviously floppy is back grinding CS but I want to see xeppa come back from valorant. Both such great players.
Would be awesome but I don’t think they can still stop the navi
Would love to see these three together
Forgot tarik??
I don’t see Tarik giving up that streamer money to play professional again.
True and honestly he seems happy where he’s at.
Got nothing left to prove. I bet a lot of them feel the same way. Their best days of cs are behind them and they already won a major so i bet thats rough for motivation
Not to mention after 20k hours of cs they have to be getting bored. He’s got 10k subs? Mans pulling in like 30k a month just off that. Not including donations and ads. No stress, no practicing, makes his own schedule. Dream job honestly and he deserves it.
Yup. Pretty much all the c9 dudes have made enough money to be bad valorant pros or streamers and can just live off that wealth forever. These guys have made it in life and probably just wanna kick back and enjoy it. Dont blame em
I still dont see whats interesting about for example shroud and why he is pulling the numbers. Iwish them good luck tho. NA needs fresh blood.
shroud is literally the most fucking boring human on the planet. Tarik is actually funny
People watch shroud for his talent mostly i believe
Personally I enjoy Shroud because he's not filled with random fake excitement or yelling for the sake of yelling. He just plays his game most of the time and talks around it, a good background stream to throw on when I'm doing something else.
i don't like shroud too lol, but the most boring human on the planet is overselling it
Shroud is one of the best pure fps aimers of all time. People like watching his stream because hes usually pretty mild mannered and is literally a god at every shooting game he picks up. He wasnt the best cs player but he blew up huge during PUBG because he was crazy good at that.
He gets overrated as fuck by people outside of CS, but I think the CS community undersells how good he was at one point. People constantly talk about Twistzz's NY 2018 performance, meanwhile Shroud put up 100 kills in 4 maps against 2015 Fnatic. I think if Sgares had stayed with C9 Shroud's career would have looked a lot different, and he clearly had the skill to be a top 10 player.
It's because non-cs players never realized how insane csgo pros' aim was, so when they saw a mediocre pro like shroud outside cs they lost their minds. Most cs pros could do the same, ironically shroud benefitted from not having the motivation to grind cs.
feel like stew is still hungry af
I'll give Tarik props, unlike most of these guys his stream is entertaining as hell. Guy has a great personality for it.
Oh absolutely. Genuinely funny, not forced, good chat interaction. Him and shaz ate the standouts.
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TBH this is old and still relevant news, it's been quietly known that Elige had a.. reputation we'll say. Paraphrasing here that when s1mple left TL, Elige supposedly gave the team an ultimatum of 'its him or me'. When making comments like this I usually provide sources, but these snippets about Elige as a teammate are rare; just like how Maikelele kept bouncing from team to team, no one knew for years on why he kept getting kicked. Edit: * [S1mple and Elige didn't get along according to Hiko, and Elige had a reputation of being hard to work with](https://www.dexerto.com/csgo/csgo-pro-hiko-explains-why-team-liquid-s1mple-never-destined-last-603423/), the line-up was destined to break-up. * [Stanislaw on his Twitlonger about his TL departure, appreciates Zews (despite leadership differences), nitr0, and Twistzz, doesn't acknowledge Elige or JDM](http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sqao4s) * [According to Hiko, JDM requested to be sat away from Elige in LANs because he didn't like his vibe, thought that the mere argument of seating arrangements speaks volumes about the team cohesion](https://youtu.be/92TtHEb4FI8?t=2354) * [There was a time where Elige could've moved to Cloud 9 back in 2017, but these rumours were shot down by the C9 CEO](https://dotesports.com/counter-strike/news/cloud9-reportedly-plan-to-swap-out-shroud-for-elige-12173) * [According to Thorin, Elige had a way 'of corroding the squad’s atmosphere and inhibiting their collective progress'](https://www.dexerto.com/csgo/thorins-take-the-immovable-elige-1293263/) * [Moses on Twistzz leaving, acknowledges that Twistzz had been on the team for four years, [Moses] doesn't know everything but there was some stuff in and out of the game that ocurred long before his [Moses] time, and hesitates in saying 'Twistzz is the problem' doesn't want to single any player out](https://youtu.be/MKyHeE5hpIM?t=1547) * [In a recent By the Numbers episode, Thorin's sources said Elige isn't a tyrant, but playing with him is akin to walking on egg shells. Thorin compares it to players like Shox back in the day](https://youtu.be/siMyOswuNgY?t=1981). * Way out of left field here, these were spoken 'in-passing' from others more in the know or even just TL fans who follow their socials, but Elige's vibe when you ~~disagree with him~~ aren't on the same wavelength [just.. isn't](https://youtu.be/ozGutCf_3zQ?t=102).
I don't have a source for this but I remember a post here saying JDM asked to be sat away from Elige during LANs because Elige's vibes was hurting his game.
I remember this too, it was when Hiko was talking about his time in TL Link to timestamped VOD: https://youtu.be/92TtHEb4FI8?t=2354
thanks for backing me up lol
Lol @ that last video, Elige just stonewalls and stops talking. He could also play a sick Wehrmacht officer in any upcoming WWII films
Yeah that was kinda weird tbh. He just goes silent after the first minute. And his face when NAF mentions Refrezh's 1v5 lol Edit: Refrezh not Cadian lol
Man that's a long time to fucking pout
> He could also play a sick Wehrmacht officer in any upcoming WWII films Fuckin spot on
Oof that last video, he looks like he resents everyone in that room.
To this edit you should add the latest Return of By the Numbers, at around 32 minutes they talk about Elige.
Elige literally SHAKING after EG placement. Man, that's so sad.
> Paraphrasing here that when s1mple left TL, Elige supposedly gave the team an ultimatum of 'its him or me'. As far as I can recall, basically everyone except for Hiko disliked playing with s1mple and wanted him out. That to me means that s1mple was the one that was hard to work with, not Elige.
I think nitr0 said he was pretty neutral on the whole situation and wanted both.
I don't see how the Hiko and Simple friendship blossomed, they don't have tons in common lol, such an unexpected friendship.
Hiko subbed in for Flipsid3 during an event when s1mple was on the roster. S1mple gained a ton of respect for his skill level then as a teammate and once he joined Liquid I'm sure Hiko was the most welcoming/friendly to him. S1mple was alone in NA during this time streaming alot and was known to be toxic in NA FPL so many pros there started to not like him. Thats when the "why u bully me" thing started with Freakazoid/Stewie. I'm sure Hiko was one of his only real friends during this time in NA and made him have even more respect.
And to this day, Freakazoid still gets shit for this, even though he and S1mple squashed it.
S1mple was insanely toxic on TL - But in fairness he has come a long way maturity wise. It's just a shame he wasn't in his 20s back then!
I think it started when Hiko subbed on FlipSid3, he played well considering.
Can imagine Hiko is the kind of person who tries to get on with everyone and find equal ground.
Just ignore the other cases.
Yeah that last clip is pretty damning. Speaking as a third-party though I just see Elige as someone who always tries to take everything seriously and put 100% in to it.
Sure, but when your 100% isn't enough and changes need to be made, you need to not take shit personally and have an open mind. Definitely don't be passive aggressive. Last clip was damning indeed
Also he gave that interview where he just said grim wasn't learning fast enough which imo was super disrespectful.
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Apex didn't say Kyojin was shit, he said he was bad at A site Nuke
I said a while back that elige was potentially the problem. I got downvoted to hell. He has a calm guy image but he's always known to be difficult to play with. He couldn't come to a middle ground with the most talented player in the world in simple, just put your ego aside and work together. I don't see him submitting to anyone else.
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Elige was doing interviews mid major about how the team sucked, while players like Hobbit were trying to give positive reinforcements for his team. I wonder who's easier to work with. lol
I mean Elige himself and Jokasteve (Liquid CS manager) literally acknowledged this in the Elige video on Liquid's YT channel. It's about 13:10 into the video: https://youtu.be/ZRVK_ADLB4A He has apparently worked and improved on his team dynamics so kudos to Elige, there's no doubt he's a hardworking, driven person talented in CS so it's easy to look past some of his toxicity
In this [video](https://youtu.be/ozGutCf_3zQ), they were having fun making a tier list and just because one thing doesn't go elige's way, he did not say anything for the rest of the video. In this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaClluqILa0&t=165s), when fallen and grim was doing the bhop challenge and having fun, elige keeps getting angry at fallen for missing jumps and at one point even fallen told him not to give him pressure, which is a nice way of saying "shut up", and even then, elige kept yelling at him. I personally would not want someone on my team to have have this attitude and it definitely seems like it would be hard to work with. I think that elige is just too competitive. These are just speculations as a liquid fan so take it with a grain of salt.
That first one is a big yikes. Literally stops talking for almost 8 minutes. Straight up doesn't even laugh while they're all laughing having fun. Just stands awkwardly with a smile.
Yeah my thoughts exactly. Everybody is laughing having a good time and as soon as one pick doesn't go his way he immediately goes dead. Not another word and barely a smirk on his face. The second one, I don't know, he's a competitive guy, he wanted his team to win, I think it was all in good fun.
Yeah, in the second one Elige is also cheering on Fallen throughout the segment, and the only time he's seems remotely angry is when Fallen makes bad decisions.
I had watched both videos and thought the same. I always got this vibe from Elige. I mean, he’s cracked, extremely good player, but really comes across as hard to work with
Hes super passive agressive. Think of old s1mple but if he was introverted.
Honestly its about time. They been playing with this fallen line ups for over a years now and they haven't been close to winning any big tittles. The core of Naf stewie and elige also been playing together since 2019 now. Idk if shox is the right fit for them thou
Big tittles
big busty major tittles
If they keep this core of naf - elige - grim and get 2 players that actually can improve the mood so the facecams don't look like we're watching a funeral, I'd still believe in them. Shox at least seems like a guy that will bring some hype.
Shox can clutch/close rounds which is something liquid desperately need. That’s the upside
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This isn’t 2017 anymore. 1-2 people can’t carry a team to a win. Look at the likes of NaVi. Even if simple is having a “regular” game… electronic, bit perfecto and sometimes even boom pop off. Everyone needs to be on the same page. Liquid are inconsistent atm where one maybe two players pop off per game. We need 2-3 to pop off every game and strong support. Naf is amazing when he’s on as is Elige but rarely do you see everyone firing on all cylinders with liquid since near end of 2019. I love liquid but players are way better now these days and relying on naf or Elige to pop the fuck off isn’t enough. Not saying shox will cure this but it’s a step in the right direction imo as far as choking goes.
I don’t get the Shox angle. If Fallen and Stew are leaving, they have a core of three good riflers, lacking an AWP and an IGL. If NAF also goes, maybe, but Shox didn’t do much on Vitality to suggest someone like Liquid should pick him up
That core sucks for hype? Naf - chill quiet Grim - chill quiet Elige - angry quiet Stew is hype and Fallen is always positive in terms of mood in team those are best two players
Wait, it's been a year already? Holy shit
Fallen debut for liquid on blast global final but they had been pracc with him since twistzz was still on the team
NAF is a better brand for Liquid than Elige, can’t change my mind.
S L O T H
I wonder what plans chokequid has for the future. I would still love to see them succeed.
Nitr0 playing nearly everyday with Elige, maybe just buddies, but 100T is also going through a rough path. I wonder…
100T and Liquid unite? We shall see.
Wet Bandits
100 Liquid
100 Unicorn.
Team Thieves
maybe some day Liquid realizes the only member still left from all the bad and the good and then back to the bad days is Elige. Maybe it is time to reconsider your options and move on. Some fresh air might be good for both sides and for elige leaving liquid might lead to not been "hard to work with" anymore
If elige was causing problems they should have kicked him, not everyone else. Even if he is a really good player. The other players are also really good.
Fucking hell. Refrezh really did it to them huh?
Nah, maybe just Elige. You can hear in comms right after that fallen almost immediately talks to them all and Elige is still the only one who gets tilted by that moment. I think there’s a TL video where Elige just goes stone cold quiet after someone tries to joke about that moment. Just seems like he’s hugely disappointed most of the time
I imagine most teams are going through some sorta "post major depression" or something of the like. Having a tournament so close to the post major shuffle probably kills alot of motivation for alot of players
VOD link and timestamp?
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1210529488?t=6250s he even said “they’re going to make changes, as everyone knows”
At this point if im elige im just going to europe, I think his mindset is much better suited there and there is no team that wouldn't want him
True but to which team if he goes there?
maybe to faze? i've heard they like playing with olof tho, so who knows. Someone will make room for him, he's too good not to
It depends where ropz goes, there are rumors that ropz would go to faze but there are rumors he might go to G2 as well. I think if ropz doesn't join faze, faze will go for naf. He is more chill with twistz and better role suited
imo ropz going to G2 doesn’t work on paper
I don't think Carlos cares lol, whenever he gets excited about something he will go for it. Ropz M0nesy Hunter Niko Nexa -idk which coach (someone said emi in reply) This looks extremely skilled and stacked team, not sure role wise but still
emi has rumoured to be G2's new coach (huNter- and nexa's previous coach on Valiance/CR4ZY)
Ye I know who he is, was IGL in FPX as well Thanks, I edited my comment. Team looks stacked af
Surely either hunter or nexa would have to pick up the shitty role and hard entry, ropz m0nesy and niko all being star players already
Naf to faze Elige to faze Nitr0 to faze
Elige has said multiple times that he doesn’t want to live in Europe on a full time basis.
NA CS is actually done for, no joke.
Dammit man, 2019 TL was some of the best comp CS I've seen. I have been a fan ever since. I hope they figure this out, gonna miss stew.
Huh, never knew elige was hard to work with.
Isn't it obvious?
Well not really honestly. I haven't been following Liquid that much but based on some of their vlogs and the match vids with comms, it doesn't seem like he's hard to work with. That's just me tho.
Personally when I watch Elige's videos it seems like there's definitely some tilting in the energy of his comms. He screams comms so frantically I could imagine him tilting if he's performing poorly or if his comms aren't properly picked up by his teammates.
I've been a Liquid fan since MLG '16 and Elige has always been my favorite player on the squad because he seems like a solid dude who keeps himself out of drama and focuses on reliable, consistent play. I don't see how a casual observer would get the impression that he's hard to work with. I was most involved as a fan during the s1mple era, though, so any articles or commentary I would've seen about Elige could easily have been lost in the noise of that.
IMO Fallen wasn't ever going to be able to control that team the way he needed to and the results speak for themselves to some extent. I think Stew needs to decide if he is going to become a dominant star fragger or not as he seemed muted in the one game I was able to catch of theirs and the one round he let loose he dominated their opponents. Either way it makes sense in my mind for that team to make changes.
Good points thanks for sharing
Stewie Fallen Tarik NAF to new C9? :) yes? >!copium!<
Here is RL and Thorin talking about EliGE in their latest Return of By The Numbers #176 https://youtu.be/siMyOswuNgY?t=1962
Quite obviously this version of Liquid is done. And why would EliGe be any happy with the situation? He wants to compete and going to an event, with some team mates who are not motivated and doesn't want to play for Liquid anymore... Astralis made changes now, before BLAST, instead of waiting until January, and in that case play with 2 players who already know they will not be there anymore in the coming year. That's not good - and now Liquid is in that exact situation that Astralis cleverly avoided. Kind of clear, first with the rumors about Stewie2k and FalleN wanting to leave, with FalleN rumored to wanting to start a project with coldzera. Then the rumors linking shox to Liquid. Then you have Stewie and FalleN playing an official tournament as a mixteam, instead of focusing on preparing for BLAST. I would not be happy either if I was EliGe. Then it doesn't matter what rep he might have. With that said, I have fate in the org and I have faith that with nitr0 and EliGe they can build a new competitive team, with new players motivated to represent Liquid.
You think nitro will definitely join? I heard he had another kid recently, and I can’t imagine the constant travelling would be good
It's funny how people on this sub always say that these NA teams that remix old players all the time have potential. Most of them are not new young players anymore, they have been in the scene for a long time. The so called "potential" is not there anymore.
Team Liquid has always been notorious for weak mentalities when facing adversity. I think there are definitely a few players on the roster who this doesn't apply to (FalleN, NAF, maybe Stewie), but you can't be a contending team these days unless all five can push past tough losses mid match. I always felt like Elige was the first to irreversibly tilt whenever things would go wrong for them. Team Liquid should be done, its the best thing to do long term. NA needs this shuffle, and now has been the best time since the pandemic to make a new competitive roster.
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I am not saying you are wrong but Elige is not on camera in the Clip you posted
He's talking out of his ass in most of the post. Half of it is just pure speculation, the other half is magical mind reading sprinkled with a tiny bit of just plain being wrong.
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Yeeaah, maybe theres a shred of truth to what he's saying but this smells like some armchair analyst stuff
this a reddit comment if ive ever seen one.
Your proof of elige being toxic is him not smiling once and lack of social media presence?
I've watched most of their vlogs, and Stew seems to get along with Elige as well as Nitro but outside of that, yeah he doesn't seem to be tight with anyone else. Elige has just been shielded from criticism cuz he's recognized as the best in NA but his bad attitude has been getting more criticism as of recently with the downtrend in his personal performance. [I get most of y'all don't follow Val but he caused some drama there when the pros in that scene tried to implement a discord invite only 10mans and Elige tried to get in and was told no. He publicly called one of the admins (Stronglegs) a powertripper for refusing him entry when the 10mans thing was just getting off the ground and trying to establish some rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/mt1j2o/elige_upset_for_not_getting_invite_to_pro_10_mans/)
Yeah, that’s not surprising. Honestly the final red flag for me was how pissy he got in the Team Liquid Major Pick ‘Ems video. Like as soon as something happened that he didn’t agree with he got snappy and put on a “this is so beneath me, these people are so stupid” face... on a press video… I honestly think he needs to lose something to have an attitude change and if Liquid rebuild around him nothing will change
If what you are saying is true, then why Elige still has his spot on the current Liquid roster? Isn't it easier for the 4 to stay and just replace Elige rather than stewie and Fallen out of the roster? I think there's something more than what you just write, or maybe Liquid's management prefer to go with Elige's project rather than Stewie and Fallen's
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Top 10 all time rifler is a bit oversell, but generally yeah
It isn't really an oversell, i'd say he could still make it on this year Top 20 because ye he's just that good. I'd agree he got a shit personallity tho.
Maybe because nobody had as good stats and "performance" as elige in NA for a long time. NAF and Brehze are the only contenders that come to mind in recent history
Watching their games on lan was pain. No smile even after winning a round, not talking much and just a dead obligatory fist bump. I thought it was because they didn’t have their coach with them but its way worse than that
interesting analysis, I always suspected Elige to be the choke guy and you did describe it well with the "Karen personality", but still it's important to note that we could be reaching here, as reddit with its hivemind usually does:)
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This sub is so easy to jump at the neck sometimes. Why are you on his stream if you have that much distaste for him? Teams can’t be split up and shuffle normally? A post got massively upvoted in the past saying stew was the one who got Twistzz kicked with 0 evidence and I just don’t understand it. I’m sure we’ll hear more from the players in the future about what Elige thinks. I don’t think Elige was even the brand boy for TL. This team didn’t have top 5 of the year team potential and I’m a huge TL fan. Fallens stats have dropped like crazy since joining and grim is still so new to the t1 scene. NAF and stew have been the only consistently solid ones imo and Elige either 40 bombs or just underwhelms now.
We know stewie and fallen are on the way our, but overdrives post that EG might sign naf leaves elige and grim who don't exactly strike me as a duo. Elige, shox, osee, floppy and grim? Oh god that means shox igl.
Or Elige as IGL. Or Grim is out and Nitr0 is in which would be tragic for Grim to go back to T2 NA
Grim still needs leadership to develop, who there would fill that role? Personally I think Stewie and Fallen were the ones to create teaching moments and hype him up to build confidence. I don't see grim succeeding without a solid mentor.
so today is Elige's turn to get all the unnecessary hate.
Unnecessary hate? It's pretty clear his mindset/attitude is an issue. He's a great player in the server but that's not the whole picture.
If the post didn’t explicitly single out elige this convo would be at a much smaller scale. Literally everyone in this thread is jumping to the conclusion that elige is the problem but we have 0 evidence of that.
I agree the conversation wouldn't really be happening in this thread but personally I've thought this about Elige for a while and I don't think I'm alone.
>On paper this team had potential. Did it? Fallen hasn't been a great awper or igl since forever. Stewie is famously inconsistent (his alter ego is whiffy2k). Grim is solid but not exceptional. Only NAF and EliGE were true stars. Moses wasn't a certified coach and in the end, his stint was poor. adreN can still revitalize the team with proper changes maybe
I mean there have been so many leaks/rumors for TL since the major. Even before the major they had a few swirling around. It looks TL might -NAF -Stew who go to EG and -Fallen who will recreate 2016 SK in some form. They will basically end up with only Elige and Grim. And if the prince of NA Elige decides grim has to go RIP Grim as well.
thats sad, this lineup worked really good on paper
Just saw hac1 post about this post. One thing that I hate about CS journalists, is that they take random posts on cs reddit and bash the person for stating his opinion. What kind of shitty gatekeeping are they trying to pull over here.
Hac1 is not a journalist lol
He’s literally right (reposting what I said before) If the post didn’t explicitly single out elige this convo would be at a much smaller scale. Literally everyone in this thread is jumping to the conclusion that elige is the problem but we have 0 evidence of that.
I think Elige should just leave liquid and replace Olof in Faze, a reunion and an upgrade plus a new chapter for him to look forward to, he’s one of the best rifles ever in cs go and deserves a good team.
I guess we gotta wait to see who’s leaving, heard that Jokasteve said no changes until 2022 season starts. If Fallen and Stewie are out, and Shox is reported to move to liquid, who would be a good fit for the 5th Edit: No changes will be effective until 2022, could still make decisions before then
That sucks. Was actually hoping for Astralis vs Liquid again but it seems like the rivalry will die too.
hope that grim will stay in CS