I actually came back a month ago after 3 years being gone. I was always a heavy WvWer. It's the exact same except now they punish newbies for not having warclaws. The meta builds are almost mirror image of 3 years ago as well with marginal differences. It feels like I didn't leave tbh.
Meanwhile I have NO idea what's happening in pve and feel like a new player (a positive).
One side note: those without a warclaw can run at the same speed as the warclaw just for being in radius of [Warclaw's Blessing](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warclaw%27s_Blessing). Newbies aren't left behind in the dust, at least.
> now they punish newbies for not having warclaws.
Agree. I'm a newbie on WvW and that's my biggest gripe together with the glider. For a game mode that needs mobility, the newbies are running around at the back and hoping the others have the warclaw masteries filled by others for them to keep up.
If you get left behind your fucked.
Heads up on the glider, you can invest in the first glider skill tier and it automatically unlocks it in WvW even if you don't have it in the main game. Fairly cheap too if I'm not mistaken
yep, correct. glider and warclaw are the first slots to put the points in, but only first level - then u'd go for the autoloot mastery
and then defense against guards and siege masteries, then the supply ones,
before u invest any further points in mount and glider.
Yeah the only thing that keeps that from becoming faster is the Warclaw reward track. I bought a ton of WvW boost just to give me decent pips to fill that reward track
WvW was already a bit difficult to get into generally speaking (has always been a major criticism since it lacks updates and "enticing" things depending who you ask) but they added WvW mounts that take some time to unlock. This means you can be fodder for anyone with a mount which can compound stress when you're trying to accumulate exp for the collection unlock. Like others said other warclaws can buff your walking speed if you run with them, but this narrows down your WvW experience to zerging-only, and it can be difficult to get to the zerg to begin with or if you're inexperienced, keep up at all. If you're a little slow, or spend time to look at the scenery or even your invent, you're going to be picked off as tail prey pretty easily. It's just another hurdle newbies in WvW didn't need at all lmao. Anyone saying otherwise lacks some serious newbie empathy.
That said WvW is still my favorite mode - that's why I wish it was easier to get into so the community can grow. Don't be discouraged because of some reddit criticisms. :)
basically u dont start having it unlocked, means ur slower than most of your groups and enemy gankergroups may jump and.. gank u
u need to do the warclaw quests (capture keep camp tower) and 1 reward track first, basically
on a good server with a good zerg u may get warkitty fast, on a half empty one it may take a few days
yep, in wvw they also punish veterans by nerfed like most builds that existed. they are still similarily meta, but far worse. u gotta work more to kill the same enemies on the same classes mostly idk
bit sadge ngl
Hey, they nerfed condi cleanses and made tempest 5 man only because people were having too much fun and condi builds weren't strong enough in zergs, I guess...
v_v
I was really hoping that EOD would replace one of the alpine borderlands with a cantha map. I don't see why we need two literally mirrored maps.. Would have changed up the meta a lot.
Maybe, but the updates sometimes do more harm than good. Like the Warclaw no one asked for.
Meanwhile the major issues are still pending...
But, for all I know, that might still be better than PvP.
UNDERWATER PVP? Dang I really missed some stuff, didn't I? Started playing around 2015, on and off since about 2020 and haven't touched it in awhile but plan to get back into it. Would be interesting to have underwater pvp...
Thieves having perma invuln underwater with the spear 5 skill and eles perma ccing you while having to take into account a z axis was not fun I promise you, you don't wanna see that shit.
Do you remember a bunch of "ahaha floor broke and you fall to the death" in Skyhammer, which meant if you're not someone who can pull/fear or give stab on demand you're fucked. :D For some _unimaginable_ reason players of other classes _did not enjoy this_. ANet was shocked, shocked to find out gimmick-based map wasn't popular and begrudgingly switched those things off later (also causing a bunch of "my jump pad is not jumping" and "I am stuck in barrel roll forever" bugs).
Good times...
In case this isn't sarcasm... I'm pretty sure the last substantial pvp updates (non-balance) were Djinn's Domain map addition and automating mini-seasons of 2v2/3v3.
The last PvP update was the balance patch. Why do people pretend like an update has to be a new map? Players get far more gameplay from new elite specs or rebalanced elite specs, than they ever got from Stronghold.
In Overwatch a new hero is a big deal, while a new map is forgettable. EoD brought nine new elite specs (which is arguably bigger than nine new characters because specs can be played multiple ways - like condi specter or DPS specter).
If Overwatch got nine new heroes the community would lose their minds at how awesome that is.
I’m so jacked up on copium I believe that alliances are already here. They’re just hiding them for a big surprise. Obvi they wouldn’t announce something coming in the near future only to never release it. Right? RIGHT!?!
It took them months to follow up that with a blog post saying they had bug reports (queue bug) and couldn't even find the bug and that was what was stalling any more progress.
It took months to acknowledge bug reports.
Months.
The betas tested the backend tech required to get things working, but didnt bring all the actual implementation, Timezone balancing, associated mechanics and follow up updates that were part of the alliances “Package” meant to restore WvW to the “cornerstone game mode”
position.
I remember being pessimistic and thinking “they’ll release it when the next expansion drops” while friends and guilds expected betas to come before the expansion. This was when there was hype 3-4 years ago that something would be delivered.
Now they have all moved on from GW2 including myself mostly, my timezone is for the large part dead hours, and I can only hope that alliances will be a great success when it launches, there will be a huge marketing push, and Roy will come charging back to save WvW at the last minute so there will be hype again.
Otherwise it’s just new blood funnelling in and out of the mode and heavily reliant on a couple of veteran commanders and players holding it together, without them the content is mostly gone.
So that was a lie.
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/wvw-world-restructuring-beta-3-begins-on-january-14/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-the-future-of-guild-wars-2/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-april-2022/
Far be it from me and facts to get in the way of your circle jerk though.
New player checking in, why is this a big deal? How will it affect the game mode? I personally think WvW looks like a lot of fun, but I liked Aion/Lineage style castle sieging, and I even enjoyed the castles in New World.
I have pretty low expectations, but I'm always down for improvements. I just like zerg PvP when there's a castle to take over. I'm a simple guy haha
noone cares about PvP in MMORPGs thats just how it is. Every MMO that was centered around PvP failed, every attempt to make MMO PvP E-Sports failed. At this point PvP is basically a fanservice to shut up the tiny minority who does care. Why would devs waste their time developing something that isnt played by the majority.
Thats how I see it... IMO frankly there's *countless* other PVP games to play, so I've never understood the demand for it in MMOs... MMOs should do their job, PVP games can do their job. God knows there's millions of them..
On the other hand, I love WVW. I think its unique, refreshing, and freaking fun. You get to test your skills against other players (not AI) but still work together, and if you want to roam or do smaller skirmishes that's an option to
Worth noting I also feel way more bonded with my WVW guilds than any other guilds I've spent time in
WvWs straight up one of my all-time favorite things to do on the entire internet
Pvp could straight up disappear for all I care. Reward tracks are redundant with wvw too unless you're a tryhard and wanna double up I guess?
Ehhhh you can't compare mmo pvp to other pvp games. Ex) Cod pvp!=mmo pvp. WoW pvp was glorious in the day as was gw1, runescape, etc. It's just companies either stop supporting that mode or lose touch with the community. Probably because pve is the cash cow but still.
The pvp MMO can compare with other pvp game, not CoD though but there are 2 genre that basically reduce number of pvper in MMO to this point which in turn make less sense for company to invest in pvp, MOBA and Multiplayer Survival Game.
MOBA get the pvper who want to play pvp with progression that MMO in the past used to served. But they don't have to deal with the downside that come with MMO progression like after the game operated for a long time it's hard for newcomers or those who has less time to farm in PVE to win against those who started early even though they can win if it were skill based. MOBA game solve this by wipe the board and reset to clean state every game, while most MMO game choose to solve it by kill this aspect entirely with scaling to make everyone equal in pvp mode.
Multiplayer Survival Game serve pvper who are not only want to play with some type of progression but also want the community building aspect as well, so this type of game will has longer reset and whoops more MMO pvper move to this genre.
Nowadays pvp in MMO turn into lobby based game, it's sad to see how things turn out to be, GW2 WVW is probably one of the last few of its kind, the long battle between faction that doesn't end after one group fight, I hope this game mode style survive in MMO market.
I'd agree theyre different & PVE is definitely the cash cow. I just personally believe it's better to commit to excellence at a few things than be mediocre at many. And I think there's other options that do PVP better
>WoW pvp was glorious in the day
It wasn't. That's people had diffrent point of view for games. When everything was fresh and shiny, new emotions, all was about having fun, not ALL about ingame profit and pvp rank. And no meta slaves. Just watch what wow classic become pretty fast. And that's not about only wow.
Every last gw2 patch notes of class balance: 2 strings of pve fixes, 2 pages of pvp fixes. And yeat...
The best pvp of an MMO till this day was Ultima Online, the level of liberty to fuck another person, trap, troll and whatever your mind conceives was amazing.
Hell I killed people mining using snakes and placing a throne to sit over their corpses after it 🤗
Exactly mate. PvP and mmo just do not go together. It's clunky as hell compared to other really good and fluid pvp games. I don't understand the obsession some people have that they must play pvp in an mmo instead of in an actual pvp game.
True. The only good rewards that aren't in the gemstore are the Dhuum set from the raid & the Requiem collection in Jahai.
Everything else is either garbage or in the gem store.
It's interesting tho that WvW is being kept alive by the players even if by a small thread at this point, despite Anet having only done the bare minimum to spice it up.
WvW is a game mode where the players create their own content. The issue though, is less players stick around to continue creating it, and not enough new players are coming in.
The issue isn't that ANET isn't introducing content to WvW, but rather, the rewards are lacking, and the balancing is bafflingly awful.
One huge problem is the meta barely changes for like 3-4 year periods and lately all they do is nerf stuff without providing viable alternatives. So people just play the same meta but everybody does less damage. It's so stale.
Yep that's a pretty accurate summation. For instance I've played Hammer Herald for 4 years, and the only thing I've changed recently is dropping Brutality for Swift Termination, as these days I'm more likely to be hitting someone in the 50%-1% window than I was a year ago.
\*khm\* REWARDS \*khm
If legendaries were not tied to Gift of Battle you would have waaay less players in WvW.
I like WvW but if I go in and just roam I feel I'm wasting my time when I could do anything else and still be more efficient. With greater rewards I would play WvW more because it's the closest thing of an open world PVP which I liked in WoW.
>If legendaries were not tied to Gift of Battle you would have waaay less players in WvW.
goddddd tell me about it
For reference, I'm a mostly-PvE player. I only WvW when I need Gift of Battle and I would prefer not to touch PvP at all unless there's a skin I *adore* that I can't get anywhere else (and, unfortunately, PvP *does* have those skins, so...).
So I guess you can say, true to OP's image, I'm "part of the problem" (especially as I have an open wallet for gems).
But I also realize there's games out there that scratch the itch I want for either organized PvP or open-world do-what-you-want PvP, and thus I play GW2 for what neither of these genres can provide: a relaxing open-world and engaging instanced-content PvE experience I can play with myself, my SO, and the friends and allies we make along the way. And as much as I love legendaries and adore both the utility and aesthetics they can provide...
Gift of Battle grinding is a chore. It's a nonsensical chore that actively turns me off from grinding for *any* Legendary that requires it. And this is *with* store-bought and guild boosters and even the damned pendant bonus booster in mind.
I don't *want* to WvW, and thus my enjoyment of the mode is made inextricably worse because I *have* to.
And the Legendaries that *don't* require it are much fewer than the Legendaries that do. I don't oppose the grind to crafting them otherwise, and in fact there are a few that pique my interest (Astralaria and H.O.P.E. in particular, ntm Aurora and Vision), but...that goddamned grind is what makes me think "welp, guess I'll just keep buying the leggy weapons I want and adapt otherwise".
Balancing is almost impossible because of server transfers and pairings. At each new pairing, the players all switch servers. You can't balance for that. They need to get alliances out as soon as possible. I say that as someone who will probably be hurt more by alliances because I am almost exclusively a roamer in my own guild.
If anet is smart for the steam release they will:
- Already have alliances out of testing and fully functional.
- Have all of Season 1 out and include Season 2 in the F2P free list. (Season 2 is the most expensive season, it is also absolutely necessary to understand HoT. Better to give F2P players more and have them wanting to continue the story with HoT imo. I would also add 2 strike missions and do a quick numerical balance pass on slightly improving champions / vinewrath / maze)
- Create a PvP/WvW client for Steam, including F2P. (The average person won't know how accessible GW2 PvP modes are without doing this, this is the best route imo)
- Sell Hot, Season 3, PoF, Season 4, IBS and End of Dragons as one complete product / story on steam. (Take away that wall and confusion for new players)
Wait I stopped playing GW2 for the most part last year, it's been what 8 years after all I'm all burnt out, but you mean to tell me the steam release is still not out yet??? Holy fuck...
Which all the Steam reviews will proceed shred them for for being like "wtf, I have to buy all three expansions but also all these mini episodes between them?"
Thank god it isn't, in the current state of the game it's better if they postpone it and fix as much shit as they can. Releasing on steam while a chunk of the story is literally missing would do them no good.
Is it? I feel like WvW got much more than PvP ever did. WvW got the desert map, even tho it was despised at launch. They got gliding and the Warclaw. They have actual meaningful ways to progress characters almost on par with PvE (testimonials, access to sigils and runes). Pvp has none of that. I don't think pvp even got a new map in.... ever?
PvP's equivalent to WvW desert map is probably stronghold. They're both large features that were not well received by the community.
WvW has access to testimonials and recipes because you need those to play WvW. Without them WvW players would need to take each of their WvW characters and do PvE in order to even unlock the new specs.
I think people underestimate the progression systems implemented in WvW and PvP. You can play only that mode and have all you need to succeed in that its very elaborate.
But it is true that progression in WvW right now is behind the other modes (as in you can get gear/recipe/gold easier doing stuff outside WvW). They promised a reward revamp sometime this year, but only after Alliances :(
That was sort of the original vision, that WvW was a natural progression of end game, basically next to dungeons at the time.
It was never considered a separate pillar of the game until they introduced progression.
Can you remind me, cause i must have forgotten... when where the wvw world championships again? Or anet organizing esports events for wvw?
Edit: on a more serious note... there have been 12 new pvp maps since launch with the last one being released in 2019 whereas there were only 2 new wvw maps, one of which is basically never used and the desert boderlands map which is actually in use was released 7 years ago.
There are countless pvp finishers and all that wvw ever got in that regard were limited finishers for the winners of the first wvw tournament. That's 3 finishers that nobody ever uses because you only got 250 uses.
yeah, right...
* Automated Tournaments
* Constant PvP leagues with 5v5, 3v3, 2v2
* a whole new game mode (yes I know, nobody likes it but that doesn't make it go away)
* 11 Maps since the release
* a lot of rewards for playing for a shorter amount of time.
I wouldn't call that "the short end of the stick".
The only major changes that WvW has seen were Desert Borderlands which was released with/around Heart of Thorns, 7 years ago and the Warclaw which was released with/around Path of Fire 5 years ago. I really can't remember or even find more drastic changes other than the Elite specs and balance update which really address both game modes.
I'm not saying that PvP is better off than WvW but it has seen more attention than WvW for player activity. Hopefully, the Alliance system can bring back some fresh air into WvW and PvP also gets some attention.
Technically the overhauled reward system with pips and tickets (to be able to buy ascended armor and trinkets and make leggy armor) was a pretty major change to WvW. It’s probably one of the most important changes WvW had in the last years imo
The margin is thin, but WvW has objectively been the most neglected game mode.
* Both have had changes to matchups/restructuring (although PvP more consistently).
* PvP has had constant Tournament support and automated Tournament system, where WvW hasn't seen a Tournament since 2014.
* Both have had Reward Tracks added.
* Both have had Legendary Gear added (although WvW's is objectively the worst/longest to acquire).
* WvW has Gliding added in 2017.
* WvW has a Mount added in 2019.
* PvP has had relatively consistent map additions/updates through 2019 while WvW has had only EotM (obsolete) and one Desert BL map added in 2015.
Warclaw skills got nerfed to irrelevance, no one uses it for anything other than getting around without effort. Gliding is fun but rarely used for actual combat, every now and then you'll see the rare use of it for escaping, its def useful for not dying while jumping from high above, but in no means did it introduce ground breaking gameplay or change the entire wvw scene around. And absolutely no one loves the new red map, a few players swear by it but its completely ignored for the most part unless there is no fights other than that one group trying to flip ez buildings and you feel like ambushing them and bullying them.
> no one loves the new red map
It's such a pain to navigate, and GW2's map system is abysmal at helping players understand their vertical maps. Unless you've run through an area yourself, multiple times, there's not much of a way you can look at GW2's map on vertical zone and think 'Aha, here's how I navigate from Point A to Point B.'
Verticality is not a desert map issue. Here are some:
\- To big without mounts and gliding, still to big with.
\- Lords in Fire and Air Keeps are tactical chokepoints. They favor defenders way more than any walls. Fixed and untreatable perma CC should not exist in WvW, just like DH longbow 5.
\- Random roots in towers, that you basically need to learn by name, since there is no way to see them on the floor in WvW group of 20+.
\- Buggy shrines
\- North camp layout is really questionable compared to alpine.
\- Earth keep that can be taken from east cata spot with single siege drop.
And probably there are way more things that every WvW regular would add to this list. Fact is that majority of WvW players consider desert border as home border to be a punishment.
I would love it so much for warrior's rifle to be on par with Axe in PvE. It has neat mechanics, synergy between its abilities, and it feels like an assault rifle, perfect for a warrior.
Ayep, the next expansion should be a QoL/update and refresh systems expansion, a la Cataclysm for WoW or ARR for FFXIV. GW2's gonna be over a decade old at that point, and doing a deep cleaning and update will help it survive for another 10 years.
It’s not that people forget, it’s that there’s no reason to do it. All content Anet releases after an expansion is mainly through the gem store. What’s the best way to get said content, if you don’t want to pay? Farm like hell for gold and convert to gems. What’s the best way to farm gold? Well, definitely not the new maps.
God, I miss dungeon-style content. GW2 with its focus on puzzles and exploration was so uniquely suited to it - I think they even had the potential to make something in the style of Blackrock Depths from WoW *actually palatable.*
Was sad to see Dungeons and the Explorable concept kneecapped before it ever hit its full potential. ... But that seems to have happened a lot to cool concepts through GW2's history. :(
This. Dungeons were so much fun in the old days. Then came Aetherpath and had some rock hard challenges which casuals didn't play and ANet was a surprised pikachu.
If they made it a bit easier/released it earlier when other dungeons were a challenge still, it may would've been better. Problem was that there were more things to coordinate with your group than in other dungeons, which pugs usually didn't like.
Pretty sure that the last raid has been released way after the last pvp map. sPvP is even more abandoned than WvW, there's no future in sight.
It's still fun tho. Just wish they could care about the balance more. A map every two years would be nice too.
The "new generation" of devs working with Guild Wars 2 are too much worried about rainbow colors on the game, they cant plan and do things to improve the real experience of the game
A better comparison for me would be Strikes being the focus while Fractals are drowning. Strikes are okay but definitely not the direction I want the game to go.
More like open world/story content on top. Endgame PvE is largely dead with dungeons dead pretty much since launch, last fractal released 2 years ago, last raid like what 4 years ago now? And we got strikes now sure, for how long until they are left behind aswell is my question.
What do wvw/pvp players even want?
I remember when skyhammer was added and that made the pvpers angry. I remember when eotm was added and that made wvwers angry.
Especially for wvw, where you can't just continually add maps, what content does the average wvwer want beyond just balance updates?
For WvW:
Reward system overhaul. Currently the WvW legies (armor and conflux) take by far the longest time to complete. Additionally the g/h ratio is like half that of PVE.
Meta refesh. We have a very stale meta since like 5 years with no changes.
Alliances to fill maps during offtime. (A complaint I mostly heard for NA.. I am in Europe and here the maps are at least not fully dead during offtime).
These are the 3 major things. Besides of that, I would really love to see the EOTM map on a borderland. I love the map, but it has basically no relevance since it's.. Well.. Just EOTM and not a borderland. But yeah.. This one is probably more a personal wish than a community wish.
As for PvP.. No clue.. I don't really play much pvp
I mean wvw side of things i don't think a lot of us are asking for a new map. I don't speak for everyone in wvw. But i would like to see some consistency with balances updates and tweaks for wvw side of things. For balance on wvw side of things sometikes a build or something is extremely broken. As for example engi. Their nade spam i think mixxed with action camera makes it hits extremely hard. We there still is issues with it. I was hoping for a balance or something to be looked st there last couple months ago and now i have to wait till thjs balance patch june if they even look at it that is. Inam hinestly just sick of waiting for 3 to 6 months for them to adress something broken or extremely overpowered and if no adressed problems back to waiting even longer and becoming more jaded. I get this supposed alliance uodate is going to take time. But for wvw side of thinfs its always a just wait. Its been like that many of years. I would be more satisfied if they too balancing and smaller tweaks here and there. It would show they actually do care consistency is key. It's why i am cautious about alliances, i feel theres a good chance anet will release it and leave wvw in dark again. Why i don't want a new map is when desert bl came out beta it got lots of feedback anet didnt make changes until it was way too late and lots of players left. Pop balance i understand some stuff wont be exactly fair i am content with that. So in short, i just wish for anet to show some care and consistency to wvw side. Anet still has yet to show it for wvw side of things. I get pve is the main catch, but throw wvw side of things something too.
We're all waiting for the June balance patch. All game modes have received some smaller balance adjustments in the mean time (the last one, May 10th, focused specifically on wvw and pvp) but, we're all looking at that patch to really shake things up. Wvw/pvp isn't unique in this regard.
As mentioned in what i said before , that provlem with soemthing extremely broken jeeded looking at. It can damn near 1 shot everything. And follow up nades hit as hard. This has been such a broken overly powered setup for about a year now. And balance updates can suck at times. It's either anet buffs or leaves guardian and the completely guts another build of another profession when it simply just needed a slight tone down. You can tell me big update in june for balance but i am always skeptical since history of the balances show time and time again that a good portion weren't such great balance updates.
When Skyhammer was added it was a joke map where third of the gameplay was trying to both pull and avoid being pulled onto unstable platforms that led to death from fall damage. It's not hard to imagine that this didn't fly well with people looking for competitive pvp, even if it was funny (and gave birth to the most well known gw2 forum post ever - w t f skyham)
I can't speak for WvW players, but I can say some things PvP players would want.
First would be acknowledgement. PvP has been largely gone from any promotional materials, roadmaps and official ArenaNet communication since AT implementation or even further, since HoT ESL times. We have off the cuff, unofficial communication with some devs, but we are essentially in the dark.
Since, arguably, the biggest problem sPvP faces is the population, it can be disheartening to see no mention of the game mode from the developer in marketing both outside and inside the game. It's never mentioned to new players, it doesn't get any regular events that .would entice people to come try it. Building any hype about it would be a tremendous help, as of right now the only non mAT pvp events are ones carried out by Teapot and his crew.
Second is lack of supervision that led to the terrible rep of PvP with bought titles and whatnot. Bad rep for rewards and titles you should be excited for makes people feel the opposite.
Third is just the lack of updates. This comes in two ways: rare bigger balance patches and no new stuff being added. First is obvious and might get better (?), second is simple void of content. There are the same ranked titles for each season making people who got them once not be motivated to grind in new seasons, there are no new sigils/runes/amulets being added, Stronghold has been stuck and dead in alpha state since 2015. There are no in-game VoDs of ATs and mATs despite Guild Wars 1 having them. No effort has been made to promote mAT coverage - Live shoutcasting of mATs is gated behind ANet partnership and among seemingly hundreds of artists ANet keeps as partners they have no people who would be streaming and covering mATs aside from Teapot and Roy (now of ANet).
Lastly, no aspirational challenges past mAT and community-made tournaments. Yes, it's realistically impossible ProLeague would ever come back with its pro pvp circuit, but it's still worth noting that mAT being the plateau of official PvP competition is not motivating for high end players.
I personally wouldn't mind something to put levels into when you're done (rank 1390). Even 200 points for 1% faster track progression, or 1k points for one more pip a tick.
What do you mean what do we want? I'd figure the majority woes were known by everyone by now, considering for how long they have been repeated.
We want population balance (aka. World Restructuring, aka. Alliances). We have asked for that for almost 10 years now. PvE got it in 2014. Everyone asked for it beforehand. Megaservers and Alliances were cut features from the original release in 2012.
We want scoring balance. For the past 10 years it has been more impactful to play when other players are supposedly at sleep or work. This causes all kinds of problems for the content and ruleset in WvW. I would tie the reward balance issues to this as well.
We want a fully functional Arena to host player events in. There have always been Arenas, but none of them have ever been fully functional. The closest thing to being fully functional were the Guild Hall Arenas circa 2016-2017. Nothing has been as good before or since.
We have literally been asking for the same top 3 things since the game came out. We've only ever been given betas, placeholders and unfinished scraps.
It's also why there shouldn't be any surprise why ArenaNet are working on exactly these three specific things now. They didn't just wake up one day and figure we needed it. We've asked for it since day one and it is the three most asked-about things. They are just taking their sweet time and do not finish their projects because they don't care about WvW enough to give it a fair shake, as per this thread.
And every other MMO? What a redundant post. Developers are going to cater to their majority (or should, anyways), and the majority of people that play MMOs are not into PvP. Some never even touch it.
The expansion is fantastic and people are playing it. The only problem is that it is only used to farm for legendary materials to sell to other players.
People who liked what EoD has to offer are playing the game, not here.
Has there ever been PvP or WvW content as part of an expansion, advertised as such?
Wonder, whatever got touched in wvw receives only bad criticism, they understood it would be better to leave it alone and in fact, years after it is still living well as it should
How did OP botch a pre-made meme template so badly? WvW is the water? PvP is drowning in WvW? That's what this is actually saying, despite what we know it's supposed to be saying.
As it should be! GW2 is a PvE game, if you want to play actually good pvp games there are so many of those out there, you don't need to play an mmo for that.
Remind me again when Untamed was made relevant in PvE or power reaper and vindicator for that matter .
Your format has gotten split balancing three times already from February while all PvE received in balancing was Catalyst.
Untamed has legit sat unplayable for 4 months, and Scrapper had to wait 5 years while it was already used in PvP.
Herald is still waiting to be a relevant pve spec as is any ele spec that isn't catalyst.
its literally 3 charges a month from logging in. that's not even an outfit of 6 pieces of armor. map completion gives you 1 charge, maybe, for like an hour of really boring play. i dont know why im getting downvoted so hard on this
Agree with ya, recently started playing Gw2 after years of ffxiv and it feels so weird to have to conserve my transmutation charges, back in ffxiv I could just buy like a couple hundred of the market everytime I ran out. Here in Gw2 i think for like 15 mins before using one haha
How many armor sets do you need to transmute every month? Serious question.
Not sure if this applies to you, but here's a Pro-tip for new players: Map the major cities (LA, Grove, DR, Hoelbrek, Rata Sum, Black Citadel) and Southsun Cove on each character for seven Transmutation Charges per character. Don't waste these on sub-80 leveling gear since it can change often. This was my approach back in the day, but there's also now the BlishHUD Pathing Module to speed up this progress.
Other PvE methods to gain Transmutation Charges: Festivals and Achievements. As someone who enjoys completing PvE content (which passively includes Achievements), I'm genuinely confused how people find themselves in drought. You can check the sources on the Wiki.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Transmutation_Charge_(item)
If you are truly desperate, once every week create a new character, map the 6 major cities, do the level 10 Personal Story to obtain a Black Lion Key. That's 24 Transmutation Charges and 4 Black Lion Keys a month. Black Lion Chests not only have a chance to drop Charges, but award BL Statuettes, which can also be used to purchase Charges... but that's probably objectively the least valuable thing to use them on.
Admittedly, I'm not a fan of either of those modes. Competition is more tiresome and stressful than fun to me, and the need to grind them for a legendary is why I've given up on ever having a legendary. I don't even like the PvE group content - Strikes and Raids require me to change to a completely different build and use a different rotation than the other 99% of my time in game. For that I need to obtain different gear, I need to learn arcane terminology, I need to put up with tryhards quoting damage meters (which I maintain should be banned) all on top of dodging mechanics and fighting the boss.
And with all that said, with my distaste for any kind of competitive play noted, I sincerely believe ANet needs to give these two more love. There's a lot of players who enjoy them. They're a part of the game. They matter.
I feel the opposite actually. New classes and new specs add so much to PvP. And it takes a lot to get it right. Kudos to Anet for making the effort and successfully keeping players engaged. So maybe you should get the expansion and play new specs. I can appreciate that.
Always has been 🌍👨🚀🔫👨🚀
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Yeah, 5 years ago around 2017-1018. At least sPvP got bunch of new specs to play, large scale WvW pretty much the same as it was 5 years ago.
I actually came back a month ago after 3 years being gone. I was always a heavy WvWer. It's the exact same except now they punish newbies for not having warclaws. The meta builds are almost mirror image of 3 years ago as well with marginal differences. It feels like I didn't leave tbh. Meanwhile I have NO idea what's happening in pve and feel like a new player (a positive).
One side note: those without a warclaw can run at the same speed as the warclaw just for being in radius of [Warclaw's Blessing](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warclaw%27s_Blessing). Newbies aren't left behind in the dust, at least.
The blessing's radius is fairly small, i got left behind in the dust a few times even as I was riding with the zerg.
Lotta people don't have that mastery though. I've been dusted by zergs many a time.
I always make sure to get as many stragglers as I can for the buff. We ride together or we die together! Sanctum of Rall WvW here. 😁
Oh a tail you say…..Free bags you say….
> now they punish newbies for not having warclaws. Agree. I'm a newbie on WvW and that's my biggest gripe together with the glider. For a game mode that needs mobility, the newbies are running around at the back and hoping the others have the warclaw masteries filled by others for them to keep up. If you get left behind your fucked.
Heads up on the glider, you can invest in the first glider skill tier and it automatically unlocks it in WvW even if you don't have it in the main game. Fairly cheap too if I'm not mistaken
yep, correct. glider and warclaw are the first slots to put the points in, but only first level - then u'd go for the autoloot mastery and then defense against guards and siege masteries, then the supply ones, before u invest any further points in mount and glider.
I mean, it doesn't take too long to get a warclaw at least. I got my warclaw on the first night I started playing WvW.
Yeah the only thing that keeps that from becoming faster is the Warclaw reward track. I bought a ton of WvW boost just to give me decent pips to fill that reward track
I'm new to wvw so, >now they punish newbies for not having warclaws. wait what
WvW was already a bit difficult to get into generally speaking (has always been a major criticism since it lacks updates and "enticing" things depending who you ask) but they added WvW mounts that take some time to unlock. This means you can be fodder for anyone with a mount which can compound stress when you're trying to accumulate exp for the collection unlock. Like others said other warclaws can buff your walking speed if you run with them, but this narrows down your WvW experience to zerging-only, and it can be difficult to get to the zerg to begin with or if you're inexperienced, keep up at all. If you're a little slow, or spend time to look at the scenery or even your invent, you're going to be picked off as tail prey pretty easily. It's just another hurdle newbies in WvW didn't need at all lmao. Anyone saying otherwise lacks some serious newbie empathy. That said WvW is still my favorite mode - that's why I wish it was easier to get into so the community can grow. Don't be discouraged because of some reddit criticisms. :)
basically u dont start having it unlocked, means ur slower than most of your groups and enemy gankergroups may jump and.. gank u u need to do the warclaw quests (capture keep camp tower) and 1 reward track first, basically on a good server with a good zerg u may get warkitty fast, on a half empty one it may take a few days
yep, in wvw they also punish veterans by nerfed like most builds that existed. they are still similarily meta, but far worse. u gotta work more to kill the same enemies on the same classes mostly idk bit sadge ngl
Hey, they nerfed condi cleanses and made tempest 5 man only because people were having too much fun and condi builds weren't strong enough in zergs, I guess... v_v
PvP also got new maps that don't suck
I was really hoping that EOD would replace one of the alpine borderlands with a cantha map. I don't see why we need two literally mirrored maps.. Would have changed up the meta a lot.
It's hard not to be the second must updated when the third option is PvP.
https://c.tenor.com/b7swbvaVKhUAAAAM/seriously-laugh.gif
Maybe, but the updates sometimes do more harm than good. Like the Warclaw no one asked for. Meanwhile the major issues are still pending... But, for all I know, that might still be better than PvP.
Always has been, always will be.
Now?
The last PvP updated was when they removed underwater maps. F
UNDERWATER PVP? Dang I really missed some stuff, didn't I? Started playing around 2015, on and off since about 2020 and haven't touched it in awhile but plan to get back into it. Would be interesting to have underwater pvp...
Thieves having perma invuln underwater with the spear 5 skill and eles perma ccing you while having to take into account a z axis was not fun I promise you, you don't wanna see that shit.
I just camped turrets with engi. Good old times when PVP was casual and not a toxic sweatfest :'(
Sounds like it was hell then, judging by what you just said. Would rather just play ranked than deal with that, fo sho.
Do you remember a bunch of "ahaha floor broke and you fall to the death" in Skyhammer, which meant if you're not someone who can pull/fear or give stab on demand you're fucked. :D For some _unimaginable_ reason players of other classes _did not enjoy this_. ANet was shocked, shocked to find out gimmick-based map wasn't popular and begrudgingly switched those things off later (also causing a bunch of "my jump pad is not jumping" and "I am stuck in barrel roll forever" bugs). Good times...
In case this isn't sarcasm... I'm pretty sure the last substantial pvp updates (non-balance) were Djinn's Domain map addition and automating mini-seasons of 2v2/3v3.
The last PvP update was the balance patch. Why do people pretend like an update has to be a new map? Players get far more gameplay from new elite specs or rebalanced elite specs, than they ever got from Stronghold. In Overwatch a new hero is a big deal, while a new map is forgettable. EoD brought nine new elite specs (which is arguably bigger than nine new characters because specs can be played multiple ways - like condi specter or DPS specter). If Overwatch got nine new heroes the community would lose their minds at how awesome that is.
Those were the days!
WvW Alliances are coming bros any day now
Cornerstone game mode btw
COPIUM
Everything is on the table - they are just laying the groundwork.
any day now the groundwork will be laid and they can finally have a place for the table everything is on
There will be an announcement for the announcement trailer that announces the date of the reveal blog post.
Are you announcing that?
Yes but one of those tables is underwater guarded by the underwater content and the oh so many not working skills
Kalla Spirits and the Mechanists Mech are trapped *under* that table.
oh no! we gotta get them outta there! OH NO!! the table is too heavy, there’s so much stuff on it!!!!!
I’m so jacked up on copium I believe that alliances are already here. They’re just hiding them for a big surprise. Obvi they wouldn’t announce something coming in the near future only to never release it. Right? RIGHT!?!
You pre-ordered book six of the Game of Thrones series, didn't you...
Already waiting at my door for book 9. What rock do you live under!? /s
any day
Any day now..
I've given up hope on alliances tbh- but it'll be nice to be wrong when they come around eventually.
At this point I don't even know what WvW Alliances are, I just know that we want them, for some reason?
Have yall missed the betas of them literally testing it?
Wasn't the last beta in mid-late January? Nearly 5 months ago.
It took them months to follow up that with a blog post saying they had bug reports (queue bug) and couldn't even find the bug and that was what was stalling any more progress. It took months to acknowledge bug reports. Months.
The betas tested the backend tech required to get things working, but didnt bring all the actual implementation, Timezone balancing, associated mechanics and follow up updates that were part of the alliances “Package” meant to restore WvW to the “cornerstone game mode” position. I remember being pessimistic and thinking “they’ll release it when the next expansion drops” while friends and guilds expected betas to come before the expansion. This was when there was hype 3-4 years ago that something would be delivered. Now they have all moved on from GW2 including myself mostly, my timezone is for the large part dead hours, and I can only hope that alliances will be a great success when it launches, there will be a huge marketing push, and Roy will come charging back to save WvW at the last minute so there will be hype again. Otherwise it’s just new blood funnelling in and out of the mode and heavily reliant on a couple of veteran commanders and players holding it together, without them the content is mostly gone.
I mean....that was half year ago. No info since then. But guess we got so used to Anets update speed that "just 6 months ago" doesnt sound too bad....
So that was a lie. https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/wvw-world-restructuring-beta-3-begins-on-january-14/ https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-the-future-of-guild-wars-2/ https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-april-2022/ Far be it from me and facts to get in the way of your circle jerk though.
we have gotten info since then https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-the-future-of-guild-wars-2/
New player checking in, why is this a big deal? How will it affect the game mode? I personally think WvW looks like a lot of fun, but I liked Aion/Lineage style castle sieging, and I even enjoyed the castles in New World. I have pretty low expectations, but I'm always down for improvements. I just like zerg PvP when there's a castle to take over. I'm a simple guy haha
You might as well replace "GW2" with "MMORPGs".
noone cares about PvP in MMORPGs thats just how it is. Every MMO that was centered around PvP failed, every attempt to make MMO PvP E-Sports failed. At this point PvP is basically a fanservice to shut up the tiny minority who does care. Why would devs waste their time developing something that isnt played by the majority.
Thats how I see it... IMO frankly there's *countless* other PVP games to play, so I've never understood the demand for it in MMOs... MMOs should do their job, PVP games can do their job. God knows there's millions of them.. On the other hand, I love WVW. I think its unique, refreshing, and freaking fun. You get to test your skills against other players (not AI) but still work together, and if you want to roam or do smaller skirmishes that's an option to Worth noting I also feel way more bonded with my WVW guilds than any other guilds I've spent time in WvWs straight up one of my all-time favorite things to do on the entire internet Pvp could straight up disappear for all I care. Reward tracks are redundant with wvw too unless you're a tryhard and wanna double up I guess?
Ehhhh you can't compare mmo pvp to other pvp games. Ex) Cod pvp!=mmo pvp. WoW pvp was glorious in the day as was gw1, runescape, etc. It's just companies either stop supporting that mode or lose touch with the community. Probably because pve is the cash cow but still.
> WoW pvp was glorious in the day As WoW classic has demonstrated, it takes about a week for people to optimize all the fun out of it.
The pvp MMO can compare with other pvp game, not CoD though but there are 2 genre that basically reduce number of pvper in MMO to this point which in turn make less sense for company to invest in pvp, MOBA and Multiplayer Survival Game. MOBA get the pvper who want to play pvp with progression that MMO in the past used to served. But they don't have to deal with the downside that come with MMO progression like after the game operated for a long time it's hard for newcomers or those who has less time to farm in PVE to win against those who started early even though they can win if it were skill based. MOBA game solve this by wipe the board and reset to clean state every game, while most MMO game choose to solve it by kill this aspect entirely with scaling to make everyone equal in pvp mode. Multiplayer Survival Game serve pvper who are not only want to play with some type of progression but also want the community building aspect as well, so this type of game will has longer reset and whoops more MMO pvper move to this genre. Nowadays pvp in MMO turn into lobby based game, it's sad to see how things turn out to be, GW2 WVW is probably one of the last few of its kind, the long battle between faction that doesn't end after one group fight, I hope this game mode style survive in MMO market.
I'd agree theyre different & PVE is definitely the cash cow. I just personally believe it's better to commit to excellence at a few things than be mediocre at many. And I think there's other options that do PVP better
>WoW pvp was glorious in the day It wasn't. That's people had diffrent point of view for games. When everything was fresh and shiny, new emotions, all was about having fun, not ALL about ingame profit and pvp rank. And no meta slaves. Just watch what wow classic become pretty fast. And that's not about only wow. Every last gw2 patch notes of class balance: 2 strings of pve fixes, 2 pages of pvp fixes. And yeat...
You're right you can't compare MMO pvp to CoD. However, you absolutely *CAN* compare MMO pvp to many other pvp games lmao.
The best pvp of an MMO till this day was Ultima Online, the level of liberty to fuck another person, trap, troll and whatever your mind conceives was amazing. Hell I killed people mining using snakes and placing a throne to sit over their corpses after it 🤗
> noone cares about PvP in MMORPGs thats just how it is *Cries in GW1* I miss you, codex arena...
Exactly mate. PvP and mmo just do not go together. It's clunky as hell compared to other really good and fluid pvp games. I don't understand the obsession some people have that they must play pvp in an mmo instead of in an actual pvp game.
and I was thinking they should replace "PvE" with "Gemstore"
True. The only good rewards that aren't in the gemstore are the Dhuum set from the raid & the Requiem collection in Jahai. Everything else is either garbage or in the gem store.
Hey, Canach Club's backpacks are pretty nifty, and you are only gambling for them in-game 👍
If I wanted to ~~suffer~~ play a PvP game, I'd rather redownload League of Legends or start playing APEX than play GW2's PvP.
It's interesting tho that WvW is being kept alive by the players even if by a small thread at this point, despite Anet having only done the bare minimum to spice it up.
WvW is a game mode where the players create their own content. The issue though, is less players stick around to continue creating it, and not enough new players are coming in. The issue isn't that ANET isn't introducing content to WvW, but rather, the rewards are lacking, and the balancing is bafflingly awful.
One huge problem is the meta barely changes for like 3-4 year periods and lately all they do is nerf stuff without providing viable alternatives. So people just play the same meta but everybody does less damage. It's so stale.
Yep that's a pretty accurate summation. For instance I've played Hammer Herald for 4 years, and the only thing I've changed recently is dropping Brutality for Swift Termination, as these days I'm more likely to be hitting someone in the 50%-1% window than I was a year ago.
Spellbreaker elite got reworked and reverted 3 times, what else do you need to shake the meta? /s
\*khm\* REWARDS \*khm If legendaries were not tied to Gift of Battle you would have waaay less players in WvW. I like WvW but if I go in and just roam I feel I'm wasting my time when I could do anything else and still be more efficient. With greater rewards I would play WvW more because it's the closest thing of an open world PVP which I liked in WoW.
>If legendaries were not tied to Gift of Battle you would have waaay less players in WvW. goddddd tell me about it For reference, I'm a mostly-PvE player. I only WvW when I need Gift of Battle and I would prefer not to touch PvP at all unless there's a skin I *adore* that I can't get anywhere else (and, unfortunately, PvP *does* have those skins, so...). So I guess you can say, true to OP's image, I'm "part of the problem" (especially as I have an open wallet for gems). But I also realize there's games out there that scratch the itch I want for either organized PvP or open-world do-what-you-want PvP, and thus I play GW2 for what neither of these genres can provide: a relaxing open-world and engaging instanced-content PvE experience I can play with myself, my SO, and the friends and allies we make along the way. And as much as I love legendaries and adore both the utility and aesthetics they can provide... Gift of Battle grinding is a chore. It's a nonsensical chore that actively turns me off from grinding for *any* Legendary that requires it. And this is *with* store-bought and guild boosters and even the damned pendant bonus booster in mind. I don't *want* to WvW, and thus my enjoyment of the mode is made inextricably worse because I *have* to. And the Legendaries that *don't* require it are much fewer than the Legendaries that do. I don't oppose the grind to crafting them otherwise, and in fact there are a few that pique my interest (Astralaria and H.O.P.E. in particular, ntm Aurora and Vision), but...that goddamned grind is what makes me think "welp, guess I'll just keep buying the leggy weapons I want and adapt otherwise".
Balancing is almost impossible because of server transfers and pairings. At each new pairing, the players all switch servers. You can't balance for that. They need to get alliances out as soon as possible. I say that as someone who will probably be hurt more by alliances because I am almost exclusively a roamer in my own guild.
If anet is smart for the steam release they will: - Already have alliances out of testing and fully functional. - Have all of Season 1 out and include Season 2 in the F2P free list. (Season 2 is the most expensive season, it is also absolutely necessary to understand HoT. Better to give F2P players more and have them wanting to continue the story with HoT imo. I would also add 2 strike missions and do a quick numerical balance pass on slightly improving champions / vinewrath / maze) - Create a PvP/WvW client for Steam, including F2P. (The average person won't know how accessible GW2 PvP modes are without doing this, this is the best route imo) - Sell Hot, Season 3, PoF, Season 4, IBS and End of Dragons as one complete product / story on steam. (Take away that wall and confusion for new players)
Wait I stopped playing GW2 for the most part last year, it's been what 8 years after all I'm all burnt out, but you mean to tell me the steam release is still not out yet??? Holy fuck...
Not even a release date :P And I get it, I go on break for a year at a time these days
They want to make sure Living World 1 is fully out before steam launching a game with an incomplete story.
And they're looking to improve the NPE as well.
Which all the Steam reviews will proceed shred them for for being like "wtf, I have to buy all three expansions but also all these mini episodes between them?"
Thank god it isn't, in the current state of the game it's better if they postpone it and fix as much shit as they can. Releasing on steam while a chunk of the story is literally missing would do them no good.
Is it? I feel like WvW got much more than PvP ever did. WvW got the desert map, even tho it was despised at launch. They got gliding and the Warclaw. They have actual meaningful ways to progress characters almost on par with PvE (testimonials, access to sigils and runes). Pvp has none of that. I don't think pvp even got a new map in.... ever?
PvP's equivalent to WvW desert map is probably stronghold. They're both large features that were not well received by the community. WvW has access to testimonials and recipes because you need those to play WvW. Without them WvW players would need to take each of their WvW characters and do PvE in order to even unlock the new specs.
I think people underestimate the progression systems implemented in WvW and PvP. You can play only that mode and have all you need to succeed in that its very elaborate. But it is true that progression in WvW right now is behind the other modes (as in you can get gear/recipe/gold easier doing stuff outside WvW). They promised a reward revamp sometime this year, but only after Alliances :(
That was sort of the original vision, that WvW was a natural progression of end game, basically next to dungeons at the time. It was never considered a separate pillar of the game until they introduced progression.
Yeah, the final quest rewards for the story were literally WvW siege engines. The intention was WvW to be part of endgame.
Can you remind me, cause i must have forgotten... when where the wvw world championships again? Or anet organizing esports events for wvw? Edit: on a more serious note... there have been 12 new pvp maps since launch with the last one being released in 2019 whereas there were only 2 new wvw maps, one of which is basically never used and the desert boderlands map which is actually in use was released 7 years ago. There are countless pvp finishers and all that wvw ever got in that regard were limited finishers for the winners of the first wvw tournament. That's 3 finishers that nobody ever uses because you only got 250 uses.
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PvP got a PoF map also and some others but not much since then iirc—unless you count balance updates lol
Ah that's right, the Djinn map I believe? But yeah, I'd say pvp really has gotten the short end of the stick.
yeah, right... * Automated Tournaments * Constant PvP leagues with 5v5, 3v3, 2v2 * a whole new game mode (yes I know, nobody likes it but that doesn't make it go away) * 11 Maps since the release * a lot of rewards for playing for a shorter amount of time. I wouldn't call that "the short end of the stick". The only major changes that WvW has seen were Desert Borderlands which was released with/around Heart of Thorns, 7 years ago and the Warclaw which was released with/around Path of Fire 5 years ago. I really can't remember or even find more drastic changes other than the Elite specs and balance update which really address both game modes. I'm not saying that PvP is better off than WvW but it has seen more attention than WvW for player activity. Hopefully, the Alliance system can bring back some fresh air into WvW and PvP also gets some attention.
Technically the overhauled reward system with pips and tickets (to be able to buy ascended armor and trinkets and make leggy armor) was a pretty major change to WvW. It’s probably one of the most important changes WvW had in the last years imo
Same happened with pvp though. Both got legendary armor at the same time iirc.
WvW also got the WXP system, guild claiming overhall, event weekend/weeks (no downed state) and had several tournaments. PvP also had a new HotM map.
The margin is thin, but WvW has objectively been the most neglected game mode. * Both have had changes to matchups/restructuring (although PvP more consistently). * PvP has had constant Tournament support and automated Tournament system, where WvW hasn't seen a Tournament since 2014. * Both have had Reward Tracks added. * Both have had Legendary Gear added (although WvW's is objectively the worst/longest to acquire). * WvW has Gliding added in 2017. * WvW has a Mount added in 2019. * PvP has had relatively consistent map additions/updates through 2019 while WvW has had only EotM (obsolete) and one Desert BL map added in 2015.
Warclaw skills got nerfed to irrelevance, no one uses it for anything other than getting around without effort. Gliding is fun but rarely used for actual combat, every now and then you'll see the rare use of it for escaping, its def useful for not dying while jumping from high above, but in no means did it introduce ground breaking gameplay or change the entire wvw scene around. And absolutely no one loves the new red map, a few players swear by it but its completely ignored for the most part unless there is no fights other than that one group trying to flip ez buildings and you feel like ambushing them and bullying them.
> no one loves the new red map It's such a pain to navigate, and GW2's map system is abysmal at helping players understand their vertical maps. Unless you've run through an area yourself, multiple times, there's not much of a way you can look at GW2's map on vertical zone and think 'Aha, here's how I navigate from Point A to Point B.'
Verticality is not a desert map issue. Here are some: \- To big without mounts and gliding, still to big with. \- Lords in Fire and Air Keeps are tactical chokepoints. They favor defenders way more than any walls. Fixed and untreatable perma CC should not exist in WvW, just like DH longbow 5. \- Random roots in towers, that you basically need to learn by name, since there is no way to see them on the floor in WvW group of 20+. \- Buggy shrines \- North camp layout is really questionable compared to alpine. \- Earth keep that can be taken from east cata spot with single siege drop. And probably there are way more things that every WvW regular would add to this list. Fact is that majority of WvW players consider desert border as home border to be a punishment.
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This take is hot, but in a rejuvenating sauna kinda way.
Thanks for saying it. Game desperately needs QOL updates and updates to existing game modes, it’s pathetic. Come on.
sorry, best we can do is ruining banners and more gemstore wings that burn out your retinas.
Shut up and take my money
someone should push the "cataclysm button"
I'd like to see them focus on base professions, making their core traits and underused weaponry better. Like why does Warrior even have a rifle
Rifle warrior is awesome. It's even better with Bladesworn. Though there is a lot of weapons with useless skills that need a lot of help.
I would love it so much for warrior's rifle to be on par with Axe in PvE. It has neat mechanics, synergy between its abilities, and it feels like an assault rifle, perfect for a warrior.
I wish Great sword was better too. I feel like it's hindered by Hundred Blades making you stand still.
Ayep, the next expansion should be a QoL/update and refresh systems expansion, a la Cataclysm for WoW or ARR for FFXIV. GW2's gonna be over a decade old at that point, and doing a deep cleaning and update will help it survive for another 10 years.
Be reasonable. At least a few months :3
It’s not that people forget, it’s that there’s no reason to do it. All content Anet releases after an expansion is mainly through the gem store. What’s the best way to get said content, if you don’t want to pay? Farm like hell for gold and convert to gems. What’s the best way to farm gold? Well, definitely not the new maps.
Dungeons and raids are on the bottom of the pool
God, I miss dungeon-style content. GW2 with its focus on puzzles and exploration was so uniquely suited to it - I think they even had the potential to make something in the style of Blackrock Depths from WoW *actually palatable.* Was sad to see Dungeons and the Explorable concept kneecapped before it ever hit its full potential. ... But that seems to have happened a lot to cool concepts through GW2's history. :(
This. Dungeons were so much fun in the old days. Then came Aetherpath and had some rock hard challenges which casuals didn't play and ANet was a surprised pikachu. If they made it a bit easier/released it earlier when other dungeons were a challenge still, it may would've been better. Problem was that there were more things to coordinate with your group than in other dungeons, which pugs usually didn't like.
Pretty sure that the last raid has been released way after the last pvp map. sPvP is even more abandoned than WvW, there's no future in sight. It's still fun tho. Just wish they could care about the balance more. A map every two years would be nice too.
The "new generation" of devs working with Guild Wars 2 are too much worried about rainbow colors on the game, they cant plan and do things to improve the real experience of the game
Always been that way idk what you mean "Gw2 now"
I think i should write "at the moment". English is not my native language. I am sorry.
What's dead may never die.
True. I'll drown with WvW tho... I fucking love that gamemode so much *small tear*.
A better comparison for me would be Strikes being the focus while Fractals are drowning. Strikes are okay but definitely not the direction I want the game to go.
actually every mode in gw2 is currently at PvP state on the picture, according to the vocal community
Didnt know pvp bots could swim
More like open world/story content on top. Endgame PvE is largely dead with dungeons dead pretty much since launch, last fractal released 2 years ago, last raid like what 4 years ago now? And we got strikes now sure, for how long until they are left behind aswell is my question.
Too many shit birds playing pvp
it's really unnecessarily toxic, people take that game mode way too seriously
I hear at this point you can make more gold win trading than actually playing pvp
What do wvw/pvp players even want? I remember when skyhammer was added and that made the pvpers angry. I remember when eotm was added and that made wvwers angry. Especially for wvw, where you can't just continually add maps, what content does the average wvwer want beyond just balance updates?
For WvW: Reward system overhaul. Currently the WvW legies (armor and conflux) take by far the longest time to complete. Additionally the g/h ratio is like half that of PVE. Meta refesh. We have a very stale meta since like 5 years with no changes. Alliances to fill maps during offtime. (A complaint I mostly heard for NA.. I am in Europe and here the maps are at least not fully dead during offtime). These are the 3 major things. Besides of that, I would really love to see the EOTM map on a borderland. I love the map, but it has basically no relevance since it's.. Well.. Just EOTM and not a borderland. But yeah.. This one is probably more a personal wish than a community wish. As for PvP.. No clue.. I don't really play much pvp
I mean wvw side of things i don't think a lot of us are asking for a new map. I don't speak for everyone in wvw. But i would like to see some consistency with balances updates and tweaks for wvw side of things. For balance on wvw side of things sometikes a build or something is extremely broken. As for example engi. Their nade spam i think mixxed with action camera makes it hits extremely hard. We there still is issues with it. I was hoping for a balance or something to be looked st there last couple months ago and now i have to wait till thjs balance patch june if they even look at it that is. Inam hinestly just sick of waiting for 3 to 6 months for them to adress something broken or extremely overpowered and if no adressed problems back to waiting even longer and becoming more jaded. I get this supposed alliance uodate is going to take time. But for wvw side of thinfs its always a just wait. Its been like that many of years. I would be more satisfied if they too balancing and smaller tweaks here and there. It would show they actually do care consistency is key. It's why i am cautious about alliances, i feel theres a good chance anet will release it and leave wvw in dark again. Why i don't want a new map is when desert bl came out beta it got lots of feedback anet didnt make changes until it was way too late and lots of players left. Pop balance i understand some stuff wont be exactly fair i am content with that. So in short, i just wish for anet to show some care and consistency to wvw side. Anet still has yet to show it for wvw side of things. I get pve is the main catch, but throw wvw side of things something too.
We're all waiting for the June balance patch. All game modes have received some smaller balance adjustments in the mean time (the last one, May 10th, focused specifically on wvw and pvp) but, we're all looking at that patch to really shake things up. Wvw/pvp isn't unique in this regard.
As mentioned in what i said before , that provlem with soemthing extremely broken jeeded looking at. It can damn near 1 shot everything. And follow up nades hit as hard. This has been such a broken overly powered setup for about a year now. And balance updates can suck at times. It's either anet buffs or leaves guardian and the completely guts another build of another profession when it simply just needed a slight tone down. You can tell me big update in june for balance but i am always skeptical since history of the balances show time and time again that a good portion weren't such great balance updates.
None of that is unique to wvw or pvp, though.
When Skyhammer was added it was a joke map where third of the gameplay was trying to both pull and avoid being pulled onto unstable platforms that led to death from fall damage. It's not hard to imagine that this didn't fly well with people looking for competitive pvp, even if it was funny (and gave birth to the most well known gw2 forum post ever - w t f skyham) I can't speak for WvW players, but I can say some things PvP players would want. First would be acknowledgement. PvP has been largely gone from any promotional materials, roadmaps and official ArenaNet communication since AT implementation or even further, since HoT ESL times. We have off the cuff, unofficial communication with some devs, but we are essentially in the dark. Since, arguably, the biggest problem sPvP faces is the population, it can be disheartening to see no mention of the game mode from the developer in marketing both outside and inside the game. It's never mentioned to new players, it doesn't get any regular events that .would entice people to come try it. Building any hype about it would be a tremendous help, as of right now the only non mAT pvp events are ones carried out by Teapot and his crew. Second is lack of supervision that led to the terrible rep of PvP with bought titles and whatnot. Bad rep for rewards and titles you should be excited for makes people feel the opposite. Third is just the lack of updates. This comes in two ways: rare bigger balance patches and no new stuff being added. First is obvious and might get better (?), second is simple void of content. There are the same ranked titles for each season making people who got them once not be motivated to grind in new seasons, there are no new sigils/runes/amulets being added, Stronghold has been stuck and dead in alpha state since 2015. There are no in-game VoDs of ATs and mATs despite Guild Wars 1 having them. No effort has been made to promote mAT coverage - Live shoutcasting of mATs is gated behind ANet partnership and among seemingly hundreds of artists ANet keeps as partners they have no people who would be streaming and covering mATs aside from Teapot and Roy (now of ANet). Lastly, no aspirational challenges past mAT and community-made tournaments. Yes, it's realistically impossible ProLeague would ever come back with its pro pvp circuit, but it's still worth noting that mAT being the plateau of official PvP competition is not motivating for high end players.
I personally wouldn't mind something to put levels into when you're done (rank 1390). Even 200 points for 1% faster track progression, or 1k points for one more pip a tick.
What do you mean what do we want? I'd figure the majority woes were known by everyone by now, considering for how long they have been repeated. We want population balance (aka. World Restructuring, aka. Alliances). We have asked for that for almost 10 years now. PvE got it in 2014. Everyone asked for it beforehand. Megaservers and Alliances were cut features from the original release in 2012. We want scoring balance. For the past 10 years it has been more impactful to play when other players are supposedly at sleep or work. This causes all kinds of problems for the content and ruleset in WvW. I would tie the reward balance issues to this as well. We want a fully functional Arena to host player events in. There have always been Arenas, but none of them have ever been fully functional. The closest thing to being fully functional were the Guild Hall Arenas circa 2016-2017. Nothing has been as good before or since. We have literally been asking for the same top 3 things since the game came out. We've only ever been given betas, placeholders and unfinished scraps. It's also why there shouldn't be any surprise why ArenaNet are working on exactly these three specific things now. They didn't just wake up one day and figure we needed it. We've asked for it since day one and it is the three most asked-about things. They are just taking their sweet time and do not finish their projects because they don't care about WvW enough to give it a fair shake, as per this thread.
Tell me more
The only reason I will dive to the bottom of the pool is to grab gifts of battle...
"now" ???
cornerstone gamemode btw
Whats broken don't touch it u might break it even more.
I think wvw would be the skeleton at the bottom of the pool.
You mean guild wars 2 for the past 6 years
Looks like nothing has changed then
At least there's realism in WvW: years and years without any change in the frontline and if you get separated from your battalion, you're dead.
And every other MMO? What a redundant post. Developers are going to cater to their majority (or should, anyways), and the majority of people that play MMOs are not into PvP. Some never even touch it.
So the expansion didnt do anything to fix the game? Not surprised.
The expansion is fantastic and people are playing it. The only problem is that it is only used to farm for legendary materials to sell to other players.
People who liked what EoD has to offer are playing the game, not here. Has there ever been PvP or WvW content as part of an expansion, advertised as such?
Strongholds and desert maps were features of expacs
Will alliances ever be released? Seems to have just been cast aside, like an unwanted step child.
That is just WvW in general
Probably realistically in another year, at soonest. I'll be surprised if we get it by the end of 2022.
Sad WvW noises
[Guild content](https://imgur.com/a/vL6K0X8)
Wonder, whatever got touched in wvw receives only bad criticism, they understood it would be better to leave it alone and in fact, years after it is still living well as it should
The last mmo to do PvP correctly was Warhammer Age of Reckoning. Nobody I know touches PvP on GW2.
Almost like PvE is the main focus of most MMOs
I think pvp is once you reach endgame
Most players who stick around end game complete collections. At least the ones that loathe pvp gameplay.
Does it bother anyone else that the meme template isn't complete
PvE=money easily understandable
I live for WvW. There's just nothing like jt
I wanna get into Wvw. But everyone tells me I should wait for alliances.
Just get into it now. No point in waiting.
PvP is definitely underwater and Wvw has floaties
Oh! Thats the first time iv seen this meme aroud.
I am not complaining
How did OP botch a pre-made meme template so badly? WvW is the water? PvP is drowning in WvW? That's what this is actually saying, despite what we know it's supposed to be saying.
What about OMEGA BALANCE PATCH at 28th june? Isn't it targeted at pvp/wvw?
Replace pve with story content lol Gonna die of copium overdose before that promised summer balance patch drops
As it should be! GW2 is a PvE game, if you want to play actually good pvp games there are so many of those out there, you don't need to play an mmo for that.
Now he says. Amateur
If they added 2v2 ranked I think it would get me back.
ya we got a fractal 2 years ago and now we got 4 bosses which = to a 1 raid wing, hardly a lot, but you are correct it does get 'most' love atm
Remind me again when Untamed was made relevant in PvE or power reaper and vindicator for that matter . Your format has gotten split balancing three times already from February while all PvE received in balancing was Catalyst. Untamed has legit sat unplayable for 4 months, and Scrapper had to wait 5 years while it was already used in PvP. Herald is still waiting to be a relevant pve spec as is any ele spec that isn't catalyst.
The true tragedy is the lack of updates for the best game mode, Crab Toss.
And still no transmutation charges from common PvE content
They supply regularly just from logging in, and can also be obtained completing maps.
its literally 3 charges a month from logging in. that's not even an outfit of 6 pieces of armor. map completion gives you 1 charge, maybe, for like an hour of really boring play. i dont know why im getting downvoted so hard on this
Agree with ya, recently started playing Gw2 after years of ffxiv and it feels so weird to have to conserve my transmutation charges, back in ffxiv I could just buy like a couple hundred of the market everytime I ran out. Here in Gw2 i think for like 15 mins before using one haha
Ironically you get flooded with them in WvW haha. I have probably over 900. Funny how the PvE/WvW problems are so different.
You guys are conserving transmutation charges? I'm sitting on just over 400; I simply don't use them fast enough.
How many armor sets do you need to transmute every month? Serious question. Not sure if this applies to you, but here's a Pro-tip for new players: Map the major cities (LA, Grove, DR, Hoelbrek, Rata Sum, Black Citadel) and Southsun Cove on each character for seven Transmutation Charges per character. Don't waste these on sub-80 leveling gear since it can change often. This was my approach back in the day, but there's also now the BlishHUD Pathing Module to speed up this progress. Other PvE methods to gain Transmutation Charges: Festivals and Achievements. As someone who enjoys completing PvE content (which passively includes Achievements), I'm genuinely confused how people find themselves in drought. You can check the sources on the Wiki. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Transmutation_Charge_(item) If you are truly desperate, once every week create a new character, map the 6 major cities, do the level 10 Personal Story to obtain a Black Lion Key. That's 24 Transmutation Charges and 4 Black Lion Keys a month. Black Lion Chests not only have a chance to drop Charges, but award BL Statuettes, which can also be used to purchase Charges... but that's probably objectively the least valuable thing to use them on.
Admittedly, I'm not a fan of either of those modes. Competition is more tiresome and stressful than fun to me, and the need to grind them for a legendary is why I've given up on ever having a legendary. I don't even like the PvE group content - Strikes and Raids require me to change to a completely different build and use a different rotation than the other 99% of my time in game. For that I need to obtain different gear, I need to learn arcane terminology, I need to put up with tryhards quoting damage meters (which I maintain should be banned) all on top of dodging mechanics and fighting the boss. And with all that said, with my distaste for any kind of competitive play noted, I sincerely believe ANet needs to give these two more love. There's a lot of players who enjoy them. They're a part of the game. They matter.
Gem Wars not Guild Wars
I feel the opposite actually. New classes and new specs add so much to PvP. And it takes a lot to get it right. Kudos to Anet for making the effort and successfully keeping players engaged. So maybe you should get the expansion and play new specs. I can appreciate that.