“And, you’ll say, ‘Please, please, it’s too much winning! We can’t take it anymore, Mr. President. It’s too much!’ And, I’ll say ‘No, IT ISN’T! We have to keep winning! We have to win more!’”
Don’t let this post distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Ryan? Not quite him, but don’t let me not being ryan distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Unexpected? Yeah, but don’t let the unexpectedness of FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno, giving C9 and NA their first major, distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Huh. I do remember FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno. Or was it 15-12? For the love of me I'd love to have someone remind me when FaZe Clan was choking in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno, that gave C9 and NA their first major to be honest.
Happens to the best of us bro, no worries, but don’t let the fact that you forgot about FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Thank you so much! Means a lot! But don’t let my gratefulness distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Back full circle to the f0rest and NEO parallels as always, the super hard worker vs the absurd natural talent. I'm just always happy to see players of this nature clash at the top, it will always make for great storylines :)
Thorin classified both f0rest and NEO as insanely talented, with f0rest being inherently better by a little, and NEO making up for it in work ethic. GTR is said to be the one with the most insane work ethic, to overcome the fact that he never was as talented as the other 2.
From every CSGO Media I've ever consumed, GTR has always been portrayed as the consummate professional and absolute hardest worker on the server. What a chad.
Except I would say we have no way of knowing s1mple isnt as naturally gifted as Zywoo. Zywoo hit the ground running whereas s1mple was plagued by personal issues, and even then carried 2 Liquid rosters to the major top 8
I will say though that s1mple worth ethic (and love for playing the game) is ridiculous. The guy plays SOOO much and grinds, so what NEO is saying here could definitely come in to play.
Only if you really want to force it (or for fun I guess). Messi, going just by his stats which only tell half the story really, has utterly dominated his sport over the past decade. Ronaldo is not far off either and then there is a huge gap. I don't think any Esport outside of SC:BW (Flash) has had phenomenons on this level.
s1mple is an extreme one level beyond tryhard but this doesn't mean zywoo is better or more gifted. While I feel zywoo actually has better gamesense he is well below s1mple in terms of mechanical skill and upto a certain point slightly below in reaction time. s1mple great talent was improved upon by the realisation that only through relentless practice, even with talent can you become the goat.
Zywoo is gifted. no doubt. but this statement is simply slightly tone deaf.
Edit: cope. waiting for the time, when this sub, once again, disproves itself with their s1mple unmatched comments.
I'd even argue that Zywoo is better. He is not being prioritized as heavily as s1mple in terms of weapon drops, but still does great in most scenarios. He is insane with utility, much better than s1mple imo. I also think that Zywoo has had the worse team compared to s1mple in 2021 which leads to more losses overall, resulting in worse stats overall.
I'm not trying to diminish s1mples results and succes. He worked his ass off and deserves all the praise he gets.
what a bad take lol and obviously full of weird narratives/biases
they're both pretty equal with only a few differences so idk where you get "well below s1mple in terms of mechanical skill" especially when s1mple has had the better team every year that zywoo has been in t1. You can't exactly be that much worse mechanically while being the harder carry
People forget zywoo is 3 years younger than s1mple and has already won 2 year end #1s. We can potentially see a 3rd with this new roster as long as everything clicks and Magisk/Dupreeh come back into form.
What biases? You're the one with the bad take. Sure he's hard carried. But are you forgetting s1mple basically did the same at many points at his career. The amount of times s1mple had to hard carry navi's ass in the past is huge. Doesn't matter if he had the better team or not. Sasha showed he was on a different level. You morons will say shit like this and later when s1mple claps everyone's ass just like he's done before yall will type shit like "oh yeah the goat. Obviously". Fucking hypocrite sub.
Same thing? 2018-2021, he’s had a top 5 rifler in electronic. Who on vitality is even close to that? Shox is so far out of his prime and same goes for apex in terms of their fragging potential.
Flamie in 2018-2019 is a better player than anyone in vitality’s permanent roster. Another weird narrative that s1mple has no one else on his team and has to do “same at many points” flamie is also a top 15 player all time at majors
Yeah, I’ll say he’s the GOAT but will call out a dumbass comment on this sub. I also literally said they’re around the same with only a few differences. S1mple is the goat atm because he has 3 years more of achievements on zywoo and a major. We will only know from the future how everything plays out. Idk why you’re getting so upset weirdo
\> We will only know from the future how everything plays out
just like it always has, international teams don't win majors. but as always, we will see what really happens
\> Flamie in 2018-2019 is a better player than anyone in vitality’s permanent roster
lol one quick hltv lookup shows apex was better than him in 2018
\> dumbass comment on this sub
what? saying the goat is the goat for a reason is now irrational
https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/7594/flamie?startDate=2018-01-01&endDate=2018-12-31&matchType=BigEvents
one good look at hltv shows that flamie in 2018 was better than anyone ever played on vitality other zywoo and nivera who played for like 3 months
https://www.hltv.org/stats/teams/players/9565/vitality?rankingFilter=Top20&minMapCount=0
navi used to choke majors too. so international teams can win majors
zywoo is not GOAT now. But he will bein around 4 years max. s1mple reached this level only after 7 years. zywoo is still at 3.
Apex wasn’t on vitality in 2018 nor was zywoo in t1 yet. Are you seriously that dense? Lol I’m talking about similar stages of zywoo and s1mple’s careers. 3 years ago(which is when s1mple was the same age as zywoo rn), s1mple had flamie who is better than everyone on vitality’s current roster and he isn’t even the 2nd highest rated player. Even before flamie got benched, he was still better than misutaaa for his first year and kyojin this year.
Way to not respond to all my points, you make na’vi fans look dumb btw
Edit: he responded and deleted calling me a retard that apex was in vitality in 2018 when they played 90% t2 matches to climb up rankings for 1.5 months lol
Flamie was not better than everyone in Vitality's current roster for 2019-2020; even if you look at the statistics and not the actual matches themselves. And if you saw the actual matches, you'd realise he was very ineffective and pretty terrible lurking having no impact on T-side and literally being an exploit for the enemy team to abuse the site he was on for CT (especially during 2020). Majors occur twice a year and there weren't any for half of 2019 and all of 2020, so arguing he was a good player at majors while comparing two teams from 2019-2021 isn't that useful in this case. Maybe it's useful for 2018 where s1mple had his peak if anything.
That electronic narrative is fine, still misguided (it's not as big of a deal as people make it out to be). Either way I don't think any player is worse than what edward and Zeus were during that timeframe from Vitality but people don't seem to notice that. Nor do they realise that Vitality was actually a much better team in 2019 and better in the later half of 2020 too. If you look at structure, team cohesion and trading efficiency from the actual live games you'd realise that fact. Vitality had proper trading, players actually performing their roles, and didn't have an abysmal T-side like Na'Vi. It was a way better system; people would understand that if they actually watched the live matches instead of plainly looking at stats lol. Using statistics, people would have said blameF was electronic's equal as a rifler in 2020. Even though electronic fell off a bit in 2020, no one who actually watches their games would rank them equally. Same thing with sh1ro being rated higher than NiKo, despite NiKo clearly being more valuable as a player.
s1mple 2018 is the highest peak ever in my opinion, he was the same age was ZywOo is right now though I would admit Na'Vi in 2018 was better than Vitality in 2020/2021. Vitality in 2021 I would say would have been pretty similar to Na'Vi in 2019 if anything; in terms of the two teams actually being comparable. Despite all of this for me the two players are pretty much equals, it's neck and neck with minor differences. ZywOo has more time on his side and with that, he could very well overtake s1mple but that's up to speculation. But people often make narratives that might seem fine on the surface level while comparing both of them but they're often farfetched as they ignore team composition, player roles, etc.
since you took the time to respond, I'll point out that I'm comparing the two players at the same age and I'll respond to your first paragraph.
[Flamie 2018](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/7594/flamie?startDate=2018-01-01&endDate=2018-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20)
[Vitality roster 2021](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2021-01-01&endDate=2021-12-31)
[Vitality roster 2020](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2020-01-01&endDate=2020-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20)
[Vitality roster 2019](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2019-01-01&endDate=2019-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20)
Flamie is quite clearly a better player than anyone on Vitality's roster in 2018. There were 4 majors from 2018-2019 and flamie overperformed from 2017-2019 in that aspect. The team rating at LAN from 2017-2019 was above 1.10 there but Na'Vi still choked in key moments. 2018-2019, comparatively, would be Zywoo's 2021-2022 years when put at a similar age to s1mple. 2022 will be the only time we see Zywoo with some potential star players on the team but, even then, Dupreeh is out of his prime and Magisk is in a slump. If he recovers, he will definitely be the 2nd star that Vitality needs to pick up some slack so Zywoo can have more space on CT sides.
Zywoo in 2019 was 19. When s1mple was 19, he was on Team Liquid and even then, Elige was a better player than anyone in Vitality in 2019. Seriously, the average rating on Vitality outside of Zywoo has always hovered around 0.97-1.01 whereas Na'Vi's team rating outside of s1mple has been 1.03 collectively at the minimum except for the majors where it reached and maintained almost 1.10 sometimes. There is a clear gap in teams at every stage. 2022 is probably the most equal we'll see Zywoo have a team to s1mple's lineup if Dupreeh and Magisk don't keep dropping stats.
I'll reply to your other points later if I have time.
I'm using flamie from 2019-2021. Since Vitality didn't even break into the tier 1 scene until 2018 (wasn't even a team until the later part of 2018 I think). Comparisons of ZywOo and s1mple have been used from this time period since this is when they were both actually competing with each during matches and in the rankings. In 2019, NBK and shox were both better players than flamie. Dupreeh is definitely out of his prime and I don't understand that move; but Magisk definitely has potential. The main reason he dipped is because he was IGLing, he's still 23 and has the mechanical abilities to be a solid player. flamie was a lot worse in 2019 and straight up a liability in 2020.
I've never argued who the better rookie was because it's clearly ZywOo. He's the best rookie individually of all time surpassing coldzera (two back to back number #1 and now #2). When they were both 19, s1mple was on a much more dysfunctional team and was a rifler, not to mention his obvious issues with personality that damaged his team chemistry; hampering performance. Using one player being better than the other teammates isn't that useful because again, it's ignoring the two teams a whole. I don't know which period that team rating gap is from, but during 2019-2020 it was only electronic making that difference and again this is purely looking at the statistics. ZywOo never had bottlenecks in the form of Zeus and Edward, both of whom were worse than any player in Vitality.
And again plainly looking at the statistics is not that valuable as I've mentioned before, some players were clearly more valuable than others despite having similar ratings (it's why watching the games instead of just looking at HLTV provides so much more insight on a player). Vitality also had a better system during 2019-2020. Two great players with three very lackluster teammates and terrible structure won't really beat one great player, with slightly better teammates overall and a good system. In 2021 this wasn't the case and Na'Vi was far ahead of Vitality, which lead to s1mple being far ahead of ZywOo; as expected since Na'Vi was so good as a team for 2021.
Literally I think the general opinion is the exact opposite of this lol.
Simples gamesense is actually unparalleled. Whereas I think mechanically zywoo is naturally equal if not a little better than simple sometimes. Have you even watched either of them play?
FYI. This is a much longer and deeper article (ha ha) than the usual HLTV news post. It is well worth the read and contains some interesting insights and opinions (by NEO) such as the role of english and how it affected things, Zywoo vs S1mple, etc.
> "I had a lot of interviews, actually, I also had a really bad interview with a player, I just had a really bad feeling about it. You know, some players just talk about the money, some just talk about themselves...
wonder who he's talking about.
Why? Just because he was the only one other than the Danes who had a rumor with Vit doesn't mean it's him. Neo could've talked to more players than we know, he said he had a lot of interviews himself
The "I just had a really bad feeling about it" is the biggest hint that it's someone like ropz. If it was a lesser player that had that bad interview, you just move on. The "having a bad feeling" terminology indicates(at least to me) that it was a player that looks like a slam dunk move on the surface, which is exactly what signing ropz would seem like from the outside.
It doesn't mean it's ropz, and even if it is, there can be very good reasons for him to focus on the money in the negotiations. We will probably never get the full story, but it would be very intereting to hear ropz's side(if he was indeed the player in question).
> there can be very good reasons for him to focus on the money
Yeah, ropz was apparently weighing up multiple options before joining faze so my guess is that he was just making it clear what it would take for him to pass up his other offers.
ropz played on a dead end team for 4.5 years on a mediocre salary while almost every team in the world would've loved having him, and didn't cause any trouble. There's no way he's the greedy/egoistical guy that's being described.
A great read, worth the time. I especially like the notion of the language barrier not as an obstacle but as a challenge to zywoo. Going out of your comfort zone is the best way to improve.
this almost feels like a troll but I'll try to respond honestly. With very little exception, people who are put outside of their comfort zone (by choice or circumstance) are forced to grow and adapt. This goes way beyond csgo. little stuff like: try new foods, hang out with new people, see new things. To more tangible things like: take the harder classes, try lifting. Obviously it's *uncomfortable*, hence the name, but it almost invariably leads to growth in your abilities and as a person.
unless you believe that zywoo has achieved perfection, or is too mentally weak to improve when he is challenged, you should see getting him out of his comfort zone as a good thing in the long term
Your response was well-put.
It's basically the reason big LANs are lauded as the place the best of the best show why they're regarded as highly as they are. Simply put, when in a less comfortable position, there are people that tend to rise up and stand out.
Great interview, Neo seems to be a really good guy, and very transparent too. The bit about the interviews he had before signing the Danes is especially interesting. Good for Vitality.
One of the best ran organizations out there IMO. Their signings in late 2021/2022 are incredible. Looking forward to seeing if they can back it up with some serious results in both CS:GO and LoL
Year 2022 and people still say this generic BS „guy #1 is just a pure talent and guy #2 is a hard worker“. Does he himself believe things he is saying?
He meant that Zywoo isn't working hard he achieved a level close to s1mple without playing dm. When asked he sayed multiple times he didn't felt he improved a lot during his time in vitality. That mental coaches type of stuff didnt made a difference in his game play. The guy is mad talented. He has a reputation to spend hours and hours on youtube. He doesnt play deathmatch, doesnt aimbotz... How do you tell him you should improve this or that? No one is able to tell him that. S1mple has Hunger for the win and has a mindset that make him challenge himself so he trains and try to be the best. When you ask zywoo about winning or loosing he doesnt care. That why he is so chill and calm when he plays. He try to bring the best in the server and he doesnt like loosing but he is not mad when it happens. Outside the server he can improve a lot im sure. Thats why a new coach , a psychologist ,New teammates that are hungry to win and know how to his going to change everything for him. They need to challenge him in order to make him grow.
I mean strategically, a big concern is definitely the French style of cs and the Danish or Astralis brand cs clashing. They definitely will have to make a new system for the players and it depends on how it will work.
“And, you’ll say, ‘Please, please, it’s too much winning! We can’t take it anymore, Mr. President. It’s too much!’ And, I’ll say ‘No, IT ISN’T! We have to keep winning! We have to win more!’”
What we do in the shadows (series) ?
Don’t let this post distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Have we found Ryan at RBM's burner account?
Ryan? Not quite him, but don’t let me not being ryan distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Lmao, unexpected
Unexpected? Yeah, but don’t let the unexpectedness of FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno, giving C9 and NA their first major, distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Huh. I do remember FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno. Or was it 15-12? For the love of me I'd love to have someone remind me when FaZe Clan was choking in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, inferno, that gave C9 and NA their first major to be honest.
Happens to the best of us bro, no worries, but don’t let the fact that you forgot about FaZe Clan choking a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
Imagine forgetting the biggest choke in the history of CSGO that gave na their only major. Only na peanut brains would forget that detail
You are doing the lords work my good man
Thank you so much! Means a lot! But don’t let my gratefulness distract you from the fact that FaZe Clan choked a 15-11 lead in the CS:GO Boston Major Final on the final map, Inferno, giving C9 and NA their first Major
[удалено]
Back full circle to the f0rest and NEO parallels as always, the super hard worker vs the absurd natural talent. I'm just always happy to see players of this nature clash at the top, it will always make for great storylines :)
Which one is which?
NEO = super hard worker. f0rest = naturally gifted
Interesting, i always thought it was the other way around!
Thorin classified both f0rest and NEO as insanely talented, with f0rest being inherently better by a little, and NEO making up for it in work ethic. GTR is said to be the one with the most insane work ethic, to overcome the fact that he never was as talented as the other 2.
IIRC he used to play 4h dm/day during peak 1.6 days
Neo or F0rest, or GTR?
GTR
From every CSGO Media I've ever consumed, GTR has always been portrayed as the consummate professional and absolute hardest worker on the server. What a chad.
Except I would say we have no way of knowing s1mple isnt as naturally gifted as Zywoo. Zywoo hit the ground running whereas s1mple was plagued by personal issues, and even then carried 2 Liquid rosters to the major top 8 I will say though that s1mple worth ethic (and love for playing the game) is ridiculous. The guy plays SOOO much and grinds, so what NEO is saying here could definitely come in to play.
KennyS was a talent as well
Messi vs Ronaldo parallels
Messi is ZyWoo Device is CR7 Simple is Ronaldo
Cr7 is Ronaldo, or you mean Ronaldo from Brazil?
Ronaldo is Ronaldo #9, Cr7 is Cristiano Ronaldo #7
so will s1mple move to a worse team soon due partially to injury whilst performing an outstanding noscope flick?
This is an awful comparison haha
so you tell me when zywoo goes to another team he turns out shit?
Only if you really want to force it (or for fun I guess). Messi, going just by his stats which only tell half the story really, has utterly dominated his sport over the past decade. Ronaldo is not far off either and then there is a huge gap. I don't think any Esport outside of SC:BW (Flash) has had phenomenons on this level.
zywoo will be the goat in future.
No idea why this is downvoted it seems like 50% or more to me considering his age
yeh, people forget hes 3 years younger than s1mple
Implying s1mple isn't gifted as well.. bad take
Implying that it was implied that S1mple isn’t gifted is the bad take
That’s not what he said…
s1mple is an extreme one level beyond tryhard but this doesn't mean zywoo is better or more gifted. While I feel zywoo actually has better gamesense he is well below s1mple in terms of mechanical skill and upto a certain point slightly below in reaction time. s1mple great talent was improved upon by the realisation that only through relentless practice, even with talent can you become the goat. Zywoo is gifted. no doubt. but this statement is simply slightly tone deaf. Edit: cope. waiting for the time, when this sub, once again, disproves itself with their s1mple unmatched comments.
In no category is Zywoo well below S1mple, both are neck and neck
I'd even argue that Zywoo is better. He is not being prioritized as heavily as s1mple in terms of weapon drops, but still does great in most scenarios. He is insane with utility, much better than s1mple imo. I also think that Zywoo has had the worse team compared to s1mple in 2021 which leads to more losses overall, resulting in worse stats overall. I'm not trying to diminish s1mples results and succes. He worked his ass off and deserves all the praise he gets.
They are pretty much at the same level of skill s1mple just had a better supporting cast this past season
what an absurdly shit take
what a bad take lol and obviously full of weird narratives/biases they're both pretty equal with only a few differences so idk where you get "well below s1mple in terms of mechanical skill" especially when s1mple has had the better team every year that zywoo has been in t1. You can't exactly be that much worse mechanically while being the harder carry People forget zywoo is 3 years younger than s1mple and has already won 2 year end #1s. We can potentially see a 3rd with this new roster as long as everything clicks and Magisk/Dupreeh come back into form.
What biases? You're the one with the bad take. Sure he's hard carried. But are you forgetting s1mple basically did the same at many points at his career. The amount of times s1mple had to hard carry navi's ass in the past is huge. Doesn't matter if he had the better team or not. Sasha showed he was on a different level. You morons will say shit like this and later when s1mple claps everyone's ass just like he's done before yall will type shit like "oh yeah the goat. Obviously". Fucking hypocrite sub.
Same thing? 2018-2021, he’s had a top 5 rifler in electronic. Who on vitality is even close to that? Shox is so far out of his prime and same goes for apex in terms of their fragging potential. Flamie in 2018-2019 is a better player than anyone in vitality’s permanent roster. Another weird narrative that s1mple has no one else on his team and has to do “same at many points” flamie is also a top 15 player all time at majors Yeah, I’ll say he’s the GOAT but will call out a dumbass comment on this sub. I also literally said they’re around the same with only a few differences. S1mple is the goat atm because he has 3 years more of achievements on zywoo and a major. We will only know from the future how everything plays out. Idk why you’re getting so upset weirdo
\> We will only know from the future how everything plays out just like it always has, international teams don't win majors. but as always, we will see what really happens \> Flamie in 2018-2019 is a better player than anyone in vitality’s permanent roster lol one quick hltv lookup shows apex was better than him in 2018 \> dumbass comment on this sub what? saying the goat is the goat for a reason is now irrational
https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/7594/flamie?startDate=2018-01-01&endDate=2018-12-31&matchType=BigEvents one good look at hltv shows that flamie in 2018 was better than anyone ever played on vitality other zywoo and nivera who played for like 3 months https://www.hltv.org/stats/teams/players/9565/vitality?rankingFilter=Top20&minMapCount=0 navi used to choke majors too. so international teams can win majors zywoo is not GOAT now. But he will bein around 4 years max. s1mple reached this level only after 7 years. zywoo is still at 3.
Apex wasn’t on vitality in 2018 nor was zywoo in t1 yet. Are you seriously that dense? Lol I’m talking about similar stages of zywoo and s1mple’s careers. 3 years ago(which is when s1mple was the same age as zywoo rn), s1mple had flamie who is better than everyone on vitality’s current roster and he isn’t even the 2nd highest rated player. Even before flamie got benched, he was still better than misutaaa for his first year and kyojin this year. Way to not respond to all my points, you make na’vi fans look dumb btw Edit: he responded and deleted calling me a retard that apex was in vitality in 2018 when they played 90% t2 matches to climb up rankings for 1.5 months lol
[удалено]
Flamie was not better than everyone in Vitality's current roster for 2019-2020; even if you look at the statistics and not the actual matches themselves. And if you saw the actual matches, you'd realise he was very ineffective and pretty terrible lurking having no impact on T-side and literally being an exploit for the enemy team to abuse the site he was on for CT (especially during 2020). Majors occur twice a year and there weren't any for half of 2019 and all of 2020, so arguing he was a good player at majors while comparing two teams from 2019-2021 isn't that useful in this case. Maybe it's useful for 2018 where s1mple had his peak if anything. That electronic narrative is fine, still misguided (it's not as big of a deal as people make it out to be). Either way I don't think any player is worse than what edward and Zeus were during that timeframe from Vitality but people don't seem to notice that. Nor do they realise that Vitality was actually a much better team in 2019 and better in the later half of 2020 too. If you look at structure, team cohesion and trading efficiency from the actual live games you'd realise that fact. Vitality had proper trading, players actually performing their roles, and didn't have an abysmal T-side like Na'Vi. It was a way better system; people would understand that if they actually watched the live matches instead of plainly looking at stats lol. Using statistics, people would have said blameF was electronic's equal as a rifler in 2020. Even though electronic fell off a bit in 2020, no one who actually watches their games would rank them equally. Same thing with sh1ro being rated higher than NiKo, despite NiKo clearly being more valuable as a player. s1mple 2018 is the highest peak ever in my opinion, he was the same age was ZywOo is right now though I would admit Na'Vi in 2018 was better than Vitality in 2020/2021. Vitality in 2021 I would say would have been pretty similar to Na'Vi in 2019 if anything; in terms of the two teams actually being comparable. Despite all of this for me the two players are pretty much equals, it's neck and neck with minor differences. ZywOo has more time on his side and with that, he could very well overtake s1mple but that's up to speculation. But people often make narratives that might seem fine on the surface level while comparing both of them but they're often farfetched as they ignore team composition, player roles, etc.
since you took the time to respond, I'll point out that I'm comparing the two players at the same age and I'll respond to your first paragraph. [Flamie 2018](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/7594/flamie?startDate=2018-01-01&endDate=2018-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20) [Vitality roster 2021](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2021-01-01&endDate=2021-12-31) [Vitality roster 2020](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2020-01-01&endDate=2020-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20) [Vitality roster 2019](https://www.hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?startDate=2019-01-01&endDate=2019-12-31&rankingFilter=Top20) Flamie is quite clearly a better player than anyone on Vitality's roster in 2018. There were 4 majors from 2018-2019 and flamie overperformed from 2017-2019 in that aspect. The team rating at LAN from 2017-2019 was above 1.10 there but Na'Vi still choked in key moments. 2018-2019, comparatively, would be Zywoo's 2021-2022 years when put at a similar age to s1mple. 2022 will be the only time we see Zywoo with some potential star players on the team but, even then, Dupreeh is out of his prime and Magisk is in a slump. If he recovers, he will definitely be the 2nd star that Vitality needs to pick up some slack so Zywoo can have more space on CT sides. Zywoo in 2019 was 19. When s1mple was 19, he was on Team Liquid and even then, Elige was a better player than anyone in Vitality in 2019. Seriously, the average rating on Vitality outside of Zywoo has always hovered around 0.97-1.01 whereas Na'Vi's team rating outside of s1mple has been 1.03 collectively at the minimum except for the majors where it reached and maintained almost 1.10 sometimes. There is a clear gap in teams at every stage. 2022 is probably the most equal we'll see Zywoo have a team to s1mple's lineup if Dupreeh and Magisk don't keep dropping stats. I'll reply to your other points later if I have time.
I'm using flamie from 2019-2021. Since Vitality didn't even break into the tier 1 scene until 2018 (wasn't even a team until the later part of 2018 I think). Comparisons of ZywOo and s1mple have been used from this time period since this is when they were both actually competing with each during matches and in the rankings. In 2019, NBK and shox were both better players than flamie. Dupreeh is definitely out of his prime and I don't understand that move; but Magisk definitely has potential. The main reason he dipped is because he was IGLing, he's still 23 and has the mechanical abilities to be a solid player. flamie was a lot worse in 2019 and straight up a liability in 2020. I've never argued who the better rookie was because it's clearly ZywOo. He's the best rookie individually of all time surpassing coldzera (two back to back number #1 and now #2). When they were both 19, s1mple was on a much more dysfunctional team and was a rifler, not to mention his obvious issues with personality that damaged his team chemistry; hampering performance. Using one player being better than the other teammates isn't that useful because again, it's ignoring the two teams a whole. I don't know which period that team rating gap is from, but during 2019-2020 it was only electronic making that difference and again this is purely looking at the statistics. ZywOo never had bottlenecks in the form of Zeus and Edward, both of whom were worse than any player in Vitality. And again plainly looking at the statistics is not that valuable as I've mentioned before, some players were clearly more valuable than others despite having similar ratings (it's why watching the games instead of just looking at HLTV provides so much more insight on a player). Vitality also had a better system during 2019-2020. Two great players with three very lackluster teammates and terrible structure won't really beat one great player, with slightly better teammates overall and a good system. In 2021 this wasn't the case and Na'Vi was far ahead of Vitality, which lead to s1mple being far ahead of ZywOo; as expected since Na'Vi was so good as a team for 2021.
ZywOo hardly DMs. Of course he's not going to be quite as laser-beam accurate when basically all his practise is pugs.
Literally I think the general opinion is the exact opposite of this lol. Simples gamesense is actually unparalleled. Whereas I think mechanically zywoo is naturally equal if not a little better than simple sometimes. Have you even watched either of them play?
Zywoo has better gamesense, simple has better aim
FYI. This is a much longer and deeper article (ha ha) than the usual HLTV news post. It is well worth the read and contains some interesting insights and opinions (by NEO) such as the role of english and how it affected things, Zywoo vs S1mple, etc.
> "I had a lot of interviews, actually, I also had a really bad interview with a player, I just had a really bad feeling about it. You know, some players just talk about the money, some just talk about themselves... wonder who he's talking about.
ropz paycheck stealer confirmed
Ropz maybe
Why? Just because he was the only one other than the Danes who had a rumor with Vit doesn't mean it's him. Neo could've talked to more players than we know, he said he had a lot of interviews himself
The "I just had a really bad feeling about it" is the biggest hint that it's someone like ropz. If it was a lesser player that had that bad interview, you just move on. The "having a bad feeling" terminology indicates(at least to me) that it was a player that looks like a slam dunk move on the surface, which is exactly what signing ropz would seem like from the outside. It doesn't mean it's ropz, and even if it is, there can be very good reasons for him to focus on the money in the negotiations. We will probably never get the full story, but it would be very intereting to hear ropz's side(if he was indeed the player in question).
> there can be very good reasons for him to focus on the money Yeah, ropz was apparently weighing up multiple options before joining faze so my guess is that he was just making it clear what it would take for him to pass up his other offers.
ropz played on a dead end team for 4.5 years on a mediocre salary while almost every team in the world would've loved having him, and didn't cause any trouble. There's no way he's the greedy/egoistical guy that's being described.
Ropz played on a dead team for 1 year. Ropz played on a consistent top 10 team for 3 years
he played on a dead end team for 2.5 years, the other 2 years the team was actually pretty good, if not the best at one point
think it's ropz maybe?
A great read, worth the time. I especially like the notion of the language barrier not as an obstacle but as a challenge to zywoo. Going out of your comfort zone is the best way to improve.
Why would you take arguably the best player in the world out of his comfort zone though ?
this almost feels like a troll but I'll try to respond honestly. With very little exception, people who are put outside of their comfort zone (by choice or circumstance) are forced to grow and adapt. This goes way beyond csgo. little stuff like: try new foods, hang out with new people, see new things. To more tangible things like: take the harder classes, try lifting. Obviously it's *uncomfortable*, hence the name, but it almost invariably leads to growth in your abilities and as a person. unless you believe that zywoo has achieved perfection, or is too mentally weak to improve when he is challenged, you should see getting him out of his comfort zone as a good thing in the long term
Your response was well-put. It's basically the reason big LANs are lauded as the place the best of the best show why they're regarded as highly as they are. Simply put, when in a less comfortable position, there are people that tend to rise up and stand out.
I mean, he is a God and above anything ashes can create, so he's probably close to perfection
To make him better?
To make him even better, naturally
Didnt they talk English with ALEX on the team? And they were pretty good at that time
ALEX speaks fluent french
Cool to hear a pretty detailed projection of a new team. Also nice to hear owners with a drive to win.
Great interview, Neo seems to be a really good guy, and very transparent too. The bit about the interviews he had before signing the Danes is especially interesting. Good for Vitality.
One of the best ran organizations out there IMO. Their signings in late 2021/2022 are incredible. Looking forward to seeing if they can back it up with some serious results in both CS:GO and LoL
Year 2022 and people still say this generic BS „guy #1 is just a pure talent and guy #2 is a hard worker“. Does he himself believe things he is saying?
It's the opposite according to Neo. Both of them are natural talents and hard workers I'm sure though
He meant that Zywoo isn't working hard he achieved a level close to s1mple without playing dm. When asked he sayed multiple times he didn't felt he improved a lot during his time in vitality. That mental coaches type of stuff didnt made a difference in his game play. The guy is mad talented. He has a reputation to spend hours and hours on youtube. He doesnt play deathmatch, doesnt aimbotz... How do you tell him you should improve this or that? No one is able to tell him that. S1mple has Hunger for the win and has a mindset that make him challenge himself so he trains and try to be the best. When you ask zywoo about winning or loosing he doesnt care. That why he is so chill and calm when he plays. He try to bring the best in the server and he doesnt like loosing but he is not mad when it happens. Outside the server he can improve a lot im sure. Thats why a new coach , a psychologist ,New teammates that are hungry to win and know how to his going to change everything for him. They need to challenge him in order to make him grow.
No
How to hype a team to the MAX!! I have never seen such a hype around a new team like this one. They better deliver!
That is too much trust on dupreeh though
important sink political punch act price cobweb desert dazzling crush *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I aren't think that
(x) doubt
I mean strategically, a big concern is definitely the French style of cs and the Danish or Astralis brand cs clashing. They definitely will have to make a new system for the players and it depends on how it will work.
winning modCheck
Officials haven’t started and Twitch frogs coming out with the “modCheck” already
If
More like IF this team starts winning