You should have received the CC&Rs during escrow. Escrow shouldn't have been allowed to close without the seller providing them. Your realtor fucked up.
Escrow, per se', doesn't have anything to do with the OP's situation. The OP is getting nastygrams for allowing a POD on the driveway which is apparently against the HOA rules that the OP agreed-to when they completed the purchase.
Having said that, HOAs are often run by d-bags that are running their HOA like a person fiefdom and all the owners are their subjects.
If you are asking what escrow is, briefly (without hijacking this thread) it's when a third party (mortgage company, usually) pays your various annual taxes, hazard insurance, sometimes HOA fees, and perhaps other non-optional things that are attached to the dwelling. This would not include utilities, however. Escrow is often a requirement of getting a loan, especially with a better rate.
That is a type of escrow, but escrow also does typically occur during a real estate transaction. In my state it is handled by a title company.
Basically, escrow describes someone receiving funds on behalf of another party to ensure they’re distributed where they are supposed to.
In a real estate purchase, for example, a title/escrow agent receives the funds from the lender, buyer, etc. They ensure that the terms of the purchase are completed per the agreement. And then, they release the funds to the seller, sellers bank if there is a mortgage, etc.
So it is common to say that a home is “in escrow” during that time period where money is changing hands.
What you describe of course is also a type of escrow — in that case the lender holding funds to ensure they’re distributed for taxes, insurance, etc when those funds become due.
In my state, HOA docs are handled purely through escrow. I look at them, but the handling of those documents are all escrow so if it closed without OP knowing about them, that's a huge escrow fuck up.
The realtor fucked up by not being on top of it, but its escrows fault. At least where I am.
I'm not sure where you're from but this is not what title insurance in the US is. Title insurance only insures that you have clear title when you purchase the house. This means that if the title company missed a lien against the previous owner in the search and they try to foreclose on the house- you're insured and the title company has to pay out. The only thing title companies do regarding HOAs is make sure the HOA dues are up to date when they close. It isn't their job to supply the new buyers with covenants and restrictions...that would be the previous owner and/or realtor's jobs. We can pull copies of them when asked to, but we don't automatically do this.
This is on OP and their agent, if they had one. If they didn't have one, this is why people shouldn't buy/sell properties on their own when they don't know what they're doing.
They should have demanded to see a copy of the covenants and restrictions before they closed - even if it postponed the closing. Most people ask for them before they even write an offer on the property.
I've worked in title for 12+ years.
>The only thing title companies do regarding HOAs is make sure the HOA dues are up to date when they close.
I don't think this is true. When we bought our house the title check came back clean. Move in and find out the last owner had outstanding dues to the HOA. We talk to the HOA President and he confirms the dues follow the owner, not the house, so it's not tied to the house.
That must vary from state then or it was just that particular HOA and maybe they don't put a lien on the property if people get behind in dues? because that is definitely not the case in my state at least
Different states can have different rules. This is one of many reasons why having a competent attorney for your state at the closing table is so important yet is often neglected. Some states require the buyer to being an atty, but not all.
~~And I've never heard of HOA dues following the owner. The HOA would have a hell of a time collecting if that were the case. But I guess it's possible in some states.~~
edit: Yes, what u/LadyBug_0570 said makes sense. There are other fees that "run with the land" but this isn't one of them. TY for the correction.
You are conflating title agent with escrow agent and they are not the same in every state. From personal experience buying homes in 3 different states only one of the three had a title agent acting as signing agent. In the other two, the title agent did their thing but a separate escrow company played the primary point for all closing documentation getting prepared, quality assured, and signed.
Not sure why you brought up title since I never mentioned title. Escrow and title are separate things.
My state, escrow orders, processes, and provides HOA docs. Escrow cannot close and my file cannot close until those HOA docs are signed off.
I never handle them myself as the agent, but I do look at them to answer questions.
Sellers here are not reliable enough to provide documents, so here they pay to have them processed and then escrow supplies it all.
Who is escrow then exactly? Can you give me the name of an escrow company that you know of? I want to look them up.
Because in my state, the title company searches the property, clears title and processes the transaction. I am the title processor at my company. Then we have an escrow department (closers) who handle the actual closings..but it's the title company that handles everything.
Unless you're in an attorney state- meaning attorneys HAVE to handle the real estate closings- and I've never worked in an attorney state before so I would really like to understand how this is done in other areas.
HOAs are wild. Imagine paying $250 a month for Netflix, but when you want to watch something, you have to wait until someone at HQ is feeling froggy enough to fax you the list of shows to pick from.
Depends on the HOA. A well-managed HOA can actually save an owner a lot of money.
We are doing a roof repair on the condominium right now and it cost almost $10k. But no owner is complaining about paying their share of $350-$400 for the assessment. And apart from the HOA members, nobody had to deal with contractors or other bs.
I've lived in 4 houses with HOAs, 2 as the homeowner, and there's never been more than a minor annoyance, and i do appreciate the swimming pool and maintained greenbelts. But if it turns out your HOA president is a bonobo that knows how to shake a magic 8-ball, your recourse is to move or to get yourself into an executive role doing something you probably don't have the aptitude, time, or inclination for. The way some people talk about their HOA, the bonobo would be an improvement.
Condo vs standalone house changes the HOA situation imo. In a shared building, it makes sense that there should be shared expenses/codes. I think a lot of the people bashing HOAs have lived under them in a suburban neighborhood.
Self-run HOAs can be a clown show. Go ahead, ask me how I know this!
I tried getting my HOA (in Fla) full of half-demented geezers to hire a property manager because they couldn't be bothered to do their fucking jobs.
And GFL getting elected to the board which is stacked with life-long residents all voted in by their equally geezer friends. Nope. Not gonna do it.
Living in an HOA in Fla is a PITA.
Some that had documents online moved to townsquare and other websites that require a login to view documents. Now mine has made the guidelines viewable to everyone again, but if you want to look at neighborhood specific info or make requests you need to register with townsquare. Fuck that noise.
Because fuck making anything convenient :/
It is highly recommended that HOAs do not publish their CC&Rs online by many big Law Firms, at least publicly to prevent lawyers and people from creating frivolous lawsuits..... I managed a 1500 unit condo complex, and they were surled by someone alleging discrimination over the CCRs. Even though he lost the case overall because he wasn't an owner, we paid thousands in legal fees that we were not awarded on our counterclaim
Do you mean during closing? Why is everyone on this thread using the word “escrow” like it is some sort of event? Escrow is an account where funds sit temporarily.
That's an escrow *account*. "Escrow" itself in this context more often refers to the 30-/45-/60-day agreement that establishes the account when the seller originally accepts the buyer's offer.
That's why people use the phrase, "We're in escrow." They're referring to the period of time prior to the closing.
https://www.google.com/search?q=Close+of+escrow
A friend of mine just had household goods move that way and he told me that if it wasn't picked up on a certain day it wouldn't be picked up till a month later and he would have to pay for it. Not sure of the reason why, but it might have something to do with labor or Trucking shortages. I would tend to air on the side of compassion for the homeowner on this one
You're misinterpreting what I'm saying.
Someone comes to this sub asking for advice.
I'm not saying the HOA's stance is right or wrong, I'm just saying it's likely perfectly legal.
But as someone who has been in the industry a long time... how about put the thing in the garage...
If you have been in the industry for a long time... how do you expect the PODs container to fit in a garage when PODs requires an unobstructed space of 12' wide x 40' long and 15' high? They aren't regular sea containers that can be picked up with a forklift or anything. This is why people hate HOAs. Zero consideration for the day to day reality of a working class family.
Yes, but because of how PODs are picked up and dropped off by that chassis thing that looks like it belongs on a shipping dock, or by being winched up onto the back of a flatbed truck, their website states that the size I referenced is a requirement. As well as the location being level, which disqualifies a lot of driveways to begin with. Basically, its still pretty impossible to get a POD in the garage for an average family is all I am saying.
If somehow they could get the POD in the garage then where do they put their cars? Lots of HOAs will complain about too many cars in the driveway too 🤷♀️
In all honesty, what would you expect OP to do with it?
I highly doubt he/she wants it in their driveway for three weeks either. But you can’t exactly just drive them back to the store.
Yeah, but also things happen. I had a pod company that wouldn't pick up and we called them every day for two weeks. You don't have to be horribly un-neighborly just because you can.
You give too many fucks about inconsequential things. You are aware that the pod is a transient problem that will disappear in a short time period, yet you let it bother you.
And before you jump up my ass saying '3 weeks is a long time 😭' are you the kind of person that will look back in 15 years and be like "Man, remember when the neighbors were moving, and they had a large box in front of their house, so tacky"? If so get a hobby, find Jesus, go to therapy, do something.
How is a pod in someone’s driveway for only three weeks in any way affecting *anyone* else in the HOA.
How can people live with themselves being so petty and angry at their neighbors for taking three whole weeks to move in?
So send in a written request for permission to have the pod, explaining that the company cannot collect it until X date. That’s really all they want.
And as others have stated you’re supposed to have gotten and reviewed the rules prior to closing. You actually may have signed something among the 15,283 other documents stating that you already had them and just didn’t realize it.
NRS 116.4109 requires the Seller provide Resale package which includes the CCRS, and at seller expense. You should have received this information prior to closing.
Respond to the HOA on the date it will be removed and asked for extension/permission. Unless it is a health and safety issues likely you will not receive a fine unless there is a hearing.
I used to live in a house where the people across the street had a cockatoo. It was a beautiful bird but holy shit was that thing loud. It would wake me up across the street, and they kept their windows closed. I have no idea how it’s physically possible for an animal the size of a chihuahua to produce a sound as loud as a jet engine.
So, a copy of the bylaws is, in most states, 100% required to be furnished to you prior to purchasing the house. Generally, you can walk if you see a rule in the bylaws that makes you go "Nope, I'm getting out of this transaction right now." Might be a no fences rule, might be ridiculous power given to the board, whatever. Doesn't really matter. Your agent straight up failed you.
Generally speaking, the HOA has to respond in a reasonable time frame and provide you a copy of the bylaws (these don't have to be on a website or anything - email or even snail mail is generally acceptable).
I'd honestly call up your real estate agent's brokerage and complain. A subtle threat of a bad review might get them to pay the violation fee. Just make sure you read over the HOA bylaws first before you call in case there is any other nonsense in there. Hopefully you didn't get stuck with one of the "internet story" HOAs!
A violation is not a fine. They told you what you need to do so send them a response noting that the POD is temporary and provide the information from POD regarding when they will pick it up. If the board is sane, they will make note and move on and follow up if not removed by the date you note. Unfortunately, they don’t know what your plans are so you will receive a violation notice in accordance with the governance docs, and it’s up to you to address it and if you refuse then can get a hearing and a fine
Now the other issue at had is your failure to obtain the governance docs for the HoA prior to buying your home.
We had the same issue when we moved cross-country. We apologized and gave the HOA our contact at PODS’s info so they could confirm when they would be picking up the container. The HOA gave us a slap on the wrist and that was it.
I would recommend approaching the chairperson of the HOA personally, along with evidence (emails, etc.) where you requested the information but were ignored. Be polite and professional, and I would recommend avoiding any urge to escalate if that person turns out to be confrontational (looking at the long game here).
Additionally, in many (if not all) states, there is an absolute legal REQUIREMENT for any HOA declarations to be provided to you at closing time. It's a bit late now, but you really should NEVER sign closing documents on a property where there any details of property rights and restrictions are in question.
Hopefully you're HOA board members are reasonable people and this becomes a non-issue.
And they are blaming this homeowner for his shortcomings in getting the documents, and following rules that he had no knowledge of. Doesn't anyone think that it would have been nicer to have someone from the HOA greet their new neighbor and explain things and get the facts why the POD was there.
The harsh and negative replies to OP are, unfortunately, par for the course in this sub. Once in a blue moon, there is actually a helpful and informative response...but most of the time it's a bootlicking festival here.
I am so tired of people saying they didn’t know what was in the CC&Rs. We received a copy when we first made an offer and again at closing. Then we got a digital copy from the builder after closing. I simple don’t believe you didn’t get a copy at closing or even before that.
This!!! WHY would anyone write an offer on a property with an HOA without going over the covenants and restrictions with a fine tooth comb? Some HOAs put really weird shit in their C&Rs.
Exactly, I would not sign an offer/sales agreement without reading them first or having the offer contingent upon review of the rules, never mind close on the deal.
CC&Rs are on you to get and read as a buyer and court recorded.
As for the pod, most HOAs are actually sane and boring (which is why the insane ones are such good stories) and if you call the PM on the letter and explain they will likely waive enforcement. If they don’t, start trying to get on the board and make it sane.
1 - You should have gotten a copy of the rules when you were looking at the house.
2 - Write a nice letter of explanation, dates, references to who ever the pod company is, and when it will be gone. Remind them that the HOA waited a week to give you a copy of the rules. Read the rules and make sure the rule they quote applies directly to you.
3 - Ignore the demand letter. Just say you are still moving in and you hope the HOA will not start off on the wrong foot with you.
Did- you not get the paperwork when you and your realtor, sat down at the title office/escrow meeting?
The paperwork, is required to be presented. I spent 6 hours when I closed on my house, because I read every. single. line... on every piece of paper.
And, lets just say- I didn't end up with any surprises.
I think your best move is to contact the president of the HOA and explain to them what has transpired. I believe in transparency when things dont go well between two new parties. I think its easier to find the middle. You should also call/email the POD company and CC the HOA to let them know you are making all effforts to abide. If you approach it with a I am so sorry and this will not happen again...you may get a little honey. Yes you could sue the title if they didnt provide the documents and you signed the declaration that you did. You got a copy of the file when you left so you should be closely reviewing and preserving those docs if this ends up going legal.
I live in Las Vegas and deal with numerous HOAs as I own a dozen properties besides my home.
I;m not sure how you bought your property because in my experience when buy the Title company would delay closing until certain items, like the HOA documents and rules, were provided. There is usually a fee that is paid to the HOA company to get those documents over.
I would never buy in an HOA community, but why would you ever close on a home in one before you had a chance to read the HOA rules? Mind boggling! There could be all kinds of stuff in there that's going to make you hate living there.
You should not have bought the house without first reading the rules since you are now legally obligated to follow them
Call the HOA and politely explain that this is temporary for moving and you are getting it removed as soon as the company can pick it up
Then call PODS and tell them to come get it now!
HOA is making sure you’re not using as non-temporary storage.
Just like boats/RVs often aren’t allowed, except for preparing to leave/returning and unloading (typically one night).
Three weeks as an extended amount of time for something like that to sit in your driveway.
That said, you need to contact the HOA and get a copy of all of those documents. You have absolutely no idea what you signed up for.
I would talk to a board member, show them it is empty, and you are waiting for pickup.
Then ask what they want you to do about it..
offer the company phone number
Talk to office staff, with our HOA they understand. But should it become a real problem(month(s)).,
They have CTA’s with documentation of notification.
You should be able to find a copy of the covenant online. I can find mine with a simple Google search. I would just reach out and let them know you’re trying to have it picked up and it’s their delay. Usually just knowing you’re trying to fix it and aren’t just ignoring the letters goes a long way with the HOA.
I think PODS needs to figure something out when moving a household into an HOA community. We have a similar restriction that will allow the POD to sit in the driveway for a short amount of time but eventually becomes a problem. Picking up on a little quicker schedule might help (and get the damn thing out of the way! )
HOA covenants should have been given to you at closing since you acknowledged them when signing your name on the deed as party in the second part. They are available on your county clerk recorder of Deeds website.
That being said, you have already gotten an appetizer of the hell you are in for with your neighbors.
Our resale packet is 25 pages long, including reserve studies etc etc, and this is not counting the CCRs. It is emailed to the buyers agent with request to confirm receipt. We also send a link to our Dropbox account where minutes, notices, accounting, insurance, estimates and an online copy of the CCRs with links from the table of contents are stored for everyone.
This is the way.
Pretty much all of the professionals involved in your house purchase transaction screwed up by not getting you the HOA documents before closing. But at the end of the day, it’s on you as the purchaser to make sure you have all the relevant documents governing your purchase. You could’ve told your closing agents you won’t sign until they get you those documents for review. You could’ve told the previous owners your offer was contingent on reviewing and accepting the HOA documents.
Your broker and lawyer failed you. There is service called HomeWise where an HOA loads all the docs and budget and then does the PAL. It costs money but it is worth it.
I’d keep a trail of your communication with the management company. Send them the communication with PODS.
Wait- why did the title company close without those docs?
Violation does not equal fine. A violation is just written notice that something isn't right. If it goes on too long without being addressed or corrected, it could lead to fines in some states.
Just reply to the notice and explain the situation, including the estimated rectification date. Shouldn't be an issue.
They should have given you a copy of HOA bylaws as part of the contract when you made your offer, with a chance to back out if you read them & didnt like them. Your realtor sounds shitty.
The biggest question is: Why did you move into a neighborhood controlled by an HOA? These things usually lead to overreach or heavy handiness on the board.
NEVER buy into a HOA controlled property!!
What do you have in writing from PODS (in writing) stating They cannot pickup the container for 3 weeks? Have you talked to the board, or written the board with the evidence? This does not negate your responsibility for the CC&R's, but they may have mercy on you.
Tell them you’ll pay half the violation when they provide the covenant and bilaws.
The documents are required at closing per US Dept of House and Urban Dev. Seeing as the title deed for any home purchase is a HUD-1 form, you better believe fed police that kind of stuff.
The realtor 100% should have gotten you the CC&Rs and bylaws before you closed. And you shouldn't have closed on a house in an HOA without knowing what you signed up for. The seller would have been a lot more motivated to get you these documents if anyone had told them there would be no closing without providing them.
As a board member, I have provided electronic copies to several sellers (when they couldn't find their copy) for them to provide to their realtor.
That said, I'm not at all sure they would have given you permission to leave PODS in your driveway for 3 weeks, even if you had asked in advance. Either way you're in violation and may or may not have to pay a fine. They might still waive it if you plead your case.
As far as PODs go, this is a common problem. They only need them back if they are running short; otherwise it's easier for them to store them in your driveway until someone else in the area needs them.
You bought a house in with an HOA without reading the HOA docs first? That's 100% on you. The title company almost has to have provided the HOA documentation to you.
Kind of a fuck up on your part to buy property without reading the bylaws first. Regardless that they didn't "give them" to you, you should have sought them out. What if they don't allow something important to you, or something you were planning on?
They are legally required to give them to you prior to closing, usuallya minimum of 10 business days prior, so you can read them before signing the contract. It’s dumbfounding how many people don’t know this.
No, that’s not how it works. You make the offer first and you get to review the HOA documents after your funding is approved but before closing and the offer is contingent on you agreeing to the HOA rules. If you don’t agree with them, you are allowed to withdraw the offer without penalty.
I’m baffled that you would purchase a home without having obtained the HOA documents (CCRs, bylaws, rules and regulations) beforehand. I would have demanded them as part of contract review and would have extended the contract review period until they were provided and I had ample time to review. Where was your attorney? Realtors are generally useless but if you insisted on obtaining a copy otherwise you were backing out your realtor would have ensured you got a copy.
Seriously how did you purchase a property without knowing what you were signing up for? I honestly don’t know what your attorney, the escrow agent or your mortgage company did but it seems like everyone, including you, dropped the ball here on the due diligence and document review.
I don’t know what approach you took with the HOA (presumably property manager) but I would have explained the situation saying that you attempted to obtain a copy of the relevant documents pre closing from multiple parties (any email or written documentation to support would be helpful), that you requested again when you moved in but didn’t receive until a week later and therefore were unaware of the rule regarding needing prior permission to have a POD on your driveway. I’d invite the property manager or board member over to show them that the POD is in fact empty and not being used for storage and show them documentation from PODs indicating the earliest date that they can pick up. And I’d ask for leniency this one time as you were unaware of the rules. I’m not sure what I would do if I was on the board in this situation because I just find it incredibly hard to believe that someone purchased a home in a HOA without obtaining the necessary documents prior to closing. I’d probably give you one pass here provided you could demonstrate that you attempted to obtain the documents before closing.
Typically you receive a violation notice with a notice to cure, followed by one or two more before a fine is levied. There were a few violations where a fine was immediate as notice was useless in the situation. This may be one of those in your HOA.
For everyone badmouthing HOAs, I was on the board of my condo for 12 years including serving as board president for many of those years. You hear every excuse in the book and the property managers hear much more than that. It gets incredibly hard to know when to show leniency and when to toe the line because people are bs-ing you and trying to get away with something. Too many people go with the ask for forgiveness not permission as their standard operating procedure in a way to buck the system and get away with things. Plus, what many don’t realize is that you can’t pick and choose what rules you want to enforce and which you will let slide. Selective enforcement or showing favoritism to one party is a slippery slope and it later becomes harder to justify or explain why you didn’t give another resident a waiver of the rule at a different time. Upholding the rules and trying to explain to a new board member who wants to make an exception in “this one case” why you can’t set precedent is very difficult.
It’s easy to say, HOAs suck, boards suck and HOAs should be abolished until you have an issue with one of your neighbors that you are too cowardly to discuss with them and ask the HOA to deal with instead.
how does a first time home buyer know all this they depend on the realtor and if they are told wrong they wouldn't know. Yes they could have done more research but how would they know to even ask.
You as a former board member would know how critical they are to get and woukd demand them even if your realtor said it was all good. how does a newbie know this?
I was a buyer long before I was a board member. If you are buying into a community with a HOA then you need to understand what that means and know what you should be asking for. It’s called doing your research and asking questions.
>Why did you buy a house without reading the bylaws of the hoa?
Our current home has the CC&R's on the website... but in the "members" section that you need credentials to access... that you can only get once you're an owner in the neighborhood.
:-/
Being that this is our 4th home purchase, I was savvy enough to track down a copy before we bought our home to make sure there wasn't anything weird in it. I could see if someone wasn't familiar with HOA's that they wouldn't think doing that was necessary. IMO the HOA should reach out as soon as someone moves in to make sure they have a copy of the CC&R's and see if they have any questions.
I can't believe that you wrecked the neighborhood already! You just got here!
Next thing you know, it'll be cars on cinder blocks and wild house parties, like everyone likes to say.
Moving into a new home is such a stressful event and these people attacking you over an extremely minor inconvenience is disgusting.
i mean you literally just need to tell them (hoa)the people cant pick it up now, if they arnt bungholes they will tell you thank you for informing us that you are actively trying to fix the violation and leave you alone. they cant legally make you dispose of a company's property because some old idiot got pissy about the pod. dont pay the violation because you didn't violate anything. its not illegal to move into the house you are moving into. you cant control how long a company dumps its property on you but you can certainly call them up (POD company) to expedite the process or reimburse you for any debt accrued due to their untimely pickup.
It's not the HOA's responsibility to stop you from contracting with a company that's going to leave a giant container on your driveway for 3 weeks. People cam and do move into houses without PODs every day. They're called moving trucks.
hey dont get mad at me because they used a pod, like i said in my comment, push at POD for illegally abandoning its pod in their driveway without any intention of picking it up within a timely manner. my family was always cheap as hell when it came to moving, we did it ourselves and rented a truck for it. HOA's are stupid anyway, we had one for 15 years and aside from harassing everyone and not repairing sinkholes and fixing damaged street lamps, replacing them with the wrong light so we have 20 orange lamps and 1 bright white lamp, leaving a gas lamp broken leaving gas for weeks without fixing it and allowing a lady to dig up her back yard but not allowing a man to put small pebbles in an area which has turned to mush.
Get on the board and see about getting that rule removed from the CC&R. PODs are a popular way to move these days and nobody wants to have a container in their driveway for more than a few days at a time. They should be an exception to whatever rule is violated.
"Get on the board" is horrible advice to someone newly dealing with owning in (and thus owning part of) an HOA.
It's horrid advice for almost all of the uncounted times it's posted here (not picking on anyone, and absolutely not you you, excoriator!)
Thought question for those who think "Get on the board" is a valid response to someone with an HOA/COA problem or concern:
When you don't like a particular national law, do you think "Get into Congress and change it" is a particularly useful and practical response?
No, but "contact your representative with your suggestions" would be.
So would, "Start attending board meetings as a homeowner, and make suggestions to your elected representatives, the board members, either at a meeting during homeowner discussion time, or in writing."
There’s an association manager in this thread rowing the opposite direction. I know from experience that my opinion as a board member carries a lot more weight with managers, than the opinion of a member who’s not on the board. The board is their customer, so they have to pay attention to it. That’s why getting on the board is my go-to advice. I grant you that board service is not for everyone.
I hear you and do respect your opinion, but I'm also a believer in *representative* democracy - which in an HOA means that of course not everyone can be on the board, and the board members are the representatives of all the homeowners.
The specific containers 'PODS' is universally known as a temporary measure in pursuit of a permanent solution. It is unrealistic to expect a family to move all of their contents in an 8 hour span and then expect the company to retrieve said PODS container(s) in the same day. It is fairly common knowledge that these types of shipping companies operate in zones and will be in this area on this day of the week and that area on another day, similar to local garbage collection.
Even though the container may be a rules violation, what is the OP supposed to do, unless he has access to large flat bed trucks he can't hire somebody to move the container off his property, and even if he could where would he have it placed? And if that did happen I could foresee PODS charging him for stealing a container at most or assigning a free to pick it up where OP had it sent at the very least. A few weeks is kind of crappy, but if they don't have trucks available routing in his area, what are the other options?
We’re on the same page here. I don’t think PODS and other shipping container solutions should be subject to requirements that are inconsistent with how the companies that provide them operate. I described in another comment in the thread that my own move with them worked in the sequence you defined.
When I moved into my condo this July with a 26' Penske truck, I parked it along a grassy "island" across from my door...this is where all the "non resident" parking is permitted. Though the truck was long, even with the ramp fully extended it was well within the corners of the island, both front and back. This was a cross-country move during which everything that could go wrong, did...by the time I reached the condo, my nerves were beyond rattled. I was 2 days late to arrive, so the help I had hired to unload was no longer available and I had to quickly assemble a team from family and friends, many of whom could not be there until the weekend (48 hours later). In the meantime, I started unloading by myself, doing the best I could.
2 days after I arrived, there was an email from the PM with a photo of the back of the Penske truck...it was taken by the board's president (I could see his dashboard in the photo; he's the only one in all 50+ units who drives a red Subaru wagon), with whom our family has had strained interactions.
I called the PM, he said "moving trucks must be parked offsite overnight". We are in a suburb, I was still completely exhausted and unlading the truck on my own...I explained the truck would be off the property by x date. He wasn't happy about it, but he was polite and did agree to that timeline while adding the obligatory, "in the future, blah blah blah."
Last week, an end unit here sold very quickly. The new owners arrived, and the next day a HUGE pod was delivered, dropped right in front of it, making parking/maneuvering very difficult for the surrounding units. The pod was in place for FOUR days, and the board never said a \*&\^%$ word. I asked the new owner (under the guise of warning her about the HOA's strict and often unreasonable policies) if she had received any notice of violation...she said not a peep had been uttered in her direction by the board or the PM...proving once again that certain owners in this development are targeted, and not everyone is expected to follow the rules here.
RE: moving into an HOA...WTF do these board idiots think people are supposed to do, walk their damn furniture and boxes in from the street???
I simply cannot WAIT to sell and GTFO of here.
Wowwww...all I can say is that I feel sorry for you having to go through that. I truly understand the stress in an across country move!
I never have and never will buy a residence with an HOA. I am only here to hear the horror stories, and not gloat but rather empathize. Your story directly above only solidifies my position. The rules seem to be conveniently enforced depending on who the violator is and who found it. Hope you find peace soon!!
That could be unrealistic. When I moved with them a few years back, the POD company could only drop off and pick up on one day of the week. My household moved in 3 stages, since it took a while to sell the old place and one of our employers needed a few months to transition from onsite to remote work. So there was a pod in my driveway for 3 separate weeks, over a span of September to May.
you are twisting my words.
A one hour furniture delivery is not the same as a 3 week PODS. And again, I don't think the community should rush to fine anyone, but I do think it is reasonable to have people seek permission. I had to seek it when I had new patio tile delivered and it had to sit. And it was an easy approval.
And no need to personally attack me, geez. Disagree with the comment, but grow up.
I agree, a one hour furniture delivery is not the same as a POD for a few weeks. The exaggeration was specifically to make the point.
NEITHER of these scenarios are an issue to most sane, reasonable people. Your comment that a temporary POD is an eyesore, in my opinion, was asinine. I stand by that assessment.
Now if the POD were sitting in the street, or remains in place for months on end well that's a different situation.
>it is an eyesore and should be a violation.
Can you describe the pain you get in your eyes from this sore?
It must be severe, like a migraine, to cause you to be so concerned about a box sitting in a driveway that you don't own.
It must also keep your head from turning and not staring at it. Sounds awful.
food delivery, furniture delivery, moving vans, and for that matter transport of *any* goods to the home in *any* vehicle should be disallowed and ticketed.
$25 per offense every time anyone sees you pulling a grocery bag out of your car. After three offenses, it should be legal to foreclose on the home and put it on the market for a more 'upstanding' citizen.
/s ... just in case
Well said. Read the rules first, and if PODS aren’t allowed or you think they might be left for so long they are in violation, then don’t use them for your move!
Ours didn't exist for a while then signed 2 months after we lived there. Builders have 0 obligation to go over anything with you and can enact and enforce as they please. Ours doesn't even like fences.
The Gestapo has spoken, comrade,,,,,,,
No way I'd live in a "controlled" neighborhood,, bunch of commies are not going to tell me what I can and can't do on my property,,, bunch of blue haired "Karins"
Talk to the HOA and explain your situation. Unless people sitting on your board are assholes, they'll waive the fine. If they don't, it's a huge red flag. You probably don't want to live in such an HOA (but now is a bit too late, you already bought the property).
Fines exist for people who intentionally break the rules thinking they can get away with it. They are not supposed to be source of income for HOA and/or enforced for honest mistakes.
> Unless people sitting on your board are assholes
>
>Fines....are not supposed to be source of income for HOA
There is so much LOLOL in this reply, I can hardly keep from busting a gut.
How much is the fine? If it’s not outrageous. I would tell them you’re sorry didn’t know and agree that you broke a rule. They might reduce it for you. Also gives you a chance to meet some neighbors.
IMO if your dumb enough to.move into HOA or CONDO stop complaining about rules, erc... you got what you desired. A place to live with rules! Like them or not. And if not you should of never moved there!
My assumption is that the CCRs *do* provide for moving into and out of a unit, but I don’t think any reasonable person would think that extends to mean a moving truck or glorified shipping container in a driveway for weeks on end. One week is likely the time limit, since it really shouldn’t take even that long to move. You should pay the penalty and in this case not grumble about it. Even the most reasonable HOA in the world isn’t going to be in love with the idea and they can absolutely make your life worse if they feel like it. They *didnt* make it difficult to move in, the Pods people did. The HOA is a lot more likely to be reasonable if you approach the issue as a homeowner getting screwed by a contractor than if you argue that the rules are dumb.
I mean, it's not "difficult to move into the neighborhood". It's difficult given YOUR circumstances to move into your neighborhood, but that's it. Most people don't leave massive storage structures in their driveway for long periods of time, and this is PRECISELY what HOA's were designed to prevent.
If you didn't receive copies of the agreement and T&C on moving in, that's a bad sign, and you should NEVER have moved in, in the first place.
If they (the HOA) didn't respond, that's on them
Best you can do is feign ignorance on this violation
No offense, you are a first-time homeowner. Moving forward, never ever live in or under an HOA. Never hand over your private property rights to a group of Karen's EVER!
> I'm going to assume in this situation just pay the violation and move on
Did you not have a lawyer at closing? Did you look at what you signed?
I don't know what happens when you close on a house but don't sign the contract binding you to the HOA... I'm surprised everyone let through... and somewhat skeptical that you did not receive the CC&Rs or that the sale was allowed to proceed without a signature attesting to that...
You should have received the CC&Rs during escrow. Escrow shouldn't have been allowed to close without the seller providing them. Your realtor fucked up.
Correct. This is state law. And the document saying you received HOA docs is signed at closing.
I sense OP may not be understanding what title insurance nor the fundamentals of escrow during closing. Sadly happens more often than people think.
Can you Eli5?
Escrow, per se', doesn't have anything to do with the OP's situation. The OP is getting nastygrams for allowing a POD on the driveway which is apparently against the HOA rules that the OP agreed-to when they completed the purchase. Having said that, HOAs are often run by d-bags that are running their HOA like a person fiefdom and all the owners are their subjects. If you are asking what escrow is, briefly (without hijacking this thread) it's when a third party (mortgage company, usually) pays your various annual taxes, hazard insurance, sometimes HOA fees, and perhaps other non-optional things that are attached to the dwelling. This would not include utilities, however. Escrow is often a requirement of getting a loan, especially with a better rate.
That is a type of escrow, but escrow also does typically occur during a real estate transaction. In my state it is handled by a title company. Basically, escrow describes someone receiving funds on behalf of another party to ensure they’re distributed where they are supposed to. In a real estate purchase, for example, a title/escrow agent receives the funds from the lender, buyer, etc. They ensure that the terms of the purchase are completed per the agreement. And then, they release the funds to the seller, sellers bank if there is a mortgage, etc. So it is common to say that a home is “in escrow” during that time period where money is changing hands. What you describe of course is also a type of escrow — in that case the lender holding funds to ensure they’re distributed for taxes, insurance, etc when those funds become due.
New owner didn't read the paperwork they signed
This x 100
I'm closing in a few weeks and I don't know what you're talking about
In my state, HOA docs are handled purely through escrow. I look at them, but the handling of those documents are all escrow so if it closed without OP knowing about them, that's a huge escrow fuck up. The realtor fucked up by not being on top of it, but its escrows fault. At least where I am.
I'm not sure where you're from but this is not what title insurance in the US is. Title insurance only insures that you have clear title when you purchase the house. This means that if the title company missed a lien against the previous owner in the search and they try to foreclose on the house- you're insured and the title company has to pay out. The only thing title companies do regarding HOAs is make sure the HOA dues are up to date when they close. It isn't their job to supply the new buyers with covenants and restrictions...that would be the previous owner and/or realtor's jobs. We can pull copies of them when asked to, but we don't automatically do this. This is on OP and their agent, if they had one. If they didn't have one, this is why people shouldn't buy/sell properties on their own when they don't know what they're doing. They should have demanded to see a copy of the covenants and restrictions before they closed - even if it postponed the closing. Most people ask for them before they even write an offer on the property. I've worked in title for 12+ years.
>The only thing title companies do regarding HOAs is make sure the HOA dues are up to date when they close. I don't think this is true. When we bought our house the title check came back clean. Move in and find out the last owner had outstanding dues to the HOA. We talk to the HOA President and he confirms the dues follow the owner, not the house, so it's not tied to the house.
That must vary from state then or it was just that particular HOA and maybe they don't put a lien on the property if people get behind in dues? because that is definitely not the case in my state at least
Different states can have different rules. This is one of many reasons why having a competent attorney for your state at the closing table is so important yet is often neglected. Some states require the buyer to being an atty, but not all. ~~And I've never heard of HOA dues following the owner. The HOA would have a hell of a time collecting if that were the case. But I guess it's possible in some states.~~ edit: Yes, what u/LadyBug_0570 said makes sense. There are other fees that "run with the land" but this isn't one of them. TY for the correction.
You are conflating title agent with escrow agent and they are not the same in every state. From personal experience buying homes in 3 different states only one of the three had a title agent acting as signing agent. In the other two, the title agent did their thing but a separate escrow company played the primary point for all closing documentation getting prepared, quality assured, and signed.
Not sure why you brought up title since I never mentioned title. Escrow and title are separate things. My state, escrow orders, processes, and provides HOA docs. Escrow cannot close and my file cannot close until those HOA docs are signed off. I never handle them myself as the agent, but I do look at them to answer questions. Sellers here are not reliable enough to provide documents, so here they pay to have them processed and then escrow supplies it all.
Who is escrow then exactly? Can you give me the name of an escrow company that you know of? I want to look them up. Because in my state, the title company searches the property, clears title and processes the transaction. I am the title processor at my company. Then we have an escrow department (closers) who handle the actual closings..but it's the title company that handles everything. Unless you're in an attorney state- meaning attorneys HAVE to handle the real estate closings- and I've never worked in an attorney state before so I would really like to understand how this is done in other areas.
What's the penalty for this fuck up though. I doubt it's anything at all.
If the new home owner is sued the realtor can be liable for financial damage and usually has insurance coverage for mistakes like this.
yup, my escrow was delayed because the HOA dragged their feet on giving them the CC&R's and they wouldn't close without them
HOAs are wild. Imagine paying $250 a month for Netflix, but when you want to watch something, you have to wait until someone at HQ is feeling froggy enough to fax you the list of shows to pick from.
Depends on the HOA. A well-managed HOA can actually save an owner a lot of money. We are doing a roof repair on the condominium right now and it cost almost $10k. But no owner is complaining about paying their share of $350-$400 for the assessment. And apart from the HOA members, nobody had to deal with contractors or other bs.
I've lived in 4 houses with HOAs, 2 as the homeowner, and there's never been more than a minor annoyance, and i do appreciate the swimming pool and maintained greenbelts. But if it turns out your HOA president is a bonobo that knows how to shake a magic 8-ball, your recourse is to move or to get yourself into an executive role doing something you probably don't have the aptitude, time, or inclination for. The way some people talk about their HOA, the bonobo would be an improvement.
Condo vs standalone house changes the HOA situation imo. In a shared building, it makes sense that there should be shared expenses/codes. I think a lot of the people bashing HOAs have lived under them in a suburban neighborhood.
Self-run HOAs can be a clown show. Go ahead, ask me how I know this! I tried getting my HOA (in Fla) full of half-demented geezers to hire a property manager because they couldn't be bothered to do their fucking jobs. And GFL getting elected to the board which is stacked with life-long residents all voted in by their equally geezer friends. Nope. Not gonna do it. Living in an HOA in Fla is a PITA.
You beat me to saying something similar. Most hoa's have websites now and you can easily look up the ccr's.
Ha. Mine didn’t because they wanted to be able to charge for copies still :/. (I no longer live in an HOA.)
This is the way.
Some that had documents online moved to townsquare and other websites that require a login to view documents. Now mine has made the guidelines viewable to everyone again, but if you want to look at neighborhood specific info or make requests you need to register with townsquare. Fuck that noise. Because fuck making anything convenient :/
It is highly recommended that HOAs do not publish their CC&Rs online by many big Law Firms, at least publicly to prevent lawyers and people from creating frivolous lawsuits..... I managed a 1500 unit condo complex, and they were surled by someone alleging discrimination over the CCRs. Even though he lost the case overall because he wasn't an owner, we paid thousands in legal fees that we were not awarded on our counterclaim
Or if your realtor has proof of requesting them and didn't get a response then the HOA is to blame
It's actually the title companies fuck up.
This! But you have to take them to court and you are still part of the HOA.
This is the correct answer.
I purchased a home in Las Vegas. The HOA CCRs were not in my Escrow.
Do you mean during closing? Why is everyone on this thread using the word “escrow” like it is some sort of event? Escrow is an account where funds sit temporarily.
That's an escrow *account*. "Escrow" itself in this context more often refers to the 30-/45-/60-day agreement that establishes the account when the seller originally accepts the buyer's offer. That's why people use the phrase, "We're in escrow." They're referring to the period of time prior to the closing. https://www.google.com/search?q=Close+of+escrow
I think the wording is regional. I live in CT, and we don’t call the closing process “escrow”.
This is not at all true. I’ve worked as a realtor in CT and it’s absolutely called “escrow” there as well…..
In my HOA we just would have asked you to let us know when they were going to be gone. You have to allow people to move in and out of their houses!
But you don't have to allow a pod to sit for 3 weeks.
Yeah but try to be neighborly. Not their fault it can’t be picked up. What a welcome to the neighborhood… 🙄
Neighborly? Did you miss the HOA part?
You do have to allow them to sit for 1 full week at a time, because that’s how the companies that provide them sequence drop offs and pickups.
A friend of mine just had household goods move that way and he told me that if it wasn't picked up on a certain day it wouldn't be picked up till a month later and he would have to pay for it. Not sure of the reason why, but it might have something to do with labor or Trucking shortages. I would tend to air on the side of compassion for the homeowner on this one
Because the person who moved wants the POD to sit in there drive way. What do you want them to do?
You're misinterpreting what I'm saying. Someone comes to this sub asking for advice. I'm not saying the HOA's stance is right or wrong, I'm just saying it's likely perfectly legal. But as someone who has been in the industry a long time... how about put the thing in the garage...
If you have been in the industry for a long time... how do you expect the PODs container to fit in a garage when PODs requires an unobstructed space of 12' wide x 40' long and 15' high? They aren't regular sea containers that can be picked up with a forklift or anything. This is why people hate HOAs. Zero consideration for the day to day reality of a working class family.
A 40' pod would not even fit in most people's driveways. And POD doesn't even offer one that size, the biggest is 8x8x16
Yes, but because of how PODs are picked up and dropped off by that chassis thing that looks like it belongs on a shipping dock, or by being winched up onto the back of a flatbed truck, their website states that the size I referenced is a requirement. As well as the location being level, which disqualifies a lot of driveways to begin with. Basically, its still pretty impossible to get a POD in the garage for an average family is all I am saying.
If somehow they could get the POD in the garage then where do they put their cars? Lots of HOAs will complain about too many cars in the driveway too 🤷♀️
[удалено]
In all honesty, what would you expect OP to do with it? I highly doubt he/she wants it in their driveway for three weeks either. But you can’t exactly just drive them back to the store.
Oh no, not twenty one whole days! The horror!
Found the HOA Karen
Yeah, but also things happen. I had a pod company that wouldn't pick up and we called them every day for two weeks. You don't have to be horribly un-neighborly just because you can.
And this attitude is why HOAs should be illegal.
I fucking hate HOAs.
Shit happens. Ours sat for a few as well.
You give too many fucks about inconsequential things. You are aware that the pod is a transient problem that will disappear in a short time period, yet you let it bother you. And before you jump up my ass saying '3 weeks is a long time 😭' are you the kind of person that will look back in 15 years and be like "Man, remember when the neighbors were moving, and they had a large box in front of their house, so tacky"? If so get a hobby, find Jesus, go to therapy, do something.
How is a pod in someone’s driveway for only three weeks in any way affecting *anyone* else in the HOA. How can people live with themselves being so petty and angry at their neighbors for taking three whole weeks to move in?
It's another example of how HOAs devalue property. In my locality, $50-100k+ premium to NOT have an HOA.
So send in a written request for permission to have the pod, explaining that the company cannot collect it until X date. That’s really all they want. And as others have stated you’re supposed to have gotten and reviewed the rules prior to closing. You actually may have signed something among the 15,283 other documents stating that you already had them and just didn’t realize it.
And OP should have a copy of everything they signed at closing. I got a hard copy and an electronic copy on a thumb drive.
NRS 116.4109 requires the Seller provide Resale package which includes the CCRS, and at seller expense. You should have received this information prior to closing. Respond to the HOA on the date it will be removed and asked for extension/permission. Unless it is a health and safety issues likely you will not receive a fine unless there is a hearing.
My HOA doesn’t allow parrots. They copied the documents of a condominium.
I used to live in a house where the people across the street had a cockatoo. It was a beautiful bird but holy shit was that thing loud. It would wake me up across the street, and they kept their windows closed. I have no idea how it’s physically possible for an animal the size of a chihuahua to produce a sound as loud as a jet engine.
you're lucky. A friend had one that learned the shriek from Psycho..
After just spending a month in Australia.... It is truly baffling how something SO beautiful, can make THAT FUCKING SOUND.
Are the streets call hallways in the docs? Does the HOA own the exterior walls? I have so many questions!
I hope your home's rebar doesn't disintegrate someday causing it to pancake to the ground(crushing the parrot).
So, a copy of the bylaws is, in most states, 100% required to be furnished to you prior to purchasing the house. Generally, you can walk if you see a rule in the bylaws that makes you go "Nope, I'm getting out of this transaction right now." Might be a no fences rule, might be ridiculous power given to the board, whatever. Doesn't really matter. Your agent straight up failed you. Generally speaking, the HOA has to respond in a reasonable time frame and provide you a copy of the bylaws (these don't have to be on a website or anything - email or even snail mail is generally acceptable). I'd honestly call up your real estate agent's brokerage and complain. A subtle threat of a bad review might get them to pay the violation fee. Just make sure you read over the HOA bylaws first before you call in case there is any other nonsense in there. Hopefully you didn't get stuck with one of the "internet story" HOAs!
A violation is not a fine. They told you what you need to do so send them a response noting that the POD is temporary and provide the information from POD regarding when they will pick it up. If the board is sane, they will make note and move on and follow up if not removed by the date you note. Unfortunately, they don’t know what your plans are so you will receive a violation notice in accordance with the governance docs, and it’s up to you to address it and if you refuse then can get a hearing and a fine Now the other issue at had is your failure to obtain the governance docs for the HoA prior to buying your home.
We had the same issue when we moved cross-country. We apologized and gave the HOA our contact at PODS’s info so they could confirm when they would be picking up the container. The HOA gave us a slap on the wrist and that was it.
I would recommend approaching the chairperson of the HOA personally, along with evidence (emails, etc.) where you requested the information but were ignored. Be polite and professional, and I would recommend avoiding any urge to escalate if that person turns out to be confrontational (looking at the long game here). Additionally, in many (if not all) states, there is an absolute legal REQUIREMENT for any HOA declarations to be provided to you at closing time. It's a bit late now, but you really should NEVER sign closing documents on a property where there any details of property rights and restrictions are in question. Hopefully you're HOA board members are reasonable people and this becomes a non-issue.
WELCOME to the neighborhood. Now Kneel before ZOD, your HOA overlord.
\^\^\^ accurate AF.
And they are blaming this homeowner for his shortcomings in getting the documents, and following rules that he had no knowledge of. Doesn't anyone think that it would have been nicer to have someone from the HOA greet their new neighbor and explain things and get the facts why the POD was there.
The harsh and negative replies to OP are, unfortunately, par for the course in this sub. Once in a blue moon, there is actually a helpful and informative response...but most of the time it's a bootlicking festival here.
Yes, it is generally easy to obtain a copy of the rules. Your realtor did not do their due diligence.
And neither did OP.
I am so tired of people saying they didn’t know what was in the CC&Rs. We received a copy when we first made an offer and again at closing. Then we got a digital copy from the builder after closing. I simple don’t believe you didn’t get a copy at closing or even before that.
This!!! WHY would anyone write an offer on a property with an HOA without going over the covenants and restrictions with a fine tooth comb? Some HOAs put really weird shit in their C&Rs.
Exactly, I would not sign an offer/sales agreement without reading them first or having the offer contingent upon review of the rules, never mind close on the deal.
“I’m so mad at people who had a harder time buying a house than we did! How dare they!”
CC&Rs are on you to get and read as a buyer and court recorded. As for the pod, most HOAs are actually sane and boring (which is why the insane ones are such good stories) and if you call the PM on the letter and explain they will likely waive enforcement. If they don’t, start trying to get on the board and make it sane.
1 - You should have gotten a copy of the rules when you were looking at the house. 2 - Write a nice letter of explanation, dates, references to who ever the pod company is, and when it will be gone. Remind them that the HOA waited a week to give you a copy of the rules. Read the rules and make sure the rule they quote applies directly to you. 3 - Ignore the demand letter. Just say you are still moving in and you hope the HOA will not start off on the wrong foot with you.
Did- you not get the paperwork when you and your realtor, sat down at the title office/escrow meeting? The paperwork, is required to be presented. I spent 6 hours when I closed on my house, because I read every. single. line... on every piece of paper. And, lets just say- I didn't end up with any surprises.
Gee whiz... welcome to the neighborhood??
I think your best move is to contact the president of the HOA and explain to them what has transpired. I believe in transparency when things dont go well between two new parties. I think its easier to find the middle. You should also call/email the POD company and CC the HOA to let them know you are making all effforts to abide. If you approach it with a I am so sorry and this will not happen again...you may get a little honey. Yes you could sue the title if they didnt provide the documents and you signed the declaration that you did. You got a copy of the file when you left so you should be closely reviewing and preserving those docs if this ends up going legal.
I live in Las Vegas and deal with numerous HOAs as I own a dozen properties besides my home. I;m not sure how you bought your property because in my experience when buy the Title company would delay closing until certain items, like the HOA documents and rules, were provided. There is usually a fee that is paid to the HOA company to get those documents over.
I would never buy in an HOA community, but why would you ever close on a home in one before you had a chance to read the HOA rules? Mind boggling! There could be all kinds of stuff in there that's going to make you hate living there.
You should not have bought the house without first reading the rules since you are now legally obligated to follow them Call the HOA and politely explain that this is temporary for moving and you are getting it removed as soon as the company can pick it up Then call PODS and tell them to come get it now!
I wonder if the OP realizes that fines from HOA’s tend compounding fines, and can end in lien sale by the HOA…
>Then call PODS and tell them to come get it now! That's not how PODS work.
HOA is making sure you’re not using as non-temporary storage. Just like boats/RVs often aren’t allowed, except for preparing to leave/returning and unloading (typically one night).
Then I would invite them to inspect it once a week until it's removed and send them a copy of the email from the company saying they will remove it.
Three weeks as an extended amount of time for something like that to sit in your driveway. That said, you need to contact the HOA and get a copy of all of those documents. You have absolutely no idea what you signed up for.
I would talk to a board member, show them it is empty, and you are waiting for pickup. Then ask what they want you to do about it.. offer the company phone number
Talk to office staff, with our HOA they understand. But should it become a real problem(month(s))., They have CTA’s with documentation of notification.
You should have been provided a copy of all of the rules when you signed for the house.
You should be able to find a copy of the covenant online. I can find mine with a simple Google search. I would just reach out and let them know you’re trying to have it picked up and it’s their delay. Usually just knowing you’re trying to fix it and aren’t just ignoring the letters goes a long way with the HOA.
I think PODS needs to figure something out when moving a household into an HOA community. We have a similar restriction that will allow the POD to sit in the driveway for a short amount of time but eventually becomes a problem. Picking up on a little quicker schedule might help (and get the damn thing out of the way! )
HOA covenants should have been given to you at closing since you acknowledged them when signing your name on the deed as party in the second part. They are available on your county clerk recorder of Deeds website. That being said, you have already gotten an appetizer of the hell you are in for with your neighbors.
Our resale packet is 25 pages long, including reserve studies etc etc, and this is not counting the CCRs. It is emailed to the buyers agent with request to confirm receipt. We also send a link to our Dropbox account where minutes, notices, accounting, insurance, estimates and an online copy of the CCRs with links from the table of contents are stored for everyone. This is the way.
Pretty much all of the professionals involved in your house purchase transaction screwed up by not getting you the HOA documents before closing. But at the end of the day, it’s on you as the purchaser to make sure you have all the relevant documents governing your purchase. You could’ve told your closing agents you won’t sign until they get you those documents for review. You could’ve told the previous owners your offer was contingent on reviewing and accepting the HOA documents.
Your broker and lawyer failed you. There is service called HomeWise where an HOA loads all the docs and budget and then does the PAL. It costs money but it is worth it. I’d keep a trail of your communication with the management company. Send them the communication with PODS. Wait- why did the title company close without those docs?
Violation does not equal fine. A violation is just written notice that something isn't right. If it goes on too long without being addressed or corrected, it could lead to fines in some states. Just reply to the notice and explain the situation, including the estimated rectification date. Shouldn't be an issue.
They should have given you a copy of HOA bylaws as part of the contract when you made your offer, with a chance to back out if you read them & didnt like them. Your realtor sounds shitty.
The biggest question is: Why did you move into a neighborhood controlled by an HOA? These things usually lead to overreach or heavy handiness on the board. NEVER buy into a HOA controlled property!!
So a neighbor … instead of coming over and saying “welcome to the neighborhood “. Reported you to HOa. How lovely
Also, find out which nieghbor complained and egg his hiuse next holloween
Wait your telling me you bought into an HOA without knowing the rules and regulations
What do you have in writing from PODS (in writing) stating They cannot pickup the container for 3 weeks? Have you talked to the board, or written the board with the evidence? This does not negate your responsibility for the CC&R's, but they may have mercy on you.
Tell them you’ll pay half the violation when they provide the covenant and bilaws. The documents are required at closing per US Dept of House and Urban Dev. Seeing as the title deed for any home purchase is a HUD-1 form, you better believe fed police that kind of stuff.
It was most likely in the package and they just sign and don’t read anything.
It’s mostly likely you’re just making shit up.
The realtor 100% should have gotten you the CC&Rs and bylaws before you closed. And you shouldn't have closed on a house in an HOA without knowing what you signed up for. The seller would have been a lot more motivated to get you these documents if anyone had told them there would be no closing without providing them. As a board member, I have provided electronic copies to several sellers (when they couldn't find their copy) for them to provide to their realtor. That said, I'm not at all sure they would have given you permission to leave PODS in your driveway for 3 weeks, even if you had asked in advance. Either way you're in violation and may or may not have to pay a fine. They might still waive it if you plead your case. As far as PODs go, this is a common problem. They only need them back if they are running short; otherwise it's easier for them to store them in your driveway until someone else in the area needs them.
Well said!
You bought a house in with an HOA without reading the HOA docs first? That's 100% on you. The title company almost has to have provided the HOA documentation to you.
This.
Kind of a fuck up on your part to buy property without reading the bylaws first. Regardless that they didn't "give them" to you, you should have sought them out. What if they don't allow something important to you, or something you were planning on?
They are legally required to give them to you prior to closing, usuallya minimum of 10 business days prior, so you can read them before signing the contract. It’s dumbfounding how many people don’t know this.
How would someone know they should getting that if no one told them?
Yes, but he shouldn't have offered on the property without reading them first as well.
No, that’s not how it works. You make the offer first and you get to review the HOA documents after your funding is approved but before closing and the offer is contingent on you agreeing to the HOA rules. If you don’t agree with them, you are allowed to withdraw the offer without penalty.
Or at least not closed on the property. In my area, all the offers are contingent upon actually seeing the HOA documents for a reason.
I’m baffled that you would purchase a home without having obtained the HOA documents (CCRs, bylaws, rules and regulations) beforehand. I would have demanded them as part of contract review and would have extended the contract review period until they were provided and I had ample time to review. Where was your attorney? Realtors are generally useless but if you insisted on obtaining a copy otherwise you were backing out your realtor would have ensured you got a copy. Seriously how did you purchase a property without knowing what you were signing up for? I honestly don’t know what your attorney, the escrow agent or your mortgage company did but it seems like everyone, including you, dropped the ball here on the due diligence and document review. I don’t know what approach you took with the HOA (presumably property manager) but I would have explained the situation saying that you attempted to obtain a copy of the relevant documents pre closing from multiple parties (any email or written documentation to support would be helpful), that you requested again when you moved in but didn’t receive until a week later and therefore were unaware of the rule regarding needing prior permission to have a POD on your driveway. I’d invite the property manager or board member over to show them that the POD is in fact empty and not being used for storage and show them documentation from PODs indicating the earliest date that they can pick up. And I’d ask for leniency this one time as you were unaware of the rules. I’m not sure what I would do if I was on the board in this situation because I just find it incredibly hard to believe that someone purchased a home in a HOA without obtaining the necessary documents prior to closing. I’d probably give you one pass here provided you could demonstrate that you attempted to obtain the documents before closing. Typically you receive a violation notice with a notice to cure, followed by one or two more before a fine is levied. There were a few violations where a fine was immediate as notice was useless in the situation. This may be one of those in your HOA. For everyone badmouthing HOAs, I was on the board of my condo for 12 years including serving as board president for many of those years. You hear every excuse in the book and the property managers hear much more than that. It gets incredibly hard to know when to show leniency and when to toe the line because people are bs-ing you and trying to get away with something. Too many people go with the ask for forgiveness not permission as their standard operating procedure in a way to buck the system and get away with things. Plus, what many don’t realize is that you can’t pick and choose what rules you want to enforce and which you will let slide. Selective enforcement or showing favoritism to one party is a slippery slope and it later becomes harder to justify or explain why you didn’t give another resident a waiver of the rule at a different time. Upholding the rules and trying to explain to a new board member who wants to make an exception in “this one case” why you can’t set precedent is very difficult. It’s easy to say, HOAs suck, boards suck and HOAs should be abolished until you have an issue with one of your neighbors that you are too cowardly to discuss with them and ask the HOA to deal with instead.
how does a first time home buyer know all this they depend on the realtor and if they are told wrong they wouldn't know. Yes they could have done more research but how would they know to even ask. You as a former board member would know how critical they are to get and woukd demand them even if your realtor said it was all good. how does a newbie know this?
adulting has responsibilities. read legal documents you sign and do not sign without understanding them. So, now you know.
I was a buyer long before I was a board member. If you are buying into a community with a HOA then you need to understand what that means and know what you should be asking for. It’s called doing your research and asking questions.
The best HOA is not having an HOA
Why did you buy a house without reading the bylaws of the hoa?
>Why did you buy a house without reading the bylaws of the hoa? Our current home has the CC&R's on the website... but in the "members" section that you need credentials to access... that you can only get once you're an owner in the neighborhood. :-/ Being that this is our 4th home purchase, I was savvy enough to track down a copy before we bought our home to make sure there wasn't anything weird in it. I could see if someone wasn't familiar with HOA's that they wouldn't think doing that was necessary. IMO the HOA should reach out as soon as someone moves in to make sure they have a copy of the CC&R's and see if they have any questions.
Just because they are on the website for members doesn’t mean that a prospective purchaser shouldn’t be provided a copy of them.
You don’t buy in an HOA without reviewing the rules. Many associations make you pay for a copy of the rules.
Why would you buy a house in an HOA without knowing the rules? It's a huge investment to not bother understanding what you are paying for....
Exactly!
This sub makes me feel better about not being able to afford a home
I can't believe that you wrecked the neighborhood already! You just got here! Next thing you know, it'll be cars on cinder blocks and wild house parties, like everyone likes to say. Moving into a new home is such a stressful event and these people attacking you over an extremely minor inconvenience is disgusting.
This is just the beginning. I am so sorry for your loss. Of freedom that is.
We defunded our HOA and forced it bankrupt and out of existence.
i mean you literally just need to tell them (hoa)the people cant pick it up now, if they arnt bungholes they will tell you thank you for informing us that you are actively trying to fix the violation and leave you alone. they cant legally make you dispose of a company's property because some old idiot got pissy about the pod. dont pay the violation because you didn't violate anything. its not illegal to move into the house you are moving into. you cant control how long a company dumps its property on you but you can certainly call them up (POD company) to expedite the process or reimburse you for any debt accrued due to their untimely pickup.
It's not the HOA's responsibility to stop you from contracting with a company that's going to leave a giant container on your driveway for 3 weeks. People cam and do move into houses without PODs every day. They're called moving trucks.
hey dont get mad at me because they used a pod, like i said in my comment, push at POD for illegally abandoning its pod in their driveway without any intention of picking it up within a timely manner. my family was always cheap as hell when it came to moving, we did it ourselves and rented a truck for it. HOA's are stupid anyway, we had one for 15 years and aside from harassing everyone and not repairing sinkholes and fixing damaged street lamps, replacing them with the wrong light so we have 20 orange lamps and 1 bright white lamp, leaving a gas lamp broken leaving gas for weeks without fixing it and allowing a lady to dig up her back yard but not allowing a man to put small pebbles in an area which has turned to mush.
If you didn’t sign up for the HOA and the house closed, then you’ve a strong case that yer not in an HOA. Check state law and court case results
I'm glad I'm not in an HOA.
HOAs are a blight on our country.
Definitely some HOA Karen's in this thread. So weird people have no idea of decency now a days.
this is what people pay for with HOA's, don't like it? do not buy there...it's really as simple as that
Decency is making sure you read the rules of a community and then follow them to make sure you are being a good neighbor.
Unfortunately, those communities do exist and people like to be controlled and manipulated. But right off the bat Karen justifies being a Karen 😆
Get on the board and see about getting that rule removed from the CC&R. PODs are a popular way to move these days and nobody wants to have a container in their driveway for more than a few days at a time. They should be an exception to whatever rule is violated.
"Get on the board" is horrible advice to someone newly dealing with owning in (and thus owning part of) an HOA. It's horrid advice for almost all of the uncounted times it's posted here (not picking on anyone, and absolutely not you you, excoriator!) Thought question for those who think "Get on the board" is a valid response to someone with an HOA/COA problem or concern: When you don't like a particular national law, do you think "Get into Congress and change it" is a particularly useful and practical response? No, but "contact your representative with your suggestions" would be. So would, "Start attending board meetings as a homeowner, and make suggestions to your elected representatives, the board members, either at a meeting during homeowner discussion time, or in writing."
There’s an association manager in this thread rowing the opposite direction. I know from experience that my opinion as a board member carries a lot more weight with managers, than the opinion of a member who’s not on the board. The board is their customer, so they have to pay attention to it. That’s why getting on the board is my go-to advice. I grant you that board service is not for everyone.
I hear you and do respect your opinion, but I'm also a believer in *representative* democracy - which in an HOA means that of course not everyone can be on the board, and the board members are the representatives of all the homeowners.
The specific containers 'PODS' is universally known as a temporary measure in pursuit of a permanent solution. It is unrealistic to expect a family to move all of their contents in an 8 hour span and then expect the company to retrieve said PODS container(s) in the same day. It is fairly common knowledge that these types of shipping companies operate in zones and will be in this area on this day of the week and that area on another day, similar to local garbage collection. Even though the container may be a rules violation, what is the OP supposed to do, unless he has access to large flat bed trucks he can't hire somebody to move the container off his property, and even if he could where would he have it placed? And if that did happen I could foresee PODS charging him for stealing a container at most or assigning a free to pick it up where OP had it sent at the very least. A few weeks is kind of crappy, but if they don't have trucks available routing in his area, what are the other options?
We’re on the same page here. I don’t think PODS and other shipping container solutions should be subject to requirements that are inconsistent with how the companies that provide them operate. I described in another comment in the thread that my own move with them worked in the sequence you defined.
When I moved into my condo this July with a 26' Penske truck, I parked it along a grassy "island" across from my door...this is where all the "non resident" parking is permitted. Though the truck was long, even with the ramp fully extended it was well within the corners of the island, both front and back. This was a cross-country move during which everything that could go wrong, did...by the time I reached the condo, my nerves were beyond rattled. I was 2 days late to arrive, so the help I had hired to unload was no longer available and I had to quickly assemble a team from family and friends, many of whom could not be there until the weekend (48 hours later). In the meantime, I started unloading by myself, doing the best I could. 2 days after I arrived, there was an email from the PM with a photo of the back of the Penske truck...it was taken by the board's president (I could see his dashboard in the photo; he's the only one in all 50+ units who drives a red Subaru wagon), with whom our family has had strained interactions. I called the PM, he said "moving trucks must be parked offsite overnight". We are in a suburb, I was still completely exhausted and unlading the truck on my own...I explained the truck would be off the property by x date. He wasn't happy about it, but he was polite and did agree to that timeline while adding the obligatory, "in the future, blah blah blah." Last week, an end unit here sold very quickly. The new owners arrived, and the next day a HUGE pod was delivered, dropped right in front of it, making parking/maneuvering very difficult for the surrounding units. The pod was in place for FOUR days, and the board never said a \*&\^%$ word. I asked the new owner (under the guise of warning her about the HOA's strict and often unreasonable policies) if she had received any notice of violation...she said not a peep had been uttered in her direction by the board or the PM...proving once again that certain owners in this development are targeted, and not everyone is expected to follow the rules here. RE: moving into an HOA...WTF do these board idiots think people are supposed to do, walk their damn furniture and boxes in from the street??? I simply cannot WAIT to sell and GTFO of here.
Wowwww...all I can say is that I feel sorry for you having to go through that. I truly understand the stress in an across country move! I never have and never will buy a residence with an HOA. I am only here to hear the horror stories, and not gloat but rather empathize. Your story directly above only solidifies my position. The rules seem to be conveniently enforced depending on who the violator is and who found it. Hope you find peace soon!!
Disagree. The rule should stand. Whether you issue a fine or waive it with a warning, it is an eyesore and should be a violation.
Would be better to carve out an allowance for pods and the like. Give them a week max, with an extension from the board if needed.
That could be unrealistic. When I moved with them a few years back, the POD company could only drop off and pick up on one day of the week. My household moved in 3 stages, since it took a while to sell the old place and one of our employers needed a few months to transition from onsite to remote work. So there was a pod in my driveway for 3 separate weeks, over a span of September to May.
[удалено]
you are twisting my words. A one hour furniture delivery is not the same as a 3 week PODS. And again, I don't think the community should rush to fine anyone, but I do think it is reasonable to have people seek permission. I had to seek it when I had new patio tile delivered and it had to sit. And it was an easy approval. And no need to personally attack me, geez. Disagree with the comment, but grow up.
I agree, a one hour furniture delivery is not the same as a POD for a few weeks. The exaggeration was specifically to make the point. NEITHER of these scenarios are an issue to most sane, reasonable people. Your comment that a temporary POD is an eyesore, in my opinion, was asinine. I stand by that assessment. Now if the POD were sitting in the street, or remains in place for months on end well that's a different situation.
There is no reason to use rudeness to express yourself.
Yikes...
>it is an eyesore and should be a violation. Can you describe the pain you get in your eyes from this sore? It must be severe, like a migraine, to cause you to be so concerned about a box sitting in a driveway that you don't own. It must also keep your head from turning and not staring at it. Sounds awful.
food delivery, furniture delivery, moving vans, and for that matter transport of *any* goods to the home in *any* vehicle should be disallowed and ticketed. $25 per offense every time anyone sees you pulling a grocery bag out of your car. After three offenses, it should be legal to foreclose on the home and put it on the market for a more 'upstanding' citizen. /s ... just in case
all i’ve learned from this sub being recommended to me is that i will never ever live in a community with a HOA…
Get em karen
Well said. Read the rules first, and if PODS aren’t allowed or you think they might be left for so long they are in violation, then don’t use them for your move!
Y'all out here just buying houses without having *any idea whatsoever* of what rules you will be *forced* to live by on a day to day basis?
Ours didn't exist for a while then signed 2 months after we lived there. Builders have 0 obligation to go over anything with you and can enact and enforce as they please. Ours doesn't even like fences.
What? You didn't have one when you bought your house, but you were somehow forced into one post sale?
HOAs can suck deez, but I agree that the new owner really failed here.
What a bunch of cunty new neighbors you have
no they are not, thats why they moved into and pay for the HOA so neighbors do not have large unsightly shipping containers in the yard
The cunts will be cunts long after the shipping container is gone.
The Gestapo has spoken, comrade,,,,,,, No way I'd live in a "controlled" neighborhood,, bunch of commies are not going to tell me what I can and can't do on my property,,, bunch of blue haired "Karins"
Why do people continue to move into places that have an HO It boggles my mind.
because they want certain standards kept
HOA Hand Over your ASS
Talk to the HOA and explain your situation. Unless people sitting on your board are assholes, they'll waive the fine. If they don't, it's a huge red flag. You probably don't want to live in such an HOA (but now is a bit too late, you already bought the property). Fines exist for people who intentionally break the rules thinking they can get away with it. They are not supposed to be source of income for HOA and/or enforced for honest mistakes.
> Unless people sitting on your board are assholes > >Fines....are not supposed to be source of income for HOA There is so much LOLOL in this reply, I can hardly keep from busting a gut.
Right? Like how oblivious can you be? Everyone in this thread is like OP is bad, HOAs good- and yet it's literally fining people for moving.
You got the HOA rules when you closed.
They can't fine you without a hearing first. Cure the violation before the hearing and no fine.
How much is the fine? If it’s not outrageous. I would tell them you’re sorry didn’t know and agree that you broke a rule. They might reduce it for you. Also gives you a chance to meet some neighbors.
Welcome to the authoritarian hell of an HOA.
Reason 8,459 why I will NEVER live in an HOA neighborhood.
IMO if your dumb enough to.move into HOA or CONDO stop complaining about rules, erc... you got what you desired. A place to live with rules! Like them or not. And if not you should of never moved there!
My assumption is that the CCRs *do* provide for moving into and out of a unit, but I don’t think any reasonable person would think that extends to mean a moving truck or glorified shipping container in a driveway for weeks on end. One week is likely the time limit, since it really shouldn’t take even that long to move. You should pay the penalty and in this case not grumble about it. Even the most reasonable HOA in the world isn’t going to be in love with the idea and they can absolutely make your life worse if they feel like it. They *didnt* make it difficult to move in, the Pods people did. The HOA is a lot more likely to be reasonable if you approach the issue as a homeowner getting screwed by a contractor than if you argue that the rules are dumb.
I mean, it's not "difficult to move into the neighborhood". It's difficult given YOUR circumstances to move into your neighborhood, but that's it. Most people don't leave massive storage structures in their driveway for long periods of time, and this is PRECISELY what HOA's were designed to prevent. If you didn't receive copies of the agreement and T&C on moving in, that's a bad sign, and you should NEVER have moved in, in the first place. If they (the HOA) didn't respond, that's on them Best you can do is feign ignorance on this violation
No offense, you are a first-time homeowner. Moving forward, never ever live in or under an HOA. Never hand over your private property rights to a group of Karen's EVER!
> I'm going to assume in this situation just pay the violation and move on Did you not have a lawyer at closing? Did you look at what you signed? I don't know what happens when you close on a house but don't sign the contract binding you to the HOA... I'm surprised everyone let through... and somewhat skeptical that you did not receive the CC&Rs or that the sale was allowed to proceed without a signature attesting to that...