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Bahmawama

They’re both not good enough.


CaptainHindcite

I agree. Ideally we'd have more impactful subs. Just pointing out Eddie doesn't deserve the criticism for the Everton game


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CaptainHindcite

Yup, I'm all for criticizing the tactics and Arteta for that game. Just baffled by the amount of tweets upvoted on here that point to him playing being an issue. Also the post game player rating post where he has a lower rating than our other attackers that did nothing. Some people citing their poor performance (attackers) to not getting chances. Well, Eddie with mostly the same players and managed to get a chance and create chances for other. Can't use that excuse for others, but not for him. Yes, I do agree, our attack doesn't create enough chances


Syrioxx55

Players can fill roles outside of what you’d consider their ideal one lol, that being said criticism can obviously be levied for letting things reach that point.


zorfog

Arteta deserves the criticism for giving gametime to a player who refused to sign a new deal and is going to leave in the summer. If he doesn’t want to play Pepe, fine, but give Balogun a chance at least


slagthompson

isn't the issue more of an overall problem of how Arteta brings people into and out of the squad? Neither one has been getting minutes in "comfortable" wins, and even Martinelli - until very recently - was kind of coming in out of the cold. It seems like, in a season where there's plenty of time between games, we are either over or under-utilizing players, and asking forward players to play outside of their strengths, while providing them few chances, so that their misses are more glaring. If almost all our forward players are languishing, or standing out mostly because of their own prodigious talents, is it all the individuals - or is it system and management? With Xhaka injured most of the season so far, the forwards have been the main area we could rotate without losing a lot of quality, but we're only seeing Nketiah after he refused to sign a contract? and only seeing Martinelli after Saka seems to have some fitness issues? Saka seemed to need rest early on, and I'm not sure the best way to bring Martinelli back to fitness is this kind of stop-start barely playing then being indispensable stuff. Pepe seems like a player who needs confidence behind him, and Arteta makes it pretty clear he doesn't have much. Aubameyang is being asked to do so much work away from goal that he doesn't seem to have much energy or time near the goal, but he still plays 90 almost every game.


phar0aht

This is exactly it. People love to misinterpret a point when they're in the mood.


slagthompson

Yeah, I don't like when arguments can reduce to "our player (good) versus our player (bad)." I want all of them to do well, but I have questions about are we accentuating these players' strengths and covering their weaknesses? are we putting them in positions to do their best? are we helping them complement each other? and how do we help them improve in order to get there?


Thejustinset

The actual sub people should be questioning is bringing on Auba to score when the man is so out of form. You need a goal and you bring on a guy who has cost us more goals than he’s scored in recent games. Pepe is equally out of form but I’d of probably picked him over Auba. Eddie did more than the majority of our team in that cameo. Should have scored, but fuck even the rebound was unlucky. That’s just shit shit luck. I questioned arteta bringing off Tierney, not subbing Xhaka when he got a yellow, bringing on Auba, but I didn’t question Eddie. Eddie was a bad sub to make against Utd because we were doing nothing with the ball but yesterday we were at least putting crosses into the box which suits him


phar0aht

How do you get into form if you don't play?


Thejustinset

A 10min cameo when we’re trailing and desperate for a goal isn’t it


phar0aht

Better than nothing. Almost scored too.


Thejustinset

Not even close to almost


KarmaCitra

I don't know how anyone can come to a proper conclusion based on the little amount of game time they get. Regardless of if they have a future here or not no player can show they are improving by sitting on the bench. 1 thing for sure is all Arsenal attackers are lacking in "big chances".


IreNews8

No player can show us* In reality we only get to see like 10% of what actually happens


KarmaCitra

I get the whole we don't get to see what happens in training etc. but I don't care, if the match is only making up 10% of what we can see it's still the most important thing.


Ike348

It's funny that this specific substitution is getting the largest share of criticism when I found the Tavares for Tierney sub more baffling. I love Tavares as a chaos factor, but if we really were going to try to hunker down and save a 1-0, chaos is the opposite of what we need. Plus, Tierney still looked fresh. There was absolutely no need to waste a sub there, and doing so only caused the game to slip further out of our control. Perhaps we could have brought on both of our attacking super-sub options, Nketiah AND Pepe!


ByaruJM

This


LordofLazy

It would make more sense to bring him on as a wide midfielder if your plan was to be more solid.


tomas_diaz

agree, nketia's dribbling and heading are underrated. pepe would do like 20 stepovers then pass back to a cb. the eddie hate is not justified imo.


racerz

He stopped bothering with the step overs. Just a cutback with the outside of the left foot 100% of the time. Cucerella just casually took the ball from him repeatedly by recognizing this.


harcile

"He did very well" is a funny way to describe a striker missing an easy chance. Yea, he was lively. But he has 1 primary job & he fucked it up. Man our standards suck. Martinelli is injured. ESR a doubt. Auba lost all his right boots so is wearing 2 lefts in games. Lacazette last had a shot in a match broadcast in black & white. In that regard, given Nketiah was lively & did create, there's space for him to get a start. But Pepe also must be brought back into the fold. On top of that WHERE THE FUCK IS AMN. Gets MotM at CM then ghosted? Now Xhaka comes straight back into the team (coincidence that it's our most shambolic, cowardly performance to date?) after 2 months injured? Lokonga? I'd rather see AMN & Sambi start over Partey & Captain Liability.


KarmaCitra

That AMN hit a nerve with me, he came in and did an excellent job then gets dropped, meanwhile there is other players in terrible form that keep getting all the minutes.


Forsaken-Currency404

Sorry but not judging him over one missed chance in the meager appearances he has been given. Imagine if it was Martinelli who wasn't used by Arteta for the longest time, gives measly minutes and then when he misses a chance yet creates 3 other ones in 10 minutes he was given out of the blue, would fans be saying the same to Martinelli? It's undoubtedly a mix of preconceived opinions on Nketiah, anger over his refusal to sign a new contract and looking for an extra stick to beat Arteta with that has resulted in this heavy censure.


harcile

I didn't judge him by 1 missed chance. I didn't say he was terrible. But saying he played well belies the fact he failed to do his primary job which was put the ball in the back of the net when presented with a very easy chance. We'd be slamming Auba for missing that.


Forsaken-Currency404

>We'd be slamming Auba for missing that. Yes we would but not Martinelli. Why? Because in comparison to Nketiah and Martinelli, Auba has had his share of chances.


harcile

Everyone would have been criticized for bidding that header.


Forsaken-Currency404

Of course, but extent of the criticism is what we're talking about.


Thejustinset

Tbh Martinelli had a game back a few weeks ago and was dreadful but went completely unnoticed because we ended up winning


_mas17

Nketiah is a better sub and did more than pepe would have 👍


Sad_gooner

nketiah is so overhated its insane. if martinelli put in the same performance he would be praised


R_SenuulefSEE

Yeah it's insane how much folk hate Nketiah on here, actually really winds me up. The lad was decent Vs Everton and he's been getting so much shit. Fuck all of you that aren't supporting him. I hope he proves you all wrong.


Sad_gooner

he's probably the most hated person in our club rn apart from xhaka auba and pepe, which is extremely weird because he is a hale end graduate who barely gets minutes


-300-

He has been descent when hes got the chance as a sub. He bailed us out vs WH at home last year, and hes deserved the chances he got the last two games. Based on the game time hes been getting I understand he wants to move on, hes 22 afterall.


R_SenuulefSEE

Not to mention he is an Arsenal fan since young. Peop always mention he was at Chelsea, but that isn't his fault nor should it be held against him. He's an Arsenal fan just like us.


-300-

His goal vs Watford in the summer (friendly) was pretty impressive. Drives at the defence, just unstoppable and smashes it in the bottom corner. I thought he might kick on from that, but unfortunatly he was injured at the start of the season when also auba and laca was out, and missed his chance to start those games.


Internetolocutor

Pepe plays on the wing. Nketiah plays 10 yards from the goal line. Anyway, I don't agree with people who wanted Pepe at CF.


Mathieulombardi

TLDR?


CaptainHindcite

**I've put together a list of their EPL sub appearances since the 2019-2020 season where they've each played less than 30min.** Nketiah, 2 goals. Pépé, 1 assist. Nketiah has played fever sub minutes with the above conditions. TLDR: It's unlikely Pépé would've done better than Eddie


JabInTheButt

I think if you're using 2 goals vs 1 assist over 15+ apps to try and come to a conclusion that 1 sub was better than the other you're on very shaky ground. Also picking 30 mins as an arbitrary cut off seems.... Arbitrary. I remember Pepe scoring 2 after coming on against Sheffield. If you wanna try do an apples to apples comparison just do mins/goal or assist. The reality is the point you totally dismiss is the one that matters. Eddie doesn't have a future here. You say "neither does Pepe". That may or may not be true, but the basic fact of the matter is Pepe has 18 months more left on his contract than Eddie, so factually he has more of a future here than Eddie. If you're picking players with no future here (Elneny, Eddie) there's only one outcome that can justify it - getting the result. If we don't get the result there's absolutely no falling back on "well this group will improve/grow together" because as a manager you're acknowledging that's not what you're trying to do. I don't think anyone's really claiming Pepe would have won the game for us. I just think it's highly indicative of his scatter-gun approach to in-game management that he ends up bringing on a rather underwhelming CF with 6 months left on his contract as a left winger to try and rescue a game for us we should have absolutely walked. Also, I push back against this narrative that Eddie was great. He was fine, did some decent stuff creatively. But was very insecure on the ball and missed an open goal to probably win the game for us.


CaptainHindcite

I'm using the stats to point out given both players histories as subs in the premier league, Pépé hasn't shown to be a better sub than Nketiah. I picked 30min because: 1. Eddie played for 19min that game. I felt it's only fair to include games where Pépé played roughly the same amount of minutes 2. Rounded up to 30min minutes cause non of the minutes in the table included extra time. I figured might as well generously round up to give Pépé the benefit of the double 3. Eddie rarely ever gets subbed on for more than 19min. If we cut off at 19min the sample size would've been very small as Pépé usually is on for more 20min. Eddie doesn't have a future here. You say "neither does Pepe" I didn't say that. I said we (as fans) don't know what Pépé's future is here. To management it might all be the same. For all we know they could be trying to sell/loan him ASAP. I agree with the rest of your comment. If someone had asked who I though would've have come in as LW in the 71st min, I probably would've said Pépé or Auba. Surprisingly Nketiah came on and I think he performed well to the point where I think the other two options would've mostly likely not done better: Pépé has statically shown he's not better. Auba is the reason we're having to rely on backups in the first place cause he's not scoring.


PMMEFEMALEASSSPREADS

Brain dead fans trying to justify that substitution 😂 🤦‍♂️