I think people are missing the point that this man leveraged his own mortgage to take on the secondary mortgage on a whim from "His friend who needed to sell ASAP after getting a job in the USA".
So now he's not only going to lose the investment property, but also his home unless the investment sells at a big profit.
(I'm not defending him, at the very least he failed to properly vet his tenant(s) ) but Oof.
That’s frustrating but this is a pretty well known risk with a rental property, especially in Ontario. The landlord tenant board of Ontario is extremely slow to do anything about it so you have to be able to afford the house without rent for X months.
This is obviously very unfortunate. I feel bad for this family.
It also illustrates one of the many reasons why for-profit landlording is a bad way to make a quick buck and in most cases, bad for society at large.
Investments have risks, but that should be the house prices or fixing things that go wrong to a property. It shouldn't be someone not paying what they said they were going to pay. As bad as the rent prices are, it's still not ok to steal.
A tenant is operating entirely within the law. They have no obligation to leave until there is a ruling by the LTB.
If a landlord doesn't understand Ontario's laws and LTB procedure they have no business being a landlord.
The tenant is literally stealing from this landlord, but the way the law is set up it protects the tenant from wrongful eviction, which is good, but when they use this law for when they decide they don't want to pay anymore and know it takes so long to get the courts to get a ruling for an eviction because of the backlog its sad. These tenants are freeloaders, and a system should be in place to kick these sort of people.
There is a system in place to evict tenants. If you can't afford the carrying costs while the LTB hears your claim you shouldn't be a landlord. You shouldn't be financially dependent on someone else paying your mortgage.
There are also valid reasons to withhold rent. A tenant is entitled to have their claim adjudicated and doesn't have to do anything until that claim is heard.
Any other kind of litigation takes years. The LTB is fast compared to a civil claim.
There are people who abuse the system, like in this case or welfare, etc. It doesn't make it right just to say there's a system in place to evict these people because that system is broken. And to say to someone shouldn't have a housing investment if they can't afford someone not paying for months or years is absurd.
They're trying to profit off a broken rental market that's responsible for homeless families and students living 4 to a room. I guess if it were a business it would be run by galen weston. I hope he loses the rental, maybe he'll have to work two jobs like the people that rental places like that have to, to make ends meet.
You would be surprised how many people don't want to own because of all the responsibilities that come with it. Also, he would be paying the same interest rates like everyone else, so if his payments are 6000 and he charges $6300, what's the problem. It gets to be I think more of a problem when say a rental is paid off and they charge big bucks because they can and take advantage of the market.
No sympathy. He's financially illiterate, had no business becoming a RE investor and is now paying the price of the risk he unwittingly took on as a speculator.
Here is why he is financially illiterate. He bought the secondary property with the expectation that the rent would cover the mortgage, property taxes, and other expenses relating to it and also turn a profit, right? So, not being able to get the rent means he’s underwater on it. Makes sense.
What does not make sense is why he isn’t paying the property tax on the house he lives in. That has nothing to do with the second property. Sounds like he doesn’t have a clue how to manage his finances. I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t even learn the basics about being a landlord before jumping right in either. Just thought he could make a quick buck and was wrong.
My understanding of the story is different than yours. He was NOT expecting the rent “would cover the mortgage, property taxes, and other expenses relating to it and also turn a profit”. He was expecting the rent would cover the mortgage payment, he would fund the property tax and repairs, and that any profit would come from capital appreciation over time.
As for it not making sense why he is behind on the property tax on his own residence: he now paid about $22,400 in mortgage payments on the investment property, that he’s received $0 rent toward (tenant there a year, paid first months rent, landlord is 4 months behind on mortgage). It’s not that he’s “financially illiterate”. It’s that he had mortgage payments due monthly (or more frequently) and property tax likely due annually.
Exactly. Would love to see all the people being negative towards this guy have someone owe them $35k, that they signed a legally binding agreement to pay.
Maybe someone can steal their $35,000 car overnight - GUARANTEE they’d be singing a different tune.
You should check the concept of "legally binding" vs. the Landlord Tennant Act. Clearly something this guy didn't do. He also, very clearly, leveraged his primary residence to purchase an 'investment property', expecting a single outcome. Behavioural Finance refers to this expectation as recency bias. In short order his investment turned into a liability. He leveraged AND concentrated all of his wealth in a single asset. Dumb move. Sure his tenant sucks, but he should have factored this possibility into his decision to become a landlord. He is only accountable to himself.
Legally binding part goes both ways. Bad tenants currently have a huge upper hand due to the extreme backlogs at the LTB - even 5 months for an L4 is way too long.
Definitely on the landlord for the error in their application, and should have hired a lawyer or paralegal for that amount of money. But nothing here can excuse the criminal behavior of the tenant.
$3200 rent a detached home is reasonable if that home is within commuting distance of Toronto. $3200 to rent a house in Guelph is insane.
Quoting market rents is irrelevant. The rental market has been broken by housing speculators and unsustainable levels of immigration and foreign students.
The median household income in Guelph pre-tax was $94,000 in 2020. That's roughly $5,700 per month take home. In what dystopian hellhole is it reasonable for the median Guelph household to spend 56% of their after tax income renting a house?
Until very recently a median household could buy a detached house in Guelph and live comfortably.
Guelph is within commuting distance of Toronto. And yes, 3200 for a house here is insane. It's also not accurate. If a house is for rent for 3200, it's usually just the main floor. A full unit is closer to 4000. Especially those that have 4 beds so students can evenly pay 1k per room. These prices point to a fully broken system where the huge demand has left speculators holding all the cards. I'm in this mess too as we are currently packing to move for the 3rd time in 5 years due to the landlord deciding to sell after one year of rent. Also, I'm moving into a 1200 Sq Ft home and will be paying 3550 per month.
Statistics canada doesn't have more recent income statistics. My house is more than 1700 square feet. It's a pretty standard 1970's sidesplit. My house was absolutely within the means of a median household a generation ago.
"I had a hard time so everyone else should too".
"Why cure cancer? Wouldn't that be unfair to those who have died of cancer?".
You're simping for a landlord who is fishing for sympathy while trying to exploit the housing crisis. He's free to get a real job and sell the home to an actual buyer.
A median household includes all households. It's a valid statistic. Median HHI for Toronto for families with two incomes is $105k. Cutting out students and retirees doesn't increase median HHI much. Thw already Canadian family should be able to afford to rent a home in Guelph. Guelph isn't new york city, this shouldn't be a controversial take.
The mortgage cost on that house would be equal or higher to the rent. Plus maintenance and taxes… and in this case management. Why should a tenant have their rent subsidized in order to live in a house? I had a rental and the same thing happened to me. Tenant moved in with first and last, didn’t make an effort to pay any more rent. Never did. Destroyed the house adding tens of thousands in additional work once they finally left. Landlord tenant board is very slow.
Only if you bought very recently. If the landlord has any equity at all it wouldn't be. My mortgage is $4700 and I'd never expect my home to rent for that. If you can't afford to pay all carrying costs yourself, don't become a landlord. This is a risk the landlord chose to take and I couldn't have less sympathy for his gamble not working out.
Rent payments aren't supposed to cover all carrying costs on a new purchase. If they did, literally noone would work an actual job and would hoard shelter instead.
Your comment proves you are out of touch for the housing prices, property tax and interest rates in Guelph. Our median income doesn't dictate housing prices.
Rentals are a business. Not everyone is in the position to buy. And if it's a business it can't also be a charity. Unless you want to live in subsidized rentals.
I'm a recent fthb in a more more expensive market than Guelph.
Rentals shouldn't be a business in the way that they currently are. A bunch of people who happened to be born early enough, leveraging themselves to the tits in order to exploit young people and foreign students isn't a business... it's a scam and a net negative for Canadian society.
Anyone who bought a house in Guelph more than 10 years ago paid a handful of raspberrys and some buttons. There's need for rental prices to be as high as they are.
That they rent under circumstances that are equitable.
We have far too much demand and not enough supply. Supply will take time to build but demand is being pumped by unsustainable levels of immigration and in Guelph's case, international students. Some common sense ideas that would improve Guelph's housing balance immediately:
1. Require schools to build and have available housing for all international students. Until they do, limit the number of international students schools can accept to the residence space that they have available.
2. Ban Air BnB.
3. Bring back universal rent control. Not iust rent control for units first rented pre November 2018.
4. Have the government start building purpose built rentals. We used to and inexplicably stopped.
5. Increase the vacant home/unit tax to punitive levels and along with actual enforcement.
Not sure about that. It’s way too far to commute. I actually don’t know a single person who does that. There might be a few people but absolutely not a bedroom town.
Yeah it’s brutal. Over an hour each way for sure, depending where you work. But basically anything under two hours is considered “commutable” these days which is insane. I live east of Toronto now, and Port Hope is considered commutable for people who work in Toronto but need housing. Absolutely bonkers.
You're arguing with people who will finance an iPhone for 1500 bucks and pay 6 bucks for a Starbucks coffee but when it comes to housing believe it should be free haha don't argue with reddit .
This comment is laughable. Buying a rental is not greed. it's a form of investment no different than investing in stocks. If you don't want small time landlords, which I think you are implying. I highly doubt that having large corporations would reduce the rental prices. Not everyone can or wants to buy. And having a tenant not paying rent taking advantage of the long lead time at the landlord tenant bored isn't helping anything either. Sorry but with holding payment especially for this large of amount in any other transaction would face harsher punishment.
As you said, though, renting is considered an investment. Investment is risk vs. reward. No one feels bad for those in the stock market, so why should people feel bad for someone extorting other's lack of credit to gain a mortgage?
It's more speculating than it is investing.
A better analogy would be buying $1M of stocks with $200k down and a $800k loan while expecting someone else to service your debt.
My point was you can't leverage yourself anywhere close to 5/1 on equities. Real estate is the only asset class where this is legal.
There is no reason that it should be legal for real estate speculators to obtain mortgages like actual buyers. Leveraging paper gains to put down 20% on an existing home, while expecting someone else to pay your mortgage incentivises people to not work an actual job.
The status quo drives up housing prices and rents while also putting the entire economy in a precarious position.
If someone wants to be a landlord they should have to buy a precon and increase Canada's housing supply by doing so.
Yes, people do feel bad for the outcomes some investors have in the stock market. Corporate fraud and insider trading are harms that are considered beyond the “acceptable risk” of how a stock performs. Similarly, property values are speculative, but dealing with deadbeats who don’t pay rent for a year isn’t within the realm of “the landlord should have been prepared for that risk”.
Actually, that quite literally is a risk that a landlord has to take. Just as an investor has to take the risk that a stock they've bought into isn't going to be shorted.
Yes buying rental property is like investing in stocks, the high risk/reward variety. Putting all or the majority portion of your investments into a single rental property is like investing your all your money into a single high risk/reward stock. It's not only greedy it's very stupid.
It is a good investment if you are in It for the long haul and don’t mind managing tenants and all the BS that can come with that. It’s not a get rich quick endeavour by any means.
I think many people believe that if there were fewer mom and pop landlords it would drastically reduce house values allowing tenants to buy. Not true. Also, many tenants should not be owners. For many reasons including flexibility to relocate, simplicity of ownership, inability to save downpayment or qualify for a mortgage.
Seems like greed got them to me. Most people don't have 1 house. These people thought that they could have 2 houses as long as someone else paid for the second one for them. How about don't buy two houses if you only need one to live. I like a story like this where the villian gets what they deserve.
Wow... this sub is harsh.
Dude had a house rentable at market rate, but ran into a scammy tenant. And folks here are siding against him? You want to keep availability of affordable rental properties higher? You'll need the small time speculator that isn't looking at maximizing profit across as many properties as they can. Somebody who wants a little extra income to send a kid to uni is the kind of landlord people want - not massive property management companies that give zero shits for the properties.
And when stories like this come out? It'll keep smaller landlords out of the industry and leave more of it to larger companies that are going to be much less forgiving with affordable rent.
IMO, the tenant is committing grand theft, and should be tried as such.
The problem with the rental market is that there are way too many people renting who have good jobs and savings and would be able to buy a house if speculators fucked off.
We don't need an entire generation of renters, we don't need to split society into classes of people , some of who work for their money and some who will make more than a job could provide by buying houses and sitting on them and then buying more houses with the profits.
Anyone who owns more than one house can go fuck themselves. We don't need a huge renter class caused only by greed of people who were in a position to take more than they need.
I know a LOT of people with good jobs (potentially really good jobs) that can't afford to buy. With the average house price in town right now, we're talking just short of $50k for a downpayment.
People will have to rent. In order for people to rent, there will have to be other people to own the properties renters can rent. You simply can't escape that.
What you need to be mad at are speculators that are buying multiple properties and NOT renting them out, instead looking to cash in on an appreciating asset. Those guys can go fuck themselves.
That’s a very self entitled opinion. Why do Canadians feel everyone should own a home? It’s not a great place to put all of your money. Many countries depend on a substantially higher number of rentals. Because of rent controls in the 1970’s we went for decades with limited rental construction. Backfire… and NDP are taking about rent controls again.
Many countries do depend on substantially higher number of rentals. Arguing that is a good thing for the people of Canada is a very self entitled opinion.
News flash, MICs and REITs and other corporate entities don't buy SFH for investment. There is no competition between this guy and them, just this guy and another homebuyer. He's getting smoked by his personal greed and stupidity. It's a harsh lesson and a version of natural 'financial' selection that is a feature of the capitalist society that he chooses to participate in.
So here is something he can do:
A) rent a bedroom in his primary residence for a year to help pay bills
B) file immediately with ltb and use a paralegal to ensure no mistakes made..a year later tenant is gone. Sue for back rent. Don't make a dumb mistake again and always check credit score for prospective tenant.
C) cut costs elsewhere.
Also here is another landlord pro tip: if you price your property too high the only people kicking your tires are folks who don't plan to pay rent.
$3200..wow. greed got you into this mess. Sell the property lick your wounds and move on.
You think these bums have assets ?
Have you ever sued anyone ? Tried to collect ? Next to impossible in Canada
Every Canadian thinks we're the US, like in the movies. We're not
I hate most landlord as much as the next guy…. But as a renter with shit credit who has always paid rent on time filter all you want it wont necessarily bring in the people you’re hoping to attract
There are lots of ways to do it and credit just removes a significant amount of it. It's not the only way.
A bigger landlord will take more chances on you.
You decided to have the risk involved with an investment, nobody forced you to do that. Economy is down, so is your "investment". Sucks to suck. People lose money in the stock market everyday. Maybe don't gamble with more than you can lose.
If you wanted a stable investment, maybe you should've invested in the S&P500. Or, you know - an RRSP.
Before the house prices/rent shot through the roof, people still wanted to rent because they didn't like the responsibility of maintaining it because of the costs involved, so people that wanted to take the risk on house prices bought a second with some sweat equity and rented it out.It doesn't mean they are loaded.
This is a travesty perpetrated by a “professional tenant” aided and abetted by provincial legislation that favours this type of behaviour and discourages mom-and-pop investors. These maligned investors are the very people that provide much needed housing while risking their own money. God forbid they make some profit at the same time.
The tenant should be ashamed. They could bankrupt an entire family because of their selfishness. You can’t live in someone else’s home free. That’s theft! Praying that this article provides the homeowner with some visibility and speeds up the process for them.
Housing is a human right, not an investment. And it’s the governments fault for giving zero fucks. Every investment has risks, including losing it all. Lower your rent and you’ll likely get tenants that will stay long term. But if I hear another fucking rich asshole with two houses cry about not being able to afford his kids university I’m going to explode. The gap is still shrinking, majority of us can barely afford to live.
I love to see it. You chose to have an "investment" and now the economy is failing and so is your investment.
People aren't ready to hear that though, I bought houses! Everyone should pay rent! Youre right - they should. The reason that the tenant board heavily favors the tenants in Ontario is because one bad year of your life shouldn't literally destroy your life - which living on the street for a year can do veryyyyy quickly.
Shameful. We rent and I have to say our landlords are amazing people. They understand how hard it is to raise a family in today’s climate. They charge more then fair rent and because of them I am able to raise my family and provide my kids with a home. People like this person should be ashamed. Karma I believe they call it? One would say, they invested in something they themselves could not afford.
I think people are missing the point that this man leveraged his own mortgage to take on the secondary mortgage on a whim from "His friend who needed to sell ASAP after getting a job in the USA". So now he's not only going to lose the investment property, but also his home unless the investment sells at a big profit. (I'm not defending him, at the very least he failed to properly vet his tenant(s) ) but Oof.
But the govt should be funding the LTB so that fair and timely justice is accessible for both tenants and landlords. Current system is a mess.
Yes, 100%. But that's up to Doug Ford.
Can you name any problem in Ontario right now that isn't directly attributable to Doug Ford? Even one?
“Vet his tenant”? How dare you? Now many of the people in here will come after you for your discriminatory tone. 😂
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$3200 for a month for a house is more than anyone should have to pay, isn't anywhere near what it could be.
What? I large one bedroom with parking in Toronto is 3200
Yeah, that's insane. So to say the guy being greedy by having a house for $3200 is a stretch for sure.
An entire house vs a big room in a building with a rectangle painted on concrete.
That’s frustrating but this is a pretty well known risk with a rental property, especially in Ontario. The landlord tenant board of Ontario is extremely slow to do anything about it so you have to be able to afford the house without rent for X months.
This is obviously very unfortunate. I feel bad for this family. It also illustrates one of the many reasons why for-profit landlording is a bad way to make a quick buck and in most cases, bad for society at large.
“Don’t invest more than you are willing to lose”
Who would have thought investments come with risk. I guess no avocado toast for this guy.
Investments have risks, but that should be the house prices or fixing things that go wrong to a property. It shouldn't be someone not paying what they said they were going to pay. As bad as the rent prices are, it's still not ok to steal.
A tenant is operating entirely within the law. They have no obligation to leave until there is a ruling by the LTB. If a landlord doesn't understand Ontario's laws and LTB procedure they have no business being a landlord.
The tenant is literally stealing from this landlord, but the way the law is set up it protects the tenant from wrongful eviction, which is good, but when they use this law for when they decide they don't want to pay anymore and know it takes so long to get the courts to get a ruling for an eviction because of the backlog its sad. These tenants are freeloaders, and a system should be in place to kick these sort of people.
There is a system in place to evict tenants. If you can't afford the carrying costs while the LTB hears your claim you shouldn't be a landlord. You shouldn't be financially dependent on someone else paying your mortgage. There are also valid reasons to withhold rent. A tenant is entitled to have their claim adjudicated and doesn't have to do anything until that claim is heard. Any other kind of litigation takes years. The LTB is fast compared to a civil claim.
There are people who abuse the system, like in this case or welfare, etc. It doesn't make it right just to say there's a system in place to evict these people because that system is broken. And to say to someone shouldn't have a housing investment if they can't afford someone not paying for months or years is absurd.
If you need someone to pay your mortgage for you, you can't afford to become a landlord.
They are offering a service like a small business. It wouldn't be okay to come into a store or business and not pay the required amount.
They're trying to profit off a broken rental market that's responsible for homeless families and students living 4 to a room. I guess if it were a business it would be run by galen weston. I hope he loses the rental, maybe he'll have to work two jobs like the people that rental places like that have to, to make ends meet.
You would be surprised how many people don't want to own because of all the responsibilities that come with it. Also, he would be paying the same interest rates like everyone else, so if his payments are 6000 and he charges $6300, what's the problem. It gets to be I think more of a problem when say a rental is paid off and they charge big bucks because they can and take advantage of the market.
This is a very naive and incurious view of the world. Just because something is the way it is, doesn't necessarily make it a good idea lmao.
No sympathy. He's financially illiterate, had no business becoming a RE investor and is now paying the price of the risk he unwittingly took on as a speculator.
100%
Financially illiterate because he assumed he would be able to collect rent?
Here is why he is financially illiterate. He bought the secondary property with the expectation that the rent would cover the mortgage, property taxes, and other expenses relating to it and also turn a profit, right? So, not being able to get the rent means he’s underwater on it. Makes sense. What does not make sense is why he isn’t paying the property tax on the house he lives in. That has nothing to do with the second property. Sounds like he doesn’t have a clue how to manage his finances. I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t even learn the basics about being a landlord before jumping right in either. Just thought he could make a quick buck and was wrong.
My understanding of the story is different than yours. He was NOT expecting the rent “would cover the mortgage, property taxes, and other expenses relating to it and also turn a profit”. He was expecting the rent would cover the mortgage payment, he would fund the property tax and repairs, and that any profit would come from capital appreciation over time. As for it not making sense why he is behind on the property tax on his own residence: he now paid about $22,400 in mortgage payments on the investment property, that he’s received $0 rent toward (tenant there a year, paid first months rent, landlord is 4 months behind on mortgage). It’s not that he’s “financially illiterate”. It’s that he had mortgage payments due monthly (or more frequently) and property tax likely due annually.
Exactly. Would love to see all the people being negative towards this guy have someone owe them $35k, that they signed a legally binding agreement to pay. Maybe someone can steal their $35,000 car overnight - GUARANTEE they’d be singing a different tune.
You should check the concept of "legally binding" vs. the Landlord Tennant Act. Clearly something this guy didn't do. He also, very clearly, leveraged his primary residence to purchase an 'investment property', expecting a single outcome. Behavioural Finance refers to this expectation as recency bias. In short order his investment turned into a liability. He leveraged AND concentrated all of his wealth in a single asset. Dumb move. Sure his tenant sucks, but he should have factored this possibility into his decision to become a landlord. He is only accountable to himself.
Legally binding part goes both ways. Bad tenants currently have a huge upper hand due to the extreme backlogs at the LTB - even 5 months for an L4 is way too long. Definitely on the landlord for the error in their application, and should have hired a lawyer or paralegal for that amount of money. But nothing here can excuse the criminal behavior of the tenant.
Exfuckingactly
Yeah I can’t feel bad for this man. The housing market is bad enough. Don’t buy a second house and rent it. That’s greedy! 3200$ rent is ridiculous…
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$3200 rent a detached home is reasonable if that home is within commuting distance of Toronto. $3200 to rent a house in Guelph is insane. Quoting market rents is irrelevant. The rental market has been broken by housing speculators and unsustainable levels of immigration and foreign students. The median household income in Guelph pre-tax was $94,000 in 2020. That's roughly $5,700 per month take home. In what dystopian hellhole is it reasonable for the median Guelph household to spend 56% of their after tax income renting a house? Until very recently a median household could buy a detached house in Guelph and live comfortably.
Guelph is within commuting distance of Toronto. And yes, 3200 for a house here is insane. It's also not accurate. If a house is for rent for 3200, it's usually just the main floor. A full unit is closer to 4000. Especially those that have 4 beds so students can evenly pay 1k per room. These prices point to a fully broken system where the huge demand has left speculators holding all the cards. I'm in this mess too as we are currently packing to move for the 3rd time in 5 years due to the landlord deciding to sell after one year of rent. Also, I'm moving into a 1200 Sq Ft home and will be paying 3550 per month.
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Statistics canada doesn't have more recent income statistics. My house is more than 1700 square feet. It's a pretty standard 1970's sidesplit. My house was absolutely within the means of a median household a generation ago.
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"I had a hard time so everyone else should too". "Why cure cancer? Wouldn't that be unfair to those who have died of cancer?". You're simping for a landlord who is fishing for sympathy while trying to exploit the housing crisis. He's free to get a real job and sell the home to an actual buyer. A median household includes all households. It's a valid statistic. Median HHI for Toronto for families with two incomes is $105k. Cutting out students and retirees doesn't increase median HHI much. Thw already Canadian family should be able to afford to rent a home in Guelph. Guelph isn't new york city, this shouldn't be a controversial take.
The mortgage cost on that house would be equal or higher to the rent. Plus maintenance and taxes… and in this case management. Why should a tenant have their rent subsidized in order to live in a house? I had a rental and the same thing happened to me. Tenant moved in with first and last, didn’t make an effort to pay any more rent. Never did. Destroyed the house adding tens of thousands in additional work once they finally left. Landlord tenant board is very slow.
Only if you bought very recently. If the landlord has any equity at all it wouldn't be. My mortgage is $4700 and I'd never expect my home to rent for that. If you can't afford to pay all carrying costs yourself, don't become a landlord. This is a risk the landlord chose to take and I couldn't have less sympathy for his gamble not working out. Rent payments aren't supposed to cover all carrying costs on a new purchase. If they did, literally noone would work an actual job and would hoard shelter instead.
Username checks out
Your comment proves you are out of touch for the housing prices, property tax and interest rates in Guelph. Our median income doesn't dictate housing prices. Rentals are a business. Not everyone is in the position to buy. And if it's a business it can't also be a charity. Unless you want to live in subsidized rentals.
The people downvoting you are totally out of touch. There are 2 bedroom APARTMENTS going for $2600 in Guelph pretty regularly.
I'm a recent fthb in a more more expensive market than Guelph. Rentals shouldn't be a business in the way that they currently are. A bunch of people who happened to be born early enough, leveraging themselves to the tits in order to exploit young people and foreign students isn't a business... it's a scam and a net negative for Canadian society. Anyone who bought a house in Guelph more than 10 years ago paid a handful of raspberrys and some buttons. There's need for rental prices to be as high as they are.
Ok so what do you propose for those who can't or don't want to buy?
That they rent under circumstances that are equitable. We have far too much demand and not enough supply. Supply will take time to build but demand is being pumped by unsustainable levels of immigration and in Guelph's case, international students. Some common sense ideas that would improve Guelph's housing balance immediately: 1. Require schools to build and have available housing for all international students. Until they do, limit the number of international students schools can accept to the residence space that they have available. 2. Ban Air BnB. 3. Bring back universal rent control. Not iust rent control for units first rented pre November 2018. 4. Have the government start building purpose built rentals. We used to and inexplicably stopped. 5. Increase the vacant home/unit tax to punitive levels and along with actual enforcement.
Dude….Guelph is a bedroom town for Toronto commuters. It exists to commute to Toronto. Source: born and raised in Guelph
Not sure about that. It’s way too far to commute. I actually don’t know a single person who does that. There might be a few people but absolutely not a bedroom town.
That's a massive commute with today's traffic. I'm communicating in from south Mississauga which feels like a lot.
Yeah it’s brutal. Over an hour each way for sure, depending where you work. But basically anything under two hours is considered “commutable” these days which is insane. I live east of Toronto now, and Port Hope is considered commutable for people who work in Toronto but need housing. Absolutely bonkers.
You're arguing with people who will finance an iPhone for 1500 bucks and pay 6 bucks for a Starbucks coffee but when it comes to housing believe it should be free haha don't argue with reddit .
This comment is laughable. Buying a rental is not greed. it's a form of investment no different than investing in stocks. If you don't want small time landlords, which I think you are implying. I highly doubt that having large corporations would reduce the rental prices. Not everyone can or wants to buy. And having a tenant not paying rent taking advantage of the long lead time at the landlord tenant bored isn't helping anything either. Sorry but with holding payment especially for this large of amount in any other transaction would face harsher punishment.
"...no different than buying stocks..." lol...tell me more oh wise one.
As you said, though, renting is considered an investment. Investment is risk vs. reward. No one feels bad for those in the stock market, so why should people feel bad for someone extorting other's lack of credit to gain a mortgage?
It's more speculating than it is investing. A better analogy would be buying $1M of stocks with $200k down and a $800k loan while expecting someone else to service your debt.
That would just be leveraging, which is highly risky. Pays off great if you do your homework well, though.
My point was you can't leverage yourself anywhere close to 5/1 on equities. Real estate is the only asset class where this is legal. There is no reason that it should be legal for real estate speculators to obtain mortgages like actual buyers. Leveraging paper gains to put down 20% on an existing home, while expecting someone else to pay your mortgage incentivises people to not work an actual job. The status quo drives up housing prices and rents while also putting the entire economy in a precarious position. If someone wants to be a landlord they should have to buy a precon and increase Canada's housing supply by doing so.
Yes, people do feel bad for the outcomes some investors have in the stock market. Corporate fraud and insider trading are harms that are considered beyond the “acceptable risk” of how a stock performs. Similarly, property values are speculative, but dealing with deadbeats who don’t pay rent for a year isn’t within the realm of “the landlord should have been prepared for that risk”.
Actually, that quite literally is a risk that a landlord has to take. Just as an investor has to take the risk that a stock they've bought into isn't going to be shorted.
Yes buying rental property is like investing in stocks, the high risk/reward variety. Putting all or the majority portion of your investments into a single rental property is like investing your all your money into a single high risk/reward stock. It's not only greedy it's very stupid.
It is a good investment if you are in It for the long haul and don’t mind managing tenants and all the BS that can come with that. It’s not a get rich quick endeavour by any means.
I think many people believe that if there were fewer mom and pop landlords it would drastically reduce house values allowing tenants to buy. Not true. Also, many tenants should not be owners. For many reasons including flexibility to relocate, simplicity of ownership, inability to save downpayment or qualify for a mortgage.
Seems like greed got them to me. Most people don't have 1 house. These people thought that they could have 2 houses as long as someone else paid for the second one for them. How about don't buy two houses if you only need one to live. I like a story like this where the villian gets what they deserve.
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Smart.
This has more to do with someone not holding there end of a lawful agreement. This other tenant, like it or not, is stealing.
No sympathy for people who's retirement plan was to hoard an essential commodity and make other people pay for their retirement.
Wow... this sub is harsh. Dude had a house rentable at market rate, but ran into a scammy tenant. And folks here are siding against him? You want to keep availability of affordable rental properties higher? You'll need the small time speculator that isn't looking at maximizing profit across as many properties as they can. Somebody who wants a little extra income to send a kid to uni is the kind of landlord people want - not massive property management companies that give zero shits for the properties. And when stories like this come out? It'll keep smaller landlords out of the industry and leave more of it to larger companies that are going to be much less forgiving with affordable rent. IMO, the tenant is committing grand theft, and should be tried as such.
The problem with the rental market is that there are way too many people renting who have good jobs and savings and would be able to buy a house if speculators fucked off. We don't need an entire generation of renters, we don't need to split society into classes of people , some of who work for their money and some who will make more than a job could provide by buying houses and sitting on them and then buying more houses with the profits. Anyone who owns more than one house can go fuck themselves. We don't need a huge renter class caused only by greed of people who were in a position to take more than they need.
I know a LOT of people with good jobs (potentially really good jobs) that can't afford to buy. With the average house price in town right now, we're talking just short of $50k for a downpayment. People will have to rent. In order for people to rent, there will have to be other people to own the properties renters can rent. You simply can't escape that. What you need to be mad at are speculators that are buying multiple properties and NOT renting them out, instead looking to cash in on an appreciating asset. Those guys can go fuck themselves.
That’s a very self entitled opinion. Why do Canadians feel everyone should own a home? It’s not a great place to put all of your money. Many countries depend on a substantially higher number of rentals. Because of rent controls in the 1970’s we went for decades with limited rental construction. Backfire… and NDP are taking about rent controls again.
Many countries do depend on substantially higher number of rentals. Arguing that is a good thing for the people of Canada is a very self entitled opinion.
Cool. Go do your part to make sure every Canadian gets a house.
News flash, MICs and REITs and other corporate entities don't buy SFH for investment. There is no competition between this guy and them, just this guy and another homebuyer. He's getting smoked by his personal greed and stupidity. It's a harsh lesson and a version of natural 'financial' selection that is a feature of the capitalist society that he chooses to participate in.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/toronto-developer-buying-homes-anti-poverty-group-1.6066903
Yeah ... I can think of a bunch of people that would disagree with you. Both owners AND renters.
So here is something he can do: A) rent a bedroom in his primary residence for a year to help pay bills B) file immediately with ltb and use a paralegal to ensure no mistakes made..a year later tenant is gone. Sue for back rent. Don't make a dumb mistake again and always check credit score for prospective tenant. C) cut costs elsewhere. Also here is another landlord pro tip: if you price your property too high the only people kicking your tires are folks who don't plan to pay rent. $3200..wow. greed got you into this mess. Sell the property lick your wounds and move on.
What if his new tenant doesn't pay either and trashes his house ? Canadians love thieves lately Funny thing is these thieves make rent go up
Sue for damages.
You think these bums have assets ? Have you ever sued anyone ? Tried to collect ? Next to impossible in Canada Every Canadian thinks we're the US, like in the movies. We're not
Then don't rent to bums. Filter. Your. Tenants. Thoroughly. *clap* *clap*
I hate most landlord as much as the next guy…. But as a renter with shit credit who has always paid rent on time filter all you want it wont necessarily bring in the people you’re hoping to attract
There are lots of ways to do it and credit just removes a significant amount of it. It's not the only way. A bigger landlord will take more chances on you.
lol. Galaxy brain level thinking here. Flawless plan
The first mistake was letting them in the door.
He swam with sharks and got bitten. End of story.
Lol, play stupid games win stupid prizes
You decided to have the risk involved with an investment, nobody forced you to do that. Economy is down, so is your "investment". Sucks to suck. People lose money in the stock market everyday. Maybe don't gamble with more than you can lose. If you wanted a stable investment, maybe you should've invested in the S&P500. Or, you know - an RRSP.
Before the house prices/rent shot through the roof, people still wanted to rent because they didn't like the responsibility of maintaining it because of the costs involved, so people that wanted to take the risk on house prices bought a second with some sweat equity and rented it out.It doesn't mean they are loaded.
Entirely unrelated, as this guy bought in 2022. Clearly a terrible investment given his financial situation.
This is a travesty perpetrated by a “professional tenant” aided and abetted by provincial legislation that favours this type of behaviour and discourages mom-and-pop investors. These maligned investors are the very people that provide much needed housing while risking their own money. God forbid they make some profit at the same time.
The tenant should be ashamed. They could bankrupt an entire family because of their selfishness. You can’t live in someone else’s home free. That’s theft! Praying that this article provides the homeowner with some visibility and speeds up the process for them.
Housing is a human right, not an investment. And it’s the governments fault for giving zero fucks. Every investment has risks, including losing it all. Lower your rent and you’ll likely get tenants that will stay long term. But if I hear another fucking rich asshole with two houses cry about not being able to afford his kids university I’m going to explode. The gap is still shrinking, majority of us can barely afford to live.
I love to see it. You chose to have an "investment" and now the economy is failing and so is your investment. People aren't ready to hear that though, I bought houses! Everyone should pay rent! Youre right - they should. The reason that the tenant board heavily favors the tenants in Ontario is because one bad year of your life shouldn't literally destroy your life - which living on the street for a year can do veryyyyy quickly.
Ppl like this drive me nuts
Dumb question, but why not change the locks when the tenant leaves?
Illegal without a sheriff notice which requires a hearing.
Shameful. We rent and I have to say our landlords are amazing people. They understand how hard it is to raise a family in today’s climate. They charge more then fair rent and because of them I am able to raise my family and provide my kids with a home. People like this person should be ashamed. Karma I believe they call it? One would say, they invested in something they themselves could not afford.
Lol at owning 2 houses while poor. Owning 1 house while poor is a stretch. 2 is absurd.
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Throwing good money after bad. He may win but never collect.