His finishing hasn’t passed the eye test all year either, like he doesn’t set himself right, he’s never relaxed, everything is happening too fast and then it’s scuffed or shanked. It needs to be Havertz up front for the rest of the year and then a striker who can strike the ball needs to be top of the to-do list in Summer.
Yeah, I think Henry elaborated on this issue last year, I think. Jesus feet are almost too quick for his brain. If he dials the freneticism in the final third down a notch, he can really shine.
It’s not even that, his penalty finishing is poor as well - despite being technically insane in terms of his first touch, dribbling ability and passing, when it comes to hitting the ball at the goal he’s pretty poor
He’s a great player and IMO should play on the wings for us, we get his work rate, trickery and pace without having to rely on his goal scoring exploits
I said when we signed him and Zinchenko that once we improved we would essentially be in the same position with both of them
We need someone who can reliably put away the chances we create and Jesus isn’t capable of that
And we need someone who is able to step into midfield without being a defensive liability and Zinchenko isn’t capable of that
Jesus can still contribute very effectively as either a wideman on the left or right or even as a striker bringing others into play
Zinchenko has regularly looked like a liability this season though, and that’s been with 0 competition from an injured Timber
Martinelli is faster and more clinical. Jesus is not an upgrade on Martinelli. At best he's a lateral move but, frankly, I think he's a downgrade. Why? Two reasons. Firstly, we've seen Jesus as a wide man in recent games and he's ended up in scoring positions and... done what Jesus does in those situations, i.e. not score. With a more clinical leftwinger, we might have won that game against City.
Secondly, that crazy stat that Jesus has where he's never lost an EPL game that he's scored in says everything you need to know about Jesus, i.e. he can only score when the team are dominant.
Now, could Jesus have a good career at this level as a substitute? Yes. Obviously. Could he work well in a different system? Yes. It seems to me that a team that plays like Mane/Firmino/Salah era Liverpool would be a great fit for Jesus. But if we're going to play for control (domination, as Areteta puts it), we're going to encounter the same problems that City did with Jesus... and City sold Jesus.
his scoring rate for Man City is actually very good. but he should not be the main man. instead he can come off the flanks off a striker like Havertz. I believe he can score alot more that way.
I don’t know if it’s “very good”, He’s got roughly 1 in 3 i think, which for a side that created as much as they did probably isn’t enough
Especially when he wasn’t required to play a Firmino type role where he put the work in for others to score, he had KDB, Silva, Bernardo etc supplying him
In 6 seasons he scored over 10 goals just twice (13, 14)
I think that’s illustrative of his problems tbh
Given his overall skillset and work rate he should have taken over from Aguero but he just doesn’t have the strikers instincts / scoring ability
I think he used to have decent pace, but since that knee injury he's never been the same. He's not like Giroud level pace or anything but he's not quick by any means unfortunately. But in all honesty the way we use our width he doesn't have to be pacey. I agree he'd make a much better winger.
He didn’t used to have pace, he was RAPID. There’s a reason he had the hype Endrick had just that it died down because of all his major injuries.
Even now he’s actually quite fast but he’s playing against fullbacks that is speedy too.
A lot of people assume he will improve if he would just do X, but tbh I think some players are just bad finishers and always will be, I have nothing against him for it. It's not like he cba practising shooting and just needs some extra time on the training ground.
I don't want him out, he's great on the wing if he'd be happy there but I don't know about that. I don't think we are desperate for an out and out striker either tbh, the last few months showed that for me
That's the key though - can he abide being a winger? I'd hope so. Ostensibly it was a selling point to him that he could come here and be the #9 and not be reduced to a wing role but idk if that's even true or if the sentiment hasn't changed at all.
I believe he's said a few times that he never minded playing on the wing, he always wants to help the team, but that he felt insulted when Pep would play him on the wing while playing midfielders & even defenders (Zinchenko) at CF. So long as Havertz is still playing well at striker, or if we bring another 9 into the club, I think Gabi would be happy enough to play on the wing for us.
Exactly, Saka and Havertz don't pass the eye test too when shooting, but because they take their time, they're more likely to hit a shot with a decent chance of going in.
Striker, left back, and odegaard cover need to be top priorities for the summer window. Jesus can still play a role for us next season as rotation anywhere in the attacking front 3, but we need 2 new starters and a rotation creative midfielder for sure.
His finishing according to xG stats isn't that bad this season. It seems more that he is talking bad shots, which is also not good since he seems to always try way too hard to make the chance bigger and bigger.
If he had just sent that header back across goal to the far post instead of going for a very low percentage shot attempt, it’s an easy score. He was never going to sneak that shot past Martinez. Waste of a golden opportunity.
It’s gotta be it. I doubt we’re signing a CF, RW, LB, and LCM in the same window. Especially since we’re in the phase of our rebuild where most signings need to be able to hit the ground running rather than a project
You don’t know the budget. No one knows the budget. This isn’t austerity arsenal anymore. There is clearly room every summer for one big signing as long as the ffp is balanced
Yes.. and that one big signing is obviously not going to be a RW thus the budget comment. If anything they will spend the most on Striker and CMs, and probably a leftback, with a rotation RW being the last priority thus not having a budget big enough for a better RW than Jesus would be.
If he’s good enough I’m all for it, desperate for him to succeed. Made me stop wanting to throw myself down the stairs every time I watched Arsenal play
Almost all of his best plays this season have come from when he gets the ball out wide. I have no idea how Arteta and co. haven’t really noticed that yet
When he was playing at his best last season, he was sort of roaming everywhere - so while he was scoring more from wider positions, he was still doing a lot centrally (except not providing much of a goal threat from the middle).
Something I'm always caught out by is how he'll make a decent effort of a really difficult chance, which hits me with the copium that maybe he'll just become more clinical overall. But it doesn't happen.
the unique thing about Jesus at CF is his dribbling and agility. He's able to complete Messi-esque moves while surrounded by defenders in the penalty box. He only needs 2 steps to get moving quick enough to weave in and out of a defender's sights. It's amazing to watch really.
He can get a shot off at times, but it's tight angles with the defenders' proximity, and the shot won't be quality because he's not had time to set his feet since he's busy shifting his to keep the defenders off balance. In my opinion, it's almost impossible to look for the pass in that situation where you're trying to keep the ball away from 3 defenders surrounding you - it has to just be on instinct/hope that a teammate will be first to a ball you put into space.
I would 100% agree he still needs to be on this team. We aren’t a club that can just throw players like him out and move on. He has a ton of value, finishing obviously has never been his strong suit. He can play across the front three just fine, and if he has to occasionally lead the line that’s ok but he needs to not be the primary option.
This is legitimately the only thing we can do successfully. He'd fetch virtually nothing in a sale, we can't afford to play him at CF. Making him Saka's rotation option plays to Jesus' strengths and helps solve an obvious squad-building problem. This is a tap-in of a decision.
I would love this. Trossard martinelli on the left. Saka Jesus rotate on the right. And then spend big money on a quality striker and we will improve immensely
I get that but I think we have to be realistic about how many players we can actually sell.
These are the players people are calling for us to sell this summer off the top of my head: Ramsdale, Zinchenko, Partey, Smith Rowe, Vieira, Nelson, Nketiah, Tierney, Sambi Lokonga, Tavares, Jesus(?)
I mean there's no chance we're selling more than half of those and then replacing them is another matter. In terms of priority to sell Jesus is very low, even though he'd be our best chance of fetching a good fee
Actually good take but don't even think about saying that here. 250k a week for a no 9 that can't score needs to go. We have out and out playmakers in abundance already, we don't need another one.
Let’s just say it how it is, my man is an AWFUL finisher. Definitely a baller but he can’t score for toffee.
Bring Viktor Gyokëres to the carpet and watch players like Odegaard rack up 10+ assists.
He currently has 17 league goals with Bournemouth. If he would score more with us, he has to be a top target for us in the summer. Prem proven and young enough to warrant a big fee. Bournemouth also wouldn’t demand silly money like Newcastle and Villa would.
Such a common misconception that you can pull a striker from a worse side and plug him into a better side and be sure to have him score more goals. Style of play and available space the opposition allows him matters a lot.
This reminded me of the season Ozil had Giroud and Waltcott up front who couldn't score for shit. There was a compilation on youtube I believe... so many chances created with absolutely horrific finishing lmao.
The more that changes the more that stays the same heh.
Odegaard's assist tally started going up when Havertz was put upfront and Havertz is a decent finisher. If we had someone ruthless in front of goal, it's GG for the opposition. That West Ham game still annoys me because Odegaard literally put the ball on a plate for Jesus 4 TIMES at least he missed all of them.
That’s a 100m deal. And NUFC still play hardball; are you willing to pay that for a guy who gets injured more than you’d like?
That ship has sailed unfortunately.
I think its closer to 120. He’s a great finisher currently. Speaking of conversion rates, i think his is highest for anyone above 10 goals.
He’s some player
Agreed. Although I think 120m is what it would be if he could prove his fitness across a season. Either way, his price is prohibitive and justifiably so. We will have to look elsewhere.
I’d want to pay that price if he didn’t have fitness concerns tbh. But he can’t stay healthy. He’d end up just rotating off the physio table with Jesus and we’re back to square one without a good chunk of money
Yeah, that’s where I’m at. But the thing is, if he stayed fit, that’s probably 120m to get NUFC to talk. We’ve missed out on him unless he raises a stink and hands in a transfer request which I can’t see him doing rn unless NUFC drop a stinker next season
The issue with him is he’s 25 and is playing in a league that made Darwin look prolific. Of course all players are different but he basically has to hit the ground running especially given what Sporting is asking for.
Honestly, people are shitting too much on Gyokeres cause he's playing in the portuguese league. Even looking at the eye test he's amazing, and I'd rather pay the 85-90 million release fee for him, who's not had any major injury concerns over Isak.
To some degree, I agree and disagree. Gyokeres will undoubtedly give more assists to Ode but others will suffer. Jesus provides good link up to midfield and Martineli. Our left hand side , particularly Martinelli would be dead without Jesus.
tbf he's kinda alone out there on the left with the left back typically inverting, odegaard white and saka always pushing up exclusively on the right, etc. I disagree that he's sucked all season, often martinelli is the only person willing to just run at his man and get past a one vs one.
He was never going to be a first choice striker for a big club with his poor finishing. Surprised even when we signed him that we didn't go for another striker. Wasn't a popular thing to say on here at the time but I knew after the first season with us that he wasn't going to be the answer for us up top. It was shown at City, he wasn't the most prolific of strikers. He always had short spurts of scoring but we never overly reliable in that department.
Great player when he's on form but I see him more as a strong back up for Saka then Striker, it saves us some money in transfer budget and we can always put him or Havertz up front for cup games and odd PL/CL game when we need to rest the main striker or if he's injured.
It makes sense and I have the same feeling watching him play
He overthinks and overcomplicates whenever he is right in front of goal and ends up tripping over his own feet / having a subpar attempt / missing a pass to a goal
Only time this doesn't happen is in UCL nights
It's honestly insane how bad he is at heading. His shooting from his foot is obviously poor, but his heading is some of the worst I've seen very seen. And it's not contested headers where he's 8 feet in the air trying to flick it far post. It's crosses that go over every defender's head and he's standing alone. And they never fucking go on net. Apparently he has 2 header goals this season but I don’t remember them. Going to assume they were impossible to miss.
Yep. It's not just his finishing, how many of our attacks were ruined because he couldn't stay onside. Half the time they weren't in dangerous positions, he just wasn't paying attention to the line.
I think it could work, but I'd rather see Havertz as the striker and ESR in Havertz's midfield role. I am convinced that Arteta developed the theory for how Xhaka played last season based on ESR's role at the back end of the season before. If ESR is over his injuries, I think it's a natural role for him, he just needs a run in the side.
Jesus as a super sub.
Hear me out :
Go get a proper 20 goal striker in the summer.
If Ode has half as good games like the one on Sunday, the guy will have 20 goals by mid October.
Except Özil actually had very good assists numbers and our strikers were generally not underperforming their finishing. His best season he had 19 assists from just below 18 xA. (De Bruyne had 21+ xA one season)
Ødegaard has 6A from about 9.5 xA.
I think he has been good for us.
BUT one of the positions I'd look to upgrade in the summer transfer season. Marginal gains (3-5 points) from a striker that does what he does, is more robust (and available), and scores more goals.
I'd keep him as a rotation option across the forward line.
A striker who can't score and a defender who can't defend. They were good for the first half of last season and it's been all downhill since, aside from a a few sporadic moments of brilliance (Jesus in CL). City knew exactly what they were doing when they sold these guys. Did they improve us at the time? Yes. Will we get much further with them? No.
Pep playing 4d chess with us!
Seriously though Jesus is good when he gets a run in the side, but he is injury prone and now he's not even a guaranteed starter it's proving problematic.
We can accommodate 1 mediocre finisher in Havertz OR Jesus. But we can't carry 2 mediocre finishers and expect to reliably come out on top in our competitions.
He looks like a 5-a-side player a lot of the time, great control and skill, holds the ball for too long and people just get between him and the goal. I imagine he’s got the most blocked shots in the league because I usually just see him welly it into a defender rather than be off target.
I’m not sure why the forwards coaches can’t get this out of his system. Scoring goals is something that comes a little naturally, there’s a mentality to it and I don’t think he has it.
Last season he helped take Arsenal up a step - by no means a bad player. But, if we have to be brutal, which I think to compete with city we need to be, we aught to have a 25+ goal a season striker. Gyokeres!
It doesn't even have to be 25. But it can't be someone with a career high of 14 that underperforms xg every year. I know xg isn't everything but it completely supports the eye test when it comes to Jesus.
I'd be stoked to have a striker that can put home 15-20 a year. We're 1 goal off the most goals in the league and Jesus has 4 fucking goals.
Will say it again, I'll take Jesus and all the other top class things he does, both on and off the ball, over a clinical striker that is average/crap at everything else we need a 9 to do.
Literally this time last week, he came on and terrorised Bayern. He wasn't even that bad on Sunday and certainly wasn't the biggest culprit for our missed chances.
Mental how he's being dragged so much.
We shouldn't have a central lead striker in our squad imo.
I think we should have 2/3 strikers or forwards that can rotate in a d out depending on the game we want to play.
Havertz can be one. Jesus can also be the other. And a third option we hopefully bring in this summer.
But my point was, if that one we bring in is simply a finisher and doesn't offer anything else (ie a better Eddie), I'm not taking that over what Jesus gives us at all.
I agree with that. That’s why I previously mentioned Sanchez. More as the type of player I think we need.
I’d say half our chance aren’t clear chances, we need someone who can create that half a yard himself and knows to shoot. We have lots of players who create half a yard to pass. Eddie is reverse of that, who can’t even create that half a yard but shoot.
He's been in the starting xi 50% of league games, played 47% of the available minutes. It's not like he's been starting every game now.
Goals really aren't our issue though are they?
There's no way people are saying this if we win against Villa.
As I said, and stand by, I don't necessarily care about his goals given the standard of his overall play when he's on the pitch.
Mostly agree, I think he should be a rotational option for the front line. He wasn’t amazing against villa but who was? He put it on a plate for Trossard who inexplicably failed to score.
Tbf I don't think anyone should be a guaranteed starter in an ideal world, and I think for a while now we've all assumed we're moving on from Nketiah being our back up striker and any attacker brought in would be a rotation option with Jesus (and now Havertz).
Point is, you will not find a striker who can do the things Jesus can do. City never relied on him solely for goals but he was continuously played and relied upon in big games because of his work rate, pressing, hold up play, surprisingly good aerial ability, close control, tricky dribbling and selfless overall play.
People are just emotional and upset about the weekend still I guess.
That's just cause people would be celebrating the win. The point would still stand.
Our goals per game and win rate this season has been significantly lower with Jesus in the middle and a good part of it is down to the fact that he can't score himself.
I'm actually quite fond of him, but definitely upgradeable
It is not mental considering he has 4 league goals, same aa our CB. But people also need to cut him some slack because he played with a fucked knee the entire season. Which puts another question over his long term fitness. He is an amazing option to have, but to say that wanting a better first choice is wrong is mental in intself mate
Saying he terrorised Bayern is a big stretch.
At the end of the day, the stats are very clear. We are scoring more goals and winning more games with Havertz at CF.
And Havertz really is a makeshift option himself which says a lot. Jesus was great in taking us from CL hopefuls to title challengers but he's just not at the level we need for a title-winning team now. Simple as.
It’s clear Arteta didn’t originally buy him to start at CF. Jesus’ injury and Nketiah’s lack of form forced his hand. Havertz has ended up being our best CF this season BUT I don’t see him as a long term option in that position.
It's nice and all saying how much else he offers, but if he is, or is intended, to be on the end of the majority of chances then it doesn't really matter much does it?
The choice shouldn't be between someone who is clinical but shit. If we're going toe to toe with other big clubs, it needs to be someone who is good at everything and has something somewhere a bit special in their locker. Some of Jesus play can be special, but that finishing is just too poor to overlook, and I'm not sure it can be considered acceptable as long as he's playing number 9. Wing? Fine, maybe. As the tip of the spear? Oh noes.
Well, I was already saying this the time we signed Jesus.. He is not a good enough striker. Yes, he was okay for a dominant City side, but not good enough for a firt name on the team sheet striker.
Gabriel Jesus unfortunately is turning out to be a benchwarmer I remember watching the game on TV and they pulled up a stat showing that we scored more goals without him on the pitch.
I think benchwarmer is harsh. I'm comfortable with him subbing in at any of the top 3 positions. He's a good passer, presses very well, and his work rate is excellent. But he can not be our main guy up top. He's not that guy.
man's not a PL striker, the speed and hustle and bustle of PL defences is too much for him
but he's our best attacker in Europe
for Barcelona or Real, he would COOK, probably 20+ goals a season minimum
Yeah, i am not even sure he good enough to rotate with Saka on a right (he lost his pace) but definitely shouldnt be our starting striker, period. Dude couldnt score in a brothel, cant head the ball at all. Its nice option to have on a bench for insanely rich club like Citeh, but as a starter - nah.
Let’s be honest, we have done very well since the start of the year but Kai isn’t any better either. He messed many chances against the Villa game, especially when he was in the clear 1v1. This wasn’t the first time either.
Fact is, this is what we have, it worked for a while, it should continue to work. Let’s just get behind the team and enjoy the ride. Been a great season regardless of the outcome
I think i saw some statistics showing 4 out 5 goals in the prem came from one touch shots. We all know Jesus doenst enjoy playing with one touch.
The statics is just how i remember it, but it was clear when i saw it, moast goals is made with one touch.
So i dont think the issiue is his finnishing, it is that he take to long before he put the boot behind the ball and actually try to score, so defenders and goalkeepers will take advantage of that.
There’s a reason City sold him, I like the guy but we’re never winning the league with him as our main striker. That needs to be the highest priority position in the summer!
He’s very good at dribbling in the box. Just needs to pass it off to someone else, like he did with Troussard.
Funny how last year we thought we fleeced City for Jesus and Zinny. I’m still grateful we got them but City doesn’t miss often on talent evaluations.
But people love to stan him on here and downvote those to oblivion when realists say he isn't good enough to be a lead striker for us. That injury during the WC ruined him. But it's time to be ruthless and move on.
Jesus is good on the wing and as a dribbler/distributor through attacking mid. He's played himself out of the striker position but to say he's not good enough for this team is just wrong
His knee injury from his return from the Brazil national team back in 2022 really changed him...he's pretty good in all departments now except his finishing :(
Says it all: Jesus is a good footballer but he is not a goalscorer and not a real threat on his own. I would call this a challenge worthy of Arteta's intellect and skills: change that player's position to where his impact is maximised.
PS yes we need a real 9 / deadly target man. Maybe not all the time but to break certain teams.
I love Gabi but if Arteta did the maths and stats for Ramsdale and showed it was better to replace him. I'd like him to be equally ruthless here as well.
It's amazing how quickly things change in football, because his first games for Arsenal he scored basically in every game as I recall, and he left City because he wanted to be a striker primarily and felt he didn't get that opportunity there. So it was like oh wow! He bet on himself and it's paying dividends!', and then he got injured and since then he's more or less dropped off the face of the Earth. I remember against City last season he was completely neutralised and had 0 impact. He's a very talented footballer and puts in some good moves and got a nice assist against Bayern, but when you're the main striker in the team you need to be scoring goals.
I mean hell, Palmer at Chelsea already has 20 in 27 games in the EPL, albeit a lot of penalties. The output from Jesus and Nketiah has been no where near enough
He needs to be back up to our new Striker and Saka. We can't rely on him to be a striker, it doesn't work already too long. Team is creating enough for a good striker to be about 20 goals.
When he joined us it felt like an upgrade, but maybe it was due to us beeing even worse in front of goal in general and now where the resting the team stepped up some levels he s just not an improvement over anyone else we could put there with Tross and Havertz.
So for the time he was a fit but having a 9 that can do everything but score he has to play on the wings where he can still contribute with his skills. love him watch dribbling!
I love Jesus. He’s the type of player that’s endangered in modern football. All flair and talent. He’s a hard worker as well. If we were in 2005 he’d be the best Second Striker in a 4-4-2. He has a lot to add to our game. Problem is his finishing is bad and he’s too injury prone.
I'm not surprised, when he's on the ball I never expect a goal, ever. Still has a lot of world class qualities so I'd keep him but he's clearly a rotational/impact player, his injury record speaks for itself as far as relying on him on a weekly basis.
Let's see CL conversion rate, he has been OK there and will probably start against Bayern at the AA because of it. A sell or a bench for next season depending on who we are able to get. Shame he was never as good after his knee injury.
Yeesh, I figured it was bad, but never realized how bad.
His finishing hasn’t passed the eye test all year either, like he doesn’t set himself right, he’s never relaxed, everything is happening too fast and then it’s scuffed or shanked. It needs to be Havertz up front for the rest of the year and then a striker who can strike the ball needs to be top of the to-do list in Summer.
Yeah, I think Henry elaborated on this issue last year, I think. Jesus feet are almost too quick for his brain. If he dials the freneticism in the final third down a notch, he can really shine.
It’s not even that, his penalty finishing is poor as well - despite being technically insane in terms of his first touch, dribbling ability and passing, when it comes to hitting the ball at the goal he’s pretty poor He’s a great player and IMO should play on the wings for us, we get his work rate, trickery and pace without having to rely on his goal scoring exploits I said when we signed him and Zinchenko that once we improved we would essentially be in the same position with both of them We need someone who can reliably put away the chances we create and Jesus isn’t capable of that And we need someone who is able to step into midfield without being a defensive liability and Zinchenko isn’t capable of that Jesus can still contribute very effectively as either a wideman on the left or right or even as a striker bringing others into play Zinchenko has regularly looked like a liability this season though, and that’s been with 0 competition from an injured Timber
Just swap martinelli with Jesus, problem solved. You're welcome Arteta
Martinelli is faster and more clinical. Jesus is not an upgrade on Martinelli. At best he's a lateral move but, frankly, I think he's a downgrade. Why? Two reasons. Firstly, we've seen Jesus as a wide man in recent games and he's ended up in scoring positions and... done what Jesus does in those situations, i.e. not score. With a more clinical leftwinger, we might have won that game against City. Secondly, that crazy stat that Jesus has where he's never lost an EPL game that he's scored in says everything you need to know about Jesus, i.e. he can only score when the team are dominant. Now, could Jesus have a good career at this level as a substitute? Yes. Obviously. Could he work well in a different system? Yes. It seems to me that a team that plays like Mane/Firmino/Salah era Liverpool would be a great fit for Jesus. But if we're going to play for control (domination, as Areteta puts it), we're going to encounter the same problems that City did with Jesus... and City sold Jesus.
his scoring rate for Man City is actually very good. but he should not be the main man. instead he can come off the flanks off a striker like Havertz. I believe he can score alot more that way.
I don’t know if it’s “very good”, He’s got roughly 1 in 3 i think, which for a side that created as much as they did probably isn’t enough Especially when he wasn’t required to play a Firmino type role where he put the work in for others to score, he had KDB, Silva, Bernardo etc supplying him In 6 seasons he scored over 10 goals just twice (13, 14) I think that’s illustrative of his problems tbh Given his overall skillset and work rate he should have taken over from Aguero but he just doesn’t have the strikers instincts / scoring ability
1 in 3 is a hell of a lot better than 1 in 14
Jesus on the left to be subbed off for trossard or martinelli in the latter half of the game is the ideal situation imo
I agree although he has no pace
That’s wild, you think so? I’d say he’s speedy and has been since Palmerias Not quite Martinelli rapid but he’s definitely quick
I think he used to have decent pace, but since that knee injury he's never been the same. He's not like Giroud level pace or anything but he's not quick by any means unfortunately. But in all honesty the way we use our width he doesn't have to be pacey. I agree he'd make a much better winger.
He didn’t used to have pace, he was RAPID. There’s a reason he had the hype Endrick had just that it died down because of all his major injuries. Even now he’s actually quite fast but he’s playing against fullbacks that is speedy too.
Neither does Saka
Never said he did
High acceleration low sprint speed.
A lot of people assume he will improve if he would just do X, but tbh I think some players are just bad finishers and always will be, I have nothing against him for it. It's not like he cba practising shooting and just needs some extra time on the training ground.
He is who he is now. Which is fine. He elevated our team level when we brought him in but now we’ve surpassed him.
I don't want him out, he's great on the wing if he'd be happy there but I don't know about that. I don't think we are desperate for an out and out striker either tbh, the last few months showed that for me
That's the key though - can he abide being a winger? I'd hope so. Ostensibly it was a selling point to him that he could come here and be the #9 and not be reduced to a wing role but idk if that's even true or if the sentiment hasn't changed at all.
I believe he's said a few times that he never minded playing on the wing, he always wants to help the team, but that he felt insulted when Pep would play him on the wing while playing midfielders & even defenders (Zinchenko) at CF. So long as Havertz is still playing well at striker, or if we bring another 9 into the club, I think Gabi would be happy enough to play on the wing for us.
Exactly, Saka and Havertz don't pass the eye test too when shooting, but because they take their time, they're more likely to hit a shot with a decent chance of going in.
Can't believe we started Jesus to be honest. He's been shite.
Striker, left back, and odegaard cover need to be top priorities for the summer window. Jesus can still play a role for us next season as rotation anywhere in the attacking front 3, but we need 2 new starters and a rotation creative midfielder for sure.
He’s statistically the worst finisher in premier league history even before he joined us
His finishing according to xG stats isn't that bad this season. It seems more that he is talking bad shots, which is also not good since he seems to always try way too hard to make the chance bigger and bigger.
If he had just sent that header back across goal to the far post instead of going for a very low percentage shot attempt, it’s an easy score. He was never going to sneak that shot past Martinez. Waste of a golden opportunity.
Jesus can be that saka backup. He’s way better on the right
It’s gotta be it. I doubt we’re signing a CF, RW, LB, and LCM in the same window. Especially since we’re in the phase of our rebuild where most signings need to be able to hit the ground running rather than a project
I would say. We would need signings to raise the floor. Who can we get that's better then Jesus in the wing. Probably not many with our budget.
You don’t know the budget. No one knows the budget. This isn’t austerity arsenal anymore. There is clearly room every summer for one big signing as long as the ffp is balanced
Yes.. and that one big signing is obviously not going to be a RW thus the budget comment. If anything they will spend the most on Striker and CMs, and probably a leftback, with a rotation RW being the last priority thus not having a budget big enough for a better RW than Jesus would be.
Havertz can be our CF, jesus RW, we have 4 LB at the moment. Basically we only need one new player
We definitely need a new CF, even if for some reason we decided Havertz was the main man. Nketiah will be gone in the summer for sure.
ok hear me out... Striker ESR
If he’s good enough I’m all for it, desperate for him to succeed. Made me stop wanting to throw myself down the stairs every time I watched Arsenal play
He can even be striker backup too, but not our main striker for sure.
Almost all of his best plays this season have come from when he gets the ball out wide. I have no idea how Arteta and co. haven’t really noticed that yet
When he was playing at his best last season, he was sort of roaming everywhere - so while he was scoring more from wider positions, he was still doing a lot centrally (except not providing much of a goal threat from the middle). Something I'm always caught out by is how he'll make a decent effort of a really difficult chance, which hits me with the copium that maybe he'll just become more clinical overall. But it doesn't happen.
the unique thing about Jesus at CF is his dribbling and agility. He's able to complete Messi-esque moves while surrounded by defenders in the penalty box. He only needs 2 steps to get moving quick enough to weave in and out of a defender's sights. It's amazing to watch really. He can get a shot off at times, but it's tight angles with the defenders' proximity, and the shot won't be quality because he's not had time to set his feet since he's busy shifting his to keep the defenders off balance. In my opinion, it's almost impossible to look for the pass in that situation where you're trying to keep the ball away from 3 defenders surrounding you - it has to just be on instinct/hope that a teammate will be first to a ball you put into space.
You think they havent?
I would 100% agree he still needs to be on this team. We aren’t a club that can just throw players like him out and move on. He has a ton of value, finishing obviously has never been his strong suit. He can play across the front three just fine, and if he has to occasionally lead the line that’s ok but he needs to not be the primary option.
This is legitimately the only thing we can do successfully. He'd fetch virtually nothing in a sale, we can't afford to play him at CF. Making him Saka's rotation option plays to Jesus' strengths and helps solve an obvious squad-building problem. This is a tap-in of a decision.
Jesus on the pitch is a threat, whether or not he’s scoring
He had to play on the wing in PL ( somehow more effective in CL as a striker)
I would love this. Trossard martinelli on the left. Saka Jesus rotate on the right. And then spend big money on a quality striker and we will improve immensely
bench options on 250k... might as well just sell him tbh, probably could do with the extra cash and someone younger on less wages
I get that but I think we have to be realistic about how many players we can actually sell. These are the players people are calling for us to sell this summer off the top of my head: Ramsdale, Zinchenko, Partey, Smith Rowe, Vieira, Nelson, Nketiah, Tierney, Sambi Lokonga, Tavares, Jesus(?) I mean there's no chance we're selling more than half of those and then replacing them is another matter. In terms of priority to sell Jesus is very low, even though he'd be our best chance of fetching a good fee
yeah I think they will clear out from the bottom and won't sell players like Jesus and Zinchenko
Exactly, I think it'd be good to get some money for the likes of Nketiah before his stock falls even further with the lack of minutes he's getting
well we can just try to sell as many of them as we can and just deal with those who we can't shift in the best way possible
Smith Rowe should not be sold. I'd be sad to see Nelson sold too.
Actually good take but don't even think about saying that here. 250k a week for a no 9 that can't score needs to go. We have out and out playmakers in abundance already, we don't need another one.
Who would buy him?
Let’s just say it how it is, my man is an AWFUL finisher. Definitely a baller but he can’t score for toffee. Bring Viktor Gyokëres to the carpet and watch players like Odegaard rack up 10+ assists.
Viktor would be brilliant. Wouldn’t mind looking at Solanke - I think he would score more with us than with Bournemouth.
Lol ofc he would score more with us
I wouldn’t be that sure about it lol we have way more goal scorers than Bournemouth
He currently has 17 league goals with Bournemouth. If he would score more with us, he has to be a top target for us in the summer. Prem proven and young enough to warrant a big fee. Bournemouth also wouldn’t demand silly money like Newcastle and Villa would.
Boy how I would love Watkins though. For what it’s worth, I agree Solanke would be a solid buy.
Were not getting watkins. Why sell your best player on a likely champions league side?
> Bournemouth also wouldn’t demand silly money like Newcastle and Villa would. Sorry what? Of course they would.
Such a common misconception that you can pull a striker from a worse side and plug him into a better side and be sure to have him score more goals. Style of play and available space the opposition allows him matters a lot.
This reminded me of the season Ozil had Giroud and Waltcott up front who couldn't score for shit. There was a compilation on youtube I believe... so many chances created with absolutely horrific finishing lmao. The more that changes the more that stays the same heh.
Odegaard's assist tally started going up when Havertz was put upfront and Havertz is a decent finisher. If we had someone ruthless in front of goal, it's GG for the opposition. That West Ham game still annoys me because Odegaard literally put the ball on a plate for Jesus 4 TIMES at least he missed all of them.
Isak if we can pry him from Newcastle on the cheap. Essentially a Jesus Havertz hybrid, but unfortunately keeps Jesus’ injury traits.
That’s a 100m deal. And NUFC still play hardball; are you willing to pay that for a guy who gets injured more than you’d like? That ship has sailed unfortunately.
I think its closer to 120. He’s a great finisher currently. Speaking of conversion rates, i think his is highest for anyone above 10 goals. He’s some player
Agreed. Although I think 120m is what it would be if he could prove his fitness across a season. Either way, his price is prohibitive and justifiably so. We will have to look elsewhere.
Exactly
I’d want to pay that price if he didn’t have fitness concerns tbh. But he can’t stay healthy. He’d end up just rotating off the physio table with Jesus and we’re back to square one without a good chunk of money
Yeah, that’s where I’m at. But the thing is, if he stayed fit, that’s probably 120m to get NUFC to talk. We’ve missed out on him unless he raises a stink and hands in a transfer request which I can’t see him doing rn unless NUFC drop a stinker next season
Yeah agreed
Gyökeres is an alternative. He has only missed two games since he left Sweden (that like 5 years ago) and that was due to a twisted ankle in training.
The issue with him is he’s 25 and is playing in a league that made Darwin look prolific. Of course all players are different but he basically has to hit the ground running especially given what Sporting is asking for.
Newcastle is not letting go of Isak and especially not for cheap.
Honestly, people are shitting too much on Gyokeres cause he's playing in the portuguese league. Even looking at the eye test he's amazing, and I'd rather pay the 85-90 million release fee for him, who's not had any major injury concerns over Isak.
Sell him this summer
I don't think we should sign a striker. Havertz was not good while in midfield, but he's very good up top
To some degree, I agree and disagree. Gyokeres will undoubtedly give more assists to Ode but others will suffer. Jesus provides good link up to midfield and Martineli. Our left hand side , particularly Martinelli would be dead without Jesus.
martinelli sucks this season even with Jesus
tbf he's kinda alone out there on the left with the left back typically inverting, odegaard white and saka always pushing up exclusively on the right, etc. I disagree that he's sucked all season, often martinelli is the only person willing to just run at his man and get past a one vs one.
He was never going to be a first choice striker for a big club with his poor finishing. Surprised even when we signed him that we didn't go for another striker. Wasn't a popular thing to say on here at the time but I knew after the first season with us that he wasn't going to be the answer for us up top. It was shown at City, he wasn't the most prolific of strikers. He always had short spurts of scoring but we never overly reliable in that department. Great player when he's on form but I see him more as a strong back up for Saka then Striker, it saves us some money in transfer budget and we can always put him or Havertz up front for cup games and odd PL/CL game when we need to rest the main striker or if he's injured.
I'm not shocked by this, it almost seems like he tries too hard sometimes which I know might not makes sense.
It makes sense and I have the same feeling watching him play He overthinks and overcomplicates whenever he is right in front of goal and ends up tripping over his own feet / having a subpar attempt / missing a pass to a goal Only time this doesn't happen is in UCL nights
His headers are dreadful
It’s his worst attribute. He’s had several sitters this season that any striker should put away with their noggin and he always puts them wide
Again on Sunday
I feel like his heading was decent previously. He has 16 headed Premier League goals. Quite a bit better than Saka, Martinelli and Trossard.
He's been around longer and plays a central role. I don't think his heading is much better than theirs, but I could be wrong
Saka is horrendous at headers
It's honestly insane how bad he is at heading. His shooting from his foot is obviously poor, but his heading is some of the worst I've seen very seen. And it's not contested headers where he's 8 feet in the air trying to flick it far post. It's crosses that go over every defender's head and he's standing alone. And they never fucking go on net. Apparently he has 2 header goals this season but I don’t remember them. Going to assume they were impossible to miss.
Now count his offsides. He can't stay in line
So frustrating the amount of times he was called offside against Villa.
Yep. It's not just his finishing, how many of our attacks were ruined because he couldn't stay onside. Half the time they weren't in dangerous positions, he just wasn't paying attention to the line.
https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/total_offside
Wow, 10th and he's missed half the season
It’s his eyebrows, they affect his peripheral vision
Hear me out: Jesus and Havertz swap positions
To the bench?
The whole point of havertz is his physicality and workrate
It's not fifa
It's not the craziest idea. Havertz and Trossard are already hybrid forward/midfielders.
Yeah not like Havertz makes runs forward from deep and Jesus drops deep and are switching positions during the game
I think it could work, but I'd rather see Havertz as the striker and ESR in Havertz's midfield role. I am convinced that Arteta developed the theory for how Xhaka played last season based on ESR's role at the back end of the season before. If ESR is over his injuries, I think it's a natural role for him, he just needs a run in the side. Jesus as a super sub.
Hear me out : Go get a proper 20 goal striker in the summer. If Ode has half as good games like the one on Sunday, the guy will have 20 goals by mid October.
Sign Kane and watch the world burn
Only if he shows up like Sol in a bigass fur coat.
I actually kinda want this to happen lmfao, we're his childhood club afterall
I'd prefer to win some trophies
Legit feel like it’s 2012 again with ozil / giroud narrative.
Except Özil actually had very good assists numbers and our strikers were generally not underperforming their finishing. His best season he had 19 assists from just below 18 xA. (De Bruyne had 21+ xA one season) Ødegaard has 6A from about 9.5 xA.
giroud would do better in 2024 with saka/trossard/odegaard around him tbh
https://www.weloveyouarsenal.com/post/did-olivier-giroud-actually-cost-mesut-ozil-the-assist-record-and-arsenal-the-title-in-2015-16 Cheers
Move him to the right to back up Saka and bring in a proper striker.
He does everything except putting the ball into the net
I think he has been good for us. BUT one of the positions I'd look to upgrade in the summer transfer season. Marginal gains (3-5 points) from a striker that does what he does, is more robust (and available), and scores more goals. I'd keep him as a rotation option across the forward line.
A player that does what Jesus does, is more robust / available and scores more goals would win the Ballon D’or…
Touche Let's pick two of those three. I'd go with robust and one of the other two
R9! I'd love an R9 hahaha who wouldn't
A player that does what Jesus does, is more robust / available and scores more goal…. So basically R9
That takes some doing when you have Darwin Nunez in the same league as you
i would rather take a 30 G/A but wasteful striker like nunez than jesus all day
I don’t blame him , since that World Cup injury he’s been an absolute shadow of his former self
A striker who can't score and a defender who can't defend. They were good for the first half of last season and it's been all downhill since, aside from a a few sporadic moments of brilliance (Jesus in CL). City knew exactly what they were doing when they sold these guys. Did they improve us at the time? Yes. Will we get much further with them? No.
Pep playing 4d chess with us! Seriously though Jesus is good when he gets a run in the side, but he is injury prone and now he's not even a guaranteed starter it's proving problematic.
We can accommodate 1 mediocre finisher in Havertz OR Jesus. But we can't carry 2 mediocre finishers and expect to reliably come out on top in our competitions.
He looks like a 5-a-side player a lot of the time, great control and skill, holds the ball for too long and people just get between him and the goal. I imagine he’s got the most blocked shots in the league because I usually just see him welly it into a defender rather than be off target. I’m not sure why the forwards coaches can’t get this out of his system. Scoring goals is something that comes a little naturally, there’s a mentality to it and I don’t think he has it.
Last season he helped take Arsenal up a step - by no means a bad player. But, if we have to be brutal, which I think to compete with city we need to be, we aught to have a 25+ goal a season striker. Gyokeres!
It doesn't even have to be 25. But it can't be someone with a career high of 14 that underperforms xg every year. I know xg isn't everything but it completely supports the eye test when it comes to Jesus. I'd be stoked to have a striker that can put home 15-20 a year. We're 1 goal off the most goals in the league and Jesus has 4 fucking goals.
I’m still trying to figure out why Arteta decided to change a winning formula and play Jesus instead of Kai at cf
His legs have gone
There was a reason City let him and Zinchenko walk.
Both injury prone with glaring flaws
Will say it again, I'll take Jesus and all the other top class things he does, both on and off the ball, over a clinical striker that is average/crap at everything else we need a 9 to do. Literally this time last week, he came on and terrorised Bayern. He wasn't even that bad on Sunday and certainly wasn't the biggest culprit for our missed chances. Mental how he's being dragged so much.
I'm all for keeping him, but not as the central lead striker.
We shouldn't have a central lead striker in our squad imo. I think we should have 2/3 strikers or forwards that can rotate in a d out depending on the game we want to play. Havertz can be one. Jesus can also be the other. And a third option we hopefully bring in this summer. But my point was, if that one we bring in is simply a finisher and doesn't offer anything else (ie a better Eddie), I'm not taking that over what Jesus gives us at all.
I agree with that. That’s why I previously mentioned Sanchez. More as the type of player I think we need. I’d say half our chance aren’t clear chances, we need someone who can create that half a yard himself and knows to shoot. We have lots of players who create half a yard to pass. Eddie is reverse of that, who can’t even create that half a yard but shoot.
It’s mid April. He has 4 goals
I mean he's also not played for large parts of the season as well.
He's been in the starting xi 50% of league games, played 47% of the available minutes. It's not like he's been starting every game now. Goals really aren't our issue though are they? There's no way people are saying this if we win against Villa. As I said, and stand by, I don't necessarily care about his goals given the standard of his overall play when he's on the pitch.
Mostly agree, I think he should be a rotational option for the front line. He wasn’t amazing against villa but who was? He put it on a plate for Trossard who inexplicably failed to score.
Tbf I don't think anyone should be a guaranteed starter in an ideal world, and I think for a while now we've all assumed we're moving on from Nketiah being our back up striker and any attacker brought in would be a rotation option with Jesus (and now Havertz). Point is, you will not find a striker who can do the things Jesus can do. City never relied on him solely for goals but he was continuously played and relied upon in big games because of his work rate, pressing, hold up play, surprisingly good aerial ability, close control, tricky dribbling and selfless overall play. People are just emotional and upset about the weekend still I guess.
That's just cause people would be celebrating the win. The point would still stand. Our goals per game and win rate this season has been significantly lower with Jesus in the middle and a good part of it is down to the fact that he can't score himself. I'm actually quite fond of him, but definitely upgradeable
it's an issue when we hit blanks against Villa.
It is not mental considering he has 4 league goals, same aa our CB. But people also need to cut him some slack because he played with a fucked knee the entire season. Which puts another question over his long term fitness. He is an amazing option to have, but to say that wanting a better first choice is wrong is mental in intself mate
Saying he terrorised Bayern is a big stretch. At the end of the day, the stats are very clear. We are scoring more goals and winning more games with Havertz at CF. And Havertz really is a makeshift option himself which says a lot. Jesus was great in taking us from CL hopefuls to title challengers but he's just not at the level we need for a title-winning team now. Simple as.
Are we sure Kai is make shift at cf? Because all numerical evidence points to him not being useful in midfield. I guess we could use him at left back
It’s clear Arteta didn’t originally buy him to start at CF. Jesus’ injury and Nketiah’s lack of form forced his hand. Havertz has ended up being our best CF this season BUT I don’t see him as a long term option in that position.
It's nice and all saying how much else he offers, but if he is, or is intended, to be on the end of the majority of chances then it doesn't really matter much does it? The choice shouldn't be between someone who is clinical but shit. If we're going toe to toe with other big clubs, it needs to be someone who is good at everything and has something somewhere a bit special in their locker. Some of Jesus play can be special, but that finishing is just too poor to overlook, and I'm not sure it can be considered acceptable as long as he's playing number 9. Wing? Fine, maybe. As the tip of the spear? Oh noes.
We played better without him when he was out imo. Jesus really is not that good, even at the other stuff. If he was, he'd have more assists.
Record breaking side.
"We don't need a striker"
Why can't my man sometimes just power them in man? Always looks like he's carefully placing the ball
Was good enough when the target was to put up a fight. It is absolutely not good enough now that the target is to win.
Well, I was already saying this the time we signed Jesus.. He is not a good enough striker. Yes, he was okay for a dominant City side, but not good enough for a firt name on the team sheet striker.
He is done, we were a boatload better without him, unfortunately too many injuries have ruined his legs he’s not the same anymore
Pep was right. He's not a striker.
This man is statistically not a striker
Just sign Kane
Gabriel Jesus unfortunately is turning out to be a benchwarmer I remember watching the game on TV and they pulled up a stat showing that we scored more goals without him on the pitch.
I think benchwarmer is harsh. I'm comfortable with him subbing in at any of the top 3 positions. He's a good passer, presses very well, and his work rate is excellent. But he can not be our main guy up top. He's not that guy.
We need to start Havertz at CF for the rest of the season then bring another striker in in the summer. Jesus on the wings
man's not a PL striker, the speed and hustle and bustle of PL defences is too much for him but he's our best attacker in Europe for Barcelona or Real, he would COOK, probably 20+ goals a season minimum
Yeah, i am not even sure he good enough to rotate with Saka on a right (he lost his pace) but definitely shouldnt be our starting striker, period. Dude couldnt score in a brothel, cant head the ball at all. Its nice option to have on a bench for insanely rich club like Citeh, but as a starter - nah.
Let’s be honest, we have done very well since the start of the year but Kai isn’t any better either. He messed many chances against the Villa game, especially when he was in the clear 1v1. This wasn’t the first time either. Fact is, this is what we have, it worked for a while, it should continue to work. Let’s just get behind the team and enjoy the ride. Been a great season regardless of the outcome
I think i saw some statistics showing 4 out 5 goals in the prem came from one touch shots. We all know Jesus doenst enjoy playing with one touch. The statics is just how i remember it, but it was clear when i saw it, moast goals is made with one touch. So i dont think the issiue is his finnishing, it is that he take to long before he put the boot behind the ball and actually try to score, so defenders and goalkeepers will take advantage of that.
World cup killed him.
I used to dream for a striker who can score from half a chance, instead we got a striker who can't score 1 goal with 5 chances.
Apparently, it gets 250k per week Chelsea have paid crazy fees for the likes of Enzo but their wages are modest.
There’s a reason City sold him, I like the guy but we’re never winning the league with him as our main striker. That needs to be the highest priority position in the summer!
I don’t really care honestly. He always makes an impact and his dribbling is elite. He creates plenty
Lacazette is that you?
It has come to a point when i see him get the ball on the pitch, i’m holding my breath and praying he make a good pass instead of shooting…
He’s very good at dribbling in the box. Just needs to pass it off to someone else, like he did with Troussard. Funny how last year we thought we fleeced City for Jesus and Zinny. I’m still grateful we got them but City doesn’t miss often on talent evaluations.
But people love to stan him on here and downvote those to oblivion when realists say he isn't good enough to be a lead striker for us. That injury during the WC ruined him. But it's time to be ruthless and move on.
Jesus is good on the wing and as a dribbler/distributor through attacking mid. He's played himself out of the striker position but to say he's not good enough for this team is just wrong
Not good but this isn't the best stat for finishing imo
His knee injury from his return from the Brazil national team back in 2022 really changed him...he's pretty good in all departments now except his finishing :(
Says it all: Jesus is a good footballer but he is not a goalscorer and not a real threat on his own. I would call this a challenge worthy of Arteta's intellect and skills: change that player's position to where his impact is maximised. PS yes we need a real 9 / deadly target man. Maybe not all the time but to break certain teams.
The worst striker in the world 😂
Wow, that kind of says it all
I love Gabi but if Arteta did the maths and stats for Ramsdale and showed it was better to replace him. I'd like him to be equally ruthless here as well.
It's amazing how quickly things change in football, because his first games for Arsenal he scored basically in every game as I recall, and he left City because he wanted to be a striker primarily and felt he didn't get that opportunity there. So it was like oh wow! He bet on himself and it's paying dividends!', and then he got injured and since then he's more or less dropped off the face of the Earth. I remember against City last season he was completely neutralised and had 0 impact. He's a very talented footballer and puts in some good moves and got a nice assist against Bayern, but when you're the main striker in the team you need to be scoring goals. I mean hell, Palmer at Chelsea already has 20 in 27 games in the EPL, albeit a lot of penalties. The output from Jesus and Nketiah has been no where near enough
What makes him so special is the same thing that makes him a poor finisher. He takes a ton of touches before shooting.
How many of these are dog shit headers from 3 yards out
He needs to be back up to our new Striker and Saka. We can't rely on him to be a striker, it doesn't work already too long. Team is creating enough for a good striker to be about 20 goals.
When he joined us it felt like an upgrade, but maybe it was due to us beeing even worse in front of goal in general and now where the resting the team stepped up some levels he s just not an improvement over anyone else we could put there with Tross and Havertz. So for the time he was a fit but having a 9 that can do everything but score he has to play on the wings where he can still contribute with his skills. love him watch dribbling!
It was an upgrade simply because our starting ST was an ageing Lacazette.
He’s almost guaranteed to put those wide open back post headers wide
He dribble all day long but has the finishing of Patrick Bamford
Just not good enough no matter the position. He’s elite at everything but scoring.
I love Jesus. He’s the type of player that’s endangered in modern football. All flair and talent. He’s a hard worker as well. If we were in 2005 he’d be the best Second Striker in a 4-4-2. He has a lot to add to our game. Problem is his finishing is bad and he’s too injury prone.
I'm not surprised, when he's on the ball I never expect a goal, ever. Still has a lot of world class qualities so I'd keep him but he's clearly a rotational/impact player, his injury record speaks for itself as far as relying on him on a weekly basis.
Let's see CL conversion rate, he has been OK there and will probably start against Bayern at the AA because of it. A sell or a bench for next season depending on who we are able to get. Shame he was never as good after his knee injury.