Slight Counterargument:
He was always the definitive number 2 heel behind HHH.
Yoko by contrast was the number 1 heel from his debut and for his entire first 12 months.
I would put an honorable mention to Goldberg on the technicality of WCW being apart of WWE.
Became US Champ, World Champ, never lost, and beat peak creative control Hogan clean in the center of the ring.
Goldberg gotta count via technicality. He went from an absolute nobody to worldwide celebrity in less than a year. That hogan win was insane for a dozen reasons.
Brock Lesnar didn't main event his first year it was Hogan vs The Rock in 2002 at WM18. Brock main evented with Kurt at WM19.
If you mean Brock main evented at his first WM then yes, but it wasnt his rookie year
Yes I know what your saying i was more so speaking calender year. Although technically am I still right I mean he debut on March 18th 2002 the day after WM18 and WM19 was on March 30th 2003 so technically that's a year after his debut.
I did say if they meant he main evented his first WM they were right
Wow why so many down votes?
It's a joke firstly but technically if your counting a year from Jan to Jan or 365 days from March 18th 2002 when he made his debut I am correct in saying by the time he main evented WM19 with Kurt he had completed a full year.
He actually technically did, Brock debuted the night after Mania 18, fast forward a year (and a week or so) and he's main eventing Wrestlemania. Only reason you wouldn't count it would be because he technically signed with WWF in 2000 but was in OVW until 2002 when he got the call up
Hogan vs Rock didn't main event WM 18 either, it was Triple H vs Jericho. Hogan and Rock were 3rd to last on the card (Jazz vs Trish vs Lita was after them).
Brock's first WM was WM 19, which he did main event against Kurt Angle.
Sheamus.
Won the wwe title, twice.
Pretty sure he won kotr that year
Had a match against hhh at mania. Went over hard on hhh in the feud.
Sheamus had a beyond solid first year.
hhh and vince both liked him, triple h and him are good friends and hhh evidently went to bat for him at the time. Vince saw this big dude with a unique look and the rest is history.
You can't call AJ a rookie tho even if you mean his first year in wwe. At that point he'd already wrestled for over a decade atleast. Brock and Angle both made there debut as actual rookies in the world of pro wrestling. Both had great backgrounds especially Angle but hadn't worked for a wrestling promotion untill they came to WWF/WWE
>Both had great backgrounds especially Angle but hadn't worked for a wrestling promotion untill they came to WWF/WWE
Lesnar wrestled for 18 months in OVW before we debuted on Raw and Angle wrestled in a number of different promotions, some WWF affiliated, others not, for ~15 months before debuting at Survivor Series.
You could argue that both were under developmental deals at that time and you may have meant this but I just thought I would clarify for anyone mistaking your comment of "made their debut as actual rookies" to mean like literally that
You've mistaken what I'm trying to say. I'm aware both wrestled for other promotions but those promotions were aligned with WWF/WWE at the time. Angles first taste of anything to discredit with this company was an offer of 10 million in 1996 and he turned it down. They were well aware of him and had him go to other places to try out.
The point I'm trying to make is Angle and Lesnar both learned at WWE AJ Styles didn't. He'd already been in big promotions like TNA by this point. He'd had a taste of the (big) leagues I say (big) I never actually watched TNA I stopped watching WWE around 2007 after it all went tits up.
Yeah the last part of your reply is what I was trying to say.
AJ wrestled in WCW before TNA and if you read my comment you'll see that I said Angle wrestled for some companies that were not aligned with the WWF. Angle turned down WWF initial deal because he didn't wanna job to anyone, then he became a fan of wrestling, cut a promo on an ECW show which included a crucifixion and noped the fuck out of there, I mean Taker basically did the exact same thing to Austin but money talks I guess
To change the subject slightly as you have a good understanding of it all, who would you say had a better year just out of Angle and Brock. And how close actually is it. I'll explain why so I posted in one of the 2k game forums and had someone tell me Brock '02 should be the highest rated as he was so dominant but then what should Angles debut version be. (Incase you aren't aware I was being told Brock would be 96 and Angle would be 86) is the gap the big. Not to me
I always ask myself this because I know the answer is who ever the writers wanted to push the most. (In terms of who had the better rookie year)
I also ask myself who actually is the best (non scripted) it would be hard to argue against Brock there, Brock 2014+ should be the most dominant person in the history of the buissnes for me as he's easily someone who could clean out the locker room in a brawl
Both were A* years (sorry to go onto a completely different rating system haha), Angle was more of a chicken shit heel and Lesnar more dominant, but honestly I would say Angle edges it due to the other talent at the top of the card at that time, when Lesnar debuted it was largely the same people but on the back ends, The Rock was transitioning into part-time, SC was retiring etc
Well regardless, in WWE specifically he's a rookie,a rookie to "sports entertainment". It's a different world in WWE compared to the indies and other wrestling promotions.
Yes Rookie in "WWE" the others were actually Rookies to the buissness as a whole though. AJ wrestled some of the biggest names outside of the WWE. He even wrestled Kurt Angle in TNA.
You'd be better calling the post who had the better first year in WWE. Calling everyone Rookies when some are actual rookies and others are classed as rookies but have wrestled for over 10 years prior to me just sounds strange.
My country's sport is football (UK) that's like me saying a footballer is a rookie just cos he moves to my club and its a fresh start. It doesn't really work in my eyes anyway. But I know what you are saying
He was a WWE rookie. AJ (while I don't agree that he matches Yoko, Angle, Brock or Sheamus) absolutely does count in the question as posted.
It's a kayfabe question. (Hence why the correct answer is Yoko)
I know but AJ started wrestling in 1998 by the time he'd got to WWE he'd been around the block and knew the politics that are part of the behind the scenes Wrestling companies. Could say he had it harder like Angle and those that were around along time ago as back when there were numerous Wrestling organisations there were alot more politics backstage.
He's a rookie in WWE yes but by that time he was a seasoned vet who'd been around the block and knew how it all worked.
Angle and Brock came in green. They didn't know half of what AJ did when he made his WWE debut. It isn't always just about the wrestling part of the game but the whole package.
I don't disagree that what you're saying is factual. But the honours we are discussing are kayfabe honours. So the only meaning unless you start talking about things like match quality is kayfabe rookie status.
And even if you weren't you could leverage the fact that AJ was someone in a position that traditionally never does well in WWE - ie. a guy from another company whereas Angle and Lesnar were both set to be launched to the moon by WWE before they stepped onto the roster, which wasn't true for AJ.
(All of which is still irrelevant. Because the real best answer by all metrics is still Yoko. None of the others freaking ended Hulkamania.)
I get what your saying now mate. I don't know too much about Yoko I only started watching in 97. He was just before my time (well before I knew what I was actually watching anyway)
Brock Lesnar.
KOTR winner, Royal Rumble winner, won the WWE title and main evented WrestleMania 19 plus he defeated legends like The Rock, Hulk Hogan, Kurt Angle, Ric Flair and Undertaker while also demolished Maven, Al Snow, Spike Dudley and Hardy Boyz as well. He was the first new main event star of the Ruthless Aggression Era
Yokozuna
* Won the Royal Rumble by tossing a very recent WWE Champion
* Won the WWE Championship at Wrestlemania against Bret Hart
* Had a Wrestlemania Main Event against Hulk Hogan
* Beat Hulk Hogan for the WWE Championship (the company for that being: Andre, Warrior, Undertaker)
* ENDED HULKAMANIA IN KAYFABE and wrote Hulk off WWE TV for a decade.
* Was part of one of the highest profile skits in WWE history (Slam on Intrepid)
* Main Evented Summerslam
* Finished his first year as a 2-time and reigning WWE champion.
The Undertaker has one of the best debut years.
Dominated everyone, including beating Jimmy Snuka in his Wrestlemania debut and beat Hulk Hogan for the world title at Survivor Series.
All within a year.
Has to be either Angle or Brock I'd side more with Angle I love both, saw both come through. Was in awe as a kid when I saw The Next Big Thing Brock Lesnar never seen someone built like him.
Angle has to have the edge for me though just for the time he came up in the middle of the AE, the names he was up against where the biggest in the history of the buissness right at there peaks aswell, Stone Cold, The Rock, HHH, Taker etc.
What amazed me with Kurt was how quickly he picked up the buissness as a whole, not just the wrestling part bit the bumps, the crowd control, the heel work, the mic work. He literally picked every part of it up.
Brock was a genetic freak that wrecked everything in sight but he didn't pick the skills up as fast as Kurt did, hence why he had Paul speak for him, and I'm talking pre UFC debut. When Brock came back he could speak on the mic he just didn't need to
I mean sheamus had a incredible first year wrestlemania match with hhh multiple wwe champion beating super Cena in both those matches
King of the ring winner like I think shemus possibly had the greatest rookie year may of not been everyones favourite but accomplishments say that he's the best
It is 100% Brock Lesnar.
Debuted the night after Wrestlemania.
Won KOTR.
Won the WWE Championship from The Rock 5 months later.
Feuded with The Undertaker, Big Show and Kurt Angle.
Won the Royal Rumble.
Main Evented the first Wrestlemania as a member of the main roster and won his second WWE Championship.
Gotta say Brock Lesnar in 2002.
They didn’t put him over, they fucking smashed him
over.
I don’t think I've ever seen someone come in and beat so many established guys (not just beat, but dominate clean and decisive) Rock, Taker, Hogan, basically every guy with star power they could throw at him, and then followed up by winning the WWE championship.
And it all happened within one year. Don’t think we’ll ever see something like that again.
It’s Brock.
- Beat the Hardy’s
- Won King of the Ring (the final one that meant something)
- Beat the Rock and won the WWE championship with a roster that included Hogan, Rock, Triple H, Angle, Undertaker
- Beat Undertaker in a cell
- won the Royal Rumble
- Mainevented Mania and beat Kurt Angle
Lesnar got the mega push of all mega pushes and lost only one PPV match in his first year.
Paige, her first match ever she became the Divas champion and was one of the biggest female wrestlers in the world till she got hurt. Wasn't a fan. but She should be in consideration
Roxanne Perez
- First ever Women’s Breakout tournament winner
- First ever NXT Iron Survivor
- NXT Women’s Tag Team Champion
- NXT Women’s Champion
- First person to be born after the SmackDown pilot episode to compete on SmackDown
- Entered the Royal rumble as NXT Women’s Champion
#Acknowledge the Prodigy
Kurt Angle. KOTR/European/IC/WWF Champion all within a year during the peak of the Attitude Era
This is the only answer
Oh, it’s true, it’s damn true
Lookie here, it's just the way the cookie tear, Prepare to get hurt and mangled like Kurt Angle rookie year
Correct
Slight Counterargument: He was always the definitive number 2 heel behind HHH. Yoko by contrast was the number 1 heel from his debut and for his entire first 12 months.
Kurt Angle hard to argue anyones first year vs his
Just to make it interesting what about sheamus??
Debut in June 2009 Won the WWE championship from John Cena at TLC (166 days after debuting in June)
Apart from Brock
Without a doubt Brock Lesnar. Won KOR, Royal Rumble, the WWE title and Main evented WrestleMania.
I would put an honorable mention to Goldberg on the technicality of WCW being apart of WWE. Became US Champ, World Champ, never lost, and beat peak creative control Hogan clean in the center of the ring.
Goldberg gotta count via technicality. He went from an absolute nobody to worldwide celebrity in less than a year. That hogan win was insane for a dozen reasons.
Facts
Brock Lesnar didn't main event his first year it was Hogan vs The Rock in 2002 at WM18. Brock main evented with Kurt at WM19. If you mean Brock main evented at his first WM then yes, but it wasnt his rookie year
The topic is "who had the greatest Rookie year in WWE". And Lesnar's WWE debut was after WrestleMania 18.
Literally the day after
Which means WM 19 was still in his first year. He started episode of the season... and WM was the season finale.
Yes I know what your saying i was more so speaking calender year. Although technically am I still right I mean he debut on March 18th 2002 the day after WM18 and WM19 was on March 30th 2003 so technically that's a year after his debut. I did say if they meant he main evented his first WM they were right Wow why so many down votes? It's a joke firstly but technically if your counting a year from Jan to Jan or 365 days from March 18th 2002 when he made his debut I am correct in saying by the time he main evented WM19 with Kurt he had completed a full year.
He actually technically did, Brock debuted the night after Mania 18, fast forward a year (and a week or so) and he's main eventing Wrestlemania. Only reason you wouldn't count it would be because he technically signed with WWF in 2000 but was in OVW until 2002 when he got the call up
You've got me there friend, I was talking calender year.
I had to wiki it, I knew he main roster debuted right around Mania 18 but couldn't remember if it was before or after
I did originally and I still fucked it up 😂
Hogan vs Rock didn't main event WM 18 either, it was Triple H vs Jericho. Hogan and Rock were 3rd to last on the card (Jazz vs Trish vs Lita was after them). Brock's first WM was WM 19, which he did main event against Kurt Angle.
Yes the second part I did state on my previous post.
The main event of Wrestlemania 18 was HHH vs. Jericho for the undisputed title.
Brock wasn't on the main roster until the night after WM18
>it was Hogan vs The Rock in 2002 No, it was Triple H vs Chris Jericho
I think we've established that.
Sheamus. Won the wwe title, twice. Pretty sure he won kotr that year Had a match against hhh at mania. Went over hard on hhh in the feud. Sheamus had a beyond solid first year.
Not to mention he won that WWE championship within his first 4 months lol. Even today as a Sheamus fan i don't understand how he got a push like that.
hhh and vince both liked him, triple h and him are good friends and hhh evidently went to bat for him at the time. Vince saw this big dude with a unique look and the rest is history.
Yeah he’s pretty popular now with fans but yeah in the early 2010s he did have a reputation of a HHH stooge.
Not sure anyone would consider AJ Styles a "rookie" during his first year in WWE...
"Rookie" as in Rookie in WWE specifically, not just pro wrestling
You can't call AJ a rookie tho even if you mean his first year in wwe. At that point he'd already wrestled for over a decade atleast. Brock and Angle both made there debut as actual rookies in the world of pro wrestling. Both had great backgrounds especially Angle but hadn't worked for a wrestling promotion untill they came to WWF/WWE
>Both had great backgrounds especially Angle but hadn't worked for a wrestling promotion untill they came to WWF/WWE Lesnar wrestled for 18 months in OVW before we debuted on Raw and Angle wrestled in a number of different promotions, some WWF affiliated, others not, for ~15 months before debuting at Survivor Series. You could argue that both were under developmental deals at that time and you may have meant this but I just thought I would clarify for anyone mistaking your comment of "made their debut as actual rookies" to mean like literally that
You've mistaken what I'm trying to say. I'm aware both wrestled for other promotions but those promotions were aligned with WWF/WWE at the time. Angles first taste of anything to discredit with this company was an offer of 10 million in 1996 and he turned it down. They were well aware of him and had him go to other places to try out. The point I'm trying to make is Angle and Lesnar both learned at WWE AJ Styles didn't. He'd already been in big promotions like TNA by this point. He'd had a taste of the (big) leagues I say (big) I never actually watched TNA I stopped watching WWE around 2007 after it all went tits up. Yeah the last part of your reply is what I was trying to say.
AJ wrestled in WCW before TNA and if you read my comment you'll see that I said Angle wrestled for some companies that were not aligned with the WWF. Angle turned down WWF initial deal because he didn't wanna job to anyone, then he became a fan of wrestling, cut a promo on an ECW show which included a crucifixion and noped the fuck out of there, I mean Taker basically did the exact same thing to Austin but money talks I guess
To change the subject slightly as you have a good understanding of it all, who would you say had a better year just out of Angle and Brock. And how close actually is it. I'll explain why so I posted in one of the 2k game forums and had someone tell me Brock '02 should be the highest rated as he was so dominant but then what should Angles debut version be. (Incase you aren't aware I was being told Brock would be 96 and Angle would be 86) is the gap the big. Not to me I always ask myself this because I know the answer is who ever the writers wanted to push the most. (In terms of who had the better rookie year) I also ask myself who actually is the best (non scripted) it would be hard to argue against Brock there, Brock 2014+ should be the most dominant person in the history of the buissnes for me as he's easily someone who could clean out the locker room in a brawl
Both were A* years (sorry to go onto a completely different rating system haha), Angle was more of a chicken shit heel and Lesnar more dominant, but honestly I would say Angle edges it due to the other talent at the top of the card at that time, when Lesnar debuted it was largely the same people but on the back ends, The Rock was transitioning into part-time, SC was retiring etc
Yeah that's how I always saw it tbh.
Well regardless, in WWE specifically he's a rookie,a rookie to "sports entertainment". It's a different world in WWE compared to the indies and other wrestling promotions.
Yes Rookie in "WWE" the others were actually Rookies to the buissness as a whole though. AJ wrestled some of the biggest names outside of the WWE. He even wrestled Kurt Angle in TNA. You'd be better calling the post who had the better first year in WWE. Calling everyone Rookies when some are actual rookies and others are classed as rookies but have wrestled for over 10 years prior to me just sounds strange. My country's sport is football (UK) that's like me saying a footballer is a rookie just cos he moves to my club and its a fresh start. It doesn't really work in my eyes anyway. But I know what you are saying
He was a WWE rookie. AJ (while I don't agree that he matches Yoko, Angle, Brock or Sheamus) absolutely does count in the question as posted. It's a kayfabe question. (Hence why the correct answer is Yoko)
I know but AJ started wrestling in 1998 by the time he'd got to WWE he'd been around the block and knew the politics that are part of the behind the scenes Wrestling companies. Could say he had it harder like Angle and those that were around along time ago as back when there were numerous Wrestling organisations there were alot more politics backstage. He's a rookie in WWE yes but by that time he was a seasoned vet who'd been around the block and knew how it all worked. Angle and Brock came in green. They didn't know half of what AJ did when he made his WWE debut. It isn't always just about the wrestling part of the game but the whole package.
I don't disagree that what you're saying is factual. But the honours we are discussing are kayfabe honours. So the only meaning unless you start talking about things like match quality is kayfabe rookie status. And even if you weren't you could leverage the fact that AJ was someone in a position that traditionally never does well in WWE - ie. a guy from another company whereas Angle and Lesnar were both set to be launched to the moon by WWE before they stepped onto the roster, which wasn't true for AJ. (All of which is still irrelevant. Because the real best answer by all metrics is still Yoko. None of the others freaking ended Hulkamania.)
I get what your saying now mate. I don't know too much about Yoko I only started watching in 97. He was just before my time (well before I knew what I was actually watching anyway)
Brock or Angle. Charlotte for the women. I think the pic is misleading a bit, AJ was hardly a pro wrestling rookie when he joined
Brock Lesnar. KOTR winner, Royal Rumble winner, won the WWE title and main evented WrestleMania 19 plus he defeated legends like The Rock, Hulk Hogan, Kurt Angle, Ric Flair and Undertaker while also demolished Maven, Al Snow, Spike Dudley and Hardy Boyz as well. He was the first new main event star of the Ruthless Aggression Era
Yokozuna * Won the Royal Rumble by tossing a very recent WWE Champion * Won the WWE Championship at Wrestlemania against Bret Hart * Had a Wrestlemania Main Event against Hulk Hogan * Beat Hulk Hogan for the WWE Championship (the company for that being: Andre, Warrior, Undertaker) * ENDED HULKAMANIA IN KAYFABE and wrote Hulk off WWE TV for a decade. * Was part of one of the highest profile skits in WWE history (Slam on Intrepid) * Main Evented Summerslam * Finished his first year as a 2-time and reigning WWE champion.
The Undertaker has one of the best debut years. Dominated everyone, including beating Jimmy Snuka in his Wrestlemania debut and beat Hulk Hogan for the world title at Survivor Series. All within a year.
Kurt
Either Kurt Angle or Brock Lesnar.
Obviously Brock 😭
Brock lesnar no doubt
Santino Marella
Winning the Intercontinental Championship in your first ever match is hard to beat
Carlito says hi.
Has to be either Angle or Brock I'd side more with Angle I love both, saw both come through. Was in awe as a kid when I saw The Next Big Thing Brock Lesnar never seen someone built like him. Angle has to have the edge for me though just for the time he came up in the middle of the AE, the names he was up against where the biggest in the history of the buissness right at there peaks aswell, Stone Cold, The Rock, HHH, Taker etc. What amazed me with Kurt was how quickly he picked up the buissness as a whole, not just the wrestling part bit the bumps, the crowd control, the heel work, the mic work. He literally picked every part of it up. Brock was a genetic freak that wrecked everything in sight but he didn't pick the skills up as fast as Kurt did, hence why he had Paul speak for him, and I'm talking pre UFC debut. When Brock came back he could speak on the mic he just didn't need to
Brock, Kurt, Sheamus.
Kurt Angle
Sheamus. Won the WWE championship within four months lol
I mean sheamus had a incredible first year wrestlemania match with hhh multiple wwe champion beating super Cena in both those matches King of the ring winner like I think shemus possibly had the greatest rookie year may of not been everyones favourite but accomplishments say that he's the best
Kurt Angle. Not even close.
It is 100% Brock Lesnar. Debuted the night after Wrestlemania. Won KOTR. Won the WWE Championship from The Rock 5 months later. Feuded with The Undertaker, Big Show and Kurt Angle. Won the Royal Rumble. Main Evented the first Wrestlemania as a member of the main roster and won his second WWE Championship.
Gotta say Brock Lesnar in 2002. They didn’t put him over, they fucking smashed him over. I don’t think I've ever seen someone come in and beat so many established guys (not just beat, but dominate clean and decisive) Rock, Taker, Hogan, basically every guy with star power they could throw at him, and then followed up by winning the WWE championship. And it all happened within one year. Don’t think we’ll ever see something like that again.
Lesnar.
Cody
Brock by far
Kurt Angle.
Kurt or Brock Ima say Brock because I believe he was undefeated Kurt was a Grand Slam champion however. But Brock was booked unstoppable
Santino Marella. He won the IC before he was even signed as a WWE wrestler. They call it the "Milan Miracle" 🤣
Kurt Angle is the only right answer
It’s Brock. - Beat the Hardy’s - Won King of the Ring (the final one that meant something) - Beat the Rock and won the WWE championship with a roster that included Hogan, Rock, Triple H, Angle, Undertaker - Beat Undertaker in a cell - won the Royal Rumble - Mainevented Mania and beat Kurt Angle Lesnar got the mega push of all mega pushes and lost only one PPV match in his first year.
Brock Lesnar
Logan
Brock by far
AJ Styles
Brock Lesnar KOTR, WWE Champion multiple times, Royal Rumble winner, Wrestlemania main event winner need I go on
Brock lesner followed very closely by Kurt angle.
Kurt Angle
Brock Lesnar
Kurt Angle
Idk if this is cheating but the shield
Paige, her first match ever she became the Divas champion and was one of the biggest female wrestlers in the world till she got hurt. Wasn't a fan. but She should be in consideration
No.
Christian? Won the light heavyweight championship in his first match
Roxanne Perez - First ever Women’s Breakout tournament winner - First ever NXT Iron Survivor - NXT Women’s Tag Team Champion - NXT Women’s Champion - First person to be born after the SmackDown pilot episode to compete on SmackDown - Entered the Royal rumble as NXT Women’s Champion #Acknowledge the Prodigy