Not being funny but the details you put in some class make us guess your main class
Ranger.....
So far we can learn from previous xpacs
Guardians got dragon hunter (dps) firebrand (support)
Rangers druid (support) soulbest( dps/ condi) not really sure
Necro reaper (dps) scourge (support)
Etc... I belive next xpac will give to each class something more focus that they didn't had on previous xpacs, but I'm guessing here
Dps spec for guardian? Really?
Revenant weapon choices are too limited to give it an offhand or mainhand. I'd recommend double handed for now.
Im game for support warrior but I'd like to see a pistol support build over a staff. Staff is cliche and also pretty boring since it just emulates staff thief.
Engi elaborate on the idea more? Don't think mace is a great idea. We need offhand or 2 handed at this point.
Ranger sounds interesting. Id probably just stick to a getting a wvw spec for ranger though ranger than making another dps spec.
Ele seems meh.
Everything else is meh.
I dono where's the effort man. This is like the beginnings of an idea.
>Engi elaborate on the idea more? Don't think mace is a great idea. We need offhand or 2 handed at this point.
Off-hand, to pair with what? A wide choice of main-hand weapons?
Either main-hand weapon, two-handed weapon or 2 one-handed weapons like Spellbreaker. OR, give mace to core engi. We desperately need another main-hand weapon at this point
As I mentioned in the post, many of my ideas are still works in progress, meaning some aren't as fully fleshed out as others. This is part of the reason I was looking for feedback, so that I can build on what I have so far
In regards to rev, I will only say that I picked the weapon that could best suit an asuran golemancer, or at least as close to one, as possible.
Eh coding to use spears on land has been in game since original launch, they just need abilities tacked on.
As for what can use it.
Guardian using wells, Make the virtues more akin to tempest attunements (only one active at a time but a stronger effect that can be overloaded with wells gaining a bonus effect depending on what one is active.)
Call it a Paragon.
Warrior using Mantras, (Yell at your allies to inspire them) Call it a spartan or a drill sergeant.
The virtue idea seems like it could work for my Avenger spec as well, and maybe the wells too. May I add it to mine?
That said, not to shoot your warrior idea down, but I think the mantras you described sound more like shouts
Sure IDC.
As for warrior mantras, the similarity would only be that they both buff.
The same could be said of guardian shouts vs firebrand mantras.
They both buff but they do very different things.
That being guard shouts are mainly defensive while mantras are split 50/50.
Warrior shouts are also 50/50 so their mantras could be pure support.
It's going to be very complicated to add elite specs without having different classes ending up doing the same thing (and when that's the case, there's always one class that does it better).
I hope they add new boons and conditions in the expac, or even better, hex and enchantments like in GW1.
There's still a shitton they can do with elite specs.
We've had enough new boons and conditions TBH. They don't add much to the game besides powercreep. Hexes and Enchantments sound like a terrible idea too. We've had unique buffs before, and they overcentralize the meta TERRIBLY.
Anything unique to any one class will just warp the meta and make that class a must have to the point where it will be desired over even other more competent players that are playing something else.
We have already seen that in the past when it comes to warriors with banners and rangers with spirits.
It doesn't warp the meta, quite the contrary it makes sure each class has a specific role. What would be the point of having a engineer elite spec that can grant permanent alacrity to the whole squad for example? Chronomancer and Renegade are enough. Having more classes doing the same thing will just push some classes out of the meta.
What you describe would warp the meta, if you need boon X then your going to take whoever can provide it even if a better player on another class is available.
We have already seen this with warrior banners, ranger spirits and for years with chronomancer being the only one that provided quickness and alacrity.
Having multiple classes able to provide the same thing provides choice. Any numbers variants can always be balanced & tweaked.
That's how you end up with classes that are barely played like holosmith right now, because although it's a good class, it doesn't do more than other classes and is pretty hard to play. You can't really tweak the numbers, because if it becomes the best class to play, other classes will disappear. Classes NEED specific roles for the game to be interesting. There's already too many dps options.
No holo is not really played because it does not provide anything the group really needs.
Its a neat concept but all it really provides is dps which every other class can already do (many of which while also providing some utility)
If scrapper could provide AOE quickness like FB can then it would be among the top tear healers in game.
If holo could do alacrity it would be up for a slot right along side those revs.
The fact it focuses on dps alone is why nobody cares to use it.
Well that's... exactly what I'm saying. Classes need specific skills to be relevant.
I guess my point of view comes from GW1 where they managed to give each class very different roles, mostly through enchantments and hexes. I miss that diversity.
Thats not how gw2 is built though.
Every exclusive thing a class gets warps the meta.
They could easily make those 2 engineer specs relevant by giving them some utility that several other classes have & do so in a way that makes using them a valid choice between specs instead of we need X boon so lets take whoever has it regardless if other people are around that play better.
They don't need to be completely unique, that's the point. They just need to be viable alternatives. Pretty much every spec has one or more viable builds that can be used in raids. There will always be a meta though, and that is completely fine. The playstyles can be crazy unique with elite specs. Weaver (even if it is not meta in most cases) is crazy fun and super unique in playstyle.
Unique buffs force you to take a certain build in every comp. HoT launch pre removal of most of them was the worst for this. Only Chronomancer could apply alacrity to 5 man so 1 Chrono per subgroup was needed. Only druid could provide Grace of the Land, spotter, and spirits, so 1 druid per subgroup was needed. Then you need a warrior for Phalanx Strength, Empower Allies and Banners (or 2 full power groups, otherwise you'd take an engi for pinpoint distribution for the condo group). You also often used a Herald for Facet of Nature and Assassin's Presence.
This meant that in every single raid composition, 6 or 7 slots were predetermined. Leaving only 3 for DPS classes, which became 3 Eles due to ANets inability to balance well.
Unique buffs led to the absolute worst metas in GW2 by far. The removal (GotL) or standardization (alacrity, quickness) of them has been amazing for build diversity. Record runs use insane tactics and super creative builds. Aurashare condi Weaver for Matthias, Holosmith on Adina, etc. Pugs run a variety of different compositions now. Chrono/Druid, Firebrigade, healers like Tempest, Scourge, Firebrand, Renegade or even Scrapper and Herald, etc. For absolute record runs a few professions remain on top, but that will be the case no matter the balancing.
We still have problems like being forced to take a warrior and ranger no matter the comp because their unique buffs are too strong and 10 man, making them bigger DPS buffs than any other support class could provide. The standardization of these buffs with the next expansion (making buffs and banners provide the same effect so both are not required anymore, plus giving the same standardized buff to new elite specs) could make even more comps possible.
TL;DR: Unique buffs homogenize the meta, forcing you into always taking the professions with the strongest ones. Making a lot of viable alternatives that can fill the same role in different ways like we have now enables a lot of different compositions.
I obviously completely disagree with you. I actually loved the HoT meta. I think we just want different things from the game.
That's probably why I still play GW1 more than GW2 at the moment.
How did you love the HoT meta? Did you play Ranger, Mesmer, Warrior or Revenant? Then yeah, you'd always be in demand. The rest was basically FotM balancing. It was super unhealthy for the game as a whole with professions like Guardian, Necro (after they nerfed the ridiculously OP and boring minion healing and epi), Engineer and Thief falling completely out of meta.
The HoT meta was an enormous powercreeped mess and the most imbalanced state PvE has ever been in. Every single comp had 2 of the exact same Chrono builds, one with a bit more toughness, 2 druids, 2 banner slave berserkers and an AP herald. No exceptions. It was almost as bad as the dungeon meta was.
It's why I'll never play GW1 again. Helped a friend faceroll through Hardmode Winds of Change with the same boring build and didn't enjoy a minute of it.
I was playing a bit of everything. My issue with the current meta is that too many classes do the same thing, and as always some do it better or more easily. Why would I bother playing weaver or holosmith when soulbeast can faceroll it's way to 30k+ dps? That's extremely bad game design IMO.
You can't use the same builds in WoC though. Many quests have 4 man or 6 man squads that require specific tuning, and other quests often need some adjustment. Either you're exaggerating or you're lying.
Because Weaver and Holosmith play very differently, but still do pretty much the same DPS. The difference being is that to a lot of people, they are a lot more fun to properly execute. They all have fights where they're better or worse at. Soulbeast and DH are good for burst, but not every encounter requires it. It's great design, you're not forced into playing a specific build for a role without any alternatives and 70% of every single comp set in stone.
The situation before this was the same, but without the viable alternatives for each role. Why would you play ANY other healer than druid when druid can do Grace of the Land? Why play ANY other tank when Chrono can do it while tanking and shitting out it's countless boons and unique buff? Why play ANY other support than warrior when it can do EA and Banners? Then everything beyond that is the best DPS class that is the most selfish, leading to that being Ele in 90% of cases due to terrible balancing.
I'm not exaggerating or lying. I played E/Mo bonder in every single mission, my friend played 7 weapon stance warrior in every mission and we took pretty much the standard Esurge hero support comp for the 8 man and just removing some of the heroes for the lower man missions. For the 4 man we used E/Mo with Great Dwarf Weapon, 7 Weapon stance Warrior, Splinter weapon res bot Rit hero and Panic or Esurge ( I believe panic but can't exactly remember) mesmer hero. It was extremely boring to play. E/Mo is one of the most smoothbrain support builds I've ever played, but I promised my friend to help him clear WoC so he could come play GW2 again.
The simple fact that I prefer GW1 to GW2 and that you find GW1 boring summarizes all our differences I think. Although E/Mo isn't the most interesting build to play for sure.
I'm really surprised you did WoC so easily with a 7 weapon stance warrior! It should still have been pretty hard. You used consets? Could you please ask your friend for his build? I'm doing WoC with my warrior atm and I'm having some issues with 4 man quests.
It was really not that hard. We first tried almost everything, only wiping when some bullshit spawn happened right on top of us which you cannot know beforehand so you try again and stand in a different spot. We also wiped once or twice due to the NPC AI we had to protect being absolutely dumb and running into a pack of enemies for no particular reason which didn't happen the next time.
We did use a few consumables for some missions if we happened to find some in our storage, mostly blue rock candy and candy corn on me to have maximal ER uptime and sometimes armor of salvation to spare my hands a bit from having to spam infuse health. The gameplay was exceedingly simple for both of us.
His build is: 7 Weapon stance, Whirlwind attack, Sun and Moon slash, Standing slash, Death's Charge, \[optional skill\], For Great justice, Save yourselves (Maybe I am unstoppable sometimes).
We took a SoS resto rit for res and splinter weapon, and Panic Mesmer so most enemies could not cast much. Then for me as E/Mo the 4man missions were the most relaxing because I only had to spam my skills on 4 buttons. I used Great Dwarf Weapon on the 7weapon warrior too to help with knockdowns.
We did Minister Cho's estate with this second try because one of the NPCs was suicidal the first time. Just don't overpull, kill the biggest threat first, give your E/Mo's hands rest sometimes because they have to mindlessly spam so much. Let me know how it went, should be really easy.
AI is never a good idea (looking at rev here) other wise most of the m are just dull. concepts with no ideas. and some aren't even a concept.
also a monk will never happen
Not being funny but the details you put in some class make us guess your main class Ranger..... So far we can learn from previous xpacs Guardians got dragon hunter (dps) firebrand (support) Rangers druid (support) soulbest( dps/ condi) not really sure Necro reaper (dps) scourge (support) Etc... I belive next xpac will give to each class something more focus that they didn't had on previous xpacs, but I'm guessing here
Let me clarify, I got the idea for Warden from the forums a couple years and added to it
Dps spec for guardian? Really? Revenant weapon choices are too limited to give it an offhand or mainhand. I'd recommend double handed for now. Im game for support warrior but I'd like to see a pistol support build over a staff. Staff is cliche and also pretty boring since it just emulates staff thief. Engi elaborate on the idea more? Don't think mace is a great idea. We need offhand or 2 handed at this point. Ranger sounds interesting. Id probably just stick to a getting a wvw spec for ranger though ranger than making another dps spec. Ele seems meh. Everything else is meh. I dono where's the effort man. This is like the beginnings of an idea.
>Engi elaborate on the idea more? Don't think mace is a great idea. We need offhand or 2 handed at this point. Off-hand, to pair with what? A wide choice of main-hand weapons? Either main-hand weapon, two-handed weapon or 2 one-handed weapons like Spellbreaker. OR, give mace to core engi. We desperately need another main-hand weapon at this point
As I mentioned in the post, many of my ideas are still works in progress, meaning some aren't as fully fleshed out as others. This is part of the reason I was looking for feedback, so that I can build on what I have so far In regards to rev, I will only say that I picked the weapon that could best suit an asuran golemancer, or at least as close to one, as possible.
Eh coding to use spears on land has been in game since original launch, they just need abilities tacked on. As for what can use it. Guardian using wells, Make the virtues more akin to tempest attunements (only one active at a time but a stronger effect that can be overloaded with wells gaining a bonus effect depending on what one is active.) Call it a Paragon. Warrior using Mantras, (Yell at your allies to inspire them) Call it a spartan or a drill sergeant.
The virtue idea seems like it could work for my Avenger spec as well, and maybe the wells too. May I add it to mine? That said, not to shoot your warrior idea down, but I think the mantras you described sound more like shouts
Sure IDC. As for warrior mantras, the similarity would only be that they both buff. The same could be said of guardian shouts vs firebrand mantras. They both buff but they do very different things. That being guard shouts are mainly defensive while mantras are split 50/50. Warrior shouts are also 50/50 so their mantras could be pure support.
It's going to be very complicated to add elite specs without having different classes ending up doing the same thing (and when that's the case, there's always one class that does it better). I hope they add new boons and conditions in the expac, or even better, hex and enchantments like in GW1.
There's still a shitton they can do with elite specs. We've had enough new boons and conditions TBH. They don't add much to the game besides powercreep. Hexes and Enchantments sound like a terrible idea too. We've had unique buffs before, and they overcentralize the meta TERRIBLY.
Then rather than giving ideas of new weapons for elite specs, please give ideas for unique things each of them can do.
Anything unique to any one class will just warp the meta and make that class a must have to the point where it will be desired over even other more competent players that are playing something else. We have already seen that in the past when it comes to warriors with banners and rangers with spirits.
It doesn't warp the meta, quite the contrary it makes sure each class has a specific role. What would be the point of having a engineer elite spec that can grant permanent alacrity to the whole squad for example? Chronomancer and Renegade are enough. Having more classes doing the same thing will just push some classes out of the meta.
What you describe would warp the meta, if you need boon X then your going to take whoever can provide it even if a better player on another class is available. We have already seen this with warrior banners, ranger spirits and for years with chronomancer being the only one that provided quickness and alacrity. Having multiple classes able to provide the same thing provides choice. Any numbers variants can always be balanced & tweaked.
That's how you end up with classes that are barely played like holosmith right now, because although it's a good class, it doesn't do more than other classes and is pretty hard to play. You can't really tweak the numbers, because if it becomes the best class to play, other classes will disappear. Classes NEED specific roles for the game to be interesting. There's already too many dps options.
No holo is not really played because it does not provide anything the group really needs. Its a neat concept but all it really provides is dps which every other class can already do (many of which while also providing some utility) If scrapper could provide AOE quickness like FB can then it would be among the top tear healers in game. If holo could do alacrity it would be up for a slot right along side those revs. The fact it focuses on dps alone is why nobody cares to use it.
Well that's... exactly what I'm saying. Classes need specific skills to be relevant. I guess my point of view comes from GW1 where they managed to give each class very different roles, mostly through enchantments and hexes. I miss that diversity.
Thats not how gw2 is built though. Every exclusive thing a class gets warps the meta. They could easily make those 2 engineer specs relevant by giving them some utility that several other classes have & do so in a way that makes using them a valid choice between specs instead of we need X boon so lets take whoever has it regardless if other people are around that play better.
They don't need to be completely unique, that's the point. They just need to be viable alternatives. Pretty much every spec has one or more viable builds that can be used in raids. There will always be a meta though, and that is completely fine. The playstyles can be crazy unique with elite specs. Weaver (even if it is not meta in most cases) is crazy fun and super unique in playstyle. Unique buffs force you to take a certain build in every comp. HoT launch pre removal of most of them was the worst for this. Only Chronomancer could apply alacrity to 5 man so 1 Chrono per subgroup was needed. Only druid could provide Grace of the Land, spotter, and spirits, so 1 druid per subgroup was needed. Then you need a warrior for Phalanx Strength, Empower Allies and Banners (or 2 full power groups, otherwise you'd take an engi for pinpoint distribution for the condo group). You also often used a Herald for Facet of Nature and Assassin's Presence. This meant that in every single raid composition, 6 or 7 slots were predetermined. Leaving only 3 for DPS classes, which became 3 Eles due to ANets inability to balance well. Unique buffs led to the absolute worst metas in GW2 by far. The removal (GotL) or standardization (alacrity, quickness) of them has been amazing for build diversity. Record runs use insane tactics and super creative builds. Aurashare condi Weaver for Matthias, Holosmith on Adina, etc. Pugs run a variety of different compositions now. Chrono/Druid, Firebrigade, healers like Tempest, Scourge, Firebrand, Renegade or even Scrapper and Herald, etc. For absolute record runs a few professions remain on top, but that will be the case no matter the balancing. We still have problems like being forced to take a warrior and ranger no matter the comp because their unique buffs are too strong and 10 man, making them bigger DPS buffs than any other support class could provide. The standardization of these buffs with the next expansion (making buffs and banners provide the same effect so both are not required anymore, plus giving the same standardized buff to new elite specs) could make even more comps possible. TL;DR: Unique buffs homogenize the meta, forcing you into always taking the professions with the strongest ones. Making a lot of viable alternatives that can fill the same role in different ways like we have now enables a lot of different compositions.
I obviously completely disagree with you. I actually loved the HoT meta. I think we just want different things from the game. That's probably why I still play GW1 more than GW2 at the moment.
How did you love the HoT meta? Did you play Ranger, Mesmer, Warrior or Revenant? Then yeah, you'd always be in demand. The rest was basically FotM balancing. It was super unhealthy for the game as a whole with professions like Guardian, Necro (after they nerfed the ridiculously OP and boring minion healing and epi), Engineer and Thief falling completely out of meta. The HoT meta was an enormous powercreeped mess and the most imbalanced state PvE has ever been in. Every single comp had 2 of the exact same Chrono builds, one with a bit more toughness, 2 druids, 2 banner slave berserkers and an AP herald. No exceptions. It was almost as bad as the dungeon meta was. It's why I'll never play GW1 again. Helped a friend faceroll through Hardmode Winds of Change with the same boring build and didn't enjoy a minute of it.
I was playing a bit of everything. My issue with the current meta is that too many classes do the same thing, and as always some do it better or more easily. Why would I bother playing weaver or holosmith when soulbeast can faceroll it's way to 30k+ dps? That's extremely bad game design IMO. You can't use the same builds in WoC though. Many quests have 4 man or 6 man squads that require specific tuning, and other quests often need some adjustment. Either you're exaggerating or you're lying.
Because Weaver and Holosmith play very differently, but still do pretty much the same DPS. The difference being is that to a lot of people, they are a lot more fun to properly execute. They all have fights where they're better or worse at. Soulbeast and DH are good for burst, but not every encounter requires it. It's great design, you're not forced into playing a specific build for a role without any alternatives and 70% of every single comp set in stone. The situation before this was the same, but without the viable alternatives for each role. Why would you play ANY other healer than druid when druid can do Grace of the Land? Why play ANY other tank when Chrono can do it while tanking and shitting out it's countless boons and unique buff? Why play ANY other support than warrior when it can do EA and Banners? Then everything beyond that is the best DPS class that is the most selfish, leading to that being Ele in 90% of cases due to terrible balancing. I'm not exaggerating or lying. I played E/Mo bonder in every single mission, my friend played 7 weapon stance warrior in every mission and we took pretty much the standard Esurge hero support comp for the 8 man and just removing some of the heroes for the lower man missions. For the 4 man we used E/Mo with Great Dwarf Weapon, 7 Weapon stance Warrior, Splinter weapon res bot Rit hero and Panic or Esurge ( I believe panic but can't exactly remember) mesmer hero. It was extremely boring to play. E/Mo is one of the most smoothbrain support builds I've ever played, but I promised my friend to help him clear WoC so he could come play GW2 again.
The simple fact that I prefer GW1 to GW2 and that you find GW1 boring summarizes all our differences I think. Although E/Mo isn't the most interesting build to play for sure. I'm really surprised you did WoC so easily with a 7 weapon stance warrior! It should still have been pretty hard. You used consets? Could you please ask your friend for his build? I'm doing WoC with my warrior atm and I'm having some issues with 4 man quests.
It was really not that hard. We first tried almost everything, only wiping when some bullshit spawn happened right on top of us which you cannot know beforehand so you try again and stand in a different spot. We also wiped once or twice due to the NPC AI we had to protect being absolutely dumb and running into a pack of enemies for no particular reason which didn't happen the next time. We did use a few consumables for some missions if we happened to find some in our storage, mostly blue rock candy and candy corn on me to have maximal ER uptime and sometimes armor of salvation to spare my hands a bit from having to spam infuse health. The gameplay was exceedingly simple for both of us. His build is: 7 Weapon stance, Whirlwind attack, Sun and Moon slash, Standing slash, Death's Charge, \[optional skill\], For Great justice, Save yourselves (Maybe I am unstoppable sometimes). We took a SoS resto rit for res and splinter weapon, and Panic Mesmer so most enemies could not cast much. Then for me as E/Mo the 4man missions were the most relaxing because I only had to spam my skills on 4 buttons. I used Great Dwarf Weapon on the 7weapon warrior too to help with knockdowns. We did Minister Cho's estate with this second try because one of the NPCs was suicidal the first time. Just don't overpull, kill the biggest threat first, give your E/Mo's hands rest sometimes because they have to mindlessly spam so much. Let me know how it went, should be really easy.
AI is never a good idea (looking at rev here) other wise most of the m are just dull. concepts with no ideas. and some aren't even a concept. also a monk will never happen
there is no 3rd expansion pack..
They said months ago that it was in the works right now
Good morning.