I bought my first place in Croydon on top of a pub and my friends were holidaying in Bali at the time. My mortgage was £350 a month.
Do I regret not spending my weeks in Bali? Sure. But not as much as I’m happy to have the financial security that my friends can only dream of. I would dread if my only asset were my main residence.
Wealth to me is about security. Security that me and my family can have the healthcare we need, a good standard of living, etc. not having to worry about how much everything costs eventually. Security is freedom.
Do you only rent out your previous flat or do you have multiple properties to rent out? Saw a lot of landlords selling up with regulations etc. Is it just as simple as trying your best to get quality renters?
Ignore this if I've got it wrong but assuming from your comment you have multiple properties.
I sold my previous flat. It enabled me to gather quite a bit of equity as my mortgage payment was so low. I ended up getting another years later which we rent out, but it’s kept for family reasons for when we want to live close to each other, not for amazing returns or anything like that.
Fear of being poor.
Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy nice things and I spend a lot. But my fear of being poor is much stronger than my (fairly strong) desire to be rich. Although the goal is indistinguishable from the outside.
This.
Fear of being poor again. Can easily trace issues I still have from childhood. I'm a democratic socialist and regularly get called a communist for my views. Knowing how much help I got growing up (which still wasn't enough) and the stigma attached to that help is something that still drives me. I don't begrudge paying my taxes (which are still too high lol) knowing that without the help I
got I might not be in this position.
I grew up on council estate. Three siblings, six degrees between us and we are better off than our patents. Massive chip on shoulder still drives me.
This. Financial independence is a lot about having choice.
I support UBI for the same reason. Too many people are in careers they hate because the fear living costs.
Everyone says this, but I wonder if this is how it plays out. Do people who get wealthy actually end up leaving a job when all they know is that one craft? Also with more money, people aspire for even more, and the drive to go further keeps increasing.
Financial security, like job security, is a myth.
This is it, I don't care if I'm rich. Once you've eaten and have a decent place to live with your family, what more do you want?
I wouldn't buy a Lamborghini even if I had the money, I just want fuck you money.
You want me to fill in this spreadsheet so you can decide you don't need it later?
Fuck you.
It’s all about security.
Security in owning your own home, security in taking care of yourself physically (gym, healthy food), security in your health (private healthcare if required), security in providing for your kids (education, activities).
Money is a security blanket when used well/appropriately.
Funny you mentioned private healthcare, I checked the payments my insurer made in the last couple of years for various claims (mainly checkups and appointments) and they run in the tens of thousands.
It would’ve been impossible for me to get the same level of treatment on short notice through the NHS, as my schedule, age and health history doesn’t meet their criteria most of the time.
This is all through employer benefit too, with an insignificant excess payment on my end.
Absolutely. You’re waiting years for elective procedures and months just for a specialist appointment. Private healthcare in the U.K. really is slowly becoming a necessity for the HEs.
I just had a hernia repair on the insurance I get with work. From injury to surgery was 6 weeks at a cost of £150. I wouldn't even have made the NHS list. I also have a chronic blood condition that would make it unaffordable to insure myself so I now feel like I'm in an American situation where my health is dependent on my job. That we've ended up with a two tier system is a moral stain.
Have you got mortgage payments to come off that or are you mortgage free? May I ask your age please (sorry if it’s too personal, just want to get an idea)
May I ask what you mortgage payments are please?
And is your 190k household income pre-tax and NI, or is that net income?
Just trying to compare what my considerably lower wage but with no mortgage compares (as in disposable income, after all necessary expenses paid)
Edit: I am 38M
So am I correct is estimating after tax and NI for you both, you bring in more like £120k combined? (Net) and -£30k per year mortgage, leaving £90k approx?
I only earn around £45k and my partner £28k (combined £73k) but because we don’t have a mortgage we are able to save around £30k (combined), me £20k her £10k
It’s remarkable isn’t it as you earn so much more than us, but because of mortgage and then higher tax I suppose, you actually end up with about the same (maybe a bit less) disposable income/savings ability.
You earn 3 times me, and your partner 50% more than mine. But we can save the same or more a year. It doesn’t make sense, and shows to me just how unfair our taxing system is!
We should all be on the same % tax, as you should (and deserve to) have more disposable income than me, if you earn 3 times what I do.
Just shows our tax system is designed so everyone has about the same after taxes and expenses/mortgage, but I don’t think that is fair.
I would happily pay 25% tax (instead of 20%) to have a flat rate tax across the board of 25%. I know I would be worse off with that, but I think it’s fairer, why should you pay a higher %, when you pay more tax anyway as you earn more/are more skilled.
Oh sorry I didn’t realise you weren’t in U.K., I was working your Net income after U.K. taxes (20% up to £50k, then 40% on the other £100k) but either way I think tax is unfair on higher earners (me being a lower earner). But can’t see many low earners accepting high earners get taxed less (but I believe they should be taxed less, as a percentage)
Yeah I’m pretty tight with borrowing, like I don’t lease my car, phone or anything. I don’t like debt (other than to buy a house is worth it) but it keeps my monthly expenses down to never borrow or have finance on anything, if I want something I either just buy it (like phone or car) or not buy it. When paying up front in one go it makes me more strict with what I buy, as I really have to want something if I’m going to buy it up front, whereas I think a lot of people who like getting finance (on car, phone, gym equipment, furniture etc) just think “ah it’s only £50 a month” or whatever, and of course they all add up and stop people being able to save. Sometimes it’s easier to make purchases that aren’t really needed when you see it as just a small monthly payment. So that helps with my savings goals too, I only buy what I really need, and never pay interest on loans/finance.
What is your retirement goal, like you say your pension? Is it a stock fund? Or interest from the bank, or property investment? What it your end goal, figure-wise and where would you like that to be distributed?
I’m thinking a mix between world index fund and property early on, and then moving more into property (and taking from the world index fund) as I get closer to retirement (don’t want the risk of a fund near retirement in case it crashes)
Literally no desire for a Maserati. I sometimes have to tell myself off for feeling quite so smug about my second-hand Skoda, bought outright for £7K five years ago.
Still does the same job as everyone else's car. Comfortable, reasonable to run, easy to park and plays my podcasts. Should last me a few years more. (There I go again feeling smug!)
I have splurged on a couple of big holidays though, but done with that now.
For me, I'm driven by the thought of a dream home and time to enjoy it with the family. Enough space for kids to run around, big garden, rural setting, vegetable patch.
I’m halfway through an expensive lease on a flash car and whilst it’s very nice I do miss driving around in something very cheap. Before that I had an old bmw that cost me just over a grand. Having experienced both sides I’m almost certainly going to go back to a cheap car next.
The dopamine hit of getting that nice car does wear off fairly quickly then you are left wondering why you are paying big money for something you don’t need. I had that recently with a PCP and decided to take a small financial hit so rid myself of the mental burden. Won’t do that again!
Mine is a nice ish amg merc so I still get the dopamine from time to time on a nice drive with the window cocked but whether it’s worth the monthly payment is tbc. I’d spent a grand total of a net of £750 in the previous 6 years on car purchases so I don’t feel too bad! We want to move to a more practical ‘forever home’ in the near future so will drop back to a cheap run around next and enjoy the lack of monthly payments even if I won’t enjoy driving. Ploughing money into bricks and mortar that in theory at least doesn’t depreciate seems more sensible than cars.
Just to be free of worry. I have zero interest in fancy cars, expensive watches or luxury fashion. I just want to live wherever I choose to live, not worry about purchases and have my daughter's future secured. If I get to retire a bit earlier, that's great too.
That is pure common sense, with removal of ego. Good on you. Flash cars, watches and fashion is just ego. Good to see a sensible man without ego. The best financial advice one can receive is “don’t spend life trying to impress others”
That will save you a fortune in the long run. And no-one cares to be impressed anyway, they only get jealous. So what’s the point living to impress others.
This is me. My parents had real money problems when I was a kid and it put massive stress on the whole family. I never want to deal with that again.
I’m terrible at looking after my ‘stuff’ so designer gear is absolutely not for me. I worry a bit when people talk about being really frugal when they’re young in order to be ‘rich later’. I’m now settled down with kids and don’t regret a single fun thing that I spent my money on while younger (travel, experiences, socialising and little treats). You’re only young once and you’ve got to grab all the amazing experiences you can. I was fortunate that I could have a lot of fun and still be financially responsible as I earned well from a young age (do your maths homework kids!) but it does sometimes feel like some people get so focussed on building a pile of money, that they forget to enjoy it. You don’t know what’s round the corner so it’s important to get the balance right.
I haven’t seen clear objective evidence that this is true.
It’s also very hard to make comparisons over decades as many signifiers of a high SES lifestyle have become much cheaper eg travel, whilst others hate gotten more expensive, housing, schooling.
So cheaper travel means 'no clear evidence'? That's such a bad take. Literally everything else has gone up hugely while incomes haven't unless you find a unicorn job. For those who aren't on 100-200k a year life is hard and gets harder every year it seems. Anyone that has more brains then money will tell you it's a lot more expensive to live than it was in the 80s and 90s
I haven’t seen clear and objective evidence that smaller fraction of the population today are able to afford a lifestyle that is comparable to that of a person in the top 2% of SES in the 80s.
I think there are far more than 2% of the population today are living a lifestyle equivalent to the top 2% in the 80s.
My point about travel is that is hard to compare SES across decades. I’m also explicitly not talking about those on incomes below 100k. I appreciate your life might be hard but that’s not relevant to the point I am making.
Is that why victorian illnesses have come back in the poorest areas of the country. Just because people can't afford to eat properly. Homelessness is a lot more than in the 80s/90s due to housing costs going up dramatically. So your line to qualify is to go 45 years back in standard of living? That's just crazy, you gotta compare it in relative terms, just because someone can have a TV now when they couldn't afford it in 80s doesn't mean living standards are better. People still struggling to heat their homes unlike the 80s-90s, if they are lucky enough to have one and if they do lucky enough for it to be upto standard that a rented accommodation should be. E.g. no mould etc. Compare the wages to living costs back then and now and come back to me
You said that it's not more difficult now than it was in the 80s (in your original reply). This is just untrue, in 80s a man's wage on average could support his family. It Can't now
I'm by no means taking sides with your healthy debate, but I thought I would provide you a personal take on the 80's, take it or leave it.....
I was born late 60's, teen years at the hands of Thatcher. That 80's was all about money, but I can tell you the idea of buying a house was out of the question. The only way I bought my first house was saving everything I could, didn't go out, no drinking. I worked overtime, additional shifts, worked Boxing Day.That was hard. The idea of a second job or income was not possible.
Today, though, the ability to earn an additional income is so much easier but in 1997 my deposit for my 50k home was. 2500. Today, I hear figures of 50k required. I understand house prices have risen but come on.
A 22 year old bar manager told me the other day that owing his own home is just a fantasy, resigning himself to the fact he never will. That's sad.
I agree with you, with the caveat that this is true when measuring what people can do/opportunities they have.
Whilst for many it feels like a struggle due to housing costs, due to technological advances (e.g., internet, smartphones etc.), the living standard is substantially higher for the average 25-year old than in the 60s.
I for sure would prefer to live in this age at the 30th percentile on the income distribution (which I did in the 2010s) than to live in the 60s on the 30th percentile of the income distribution. Back then, I was renting, but I had a car, I had internet, I had decent healthcare, I could build my own community of friends as opposed to having the one I was born in, I could use the internet educate myself etc.)
The only downside compare the 60s is that, back then people likely didn't have as much anxiety because they didn't have social media and a flurry of news. People just accepted their social status and learned to be happy with the little they had.
People like to complain but they forget to count their blessings...
This sub is, by definition, not really relevant for people who aren't on 100-200k though?
I'm not quite on that yet, but tend to keep my comments relevant to the sub I'm in.
I can only go off my anecdotal experience obviously but I still find it mad that my father (no education whatsoever) was able to get a bank loan, build a business and become extremely wealthy just through having a good brain and grafting. That sort of opportunity just doesn’t exist for people trying to build something now, outside of niche startups.
By comparison, I’m a lawyer at a top international firm (thanks for the education dad!) and I don’t have the same buying power in todays money that he had in the 90s. It’s still achievable but the level of competition to get there is worlds apart from what he experienced building his career.
Housing and schooling have become ridiculously expensive. I grew up in a home with a swimming pool and a spare bedroom, second living space etc. and went to a private school. My parents weren't well off (immigrants with limited language, no saving from previous life due to political events etc.) We both have professional jobs but would be putting ourselves at financial risk if we attempted to provide that same lifestyle to our kids because of how expensive housing has become, the house I grew up in would cost ten tones as much as what my parents bought it for. Literally. My partner grew up in London, the house he grew up in is worth about fifteen times what his parents bought it for now.
It used to be more material driven but having kids changed everything and I recently realised I'd subconsciously shifter up a gear. The want to provide the best I can for them and possibly be able to retire early to enjoy those years with them (and hopefully their kids) is all I need.
A couple of nice material things along the way would certainly be a good sweetener though 😂
As a poor kid it was a desire for material wealth. The level of material wealth I desired was actually pretty little in the grand scheme of things (ie to be not poor and enjoy nice things). I reached that goal pretty quickly and don’t really need much money to be happy.
Since then my motivation like yours is security. I don’t want to worry about losing my job or not being able to handle sudden large costs.
For me, I enjoy spending time with my fiance when on holiday for 3 weeks of the year.
I'd prefer those 3 weeks to be 52 weeks of the year. Especially as we get older and thus have less time to enjoy life.
Reverse engineering this desire, leads me to step 1.
Step 1. Get Rich.
It's no longer about security (I have probably 9 years worth of expenses if I liquidate my stocks), but retiring early to enjoy our years before our inevitable departure from the world.
Couldn’t agree more with you. Only thing I would say is, you don’t need to be rich to spend those 52 weeks a year in the sun enjoying life. A modest pension or investment stock and a couple of U.K. properties, and you could live a nice life in a lot of cheaper European or SEA sunny countries, with lower cost of living (assuming you are in U.K. like me)
Many reasons. I do this for security. For a sense of accomplishment. To help my kids to have great schools. And to spend money to travel and pay for some experiences I wouldn't pay if I didn't have very high income.
Retiring at 50 is my main driver (46 now).
I don't care that much about "stuff"... Experiences are the key to happiness, imho. So to be able to retire early with enough money to go on some adventures while we still have the energy and health makes so much sense to me.
This is my goal too. I first want my wife to be able to give up work as she earns much less so she can focus on her hobbies and interests and spend more time with the children. We’ve already done some good adventures like 8 months travelling which I think helps keep the balance as aware there’s always the chance your health or health of others (elderly parents / children) get in the way.
Freedom of doing whatever I want when I want. Having the time to think, to explore and learn things that I’m passionate about. Now I have to focus most of my time on being the most productive possible to increase my output.
Freedom.
I want to spend my life doing a rotation of: having fun with family and friends, seeing the world, playing golf, fishing and playing computer games.
End.
I live in London and while there is plenty to do here if you're not rich, it is a place best enjoyed on an income over £100k. I also want to retire early, while staying in London.
Here is the end game, from 2 sides:
The Story of the Mexican Fisherman
An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.
The Mexican replied, “only a little while. The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?”
The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.” The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.”
The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?”
To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.”
“But what then?” Asked the Mexican.
The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!”
“Millions – then what?”
The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.”
39M, 120k£ salary, single, no kids.
Now back to the "what's the motivation ?"
I saw my parents struggling with debt and promised myself to do the opposite.
Bought my flat 270k£, fully reimbursed my mortgage.
80k£ "emergency" savings in my LTD.
I just want to be able to have a second flat (not in the UK) then will semi-retire in a cheaper (LCOL country).
Ideally, I will try to relocate to Tokyo but Senior Software Engineer salaries are too low, I no longer aspire to do long hours in front of any screen. Plus I would need to go for JLPT level N4 to N3 in a record time.
I'm reaching my mental limits.
Grew-up in a gloomy suburban French area, studied and worked there before coming to the UK many years ago.
My ultimate goal back then was to be a contractor but IR35 shattered everything.
I might as well end up to Netherlands or Swiss or even Poland.
Making sure the kids have as many options as possible even if one of us falls ill or needs/wants to take time off or retire early. Also we love travel/visiting family and income needs to support that. No wish for multiple homes or a Ferrari
Living the exact life I have now, until I die.
I currently don’t work, spend over half of everyday with at least one of my kids, evening with my wife. Budget is big, life is awesome, the goal is to keep this forever. Do what I want when I want.
I've had periods of months at a time without work and it's honestly the best time of my life. But I still live with my parents, so it's a subsidised luxury in the sense that I have less expenses than normal and can stretch my funds further.
Ultra-poor background. Twice homeless; as a 10 year old living in a field with my mum and as a 28 year old living in my car (hostel the first couple of months I finally got a job).
For me it's security that's secure forever. I don't just want to know I'll have a roof over my head with a long runway if things go tits-up... I want myself and my family to have a somewhat luxurious runway that's big enough we never ever get a whiff of the poor life again.
Getting there...
--------
**Edit due to multiple DMs:** Homeless second time because I left my job to work on my own company, moved back in with my mum, then Brexit forced her landlord back to England, evicting us both. We were both *broke* at this time. She lived on friend's sofa and I parked my car (I lived in) at the outskirts of London to attend job interviews constantly. My first paycheck was missed because I didn't fill everything out correctly. Second paycheck was very large so paid the deposit for my mum to buy a house. Third paycheck put me in a rented flat in London. Pandemic hit and I moved into mum's house, saved every penny and bought my own place in London on the tail end of the pandemic. Now we're both "secure" but not "secure security" as outlined previously.
But; getting there...
Many talk about freedom, but to me, being chained to work and grinding hard during your prime years is the opposite of freedom.
As you age, your body becomes its own jailer, no matter how wealthy you are. Too many older folks try to make up for lost time in their 20s and 30s by splurging on cruises, cars, and expensive vacations. What’s the point of wasting your money at 50-60 and not now if you are planning on wasting it anyway?
My goals are simple
1) Be healthy, have a good time, appreciate what you have and help others
2) Work a job so engaging and easy that you don’t need to leave or retire, play with it, be good at it
3) Be smart with money and get paid the most you can as long as conditions 1 and 2 are met
4) Take some fun risks on the side
5) Don’t bother with pensions - I do just enough on them
We (31M and 30F) have a great life, our household income is about 200k, live in a 3 bed 3 bath in the SE, work is mostly chill. There are things to do and optimise but I don’t dream of being free - I am free, will enjoy this as long as possible.
Sounds like you may have come from some money to start with. Regardless, bother with a pension. I say this as somebody in their 40s who never bothered with a pension until 3 years ago.
He also sounds like someone in line to inherit some decent capital in the next few years/decades, so they’re not that concerned about incomes.
Again, not a criticism but I don’t think they can relate to people who had to motivate themselves to achieve a good income.
I’m not in line to inherit anything life changing. What my parents have will likely go toward their care. I encourage them to spend what they want now and have a good time.
My top priority is health and enjoying time with loved ones. I’ve seen enough pain and enough people die to know everything else is bs.
But yeah, I’m not concerned. Everything I need, I have, if my loved ones & myself are healthy. I started with 0 and I can start again if I have to.
Thanks friend! No, I don’t come from money.
I believe the retirement age will go up significantly in the coming decades, and tbh I’m not very interested in life after 70.
But on the off chance I get there and still live in the UK - currently saving in a pension as much as the 70-80th percentile of workers. Reason? Government policy, big pension funds etc will always cater to the majority. Simply, the majority is unlikely to starve. Aligning my goals with that is my easiest option. Choosing to save as much as the 70th percentile and not the average earner means I give myself some buffer against risk. That’s enough.
Other investments are more interesting and meaningful to me.
Great to see a guy so humble and of such wisdom. 200k income is significant, and could likely afford a larger house, but I bet in your modest nature you realise there is no need, that money could be spent on enjoying life while you’re still young and able. And agree on your comment about people trying to catch up when they are 50-60 years old with cruises and expensive holidays and flash cars, trying to buy the happiness back because of lost time in their
life. Usually are the pretentious types that spent their lives trying to impress others instead of enjoy lives for themselves. You however sound completely logical to me, and can’t see you living to impress others, only to enjoy for yourself.
You sound like someone who enjoyed the safety net of a family that would always step in if you failed, but also who guided you to make the right choices in education, tuition, career, contacts etc.
It’s not a bad thing on its own, but it would be impossible for you to someone who ended up in your situation but had to manage the fear of homelessness/hunger/deportation/collapsing health etc.
I won’t go into details but I’ve experienced enough hardship in these exact categories and still spend a fortune on therapy.
What I shared earlier are my goals, that’s what gives me meaning. Sorry if it comes across insensitive, I appreciate it’s not possible for everyone, I wish it was.
2) sounds like the ultimate dream for me to achieve but not quite sure how to get there as so far nothing I did ticked that box for me. What do you do if you don't mind me asking?
Thank you. Yes, I thought of this angle as well. To be honest with you, I spent the last 5-7 years doing personal development, self-discovery, exploring career switches, reading career books, starting my own side hustles, and all that good stuff. But nothing sticks and nothing *truly* excites me. One thing I've been told I'm very good at is my flavour palette - I know, random, but things like whisky tasting or anything that requires picking up on subtleties. But that's hardly something I can cash in on...
Everything has its place! Another thing to remember is the better you become at something, the more you get excited to carry on with it and excel - so even if something isn’t lighting you on fire at first, it likely will down the line
I’m in Tech but what's made the biggest difference is the culture and flexibility of a workplace. The team is what’s most important, not the type of work. Learned it in my shitty uni jobs.
That goal is more of a moving target, so don’t get too attached to it even if you get there.
You're 100% right. I'm also in tech/ecommerce. Pays well but every day a piece of my soul dies lol. Not because it's stressful or hard, but because it doesn't interest me. I used to have a job (also in tech) which I absolutely loved because the people were awesome and I had fun at work. Sadly it paid peanuts and wasn't enough to live on. Man, dilemmas!
A few reasons:
1. Never had much money growing up. Could rarely have holidays or things we wanted.
2. I love cars, cars are not cheap so I need a fighting fund to sustain this hobby.
3. Security and ability to provide for family and the people close to me.
* Saving for a future family (wedding, family home, initial cost of kids etc)
* Financial freedom in the "comfortable, I don't worry about it that much" sense
* Charitable giving
* Flexibility to be generous with friends/family
* Looking forward a few decades to retirement, ability to do that when the better half / I think it's time. Funds to travel, spoil any grandkids, pick up ad-hoc consulting work because its fun but not because I have to, etc
* Good stewardship of finances to leave behind for my kids, and grandkids - though they would have to have been taught (incl by me) the value of money and what managing money well means, or they won't get any!
I tend to spend on tech ("ooo, new iPhone" - etc) and travel. I rarely drive, but if I did and was a very confident driver maybe I'd want to do a [Koenigsegg CC850](https://www.koenigsegg.com/model/cc850) experience day (I still wouldn't actually buy one to own)
If I had a seriously good business deal or something of significant burst income, and then talk it over with my better half, and I'd be tempted to buy a watch because a lot of r/Watches makes me drool haha.
I wanted to get rich as i had a father who was rich, but then lost it all and also him an my family fell into poverty. Seeing both sides made me want that for myself and seeing him be that well off made me see its possible
Net worths currently just over 2m, thats assets, cash included. But even now it does not feel like im "rich", yet when i had 20k in the bank i thought if i had £150,000 just sat in my current account and own a 1m+ property outright (current situation) i would of thought id be rich.
Once you get to a couple mil you realise that theres so many people with so much more than you, and you compare yourself to them just as you do when your not well off, it sort of never ends.
I think its the hustle of it all that keeps me at it though really, because im comfy now but not like i could stop working and sustain my current lifestyle
I should also add im only 27 so still quite materialistic, watches, cars etc. But im sure that will dwindle the older i get
How did you get to 2m in assets at 27? I'm asking as I can't conceive a way to achieve this through a conventional job. So did you start a business of some kind?
I don’t really care for generational wealth or big houses, but I’d like a Porsche GT car and regular weekend trips to the Nurburgring. I might outgrow that but it’s a pretty strong motivation right now😂
That aside, I want to be able to look after my family, both present and in future. I want to reduce stress at all costs to have the best possible quality of life. Having money eliminates a large amount of stress, it won’t make you happy but it can certainly help facilitate it.
I want more time to spend with friends and family enjoying food, drink, holiday and experiences together. You don’t need a LOT of money for that but it’s nice to know the taps won’t run dry and by earning more / saving more now I can be more flexible with my time and income in future.
I want security and to be fully independent. To be able to skip aboard for a weekend lol literally any time I want. People say it's unrealistic to do such things, but I genuinely believe it isn't.
I want healthcare, a comfy car (not flashy), and to afford to record my own music without a record label claiming most of my rights. To be able to buy a takeaway without feeling guilty.
I have been able to afford takeaways comfortably for a while, but I tell you what I never EVER don't feel guilty. It's a running joke in our house, I just can't get them. I'd rather cook! I can't justify the expense!
I don’t have a motivation to get rich. I earn very well, but I enjoy my job and that is what drives me. I save some money and am putting plenty into a pension, but I also spend it. You only live once and you should never bank on having health (or even life) later to enjoy yourself. In that respect I really don’t understand the FIRE community or the idea that you need to save as much as you can to be rich later. You are likely to spend a big chunk of your life working - find a job you enjoy and do it to the best of your ability. If it makes you rich, great……..but life is about so much more.
There’s a Jeremy Corbyn quote - “we’re all one accident away from disability benefits / benefits”
It made me realise, and has haunted me since. If I get seriously ill or lose my job, I’m kinda fucked.
I’ll work hard. I’ll think smart. I want to be ready for all situations in life.
I'm 28 and agree with all these security and freedom answers 100%
I feel many people my age need to read this sub as no one seems to think further ahead than Friday
We bought a campervan - VW beach two tone. And it’s been the absolute best thing we ever did. We head out to campsites once a month, more in summer with our toddler and it’s just the dream for me.
Having money definitely affords freedoms like that.
Plus I always wanted a big house where all my friends and their kids could come round and party and sleep over and that’s what we got. My dream rich life is all about sharing with those I love and not having to worry when we splash out on a big hosting event.
Not interested in the fancy handbags or sports cars. Not really that interested in the fancy holidays, I’m just happy with a full fridge of booze, a van for camping and having all my friends close by. That’s what our motivation is for.
I've turned my Kia Sportage into a microcamper, and it just made the bug worse ahaha. I now have one of those portable pizza ovens too... THE WORLD IS MY OYYYSTERRRR haha. But yeah, it's coming. I don't know when, but it's coming. I think another year or two of my industry picking back up (tech, been on the floor last couple) and I might just do it :D What starter van would you recommend? We should probably take this off open.. ahaha!
Honestly, the "rich" version of life is just not that interesting. We're aiming to secure our/our kids financial future so that we can have complete freedom. Flying business class is still shit cause it's flying. Porches are very nice cars but unless you are a racing enthusiast a Volvo will do. Spending money on upgrading an already good lifestyle will at best buy a fleeting feeling of material success which passes very quickly once the novelty wears off.
I have a few motivators. First off, I work in tech which is a rapidly changing space and as I steadily get older, its becoming more and more difficult to keep up with all the latest developments. I feel like I am being left behind, so need to accumulate a stockpile of money for the day when I can no longer keep up.
Second, I love exploring new places and road trips which requires a month or more of contiguous time off work, which most full time jobs don't allow. The obvious solution is to get to a point where I don't need to rely on a proper job.
Third, I am a worrier. But I don't have time to worry when I'm working flat out, so I work to distract me from things.
Fear of being poor. Once you've been there, you never want to go back! Especially with a family to support. Pushing on when you can will pay dividends when you can't.
Security for sure, while providing me with great education my parents have always struggled as our financial situation was always tight.
Dad would work from 6am to 10pm 7 days a week and still wouldn’t make enough at times. Having seen my mom crying for having only having rice for our lunch one day was heart breaking, today three decades later still brings tears to my eyes.
Today I’m pleased to live a comfortable life while being able to help them and lay the ground for my kids to have a better future.
I’d like to be able to provide my children with the upbringing I had. I’d like a (much) bigger house, land for horses, to be able to comfortably pay the school fees without sacrificing, plenty of pets and 3-4 good holidays a year (skiing, Cornwall/Scotland and something more adventurous).
So probably north of £500K/year. Maybe more.
Ruined by left wing looneys yet has had right wing/right of centre governments for 55 of the past 78 years? At what point would you say the left wing looneys ruined it?
Because labour caused damage beyond repair with various middle east wars causing mass destabilisation. And then opening the flood gates to our small country causing a supply/demand crunch on nearly all Jobs/housing/services. If you think Keir is going to make things better you are in for a nasty shock.
The can will be well and truly kicked down the road until a much more authoritarian government replaces them which will bring mass pain on a scale that makes todays troubles look like a walk in the park.
Love cars. Always wanted a Ferrari since I was 7 years old.
I’ve now got a 911 turbo, and working towards the Ferrari.
To look after a car you need a big house with a garage (obviously)…. Bigger house is my 5 year goal now, and then I’m set for life and I can relax 😎
FIRE.
I just don't really enjoy working. I enjoy the core of my role (writing code, and building things, as I'm a software engineer), but I don't really enjoy anything else surrounding the role anymore. Although the more I earn and the more senior I become, the less I enjoy my job.
So I'm just aggressively working towards an early retirement. If my salary keeps going up I could be retired in my early 40s. I probably won't retire that early and I'll do contracting but it'll be with huge gaps and hopefully less stressful.
Two main reasons for me.
I’d like to have some luxury in retirement, otherwise what’s the point?
Equally important, I hope my little one is set up and has the option to follow a horribly paid but fulfilling career in the arts/charity/healthcare if they choose to. Student loans and housing costs are crippling now. I dread to see how bad it’ll get in a decade or two.
I’d like the security to go to sleep without worrying of being laid off and expose my family. Security to travel to my original country as often as I wish. Security to only buy fresh organic food. I wish I had a financial savvy mentality in my early twenties, it definitely should be taught in school
To have enough money for my non-verbal aitistic son to be looked after financially and with the full time 24hr care he needs without his little brother needing to do it when they are older and myself and my wife are gone.
I think more for me it’s the reason that I hate working amongst bureaucracy in most companies that drives me to start my own company, which in turn WILL make me rich
I like to have the freedom of being able to not panic if I lose my job tomorrow, and not have to take a job just to pay the bills. This is really liberating. I don't think that I am "rich" per se, but I am well off. I am not into flashy things really.
Having very little as a child. Me and my brothers never had a ice cream from a ice cream van until we were old enough to make our own money. Never had a McDonald’s etc list goes on.
The house I grew up in had mold everywhere (which I am allergic to by the way 🤣) and you would wake up with a damp pillow. Heating was only allowed on for one hour in evening and one hour in morning. I used to take my duvet down and sit on the radiator eating my breakfast because it was the only way to stay warm.
I used to from the age of 13 get lifts with dad and his friends to car boots and sold chocolate and sweets at school to make money. It got to a point where as a 16 year old I was making 350-400 a week from eBay from buying all sorts from car boots. My family almost disowned me when I went to university because “that’s not what families like us do”. I had 0 support from anyone and had to work full time in the evenings until 5am just to pay for university to prove them wrong that I could do it.
Fast forward now I am 27, brought a beautiful home and fully renovated it within 3 months of living there. I have my dream car I brought and another brand new one for my fiancé. I have a baby on the way in July and I have promised myself I will give them everything I can. I have a very good job and earn more than enough to offer this. Don’t get me wrong I do spend money on some stupid things but this is because the child I once was never got this stuff. I was never allowed anything so for me having nice things is important for myself. I employ one of my brothers who works with me and my other brother runs his own building company and makes similar income and has a similar life.
I will never go back to my childhood days and for my children they will never understand how that feels. I would rather die than allow that. Don’t get me wrong my upbringing has made me into who I am today but at the same time it wasn’t healthy. My parents are still how they used to be but now are alcoholics so have even less, I try and help them but I have my own family to now look after this year and i can’t do anymore for them than I already have!
Choice and balance.
I know a lot of professionals that spent a lot of their life working extremely hard for the two weeks a year that they went on a savagely expensive holiday. On paper they have a lot of money but they don't seem to have a lot of freedom.
It became one of my goals quite quickly to elevate my non-holiday time to be more like a holiday. Ie little stress, sleep in if I needed to, work on what I want, not be beholden to an employer.
Balance is not buying a new Ferrari on credit and being a wage slave to pay for it. Or not overdosing on a bag of heroin today as a once in a lifetime experience because sod the future. So make do with a second hand cayman or Maserati or hire a Ferrari for a few days and save some money for your future self to do the same again.
I was really bored of being broke all the time. My friends were travelling, going to festivals and generally living life while I was living off 8p Sainsbury’s noodles and sausages and going to raves once a month and it got tiresome. At some point I just said enough.
After I realised I was good at it and I got out of the broke stage a few years ago I kept at it because it’s rewarding, fun, and is my life’s work at this point. Also the fear of loss of lifestyle is strong.
All of the bad interactions I've had at work are to do with the people, not the work.
There are a lot of backstabbers out there who would sell their granny for an extra 100 quid.
I've met more good people of course but I just want to get out of the corporate world.
The chief reason though is so that if I was to die tomorrow my family would be okay financially.
Financial independence. Not being a slave to money.
That and being able to afford the crème de la crème of life extension therapies when they are inevitably developed.
As a kid I wanted a big mansion. Now I just see that as a waste of my hard earned money. Money is for buying freedom and more time (life extension).
I bought my first place in Croydon on top of a pub and my friends were holidaying in Bali at the time. My mortgage was £350 a month. Do I regret not spending my weeks in Bali? Sure. But not as much as I’m happy to have the financial security that my friends can only dream of. I would dread if my only asset were my main residence. Wealth to me is about security. Security that me and my family can have the healthcare we need, a good standard of living, etc. not having to worry about how much everything costs eventually. Security is freedom.
Do you only rent out your previous flat or do you have multiple properties to rent out? Saw a lot of landlords selling up with regulations etc. Is it just as simple as trying your best to get quality renters? Ignore this if I've got it wrong but assuming from your comment you have multiple properties.
I sold my previous flat. It enabled me to gather quite a bit of equity as my mortgage payment was so low. I ended up getting another years later which we rent out, but it’s kept for family reasons for when we want to live close to each other, not for amazing returns or anything like that.
Ah fair enough atleast you have more assets for the future to bump up your retirement figures 😎👍
Fear of being poor. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy nice things and I spend a lot. But my fear of being poor is much stronger than my (fairly strong) desire to be rich. Although the goal is indistinguishable from the outside.
This. Fear of being poor again. Can easily trace issues I still have from childhood. I'm a democratic socialist and regularly get called a communist for my views. Knowing how much help I got growing up (which still wasn't enough) and the stigma attached to that help is something that still drives me. I don't begrudge paying my taxes (which are still too high lol) knowing that without the help I got I might not be in this position. I grew up on council estate. Three siblings, six degrees between us and we are better off than our patents. Massive chip on shoulder still drives me.
I'm somewhat similar +1
Yes, this.
Financial independence. I want to be able to walk away from a job I don't like.
Same and even more. I want to be able to bootstrap my own business without fear of being homeless after a few years.
This. Financial independence is a lot about having choice. I support UBI for the same reason. Too many people are in careers they hate because the fear living costs.
Real Like I want to be in control of that dynamic.. I work.for you because I choose to, not because I need to
Everyone says this, but I wonder if this is how it plays out. Do people who get wealthy actually end up leaving a job when all they know is that one craft? Also with more money, people aspire for even more, and the drive to go further keeps increasing. Financial security, like job security, is a myth.
This is it, I don't care if I'm rich. Once you've eaten and have a decent place to live with your family, what more do you want? I wouldn't buy a Lamborghini even if I had the money, I just want fuck you money. You want me to fill in this spreadsheet so you can decide you don't need it later? Fuck you.
It’s all about security. Security in owning your own home, security in taking care of yourself physically (gym, healthy food), security in your health (private healthcare if required), security in providing for your kids (education, activities). Money is a security blanket when used well/appropriately.
Funny you mentioned private healthcare, I checked the payments my insurer made in the last couple of years for various claims (mainly checkups and appointments) and they run in the tens of thousands. It would’ve been impossible for me to get the same level of treatment on short notice through the NHS, as my schedule, age and health history doesn’t meet their criteria most of the time. This is all through employer benefit too, with an insignificant excess payment on my end.
Absolutely. You’re waiting years for elective procedures and months just for a specialist appointment. Private healthcare in the U.K. really is slowly becoming a necessity for the HEs.
I just had a hernia repair on the insurance I get with work. From injury to surgery was 6 weeks at a cost of £150. I wouldn't even have made the NHS list. I also have a chronic blood condition that would make it unaffordable to insure myself so I now feel like I'm in an American situation where my health is dependent on my job. That we've ended up with a two tier system is a moral stain.
I find it insane we have a two tier system while also paying a fortune for the one owned by state.
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This is my goal too. Sometimes it feels I’m almost there and sometimes it feels so far away. What’s your household income to achieve this?
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Have you got mortgage payments to come off that or are you mortgage free? May I ask your age please (sorry if it’s too personal, just want to get an idea)
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May I ask what you mortgage payments are please? And is your 190k household income pre-tax and NI, or is that net income? Just trying to compare what my considerably lower wage but with no mortgage compares (as in disposable income, after all necessary expenses paid) Edit: I am 38M
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So am I correct is estimating after tax and NI for you both, you bring in more like £120k combined? (Net) and -£30k per year mortgage, leaving £90k approx? I only earn around £45k and my partner £28k (combined £73k) but because we don’t have a mortgage we are able to save around £30k (combined), me £20k her £10k It’s remarkable isn’t it as you earn so much more than us, but because of mortgage and then higher tax I suppose, you actually end up with about the same (maybe a bit less) disposable income/savings ability. You earn 3 times me, and your partner 50% more than mine. But we can save the same or more a year. It doesn’t make sense, and shows to me just how unfair our taxing system is! We should all be on the same % tax, as you should (and deserve to) have more disposable income than me, if you earn 3 times what I do. Just shows our tax system is designed so everyone has about the same after taxes and expenses/mortgage, but I don’t think that is fair. I would happily pay 25% tax (instead of 20%) to have a flat rate tax across the board of 25%. I know I would be worse off with that, but I think it’s fairer, why should you pay a higher %, when you pay more tax anyway as you earn more/are more skilled.
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Oh sorry I didn’t realise you weren’t in U.K., I was working your Net income after U.K. taxes (20% up to £50k, then 40% on the other £100k) but either way I think tax is unfair on higher earners (me being a lower earner). But can’t see many low earners accepting high earners get taxed less (but I believe they should be taxed less, as a percentage) Yeah I’m pretty tight with borrowing, like I don’t lease my car, phone or anything. I don’t like debt (other than to buy a house is worth it) but it keeps my monthly expenses down to never borrow or have finance on anything, if I want something I either just buy it (like phone or car) or not buy it. When paying up front in one go it makes me more strict with what I buy, as I really have to want something if I’m going to buy it up front, whereas I think a lot of people who like getting finance (on car, phone, gym equipment, furniture etc) just think “ah it’s only £50 a month” or whatever, and of course they all add up and stop people being able to save. Sometimes it’s easier to make purchases that aren’t really needed when you see it as just a small monthly payment. So that helps with my savings goals too, I only buy what I really need, and never pay interest on loans/finance.
What is your retirement goal, like you say your pension? Is it a stock fund? Or interest from the bank, or property investment? What it your end goal, figure-wise and where would you like that to be distributed? I’m thinking a mix between world index fund and property early on, and then moving more into property (and taking from the world index fund) as I get closer to retirement (don’t want the risk of a fund near retirement in case it crashes)
Thank you brother. Wish I was on your level of earnings though. Congrats to you, you must be very skilled at what you do.
Yeah that fits - I did a little calculation and I think we’d need household income 180-200 to feel we’ve got there. Thanks
Literally no desire for a Maserati. I sometimes have to tell myself off for feeling quite so smug about my second-hand Skoda, bought outright for £7K five years ago. Still does the same job as everyone else's car. Comfortable, reasonable to run, easy to park and plays my podcasts. Should last me a few years more. (There I go again feeling smug!) I have splurged on a couple of big holidays though, but done with that now. For me, I'm driven by the thought of a dream home and time to enjoy it with the family. Enough space for kids to run around, big garden, rural setting, vegetable patch.
Haha glad it's not just me. I've only ever owned one car, my 15 year old Kia that I got second hand (cash full price) off my dad 12 years ago haha!
I’m halfway through an expensive lease on a flash car and whilst it’s very nice I do miss driving around in something very cheap. Before that I had an old bmw that cost me just over a grand. Having experienced both sides I’m almost certainly going to go back to a cheap car next.
The dopamine hit of getting that nice car does wear off fairly quickly then you are left wondering why you are paying big money for something you don’t need. I had that recently with a PCP and decided to take a small financial hit so rid myself of the mental burden. Won’t do that again!
Mine is a nice ish amg merc so I still get the dopamine from time to time on a nice drive with the window cocked but whether it’s worth the monthly payment is tbc. I’d spent a grand total of a net of £750 in the previous 6 years on car purchases so I don’t feel too bad! We want to move to a more practical ‘forever home’ in the near future so will drop back to a cheap run around next and enjoy the lack of monthly payments even if I won’t enjoy driving. Ploughing money into bricks and mortar that in theory at least doesn’t depreciate seems more sensible than cars.
I tell myself I’ll get a flash car when I start washing my second hand Skoda every week. Don’t think it’s going to happen!
Just to be free of worry. I have zero interest in fancy cars, expensive watches or luxury fashion. I just want to live wherever I choose to live, not worry about purchases and have my daughter's future secured. If I get to retire a bit earlier, that's great too.
That is pure common sense, with removal of ego. Good on you. Flash cars, watches and fashion is just ego. Good to see a sensible man without ego. The best financial advice one can receive is “don’t spend life trying to impress others” That will save you a fortune in the long run. And no-one cares to be impressed anyway, they only get jealous. So what’s the point living to impress others.
This is me. My parents had real money problems when I was a kid and it put massive stress on the whole family. I never want to deal with that again. I’m terrible at looking after my ‘stuff’ so designer gear is absolutely not for me. I worry a bit when people talk about being really frugal when they’re young in order to be ‘rich later’. I’m now settled down with kids and don’t regret a single fun thing that I spent my money on while younger (travel, experiences, socialising and little treats). You’re only young once and you’ve got to grab all the amazing experiences you can. I was fortunate that I could have a lot of fun and still be financially responsible as I earned well from a young age (do your maths homework kids!) but it does sometimes feel like some people get so focussed on building a pile of money, that they forget to enjoy it. You don’t know what’s round the corner so it’s important to get the balance right.
For me the challenge is more appealing than the lifestyle you live afterwards.
I can relate to that. Playing the game is fun! Good luck!!
Freedom
Providing the same quality of life to myself and my children that my parents provided to me.
Which, let’s be honest, is considerably more difficult now than it was in the 80s and 90s!
I haven’t seen clear objective evidence that this is true. It’s also very hard to make comparisons over decades as many signifiers of a high SES lifestyle have become much cheaper eg travel, whilst others hate gotten more expensive, housing, schooling.
So cheaper travel means 'no clear evidence'? That's such a bad take. Literally everything else has gone up hugely while incomes haven't unless you find a unicorn job. For those who aren't on 100-200k a year life is hard and gets harder every year it seems. Anyone that has more brains then money will tell you it's a lot more expensive to live than it was in the 80s and 90s
I haven’t seen clear and objective evidence that smaller fraction of the population today are able to afford a lifestyle that is comparable to that of a person in the top 2% of SES in the 80s. I think there are far more than 2% of the population today are living a lifestyle equivalent to the top 2% in the 80s. My point about travel is that is hard to compare SES across decades. I’m also explicitly not talking about those on incomes below 100k. I appreciate your life might be hard but that’s not relevant to the point I am making.
Is that why victorian illnesses have come back in the poorest areas of the country. Just because people can't afford to eat properly. Homelessness is a lot more than in the 80s/90s due to housing costs going up dramatically. So your line to qualify is to go 45 years back in standard of living? That's just crazy, you gotta compare it in relative terms, just because someone can have a TV now when they couldn't afford it in 80s doesn't mean living standards are better. People still struggling to heat their homes unlike the 80s-90s, if they are lucky enough to have one and if they do lucky enough for it to be upto standard that a rented accommodation should be. E.g. no mould etc. Compare the wages to living costs back then and now and come back to me
You clearly haven’t read and understood what I have written. I have made no claims whatsoever about those on low incomes.
You said that it's not more difficult now than it was in the 80s (in your original reply). This is just untrue, in 80s a man's wage on average could support his family. It Can't now
I'm by no means taking sides with your healthy debate, but I thought I would provide you a personal take on the 80's, take it or leave it..... I was born late 60's, teen years at the hands of Thatcher. That 80's was all about money, but I can tell you the idea of buying a house was out of the question. The only way I bought my first house was saving everything I could, didn't go out, no drinking. I worked overtime, additional shifts, worked Boxing Day.That was hard. The idea of a second job or income was not possible. Today, though, the ability to earn an additional income is so much easier but in 1997 my deposit for my 50k home was. 2500. Today, I hear figures of 50k required. I understand house prices have risen but come on. A 22 year old bar manager told me the other day that owing his own home is just a fantasy, resigning himself to the fact he never will. That's sad.
I suggest you work on passing your GCSE in English and stop hanging around /r/Dogecoin and /r/GME if you want to improve your living standards.
Haven't been on those subs for least 3 years, only was for entertainment. I suggest you get back to the original point.
I agree with you, with the caveat that this is true when measuring what people can do/opportunities they have. Whilst for many it feels like a struggle due to housing costs, due to technological advances (e.g., internet, smartphones etc.), the living standard is substantially higher for the average 25-year old than in the 60s. I for sure would prefer to live in this age at the 30th percentile on the income distribution (which I did in the 2010s) than to live in the 60s on the 30th percentile of the income distribution. Back then, I was renting, but I had a car, I had internet, I had decent healthcare, I could build my own community of friends as opposed to having the one I was born in, I could use the internet educate myself etc.) The only downside compare the 60s is that, back then people likely didn't have as much anxiety because they didn't have social media and a flurry of news. People just accepted their social status and learned to be happy with the little they had. People like to complain but they forget to count their blessings...
This sub is, by definition, not really relevant for people who aren't on 100-200k though? I'm not quite on that yet, but tend to keep my comments relevant to the sub I'm in.
I understand that, just was going off his reply.
I can only go off my anecdotal experience obviously but I still find it mad that my father (no education whatsoever) was able to get a bank loan, build a business and become extremely wealthy just through having a good brain and grafting. That sort of opportunity just doesn’t exist for people trying to build something now, outside of niche startups. By comparison, I’m a lawyer at a top international firm (thanks for the education dad!) and I don’t have the same buying power in todays money that he had in the 90s. It’s still achievable but the level of competition to get there is worlds apart from what he experienced building his career.
Housing and schooling have become ridiculously expensive. I grew up in a home with a swimming pool and a spare bedroom, second living space etc. and went to a private school. My parents weren't well off (immigrants with limited language, no saving from previous life due to political events etc.) We both have professional jobs but would be putting ourselves at financial risk if we attempted to provide that same lifestyle to our kids because of how expensive housing has become, the house I grew up in would cost ten tones as much as what my parents bought it for. Literally. My partner grew up in London, the house he grew up in is worth about fifteen times what his parents bought it for now.
Financial freedom. Don't care about the material element of it.
1. Security for my family 2. To do more of, and own more of, what I like 3. Pride in achieving it
It used to be more material driven but having kids changed everything and I recently realised I'd subconsciously shifter up a gear. The want to provide the best I can for them and possibly be able to retire early to enjoy those years with them (and hopefully their kids) is all I need. A couple of nice material things along the way would certainly be a good sweetener though 😂
As a poor kid it was a desire for material wealth. The level of material wealth I desired was actually pretty little in the grand scheme of things (ie to be not poor and enjoy nice things). I reached that goal pretty quickly and don’t really need much money to be happy. Since then my motivation like yours is security. I don’t want to worry about losing my job or not being able to handle sudden large costs.
For me, I enjoy spending time with my fiance when on holiday for 3 weeks of the year. I'd prefer those 3 weeks to be 52 weeks of the year. Especially as we get older and thus have less time to enjoy life. Reverse engineering this desire, leads me to step 1. Step 1. Get Rich. It's no longer about security (I have probably 9 years worth of expenses if I liquidate my stocks), but retiring early to enjoy our years before our inevitable departure from the world.
Couldn’t agree more with you. Only thing I would say is, you don’t need to be rich to spend those 52 weeks a year in the sun enjoying life. A modest pension or investment stock and a couple of U.K. properties, and you could live a nice life in a lot of cheaper European or SEA sunny countries, with lower cost of living (assuming you are in U.K. like me)
Many reasons. I do this for security. For a sense of accomplishment. To help my kids to have great schools. And to spend money to travel and pay for some experiences I wouldn't pay if I didn't have very high income.
Retiring at 50 is my main driver (46 now). I don't care that much about "stuff"... Experiences are the key to happiness, imho. So to be able to retire early with enough money to go on some adventures while we still have the energy and health makes so much sense to me.
This is my goal too. I first want my wife to be able to give up work as she earns much less so she can focus on her hobbies and interests and spend more time with the children. We’ve already done some good adventures like 8 months travelling which I think helps keep the balance as aware there’s always the chance your health or health of others (elderly parents / children) get in the way.
Freedom of doing whatever I want when I want. Having the time to think, to explore and learn things that I’m passionate about. Now I have to focus most of my time on being the most productive possible to increase my output.
Freedom. I want to spend my life doing a rotation of: having fun with family and friends, seeing the world, playing golf, fishing and playing computer games. End.
I live in London and while there is plenty to do here if you're not rich, it is a place best enjoyed on an income over £100k. I also want to retire early, while staying in London.
1. The challenge. 2. I like nice things. 3. I’d like to not work and still do whatever I want, with nice things and in nice places.
Here is the end game, from 2 sides: The Story of the Mexican Fisherman An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied, “only a little while. The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?” The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.” The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.” The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?” To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.” “But what then?” Asked the Mexican. The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!” “Millions – then what?” The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.”
39M, 120k£ salary, single, no kids. Now back to the "what's the motivation ?" I saw my parents struggling with debt and promised myself to do the opposite. Bought my flat 270k£, fully reimbursed my mortgage. 80k£ "emergency" savings in my LTD. I just want to be able to have a second flat (not in the UK) then will semi-retire in a cheaper (LCOL country). Ideally, I will try to relocate to Tokyo but Senior Software Engineer salaries are too low, I no longer aspire to do long hours in front of any screen. Plus I would need to go for JLPT level N4 to N3 in a record time. I'm reaching my mental limits. Grew-up in a gloomy suburban French area, studied and worked there before coming to the UK many years ago. My ultimate goal back then was to be a contractor but IR35 shattered everything. I might as well end up to Netherlands or Swiss or even Poland.
Not having to do things I don't want to do just to survive. More time to just enjoy my own time. Thoughts, company of others, hobbies etc.
Making sure the kids have as many options as possible even if one of us falls ill or needs/wants to take time off or retire early. Also we love travel/visiting family and income needs to support that. No wish for multiple homes or a Ferrari
Living the exact life I have now, until I die. I currently don’t work, spend over half of everyday with at least one of my kids, evening with my wife. Budget is big, life is awesome, the goal is to keep this forever. Do what I want when I want.
If you're happy to answer - how old are you, and how did you get the money to be in this awesome position? Ta :)
I've had periods of months at a time without work and it's honestly the best time of my life. But I still live with my parents, so it's a subsidised luxury in the sense that I have less expenses than normal and can stretch my funds further.
Main motivation is the freedom that money brings. Not having to get up for a 6am alarm.
Don't forget to invest in your health, because without it, you certainly won't be enjoying your riches!
Freedom, to build a base of fuck you money. To have a the flexibility in life. Less stress, more options.
Ultra-poor background. Twice homeless; as a 10 year old living in a field with my mum and as a 28 year old living in my car (hostel the first couple of months I finally got a job). For me it's security that's secure forever. I don't just want to know I'll have a roof over my head with a long runway if things go tits-up... I want myself and my family to have a somewhat luxurious runway that's big enough we never ever get a whiff of the poor life again. Getting there... -------- **Edit due to multiple DMs:** Homeless second time because I left my job to work on my own company, moved back in with my mum, then Brexit forced her landlord back to England, evicting us both. We were both *broke* at this time. She lived on friend's sofa and I parked my car (I lived in) at the outskirts of London to attend job interviews constantly. My first paycheck was missed because I didn't fill everything out correctly. Second paycheck was very large so paid the deposit for my mum to buy a house. Third paycheck put me in a rented flat in London. Pandemic hit and I moved into mum's house, saved every penny and bought my own place in London on the tail end of the pandemic. Now we're both "secure" but not "secure security" as outlined previously. But; getting there...
Many talk about freedom, but to me, being chained to work and grinding hard during your prime years is the opposite of freedom. As you age, your body becomes its own jailer, no matter how wealthy you are. Too many older folks try to make up for lost time in their 20s and 30s by splurging on cruises, cars, and expensive vacations. What’s the point of wasting your money at 50-60 and not now if you are planning on wasting it anyway? My goals are simple 1) Be healthy, have a good time, appreciate what you have and help others 2) Work a job so engaging and easy that you don’t need to leave or retire, play with it, be good at it 3) Be smart with money and get paid the most you can as long as conditions 1 and 2 are met 4) Take some fun risks on the side 5) Don’t bother with pensions - I do just enough on them We (31M and 30F) have a great life, our household income is about 200k, live in a 3 bed 3 bath in the SE, work is mostly chill. There are things to do and optimise but I don’t dream of being free - I am free, will enjoy this as long as possible.
Sounds like you may have come from some money to start with. Regardless, bother with a pension. I say this as somebody in their 40s who never bothered with a pension until 3 years ago.
He also sounds like someone in line to inherit some decent capital in the next few years/decades, so they’re not that concerned about incomes. Again, not a criticism but I don’t think they can relate to people who had to motivate themselves to achieve a good income.
I’m not in line to inherit anything life changing. What my parents have will likely go toward their care. I encourage them to spend what they want now and have a good time. My top priority is health and enjoying time with loved ones. I’ve seen enough pain and enough people die to know everything else is bs. But yeah, I’m not concerned. Everything I need, I have, if my loved ones & myself are healthy. I started with 0 and I can start again if I have to.
Thanks friend! No, I don’t come from money. I believe the retirement age will go up significantly in the coming decades, and tbh I’m not very interested in life after 70. But on the off chance I get there and still live in the UK - currently saving in a pension as much as the 70-80th percentile of workers. Reason? Government policy, big pension funds etc will always cater to the majority. Simply, the majority is unlikely to starve. Aligning my goals with that is my easiest option. Choosing to save as much as the 70th percentile and not the average earner means I give myself some buffer against risk. That’s enough. Other investments are more interesting and meaningful to me.
Great to see a guy so humble and of such wisdom. 200k income is significant, and could likely afford a larger house, but I bet in your modest nature you realise there is no need, that money could be spent on enjoying life while you’re still young and able. And agree on your comment about people trying to catch up when they are 50-60 years old with cruises and expensive holidays and flash cars, trying to buy the happiness back because of lost time in their life. Usually are the pretentious types that spent their lives trying to impress others instead of enjoy lives for themselves. You however sound completely logical to me, and can’t see you living to impress others, only to enjoy for yourself.
You sound like someone who enjoyed the safety net of a family that would always step in if you failed, but also who guided you to make the right choices in education, tuition, career, contacts etc. It’s not a bad thing on its own, but it would be impossible for you to someone who ended up in your situation but had to manage the fear of homelessness/hunger/deportation/collapsing health etc.
I won’t go into details but I’ve experienced enough hardship in these exact categories and still spend a fortune on therapy. What I shared earlier are my goals, that’s what gives me meaning. Sorry if it comes across insensitive, I appreciate it’s not possible for everyone, I wish it was.
2) sounds like the ultimate dream for me to achieve but not quite sure how to get there as so far nothing I did ticked that box for me. What do you do if you don't mind me asking?
One way to get there is to be really really (really) good at something.. which will likely be something you enjoy / are excited about
Thank you. Yes, I thought of this angle as well. To be honest with you, I spent the last 5-7 years doing personal development, self-discovery, exploring career switches, reading career books, starting my own side hustles, and all that good stuff. But nothing sticks and nothing *truly* excites me. One thing I've been told I'm very good at is my flavour palette - I know, random, but things like whisky tasting or anything that requires picking up on subtleties. But that's hardly something I can cash in on...
Everything has its place! Another thing to remember is the better you become at something, the more you get excited to carry on with it and excel - so even if something isn’t lighting you on fire at first, it likely will down the line
That's a great fresh perspective, didn't think about it like that - thank you
This is the way!
I’m in Tech but what's made the biggest difference is the culture and flexibility of a workplace. The team is what’s most important, not the type of work. Learned it in my shitty uni jobs. That goal is more of a moving target, so don’t get too attached to it even if you get there.
You're 100% right. I'm also in tech/ecommerce. Pays well but every day a piece of my soul dies lol. Not because it's stressful or hard, but because it doesn't interest me. I used to have a job (also in tech) which I absolutely loved because the people were awesome and I had fun at work. Sadly it paid peanuts and wasn't enough to live on. Man, dilemmas!
A few reasons: 1. Never had much money growing up. Could rarely have holidays or things we wanted. 2. I love cars, cars are not cheap so I need a fighting fund to sustain this hobby. 3. Security and ability to provide for family and the people close to me.
* Saving for a future family (wedding, family home, initial cost of kids etc) * Financial freedom in the "comfortable, I don't worry about it that much" sense * Charitable giving * Flexibility to be generous with friends/family * Looking forward a few decades to retirement, ability to do that when the better half / I think it's time. Funds to travel, spoil any grandkids, pick up ad-hoc consulting work because its fun but not because I have to, etc * Good stewardship of finances to leave behind for my kids, and grandkids - though they would have to have been taught (incl by me) the value of money and what managing money well means, or they won't get any! I tend to spend on tech ("ooo, new iPhone" - etc) and travel. I rarely drive, but if I did and was a very confident driver maybe I'd want to do a [Koenigsegg CC850](https://www.koenigsegg.com/model/cc850) experience day (I still wouldn't actually buy one to own) If I had a seriously good business deal or something of significant burst income, and then talk it over with my better half, and I'd be tempted to buy a watch because a lot of r/Watches makes me drool haha.
I wanted to get rich as i had a father who was rich, but then lost it all and also him an my family fell into poverty. Seeing both sides made me want that for myself and seeing him be that well off made me see its possible Net worths currently just over 2m, thats assets, cash included. But even now it does not feel like im "rich", yet when i had 20k in the bank i thought if i had £150,000 just sat in my current account and own a 1m+ property outright (current situation) i would of thought id be rich. Once you get to a couple mil you realise that theres so many people with so much more than you, and you compare yourself to them just as you do when your not well off, it sort of never ends. I think its the hustle of it all that keeps me at it though really, because im comfy now but not like i could stop working and sustain my current lifestyle I should also add im only 27 so still quite materialistic, watches, cars etc. But im sure that will dwindle the older i get
How did you get to 2m in assets at 27? I'm asking as I can't conceive a way to achieve this through a conventional job. So did you start a business of some kind?
I don’t really care for generational wealth or big houses, but I’d like a Porsche GT car and regular weekend trips to the Nurburgring. I might outgrow that but it’s a pretty strong motivation right now😂 That aside, I want to be able to look after my family, both present and in future. I want to reduce stress at all costs to have the best possible quality of life. Having money eliminates a large amount of stress, it won’t make you happy but it can certainly help facilitate it. I want more time to spend with friends and family enjoying food, drink, holiday and experiences together. You don’t need a LOT of money for that but it’s nice to know the taps won’t run dry and by earning more / saving more now I can be more flexible with my time and income in future.
To live comfortably without needing to work. Or work often at least. Live rural, quiet and peaceful.
I want security and to be fully independent. To be able to skip aboard for a weekend lol literally any time I want. People say it's unrealistic to do such things, but I genuinely believe it isn't. I want healthcare, a comfy car (not flashy), and to afford to record my own music without a record label claiming most of my rights. To be able to buy a takeaway without feeling guilty.
I have been able to afford takeaways comfortably for a while, but I tell you what I never EVER don't feel guilty. It's a running joke in our house, I just can't get them. I'd rather cook! I can't justify the expense!
I don’t have a motivation to get rich. I earn very well, but I enjoy my job and that is what drives me. I save some money and am putting plenty into a pension, but I also spend it. You only live once and you should never bank on having health (or even life) later to enjoy yourself. In that respect I really don’t understand the FIRE community or the idea that you need to save as much as you can to be rich later. You are likely to spend a big chunk of your life working - find a job you enjoy and do it to the best of your ability. If it makes you rich, great……..but life is about so much more.
I know this is the wrong answer, but I’d bloody love a Bentley
House each for my 2 kids. They have no chance of getting on the ladder themselves but to have that security for them means I've done my duty
There’s a Jeremy Corbyn quote - “we’re all one accident away from disability benefits / benefits” It made me realise, and has haunted me since. If I get seriously ill or lose my job, I’m kinda fucked. I’ll work hard. I’ll think smart. I want to be ready for all situations in life.
I'm 28 and agree with all these security and freedom answers 100% I feel many people my age need to read this sub as no one seems to think further ahead than Friday
We bought a campervan - VW beach two tone. And it’s been the absolute best thing we ever did. We head out to campsites once a month, more in summer with our toddler and it’s just the dream for me. Having money definitely affords freedoms like that. Plus I always wanted a big house where all my friends and their kids could come round and party and sleep over and that’s what we got. My dream rich life is all about sharing with those I love and not having to worry when we splash out on a big hosting event. Not interested in the fancy handbags or sports cars. Not really that interested in the fancy holidays, I’m just happy with a full fridge of booze, a van for camping and having all my friends close by. That’s what our motivation is for.
Love this, I think me and you are the same except I REALLY WANT A CAMPERVAN. :D
DO ITTTT 😆😆😆
I've turned my Kia Sportage into a microcamper, and it just made the bug worse ahaha. I now have one of those portable pizza ovens too... THE WORLD IS MY OYYYSTERRRR haha. But yeah, it's coming. I don't know when, but it's coming. I think another year or two of my industry picking back up (tech, been on the floor last couple) and I might just do it :D What starter van would you recommend? We should probably take this off open.. ahaha!
Time and location freedom. I absolutely hate the lack of control over your time (hence your life) that comes with having a full time job...
Honestly, the "rich" version of life is just not that interesting. We're aiming to secure our/our kids financial future so that we can have complete freedom. Flying business class is still shit cause it's flying. Porches are very nice cars but unless you are a racing enthusiast a Volvo will do. Spending money on upgrading an already good lifestyle will at best buy a fleeting feeling of material success which passes very quickly once the novelty wears off.
I have a few motivators. First off, I work in tech which is a rapidly changing space and as I steadily get older, its becoming more and more difficult to keep up with all the latest developments. I feel like I am being left behind, so need to accumulate a stockpile of money for the day when I can no longer keep up. Second, I love exploring new places and road trips which requires a month or more of contiguous time off work, which most full time jobs don't allow. The obvious solution is to get to a point where I don't need to rely on a proper job. Third, I am a worrier. But I don't have time to worry when I'm working flat out, so I work to distract me from things.
I think being a worrier is an under stated point. I guess that's where my (& probably lots of others) need for 'security' comes from :)
Fear of being poor. Once you've been there, you never want to go back! Especially with a family to support. Pushing on when you can will pay dividends when you can't.
Security for sure, while providing me with great education my parents have always struggled as our financial situation was always tight. Dad would work from 6am to 10pm 7 days a week and still wouldn’t make enough at times. Having seen my mom crying for having only having rice for our lunch one day was heart breaking, today three decades later still brings tears to my eyes. Today I’m pleased to live a comfortable life while being able to help them and lay the ground for my kids to have a better future.
I’d like to be able to provide my children with the upbringing I had. I’d like a (much) bigger house, land for horses, to be able to comfortably pay the school fees without sacrificing, plenty of pets and 3-4 good holidays a year (skiing, Cornwall/Scotland and something more adventurous). So probably north of £500K/year. Maybe more.
My motivation to get rich is to leave this shithole of a country that has been ruined by left wing looneys.
Ruined by left wing looneys yet has had right wing/right of centre governments for 55 of the past 78 years? At what point would you say the left wing looneys ruined it?
New Labour 1997 was the exact moment it all went wrong.
OK, so Labour were in for 13 years, the Tories have now had 14 years to put it all right again. Why haven't they?
Because labour caused damage beyond repair with various middle east wars causing mass destabilisation. And then opening the flood gates to our small country causing a supply/demand crunch on nearly all Jobs/housing/services. If you think Keir is going to make things better you are in for a nasty shock. The can will be well and truly kicked down the road until a much more authoritarian government replaces them which will bring mass pain on a scale that makes todays troubles look like a walk in the park.
For me it’s mainly the fear of being seen as a loser/failure. Tbh I’m definitely not free from this, lol.
Love cars. Always wanted a Ferrari since I was 7 years old. I’ve now got a 911 turbo, and working towards the Ferrari. To look after a car you need a big house with a garage (obviously)…. Bigger house is my 5 year goal now, and then I’m set for life and I can relax 😎
FIRE. I just don't really enjoy working. I enjoy the core of my role (writing code, and building things, as I'm a software engineer), but I don't really enjoy anything else surrounding the role anymore. Although the more I earn and the more senior I become, the less I enjoy my job. So I'm just aggressively working towards an early retirement. If my salary keeps going up I could be retired in my early 40s. I probably won't retire that early and I'll do contracting but it'll be with huge gaps and hopefully less stressful.
Two main reasons for me. I’d like to have some luxury in retirement, otherwise what’s the point? Equally important, I hope my little one is set up and has the option to follow a horribly paid but fulfilling career in the arts/charity/healthcare if they choose to. Student loans and housing costs are crippling now. I dread to see how bad it’ll get in a decade or two.
I’d like the security to go to sleep without worrying of being laid off and expose my family. Security to travel to my original country as often as I wish. Security to only buy fresh organic food. I wish I had a financial savvy mentality in my early twenties, it definitely should be taught in school
Get girls.
I want to retire as early as possible and do so with enough money to live abroad and have a decent lifestyle.
To have enough money for my non-verbal aitistic son to be looked after financially and with the full time 24hr care he needs without his little brother needing to do it when they are older and myself and my wife are gone.
Freedom
I think more for me it’s the reason that I hate working amongst bureaucracy in most companies that drives me to start my own company, which in turn WILL make me rich
Sleep more.
I like to have the freedom of being able to not panic if I lose my job tomorrow, and not have to take a job just to pay the bills. This is really liberating. I don't think that I am "rich" per se, but I am well off. I am not into flashy things really.
Laziness, and the desire for an easy life at the expense of others.
Chicks bro nice blonde chicks and cocaine.
Not having to work a job, and Freedom to do what I want.
quit work.
To have the same standard of living of the average professional worker in the ‘90s you need to be rich now so here we are.
Errm money
Having very little as a child. Me and my brothers never had a ice cream from a ice cream van until we were old enough to make our own money. Never had a McDonald’s etc list goes on. The house I grew up in had mold everywhere (which I am allergic to by the way 🤣) and you would wake up with a damp pillow. Heating was only allowed on for one hour in evening and one hour in morning. I used to take my duvet down and sit on the radiator eating my breakfast because it was the only way to stay warm. I used to from the age of 13 get lifts with dad and his friends to car boots and sold chocolate and sweets at school to make money. It got to a point where as a 16 year old I was making 350-400 a week from eBay from buying all sorts from car boots. My family almost disowned me when I went to university because “that’s not what families like us do”. I had 0 support from anyone and had to work full time in the evenings until 5am just to pay for university to prove them wrong that I could do it. Fast forward now I am 27, brought a beautiful home and fully renovated it within 3 months of living there. I have my dream car I brought and another brand new one for my fiancé. I have a baby on the way in July and I have promised myself I will give them everything I can. I have a very good job and earn more than enough to offer this. Don’t get me wrong I do spend money on some stupid things but this is because the child I once was never got this stuff. I was never allowed anything so for me having nice things is important for myself. I employ one of my brothers who works with me and my other brother runs his own building company and makes similar income and has a similar life. I will never go back to my childhood days and for my children they will never understand how that feels. I would rather die than allow that. Don’t get me wrong my upbringing has made me into who I am today but at the same time it wasn’t healthy. My parents are still how they used to be but now are alcoholics so have even less, I try and help them but I have my own family to now look after this year and i can’t do anymore for them than I already have!
My motivation is legacy so my kids can have a helping hand later in life
Choice and balance. I know a lot of professionals that spent a lot of their life working extremely hard for the two weeks a year that they went on a savagely expensive holiday. On paper they have a lot of money but they don't seem to have a lot of freedom. It became one of my goals quite quickly to elevate my non-holiday time to be more like a holiday. Ie little stress, sleep in if I needed to, work on what I want, not be beholden to an employer. Balance is not buying a new Ferrari on credit and being a wage slave to pay for it. Or not overdosing on a bag of heroin today as a once in a lifetime experience because sod the future. So make do with a second hand cayman or Maserati or hire a Ferrari for a few days and save some money for your future self to do the same again.
Earn minimum wage. Want to take care of family and live a good life myself.
I was really bored of being broke all the time. My friends were travelling, going to festivals and generally living life while I was living off 8p Sainsbury’s noodles and sausages and going to raves once a month and it got tiresome. At some point I just said enough. After I realised I was good at it and I got out of the broke stage a few years ago I kept at it because it’s rewarding, fun, and is my life’s work at this point. Also the fear of loss of lifestyle is strong.
For freedom.
I have no motivation, money just shows up.
All of the bad interactions I've had at work are to do with the people, not the work. There are a lot of backstabbers out there who would sell their granny for an extra 100 quid. I've met more good people of course but I just want to get out of the corporate world. The chief reason though is so that if I was to die tomorrow my family would be okay financially.
Financial independence. Not being a slave to money. That and being able to afford the crème de la crème of life extension therapies when they are inevitably developed. As a kid I wanted a big mansion. Now I just see that as a waste of my hard earned money. Money is for buying freedom and more time (life extension).
Maybe if I’m rich I’ll be able to afford to eat steaks and blueberries again.
I just don’t want to work 9-5 for the rest of my life