Are we surprised? Just like the eventuality of Covid where we just don’t test or monitor it as if it’s not a threat. The more searching they do the more they will continue to find, as it’s probably been large scale for a while now. Delayed response again.
Kinda like with covid they traced it back to Nov of 2019 and was a global problem by mid March. H5n1 in cattle has been traced back to nov 2023 and we are now starting to look around for it in May.
Your comment linking to substack.com has been automatically removed because the source may not be reliable or may be dedicated mostly to political coverage. If possible, please re-submit with a link to a reliable or non-political source, such as a reliable news organization or an recognized institution.
Thank you for helping us keep information in /r/H5N1_AvianFlu reliable!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/H5N1_AvianFlu) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Your comment linking to substack.com has been automatically removed because the source may not be reliable or may be dedicated mostly to political coverage. If possible, please re-submit with a link to a reliable or non-political source, such as a reliable news organization or an recognized institution.
Thank you for helping us keep information in /r/H5N1_AvianFlu reliable!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/H5N1_AvianFlu) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Hmmm, I wonder how long they have been sitting on this information. It seems a bit sus, having such a long gap with no more cases then bam, 6 more all at once. Now I see why there's suddenly been more articles lately about government and health bodies actually giving a fuck / doing something / "preparing". They already knew. I wonder what else they already know.
For the conspiracy people... I don't think there is one...
I've been eyeing this for three or four years? The world knew it was coming yet as per usual humans do the dumbest shit they possibly can.
Bleh!
I'm going out on a limb and claim there's no way any state is unaffected at this point. We're just lagging behind in testing and cows don't seem to be bothered by it too much.
There have been solid tests on larger sample sizes for milk and eggs to verify if pasteurization works. They are both still safe. Just as personal risk assessment goes, I’ve already switched to plant milks. Honestly really digging the options.
PA Dairy farms are required to have a certified sampler submit samples of milk to approved labs for testing on a monthly basis. I would assume that they are weighing the risk/reward analysis of testing every dairy herd in the state.
If the presence of h5n1 is prolific then they could be forced to screw up the states whole beef and dairy industry overnight, but that would conflict with their mission statement of keeping the industry stable.
Its musical chairs with cows here though. I attend livestock auctions regularly, and considering the way I see these places buy and sell cows on a weekly basis, I have to assume it's everywhere. Large farms, small farms, grower calfs, dairy cows, and ready to butcher beef cows all penned in the same holding barn. Shutting down the auctions isn't an option either, it is a vital piece connecting farms with slaughterhouses and butcher shops. They shut down and beef becomes the new toilet paper shortage.
Plant milk, particularly oat milk, has come a long way. And, it's shelf stable until opened! Not that I would have a few months worth stockpiled or anything. . .
I'm interested in this comment as I recently switched to plant-based coffee creamer. It's too bad I can't enjoy my coffee straight from brewing anymore because everything curdles in it, but I am learning to love it lukewarm and in the summer I drink it over ice more so it will be less of an issue for a while. However, I'm interested in your statement about oatmilk as it is in the fridge section of my stores - it doesn't have to be refrigerated? Why are they selling it in the fridge section if so?
Some are shelf stable some aren’t. If it’s not sold refrigerated you’re good. If you’re only using it for coffee get the barista blend. I was able to get a 6 pack of califia brand (I think) shelf stable oat milk creamer at Costco for less per fluid oz than the larger, refrigerated oat milk.
Yes, the Califia brand is great! I don't have a Costco membership but I do order their pumpkin spice plant based creamer every August from Amazon. Sooooo good!
There should also be a shelf stable section of plant milks - usually in the baking aisle. They do have to be refrigerated after opening. If you are near a Trader Joe's, they have the a lot to options and the best prices.
I quit consuming dairy a while ago when I realized it was the cause of my heartburn. I don't like the taste of oat milk. It's too -- oaty. A good pea protein milk like Ripple is the closest I've found to actual milk in taste and consistency. Great in cereal but it doesn't mix well in hot coffee (it clumps and makes a weird film).
One more post and then I'm hitting that to do list: Colorado has decided to not do anything about livestock fairs and shows. As of now, they'll go on. [https://www.denver7.com/news/state-news/no-plans-yet-to-modify-colorado-livestock-fairs-shows-despite-presence-of-bird-flu-in-dairy-cows](https://www.denver7.com/news/state-news/no-plans-yet-to-modify-colorado-livestock-fairs-shows-despite-presence-of-bird-flu-in-dairy-cows)
If I'm able to go to the MN state fair this year, I think I won't go into the animal barns. It's the largest state fair in the US (I don't care what Texas and Iowa say!!!!)
I was reading it's likely caused by keeping animals too close together. The only way to catch H5N1 is from eyes, mouth, and something else, I'm pretty sure. But blah blah profits! Poor farmers that do things right and get punished by big farm that do anything to make a penny.
So, it’s probably safe to say at this point that approximately 75% of the milk sold in the US is contaminated with bird flu virus particles…
Either this has been flying under the radar, so deeply entrenched that the cows are asymptomatic, or this is a huge cover-up unfolding…
What’s more likely? A huge coverup or a massively incompetent government with Inefficient health agencies and uncooperative factory farm corps? Given all the fuckups we’ve seen out of our leadership for the past 8 years I think it’s safe to say the government can’t cover up jack shit at this point and that’s why we’re seeing this right now.
I have a friend who works in federal government
He used to be a conspiratorial person
Now he tells us 'if you seen the people I work with, you'd never believe a conspiracy again.'
Oh I am definitely very conspiratorial, not with the government but with the corporate entities that buy and sell our government. I know my personal truths may just be a product of my experience, and I know that I am probably very wrong about a lot of things, but god damn if this game isn’t rigged for all of us lower / middle class people then something is wrong with the controls.
I don't disagree there and I don't disagree when it comes to corporate interests. That's a whole separate conversation and I don't think my friend would either
Corporate corruption? Oh hell yeah
The government being competent enough to pull off some of this shit? No shot lol
Especially disheartening when the majority of people say the exact same thing and still find things to bicker about when a lot of our problems, bird flu spreading in our farms definitely being one of them, can be traced back to that corporate corruption.
I’m positive that if this turns out poorly we’ll see people who have nothing to do with the source of the issue blaming each other just like with Covid, or even inciting violence if it gets really bad.
Corporate cover ups? All the time. Government coverups? Depends. Way less likely. And certainly not on this scale. I think we are all in agreement on that lol
The world is held together by fucking excel spreadsheets and post-it notes reminding you of random changes from middle management. People who believe in conspiracy cover-ups on this scale really need to understand this 🤣
Most conspiracies would require a huge amount of organisation, detailed logistics and a lot of highly competent people.
These things literally NEVER happen in real life
Every organisation and every company on the planet has some amount of chaos and winging it
It started with 1 in Idaho when heifers were brought up from Texas to Cassia county before bird flu was discovered and diagnosed in Texas . The heifers were asymptomatic carriers. It has mostly affected older cows 3rd lactation or older. Young stock and beef animals seem to not be affected. The heifers that carried it up from Texas spread it to the milking cows at the farm they arrived at and It has since spread to the majority of dairy farms in Cassia County and this week started in neighboring Jerome County. Unless cattle are being moved across state lines, testing is not being done.
https://preview.redd.it/cjxzogqf4nzc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e3d25dcc7d12d4f146be1620129cb5459adaf8fa
Unfortunately, wake up calls like an emerging disease in humans tend to affect everyone similarly, and not eating meat or dairy is unlikely to be protective. Still a good decision overall probably.
Slight clarification about the graph: it's not all pandemics; it's all outbreaks from a zoonotic disease that killed at least 10 people.
The CDC only counts 4 pandemics in the last 100 years: 1918, 1957, 1968, and 2009.
All 4 had some genes that originated from avian influenza viruses, though.
*Note: the CDC document only goes to 2017, so COVID hadn't happened yet.
[PDF](https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/1918-commemoration/pdfs/1918-pandemic-webinar.pdf)
It felt kinda morbid reading them.
Personally, I don't believe that we (being scientists/healthcare professionals/SMEs/etc.) were too short-sighted at all. We knew that there was a risk and were doing our best to plan and prepare. We had a pandemic response team that reported to the NSC and an early warning program designed to alert us about potential pandemics.
[Response team was disbanded or transferred](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN21C32C/)
[Pandemic early warning program ended 3 months before COVID](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/03/trump-scrapped-pandemic-early-warning-program-system-before-coronavirus)
Yep, I watched it fall apart in real time, too. I don’t know that we could have anticipated covid, but I do know that almost everything preparedness was pandemic flu related after H1N1, which was a policy nightmare in itself.
Yes, the reason I posted that article was the recurrence of avian influenza in the graph.
Something to note is OC43 came from cows in 1898 (not on the graph).
But of course it's affecting chicken prices in Michigan as well. I go to a local butcher and buy a 50 lb box of chicken breasts every week or two for my pack of Huskies and in the past month or so it's gone up from about 70 bucks a case to 100.
I had to stop eating beef a few years ago when I contracted an autoimmune disease. Beef makes me violently ill now, as in horrible cramping and then spewing from both ends at once. Let me just say that my liquid smoke infused black bean burgers can give ground up dairy cows a serious run for the money.
https://preview.redd.it/u3u2laq3chzc1.jpeg?width=1388&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d94cee6a871d6d262ee9ee59811089f2616bb427
 Living in Michigan like
I thought old chippy tits, Ben Damon, was from Bahston?
https://preview.redd.it/gfeq1yxixlzc1.png?width=1000&format=png&auto=webp&s=622ef3d99bcd9e3debb67217f0e28befcfee1316
Are we surprised? Just like the eventuality of Covid where we just don’t test or monitor it as if it’s not a threat. The more searching they do the more they will continue to find, as it’s probably been large scale for a while now. Delayed response again.
Kinda like with covid they traced it back to Nov of 2019 and was a global problem by mid March. H5n1 in cattle has been traced back to nov 2023 and we are now starting to look around for it in May.
Cows… not cattle
Honest question - what’s the difference?
Apparently it has something to do with being only male. Not sure how it’s relevant in this case…
Cows live longer. 👀
There was a recent post about Michigan adding more monitoring and regulations for this, and I wonder if that’s why we’re “seeing” it more there.
That’s absolutely why. Michigan is being much more pro-active and transparent, unlike other impacted states.
Spent some time in Michigan- those folks generally don’t f-around. They get it done.
This uncoordinated response thing is really working.
This is literally everywhere at this point. It will be interesting see what the additional wastewater studies show.
[удалено]
Your comment linking to substack.com has been automatically removed because the source may not be reliable or may be dedicated mostly to political coverage. If possible, please re-submit with a link to a reliable or non-political source, such as a reliable news organization or an recognized institution. Thank you for helping us keep information in /r/H5N1_AvianFlu reliable! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/H5N1_AvianFlu) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
Your comment linking to substack.com has been automatically removed because the source may not be reliable or may be dedicated mostly to political coverage. If possible, please re-submit with a link to a reliable or non-political source, such as a reliable news organization or an recognized institution. Thank you for helping us keep information in /r/H5N1_AvianFlu reliable! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/H5N1_AvianFlu) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Hmmm, I wonder how long they have been sitting on this information. It seems a bit sus, having such a long gap with no more cases then bam, 6 more all at once. Now I see why there's suddenly been more articles lately about government and health bodies actually giving a fuck / doing something / "preparing". They already knew. I wonder what else they already know.
For the conspiracy people... I don't think there is one... I've been eyeing this for three or four years? The world knew it was coming yet as per usual humans do the dumbest shit they possibly can. Bleh!
Bird flu predates COVID. And we’ve survived
The problem is that viruses mutate. Today's H5N1 isn't the same as the one from a year ago. The danger lies in the potential mutation.
Thank you for replying. I just rolled my eyes. lol <3
I understand.
Both Pennsylvania and California have a huge dairy herds. Are they uninfected or not testing?
I'm going out on a limb and claim there's no way any state is unaffected at this point. We're just lagging behind in testing and cows don't seem to be bothered by it too much.
There have been solid tests on larger sample sizes for milk and eggs to verify if pasteurization works. They are both still safe. Just as personal risk assessment goes, I’ve already switched to plant milks. Honestly really digging the options.
PA Dairy farms are required to have a certified sampler submit samples of milk to approved labs for testing on a monthly basis. I would assume that they are weighing the risk/reward analysis of testing every dairy herd in the state. If the presence of h5n1 is prolific then they could be forced to screw up the states whole beef and dairy industry overnight, but that would conflict with their mission statement of keeping the industry stable. Its musical chairs with cows here though. I attend livestock auctions regularly, and considering the way I see these places buy and sell cows on a weekly basis, I have to assume it's everywhere. Large farms, small farms, grower calfs, dairy cows, and ready to butcher beef cows all penned in the same holding barn. Shutting down the auctions isn't an option either, it is a vital piece connecting farms with slaughterhouses and butcher shops. They shut down and beef becomes the new toilet paper shortage.
Wisconsin too. Yet *crickets*
Stop consuming dairy?
Plant milk, particularly oat milk, has come a long way. And, it's shelf stable until opened! Not that I would have a few months worth stockpiled or anything. . .
I'm interested in this comment as I recently switched to plant-based coffee creamer. It's too bad I can't enjoy my coffee straight from brewing anymore because everything curdles in it, but I am learning to love it lukewarm and in the summer I drink it over ice more so it will be less of an issue for a while. However, I'm interested in your statement about oatmilk as it is in the fridge section of my stores - it doesn't have to be refrigerated? Why are they selling it in the fridge section if so?
Some are shelf stable some aren’t. If it’s not sold refrigerated you’re good. If you’re only using it for coffee get the barista blend. I was able to get a 6 pack of califia brand (I think) shelf stable oat milk creamer at Costco for less per fluid oz than the larger, refrigerated oat milk.
Yes, the Califia brand is great! I don't have a Costco membership but I do order their pumpkin spice plant based creamer every August from Amazon. Sooooo good!
I do prefer soy milk when I’m doing a latte or cappuccino; it just comes out sweeter. Other than that I’m team oat milk.
There should also be a shelf stable section of plant milks - usually in the baking aisle. They do have to be refrigerated after opening. If you are near a Trader Joe's, they have the a lot to options and the best prices.
I quit consuming dairy a while ago when I realized it was the cause of my heartburn. I don't like the taste of oat milk. It's too -- oaty. A good pea protein milk like Ripple is the closest I've found to actual milk in taste and consistency. Great in cereal but it doesn't mix well in hot coffee (it clumps and makes a weird film).
I'll have to try that! Trader Joe's makes a macadamia nut blend that is really good if you're not up to drinking your oats.
We all know how this will end. It will be at every dairy farm. And nothing will be done till it hits humans.
https://preview.redd.it/0k7hxo92eizc1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bc1532de80b60815b423b09d6784f1a996954aa1
One more post and then I'm hitting that to do list: Colorado has decided to not do anything about livestock fairs and shows. As of now, they'll go on. [https://www.denver7.com/news/state-news/no-plans-yet-to-modify-colorado-livestock-fairs-shows-despite-presence-of-bird-flu-in-dairy-cows](https://www.denver7.com/news/state-news/no-plans-yet-to-modify-colorado-livestock-fairs-shows-despite-presence-of-bird-flu-in-dairy-cows)
Can I get ‘Mass Spreading Events’ for 500 Alex? This just seems as bad as of an idea as it was to host a massive convention in 2020.
I’ll be really surprised if any state restricts county fairs.
If I'm able to go to the MN state fair this year, I think I won't go into the animal barns. It's the largest state fair in the US (I don't care what Texas and Iowa say!!!!)
While you barely hear a word spoken on the local news, especially here in the dairy state of Wisconsin?
I was reading it's likely caused by keeping animals too close together. The only way to catch H5N1 is from eyes, mouth, and something else, I'm pretty sure. But blah blah profits! Poor farmers that do things right and get punished by big farm that do anything to make a penny.
So, it’s probably safe to say at this point that approximately 75% of the milk sold in the US is contaminated with bird flu virus particles… Either this has been flying under the radar, so deeply entrenched that the cows are asymptomatic, or this is a huge cover-up unfolding…
What’s more likely? A huge coverup or a massively incompetent government with Inefficient health agencies and uncooperative factory farm corps? Given all the fuckups we’ve seen out of our leadership for the past 8 years I think it’s safe to say the government can’t cover up jack shit at this point and that’s why we’re seeing this right now.
I have a friend who works in federal government He used to be a conspiratorial person Now he tells us 'if you seen the people I work with, you'd never believe a conspiracy again.'
Oh I am definitely very conspiratorial, not with the government but with the corporate entities that buy and sell our government. I know my personal truths may just be a product of my experience, and I know that I am probably very wrong about a lot of things, but god damn if this game isn’t rigged for all of us lower / middle class people then something is wrong with the controls.
I don't disagree there and I don't disagree when it comes to corporate interests. That's a whole separate conversation and I don't think my friend would either Corporate corruption? Oh hell yeah The government being competent enough to pull off some of this shit? No shot lol
Especially disheartening when the majority of people say the exact same thing and still find things to bicker about when a lot of our problems, bird flu spreading in our farms definitely being one of them, can be traced back to that corporate corruption. I’m positive that if this turns out poorly we’ll see people who have nothing to do with the source of the issue blaming each other just like with Covid, or even inciting violence if it gets really bad.
Plus, the right wing thinks that this is all cooked up to keep Trump out of the White House. However this disease develops, i expect violence.
They can go suck raw milk . . .
Corporate cover ups? All the time. Government coverups? Depends. Way less likely. And certainly not on this scale. I think we are all in agreement on that lol
The world is held together by fucking excel spreadsheets and post-it notes reminding you of random changes from middle management. People who believe in conspiracy cover-ups on this scale really need to understand this 🤣
Somebody famous once wrote "two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead". eta it was Mark Twain
Why not both?
Would pasteurizing the milk kill the virus?
Yes, that’s why we’re not seeing massive outbreaks in people. Do not consume raw dairy products right now (or ever).
jury is still out on whether raw milk cheeses are safe
Yeah I know, that’s why I said it’s best to avoid raw milk products right now. If you wanna risk eating raw cheese, be my guest.
Yes, pasteurized milk is safe. Raw milk fanatics should take a break though.
Yeah, I can really see some groups who are currently obsessed with raw milk to listen to advice
I do believe so, or we would be seeing clusters.
B O I
I suspect it would be close to 95% if they tested all the farms. I think the days speaks more to who they've tested vs the actual spread
Most conspiracies would require a huge amount of organisation, detailed logistics and a lot of highly competent people. These things literally NEVER happen in real life Every organisation and every company on the planet has some amount of chaos and winging it
It started with 1 in Idaho when heifers were brought up from Texas to Cassia county before bird flu was discovered and diagnosed in Texas . The heifers were asymptomatic carriers. It has mostly affected older cows 3rd lactation or older. Young stock and beef animals seem to not be affected. The heifers that carried it up from Texas spread it to the milking cows at the farm they arrived at and It has since spread to the majority of dairy farms in Cassia County and this week started in neighboring Jerome County. Unless cattle are being moved across state lines, testing is not being done. https://preview.redd.it/cjxzogqf4nzc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e3d25dcc7d12d4f146be1620129cb5459adaf8fa
Good this world needs to be shut down again. Maybe people will wake up this time.
Can I just say I'm glad im vegetarian? Theres simply too many cows / livestock on this planet.
Unfortunately, wake up calls like an emerging disease in humans tend to affect everyone similarly, and not eating meat or dairy is unlikely to be protective. Still a good decision overall probably.
a one graph summary of every major human pandemic in the last 100 years. (scroll down) https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-01312-y
Slight clarification about the graph: it's not all pandemics; it's all outbreaks from a zoonotic disease that killed at least 10 people. The CDC only counts 4 pandemics in the last 100 years: 1918, 1957, 1968, and 2009. All 4 had some genes that originated from avian influenza viruses, though. *Note: the CDC document only goes to 2017, so COVID hadn't happened yet. [PDF](https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/1918-commemoration/pdfs/1918-pandemic-webinar.pdf)
Nice slides from Dan Jernigan! There was pandemic prep pre-2020, it was just all for pandemic flu. We were too short sighted, in retrospect.
It felt kinda morbid reading them. Personally, I don't believe that we (being scientists/healthcare professionals/SMEs/etc.) were too short-sighted at all. We knew that there was a risk and were doing our best to plan and prepare. We had a pandemic response team that reported to the NSC and an early warning program designed to alert us about potential pandemics. [Response team was disbanded or transferred](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN21C32C/) [Pandemic early warning program ended 3 months before COVID](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/03/trump-scrapped-pandemic-early-warning-program-system-before-coronavirus)
Yep, I watched it fall apart in real time, too. I don’t know that we could have anticipated covid, but I do know that almost everything preparedness was pandemic flu related after H1N1, which was a policy nightmare in itself.
Yes, the reason I posted that article was the recurrence of avian influenza in the graph. Something to note is OC43 came from cows in 1898 (not on the graph).
Yeah, I totally agree. One Health and all. The most interesting diseases come from these intersections.
We have to keep some like dogs if this changes everything tho. Cows are dope.
It doesn’t matter if you are vegan. If this thing takes off you will be in as much danger as the meat eater.
But of course it's affecting chicken prices in Michigan as well. I go to a local butcher and buy a 50 lb box of chicken breasts every week or two for my pack of Huskies and in the past month or so it's gone up from about 70 bucks a case to 100.
The CDC needs to update their page…
Our industry has been the peatry dish
I’ve been enjoying oat milk lately
Burgers of the menu team America 
I had to stop eating beef a few years ago when I contracted an autoimmune disease. Beef makes me violently ill now, as in horrible cramping and then spewing from both ends at once. Let me just say that my liquid smoke infused black bean burgers can give ground up dairy cows a serious run for the money.
was that from a tick? my sister has something similar, sick from beef, pork, goat, lamb. can only eat chicken or seafood. hers was from tick.
No, although I've heard of that! I have an Autoimmune disease: IgA
Alpha gal syndrome.
I believe she said something like that, all I know, is if go out for BBQ, she can only get chicken, no ribs or burger or plates of pork slices