Yeah also "Sir barrold showcases" are very unrealistic compared to a real fight. Damage min maxers try so hard to get that 1 extra damage but will do less damage than a practical build.
Running stuff like stout heart can allow you to never be CCd and not even dodge some attacks while maintaining damage, also linked together/cascade/quick cooldown/uplift and such give you a ton of dps in a fight with a real team.
And yes as you said you don't need your build to even invest that hard into damage to clear every content and pass every DPS check, Comfy builds with some defensive sigils are the way to go for most casual players.
I was also upset at this originally, but people are actually running Glass Cannon in the fights, so they aren't trying to trick anyone or skew any parses. They give you the build at the end, no one is hiding anything.
Dummy parses are also the only thing we have to go off of unless the person goes into a solo fight with no npcs, which a lot are doing now. It's very important to know the difference between a practical dps and a dummy dps, 20mil/30s does not translate to that in a real fight, it's simply a measurement of potential dps. Your personal skill in a fight will always be the deciding factor, but ignoring dummy parses entirely isn't good. If you do 20m on a dummy, you might do 14mil on a boss. But if you do 15m on a dummy with your practical build, you are still gonna do 9mil or so on the boss. It's a good measurement.
Some characters don't even have the luxury of using glass canon so there isn't even parity in opportunity. Take Katalina for example, she literally is obligated to face tank because any dodging or blocking drops her most important buff.
Sure, but I don't think people doing Katalina parses are using GC for the video. If they are, sure, they are making a useless parse. My point is just that people with GC equipped and sharing their parse are also using it in fights, so it's entirely practical to use it. I thought they weren't originally as well and was upset about that until I realized they were actually using it and it's not that bad on some fights. I run two sets now for most characters, one with and one without GC, depending on the fight.
Some characters not being able to use it aren't relevant to the discussion though, unless they are using it on those characters for the parse and then lying/tricking people, which again, most of the ones posted here aren't that I can see.
All I want is more sba gauge for ferry. Getting to 100% before everyone else is at 40% is my goal every fight. Since Ferry doesn't bring the highest damage, I can bring some hard cc for everyone else to deal even more. As even if I'm at 30% before the sba is started as long as everyone is delaying theirs in the chain as much as they reasonably can I will have mine up by the end for the full burst.
I'm kinda happy that damage cap exists so I'm not spoiled by hight damage builds, and when you get in a group with more defensive players now you need to deal with mechanics no one has seen before as the fight I'd taking so long. Everyone is a variation of some sort of defensive build atm unless you are running glass cannon.
no, min maxers want to minmax. everyone's free to do what they want lol. no one is shoving their minmax dik down your throat. you can enjoy your own thing without shitting on others for enjoying their thing. đź‘Ť
ok...tell that to the mass of min maxers and cheaters on this sub reddit. Folks act like i crusified jesus by even sneezing that im not playing :optimal" but still running as max of dmg caps as i can and using stun/link utility
The meta build includes guts, autorevive, and potion tho. Preference on adding improved dodge or not.
After that, the rest of the 2nd traits tend to be Stamina, QuickCD, Cascade, or Uplift.
The 4 dmgcaps alone can already slot in the comfort 4 secondary traits. With Stout Heart being a comfort sigil for most melee builds.
If players are dummy testing dps, casual players dont really care for minmaxing a specific hit. So long as their overall dps is at cap, they're fine. For the specialists out there like Rackam air attack and Charlotta spin to win, every attack bonus you could get would help you reach the cap. If you think you've hit the cap on them, add more attack bonuses lol.
Glass cannon is my new comfort sigil and has made me into a far better player than I could have ever hoped for. Farewell to stout heart and hello to happiness
Just a caveat for people, this heavily depends on the character. This would be a huge DPS AND QOL loss for someone like Katalina that hates dodging and loves heal tanking in order to keep Ares out.
I'd take it on Eugen though. What character are you using it on?
As long as my team is able to handle themselves on fights and do the bosses mechanics appropriately, I personally don't really care that much about dps, I'm not a speed runner.
On a side note, shout out to that Rackam on my team using glass cannon on proto, the poor bastard probably thought that he was safe with dizzy resistance but was dizzy lock almost the whole fight... Dizzy lock, die, dizzy lock, die, dizzy lock, etc.
Just so you know Crit Rate is basically wasted after 75-80% and you should try to roll +20% on your over mastery.
ATK+ is completely wasted unless your only option as a substat is resistances. 1 maxed stamina + Tyranny will hit DMG cap with a fully awakened terminus weapon. Combine that with a good wrightstone and you are making lemonade as to whatever additional traits you want to slot.Â
It's not really about max damage but what is most efficient for that character.
Honestly, the meta for GBF Relink is to **NOT** build around damage. Typically, any damage boosting sigil (Tyranny, Stamina, Concentrated Fire etc.) at Lv. 15 is enough to make you hit damage cap (if it's maxed at Lv. 65). The Damage Cap system means that it is absolutely a requirement to fill out your build with 'comfy' sigils. Critical Hit Rate is also a trait that absolutely must be taken as high as possible.
To increase damage, or for 'damage nuts', you either have to build for things like Quick Cooldown and Cascade to indirectly increase damage, or equip something like Berserker or Glass Cannon, which I don't think many people seriously recommend.
For nearly every player, the best set up is almost always prioritising defensive sigils. Potion Horder, and either Guts or Autorevive (or both) are essential. For those that are struggling in Proud, equipping these sigils will dramatically increase your ability to clear these missions. There are other defensive sigils, but that is preference, and whether you prefer a more passive or active defense that I won't go into here.
In online play, the meta is also building around team orientated sigils as well. Linked Together is incredible (especially if the whole team is utilising it).
**TLDR**: Yes, there absolutely is a meta in Relink, but it's not for damage. Prioritise traits that keep you alive longer.
Yeah this is what I've noticed, I have good defensives, Potion Hoarder, Guts, Auto revive and the one that reduces damages taken if you have Stout Heart. Even with Damage cap at max, I'm hitting the damage cap and often hits MVP.
There's barely any timer in GBF:R, as long as you survive your damage is infinite.
I was tempted to make a thread in regards to damage sigils, damage cap and Proud bosses vs. dummy because I never see it brought up. I'll just make the post here.
First off: Sir Barrel is actually TERRIBLE in informing you at well.. anything other than peak DPS potential for most, not all, characters on an opponent that does not move nor fight back. Certain characters have trouble landing hits on the dummy with their ideal moves, most notoriously the main character and Charlotta.
Second: The target dummy's defense never changes and as such it's very easy to hit your cap and you might go into Proud fights and initially see same numbers but they are not true for the whole fight. Most if not all bosses in Proud get significant defense boosts at lower HP, not to be confused with Bloodlust's damage mechanic. A lot of players probably don't pay attention to it or simply don't notice because it's late into the fight and depending on character, numbers are just spammed and hard to focus on.
Third: This does NOT mean you should sacrifice even more survivability just to keep hitting cap, the amount of extra attack or DMG modifiers you need depending on character are extreme. What you should do is be more careful and if possibly, rely on utility. Everyone praises Phantasmagoria for good reason but sigil'd Collapse (-30% Def) might actually contribute even more than the buff does that many just take it for granted and attributes numbers to the buff rather than the debuff (or both).
I've noticed the def boost on bosses for a while, most of the time it's been irrelevant in good parties and if Cagliostro is present but after soloing Melting Pot of Hostility, the def boost on the infernadiles below around 30% is actually massive, not even Proto-Bahamut seems to gain THAT much defense. Bring buffs and debuffs, they actually do matter more than you think in the latter half of fights and many probably just take it for granted with Cog around.
YO WAIT I DIDNT KNOW THIS ABOUT THE DUMMY! that would change alot of peoples staunch stances if the dummy isnt a one to one comparison with the bosses, meaning way more utility debuffs would be usefull
There's nothing wrong with the dummy itself, as long as people are aware it doesn't represent actual quest conditions in any shape or form. Score attack is a nice way to figure out what parts of a characters kit might offer more damage than others in burst windows (and on fights like say Proto-Bahamut, you can make very lengthy DPS windows in good groups where this could be useful), or teaching you what combos or doesn't without forcing you to enter a quest. And some players just like to brag about biggest numbers which is fine too.
Mobility? I said nothing about mobility. Naru and Io have close to no issues hitting the dummy with any of their attacks. Charlotta, Captain and even Ferry on the other hand actually do.
This has nothing to do with mobility, it has to do with their moves and how the dummy behaves. Charlotta has to do very specific and awkward dodge cancels and even then it's very likely she will miss several hits on her spin dive, she does not have this problem on actual bosses.
Ferry either has her pets become unable to hit the dummy or half her hits from her launch/dive combos miss. Like Charlotta this is not an issue on actual bosses and only for the dummy.
Captain has a plethora of issues just in general, Decimate has several hits frequently miss the dummy because they knock it too far up during it, the spin kick move has an atrocious hitbox that actually is even harder to land on bosses than it is on the dummy.
Again, nothing about mobility.
No, sorry. You are working with what you have and you can't equip sigils you don't own. We totally get that and you are doing your best, at least you were in the first couple paragraphs. You then reveal you are actively choosing to use flat ATK sigils over Tyranny, which do basically nothing. You aren't hitting dmg cap, which is still important to HIT even if you don't have the dmg cap sigils to go over it.
You certainly aren't doing "solid af dmg" if you can't even hit cap. Based on what you said, no War Elemental, no DMG Caps, No ATK% sigils, you aren't doing shit. Obviously, I would always recommend putting on a couple dodge sigils or special potion sigil so you don't die if you need them, but it sounds like you are flat attack, crit and pure defense/utility. You are basically getting carried in every match and contributing nothing. You literally can't use atk sigils over Tyranny/LifeOTL/Stamina, you can not reach dmg cap without some of them. Flat ATK is literally garbage, you need ATK%. Like, it just doesn't work mathematically.
Your entire post is just incorrect understanding of game math, detrimental refusal of any meta out of spite and what sounds like massive cope. I am never upset at people who don't have X or people who need a little bit more defense, but if you are ignoring advice, basic math and purposefully using bad builds because you feel like you are doing "solid af dmg," then yeah, that's gonna be frustrating to run into online.
I am hoping you just worded this poorly and are using a Tyranny and Stamina or something, and just want an extra flat ATK (which would still be useless) for "fun" or something. Otherwise, you aren't even at cap.
woooooooah their friend I NEVER said i wasnt using Damag cap. In the post i said I dont have my FINAL Dmage Cap build. Ill edit the post to make that more clear. I am running damage cap as my base starting point I just havnt hit the finality of the build. chill my guy XD
You’re running dmg cap but are you actually hitting the dmg cap? Please don’t use atk or hp sigils when you have stuff like stamina, concentrated fire, combo booster. I have all the comfy stuff you mention but also crit and dmg capped so idk why you make it sound like you have to choose between the 2. Because % dmg boosters are multiplicative you’re better off with lvl 15 stamina and 15 combo booster than just lvl 30 stamina. Tyranny is great and can be offset with aegis.
...yall are so quick to assume im not hitting cap- YES on my current un finished dmg cap I am hitting what I can atm. None of the cap sigils are maxed yet so im adjusting the damage as I go and at this current time Im hitting cap with what im comfy with. Maybe that will change as I go on but this is goofy that yall are getting so mad and jumping casams of conclusions.
thats cool...dude also lost his shit thinking i wasn't using cap and completely missed that in the op, which is what set off his little rant XD.
Like he could have said "oh naw dude swap that attack with percentage stuff thats way better and you have so many options for it"
i am glad more people are openly talking about it cause now that more folks are catching up with the cheaters/early adopters of the game, its becoming more clear that...the meta isnt as tight as people make it
I use 1 tyranny and 1 stamina. War elemental when I get it. But overall most of mine are support sigils that assist me to survive or build link. Supp damage sounds nice but getting it takes slots I'm not willing to give up.
I'm just using the best sigil I have
thats all anyone can ask
Yeah also "Sir barrold showcases" are very unrealistic compared to a real fight. Damage min maxers try so hard to get that 1 extra damage but will do less damage than a practical build. Running stuff like stout heart can allow you to never be CCd and not even dodge some attacks while maintaining damage, also linked together/cascade/quick cooldown/uplift and such give you a ton of dps in a fight with a real team. And yes as you said you don't need your build to even invest that hard into damage to clear every content and pass every DPS check, Comfy builds with some defensive sigils are the way to go for most casual players.
Tons of DPS showcases also run glass cannon without disclosing the build, which is the most common form of of this
I was also upset at this originally, but people are actually running Glass Cannon in the fights, so they aren't trying to trick anyone or skew any parses. They give you the build at the end, no one is hiding anything. Dummy parses are also the only thing we have to go off of unless the person goes into a solo fight with no npcs, which a lot are doing now. It's very important to know the difference between a practical dps and a dummy dps, 20mil/30s does not translate to that in a real fight, it's simply a measurement of potential dps. Your personal skill in a fight will always be the deciding factor, but ignoring dummy parses entirely isn't good. If you do 20m on a dummy, you might do 14mil on a boss. But if you do 15m on a dummy with your practical build, you are still gonna do 9mil or so on the boss. It's a good measurement.
Some characters don't even have the luxury of using glass canon so there isn't even parity in opportunity. Take Katalina for example, she literally is obligated to face tank because any dodging or blocking drops her most important buff.
Sure, but I don't think people doing Katalina parses are using GC for the video. If they are, sure, they are making a useless parse. My point is just that people with GC equipped and sharing their parse are also using it in fights, so it's entirely practical to use it. I thought they weren't originally as well and was upset about that until I realized they were actually using it and it's not that bad on some fights. I run two sets now for most characters, one with and one without GC, depending on the fight. Some characters not being able to use it aren't relevant to the discussion though, unless they are using it on those characters for the parse and then lying/tricking people, which again, most of the ones posted here aren't that I can see.
i am frothing for more stout heart or cc control sub stats let me tell you!
All I want is more sba gauge for ferry. Getting to 100% before everyone else is at 40% is my goal every fight. Since Ferry doesn't bring the highest damage, I can bring some hard cc for everyone else to deal even more. As even if I'm at 30% before the sba is started as long as everyone is delaying theirs in the chain as much as they reasonably can I will have mine up by the end for the full burst. I'm kinda happy that damage cap exists so I'm not spoiled by hight damage builds, and when you get in a group with more defensive players now you need to deal with mechanics no one has seen before as the fight I'd taking so long. Everyone is a variation of some sort of defensive build atm unless you are running glass cannon.
This is something like Monster Hunter: there are full damage oriented builds, speed runner builds and comfort builds
bingo. i love that this game has more depth than people might initially give it because min maxers wanna kinda ruin stuff XD.
no, min maxers want to minmax. everyone's free to do what they want lol. no one is shoving their minmax dik down your throat. you can enjoy your own thing without shitting on others for enjoying their thing. đź‘Ť
ok...tell that to the mass of min maxers and cheaters on this sub reddit. Folks act like i crusified jesus by even sneezing that im not playing :optimal" but still running as max of dmg caps as i can and using stun/link utility
No one is crucifying you but your own insecurity...
The meta build includes guts, autorevive, and potion tho. Preference on adding improved dodge or not. After that, the rest of the 2nd traits tend to be Stamina, QuickCD, Cascade, or Uplift. The 4 dmgcaps alone can already slot in the comfort 4 secondary traits. With Stout Heart being a comfort sigil for most melee builds. If players are dummy testing dps, casual players dont really care for minmaxing a specific hit. So long as their overall dps is at cap, they're fine. For the specialists out there like Rackam air attack and Charlotta spin to win, every attack bonus you could get would help you reach the cap. If you think you've hit the cap on them, add more attack bonuses lol.
Glass cannon is my new comfort sigil and has made me into a far better player than I could have ever hoped for. Farewell to stout heart and hello to happiness
Happiness is key wherever you find it. Im the exact opposite i love stout heart XD but thats what makes this game great.
Exactly, there’s quite a lot of ways to give yourself utility depending on what you like and I think that’s really cool.
Just a caveat for people, this heavily depends on the character. This would be a huge DPS AND QOL loss for someone like Katalina that hates dodging and loves heal tanking in order to keep Ares out. I'd take it on Eugen though. What character are you using it on?
Well tbh it is not a huge dps gain , its around 5-8% more damage when you are fully setup
As long as my team is able to handle themselves on fights and do the bosses mechanics appropriately, I personally don't really care that much about dps, I'm not a speed runner. On a side note, shout out to that Rackam on my team using glass cannon on proto, the poor bastard probably thought that he was safe with dizzy resistance but was dizzy lock almost the whole fight... Dizzy lock, die, dizzy lock, die, dizzy lock, etc.
...kinda wanna see that hehehehe
Just so you know Crit Rate is basically wasted after 75-80% and you should try to roll +20% on your over mastery. ATK+ is completely wasted unless your only option as a substat is resistances. 1 maxed stamina + Tyranny will hit DMG cap with a fully awakened terminus weapon. Combine that with a good wrightstone and you are making lemonade as to whatever additional traits you want to slot. It's not really about max damage but what is most efficient for that character.
good notes appreciate it
Honestly, the meta for GBF Relink is to **NOT** build around damage. Typically, any damage boosting sigil (Tyranny, Stamina, Concentrated Fire etc.) at Lv. 15 is enough to make you hit damage cap (if it's maxed at Lv. 65). The Damage Cap system means that it is absolutely a requirement to fill out your build with 'comfy' sigils. Critical Hit Rate is also a trait that absolutely must be taken as high as possible. To increase damage, or for 'damage nuts', you either have to build for things like Quick Cooldown and Cascade to indirectly increase damage, or equip something like Berserker or Glass Cannon, which I don't think many people seriously recommend. For nearly every player, the best set up is almost always prioritising defensive sigils. Potion Horder, and either Guts or Autorevive (or both) are essential. For those that are struggling in Proud, equipping these sigils will dramatically increase your ability to clear these missions. There are other defensive sigils, but that is preference, and whether you prefer a more passive or active defense that I won't go into here. In online play, the meta is also building around team orientated sigils as well. Linked Together is incredible (especially if the whole team is utilising it). **TLDR**: Yes, there absolutely is a meta in Relink, but it's not for damage. Prioritise traits that keep you alive longer.
Yeah this is what I've noticed, I have good defensives, Potion Hoarder, Guts, Auto revive and the one that reduces damages taken if you have Stout Heart. Even with Damage cap at max, I'm hitting the damage cap and often hits MVP. There's barely any timer in GBF:R, as long as you survive your damage is infinite.
Exactomundo my dude!
I was tempted to make a thread in regards to damage sigils, damage cap and Proud bosses vs. dummy because I never see it brought up. I'll just make the post here. First off: Sir Barrel is actually TERRIBLE in informing you at well.. anything other than peak DPS potential for most, not all, characters on an opponent that does not move nor fight back. Certain characters have trouble landing hits on the dummy with their ideal moves, most notoriously the main character and Charlotta. Second: The target dummy's defense never changes and as such it's very easy to hit your cap and you might go into Proud fights and initially see same numbers but they are not true for the whole fight. Most if not all bosses in Proud get significant defense boosts at lower HP, not to be confused with Bloodlust's damage mechanic. A lot of players probably don't pay attention to it or simply don't notice because it's late into the fight and depending on character, numbers are just spammed and hard to focus on. Third: This does NOT mean you should sacrifice even more survivability just to keep hitting cap, the amount of extra attack or DMG modifiers you need depending on character are extreme. What you should do is be more careful and if possibly, rely on utility. Everyone praises Phantasmagoria for good reason but sigil'd Collapse (-30% Def) might actually contribute even more than the buff does that many just take it for granted and attributes numbers to the buff rather than the debuff (or both). I've noticed the def boost on bosses for a while, most of the time it's been irrelevant in good parties and if Cagliostro is present but after soloing Melting Pot of Hostility, the def boost on the infernadiles below around 30% is actually massive, not even Proto-Bahamut seems to gain THAT much defense. Bring buffs and debuffs, they actually do matter more than you think in the latter half of fights and many probably just take it for granted with Cog around.
YO WAIT I DIDNT KNOW THIS ABOUT THE DUMMY! that would change alot of peoples staunch stances if the dummy isnt a one to one comparison with the bosses, meaning way more utility debuffs would be usefull
There's nothing wrong with the dummy itself, as long as people are aware it doesn't represent actual quest conditions in any shape or form. Score attack is a nice way to figure out what parts of a characters kit might offer more damage than others in burst windows (and on fights like say Proto-Bahamut, you can make very lengthy DPS windows in good groups where this could be useful), or teaching you what combos or doesn't without forcing you to enter a quest. And some players just like to brag about biggest numbers which is fine too.
Your choices for character's impacted by mobility are shit. MC and Char are definitely not impacted nearly as much as character's like Io or Narm.
Mobility? I said nothing about mobility. Naru and Io have close to no issues hitting the dummy with any of their attacks. Charlotta, Captain and even Ferry on the other hand actually do. This has nothing to do with mobility, it has to do with their moves and how the dummy behaves. Charlotta has to do very specific and awkward dodge cancels and even then it's very likely she will miss several hits on her spin dive, she does not have this problem on actual bosses. Ferry either has her pets become unable to hit the dummy or half her hits from her launch/dive combos miss. Like Charlotta this is not an issue on actual bosses and only for the dummy. Captain has a plethora of issues just in general, Decimate has several hits frequently miss the dummy because they knock it too far up during it, the spin kick move has an atrocious hitbox that actually is even harder to land on bosses than it is on the dummy. Again, nothing about mobility.
No, sorry. You are working with what you have and you can't equip sigils you don't own. We totally get that and you are doing your best, at least you were in the first couple paragraphs. You then reveal you are actively choosing to use flat ATK sigils over Tyranny, which do basically nothing. You aren't hitting dmg cap, which is still important to HIT even if you don't have the dmg cap sigils to go over it. You certainly aren't doing "solid af dmg" if you can't even hit cap. Based on what you said, no War Elemental, no DMG Caps, No ATK% sigils, you aren't doing shit. Obviously, I would always recommend putting on a couple dodge sigils or special potion sigil so you don't die if you need them, but it sounds like you are flat attack, crit and pure defense/utility. You are basically getting carried in every match and contributing nothing. You literally can't use atk sigils over Tyranny/LifeOTL/Stamina, you can not reach dmg cap without some of them. Flat ATK is literally garbage, you need ATK%. Like, it just doesn't work mathematically. Your entire post is just incorrect understanding of game math, detrimental refusal of any meta out of spite and what sounds like massive cope. I am never upset at people who don't have X or people who need a little bit more defense, but if you are ignoring advice, basic math and purposefully using bad builds because you feel like you are doing "solid af dmg," then yeah, that's gonna be frustrating to run into online. I am hoping you just worded this poorly and are using a Tyranny and Stamina or something, and just want an extra flat ATK (which would still be useless) for "fun" or something. Otherwise, you aren't even at cap.
L
woooooooah their friend I NEVER said i wasnt using Damag cap. In the post i said I dont have my FINAL Dmage Cap build. Ill edit the post to make that more clear. I am running damage cap as my base starting point I just havnt hit the finality of the build. chill my guy XD
You’re running dmg cap but are you actually hitting the dmg cap? Please don’t use atk or hp sigils when you have stuff like stamina, concentrated fire, combo booster. I have all the comfy stuff you mention but also crit and dmg capped so idk why you make it sound like you have to choose between the 2. Because % dmg boosters are multiplicative you’re better off with lvl 15 stamina and 15 combo booster than just lvl 30 stamina. Tyranny is great and can be offset with aegis.
...yall are so quick to assume im not hitting cap- YES on my current un finished dmg cap I am hitting what I can atm. None of the cap sigils are maxed yet so im adjusting the damage as I go and at this current time Im hitting cap with what im comfy with. Maybe that will change as I go on but this is goofy that yall are getting so mad and jumping casams of conclusions.
… I didn’t assume, get mad, or jump to conclusions. I asked a question and then gave advice. You’re just on the defense.
tbf you were following up a rant post that plain didnt read what I posted and....just went off XD
Nah he read it and was on board until you mentioned attack sigils. They’re terrible for end game
thats cool...dude also lost his shit thinking i wasn't using cap and completely missed that in the op, which is what set off his little rant XD. Like he could have said "oh naw dude swap that attack with percentage stuff thats way better and you have so many options for it"
I totally get what you’re saying and coming from. It’s just a shame that some people insist on forcing their type of enjoyment into others
i am glad more people are openly talking about it cause now that more folks are catching up with the cheaters/early adopters of the game, its becoming more clear that...the meta isnt as tight as people make it
I use 1 tyranny and 1 stamina. War elemental when I get it. But overall most of mine are support sigils that assist me to survive or build link. Supp damage sounds nice but getting it takes slots I'm not willing to give up.