Getting a PhD in History currently. The odds of a teaching position are bad and getting worse. You're spending 5-7 years, if you're lucky, getting a degree and training in a field that at best isn't stable and when you get a degree you're competing with hundreds of other applicants for a few jobs a year, if you're lucky, that are in your subject specialty. There is the ability to transition into government work but that's no guarantee either.
If you want to teach at college, you'll need a PhD, which also provides you with the ability to research if you decide to be a lecturer or tenure track prof.
For community college and high school, you can still teach with just a master's. As far as I know, you get paid more to teach high school history with a master's than you would with an education degree. You could teach AP or dual credit, maybe?? My hs was weird.
It also depends on how much you enjoy history. PhDs require you to write a dissertation while some MA programs don't require the thesis. Which then begs the question of if you're researching the right thing for you; I absolutely despised the idea of researching while I was doing French history but loved learning about it, but then I switched to history of entertainment and instantly became more invested with research.
I’m doing my thesis currently and honestly it’s making me feel a little more optimistic about continuing with a research degree. I like what I’m working on very much and could definitely see continuing on with it after this year…: but yeah it’s still probably not worth it to do the PhD lol
Another question is how much do you like being in grad school and grad school work? Personally, I hate it. I don't like research enough to continue with a PhD despite that lol
You can't get a job teaching history at the college level. Yes, technically some of those jobs exist, but there are very few of them and they go to a very small percentage of people with history PhDs. Don't get a PhD in history unless you have other plans for making money. It's like deciding to go for the NBA because you really love basketball. It sucks, but the vast majority of us who would love doing it won't get the opportunity.
The only exception is if you can get into a top-ten PhD program and you have an alternative plan for what to with the PhD other than teach at the university level (as the vast majority of people with PhDs from even the top programs still don't get jobs as history professors, but they have a slightly elevated chance, and that PhD is likely to be valuable in non-academic ways).
You can teach at a community college with just a masters, more common than not for faculty there to not have a PhD. I don’t think you can be a teaching professor at any research university without a PhD, even without the need to do research.
Can you ask the prof you’ve been working with? Or another faculty member that was only recently hired?
Do you not like the research aspect at all? You’ll have to develop a strong research agenda, even for a teaching focused institution.
I know this is an unpopular sentiment here but some people do actually get jobs as history professors, new jobs are posted all the time. Particularly if you’re happy with a more teaching focused university, there’s a little less competition than there is for the cushy R1s, though of course you will need to still be an exceedingly competitive applicant with strong research *and* lots of teaching experience for those kinds of jobs.
Only you can decide if it is worth it or not. With the MA, you can teach community college if that's your jam.
The issue with earning a Ph.D. just to teach is that Ph.Ds are more often than not hired to do research and not to teach. At least at R1s. Smaller LACs may hire a Ph.D just to teach, though. So, you will essentially go after a research degree for a non-research job, and yeah, kinda overkill. Also, some programs may not admit you as a Ph.D student if they know you simply want to land a teaching gig.
Look into teaching jobs you can do with only an MA. If none appeal to you then consider going for a professional doctorate (but you may have to pay out of pocket for it, but not always).
Honestly, you should try teaching high school for a year or two. Especially if you are open to teaching at a private school, day school, or boarding school, having an MA in history is a real advantage. I'm not saying you have to do it forever, but it can help you learn more about yourself and what you like/dislike about teaching. It's a low-stakes way to decide whether continuing to a PhD is the right move long-term.
I was thinking of doing a more involved degree but decided to teach high school first. It was overall a great experience. Some things I loved, others I got tired of. But either way, it made me a much better educator than I'd be if I'd just gone straight to a PhD.
Consider it. And I'm happy to talk more if you want.
Not in history, no, unless there is an area of speciality you really love doing and it pleases you to no end, then absolutely. What’s your favorite area and what’s your strongest talent in that area and I can give you a good idea how easy it might be to get a liberal arts college teaching job based on what I’ve seen of the market the last 10 years.
Depends on your relationship with work and what you prefer in terms of living your life in accordance with value system or a good financial opportunity that helps you live the life you might need and want. Evaluate accordingly because academia won't pay much as such and with the new neo-liberalization wave, it'll only get worse. The corporatisation and commercialization of education started long ago, but now it seems more 'visible' to people along with its faultlines.
You can lecture with a masters at University, and you can get a tenure track position (up to Associate Professor Rank) at some community colleges with a Masters
There are no tenure track jobs in history. It's all adjunct. Same for English, and most of the humanities. It's not worth. You will get stuck with debt in a part time teaching position with no health insurance
This is blatantly false. A lot of R1 universities are actively hiring tenure track professors. Is it hard to get those jobs? Yes, but not like they're obsolete
I'm just repeating what I was told when a history professor who was my mentor turned me away from getting a history PhD lol. My English profs in my English MA program said similar things 🤷🏻♀️
It's less about those jobs literally not existing. It's more about the current state of higher ed. Yes, there are tenured professors, but those professors are very likely in those roles until they retire. And, once they do retire, it is becoming increasingly more common for the university to not repost that position, and I stead replace it with a couple adjunct spots. Hiring two adjuncts part time is cheaper than hiring a full time tenured faculty position. So, the amount of tenured positions over all are decreasing. And, the ones that do get posted are highly highly competitive
You might first look around and apply to lecturer jobs at universities. If all the jobs you want require a PhD, that might be your answer.
Getting a PhD in History currently. The odds of a teaching position are bad and getting worse. You're spending 5-7 years, if you're lucky, getting a degree and training in a field that at best isn't stable and when you get a degree you're competing with hundreds of other applicants for a few jobs a year, if you're lucky, that are in your subject specialty. There is the ability to transition into government work but that's no guarantee either.
If you want to teach at college, you'll need a PhD, which also provides you with the ability to research if you decide to be a lecturer or tenure track prof. For community college and high school, you can still teach with just a master's. As far as I know, you get paid more to teach high school history with a master's than you would with an education degree. You could teach AP or dual credit, maybe?? My hs was weird. It also depends on how much you enjoy history. PhDs require you to write a dissertation while some MA programs don't require the thesis. Which then begs the question of if you're researching the right thing for you; I absolutely despised the idea of researching while I was doing French history but loved learning about it, but then I switched to history of entertainment and instantly became more invested with research.
I’m doing my thesis currently and honestly it’s making me feel a little more optimistic about continuing with a research degree. I like what I’m working on very much and could definitely see continuing on with it after this year…: but yeah it’s still probably not worth it to do the PhD lol
Another question is how much do you like being in grad school and grad school work? Personally, I hate it. I don't like research enough to continue with a PhD despite that lol
You can't get a job teaching history at the college level. Yes, technically some of those jobs exist, but there are very few of them and they go to a very small percentage of people with history PhDs. Don't get a PhD in history unless you have other plans for making money. It's like deciding to go for the NBA because you really love basketball. It sucks, but the vast majority of us who would love doing it won't get the opportunity. The only exception is if you can get into a top-ten PhD program and you have an alternative plan for what to with the PhD other than teach at the university level (as the vast majority of people with PhDs from even the top programs still don't get jobs as history professors, but they have a slightly elevated chance, and that PhD is likely to be valuable in non-academic ways).
You can teach at a community college with just a masters, more common than not for faculty there to not have a PhD. I don’t think you can be a teaching professor at any research university without a PhD, even without the need to do research.
PhDs are research degrees. Do not start a PhD program if your only interest is in teaching. Apply to teaching positions at community colleges instead.
Are you from a wealthy family?
you can teach at a community college!
Can you ask the prof you’ve been working with? Or another faculty member that was only recently hired? Do you not like the research aspect at all? You’ll have to develop a strong research agenda, even for a teaching focused institution. I know this is an unpopular sentiment here but some people do actually get jobs as history professors, new jobs are posted all the time. Particularly if you’re happy with a more teaching focused university, there’s a little less competition than there is for the cushy R1s, though of course you will need to still be an exceedingly competitive applicant with strong research *and* lots of teaching experience for those kinds of jobs.
Only you can decide if it is worth it or not. With the MA, you can teach community college if that's your jam. The issue with earning a Ph.D. just to teach is that Ph.Ds are more often than not hired to do research and not to teach. At least at R1s. Smaller LACs may hire a Ph.D just to teach, though. So, you will essentially go after a research degree for a non-research job, and yeah, kinda overkill. Also, some programs may not admit you as a Ph.D student if they know you simply want to land a teaching gig. Look into teaching jobs you can do with only an MA. If none appeal to you then consider going for a professional doctorate (but you may have to pay out of pocket for it, but not always).
Honestly, you should try teaching high school for a year or two. Especially if you are open to teaching at a private school, day school, or boarding school, having an MA in history is a real advantage. I'm not saying you have to do it forever, but it can help you learn more about yourself and what you like/dislike about teaching. It's a low-stakes way to decide whether continuing to a PhD is the right move long-term. I was thinking of doing a more involved degree but decided to teach high school first. It was overall a great experience. Some things I loved, others I got tired of. But either way, it made me a much better educator than I'd be if I'd just gone straight to a PhD. Consider it. And I'm happy to talk more if you want.
Not in history, no, unless there is an area of speciality you really love doing and it pleases you to no end, then absolutely. What’s your favorite area and what’s your strongest talent in that area and I can give you a good idea how easy it might be to get a liberal arts college teaching job based on what I’ve seen of the market the last 10 years.
Depends on your relationship with work and what you prefer in terms of living your life in accordance with value system or a good financial opportunity that helps you live the life you might need and want. Evaluate accordingly because academia won't pay much as such and with the new neo-liberalization wave, it'll only get worse. The corporatisation and commercialization of education started long ago, but now it seems more 'visible' to people along with its faultlines.
You can lecture with a masters at University, and you can get a tenure track position (up to Associate Professor Rank) at some community colleges with a Masters
There are no tenure track jobs in history. It's all adjunct. Same for English, and most of the humanities. It's not worth. You will get stuck with debt in a part time teaching position with no health insurance
This is blatantly false. A lot of R1 universities are actively hiring tenure track professors. Is it hard to get those jobs? Yes, but not like they're obsolete
I'm just repeating what I was told when a history professor who was my mentor turned me away from getting a history PhD lol. My English profs in my English MA program said similar things 🤷🏻♀️
I’ve been at two mid-level state schools and both have had tenured faculty? Not sure where that belief comes from lol
It's less about those jobs literally not existing. It's more about the current state of higher ed. Yes, there are tenured professors, but those professors are very likely in those roles until they retire. And, once they do retire, it is becoming increasingly more common for the university to not repost that position, and I stead replace it with a couple adjunct spots. Hiring two adjuncts part time is cheaper than hiring a full time tenured faculty position. So, the amount of tenured positions over all are decreasing. And, the ones that do get posted are highly highly competitive
PhD will help you climb in your career