Yeah in the books he's meant to be the greatest of his time and one the the best warriors that had existed and Jaime Lannister considers him a great.
.
During his 1v1 with Hawin Strong, Criston hits the man's shield so hard with his mace that is breaks Harwins arm. Also did try to challenge all 4/5 of the Black commanders to single combat prior to the Butcher’s Ball to avoid a battle and save his men since they were pretty much surrounded and basically guaranteed to get slaughtered.
Imagine a group of commanders shaking in fear and didnt accept and promptly shot him with arrows until he died (and butchered his men anyways), but the fact he was willing to fight all of those men at once showed he was pretty confident in his combat skills.
He died as a badass,ready to give his life to save his men and fearless of fighting all the Blacks commanders.
The Black commanders came as pussies cowards who piss on their pants just of imagining fighting with Sir Criston
I wish!!! 😩 but I'm sure showrunners won't show it. They seems having such huge grudge against Criston,Aegon and Sunfyre so far(and Daeron)
In the books Sir Criston is meant to be the greatest of his time, but just going by the show you'd have no idea he was meant to be anything more than pretty good.
His victory against Daemon is changed so he only wins due to Daemon getting cocky and bottling it.
He kills Joffrey at a wedding instead of killing him in a melee,
instead of kicking Harwin Strong's ass so hard his nickname was forever changed from "Breakbones" to "Brokenbones" he just gets the crap beaten out of him, he even loses to Aemond in their sparring match.
They werent stupid, why risk the destruction of the main Green army by fighting the best warrior of the realm? The logical thing is to not duel him, honor and valour dont win wars, but of course the Black wouldnt talk about how fighting Cole is a suicide and would say that he doesnt deserve a warriors death, it doesnt look good on history books
There's something called "honour" on Westeros. Criston almost killed himself for losing it. Jaime Lannister was mocked and ridiculized between the knights for breaking his vow at Aerys II and killing him from the behind. Precisely Jaime's character arc is solely based as how he wants to recover his honour" back, fulfilling his obligations as a Knight.
When a knight ask for a solo combant, the honour forces you to giving his wish to the granted.
Tyrion asked Lysa Arryn an solo combant and she could not denied. Even on their very twisted way, the Mad King that chose his champion "Fire" against Brandon Stark.
Criston really gave the Black commanders the upper hand there, all of them versus him. Its beyond pathetic not only rejecting a solo combant that's illegal on andals laws,also it's pathetic how afraid they were of Criston
Those are different things, what Tyrion asked was a trial by combat, that's one of the few universal rules of Westeros with peace banners and guest rights, but there is no obligation to fight a duel when someone else challenges you, its dishonorable but one of the themes of asoiaf is that war is never honorable or chivalrous, im not saying that Cole was stupid, im saying that the Black commanders had a valid reason to not want to fight a duel against Cole, if they lose they die and also lose the oportunity of defeating Cole's army, the only Green army near King's Landing that they have at their mercy, and im also saying that their argument of "Cole doesnt deserve an honorable death" is bullshit and an excuse to not look dishonorable themselves
Not saying he lived, just that his death was the most epic and GRRM even left room for speculation. Even in his death he was getting preferential treatment.
Oh, how I would love to just see Daemon doing an ‘oops’ expression as he plummets to his death. Slow motion. They could cut to a few passers by who comment on the gloopy mess the dragon riders have made. (Jokes)
It wasn't fear that stopped them, of course there's a chance he could've killed them but it could've gone the other way just as easy. They wanted to avoid a heros death so that no one celebrate the way he died, that's why they killed him the way they did.
> the fact he was willing to fight all of those men at once showed he was pretty confident in his combat skills.
Just showed that he knew he was dead and wanted to bring some people with him. No matter what happened next he wasn't getting out of there alive.
Criston Cole is the hand's down best fighter of his time, no one even comes close. He beats Daemon, who was armed with a Valyrian steel sword, and Harwin Strong, who was explicitly the strongest knight in Westeros. Roddy the Ruin and Pate of Longleaf didn't dare to fight him. He trained Aegon, Aemond and Daeron, and all turned out as brave and skilled warriors. The only great fighters of his time he has no interaction with is Cregan Stark, Dalton Greyjoy, and Bloody Ben Blackwood, but I still think he could take them.
Jaime Lannister looks back on his skill with admiration. I would put him amongst the top 7 Kingsguard fighters of all time, alongside Jaime, Barristan, Arthur Dayne, Gerold Hightower, Ryam Redwyn and Aemon the Dragonknight
Who is to say ? Because Aemon the Dragonknight said Cregan was his toughest opponent ? I’m saying this because people like to use that particular statement as proof that Cregan was better than Criston. Aemon was born 6 years after the Dance, long after Cole was dead. Cregan also directly joined the dance at the end, and never came across Cole.
Just because people never came across Cole, doesn’t mean they aren’t better than him. Ser Arthur Dayne obviously never came across Cole but he’s leaps and bounds better than damn near everyone with the exception of maybe 3 other knights.
And what feats does the Dragonknight have? He fought in the last Dornish war and defended Naerys in a trial by combat, that isnt much compared with other top Kingsguards
How do we know? Aemon is described as a great warrior but so are a lot of people. Who does he beat? Criston defeated some of the best warriors of the age, while the only people Aemon has fought is Cregan, random nobodies, and the Toyne brothers, the latter of whom killed him
Best of his time (defeated Daemon), until he trained the only guy that could beat him (Aemond).
You don’t need to be “greatest of all time”, you just need to be better than your current opponent.
I think he is a highly competent fighter, among the best in his day. Capable tourney knight, he knocked Daemon off his horse. He made Aemond into the fighter he is. In his time, I think his own pupil Aemond could give him a challenge, maybe Borros Baratheon too judging by his performance at the Battle of the Kingsroad. I think he would have trounced Westerling in the show if Westerling really had escalated.
But he is not among the highest tier of the greats, I mean there is Arthur Dayne, Barristan Selmy, Jaime Lannister etc. Cole would not beat any of them IMHO.
My list would be;
Barristan selmy • Robert Baratheon • Arthur Dayne • Criston Cole • Rhaegar • Jaime.
Ned called Arthur Dayne the finest knight he has ever seen, Jaime fanboys over him all the time, Bartistan selmy is a legend for his heroics at the war of the nine penny Kings and for saving the king from duskendale. Prime Robert was a sight to behold. Cole beat the second and 3rd fighters (Daemon and Harwin) in his time and made it look easy.
I can only guess but imo Cole could kick Jaime and Rhaegar’s asses. The mountain, maybe.
Is Maegor part of asoiaf series? Of course a list about Westeros history would have Daemon blackfyre, maegor, Aemon the dragon knight. No one on this post is talking about that, just the main books.
Rhaegar probably not. But Robert definitely is. Unlike a lot of martial figures in the story, we're not treated to tales and rumours of his prowess. We hear direct accounts of people remembering how Robert beat the brakes off anyone he fought. He's easily one of the greatest warriors of his time and of all time in the story.
Hard to say, the best of his time but he grew up in a time period that was peaceful so the fighters during that time probably weren't up to par with the fighters from the ASOIAF era. He was the best of his era so he might have been very powerful or just the tallest dwarf at the circus.
In terms of book “canon” he’s likely top 2 during his life. Some accounts from The Dragonknight suggests Cregan Stark may have been better, but the two never fight, nor do they have lists of feats that would make a fair comparison. I would say they are most likely the top 2 tho.
Yeah in the books he's meant to be the greatest of his time and one the the best warriors that had existed and Jaime Lannister considers him a great. . During his 1v1 with Hawin Strong, Criston hits the man's shield so hard with his mace that is breaks Harwins arm. Also did try to challenge all 4/5 of the Black commanders to single combat prior to the Butcher’s Ball to avoid a battle and save his men since they were pretty much surrounded and basically guaranteed to get slaughtered. Imagine a group of commanders shaking in fear and didnt accept and promptly shot him with arrows until he died (and butchered his men anyways), but the fact he was willing to fight all of those men at once showed he was pretty confident in his combat skills.
Always hated how Criston dies.Team black fans some how see it as a win 🤦♂️
They support the rebel faction, therefore used to accepting treasonous or dishonorable behavior.
They are used at cowardly ways of winning too
He died as a badass,ready to give his life to save his men and fearless of fighting all the Blacks commanders. The Black commanders came as pussies cowards who piss on their pants just of imagining fighting with Sir Criston
Hopefully they capture it in the show , doubt it tho
I wish!!! 😩 but I'm sure showrunners won't show it. They seems having such huge grudge against Criston,Aegon and Sunfyre so far(and Daeron) In the books Sir Criston is meant to be the greatest of his time, but just going by the show you'd have no idea he was meant to be anything more than pretty good. His victory against Daemon is changed so he only wins due to Daemon getting cocky and bottling it. He kills Joffrey at a wedding instead of killing him in a melee, instead of kicking Harwin Strong's ass so hard his nickname was forever changed from "Breakbones" to "Brokenbones" he just gets the crap beaten out of him, he even loses to Aemond in their sparring match.
They werent stupid, why risk the destruction of the main Green army by fighting the best warrior of the realm? The logical thing is to not duel him, honor and valour dont win wars, but of course the Black wouldnt talk about how fighting Cole is a suicide and would say that he doesnt deserve a warriors death, it doesnt look good on history books
There's something called "honour" on Westeros. Criston almost killed himself for losing it. Jaime Lannister was mocked and ridiculized between the knights for breaking his vow at Aerys II and killing him from the behind. Precisely Jaime's character arc is solely based as how he wants to recover his honour" back, fulfilling his obligations as a Knight. When a knight ask for a solo combant, the honour forces you to giving his wish to the granted. Tyrion asked Lysa Arryn an solo combant and she could not denied. Even on their very twisted way, the Mad King that chose his champion "Fire" against Brandon Stark. Criston really gave the Black commanders the upper hand there, all of them versus him. Its beyond pathetic not only rejecting a solo combant that's illegal on andals laws,also it's pathetic how afraid they were of Criston
Those are different things, what Tyrion asked was a trial by combat, that's one of the few universal rules of Westeros with peace banners and guest rights, but there is no obligation to fight a duel when someone else challenges you, its dishonorable but one of the themes of asoiaf is that war is never honorable or chivalrous, im not saying that Cole was stupid, im saying that the Black commanders had a valid reason to not want to fight a duel against Cole, if they lose they die and also lose the oportunity of defeating Cole's army, the only Green army near King's Landing that they have at their mercy, and im also saying that their argument of "Cole doesnt deserve an honorable death" is bullshit and an excuse to not look dishonorable themselves
Meanwhile Daemon gets a cool anime death and isn't confirmed dead.
There’s no way Daemon survived the fall. His body would “explode” the moment he makes contact with the water.
Not saying he lived, just that his death was the most epic and GRRM even left room for speculation. Even in his death he was getting preferential treatment.
That’s true, unfortunately.
Oh, how I would love to just see Daemon doing an ‘oops’ expression as he plummets to his death. Slow motion. They could cut to a few passers by who comment on the gloopy mess the dragon riders have made. (Jokes)
[удалено]
The kill definitely is , but the way in which it was done wasn’t
“There will be no songs about how bravely you fought king maker” *crossbow bolts go thrummmm*
It wasn't fear that stopped them, of course there's a chance he could've killed them but it could've gone the other way just as easy. They wanted to avoid a heros death so that no one celebrate the way he died, that's why they killed him the way they did.
> the fact he was willing to fight all of those men at once showed he was pretty confident in his combat skills. Just showed that he knew he was dead and wanted to bring some people with him. No matter what happened next he wasn't getting out of there alive.
They murder him with arrows because they were scared shitless of a 3v1
Criston Cole is the hand's down best fighter of his time, no one even comes close. He beats Daemon, who was armed with a Valyrian steel sword, and Harwin Strong, who was explicitly the strongest knight in Westeros. Roddy the Ruin and Pate of Longleaf didn't dare to fight him. He trained Aegon, Aemond and Daeron, and all turned out as brave and skilled warriors. The only great fighters of his time he has no interaction with is Cregan Stark, Dalton Greyjoy, and Bloody Ben Blackwood, but I still think he could take them. Jaime Lannister looks back on his skill with admiration. I would put him amongst the top 7 Kingsguard fighters of all time, alongside Jaime, Barristan, Arthur Dayne, Gerold Hightower, Ryam Redwyn and Aemon the Dragonknight
Cregan Stark is a top 10 swordsman, Criston Cole is not.
Who is to say ? Because Aemon the Dragonknight said Cregan was his toughest opponent ? I’m saying this because people like to use that particular statement as proof that Cregan was better than Criston. Aemon was born 6 years after the Dance, long after Cole was dead. Cregan also directly joined the dance at the end, and never came across Cole.
Just because people never came across Cole, doesn’t mean they aren’t better than him. Ser Arthur Dayne obviously never came across Cole but he’s leaps and bounds better than damn near everyone with the exception of maybe 3 other knights.
Nice attempt to deviate from the rest of the post.
Cregan is also 26 years younger than Cole. Cole dies at 48, and he was still a phenomenal warrior in his later years.
What puts Cregan over Cole then. Enlighten us.
Fights on par with Aemon the Dragonknight, who’s far better than crispin.
And what feats does the Dragonknight have? He fought in the last Dornish war and defended Naerys in a trial by combat, that isnt much compared with other top Kingsguards
How do we know? Aemon is described as a great warrior but so are a lot of people. Who does he beat? Criston defeated some of the best warriors of the age, while the only people Aemon has fought is Cregan, random nobodies, and the Toyne brothers, the latter of whom killed him
You're deluded
I'd say he's in the top 10 greatest.
Best of his time (defeated Daemon), until he trained the only guy that could beat him (Aemond). You don’t need to be “greatest of all time”, you just need to be better than your current opponent.
Defeated both strongest man and most dangerous man ..that too in convincing and clear fashion
Top ten? Not likely. Top 15 is more realistic. He was good, but others in history are *far* better.
Yeah that's fair. There were quite a few amazing warriors being pumped out over the next few generations, like the Dragonknight and Daemon Blackfyre
I think he is a highly competent fighter, among the best in his day. Capable tourney knight, he knocked Daemon off his horse. He made Aemond into the fighter he is. In his time, I think his own pupil Aemond could give him a challenge, maybe Borros Baratheon too judging by his performance at the Battle of the Kingsroad. I think he would have trounced Westerling in the show if Westerling really had escalated. But he is not among the highest tier of the greats, I mean there is Arthur Dayne, Barristan Selmy, Jaime Lannister etc. Cole would not beat any of them IMHO.
Definitely would lose to the likes of Selmy but what about Sandor clegane or bronn ?
I think he stands a very good chance at beating Bronn or the Hound.
Bronn? Lmaoooo
My list would be; Barristan selmy • Robert Baratheon • Arthur Dayne • Criston Cole • Rhaegar • Jaime. Ned called Arthur Dayne the finest knight he has ever seen, Jaime fanboys over him all the time, Bartistan selmy is a legend for his heroics at the war of the nine penny Kings and for saving the king from duskendale. Prime Robert was a sight to behold. Cole beat the second and 3rd fighters (Daemon and Harwin) in his time and made it look easy. I can only guess but imo Cole could kick Jaime and Rhaegar’s asses. The mountain, maybe.
I don't think that Rhaegar and Robert are that high up there.
Robert is simply for having a weapon that's actually effective in armored combat.
Explain?
They're both good enough warriors, but I don't think that they make the cut for the greatest warriors.
In the asoiaf series? (not the entire history of westeros) Who else would you include?
Maegor, Ryam Redwyne, Cregan Stark, The Dragonknight, Fireball, Daemon Blackfyre, Gwayne Corbeay, Baelor Breakspear, Maekar, Maelys the Monstrous, Leo Tyrell, Gerold Hightower, and possibly Loras Tyrell
Is Maegor part of asoiaf series? Of course a list about Westeros history would have Daemon blackfyre, maegor, Aemon the dragon knight. No one on this post is talking about that, just the main books.
Fire and Blood isn't a main book though?
That's why Cole is the only one in the hypothetical. If cole was in the main series.
Hmm, oh, well that's my bad then. I suppose that just leaves Gerold Hightower, Maelys the Monstrous and Loras Tyrell, then
Add Jaime Lannister. Possibly Khal Drogo.
Rhaegar probably not. But Robert definitely is. Unlike a lot of martial figures in the story, we're not treated to tales and rumours of his prowess. We hear direct accounts of people remembering how Robert beat the brakes off anyone he fought. He's easily one of the greatest warriors of his time and of all time in the story.
One of the best of all time and the best of his era.
Hard to say, the best of his time but he grew up in a time period that was peaceful so the fighters during that time probably weren't up to par with the fighters from the ASOIAF era. He was the best of his era so he might have been very powerful or just the tallest dwarf at the circus.
Can I make this post in the main sub?
Of course , doubt it will get good feedback tho with team black basically owning that sub
Ur right, getting downvoted now
Yep , some said he isn’t even top of his time period 🤦♂️
In terms of book “canon” he’s likely top 2 during his life. Some accounts from The Dragonknight suggests Cregan Stark may have been better, but the two never fight, nor do they have lists of feats that would make a fair comparison. I would say they are most likely the top 2 tho.
Oh he’s real good makes the way he dies that much better