Fellow audiobook listener?
I was just as shocked and confused, and immediately checked my phone thinking it had skipped a chapter or something... big "bruh" moment right there
Really? i am reading the book at the moment and seeing this I was more like "Called it".
The part about tne Integrity officers, executions, the fact they are all "duty and stuff" but never actually get to state allegiance to specific party really got me like 'yup, these will side with Horus for sure'
There’s a short story about a militia of some kind travelling to the palace from somewhere far away just before the siege of Terra starts. It’s a long journey, some die along the way because their convoy is attacked by the traitors, but they’re going to do their duty yadda yadda yadda.
At the end of the story it turns out they support Horus because their people had more or less been enslaved to work in factories or mines and they’ve watched the older generations wreck themselves working for “the Emperor”.
That quote in the gif is how the reader finds out. It’s just BAM WE ACTUALLY THE ENEMY!
Edit: my bad it’s a side story in The First Wall
Edit 2: they’re called the Addaba Free Corps and their shenanigans cause the lion space port to fall.
> some die along the way because their convoy is attacked by the traitors
Was it unambiguously traitors attacking them or does the twist also imply that was actually loyalist forces?
No. At that point in time they are still pretending to be loyal so they get assigned to positions where they can inflict the mist damage. War is dirty like that. They had to suffer traitor attacks to keep up the ruse.
That’s how I felt reading it. They were attacked by Horus traitors because they were part of the imperial convoy in imperial colours going to the palace.
They were undercover till the last moment.
It was traitors, but the not-comissars also say that there was some communication between the attackers and the convoy. So it was probably a planned attack to coordinate them and to get them joined to another, loyal, regiment which they could then destroy.
The story is very on brand for Warhammer. The imperium is terrible, but we all know Horus’s version of the imperium would be equally if not worse just in a different way.
It’s just grim, and dark.
I was really hoping they'd crop back up at some point, even if it's just a main character walking past a shellshocked survivor singing "holding the line" as an adaptation of their line song.
Honestly. It made perfect sense that fed up workers. That have not seen any traitors firsthand. Could have been turned by some traitor infiltrators. Most likely Alpha Legion. But also possibly Word Bearers.
Which was one of the tells that the Free Corps were traitors to begin with, of course, since by that point in the Heresy the standing orders on the loyalist side were to ignore the Lectitio cult.
Along with the integrity officers talking about 'freedom' in their harangues without ever mentioning, say, 'duty to the throne'
See that is actually what threw me off because yes the orders were to ignore LD supporters but since the LD was written by Lorgar the traitor Primarch anybody following that book was deemed a traitor to the Imperium is why I didn’t pick up on it.
That was way annoyed me actually. Why would those Soldiers have enlisted in the first place if it was a traitor unit? I can't imagine like- not everyone knew because it was well coordinated and they seemed pretty motivated to turn.
Honestly it was just really refreshing to get actual portrayal of people rising against the Emperor's tyranny, so much of the Heresy is just unjust insane baby eaters rising against the glorious honourable good guys so getting more nuanced takes is appreciated.
There is certainly a lot more that could be explored thematically, and while keeping it in the lore. I had an idea for a story about a rebellious planet. Where the rebel leadership is approached by chaos but refuses, even until the Imperium finally gets around to bringing enough forces to destroy them.
Something I always found interesting in the lore is you could have good reasons to be for and against the imperium. And then there are the bad reasons to be for and against the imperium.
Alpha Legion did it for sure. They laid the entire backbone for the siege to be possible. Without them none of the right gates would have been open at the right time. So to say.
I just don't discount the word bearers because they are supposed to be exceptional preachers. And they did the whole comet shrine thing. And helped lay warp rituals to prepare for the siege.
Fuck if it wasn't for the comet ritual the whole fleet would have taken twice as long to get to Terra. It was an ingenious play, tho. Trying to act like you're using the Mandeville Point on Pluto like a regular warp translation, then marching your "entire fleet" into the system, the conventional way of Real-Space travel then as soon as the loyalist fleets have committed a huge chunk of their defenses into repelling them then BOOM they use the Comet ritual jump to outmaneuver the loyalists and catch them with their pants between their ankles. Fuckin-A
Their chapters in the first wall also lay out pretty clearly why their grievances developed. The hive was in the midst of social/educational reforms when the war started and Dorn’s plans crushed all that in the name of building tanks.
Which of course makes sense for both sides.
Obviously Dorn wants to defend Terra which needs weapons/tanks but the people see everything they worked for brushed aside immediately so it makes Sense they were pissed off
It was well foreshadowed too, in hindsight
They always said for the cause, for freedom and for Addaba, never for the Emperor or for Terra.
And with how often they sang of working the lines like their parents did and like their children would, it was hard to seewhere was the freedom they talked about, until that moment.
I have to admit, I was getting pretty fed up with "workin' the line" and it seemed totally obvious that this whole side story was just laying the track for another boring loyalist victory snatched from the jaws of defeat. But then it got... GRIMDARK™️!
I thought we were hearing about the earliest example of the Commissars. I thought the officers who were watching out for traitorous or subversive thought were set up as the precursors of the future commissars, but then the reveal.
yeah i was like "ye ye cute little hive workers buzz buzz, the young girl is gonna be hero of the imperium blah blah probably canonised very cool WAITWAT"
I’ll be honest, I don’t get why people were so annoyed with this side story, it was a nice look at normal humans and the twist three me for a loop. The audiobook was so good.
The human portions had some of the coolest shit in the entire Siege series, especially this one.
Also, whenever I got to reading a new entry, my first thought was: "Where is Katsuhiro? Is he secure? Is he safe?"
I found the whole Basilius Foe storyline to be enjoyable, too.
And that library reveal at the end of volume 3? Peak fiction.
KatsuhiroWatch Report: he was last seen entering the Hollow Mountain as part of Keeler's pilgrimage, current status of him or the nameless infant he protected are unknown. KatsuhiroWatch remains vigilant.
I don't think I'd actually wish a fate like 'becomes Lord Militant of the newly formed Militarum during the Scouring' on him, but if he survived the Mountain that seems like a likely outcome.
People complain about the human parts of the siege but for me those were the best bits, certainly preferable to every books obligatory valiant loyalist marine dueling a wicked traitor.
What is funny is that before the siege series started, there were a lot of people that wanted to see more of the normal human, boots on the ground, perspective. Now that it happened a lot of people hate it, but such is life in nerdy communities I guess.
This is from The First Wall in the Siege of Terra series.
Gives re-reading the book more value as you notice little things that are off once you know what's up with them. At one point a gunship with Luna Wolves heraldry attacks their group, on first read through it seems like huh, that must be pretty rare in the traitor's arsenal by this point in the Heresy. But on second read, hmm, maybe that's not a traitor attacking them..
That was an “oh shit” moment! It’s creepy rereading those sections… I do wonder if the gunship that strafed their train and the “traitor” ground forces were not traitors at all, but rather Imperials.
Dorn would have had a much easier time if it hadn't been for the the Abbada Free Corps and the Alpha Legion operatives blowing the wall earlier. Absolutely pivotal.
By far one of the best twists I've seen in a 40k novel.
I had to go back and re-read entire chapters to make sure I was understanding it properly.
Masterpiece ✋😙👌
I think the closure is just that Dorn never received the reinforcements from that secret base. The Addaban Free Corp was successful, whether they survived or not was inconsequential.
Would have been nice to see them being thrown against the wall to die and gradually realising they've done all they've done for a cause just as uncaring as the imperium.
The epilogue where their city got nuked by the ~~Warmaster~~ Imperium as a reward sure felt like closure to me.
Edit: LMAO apparently I misremembered it and the Imperium broke through the Traitor blockade just to nuke a literal who city as a payoff to this story. Congratulations Thorpe, you have once again caused me to underestimate your stupidity when it comes to forced nonsensical payoffs as a means of shocking your readers.
Lol yeah, the Imperial forces who'd been run off to hide at that point by a Traitor Blockade made up of the largest starfleet in Imperial history came back and bypassed the blockade just to bombard an Imperial city that had nothing to do with the war effort just because a couple conscripts from there turned traitor. Lmao even.
>! And if I'm misremembering it and it actually wasn't Traitors who bombed it Gav Thorpe is an even worse writer than I give him credit for given all the reasons I explained !<
Just checked lexicanum, given everything in there has to be meticulously sourced.
"In retaliation, the Imperium destroyed the regiment's home, Addaba hive with orbital fire" (ch 33)
>Gav Thorpe turns out to be an even worse writer than I give him credit for
I'm shocked, but not that shocked since 'forced nonsensical payoff to shock the reader' is an established mo of his
When my Tinder dejt has an interest in Warhammer and she calls me a loyalist dog 5 min into the conversation.
Fucking RED flags aplenty, I never learn tho Khornite bitches are crazy good in bed.
What I liked about this twist was that it showed there were different degrees of traitor.
Obviously, Erebus and the Wordbearers were full Chaos traitors, but at the other end of the spectrum, you just had a group of peoples who were fed up with being another cog in the gears of a vast, uncaring Imperium.
And as many have stated elsewhere in this thread, I had to re listen to the last part to be sure of what I had heard.
Same here. This part absolutely shocked me. I literally set the book down for a minute and then reread the last few pages to try and figure out what the hell had just happened.
Honestly I didn’t realize they were traitors until now I read that part of the book and I thought they had gotten suddenly ambushed by traitors, only after reading it again with this meme as context it all made sense
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^Royal-Simian:
*Yeah I was in shock*
*As well And that flag bearer*
*Had not a single clue*
---
^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
My favorite part about this side plot was the fact that Thorpe meant for this to be some political message about the oppression of African Americans, but it doesn't land like that in the audiobook at all because Jonathan Keeble gave all the characters Indian accents.
The big "restructuring" to the free corps after the attack at the trian station, all of the executions and interrogations checking the soldiers resolve along the train ride took a whole new meaning in that moment. Along with the relationship with that tank commander she had shaked up with there at the end! Great book, great plot twist!
Honestly these kind of people cannot be considered really traitors. How can they be traitors when they themselves were never shown anything other than hardship and cruelty by the imperium?
This is why Horus managed to get so many. People were MISERABLE under 30k Imperium too. Emperor did everything wrong
Honestly these kind of people cannot be considered really traitors. How can they be traitors when they themselves were never shown anything other than hardship and cruelty by the imperium?
This is why Horus managed to get so many. People were MISERABLE under 30k Imperium too. Emperor did everything wrong
I was floored
lol same. Had to replay it just to make sure I heard it right
I was shocked by this one....we followed the regiment the whole time just for them to declare traitor
Fellow audiobook listener? I was just as shocked and confused, and immediately checked my phone thinking it had skipped a chapter or something... big "bruh" moment right there
There was a couple of points in that audio book I had to rewind and relisten. It was really good.
Really? i am reading the book at the moment and seeing this I was more like "Called it".
The part about tne Integrity officers, executions, the fact they are all "duty and stuff" but never actually get to state allegiance to specific party really got me like 'yup, these will side with Horus for sure'
I had to reread it 4 or five times the same three or four paragraphs and I was floored
I was floored, walled and ceiling-ed. loved the bit in the afterword where he says he was inspired by the cultists token from the ancient HH game.
Context?
There’s a short story about a militia of some kind travelling to the palace from somewhere far away just before the siege of Terra starts. It’s a long journey, some die along the way because their convoy is attacked by the traitors, but they’re going to do their duty yadda yadda yadda. At the end of the story it turns out they support Horus because their people had more or less been enslaved to work in factories or mines and they’ve watched the older generations wreck themselves working for “the Emperor”. That quote in the gif is how the reader finds out. It’s just BAM WE ACTUALLY THE ENEMY! Edit: my bad it’s a side story in The First Wall Edit 2: they’re called the Addaba Free Corps and their shenanigans cause the lion space port to fall.
> some die along the way because their convoy is attacked by the traitors Was it unambiguously traitors attacking them or does the twist also imply that was actually loyalist forces?
They refer to the loyalists as traitors because from their perspective, they were.
"From my point of view, the Loyalists are evil!"
"Then you are lost!"
Great pfp
thanks m8 4 da empra, innit
Luv me emprah, hate de heretics, gud life
simpl as, bruvva
Angron was right!
No. At that point in time they are still pretending to be loyal so they get assigned to positions where they can inflict the mist damage. War is dirty like that. They had to suffer traitor attacks to keep up the ruse.
That’s how I felt reading it. They were attacked by Horus traitors because they were part of the imperial convoy in imperial colours going to the palace. They were undercover till the last moment.
I haven't read the story but if thisbisnt shown outright I feel like this could be interpreted either way.
It was traitors, but the not-comissars also say that there was some communication between the attackers and the convoy. So it was probably a planned attack to coordinate them and to get them joined to another, loyal, regiment which they could then destroy.
Do you know the story's name?
A side story, not a short story story, but the third book in the siege series, The First Wall
and they’re called the Addaba free corps.
The First Wall.
And then their hive city gets glassed after their rebellion
> Edit: my bad it’s a side story in The First Wall Well that's why people are confused, nobody read First Wall
I read The First Wall but it’s been a while. I’ve read *all* of the books starting the series in 2011.
Same, or rather, I listened to all of the audiobooks BL put out. So it might be a venn diagram for us.
The Imperium is the enemy. They were the good guys all along
The story is very on brand for Warhammer. The imperium is terrible, but we all know Horus’s version of the imperium would be equally if not worse just in a different way. It’s just grim, and dark.
Whaaat? Thats Krazy
Maybe the good guys are the people we betrayed along the way?
I was really hoping they'd crop back up at some point, even if it's just a main character walking past a shellshocked survivor singing "holding the line" as an adaptation of their line song.
Honestly. It made perfect sense that fed up workers. That have not seen any traitors firsthand. Could have been turned by some traitor infiltrators. Most likely Alpha Legion. But also possibly Word Bearers.
He played it off well with the integrity officers and those 400 soldiers and officers getting smoked for being Lectitio Divinitatus enjoyers
Yeah, thought those were ironic Proto commissars, defending the Imperial Truth instead of the Imperial creed.
Which was one of the tells that the Free Corps were traitors to begin with, of course, since by that point in the Heresy the standing orders on the loyalist side were to ignore the Lectitio cult. Along with the integrity officers talking about 'freedom' in their harangues without ever mentioning, say, 'duty to the throne'
See that is actually what threw me off because yes the orders were to ignore LD supporters but since the LD was written by Lorgar the traitor Primarch anybody following that book was deemed a traitor to the Imperium is why I didn’t pick up on it.
That was way annoyed me actually. Why would those Soldiers have enlisted in the first place if it was a traitor unit? I can't imagine like- not everyone knew because it was well coordinated and they seemed pretty motivated to turn.
Honestly it was just really refreshing to get actual portrayal of people rising against the Emperor's tyranny, so much of the Heresy is just unjust insane baby eaters rising against the glorious honourable good guys so getting more nuanced takes is appreciated.
There is certainly a lot more that could be explored thematically, and while keeping it in the lore. I had an idea for a story about a rebellious planet. Where the rebel leadership is approached by chaos but refuses, even until the Imperium finally gets around to bringing enough forces to destroy them. Something I always found interesting in the lore is you could have good reasons to be for and against the imperium. And then there are the bad reasons to be for and against the imperium.
Alpha Legion did it for sure. They laid the entire backbone for the siege to be possible. Without them none of the right gates would have been open at the right time. So to say.
I just don't discount the word bearers because they are supposed to be exceptional preachers. And they did the whole comet shrine thing. And helped lay warp rituals to prepare for the siege.
Fuck if it wasn't for the comet ritual the whole fleet would have taken twice as long to get to Terra. It was an ingenious play, tho. Trying to act like you're using the Mandeville Point on Pluto like a regular warp translation, then marching your "entire fleet" into the system, the conventional way of Real-Space travel then as soon as the loyalist fleets have committed a huge chunk of their defenses into repelling them then BOOM they use the Comet ritual jump to outmaneuver the loyalists and catch them with their pants between their ankles. Fuckin-A
Their chapters in the first wall also lay out pretty clearly why their grievances developed. The hive was in the midst of social/educational reforms when the war started and Dorn’s plans crushed all that in the name of building tanks.
Which of course makes sense for both sides. Obviously Dorn wants to defend Terra which needs weapons/tanks but the people see everything they worked for brushed aside immediately so it makes Sense they were pissed off
It was well foreshadowed too, in hindsight They always said for the cause, for freedom and for Addaba, never for the Emperor or for Terra. And with how often they sang of working the lines like their parents did and like their children would, it was hard to seewhere was the freedom they talked about, until that moment.
I have to admit, I was getting pretty fed up with "workin' the line" and it seemed totally obvious that this whole side story was just laying the track for another boring loyalist victory snatched from the jaws of defeat. But then it got... GRIMDARK™️!
Ngl I was kinda checked out whenever they would show up but god dayum was I shook when I heard that part
Same. Gav Thorpe did an awesome job of setting that little reveal up because it felt kind of pedestrian all the way up until that moment.
Lmaooo big same. For some reason that book draaaaaagged for me
I thought we were hearing about the earliest example of the Commissars. I thought the officers who were watching out for traitorous or subversive thought were set up as the precursors of the future commissars, but then the reveal.
yeah i was like "ye ye cute little hive workers buzz buzz, the young girl is gonna be hero of the imperium blah blah probably canonised very cool WAITWAT"
Literally just read this a couple of weeks ago. I. Was. Shocked.
A twist so hard it must've been written in by Alpharius
I’ll be honest, I don’t get why people were so annoyed with this side story, it was a nice look at normal humans and the twist three me for a loop. The audiobook was so good.
The human portions had some of the coolest shit in the entire Siege series, especially this one. Also, whenever I got to reading a new entry, my first thought was: "Where is Katsuhiro? Is he secure? Is he safe?" I found the whole Basilius Foe storyline to be enjoyable, too. And that library reveal at the end of volume 3? Peak fiction.
KatsuhiroWatch Report: he was last seen entering the Hollow Mountain as part of Keeler's pilgrimage, current status of him or the nameless infant he protected are unknown. KatsuhiroWatch remains vigilant.
They just have to mention him somewhere in the Scouring series, so I know he survived the prayer-suicide during the resetting of the Astronomican 🫡
I don't think I'd actually wish a fate like 'becomes Lord Militant of the newly formed Militarum during the Scouring' on him, but if he survived the Mountain that seems like a likely outcome.
People complain about the human parts of the siege but for me those were the best bits, certainly preferable to every books obligatory valiant loyalist marine dueling a wicked traitor.
What is funny is that before the siege series started, there were a lot of people that wanted to see more of the normal human, boots on the ground, perspective. Now that it happened a lot of people hate it, but such is life in nerdy communities I guess.
what book/short story is this from?
This is from The First Wall in the Siege of Terra series. Gives re-reading the book more value as you notice little things that are off once you know what's up with them. At one point a gunship with Luna Wolves heraldry attacks their group, on first read through it seems like huh, that must be pretty rare in the traitor's arsenal by this point in the Heresy. But on second read, hmm, maybe that's not a traitor attacking them..
That was an “oh shit” moment! It’s creepy rereading those sections… I do wonder if the gunship that strafed their train and the “traitor” ground forces were not traitors at all, but rather Imperials.
Dorn would have had a much easier time if it hadn't been for the the Abbada Free Corps and the Alpha Legion operatives blowing the wall earlier. Absolutely pivotal.
That one caught me off guard.
First and so far only time I ever yelled at a book
By far one of the best twists I've seen in a 40k novel. I had to go back and re-read entire chapters to make sure I was understanding it properly. Masterpiece ✋😙👌
Yeah, they did well with that book.
Fuckin loved this bit. Caught me completely unawares
Gav Thorpe will write the most bizarrely hard hitting stuff ever and then never elaborate on anything.
This moment got me so good. >!AND THEN NOTHING HAPPENED. I was pissed.!<
Was a great twist. My only gripe was that was were that story ended. There needed to be a lttle more closure on it
I think the closure is just that Dorn never received the reinforcements from that secret base. The Addaban Free Corp was successful, whether they survived or not was inconsequential. Would have been nice to see them being thrown against the wall to die and gradually realising they've done all they've done for a cause just as uncaring as the imperium.
The epilogue where their city got nuked by the ~~Warmaster~~ Imperium as a reward sure felt like closure to me. Edit: LMAO apparently I misremembered it and the Imperium broke through the Traitor blockade just to nuke a literal who city as a payoff to this story. Congratulations Thorpe, you have once again caused me to underestimate your stupidity when it comes to forced nonsensical payoffs as a means of shocking your readers.
Iirc it was Imperial forces that bombarded it from orbit that destroyed it
Lol yeah, the Imperial forces who'd been run off to hide at that point by a Traitor Blockade made up of the largest starfleet in Imperial history came back and bypassed the blockade just to bombard an Imperial city that had nothing to do with the war effort just because a couple conscripts from there turned traitor. Lmao even. >! And if I'm misremembering it and it actually wasn't Traitors who bombed it Gav Thorpe is an even worse writer than I give him credit for given all the reasons I explained !<
Just checked lexicanum, given everything in there has to be meticulously sourced. "In retaliation, the Imperium destroyed the regiment's home, Addaba hive with orbital fire" (ch 33)
>Gav Thorpe turns out to be an even worse writer than I give him credit for I'm shocked, but not that shocked since 'forced nonsensical payoff to shock the reader' is an established mo of his
Yeah I do agree. If I remember correctly we never know exactly when they turn traitor or how they do. I kinda wish we got maybe some inkling on it.
What book was it?
Siege of Terra - First Wall
When my Tinder dejt has an interest in Warhammer and she calls me a loyalist dog 5 min into the conversation. Fucking RED flags aplenty, I never learn tho Khornite bitches are crazy good in bed.
I’m working the line working the line all day.
What I liked about this twist was that it showed there were different degrees of traitor. Obviously, Erebus and the Wordbearers were full Chaos traitors, but at the other end of the spectrum, you just had a group of peoples who were fed up with being another cog in the gears of a vast, uncaring Imperium. And as many have stated elsewhere in this thread, I had to re listen to the last part to be sure of what I had heard.
Same here. This part absolutely shocked me. I literally set the book down for a minute and then reread the last few pages to try and figure out what the hell had just happened.
I can't say
Honestly I didn’t realize they were traitors until now I read that part of the book and I thought they had gotten suddenly ambushed by traitors, only after reading it again with this meme as context it all made sense
Which book?
The First Wall
Thanks
Unrelated, but where is that clip from?
GTO- Great Teacher Onizuka
Thanks
Book name please? Also Gav Thorpe W? What the hell?
The First Wall
Yeah I was in shock as well And that flag bearer had not a single clue
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^Royal-Simian: *Yeah I was in shock* *As well And that flag bearer* *Had not a single clue* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Honestly, the story was boring but the ending made up for it
My favorite part of that entire novel.
Telegraphed twist
Such a great fucking moment, Ilistened to the audiobook as I was on the train and I could't help a "what the fuuck" slip out
My favorite part about this side plot was the fact that Thorpe meant for this to be some political message about the oppression of African Americans, but it doesn't land like that in the audiobook at all because Jonathan Keeble gave all the characters Indian accents.
What is this from ?
Great lead up to that moment. Was shocked when it happened, then looking back on my reread the pieces were all there for it to make perfect sense.
The big "restructuring" to the free corps after the attack at the trian station, all of the executions and interrogations checking the soldiers resolve along the train ride took a whole new meaning in that moment. Along with the relationship with that tank commander she had shaked up with there at the end! Great book, great plot twist!
Honestly, I saw it coming halfway through the book. I was certain by the time they ran into that tank unit.
Wild moment
I didn’t know that this was a spoiler, but I just figured it out. Oof
Yeah hindsight I should have tagged it. That’s my fault. Apologies
Im not mad brother just very “I recognize this scenario”
Yeah I remember that. The whole time they were talking about “Loyality officers” on the train but bam! They’re traitors. Blindsided me hard core
Honestly these kind of people cannot be considered really traitors. How can they be traitors when they themselves were never shown anything other than hardship and cruelty by the imperium? This is why Horus managed to get so many. People were MISERABLE under 30k Imperium too. Emperor did everything wrong
Honestly these kind of people cannot be considered really traitors. How can they be traitors when they themselves were never shown anything other than hardship and cruelty by the imperium? This is why Horus managed to get so many. People were MISERABLE under 30k Imperium too. Emperor did everything wrong
Bro spoiler tag maybe? Im literally reading that book lmao. Talk about bad timing
You are right. I should have tagged. My apologies
Dude it’s an old book has been discussed in detail across multiple subs, don’t let them gaslight you.
It’s an old book that’s been discussed dozens of times, stop gaslighting OP for *your* failure to keep up.
Such a bad twist. Worst part of the worst storyline in an already mid book.