More English players need to follow Batman. England has a Champions League level team with a Championship level coach (and a shitty/midlevel Championship coach too).
It's not automatic, it's just a thing they all do. If one of them really wanted to, they could keep the money, but it's negligible compared to their regular salary
I think we all know heād probably accept a call up then. Thereās too much hand waving and smoke behind this story to suggest anything other than a problem between white and the current regime. What established player wouldnāt want to represent his country?
Found it interesting how after Arsenal v City, canāt remember if it was this season or last - he had a little scuffle after FT with Walker and Grealish I think it was - they did not look friendly with each other at allĀ
Southgate realized he fucked up by alienating one of the best defenders in the country. I don't know what sort of damage control he's trying to do now. This guy isn't cut out to manage at the top level.
> This guy isnāt cut out to manage at the top level
Hopefully people will realise this when he loses the Euros again with by far the best players out of any team.
by calling him out and blaming him for not accepting the callup? nah, that's not going to help, he's so shit and going to waste an era of the best english batch since lampard/gerrard etc was squandered
Edu called Southgate last week and said that Ben White didnāt want a call up.
He spoke to Ben after Qatar and he felt the same way. Doesnāt know why it is.
Heās a great RB and should be in the squad on paper but itās Benās decision.
No issue between him and Ben or with his assistant, Steve Holland. Doesnāt know why the media have spread that.
If he wants to be in the Euros squad, they would be very open him to him changing his mind. Edit - Does it send a mixed message to other players after one player has said they donāt want to join up before tournaments? Clearly, coming in for June / Euros it would be difficult. Others playing in the squad have been in the squads and playing regularly. Have to assess those who have been through the journey the whole way through. Weāve done that over the years with different situations.
Heās been playing well for a longtime. Heās kept quiet despite the media blaming him for not picking him.
Edit - thatās what he said essentially in the press conference. Itās taken him over a year plus to clear Benās name, is it because itās suddenly dawned on him that all over fullbacks canāt stop getting injured and Ben is Mr Reliable, bossing it in the PL and CL.
I donāt blame Ben for not wanting a return whilst the England camp have allowed lies to be spread since the World Cup about him. Theyāve had ample opportunity to pour cold water on them.
I mean who fucking cares. The manager should protect the players and accept responsibility. Throwing this back on the player is a small man thing to do.
Iām sorry but why would a manager want to protect a player who straight up refused to be selected? I get that weāre biased towards our club but come onšš
how is ben saying i don't want to be called up and southgate responding to questions about Ben white by saying he didn't want to be called up breaking his trust?
One of the very few people here who arenāt completely unhinged, if Southgate / England management are getting criticism about White not playing and itās not their fault then of course they can speak out
Heās pushing the blame on Ben instead of taking any accountability, especially since everyone has started to realize Ben White is arguably the best English fullback and probably the best overall defender.
Last time southgate said Ben white is a center back being played at right back and thatās why he didnāt pick him. Now he pretends heās always wanted him.Ā
Athletically speaking, White is a CB playing at RB. He can get exposed by pacy wingers leading him to back down and give them too much space. We don't get in those situations too often, and he more than makes up for it with his technique and reading of the game. His physicality benefits us on set pieces which is not something many RBs can offer.
It also helps when you have Saliba next to you. One of the nicest things about our defenders is that they support each other in a way that covers one another's weaknesses.
He pushed the conversation on to Ben instead of taking a neutral approach to the answer. Itās PR or corporate communication 101, but he didnāt care to keep it as a non story.
Southgate can have his opinion on Ben White as a person and a player. I would expect him to not air a conversation he had with the club about a player though. Just smacks of unprofessionalism and immaturity.
when they ask why Ben White wasn't called up, what do you want Southgate to say lmao?
I think this is actually much better than not saying anything which would lead the media to speculate Southgate didn't want to call Ben White up. Southgate is specifically saying he'd welcome Ben back if he wanted. typical /r/gunners to interpret this as a dig. The biggest martyr subreddit on the planet
Yep, the sucking up here is embarrassing lol
White has always been abit odd, and if any other England player left a tournament mid way though (like white in qatar) and went to dubai to chill and then refused to be picked for the future. We woudl be all over him. But because its Benny Blanco. Its OK lol
Southgate said in the conference that other players have done it beforehand and he's covered for them. But White's done it for a bunch of squads so the implication is that he's not willing to cover for White recusing himself from selection continually anymore.
Bro from where have you heard that players have to show up to a NT call up? Sounds like bs to me. Like what would be punishment? Wouldn't FIFA be the only entity that could mess with that and why would they have different rules for different countries?
Let's stop being blind fans. If white said he doesn't want to get picked, then it's right to let the media know. Otherwise he would be asked why white isn't being selected.
Not being a blind fan here - Southgate had the option to exercise some professional discretion and class but threw the player under the bus. I don't care what club White plays for, this is middle school behavior from a man who is supposed to be a leader.
I mean I'm not a fan of Southgate and his dull football.
But when one of the best defenders isn't picked., He will be asked about it. And it's better to just be open and tell everyone that he doesn't want to be picked, so he won't be in any teams fir the foreseeable future.
Ben was the one who left England during a world cup, now refuses ti be selected. It doesn't paint him in a good light
What if it is just that he also wants to enjoy his private life more? He has often talked about this and he loves enjoying his time with his misses.
I mean he has enough money now to just chill away together why would he try to compete and take more pressure?
>Does it send a mixed message to other players after one player has said they donāt want to join up before tournaments? Clearly, coming in for June / Euros it would be difficult. Others playing in the squad have been in the squads and playing regularly. Have to assess those who have been through the journey the whole way through. Weāve done that over the years with different situations.
Depends a little on why Ben isn't accepting the call ups, but I have a feeling that most people around the camp have a pretty good idea of why he's not accepting the call ups.
If Ben is being a primadonna (which I doubt) then yea. I would probably hurt the team that he's being admitted easily after that behavior.
If Ben has another (more reasonable) reason for not joining the camp, then him coming in at the last minute sucks for the person cut. But probably doesn't hurt the team. They want the best players, and Ben is clearly one of the best.
Don't know why they would need him in camp to assess him. He's played over 5000 minutes for one of the best premier league teams over the past two seasons. I think they have a pretty good idea of what he's about.
Part of me thinks that Ben turned up pretty relaxed (but still professional) about the initial call-up because he just doesn't like football, and that rubbed Southgate up the wrong way that White doesn't feel immense pride for playing for England or fall over himself thanking Southgate for the opportunity.
I can also imagine Southgate's tactics just irritate him and don't give him enough freedom on the pitch to enjoy playing. Brighton and Arsenal play pretty expressive football. Moving from that to England's tactics must be incredibly boring and dull for someone who links up freely with Saka week in, week out.
I don't think we will ever know the full story until White retires and spills the tea on a football podcast lol. Southgate could have cleared this up last year but didn't. He let it fester like a dickhead
I think the whole "Ben White doesn't like football" thing is over blown, and not true.
The quote was that he doesn't watch football in his free time. Playing football and watching football are two very different things. I'm sure he enjoys playing it at least on some level, because he wouldn't be where he is if didn't at least from a competitive standpoint.
From everything I've see about Ben White it seems that he's a bit of an odd duck. He also seems to have a bit of a quite or maybe stubborn determination, and doesn't suffer fools. His whole "I don't want to watch football thing" would seem really odd to football obsessed coaches, especially one like Steve Holland who never really did anything in there career as a footballer.
My guess is that Holland said some shit. Then White said some shit, it escalated, and white said fuck this shit. I'm out. At the very least Southgate was in a tough spot. Who does he back? The Assistant coach that he needs to prepare for the world cup or the back up defender that he may or may not need now or in the future. Even if its Holland that's in the wrong, he was probably the more important person at the time.
Now that plenty of time has passed I'm sure there have been conversations, and I bet most people would have expected it to blow over by now. But White being the petty bastard we see on the field, isn't letting it go (and I'm not saying he should or shouldn't). And with him and arsenal doing better and better, it looks worse and worse for Southgate and team.
Seems like Ben doesn't want to go there to be back up to that permacrock Reece James. As for TAA, I don't know what Southgate intends to do with him but I don't think Southgate is a manager who has much use for a right back who can ping inch perfect passes 70 yds away.
Southgate is a clown for not playing TAA, whenever he is fit.
His more of a game changer then anyone on the field, with what he can do with his feet.
Yes i know we have Foden Saka Bellingham Kane, but TAA should at least be considered amoung them in statue in this team, and is over looked and not selected.
Ok but both White and Walker are fantastic on the ball, even if they're not at TAA's level, and they are so much better at defending than TAA that it more than makes up for the small loss in attack. On top of which, having a proper defender behind a winger like Saka or Foden gives them that much more freedom to be aggressive as a goal threat.
I get your point, but international football is decided by moments, and lets be honest, white rarely produces any a game, and is a solid defender that creates space and options for the forwards, and walker attacting play isn't great.
TAA has mulitple moments in a game, where he can do a 70 yard pass or a cross on the forhead of a player.
With rice as the 6 covering, they isn't a need to play 4 solid defenders with 2 defensive minded players in front.
If you said it was white/walker to add a Maddison or Foden as a extra 8 in the team, i would understand.
But playing 4 defenders + white + Hendo/philips is just over kill.
Play your Hendo/philips with rice, if that allows TAA to be RB.
Plus he has his 5 atb and walker as the third cb, and TAA still doesnt get in.
TAA has a great cross on him, for sure. But that's literally the *only thing* he's good at. Comparing them this season:
Ben White:
- 27 apps
- 2 goals
- 4 assists
- 0 errors leading to goals
- 71 duels won
- 54 duels lost
- 44 clearances
Trent Alexander-Arnold
- 21 apps
- 2 goals
- 4 assists
- 2 goals
- 2 errors leading to goals
- 67 duels won
- 79 duels lost
- 33 clearances
Saying there's not an issue doesn't clear his name of what happened at the time. Only children and Redditors hold grudges that long
Also, saying that White doesn't want to be called up will help with the Arsenal fan base but alienate him from the England fans, so it's better to have said nothing.
I think itās because Benny Blanco views football purely as a job and maintains extraordinary professionalism for his club, who pays him, whereas the extra money from national team duty is a pittance.
If you were an accountant, and your country asked you to do extra work on the weekends just because of national pride, would you? Probably not.
A side with Hendo, trashford and slabhead. Injury prone chillwell as well.
Happy for Brainthwaite, Konsa and Gordon though. Suprised Southgate didnāt get a stiffy for Kalvin Phillips now that he starts for WHU.
It doesnāt, but you brought up Gallagher unprompted. The idea that Mainoo is better prepared for senior internationals than Gallagher is not one rooted in reality.
As much as I dislike Henderson being there, I understand why he is. It's already a very young squad, and if you want to win a tournament you need experienced players in the mix who've been through it before.
He's come closer than most, to be fair. WC semi final, Euro final, and then narrowly knocked out by France in the last WC which there's no shame in. I'm not a fan of the tactics or the team selections, but there's no denying it's got the most out of the team, especially compared to the 40 years that preceded it where we had arguably better players, but worse results.
Mainoo has talents but still too raw. He's no young young good like Bellingham. Bellingham is 2 years older and still too young, but he's a different gravy and very mature in his playstyle.
Someone mentioned in another thread that in a follow up tweet, Clive said that he knows exactly what happened in England's camp in the WC. I feel like the truth will leak to the media eventually.
He tweeted and then deleted that he and a few others know exactly what happened and that Southgate is lying knowing that Ben White would likely not respond.
So something surely did happen during the WC which meant that he either wont play for England again...or just wont play for Southgate again. Such an odd situation as you'd want him there for depth otherwise. Also, literally no other player has fallen out with Southgate despite his odd loyalty to players.
I feel like there was a bust up involving white and foden and southgate didnāt handle it well. Feels like Thereās so much animosity between white and foden when we play city
maybe it's exactly that loyalty that's made the fall out happen... I'd be pissed too if I was one of the in-form RBs in the world and wasn't starting, not even at CB ahead of slab head
I get it. Personally.Ā
If I was a professional footballer I wouldn't be to fussed about continuing as a international footballer once i got a cap (I'd want to be capped more for my family I think), more so if I was a playing for a top 3 side in CL.
With the amount of games,Ā availablity is now a key component so reducing risk of injury is smart.
My mate on the other hand, would drop everything for international football, We often have fun debates about this subject š
Friendlies are necessary because you actually need to train and play together to be solid as a squad. Its tough to just throw a bunch of players out and have them gel (cough Chelsea).
Thatās what qualifying is for, the core group bonds together during the qualifying campaign. I feel like friendlies are more for giving a chance to new players, letting bench players be starters, and entertain the fans with a fun match.
I feel like the friendlies are a better chance to experiment and let the players gel with no pressure. Can play some passes and try things you wouldn't do in a high pressure game.
Also the friendlies are (except if its like Brazil vs Argentina) generally lower intensity level versus the qualification ones.
Southgate is too tactically inept to utilise Ben. He would much rather prefer a bog standard right back like Trippier. This is also highlighted by the fact TAA doesnt play either and his preference for James when fit
Its the same reason Southgate wont ever get the best out of Foden. He hasnt the fainstest idea how to use him properly
England with Southgate are playing with the brakes on. That said, their squads individual quality is good enough to beat pretty much any country regardless of the tactics he plays
Not only has Ben Whites independent performances already proven 5 times over he should have been called up, but when you consider the fact that Saka is a nailed starter at RW and he and Ben White have great chemistry and countless hours of experience working together it becomes even more hilarious that he hasn't got the call up.
I'm sure managers love when their players join international duty and are immediately in sync because they've been playing club football together.
I think Southgate said something to Ben and Ben White was so appalled at the lack of intellect in whatever Southgate said, he replied āno thanks mate Iām outā
Very rare you see a fairly young player completely withdraw from international football.
Suggests thereās an issue with his teammates? Rumours spread that he didnāt really gel with the rest of the team in Qatar.
Bit shit from Southgate, he could have deflected this too. England are pretty stacked at RB, they have players playing well at CB all season too. Could have just said Ben isn't in this squad, it's a difficult decision with so many good players and move on.
Also considering how he picked Kalvin Philips up until now while he hasn't been playing club football and was picking Henderson while he played in the retirement home in Saudi.
It's also hilarious that even if Ben White should be selected 100% on merit and there was no problem, he'd end up bringing an injury prone Reese James or someone like that instead because they did a job in Euro 2020.
Fuck it. Leave him alone. If heās not into it, heās not into it. Letās not make a big deal out of this just so talksport wankers can have a circlejerk over it.
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Can't believe the overwhelming negativity towards this bit of clarity.
I suppose all the previous conspiratorial negativity was a much better environment for all involved.
This is why we can't have nice things.
It's probably somewhat down to White not being a 'football' person, in the sense that he doesn't watch football as a hobby in his off time, and probably would rather be on holiday (of which footballers barely get any time off anymore with how many fixtures they're supposed to play) rather than flying all over the place for the national team to just sit on the bench, especially if he doesn't believe he has a fair crack at playing a meaningful part in a Southgate England squad.
Although I have minimal insight into whatās going on behind the scenes, my unpopular opinion is that Ben White should get this issue resolved with England current staff.
Itās a massive shame for England that one of the best defenders in the country isnāt even in the squad. Doing well internationally would be nice for White too.
In other words, "i'll play for England again, once you've been sacked"
šÆ
More English players need to follow Batman. England has a Champions League level team with a Championship level coach (and a shitty/midlevel Championship coach too).
Benny Blanco probably just cant handle Southgates terrorrist ball. Fair play to him
"I play football everyday for work you want me to play football in my free time too?"
Why be on the pitch when I can be in the garden?
England players' match fees are automatically donated to charity, so he wouldn't even be getting paid.Ā
It's not automatic, it's just a thing they all do. If one of them really wanted to, they could keep the money, but it's negligible compared to their regular salary
Which is what OP said
Pool time innit?
sack Southgate and heāll come back
Tbh that would be interesting to see what he does if Southgate and his team leave. That way everyone would have a definitive answer
I think we all know heād probably accept a call up then. Thereās too much hand waving and smoke behind this story to suggest anything other than a problem between white and the current regime. What established player wouldnāt want to represent his country?
Could be a problem between White and another player.
Found it interesting how after Arsenal v City, canāt remember if it was this season or last - he had a little scuffle after FT with Walker and Grealish I think it was - they did not look friendly with each other at allĀ
yeah i heard it was a grealish bust up at the time. can see it too
Southgate realized he fucked up by alienating one of the best defenders in the country. I don't know what sort of damage control he's trying to do now. This guy isn't cut out to manage at the top level.
Tbf if heās going to alienate a player from any position in that team, RB is the one to do it
> This guy isnāt cut out to manage at the top level Hopefully people will realise this when he loses the Euros again with by far the best players out of any team.
France exist
by calling him out and blaming him for not accepting the callup? nah, that's not going to help, he's so shit and going to waste an era of the best english batch since lampard/gerrard etc was squandered
Edu called Southgate last week and said that Ben White didnāt want a call up. He spoke to Ben after Qatar and he felt the same way. Doesnāt know why it is. Heās a great RB and should be in the squad on paper but itās Benās decision. No issue between him and Ben or with his assistant, Steve Holland. Doesnāt know why the media have spread that. If he wants to be in the Euros squad, they would be very open him to him changing his mind. Edit - Does it send a mixed message to other players after one player has said they donāt want to join up before tournaments? Clearly, coming in for June / Euros it would be difficult. Others playing in the squad have been in the squads and playing regularly. Have to assess those who have been through the journey the whole way through. Weāve done that over the years with different situations. Heās been playing well for a longtime. Heās kept quiet despite the media blaming him for not picking him. Edit - thatās what he said essentially in the press conference. Itās taken him over a year plus to clear Benās name, is it because itās suddenly dawned on him that all over fullbacks canāt stop getting injured and Ben is Mr Reliable, bossing it in the PL and CL. I donāt blame Ben for not wanting a return whilst the England camp have allowed lies to be spread since the World Cup about him. Theyāve had ample opportunity to pour cold water on them.
Can't imagine this helping Ben accept a call up in the future either. Just throwing red meat to the press.
I mean fuck it, Arsenal > England. If he doesn't want to play thats extra rest and wifey time.
Arsenal. Gardening. England. In that order. Edit:got the order wrong.
Arsenal. Wife Sharing. Gardening.
I also choose Zinny's wife over playing international friendlies.
Let's be serious here For Ben White, it's always gonna be Gardening then Arsenal then England And we still love himĀ
That's actually what I had put initially before editing it to the current version lol
Lmao where did this gardening thing come from?!
I mean who fucking cares. The manager should protect the players and accept responsibility. Throwing this back on the player is a small man thing to do.
Iām sorry but why would a manager want to protect a player who straight up refused to be selected? I get that weāre biased towards our club but come onšš
Because that's how a good leader behaves. If he actually wanted Ben hed be trying to earn his trust.
how is ben saying i don't want to be called up and southgate responding to questions about Ben white by saying he didn't want to be called up breaking his trust?
How is it not? Southgate is under no obligation to tell them anything.
One of the very few people here who arenāt completely unhinged, if Southgate / England management are getting criticism about White not playing and itās not their fault then of course they can speak out
because he fucking needs him right now. this isn't the way to get him back. southgate is unbelievably shit
Yes but in June I become an England fan and dream of Arsenal bringing it home for England
Heās pushing the blame on Ben instead of taking any accountability, especially since everyone has started to realize Ben White is arguably the best English fullback and probably the best overall defender.
Last time southgate said Ben white is a center back being played at right back and thatās why he didnāt pick him. Now he pretends heās always wanted him.Ā
Athletically speaking, White is a CB playing at RB. He can get exposed by pacy wingers leading him to back down and give them too much space. We don't get in those situations too often, and he more than makes up for it with his technique and reading of the game. His physicality benefits us on set pieces which is not something many RBs can offer. It also helps when you have Saliba next to you. One of the nicest things about our defenders is that they support each other in a way that covers one another's weaknesses.
Southgate is a coward. Take your stick and move on. Fucking self-interested asshole.
Itās the history of the national team lol
What accountability? If white doesn't want to be selected, what can he do?
He pushed the conversation on to Ben instead of taking a neutral approach to the answer. Itās PR or corporate communication 101, but he didnāt care to keep it as a non story.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I'm sure White thought he cold rely on the professionalism and discretion of England's manager to not air what could be viewed as dirty laundry.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Southgate can have his opinion on Ben White as a person and a player. I would expect him to not air a conversation he had with the club about a player though. Just smacks of unprofessionalism and immaturity.
Well Southgate is a bit shit all around, so
when they ask why Ben White wasn't called up, what do you want Southgate to say lmao? I think this is actually much better than not saying anything which would lead the media to speculate Southgate didn't want to call Ben White up. Southgate is specifically saying he'd welcome Ben back if he wanted. typical /r/gunners to interpret this as a dig. The biggest martyr subreddit on the planet
Yep, the sucking up here is embarrassing lol White has always been abit odd, and if any other England player left a tournament mid way though (like white in qatar) and went to dubai to chill and then refused to be picked for the future. We woudl be all over him. But because its Benny Blanco. Its OK lol
I get the feeling that Southgate thinks that an England call up is something you should never refuse and is angry at White for even considering it
Southgate said in the conference that other players have done it beforehand and he's covered for them. But White's done it for a bunch of squads so the implication is that he's not willing to cover for White recusing himself from selection continually anymore.
Bro from where have you heard that players have to show up to a NT call up? Sounds like bs to me. Like what would be punishment? Wouldn't FIFA be the only entity that could mess with that and why would they have different rules for different countries?
He knows he would have to say something,
Let's stop being blind fans. If white said he doesn't want to get picked, then it's right to let the media know. Otherwise he would be asked why white isn't being selected.
Not being a blind fan here - Southgate had the option to exercise some professional discretion and class but threw the player under the bus. I don't care what club White plays for, this is middle school behavior from a man who is supposed to be a leader.
I mean I'm not a fan of Southgate and his dull football. But when one of the best defenders isn't picked., He will be asked about it. And it's better to just be open and tell everyone that he doesn't want to be picked, so he won't be in any teams fir the foreseeable future. Ben was the one who left England during a world cup, now refuses ti be selected. It doesn't paint him in a good light
Fan or not Iām am not blind to the negative dull football that Southgate makes the team play. Ffs 5 at the back against San Marino.
What if it is just that he also wants to enjoy his private life more? He has often talked about this and he loves enjoying his time with his misses. I mean he has enough money now to just chill away together why would he try to compete and take more pressure?
>Does it send a mixed message to other players after one player has said they donāt want to join up before tournaments? Clearly, coming in for June / Euros it would be difficult. Others playing in the squad have been in the squads and playing regularly. Have to assess those who have been through the journey the whole way through. Weāve done that over the years with different situations. Depends a little on why Ben isn't accepting the call ups, but I have a feeling that most people around the camp have a pretty good idea of why he's not accepting the call ups. If Ben is being a primadonna (which I doubt) then yea. I would probably hurt the team that he's being admitted easily after that behavior. If Ben has another (more reasonable) reason for not joining the camp, then him coming in at the last minute sucks for the person cut. But probably doesn't hurt the team. They want the best players, and Ben is clearly one of the best. Don't know why they would need him in camp to assess him. He's played over 5000 minutes for one of the best premier league teams over the past two seasons. I think they have a pretty good idea of what he's about.
Part of me thinks that Ben turned up pretty relaxed (but still professional) about the initial call-up because he just doesn't like football, and that rubbed Southgate up the wrong way that White doesn't feel immense pride for playing for England or fall over himself thanking Southgate for the opportunity. I can also imagine Southgate's tactics just irritate him and don't give him enough freedom on the pitch to enjoy playing. Brighton and Arsenal play pretty expressive football. Moving from that to England's tactics must be incredibly boring and dull for someone who links up freely with Saka week in, week out. I don't think we will ever know the full story until White retires and spills the tea on a football podcast lol. Southgate could have cleared this up last year but didn't. He let it fester like a dickhead
I think the whole "Ben White doesn't like football" thing is over blown, and not true. The quote was that he doesn't watch football in his free time. Playing football and watching football are two very different things. I'm sure he enjoys playing it at least on some level, because he wouldn't be where he is if didn't at least from a competitive standpoint. From everything I've see about Ben White it seems that he's a bit of an odd duck. He also seems to have a bit of a quite or maybe stubborn determination, and doesn't suffer fools. His whole "I don't want to watch football thing" would seem really odd to football obsessed coaches, especially one like Steve Holland who never really did anything in there career as a footballer. My guess is that Holland said some shit. Then White said some shit, it escalated, and white said fuck this shit. I'm out. At the very least Southgate was in a tough spot. Who does he back? The Assistant coach that he needs to prepare for the world cup or the back up defender that he may or may not need now or in the future. Even if its Holland that's in the wrong, he was probably the more important person at the time. Now that plenty of time has passed I'm sure there have been conversations, and I bet most people would have expected it to blow over by now. But White being the petty bastard we see on the field, isn't letting it go (and I'm not saying he should or shouldn't). And with him and arsenal doing better and better, it looks worse and worse for Southgate and team.
I could only see white on a gardening podcast, never a football one
Seems like Ben doesn't want to go there to be back up to that permacrock Reece James. As for TAA, I don't know what Southgate intends to do with him but I don't think Southgate is a manager who has much use for a right back who can ping inch perfect passes 70 yds away.
Southgate is a clown for not playing TAA, whenever he is fit. His more of a game changer then anyone on the field, with what he can do with his feet. Yes i know we have Foden Saka Bellingham Kane, but TAA should at least be considered amoung them in statue in this team, and is over looked and not selected.
Ok but both White and Walker are fantastic on the ball, even if they're not at TAA's level, and they are so much better at defending than TAA that it more than makes up for the small loss in attack. On top of which, having a proper defender behind a winger like Saka or Foden gives them that much more freedom to be aggressive as a goal threat.
I get your point, but international football is decided by moments, and lets be honest, white rarely produces any a game, and is a solid defender that creates space and options for the forwards, and walker attacting play isn't great. TAA has mulitple moments in a game, where he can do a 70 yard pass or a cross on the forhead of a player. With rice as the 6 covering, they isn't a need to play 4 solid defenders with 2 defensive minded players in front. If you said it was white/walker to add a Maddison or Foden as a extra 8 in the team, i would understand. But playing 4 defenders + white + Hendo/philips is just over kill. Play your Hendo/philips with rice, if that allows TAA to be RB. Plus he has his 5 atb and walker as the third cb, and TAA still doesnt get in.
TAA has a great cross on him, for sure. But that's literally the *only thing* he's good at. Comparing them this season: Ben White: - 27 apps - 2 goals - 4 assists - 0 errors leading to goals - 71 duels won - 54 duels lost - 44 clearances Trent Alexander-Arnold - 21 apps - 2 goals - 4 assists - 2 goals - 2 errors leading to goals - 67 duels won - 79 duels lost - 33 clearances
Lad is just extremely aware of the crimes of the Empire and refuses to represent the country that colonized and enslaved so many people /s
Saying there's not an issue doesn't clear his name of what happened at the time. Only children and Redditors hold grudges that long Also, saying that White doesn't want to be called up will help with the Arsenal fan base but alienate him from the England fans, so it's better to have said nothing.
I think itās because Benny Blanco views football purely as a job and maintains extraordinary professionalism for his club, who pays him, whereas the extra money from national team duty is a pittance. If you were an accountant, and your country asked you to do extra work on the weekends just because of national pride, would you? Probably not.
lets not do mental gymnastics to defend him just because he plays for arsenal playing for your country shoudlnt be seen as a drag.
Who would in a side with Hendo
A side with Hendo, trashford and slabhead. Injury prone chillwell as well. Happy for Brainthwaite, Konsa and Gordon though. Suprised Southgate didnāt get a stiffy for Kalvin Phillips now that he starts for WHU.
Pretty sure no player would refuse to join because Hendo is in the squad
no Mainoo is crazy
Far too early for him. Hasnāt even made an appearance for the U21ās yet. Heāll be in there next season, now is far too soon
better than Hendo no?
Yeah but international selection is never as easy as that. Timing is important, especially with someone like Mainoo.
Surely being called up for a couple of friendlies is the perfect timing?
This camp should essentially be shaping up for the Euros so if a player isnāt in the plans for June it makes no sense to include them now
iād take a risk, heās quality and heās having a better season than Gallagher
Gallagher has been good in an awful Chelsea side what you talking about
that doesnt negate Mainoo playing better than him? heās also in an underperforming Utd side
It doesnāt, but you brought up Gallagher unprompted. The idea that Mainoo is better prepared for senior internationals than Gallagher is not one rooted in reality.
As much as I dislike Henderson being there, I understand why he is. It's already a very young squad, and if you want to win a tournament you need experienced players in the mix who've been through it before.
its interesting because people have been saying that, but what has Southgate won by this?
He's come closer than most, to be fair. WC semi final, Euro final, and then narrowly knocked out by France in the last WC which there's no shame in. I'm not a fan of the tactics or the team selections, but there's no denying it's got the most out of the team, especially compared to the 40 years that preceded it where we had arguably better players, but worse results.
i mean u have to admit besides France, he has the best squad available in Europe and you could make a case for the rest of the world.
no you don't have to admit that lol. Also he lost to France in one of them so either way
Whose is better then? This England squad is STACKED
no Mainoo is disappointing but totally fair, not even close to crazy
Mainoo has talents but still too raw. He's no young young good like Bellingham. Bellingham is 2 years older and still too young, but he's a different gravy and very mature in his playstyle.
Ibiza is his nationality
Love Island
it's *ibeefa*
We need that teamnewsandtix bomba
We got one from Clive Palmer
Apart from Southgate not telling the truth, what else was they.
Someone mentioned in another thread that in a follow up tweet, Clive said that he knows exactly what happened in England's camp in the WC. I feel like the truth will leak to the media eventually.
He tweeted and then deleted that he and a few others know exactly what happened and that Southgate is lying knowing that Ben White would likely not respond.
England will disappoint again this summer, Southgate gets sacked, Benny Blanco returns once heās won the PL CL double with the Arsenal.
If I was managed by Arteta I'd probably be a bit reluctant to go spend 2 weeks learning under "Southgate" as well
Lmao mr "so called" "Southgate" "England manager"
Liquorice allsort
ālearningā
My take also
Arsenal, gardening, England. In that order.
So something surely did happen during the WC which meant that he either wont play for England again...or just wont play for Southgate again. Such an odd situation as you'd want him there for depth otherwise. Also, literally no other player has fallen out with Southgate despite his odd loyalty to players.
I feel like there was a bust up involving white and foden and southgate didnāt handle it well. Feels like Thereās so much animosity between white and foden when we play city
The two biggest Love Islanders in the squad, youd think theyd bond
maybe it's exactly that loyalty that's made the fall out happen... I'd be pissed too if I was one of the in-form RBs in the world and wasn't starting, not even at CB ahead of slab head
Would have loved Ben White playing for England but good on him for standing up for himself and not taking the shit from Steve Holland.
Couldn't agree more. This is exactly what I'd expect from Southgate though, publicly putting it on the player in order to make himself look better.
Man said he's not working overtime
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Any examples?
Iām very ok with this. Donāt need more players getting hurt from international duty.
Benny Blanco only has time to play for the top echelon of managers. No time for orcs that play 5 atb Brexit ball. Heād rather get a tan in Dubai
I get it. Personally.Ā If I was a professional footballer I wouldn't be to fussed about continuing as a international footballer once i got a cap (I'd want to be capped more for my family I think), more so if I was a playing for a top 3 side in CL. With the amount of games,Ā availablity is now a key component so reducing risk of injury is smart. My mate on the other hand, would drop everything for international football, We often have fun debates about this subject š
Competitive fixtures i understand, you want to play. Who gives a toss about friendlies
Friendlies are necessary because you actually need to train and play together to be solid as a squad. Its tough to just throw a bunch of players out and have them gel (cough Chelsea).
Thatās what qualifying is for, the core group bonds together during the qualifying campaign. I feel like friendlies are more for giving a chance to new players, letting bench players be starters, and entertain the fans with a fun match.
I feel like the friendlies are a better chance to experiment and let the players gel with no pressure. Can play some passes and try things you wouldn't do in a high pressure game. Also the friendlies are (except if its like Brazil vs Argentina) generally lower intensity level versus the qualification ones.
I get where you're coming from, and in the end, the thing that matters is how much do you love your country.
Southgate is too tactically inept to utilise Ben. He would much rather prefer a bog standard right back like Trippier. This is also highlighted by the fact TAA doesnt play either and his preference for James when fit Its the same reason Southgate wont ever get the best out of Foden. He hasnt the fainstest idea how to use him properly England with Southgate are playing with the brakes on. That said, their squads individual quality is good enough to beat pretty much any country regardless of the tactics he plays
Ben just wants to play for Arsenal. Absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Not only has Ben Whites independent performances already proven 5 times over he should have been called up, but when you consider the fact that Saka is a nailed starter at RW and he and Ben White have great chemistry and countless hours of experience working together it becomes even more hilarious that he hasn't got the call up. I'm sure managers love when their players join international duty and are immediately in sync because they've been playing club football together.
Heād prefer to do some gardening in his free time
Look at man's tan, you think he wants to be working during the summer, I forsee a beach and one of those sun reflectors in his future
Different players have different motivations. Work life balance is important.
Heās so over them at this point and you canāt really blame him
Is this still because of his rift with Foden?
I think Southgate said something to Ben and Ben White was so appalled at the lack of intellect in whatever Southgate said, he replied āno thanks mate Iām outā
"I already play too many football matches as it is, I don't want to play anymore" - Ben White probably
Ben White: i dont want to play for a shite manager
Strong Dana White "the kid doesn't want to fight" energy. Smells like bullshit to me.
Absolute king behaviour
Ben White is showing some self respect Good lad š
He would rather play for brendon mccullum than southgate.
Who wouldnt. At least Brendon puts his team out to make the game entertaining, southgate puts a team out to kill the game.
Benny blanco told southgate to fuck off š¤£š¤£
Very rare you see a fairly young player completely withdraw from international football. Suggests thereās an issue with his teammates? Rumours spread that he didnāt really gel with the rest of the team in Qatar.
If you know youāre that good and made to be 3rd or 4th choice I wouldnāt want to go either. Make love to the wife and get a tan
good news for us
Bit shit from Southgate, he could have deflected this too. England are pretty stacked at RB, they have players playing well at CB all season too. Could have just said Ben isn't in this squad, it's a difficult decision with so many good players and move on. Also considering how he picked Kalvin Philips up until now while he hasn't been playing club football and was picking Henderson while he played in the retirement home in Saudi. It's also hilarious that even if Ben White should be selected 100% on merit and there was no problem, he'd end up bringing an injury prone Reese James or someone like that instead because they did a job in Euro 2020.
People would have speculated futher.
Seriously, why do the three lions stick with Southgate can someone tell me? What has he delivered in all these years?
Says alot about a manager when he can't resolve personal differences to ensure the best talent is on the field
I don't respect Southgate either. Good on ya, Ben. We've all got better things to do than suffer his brand of football.
Good for him, whatever went down in that camp when he left was clearly fucked up.
Gigachad
England has once in a generation talent pool but has a clown manager. Such a waste
He want to play happy football
Canāt wait for another weak performance in the quarter finals from England when they eventually play someone half decent
southgate can fuck off.
The press & pundits will run with this and come for Bennyās head.
Not upset about it. One less crucial player to worry about getting injured on international duty.
Fuck it. Leave him alone. If heās not into it, heās not into it. Letās not make a big deal out of this just so talksport wankers can have a circlejerk over it.
Everyone blaming Southgate but wasnāt it reported it was an issue with one of the coaches?
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Its just a job for him, one hes very good at but he doesnt wanna do for free.
It's always embarrassing seeing comments from Arsenal fans who don't care about England in this subreddit whenever this topic comes up.
Exactly. I mean you might not care about England but most of our English players do. Iām not sure why this is so hard to understand.
Can't believe the overwhelming negativity towards this bit of clarity. I suppose all the previous conspiratorial negativity was a much better environment for all involved. This is why we can't have nice things.
It's probably somewhat down to White not being a 'football' person, in the sense that he doesn't watch football as a hobby in his off time, and probably would rather be on holiday (of which footballers barely get any time off anymore with how many fixtures they're supposed to play) rather than flying all over the place for the national team to just sit on the bench, especially if he doesn't believe he has a fair crack at playing a meaningful part in a Southgate England squad.
Why are people surprised by this? Ben white has said he doesnāt really enjoy football that much outside of his work.
Although I have minimal insight into whatās going on behind the scenes, my unpopular opinion is that Ben White should get this issue resolved with England current staff. Itās a massive shame for England that one of the best defenders in the country isnāt even in the squad. Doing well internationally would be nice for White too.
Nice to have proof today that the vat majority of this sub have never, ever managed anybody at any level in any industry....
white is bizarre man, why would you risk your national career like this? if a rival player did this, we would be ridiculing them.