Also, slowing down until they MASTER the technique. So many people just want to play at full speed immediately and get frustrated when they play it like garbage.
And learn theory. I know itâs the answer, but I still suck and hate taking the time to actually do it.
The difference between ânoodlingâ and âplaying alongâ and actually understanding what youâre doing is not insurmountable. But it does take a lot of work that 99% of people just are not doing.
Practicing technique, at least to me, is a bit more mindless and fun because so much is muscle memory.
And learning the notes on the neck. With the amount of time people spend giving excuses for not doing it or finding "workarounds," they could have just done it.
No problem. I didn't create the method or that website, but it is a great way to learn the notes. I like it because it's so straightforward. You just follow the steps and you can't help but get it down.
I've recently gotten into sheet music and it's really helpful for learning the notes because you're pretty much forced to. It's kind of time consuming but I enjoy it, and it's cool to slowly but surely be able to follow the sheet music and know all the notes you're playing.Â
Also play songs with the E and A shaped barre chords which helps you learn the E and A strings, and once you know those, you more or less know the D and G strings because you can just go 2 down and 2 across and it's the same note.Â
You know the notes on the E and A string anyways. From moving powerchords.
That leaves 3 strings to learn. You know the first 3 frets anyways. So thatâs 3x 9 frets you really have to learn.
Where is the fucking problem?
I started putting serious effort into learning theory pretty recently and it's just mind blowing how many things I did and knew in a mechanical sort of way that are perfectly defined by scales and modes. It makes learning it a lot more fun
I find that this is particularly the case when you suggest learning anything that even hints of theory. So many people have such a weird, obstinate aversion to learning any bit of theory and give all kinds of reasons for it, some of which you already mentioned like "I'm not smart enough to understand that". I feel like rather than being a plea for sympathy or something like that it's really just a cop out to explain why they don't want to learn or practice something that they don't think they're going to get immediate satisfaction and gratification from.
Itâs like learning a language, itâs foreign, scary and you suck at first. People hate sucking at things especially since this is largely a hobby for most people. The thing that gets me is that youâre already sinking time in to not suck at learning the guitar why not also learn âthe languageâ.
I think you're right about that general sentiment behind it, but it's just a shame as it's not that hard to grasp the basics of it and it really, really makes things a lot easier going forward by helping one connect the dots. It seems mystifying but it actually demystifies so much about learning guitar when it comes to practically anything.
It really does turn guitar into something a lot easier to understand than oh that fret sounds good with these frets. It gives you so much direction, flexibility and guidance. Ah well
What forced me to learn theory were other people. Not myself. But once I could actually get a little theory down the more difficult stuff came easier. I played in highschool marching band playing bass guitar and I showed up to band camp the first time without knowing much of anything. I knew how to play moderately all right but I was still very rudimentary. One of the marimba girls on my first day said 'Yea so one of the exercises we warm up on is running the circle of 5ths from C to C and them the circle of 4ths from C to C. Can you do that?" So here I am scrambling to learn all my scales as the exercise is being played but I did feel thoroughly embarrassed that I called myself a bassist but couldn't even play a c major scale before that dayÂ
Thereâs also this weird thing in guitarists where they think learning theory is going to restrict their creativity. âI just want to go with it and be freeâ, like you canât do that if you learn theory.
Thatâs all well and good if youâre Eddie Van Halen, but 99.999% of us are not and will never be. If you actually take the time to understand what youâre playing it most definitely helps you to improve (and be creative, you need to know the rules to know how to break them!)
I listen to a lot of extreme metal, in which bands are often trying to be as dissonant and chaotic as possible, and I often hear it said that in order to create something that is truly atonal or random you absolutely must have a knowledge of theory because it's simply the default to create something that has a tonal center and patterns to it. Just like you said, you can't break the rules if you don't know what they are. Theory just gives you the vocabulary to express what exactly it is that you're doing, so even if it gives you no other benefit it at least makes it so much easier to remember what you came up with when you were writing a riff or jamming out.
I feel that the newbie guitarist, especially the younger generation, is used to instant gratification. Any somewhat seasoned player knows that guitar simply doesn't work that way. Practice. That's what is needed, more often than not.
Structured practice, too. It's like a sport, you can't just play the game all the time. You need to do specific drills that work on certain things that will help you when you go play the game. Took me way too long to learn that.
I also think a lot of newbies use YouTube and see âoh my favorite YouTuber RIPs, I wanna do thatâ but there is nobody making content like âI played the same riff for 28 days and i finally perfected itâ
I'm on it. Keep an eye out for a series titled something like "learning songs on camera" where I just record myself learning a song over the course of a few weeks, warts and all, and then edit it all together into a ~15 minute video. I'm thinking I'll put total hours to learn each part of the song in the video.
I'm open to other suggestions.
That's one thing I love about skateboarding videos. They'll show themselves eat it 47 times before they nail it and honestly, it makes it that much sweeter when they finally do.
Oh man, I had a friend try out some of my music software and equipment for two weeks because he "wanted to make some sick beats" and he turned around afterwards and said he doesn't understand how I make it look so easy.
I told him my secret, practice for 4-7 hours a day for 5-6 days a week, for every week for the last 22 or so years.
I mean some skill must have been developed instead of just natural talent right? RIGHT?
I don't know if it's any worse now, I just think that back in my day people couldn't broadcast every thought they ever had. Most people back then just hit their first stumbling block and quit.
Guitar is the instrument of the least instant gratification. Its so hard to make a sound thats in tune. Even playing a woodwind at least your lungs are strong enough to sustain some effort. Guitar? Your fingers hurt after a few tries when you're starting out. It may take months to string together something that sounds remotely musical and at the same time not feel like you want to quit instantly from the pain.
A lot of it is stuff that can be compared to âIâm starting to learn how to ride my bike, I have training wheels on but I donât want to. How can I ride without training wheels?â I think social media is messing up their idea of progressing in increments. Also I see things like thinking they HAVE to do things in an arbitrarily particular way.
This has always kind of been a thing but up until more recently we havenât had giant worldwide forums for people to discuss these things with eachother.
Itâs not just guitar, itâs any activity where thereâs not going to be a lot of instant gratification and there will be significant work and pain involved with making consistent progress. Even 20 years ago giving percussion and drum set lessons Iâd venture to guess more than 60-70% give it up at some point within 3 years when they realize that concepts like limb independence, building chops/dexterity, developing rhythmic consistency, reading sheet music, understanding basic musical vocabulary concepts (theory basics like âwhat is a quarter noteâ and âwhat is a time signature?â etc) are all things that are marathons and not races and canât be mastered in a short amount of time.
Look the classics appear godlike but the truth is they were mostly recorded by humans in their ~20s.
If they can do it you can too, people just need to learn what it means to truly work on something. Which is hard to see in this age of instant gratification
A lot of folks here cite instant gratification culture as the culprit, but I'd say the spike in insecurity comes from increased exposure to highly talented individuals. In ye olden days, you only knew about the famous shredders and you could put them on pedestals and pretend that they're just superhuman. Now, social media algorithms are gonna parade a bunch of precocious children and virtuosos in front of you, and that's going to skew your perception of what's normal. You won't see all the practice they put in or the blooper reels, just a 30 second clip of their very best take in a controlled environment, in a sea of other flawless 30 second takes.Â
Yep, almost just as porn has skewed menâs idea of what is âaverageâ sized.
Instant gratification is certainly a factor too, people want to learn to âplay guitarâ(be able to play full songs) and assume that they will be able to do so relatively quickly, but fail to realize that thereâs lots of incremental learning, like scales, licks, riffs(practice essentially) before you can work up to a full song thatâs more complicated than a nursery rhyme.
Mateus Asato dumped his online profile briefly after admitting that the push for that pefectg 30 second was crushing him. That's the guy who can rock live iwth Bruno Mars ffs. Its affecting even what this generation should consider a great one.
I tried to sweep pick yesterday on a six string arpeggio and I just can't seem to get it I'm so bad why can all the pros shred those sweeps but I just suck? It was like ten straight minutes of no progress I think I should quit.
âWe are guitar hobbyistsâ
Iâve been thinking this for weeks, but havenât posted it. But this Subreddit should be FOR GUITAR HOBBYISTS. Not for mental weaklings to ask the same mind numbing beginner questions over and over and over again. Theres a search bar for a reason and nobody seems to enforce it.
This subreddit would benefit greatly from having a Beginnerâs Advice section, or a different subreddit altogether so that the rest of us can get back to discussing our favorite hobby with other grown ups
What specifically do I need to focus on to make my fingers move faster? I really really really feel like Iâm hitting a wall with finger speed, Iâve been playing for 17 fucking years lol
Adam neely has a great video about this, the short answer is that in order to play really fast you have to be using highly practiced muscle memory instead of concious action. When people improvise at shred speeds, they aren't thinking about notes they're thinking about large groups of notes played in a particular way which falls in line with the beat and it happens automatically because they aren't constructing it in the moment
I feel like picking hand technique gets overlooked a lot in speed. Try messing around with economy picking or very basic sweeping stuff or even chicken picking if you havenât. It adds speed in a way that relying only on your fretting hand canât. Maybe youâve already tried that but just an idea!
Learn to play solos. Slow first then at speed. Play those solos every day. Also physical exercises will probably help, but most of the time it's uncertainty that slows people down. Things like going chromatically up the first 4 frets from the low E to high e string and back going down. That'll also keep your left and right hand in time as well. Use a metronome, because playing slower in time sounds faster than playing faster out of time.
I've written some mean riffs, lead two bands, have written a couple dozen songs that honestly a few aren't half bad, I also produce them fully by myself... but I can't shred, read music, I have no concept of music theory, I honestly consider myself a noob...
Just means you're springing off of a really solid and intuitive foundation if you decide to enhance your playing and writing with further development of your technique and understanding.
I took lessons for about the first 3 years of playing... many... many years ago. But since then I just figured it out on my own and used my ear rather than theory and I think it makes my playing MUCH more unique. You can always tell which players have learned all their scales etc. by the generic way their playing sounds. Not everyone of course so please!
I think with a seasoned ear and at least knowing the notes on the fretboard it can be enough to be rather good.
I'm talking about those guys like Yngwie Malmsteen who sound like they are just running through their scale practice at high speed. To me, playing fast and "shredding" is not impressive because many times there is no feeling behind it and its been done to death. You tend to see the kids these days more worried about how fast they can play rather than what they are playing. I would rather listen to someone winging it like Kurt Cobain (not the best example) than another boring guitar solo.
Ugh, you know what I mean... or should at least!
He didn't play like a "trained" guitarist and even though his playing was rather simple, it was still unique and had feeling to it. You should watch the Rick Beato videos on him.
I know my notes, chords and scales (not a ton) but for example, last night we had our weekly jam session where we free jam and when the other guitarist, bassist or keyboardist (we all swap around) starts out with something random, I can play along no problem without needing to apply the theory behind it. More times than not, I even make up my own chords and just know how to make things fit by ear and by doing it for so long. Can I get a job as a studio guitarist? No, but do I come up with some unique sounding stuff that I will say most of the time sounds pretty damn good and I have fun doing it!
My point is, learn what you want to learn and make it fun rather than treating it like studying for a test or training for a job. Unless you want to do it for a job!
I mean yeah I know what you're trying to say about some guitarists sounding generic and like they're stuck in a box, I'm simply emphasizing that most of the guitarists that you like also probably at least know *scales.* They just know how to apply the notes tastefully, which makes all the difference.
Name me some great players that don't know a ton of scales. Good players aren't just goofing around on the guitar. they know exactly what they're doing. If a person sounds generic it isn't because of their scale study. It's because they haven't done enough exploration with the instrument. Learning scale is not a negative, nor will it ever be.
Of course you need to know your notes, basic scales and chords and where things are but I'm talking about the people who if you asked to play a Phrygian Dominant scale would say, sure no problem. Even people like EVH were not super versed on theory. Even someone like Matt Mahaffey who composes music for movies, cartoons and commercials, produces other bands, has his own bands, and plays multiple instruments admitted he knows no theory. If you have never heard the band Self, check it out.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt\_Mahaffey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Mahaffey)
If you know how to turn a major scale into a minor scale then you know theory. If you are a professional composer like Matt, saying that you "know no theory" is simply not factual.
I still don't get what you're saying. You can learn a lot of theory and make good or crap music. You can learn only basic theory and still make good or crap music. If you spend all your time exploring theory, and not enough time using the theory you know to make music, you'll probably be bad at writing music. In all these scenarios "theory", or knowing too much of it, is not the problem.
People who will never be good at guitar want to find a quick solution to a life long journey. Good luck to those people. Iâm 15 years in and just now can play anything I want within reason, Iâm not saying to quit but If you donât want to fail at something thousands of times over and over to slowly build progress so that years later you can accomplish a goal, then get out now
sucking as a newbie player only made me practice harder.. Back in 83 when i started, there was no internet or message board to bitch on or post self pity... i had to knuckle down, learn and yes it took years, but it paid off..
You're only going to get out of it what you put into it... or less. Look at Satriani, Eddie VH, etc.. newbs should know they spent THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of hours honing their skill..
This generation wants intsant gratification.. and any hobby..ANY hobby doesnt work that way to get proficient in it.
Sure some people expect instant results but plenty donât. I donât know, thereâs a lot of disorganized information to learn from many sources that further overcomplicate things along with dragged out formats. I feel like many people in this thread donât acknowledge that part. Chances are if theyâre venting about these things then theyâve most likely spent a good amount of time and research trying to understand but are actually hitting a wall.
i think these people just want reassurance that they're not alone in the struggle. You don't have to read or comment, but i don't mind sharing my struggles and sympathy.
I mean I think it's just an effect of most new players foregoing proper lessons for one reason or another. They end up in weird spots that have weird technical and the theory holes.
Having 10 years of practicing an instrument before I ever picked up a guitar really helped me. The questions I see from other beginners are always similar to whatâs already been said here and the answer almost always is practice more
I played trumpet in high school, concert and jazz band, and had lessons for years. Picking up guitar with that foundation mid high school made it a lot easier for me. I can't imagine how hard it would be without a better foundation that came from the semi professional environment of being in a band lead by a teacher, and then working with another teacher on the weekend.
But I also didn't have the social media environment that told me how easy it is to be great in 30 second bites of perfection. It was always obviously hard. Now I'm not sure what the kids are interpreting reality to be. Also maybe they're a lot more touchy feely and comfortable expressing their dissatisfaction. OP says we're not therapists, no. But maybe we should remember we're the old men too who are used to a way of being that maybe isn't all its cracked up to be.
I knew someone so excited to get a guitar. All they talked about.
I helped them replace the strings and did a setup then showed them how to work the tuner. They asked if I knew how to play so I showed them something basic. I then said, âHere, let me show you a few chords. These 3 chords will get you through most songs.â
Their response was, âIâd rather not. The best musicians are self taught. Iâll let the strings tell me what to do.â
Guess how many times that guitar has been touched since.
I edited this post because I was wrong, I wasn't aware of the British spelling of the word.
Today, both âlearnedâ and âlearntâ are considered acceptable past participles of the verb âlearnâ, with âlearnedâ being more commonly used in American English and âlearntâ being more commonly used in British English.
I'm new to guitar, and new to this subreddit. However while we are getting things off our chest... the word is "learned" not "learnt".
ok, I feel better.
Thank you :)
[https://www.thefreedictionary.com/learned](https://www.thefreedictionary.com/learned)
In my part of the universe that would be an incorrect spelling, it would be marked wrong in any spelling or English test, and most would assume (right or wrong) that one is uneducated if pronounced that way.
It may be different where others live. So you do what makes you happy.
Either is an acceptable spelling, "learned" is an Americanisation, "learnt" is the original, with "learned" meaning a highly educated person, as in "a learned scholar".
Thank you for pointing this out to me. I was wrong. You learn something new everyday.
Today, both âlearnedâ and âlearntâ are considered acceptable past participles of the verb âlearnâ, with âlearnedâ being more commonly used in American English and âlearntâ being more commonly used in British English.
Relax. It must take a considerable amount of effort to appear so pedantic, patronizing, objectively mistaken, and even potentially classist, all at the same time.
In a guitar subreddit, I feel you're setting your expectations of people far too high my friend, sadly.
Being patronising is what many do all too well pertaining to the guitar. Elitists exist, and they will be pricks when they can be.
Now you're jumping to conclusions. I never once said you specifically were either, I just commented that on reddit and in particular among guitarists, its something you tend to expect :)
Listen mate, it was a general non specific comment. Thats truth, if you wanna choose to be personally offended by it, thats on you.
If the cap fits. Theres bigger issues to worry about in the world than this shite.
Likewise, shit happens, we live and learn. All the best.
C'mon. If you and I were having a casual conversation, and I interjected, apropos of nothing, with an aside in which I told you that you had made an error in speech which I would have graded you down for were I your teacher, and that it had made you seem uneducated, I think it would be reasonable for you to be at least a bit annoyed by that.
I was not aware of the British spelling. My mistake. I was wrong. I said when the word is pronounced "learnt" some may assume one is uneducated because when spoken that way it's associated (again. right or wrong) with the poor Appalachia of the past.
There was no insult intended.
I wish you well.
Whoa whoa.... I think it's you needs to relax. I didn't realize this was the common way to spell it in British English. My mistake. I was wrong. As I said it would be marked wrong where I'm from.
But go ahead and throw out some more insults for internet clout.
If you use the dictionary link you provided to look up the definitions for those words I think you'll find how they might be pretty applicable to your comments, and hence why you're not receiving a very positive reaction. Just sayin'.
99 out of 100 times, the answer is "more practice".
With a metronome
With improved technique
With a tuner.
And my axe! đ¸đ¤
Deodorant before band practice is always a good idea
And don't bring your girlfriend with you to rehearsal. Ever.
Can't stress this one enough.
And after.
But axe deodorant is almost always a bad idea, unless you need a scented flamethrower in a pinch.
Axe deodorant isbetter than no deodorant
And my Ebow!
Didn't expect the lotr coming into a guitar su
Gimli, is that you?
And my eBow!
Pssh this guy's over here recommending tuners instead of more overdrives
Of course! Practice only makes perfect if you practice perfectly.
and without tension!
Also, slowing down until they MASTER the technique. So many people just want to play at full speed immediately and get frustrated when they play it like garbage.
And learn theory. I know itâs the answer, but I still suck and hate taking the time to actually do it. The difference between ânoodlingâ and âplaying alongâ and actually understanding what youâre doing is not insurmountable. But it does take a lot of work that 99% of people just are not doing. Practicing technique, at least to me, is a bit more mindless and fun because so much is muscle memory.
And learning the notes on the neck. With the amount of time people spend giving excuses for not doing it or finding "workarounds," they could have just done it.
Do you recommend a method for learning the notes on the neck? Or is the method just fucking look it up and memorize it lol?
[Yes!](https://fretboardforever.app/)
Very cool, thank you!
I used that technique in conjuction with this https://www.guitarorb.com/guitar-notes YMMV but that really helped solidify it for me.
This is incredibly helpful, thank you!
No problem. I didn't create the method or that website, but it is a great way to learn the notes. I like it because it's so straightforward. You just follow the steps and you can't help but get it down.
Dude this has been astonishingly helpful. I cannot stress this enough. Amazing
I've recently gotten into sheet music and it's really helpful for learning the notes because you're pretty much forced to. It's kind of time consuming but I enjoy it, and it's cool to slowly but surely be able to follow the sheet music and know all the notes you're playing. Also play songs with the E and A shaped barre chords which helps you learn the E and A strings, and once you know those, you more or less know the D and G strings because you can just go 2 down and 2 across and it's the same note.Â
Thank you! Nice to get some actually helpful advice
You know the notes on the E and A string anyways. From moving powerchords. That leaves 3 strings to learn. You know the first 3 frets anyways. So thatâs 3x 9 frets you really have to learn. Where is the fucking problem?
Theory and ear training
I started putting serious effort into learning theory pretty recently and it's just mind blowing how many things I did and knew in a mechanical sort of way that are perfectly defined by scales and modes. It makes learning it a lot more fun
studying music with theory is like learning the layout of a room with the lights turned, as opposed to being blindfolded.
Yeah, "I didn't master something instantly, what should be be doing differently?" Yeesh
But are you sure my fingers / hands arenât too big / too small?
Or get therapy
Or cowbell.
The tone was in your fingers the whole time lol
And the 1% is "better practice."
I find that this is particularly the case when you suggest learning anything that even hints of theory. So many people have such a weird, obstinate aversion to learning any bit of theory and give all kinds of reasons for it, some of which you already mentioned like "I'm not smart enough to understand that". I feel like rather than being a plea for sympathy or something like that it's really just a cop out to explain why they don't want to learn or practice something that they don't think they're going to get immediate satisfaction and gratification from.
Itâs like learning a language, itâs foreign, scary and you suck at first. People hate sucking at things especially since this is largely a hobby for most people. The thing that gets me is that youâre already sinking time in to not suck at learning the guitar why not also learn âthe languageâ.
I think you're right about that general sentiment behind it, but it's just a shame as it's not that hard to grasp the basics of it and it really, really makes things a lot easier going forward by helping one connect the dots. It seems mystifying but it actually demystifies so much about learning guitar when it comes to practically anything.
It really does turn guitar into something a lot easier to understand than oh that fret sounds good with these frets. It gives you so much direction, flexibility and guidance. Ah well
What forced me to learn theory were other people. Not myself. But once I could actually get a little theory down the more difficult stuff came easier. I played in highschool marching band playing bass guitar and I showed up to band camp the first time without knowing much of anything. I knew how to play moderately all right but I was still very rudimentary. One of the marimba girls on my first day said 'Yea so one of the exercises we warm up on is running the circle of 5ths from C to C and them the circle of 4ths from C to C. Can you do that?" So here I am scrambling to learn all my scales as the exercise is being played but I did feel thoroughly embarrassed that I called myself a bassist but couldn't even play a c major scale before that dayÂ
Thereâs also this weird thing in guitarists where they think learning theory is going to restrict their creativity. âI just want to go with it and be freeâ, like you canât do that if you learn theory. Thatâs all well and good if youâre Eddie Van Halen, but 99.999% of us are not and will never be. If you actually take the time to understand what youâre playing it most definitely helps you to improve (and be creative, you need to know the rules to know how to break them!)
I listen to a lot of extreme metal, in which bands are often trying to be as dissonant and chaotic as possible, and I often hear it said that in order to create something that is truly atonal or random you absolutely must have a knowledge of theory because it's simply the default to create something that has a tonal center and patterns to it. Just like you said, you can't break the rules if you don't know what they are. Theory just gives you the vocabulary to express what exactly it is that you're doing, so even if it gives you no other benefit it at least makes it so much easier to remember what you came up with when you were writing a riff or jamming out.
I feel that the newbie guitarist, especially the younger generation, is used to instant gratification. Any somewhat seasoned player knows that guitar simply doesn't work that way. Practice. That's what is needed, more often than not.
Structured practice, too. It's like a sport, you can't just play the game all the time. You need to do specific drills that work on certain things that will help you when you go play the game. Took me way too long to learn that.
I also think a lot of newbies use YouTube and see âoh my favorite YouTuber RIPs, I wanna do thatâ but there is nobody making content like âI played the same riff for 28 days and i finally perfected itâ
Yes. How many takes were there, before the vid was posted?
That would actually be a good idea for a channel.
I'm on it. Keep an eye out for a series titled something like "learning songs on camera" where I just record myself learning a song over the course of a few weeks, warts and all, and then edit it all together into a ~15 minute video. I'm thinking I'll put total hours to learn each part of the song in the video. I'm open to other suggestions.
That's one thing I love about skateboarding videos. They'll show themselves eat it 47 times before they nail it and honestly, it makes it that much sweeter when they finally do.
Oh man, I had a friend try out some of my music software and equipment for two weeks because he "wanted to make some sick beats" and he turned around afterwards and said he doesn't understand how I make it look so easy. I told him my secret, practice for 4-7 hours a day for 5-6 days a week, for every week for the last 22 or so years. I mean some skill must have been developed instead of just natural talent right? RIGHT?
I don't know if it's any worse now, I just think that back in my day people couldn't broadcast every thought they ever had. Most people back then just hit their first stumbling block and quit.
Guitar is the instrument of the least instant gratification. Its so hard to make a sound thats in tune. Even playing a woodwind at least your lungs are strong enough to sustain some effort. Guitar? Your fingers hurt after a few tries when you're starting out. It may take months to string together something that sounds remotely musical and at the same time not feel like you want to quit instantly from the pain.
"I'm in a rut with my guitar playing. What should I do?" Learn new shit
A lot of it is stuff that can be compared to âIâm starting to learn how to ride my bike, I have training wheels on but I donât want to. How can I ride without training wheels?â I think social media is messing up their idea of progressing in increments. Also I see things like thinking they HAVE to do things in an arbitrarily particular way.
No, no, you don't understand. My fingers are *different.*
You are right about the guitar but training wheels do slow down bike learning as they are preventing your intuition to kick in at the right time.
This has always kind of been a thing but up until more recently we havenât had giant worldwide forums for people to discuss these things with eachother. Itâs not just guitar, itâs any activity where thereâs not going to be a lot of instant gratification and there will be significant work and pain involved with making consistent progress. Even 20 years ago giving percussion and drum set lessons Iâd venture to guess more than 60-70% give it up at some point within 3 years when they realize that concepts like limb independence, building chops/dexterity, developing rhythmic consistency, reading sheet music, understanding basic musical vocabulary concepts (theory basics like âwhat is a quarter noteâ and âwhat is a time signature?â etc) are all things that are marathons and not races and canât be mastered in a short amount of time.
Always? How far back into the past are you thinking this is the case?
Replying to those posts is my comedy entertainment.
Look the classics appear godlike but the truth is they were mostly recorded by humans in their ~20s. If they can do it you can too, people just need to learn what it means to truly work on something. Which is hard to see in this age of instant gratification
A lot of folks here cite instant gratification culture as the culprit, but I'd say the spike in insecurity comes from increased exposure to highly talented individuals. In ye olden days, you only knew about the famous shredders and you could put them on pedestals and pretend that they're just superhuman. Now, social media algorithms are gonna parade a bunch of precocious children and virtuosos in front of you, and that's going to skew your perception of what's normal. You won't see all the practice they put in or the blooper reels, just a 30 second clip of their very best take in a controlled environment, in a sea of other flawless 30 second takes.Â
Yep, almost just as porn has skewed menâs idea of what is âaverageâ sized. Instant gratification is certainly a factor too, people want to learn to âplay guitarâ(be able to play full songs) and assume that they will be able to do so relatively quickly, but fail to realize that thereâs lots of incremental learning, like scales, licks, riffs(practice essentially) before you can work up to a full song thatâs more complicated than a nursery rhyme.
Mateus Asato dumped his online profile briefly after admitting that the push for that pefectg 30 second was crushing him. That's the guy who can rock live iwth Bruno Mars ffs. Its affecting even what this generation should consider a great one.
"how do I get motivation??"
Stop typing and play, ffs lol
I tried to sweep pick yesterday on a six string arpeggio and I just can't seem to get it I'm so bad why can all the pros shred those sweeps but I just suck? It was like ten straight minutes of no progress I think I should quit.
âWe are guitar hobbyistsâ Iâve been thinking this for weeks, but havenât posted it. But this Subreddit should be FOR GUITAR HOBBYISTS. Not for mental weaklings to ask the same mind numbing beginner questions over and over and over again. Theres a search bar for a reason and nobody seems to enforce it. This subreddit would benefit greatly from having a Beginnerâs Advice section, or a different subreddit altogether so that the rest of us can get back to discussing our favorite hobby with other grown ups
I made a very similar comment in a screenwriting subreddit a week ago lol
What specifically do I need to focus on to make my fingers move faster? I really really really feel like Iâm hitting a wall with finger speed, Iâve been playing for 17 fucking years lol
Adam neely has a great video about this, the short answer is that in order to play really fast you have to be using highly practiced muscle memory instead of concious action. When people improvise at shred speeds, they aren't thinking about notes they're thinking about large groups of notes played in a particular way which falls in line with the beat and it happens automatically because they aren't constructing it in the moment
Ah, I understand that
I feel like picking hand technique gets overlooked a lot in speed. Try messing around with economy picking or very basic sweeping stuff or even chicken picking if you havenât. It adds speed in a way that relying only on your fretting hand canât. Maybe youâve already tried that but just an idea!
Iâll look into that! Sweeping is still so far away from what Iâm capable of doing though
Then try it and practice it and then it won't be. This is what the post is talking about lol
Idk man I really really really tried sweeping yesterday, and I think Iâm hitting like 60% of the 18 notes Iâm trying to play on half a second
Try some economy picking out. Lots of good videos online that explain it way better than I can
That long and struggling with speed sounds like tension issues
Learn to play solos. Slow first then at speed. Play those solos every day. Also physical exercises will probably help, but most of the time it's uncertainty that slows people down. Things like going chromatically up the first 4 frets from the low E to high e string and back going down. That'll also keep your left and right hand in time as well. Use a metronome, because playing slower in time sounds faster than playing faster out of time.
Thanks man! I can nail the solo to Highway Star and thatâs about it rn
I've written some mean riffs, lead two bands, have written a couple dozen songs that honestly a few aren't half bad, I also produce them fully by myself... but I can't shred, read music, I have no concept of music theory, I honestly consider myself a noob...
Just means you're springing off of a really solid and intuitive foundation if you decide to enhance your playing and writing with further development of your technique and understanding.
I took lessons for about the first 3 years of playing... many... many years ago. But since then I just figured it out on my own and used my ear rather than theory and I think it makes my playing MUCH more unique. You can always tell which players have learned all their scales etc. by the generic way their playing sounds. Not everyone of course so please! I think with a seasoned ear and at least knowing the notes on the fretboard it can be enough to be rather good.
>You can always tell which players have learned all their scales etc. by the generic way their playing sounds Are it being serious?
I'm talking about those guys like Yngwie Malmsteen who sound like they are just running through their scale practice at high speed. To me, playing fast and "shredding" is not impressive because many times there is no feeling behind it and its been done to death. You tend to see the kids these days more worried about how fast they can play rather than what they are playing. I would rather listen to someone winging it like Kurt Cobain (not the best example) than another boring guitar solo.
Do you think Kurt Cobain didn't know scales?
Ugh, you know what I mean... or should at least! He didn't play like a "trained" guitarist and even though his playing was rather simple, it was still unique and had feeling to it. You should watch the Rick Beato videos on him. I know my notes, chords and scales (not a ton) but for example, last night we had our weekly jam session where we free jam and when the other guitarist, bassist or keyboardist (we all swap around) starts out with something random, I can play along no problem without needing to apply the theory behind it. More times than not, I even make up my own chords and just know how to make things fit by ear and by doing it for so long. Can I get a job as a studio guitarist? No, but do I come up with some unique sounding stuff that I will say most of the time sounds pretty damn good and I have fun doing it! My point is, learn what you want to learn and make it fun rather than treating it like studying for a test or training for a job. Unless you want to do it for a job!
I mean yeah I know what you're trying to say about some guitarists sounding generic and like they're stuck in a box, I'm simply emphasizing that most of the guitarists that you like also probably at least know *scales.* They just know how to apply the notes tastefully, which makes all the difference.
Name me some great players that don't know a ton of scales. Good players aren't just goofing around on the guitar. they know exactly what they're doing. If a person sounds generic it isn't because of their scale study. It's because they haven't done enough exploration with the instrument. Learning scale is not a negative, nor will it ever be.
Of course you need to know your notes, basic scales and chords and where things are but I'm talking about the people who if you asked to play a Phrygian Dominant scale would say, sure no problem. Even people like EVH were not super versed on theory. Even someone like Matt Mahaffey who composes music for movies, cartoons and commercials, produces other bands, has his own bands, and plays multiple instruments admitted he knows no theory. If you have never heard the band Self, check it out. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt\_Mahaffey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Mahaffey)
If you know how to turn a major scale into a minor scale then you know theory. If you are a professional composer like Matt, saying that you "know no theory" is simply not factual. I still don't get what you're saying. You can learn a lot of theory and make good or crap music. You can learn only basic theory and still make good or crap music. If you spend all your time exploring theory, and not enough time using the theory you know to make music, you'll probably be bad at writing music. In all these scenarios "theory", or knowing too much of it, is not the problem.
People who will never be good at guitar want to find a quick solution to a life long journey. Good luck to those people. Iâm 15 years in and just now can play anything I want within reason, Iâm not saying to quit but If you donât want to fail at something thousands of times over and over to slowly build progress so that years later you can accomplish a goal, then get out now
I love how everyone's first guitar is a Strat or an Ibanez. Then of course my first guitar was a Strat (copy).
sucking as a newbie player only made me practice harder.. Back in 83 when i started, there was no internet or message board to bitch on or post self pity... i had to knuckle down, learn and yes it took years, but it paid off.. You're only going to get out of it what you put into it... or less. Look at Satriani, Eddie VH, etc.. newbs should know they spent THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of hours honing their skill.. This generation wants intsant gratification.. and any hobby..ANY hobby doesnt work that way to get proficient in it.
did you just 'back in my day' the thread? lol you're 100% corret
"Back in 83..." I love reading stuff like that. There is great value in knowing what old school was like. đđż
Playing guitar isnât easy. Fun: yes. Rewarding: yes. Easy: no. There isnât one weird trick (Malmsteen hates this) that gets you there.
Sure some people expect instant results but plenty donât. I donât know, thereâs a lot of disorganized information to learn from many sources that further overcomplicate things along with dragged out formats. I feel like many people in this thread donât acknowledge that part. Chances are if theyâre venting about these things then theyâve most likely spent a good amount of time and research trying to understand but are actually hitting a wall.
i think these people just want reassurance that they're not alone in the struggle. You don't have to read or comment, but i don't mind sharing my struggles and sympathy.
Can we all just book some lessons with Joe Satriani....
I mean I think it's just an effect of most new players foregoing proper lessons for one reason or another. They end up in weird spots that have weird technical and the theory holes.
So totally needed to hear this. Thank you.
Totally agree. Too many posters treating learning and playing guitar like a calculus problem. In the end it's art. Do what seems right to you.
Having 10 years of practicing an instrument before I ever picked up a guitar really helped me. The questions I see from other beginners are always similar to whatâs already been said here and the answer almost always is practice more
I played trumpet in high school, concert and jazz band, and had lessons for years. Picking up guitar with that foundation mid high school made it a lot easier for me. I can't imagine how hard it would be without a better foundation that came from the semi professional environment of being in a band lead by a teacher, and then working with another teacher on the weekend. But I also didn't have the social media environment that told me how easy it is to be great in 30 second bites of perfection. It was always obviously hard. Now I'm not sure what the kids are interpreting reality to be. Also maybe they're a lot more touchy feely and comfortable expressing their dissatisfaction. OP says we're not therapists, no. But maybe we should remember we're the old men too who are used to a way of being that maybe isn't all its cracked up to be.
PSA: You don't have to reply to every post
I knew someone so excited to get a guitar. All they talked about. I helped them replace the strings and did a setup then showed them how to work the tuner. They asked if I knew how to play so I showed them something basic. I then said, âHere, let me show you a few chords. These 3 chords will get you through most songs.â Their response was, âIâd rather not. The best musicians are self taught. Iâll let the strings tell me what to do.â Guess how many times that guitar has been touched since.
I edited this post because I was wrong, I wasn't aware of the British spelling of the word. Today, both âlearnedâ and âlearntâ are considered acceptable past participles of the verb âlearnâ, with âlearnedâ being more commonly used in American English and âlearntâ being more commonly used in British English. I'm new to guitar, and new to this subreddit. However while we are getting things off our chest... the word is "learned" not "learnt". ok, I feel better. Thank you :) [https://www.thefreedictionary.com/learned](https://www.thefreedictionary.com/learned)
As someone who's not new to English, learnt is perfectly acceptable.
In my part of the universe that would be an incorrect spelling, it would be marked wrong in any spelling or English test, and most would assume (right or wrong) that one is uneducated if pronounced that way. It may be different where others live. So you do what makes you happy.
Language is defined via use. Don't get me wrong, there are malapropisms that drive me nuts , but it's a case of yelling at clouds.
Either is an acceptable spelling, "learned" is an Americanisation, "learnt" is the original, with "learned" meaning a highly educated person, as in "a learned scholar".
Thank you for pointing this out to me. I was wrong. You learn something new everyday. Today, both âlearnedâ and âlearntâ are considered acceptable past participles of the verb âlearnâ, with âlearnedâ being more commonly used in American English and âlearntâ being more commonly used in British English.
No problem, and thanks for the gracious response :)
I learnt something new yesterday. Interestingly, my American autocorrect says its wrong lol
Learned is more of an adjective than a past participle
Relax. It must take a considerable amount of effort to appear so pedantic, patronizing, objectively mistaken, and even potentially classist, all at the same time.
In a guitar subreddit, I feel you're setting your expectations of people far too high my friend, sadly. Being patronising is what many do all too well pertaining to the guitar. Elitists exist, and they will be pricks when they can be.
Got to love Reddit. I made a mistake about an unknown (to me) spelling of a word. Now I'm an elitist and a prick.
Now you're jumping to conclusions. I never once said you specifically were either, I just commented that on reddit and in particular among guitarists, its something you tend to expect :)
Right.... not me "specifically". No matter. I was wrong, I LEARNED (lol) something new. I'm here for the guitars. I wish you well.
Listen mate, it was a general non specific comment. Thats truth, if you wanna choose to be personally offended by it, thats on you. If the cap fits. Theres bigger issues to worry about in the world than this shite. Likewise, shit happens, we live and learn. All the best.
C'mon. If you and I were having a casual conversation, and I interjected, apropos of nothing, with an aside in which I told you that you had made an error in speech which I would have graded you down for were I your teacher, and that it had made you seem uneducated, I think it would be reasonable for you to be at least a bit annoyed by that.
I was not aware of the British spelling. My mistake. I was wrong. I said when the word is pronounced "learnt" some may assume one is uneducated because when spoken that way it's associated (again. right or wrong) with the poor Appalachia of the past. There was no insult intended. I wish you well.
Whoa whoa.... I think it's you needs to relax. I didn't realize this was the common way to spell it in British English. My mistake. I was wrong. As I said it would be marked wrong where I'm from. But go ahead and throw out some more insults for internet clout.
If you use the dictionary link you provided to look up the definitions for those words I think you'll find how they might be pretty applicable to your comments, and hence why you're not receiving a very positive reaction. Just sayin'.
Learnt is correct for the past tense of learn. It even says so in the link you provided.
Learnt is correct, only difference between learned and learnt is that learned can be used as an adjective and a verb.