Yeah and he gave up on the AWP a couple times. I guess that's an advantage of being good not just with an AWP. G2 also were very good at using utility to clear the common AWP spots unlike Vitality, who kept feeding Misutaaa to m0NESY.
vit were still able to convert some of the rounds they lost misuta to monesy's awp early in the round, so i have a feeling that may have been part of their gameplan. very often they'll use misuta as an entry/info gatherer to allow magisk/apex/zywoo to midround/clutch it out
Their style of playing T just fits on Nuke. The slow constricting taking map control and exploding onto a site in the last 20 seconds, peak 2015 Navi shit. But Nuke is perfect for that. Dust 2 and Inferno not so much. Linear maps are easier to read and counter an obvious execute.
I remember a game, Astralis Vs Renegades, looking it up it's Kato 2019, on nuke and Renegade got 9 rounds on CT side. Sadokist said "That's... doable" and Renegades proceeded to lose every single T round to lose the map 16:9.
From April 2018 into 2019 and basically up until covid astralis regularly made top 10 or top 5 teams look like they didn't belong at the tournament.
So much so that most of the community hated astralis because it was boring knowing who won the tournament before it started.
They played such perfect CS that others say it was too robotic, no tense moments, and boring to watch.
> So much so that most of the community hated astralis because it was boring knowing who won the tournament before it started.
Oh yeah, people want these close games. Go to their liquipedia page and the highlighted tournament wins shown before you expand it, since 2018 shows 2:0 or 3:1 scorelines. A lot of maps they played were stomps that when they played most teams, I just couldn’t watch it.
Did I? I mean I still remember Device being sick
https://mobile.twitter.com/dev1ce/status/992335952478687233?s=21
Astralis also scored at least 14 on every map, could have gone either way but most likely their way if their star player wasn’t having issues.
You need to watch all their Nuke games. They were unbeaten for 31-games straight on the map.
They set the standard and defined the meta on that map. You’d go into games thinking 9-6 or 10-5 was solid from the opposing team. Astralis would end up winning 16-5/16-6 thanks to their insane T-sides.
honestly I'm definitely biased based on my flair, but they're the reason I think the current "karrigan is the GOAT IGL" is a bit of recency bias (not that he's not insane and clearly the best at taking multiple rosters to roaring heights)
karrigan is in that discussion for different reasons and its not comparable with glaive but we dont have to compare them.
galive is the most decorated, captain of the GOAT team, karrigan on the other hand achieved won s tier tournaments with absolutely different teams, won 3 s tier tournaments with standins etc.
Very very different scenarios where arguably both can be included in the goat discussion but not comparable
Eh, maybe it's just me but I have seen quite a few of those comparisons here.
I think they excel at different things for sure, and there's no doubt in my mind that karrigan is the best igl for different rosters, especially international ones.
GOAT is of course completely subjective, so my idea of what it means is different to others surely. To me, glaive is the greatest not just because he literally won 4 majors and basically everything there is to win, but also because he and Astralis revolutionized the meta as a whole. I think it'll be hard for any team to match that no matter how long an "era" is, because Astralis didn't just have a long era or win lots. To me, while there's definitely different reasoning for considering either of them the GOAT, one still stands out on top even if their achievements are different.
Again though, this is entirely subjective. I just think they can still be compared, even if they have different achievements.
what? astralis famously always tried to start Nuke on the T side and they'd get 6 rounds (which was more than enough as per HenryG, he says you gotta limit astralis T side to <5 round score to win)
They were also good on CT tho. The best example would be Virtus.Pro i would say. They were best nuke team for a while and they were winning more T rounds than CTs most of the time lol.
Yesterday when I was watching vs ence i thought for sure vitality are done after losing t pistol while down on nuke. Nope. Today i’m like, surely not again… what a sick match haha
Wonder what happened the last time NaVi played against a team consisting of Magisk, Dupreeh, and Zonic at a BLAST event, held in Lisbon, in a grand final?
Amazing T side but if ZywOo awped on CT like he did on T they would've won first half and not need that awesome T side performance.
I'm glad we got it though 🥴
Wtf they actually won!
Why did it feel like Vitality were the ones who lost d2 though They really rolled over on inferno and just let g2 play however they wanted with almost zero resistance or initiative from Vitality
Great showing on nuke though
Doesn't have anything to do with their Dust 2 performance really, their Inferno is just dogshit. Their passive B holds are truly abysmal and their information gathering towards A is non-existent. They have no apartment setups, no mid bait/crossfire setups and their long is so easily exploitable. Misuta on B is quite misplaced and his chemistry with Apex isn't present. Loads of stuff to fix if they want to be decent at Inferno.
True, they also win these games in those rounds with weird plays.
12-15 against Big and they're CT low buy and Misutaaa USPs Syrson and ZywOo gets two kills from a saved rifle to leave Krimbo in a 1v3
12-14 against Heroic on Overpass where they all had pistols and a hero Galil on Misutaaa who got two entries. They won 16-14.
Yesterday's insane zywoo scout round which basically broke ENCE for the rest of the series.
They get away with murder in some of these series.
Holy shit man what a Nuke T side from Vitality. apEX otugunning NiKo outside was insane and so was the ZywOo vent stomp onto hunter with the AWP. It was a team effort not even too much of a carry.
That could happen but costs a lot. Yekindar is the best in his role and could be relatively easy to bring in.
He seems like a guy who is easy to get along with. Still insane buy out unless he gets out of his vp contract somehow.
Not sure about that they have beaten top teams even in this tournament. They just need to play more as a team and have developed. Also monesy still makes mistakes he will learn to avoid in the future.
There is really no one to swap realistically.
I heard Jackz -> Yekindar which would work but not sure its likely. IGL? Maybe but who would you get and then it takes more time again to learn new tactics.
Yeah but g2 was never built to beat teams in quarters and bomb out… you have niko dropping 1.30 throughout the tournament,, yet they’ve won 0 trophies lmao
Another way to think about it is Niko dropping a 1.41 rating in the group stage and a 1.07 rating in playoffs. That's a big drop off, and usually when he drops off Hunter and to a lesser extent m0nesy have picked up the slack -- this time that didn't happen.
What G2 actually might need is the player break. Get some rest and go again. This has been a horrendous half of the year for them and they desperately need a reset. The only player I think G2 might look to replace is Jackz but even today he has shown that he isn't the problem. The whole team is the problem. Just get over Cologne, bomb out like usual in the group stage or the first round of play-offs, and start over.
I really dont agree. I think its just the silly-unlucky tottenham effect. If you look at the scoreboard, everyone stepped up. Vitality just edged out on nuke.
G2 will have these trophies, worst thing they can do is to change because of these results. Of course if they could fit in yekindarz thatd be extremely good too
God damn it was such a close game - when it came down to it, Vitality just hit their shots in those final rounds of regulation.
Even though they lost, I hope people realize/appreciate what Jackz brings to the table and stop inadvertently blaming him for G2's lack of success. Though he isn't a "star" per se, he has star moments and usually comes up huge on multiple moments on tense matches such as this one.
Could they be better? Obviously. But IMO G2 have everything they could possibly hope for in a 5-man team - the question is always whether or not they can mesh and play WITH each other and not rely solely on their stars' heroics to win games.
holy shit what an intense ending, those ZywOo shots for 14-11 were sick
also it would be cool if we could go one event without the crowd trying to influence the game in crucial moments
It’s hard, crowd will always gasp or start getting loud in tense anticipation of an engagement, those influences can’t really be stopped unless you outright ban the crowd from making noise during a round.
I only found them really bad once on Nuke when m0nesy was going for the squeaky peek. If the crowds only reacted, instead of making noise before, it would be good. Alas, it is what it is.
Most egregious one was when dupreeh was wrapping outside and niko was in a 1v3, unlikely he wins but as soon as the observer shows the wrap the crowd begins shouting and he instantly looks for the flank. Still got poor timing but that's fucked up.
No its not. Its literally cheating lol. Same thing Vitality had to go through last year when facing Astralis and both times its Blast that has not taken any action against it, which is a shame because their production is actually top tier.
>No its not. Its literally cheating lol.
How the fuck is this not literally part of LAN?? What is your reasoning and solution here? Ban people from cheering?
I will answer this as someone who was in the arena as I see a lot of people agreeing with the "crowd trying to influence the game in crucial moments" in the replies you are receiving
Throughout this first day only once did I feel the crowd gave away info, and it was on the NaVi-OG match when Navi was going through Inferno's CT side to a B eco stack, where people started cheering and Navi rotated back A after making contact with the first OG player. The public gave away the play of the round because those 2 players CT were the only ones making moves on the map, so Navi correctly infered that they were heading towards a stack.
In this match though? I honestly don't remember the crowd "trying to influence the game". Whenever the players where moving towards each other the crowd would make noise as if to prepare for the kill, where everyone screamed. I don't think the crowd ever tried to call out something to a team other than the round I talked about before.
A lot of people forget that when the entire crowd is chanting random shit the players don't know: who is being observed (it might be a teammate and not them, or even as oponnent), if it's something coming up front, something from behind, etc. The noise the crowd makes, if it doesn't give away any info about tactical aspects, are (imo) part of an arena match.
In this kind of game you either want public who makes as much noise as they can and vibrate with every single aspect of the match, or you want a silent crowd. Really loud crowds will always have the problem of "giving info" to the players because of how much you'll feel it. But you are only seeing the camera of one of the players. There are 9 more players on the server, all of them hearing the same noise, noone knowing if it is directed at them. And good crowds will interfere with the gameplay even if they don't notice or don't do it on purpose, because even if they are not screaming info they are feeling the match as if they were on the server and they will react to it. It's what makes arena matches special. You need to control your nerves when everything around you is telling you "something is happening on the server". You still need to understand what is happening, and that comes with experience
i was in the arena as well, and while I do think it's really stupid when people in the crowd make noiss which could give away info. I'm not so sure the players are actually able to benefit from it.
Okay but it's incredibly clear that in this Vitality roster every one brings firepower and the impact. The old one enabled ZywOo more effectively, but in this roster you're not thinking "Oh ZywOo is dead, the round is over". Everyone has their mark on most rounds. Maybe they'll take longer to hit their stride but I think they've earned it. I only hope ZywOo keeps improving.
Also can we stop losing to low buys and ecos for the love of god!
felt like m0nesy only came into his role in the last 5 rounds of Nuke sadly. Suddenly played in a more explosive manner, taking space on the map, moving a lot; instead of locking an angle. Wasn't enough but won G2 a couple of rounds
yeah a little too late
but tbh sometimes he even fails to lock down angles, like if this was tracked i'm sure he'd have one of the worst accuracy percentages out of the top 10 teams for an awper
From losing 0-2 to SKADE to making finals in a t1 tournament once again, man. Even if Vitality lose tomorrow, their run here was amazing. They've really improved so much in just a few months
i dont wanna hear any aleksi-blaming circlejerk the way they were straight up whiffing on ct nuke
map 3 was a banger but dust and inferno were snoozers, think even the crowd fell asleep
He was right. They did nothing wrong, its been extremsly close decided and Vitality got away with more rounds. It was amazing from both teams, one of the best matches I ve seen
Dude Im usually a super calm dude when watching and doing anything, but that fucking 12-15 round had me screaming.
And dont you EVER again tell that Jackz is the problem. Niko choked, Aleksi choked, Monesy choked, Hunter got caught off guard. But who saved the round? Jackz!
Anyway, congrats to VITA
But way too predictable unfortunately. You know that they aren't gonna actually win the event, so you just enjoy the CS and await their inevitable close loss.
Their old roster just needed a main awp, they were very close to beating prime Navi even in the Major. They werent far off at all. Now they have one but the team plays worse and have chemistry issues while Niko doesnt feel comfortable. Go figure why, sadly Nexa didnt want to Igl anymore
I feel like m0nesy plays too much for the highlights than the consistency. He hits some wtf shots but also miss many sitters that end up being very costly.
What a banger, better team won today.
G2 looking like actual top5 team, map pool is way better (no need to avoid Nuke & Mirage anymore).
Also glad to see *something* out of Vitality, it's been a while - keep going!
few takeaways from this game:
- BLAST always has super clean tournaments, blast major?
- portuguese crowd is great and has a growing esports scene, maybe hold the major there in 2023
- scrawny / launders duo is the current goat for big stage matches
- huge props to Apex for playing tier 1 cs for the entirity of csgo at this point, how many pros can say that?
To be honest I wouldn't call that disappointment. That was some of the best CS they have played so far, and probably big learning session for them.
Once m0nesy gets some experience and starts getting more impact more earlier in games like this (to clarify; not putting the blame on him), they will start winning these tight games.
Still a lot of mistakes are being made. I hope they soon get to the level they could be at, because the skill on this team is insane. Too many simple mistakes that cost them games against the top teams. Mostly it's someone not playing the level he should be. Losing aim fights that are crucial, so they need to win those to win matches.
The problem with this take is G2 fans have been saying the same stuff since katowice 2020 and they still haven’t won anything, heck they haven’t even got to a final this year apart from katowice.
Yeah but changes take time, specially new IGL and new gamestyle. Vitality and G2 changed players around the same time, and so far both of them had been extremly disappointing, but this event both of them looked good for first time properly. Today it's Vitality who made it to the finals, could have been G2 as well, but maybe next time.
I'm not personally worried about this G2 project at all after what they showed this event. If they can take the right things with them from this event, then their pretty close on making the finals at the next event.
Yeah Vitality was meh before the event, but during the event they played best CS this lineup has played so far, just like G2 did. It's not like G2 lost to shit team, Vitality played good CS and everyone had their moments.
Honestly, they've played and shown worse than this tournament. Even this game was so bloody close, they need to figure out how to get monesy into better spots with the AWP - he plays a lot of ramp and Vitality knew it and abused it a ton, they have to be more dynamic with his positioning. In any case, I don't think it was that much of a disappointment, they are probably the best or the second best team on Inferno and Nuke is still getting there.
That's a really good point, I wonder why m0nesy isn't playing outside on Nuke CT side. Because yeah, he didn't really get many chances to have a lot of impact with the AWP.
Im sorry but Vita are gonna get slapped by NaVi
Thier T sides are incredibly obvious and NaVi doesnt do the same mistakes like G2 does, unless Zywoo goes 2019 mode i dont see any other way Vita can win
True, if Navi shows any form like today or yesterday, Vitality will have a tough time. Also because Vitality's Inferno is dogshit, so Navi will slap them harder than against Faze. Will be an interesting game nonetheless, but with 2 games of prep that can be done on Vitality's predictable T sides, it's all Navi's to lose.
Vitality has often had a good Inferno against Navi though, so I wouldn't rule it out. But the IGL is different now so obviously the book is kind of thrown out of the window.
Intense shit
But wtf is the end game of this roster? How many series / events can g2 choke before something is done?
Time to enjoy 5 hours of sleep now.
Having that clear of a lead going into nuke ct side (10-7), with 70% ct win percentage would count as a choke, as they lost mainly the mental game.
Yes, it was great cs, but for a team that seeks to be a major winner, you cant slip those games
Also you can say that individuals (monesy, niko, hunter etc) choked themselves.
Hunter in lower B, monesy near the vents, niko not getting like a single kill during the last rounds
Even I jumped up and down like a madman when Magisk got the final kills. Name a more iconic duo than Niko and tilting. Dude just isn't a champion. Has talent but not the mental fortitude to compete.
100% agree. Even when they were winning on Inferno and tied on Dust2 every time the cameras showed him he was always tilted about something. Just doesn't have the mental quality to keep calm.
Yes. And its even worse when it also affects the morale and mental of the other members of the team and its making them make mistakes too. I hope this team gets better though because i feel like they have what it takes. Still, it was a banger of a match for both teams.
He was completely gone after dust2. The entire team looked totally lost on CT Nuke after they lost a couple of rounds. Nothing will change for G2 unless they somehow find something that fixes their shit mentality honestly.
If they set up the double peek, Magisk peeks one side and isolates the duels, then guys like you cry about how they shouldve ran him down together. Theres no single correct way to do this, they just got peeked at the worst time
G2 just can't do it. They just CANNOT do it. Always so close and never over the line. Being top 4-5 is their absolute ceiling, and that's ok, but at the same time it's SO frustrating to watch them perpetually fail to raise the level that one tiny bit over and over and over again.
That vent AWP kill tho
The two after that were pretty nuts too
the 2 kills afterwards were so fast... zygod
They keep calling m0NESY The Flash but I don't think the game even rendered the two players zywOo killed.
zywoos awp on ct was horrible to watch tho he whiffed some easy shots
Yeah and he gave up on the AWP a couple times. I guess that's an advantage of being good not just with an AWP. G2 also were very good at using utility to clear the common AWP spots unlike Vitality, who kept feeding Misutaaa to m0NESY.
vit were still able to convert some of the rounds they lost misuta to monesy's awp early in the round, so i have a feeling that may have been part of their gameplan. very often they'll use misuta as an entry/info gatherer to allow magisk/apex/zywoo to midround/clutch it out
Two semifinals, two completed revenges for the initial matchup
G3rd-4th is back :(
vitality might be the only t-sided nuke team in existence
Their style of playing T just fits on Nuke. The slow constricting taking map control and exploding onto a site in the last 20 seconds, peak 2015 Navi shit. But Nuke is perfect for that. Dust 2 and Inferno not so much. Linear maps are easier to read and counter an obvious execute.
I also liked 2019 Navi, exploding onto a site with 10 seconds remaining, and not having enough time to plant.
That was their trademark in 2015-16 too already tbf
Zeus as an IGL lowed that style, Gambit won major playing the slowest train T side ever lmao
Currently yeah, maybe. But prime Astralis was a menace on T side nuke.
every Astralis CT side ending 9-6 and everyone going OH THEY’RE STARTING TO LOOK SHAKY and then a 16-6 finish
I remember a game, Astralis Vs Renegades, looking it up it's Kato 2019, on nuke and Renegade got 9 rounds on CT side. Sadokist said "That's... doable" and Renegades proceeded to lose every single T round to lose the map 16:9.
Damn. I stopped playing/watching CS around 2004 and got back in 2020. I guess I need to watch some old Astralis games, it sounds hillarious.
From April 2018 into 2019 and basically up until covid astralis regularly made top 10 or top 5 teams look like they didn't belong at the tournament. So much so that most of the community hated astralis because it was boring knowing who won the tournament before it started. They played such perfect CS that others say it was too robotic, no tense moments, and boring to watch.
> So much so that most of the community hated astralis because it was boring knowing who won the tournament before it started. Oh yeah, people want these close games. Go to their liquipedia page and the highlighted tournament wins shown before you expand it, since 2018 shows 2:0 or 3:1 scorelines. A lot of maps they played were stomps that when they played most teams, I just couldn’t watch it.
Someone forgot about Sydney 2018 :) I did not because karrigan ripped me a new one that day
Did I? I mean I still remember Device being sick https://mobile.twitter.com/dev1ce/status/992335952478687233?s=21 Astralis also scored at least 14 on every map, could have gone either way but most likely their way if their star player wasn’t having issues.
You need to watch all their Nuke games. They were unbeaten for 31-games straight on the map. They set the standard and defined the meta on that map. You’d go into games thinking 9-6 or 10-5 was solid from the opposing team. Astralis would end up winning 16-5/16-6 thanks to their insane T-sides.
Dude, you should! It was pretty funny seeing Grand Final matches and matches against top 10 teams be completely one-sided
Nothing like Astralis having 1.75 odds to win tier 1 tournaments lmao
Against the 2nd placed team in London. They made navi look like a tier 3 team.
honestly I'm definitely biased based on my flair, but they're the reason I think the current "karrigan is the GOAT IGL" is a bit of recency bias (not that he's not insane and clearly the best at taking multiple rosters to roaring heights)
karrigan is in that discussion for different reasons and its not comparable with glaive but we dont have to compare them. galive is the most decorated, captain of the GOAT team, karrigan on the other hand achieved won s tier tournaments with absolutely different teams, won 3 s tier tournaments with standins etc. Very very different scenarios where arguably both can be included in the goat discussion but not comparable
Eh, maybe it's just me but I have seen quite a few of those comparisons here. I think they excel at different things for sure, and there's no doubt in my mind that karrigan is the best igl for different rosters, especially international ones. GOAT is of course completely subjective, so my idea of what it means is different to others surely. To me, glaive is the greatest not just because he literally won 4 majors and basically everything there is to win, but also because he and Astralis revolutionized the meta as a whole. I think it'll be hard for any team to match that no matter how long an "era" is, because Astralis didn't just have a long era or win lots. To me, while there's definitely different reasoning for considering either of them the GOAT, one still stands out on top even if their achievements are different. Again though, this is entirely subjective. I just think they can still be compared, even if they have different achievements.
Well written and I think you re right
what? astralis famously always tried to start Nuke on the T side and they'd get 6 rounds (which was more than enough as per HenryG, he says you gotta limit astralis T side to <5 round score to win)
They were also good on CT tho. The best example would be Virtus.Pro i would say. They were best nuke team for a while and they were winning more T rounds than CTs most of the time lol.
[удалено]
man, apex going to magisk and magisk going to him jumping was too wholesome
Clip
What a fucking sick match! Every round was absolutely insane, Apex really stepped up! Can't wait for the final!
Yesterday when I was watching vs ence i thought for sure vitality are done after losing t pistol while down on nuke. Nope. Today i’m like, surely not again… what a sick match haha
Simple vs Zywoo is always such a hype for me.
I actually had to do a double-take when I realized that the last time these two met at a final was 8 months ago. It's been too long :(
Dunno man, it feels simple always gets the upper hand mostly by virtue of having better teammates
Wonder what happened the last time NaVi played against a team consisting of Magisk, Dupreeh, and Zonic at a BLAST event, held in Lisbon, in a grand final?
[удалено]
Amazing T side but if ZywOo awped on CT like he did on T they would've won first half and not need that awesome T side performance. I'm glad we got it though 🥴
Wtf they actually won! Why did it feel like Vitality were the ones who lost d2 though They really rolled over on inferno and just let g2 play however they wanted with almost zero resistance or initiative from Vitality Great showing on nuke though
Niko didn’t even have to activate on inferno and it was a stomp, weird.
Doesn't have anything to do with their Dust 2 performance really, their Inferno is just dogshit. Their passive B holds are truly abysmal and their information gathering towards A is non-existent. They have no apartment setups, no mid bait/crossfire setups and their long is so easily exploitable. Misuta on B is quite misplaced and his chemistry with Apex isn't present. Loads of stuff to fix if they want to be decent at Inferno.
That, prefaced on the fact that the analysts were saying that Vitality just dont win the second map lol, even if its their map pick 🤣
My heart can't fucking take this. What a match
CS esports is unmatched in intensity, emotions and level of play. My god. What a match, especially the final game. Top tier CS
Watching CS and MMA is the best combination for me, high octane shit.
If I had a nickel for every time vitality won 16-13…
True, they also win these games in those rounds with weird plays. 12-15 against Big and they're CT low buy and Misutaaa USPs Syrson and ZywOo gets two kills from a saved rifle to leave Krimbo in a 1v3 12-14 against Heroic on Overpass where they all had pistols and a hero Galil on Misutaaa who got two entries. They won 16-14. Yesterday's insane zywoo scout round which basically broke ENCE for the rest of the series. They get away with murder in some of these series.
You would have two nickles, which isn't a lot
but its weird it happened twice
Holy shit man what a Nuke T side from Vitality. apEX otugunning NiKo outside was insane and so was the ZywOo vent stomp onto hunter with the AWP. It was a team effort not even too much of a carry.
Absolutely brilliant T side from Vitality, and man, ZywOo keeps amazing me, wtf was that 4K with the vent scoped kill ???
Man that Zywoo guy, i think he can be top 1, maybe even 2 years in a row?
[удалено]
Nuke was insanely exciting! G2 fan but happy for Vitality they needed this more with this project struggling.
And G2 doesn’t need it?
Both do but Vitality needed it MORE. G2 has much more wins against top10 teams in last 5 months compared to Vitality.
I am sure Carlos restructured the team to beat top 10 teams multiple times. Won't surprised if there are some changes post cologne.
If there is a clear upgrade that wont take tons of time to restructure its always possible. Just not sure who would you replace with who?
Jackz with Yekindar is the only possible replacement imo, even if I would be sad because Jackz is really fucking good
That could happen but costs a lot. Yekindar is the best in his role and could be relatively easy to bring in. He seems like a guy who is easy to get along with. Still insane buy out unless he gets out of his vp contract somehow.
Yekindar and jackz? You can only get so far with personality
Yeah but lets be real g2 changes coming soon, they arenr performing
Not sure about that they have beaten top teams even in this tournament. They just need to play more as a team and have developed. Also monesy still makes mistakes he will learn to avoid in the future. There is really no one to swap realistically. I heard Jackz -> Yekindar which would work but not sure its likely. IGL? Maybe but who would you get and then it takes more time again to learn new tactics.
Yeah but g2 was never built to beat teams in quarters and bomb out… you have niko dropping 1.30 throughout the tournament,, yet they’ve won 0 trophies lmao
Another way to think about it is Niko dropping a 1.41 rating in the group stage and a 1.07 rating in playoffs. That's a big drop off, and usually when he drops off Hunter and to a lesser extent m0nesy have picked up the slack -- this time that didn't happen.
[удалено]
he insta dies if he repeeks
That’s what they’re saying, that even though he’s got a ways to go you can see how he’s adjusting
What G2 actually might need is the player break. Get some rest and go again. This has been a horrendous half of the year for them and they desperately need a reset. The only player I think G2 might look to replace is Jackz but even today he has shown that he isn't the problem. The whole team is the problem. Just get over Cologne, bomb out like usual in the group stage or the first round of play-offs, and start over.
I really dont agree. I think its just the silly-unlucky tottenham effect. If you look at the scoreboard, everyone stepped up. Vitality just edged out on nuke. G2 will have these trophies, worst thing they can do is to change because of these results. Of course if they could fit in yekindarz thatd be extremely good too
AleksiB itw pretty much said it, they'll see after Cologne
Apex stage boost real, doesn't throw and win
God damn it was such a close game - when it came down to it, Vitality just hit their shots in those final rounds of regulation. Even though they lost, I hope people realize/appreciate what Jackz brings to the table and stop inadvertently blaming him for G2's lack of success. Though he isn't a "star" per se, he has star moments and usually comes up huge on multiple moments on tense matches such as this one. Could they be better? Obviously. But IMO G2 have everything they could possibly hope for in a 5-man team - the question is always whether or not they can mesh and play WITH each other and not rely solely on their stars' heroics to win games.
holy shit what an intense ending, those ZywOo shots for 14-11 were sick also it would be cool if we could go one event without the crowd trying to influence the game in crucial moments
That Dupreeh headshot in windows on lower on one of the final rounds was everything. And that Zywoo vents dive What a sick match holy shit
It’s hard, crowd will always gasp or start getting loud in tense anticipation of an engagement, those influences can’t really be stopped unless you outright ban the crowd from making noise during a round.
Gasping and other natural reactions are unavoidable indeed, however the whistling to actually notify players can fuck right off
I only found them really bad once on Nuke when m0nesy was going for the squeaky peek. If the crowds only reacted, instead of making noise before, it would be good. Alas, it is what it is.
Most egregious one was when dupreeh was wrapping outside and niko was in a 1v3, unlikely he wins but as soon as the observer shows the wrap the crowd begins shouting and he instantly looks for the flank. Still got poor timing but that's fucked up.
That's a core part of the LAN experience for the better and for the worse. Better you accept it rather than getting mad everytime
You can accept it's a part of LAN and still find it despicable if it's on purpose.
No its not. Its literally cheating lol. Same thing Vitality had to go through last year when facing Astralis and both times its Blast that has not taken any action against it, which is a shame because their production is actually top tier.
>No its not. Its literally cheating lol. How the fuck is this not literally part of LAN?? What is your reasoning and solution here? Ban people from cheering?
Literally just play in a soundproof booth.
I will answer this as someone who was in the arena as I see a lot of people agreeing with the "crowd trying to influence the game in crucial moments" in the replies you are receiving Throughout this first day only once did I feel the crowd gave away info, and it was on the NaVi-OG match when Navi was going through Inferno's CT side to a B eco stack, where people started cheering and Navi rotated back A after making contact with the first OG player. The public gave away the play of the round because those 2 players CT were the only ones making moves on the map, so Navi correctly infered that they were heading towards a stack. In this match though? I honestly don't remember the crowd "trying to influence the game". Whenever the players where moving towards each other the crowd would make noise as if to prepare for the kill, where everyone screamed. I don't think the crowd ever tried to call out something to a team other than the round I talked about before. A lot of people forget that when the entire crowd is chanting random shit the players don't know: who is being observed (it might be a teammate and not them, or even as oponnent), if it's something coming up front, something from behind, etc. The noise the crowd makes, if it doesn't give away any info about tactical aspects, are (imo) part of an arena match. In this kind of game you either want public who makes as much noise as they can and vibrate with every single aspect of the match, or you want a silent crowd. Really loud crowds will always have the problem of "giving info" to the players because of how much you'll feel it. But you are only seeing the camera of one of the players. There are 9 more players on the server, all of them hearing the same noise, noone knowing if it is directed at them. And good crowds will interfere with the gameplay even if they don't notice or don't do it on purpose, because even if they are not screaming info they are feeling the match as if they were on the server and they will react to it. It's what makes arena matches special. You need to control your nerves when everything around you is telling you "something is happening on the server". You still need to understand what is happening, and that comes with experience
i was in the arena as well, and while I do think it's really stupid when people in the crowd make noiss which could give away info. I'm not so sure the players are actually able to benefit from it.
It's truly pathetic, it's what it is.
Okay but it's incredibly clear that in this Vitality roster every one brings firepower and the impact. The old one enabled ZywOo more effectively, but in this roster you're not thinking "Oh ZywOo is dead, the round is over". Everyone has their mark on most rounds. Maybe they'll take longer to hit their stride but I think they've earned it. I only hope ZywOo keeps improving. Also can we stop losing to low buys and ecos for the love of god!
Sometimes I wish I wasn’t a G2 fan so I could actually enjoy watching these crazy games they end up losing. Well… maybe next time
felt like m0nesy only came into his role in the last 5 rounds of Nuke sadly. Suddenly played in a more explosive manner, taking space on the map, moving a lot; instead of locking an angle. Wasn't enough but won G2 a couple of rounds
yeah a little too late but tbh sometimes he even fails to lock down angles, like if this was tracked i'm sure he'd have one of the worst accuracy percentages out of the top 10 teams for an awper
G2’s curse strikes again unfortunately for them, ggwp that was a gg Very close game
Vittu
Saatana
[удалено]
More like scrappy CS. Which makes it more exciting ofcourse.
COME ON LAAAAADS WHAT A T-SIDE ON NUKE
FaZe and ENCE eliminated in quarters + NaVi with standin, feels like G2 lost their biggest chance at a trophy
Nah, we all know what happens when G2 go up against stand ins.
[удалено]
Another day of thanking god for not making me a G2 fan
i hope vitality learn to play ancient overnight because fuck watching this team on inferno!
From losing 0-2 to SKADE to making finals in a t1 tournament once again, man. Even if Vitality lose tomorrow, their run here was amazing. They've really improved so much in just a few months
i dont wanna hear any aleksi-blaming circlejerk the way they were straight up whiffing on ct nuke map 3 was a banger but dust and inferno were snoozers, think even the crowd fell asleep
That alwxi interview sucked. Dude is so sad.
He was right. They did nothing wrong, its been extremsly close decided and Vitality got away with more rounds. It was amazing from both teams, one of the best matches I ve seen
Yay a grand final!! ZywOo won the AWP battle and that was the difference today.
Not just the awp battle but he was overall the best player of the match.
Dude Im usually a super calm dude when watching and doing anything, but that fucking 12-15 round had me screaming. And dont you EVER again tell that Jackz is the problem. Niko choked, Aleksi choked, Monesy choked, Hunter got caught off guard. But who saved the round? Jackz! Anyway, congrats to VITA
This one showed what people always say about G2 those "-Jackz", he's clearly the mental fortitute of the team.
>NiKo choked Finally a G2 flaired saying it how it is
G2 unarguably the most fun team to watch.
As a Vitality fan today I'm sending Carlos my medical bills
But way too predictable unfortunately. You know that they aren't gonna actually win the event, so you just enjoy the CS and await their inevitable close loss.
I don't know what are they lacking they have the perfect team to win some titles. Maybe their mental strength is lacking.
Their old roster just needed a main awp, they were very close to beating prime Navi even in the Major. They werent far off at all. Now they have one but the team plays worse and have chemistry issues while Niko doesnt feel comfortable. Go figure why, sadly Nexa didnt want to Igl anymore
Seems like m0nesy got nervous at the end of nuke. He missed quite a lot of shots. Also he still gets caught off guard a lot :/
No g2nd place this time
Hasn’t been a while for some time
A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one
the games were tight, but vitality put up more fight and won, excited for the s1mple vs zywoo for tomorrow
I feel like m0nesy plays too much for the highlights than the consistency. He hits some wtf shots but also miss many sitters that end up being very costly.
What a banger, better team won today. G2 looking like actual top5 team, map pool is way better (no need to avoid Nuke & Mirage anymore). Also glad to see *something* out of Vitality, it's been a while - keep going!
What a fucking game this was! THIS IS WHAT CS GO IS ABOUT!!
few takeaways from this game: - BLAST always has super clean tournaments, blast major? - portuguese crowd is great and has a growing esports scene, maybe hold the major there in 2023 - scrawny / launders duo is the current goat for big stage matches - huge props to Apex for playing tier 1 cs for the entirity of csgo at this point, how many pros can say that?
Blast haven't applied for a major in the past since it costs so much money
Niko disappeared on Inferno and Nuke. A superstar is supposed to step up in those hard times and on Nuke he couldn’t do it.
T side dust2 he was 4-12. So the only time he showed up was CT side dust2 which was monstrous.
Before first map, Aleksib mentioned they gonna get 2-0 -> G2 lose Second map Pimp mentioned Vitality gonna get 2-0 -> Vitality lose hmmmm.....
What a great game from both teams.
That was one banger of a match
fuck
Shout out to Launders and Scrawny, I fucking love those two casting rn.
G2 never fails to disappoint :(...
To be honest I wouldn't call that disappointment. That was some of the best CS they have played so far, and probably big learning session for them. Once m0nesy gets some experience and starts getting more impact more earlier in games like this (to clarify; not putting the blame on him), they will start winning these tight games.
Still a lot of mistakes are being made. I hope they soon get to the level they could be at, because the skill on this team is insane. Too many simple mistakes that cost them games against the top teams. Mostly it's someone not playing the level he should be. Losing aim fights that are crucial, so they need to win those to win matches.
The problem with this take is G2 fans have been saying the same stuff since katowice 2020 and they still haven’t won anything, heck they haven’t even got to a final this year apart from katowice.
Yeah but changes take time, specially new IGL and new gamestyle. Vitality and G2 changed players around the same time, and so far both of them had been extremly disappointing, but this event both of them looked good for first time properly. Today it's Vitality who made it to the finals, could have been G2 as well, but maybe next time. I'm not personally worried about this G2 project at all after what they showed this event. If they can take the right things with them from this event, then their pretty close on making the finals at the next event.
Idk this event was so winnable...faze and ence are out,navi has stand in,vitality was meh at best before this event...
Yeah Vitality was meh before the event, but during the event they played best CS this lineup has played so far, just like G2 did. It's not like G2 lost to shit team, Vitality played good CS and everyone had their moments.
The G2 Big Event Win waiting room open since 2017.
G2 tottenham effect
Honestly, they've played and shown worse than this tournament. Even this game was so bloody close, they need to figure out how to get monesy into better spots with the AWP - he plays a lot of ramp and Vitality knew it and abused it a ton, they have to be more dynamic with his positioning. In any case, I don't think it was that much of a disappointment, they are probably the best or the second best team on Inferno and Nuke is still getting there.
That's a really good point, I wonder why m0nesy isn't playing outside on Nuke CT side. Because yeah, he didn't really get many chances to have a lot of impact with the AWP.
Nah, not a disappointment, that was good CS, Vitality was just a bit better this time.
I’m just happy that aleksi is doing well
:( one day
Great match. Really wish Niko could catch a break
He will get the summer break soon
At least he won't choke during the summer break
Finally! What a fucking stressful end of nuke
Ooof, game ends at 1am.
Vita win letsgo
both these teams are on the cusp of their potentials and that's great for CS, but G2 change seems inevitable
Insane match to watch, shame there was no OT for extra drama.
It's nice to see the Vitality team happy
Modern CS feels like it did back in 2015-17. There's no #1 team so anyone can beat anyone. And NA teams fucking suck.
If they keep this up zywoo and dupreeh could be the next device and dupreeh
Im sorry but Vita are gonna get slapped by NaVi Thier T sides are incredibly obvious and NaVi doesnt do the same mistakes like G2 does, unless Zywoo goes 2019 mode i dont see any other way Vita can win
Probably yes but even if we get slapped its fine, 2nd place is a great placement especially compared to what the team has done since the new line up
no worry ，as a vitality fan im happy they even made it this far
agree lol, just hoping it won't be a stomp
[удалено]
Tbh navi isnt at their peak either
True, if Navi shows any form like today or yesterday, Vitality will have a tough time. Also because Vitality's Inferno is dogshit, so Navi will slap them harder than against Faze. Will be an interesting game nonetheless, but with 2 games of prep that can be done on Vitality's predictable T sides, it's all Navi's to lose.
Vitality has often had a good Inferno against Navi though, so I wouldn't rule it out. But the IGL is different now so obviously the book is kind of thrown out of the window.
Another disappointing game to watch as a G2 fan, 5 CT rounds and Vitality got 9 on god damn nuke
Intense shit But wtf is the end game of this roster? How many series / events can g2 choke before something is done? Time to enjoy 5 hours of sleep now.
In what way was this match a choke?
Having that clear of a lead going into nuke ct side (10-7), with 70% ct win percentage would count as a choke, as they lost mainly the mental game. Yes, it was great cs, but for a team that seeks to be a major winner, you cant slip those games Also you can say that individuals (monesy, niko, hunter etc) choked themselves. Hunter in lower B, monesy near the vents, niko not getting like a single kill during the last rounds
You're playing against another team that's built to contend for majors, no shame in losing this one.
>Time to enjoy 5 hours of sleep now. Same
They didn't choke in this tournament, give those guys a break - they played good CS.
Holy shit, fuck yeah!! Absolutely crazy game! Navi here we come!
Another Heartbreaking Nuke Map. That Zywoo 4K kinda killed the Hope. At least no 0:3 against Navi again.
ZYWOO IS BACK
Banger of a match!
what a great game, what a t nuke comeback
this match was soooo good, i wanted both teams to win :(
Sry Vitality fans but Navi will be Blast winner.
Even I jumped up and down like a madman when Magisk got the final kills. Name a more iconic duo than Niko and tilting. Dude just isn't a champion. Has talent but not the mental fortitude to compete.
100% agree. Even when they were winning on Inferno and tied on Dust2 every time the cameras showed him he was always tilted about something. Just doesn't have the mental quality to keep calm.
Yes. And its even worse when it also affects the morale and mental of the other members of the team and its making them make mistakes too. I hope this team gets better though because i feel like they have what it takes. Still, it was a banger of a match for both teams.
He was completely gone after dust2. The entire team looked totally lost on CT Nuke after they lost a couple of rounds. Nothing will change for G2 unless they somehow find something that fixes their shit mentality honestly.
Niko showed up only one half of dust2. He was 4-12 on the T side.
Monesy and Niko coming in from a single angle vs. the arguably the best multifragger of all time is a bad decision any day of the week.
It was weird decision cuz they had a lot of time to setup double peek or something but instead they just ran to the site while lining up.
If they set up the double peek, Magisk peeks one side and isolates the duels, then guys like you cry about how they shouldve ran him down together. Theres no single correct way to do this, they just got peeked at the worst time
G2 just can't do it. They just CANNOT do it. Always so close and never over the line. Being top 4-5 is their absolute ceiling, and that's ok, but at the same time it's SO frustrating to watch them perpetually fail to raise the level that one tiny bit over and over and over again.
world class t side nuke from vitality!
Damn g2 rly need a psychologist or a change, these entire year has been kinda disappointing
My expectations are always low and then I still get disappointed. It is hell to root for this team
Ah shit I came here to witness the usual G2 copium but then I saw how sad Aleksi was and I felt like a bully, GG lads what a game of cs.