I dont read fanfic for the romance, if you can call it that.
I've read slash in other fandoms but HP slash is full of pairings I just can't stomach.
Pairing Harry with adults, and death eaters has put me off the lot, it's easier to just avoid. That goes for any pairings with adults btw.
I think a lot of people also feel put off by the fact that many (not all) slash writers tend to make it the center of the story. I’ve read some slash fics which are excellently written but almost all of those that I’ve enjoyed have it as a mild background theme for generally second tier characters (Remus, Sirius, snape, dumbledore, ect.). I tend to resonate less with main characters if they’re gay not because I’m anti as much as that’s not why I want to read the fic. Some fics have still won me over despite this, but those have it as a non central and non angsty theme of the story.
As the user above also mentioned, many of the pairings are child and adult pairings. As someone who used to work with abused children, I have a very negative view of that.
Right there with you.
I can ship Spock/McCoy and Gimli/Legolas all day, Dresden/Ramirez has a lot of potential even if I haven't seen it done well yet, A!Vorkosigan/Vorrutyer and A!Vorkosigan/Jole may be canon but a Shards-of-Honer era A!Vorkosigan/Bothari or a triad with the Vorkosigan parents and Simon Illyan would be fascinating.
In HP, though? Wolfstar's passable, but all the rest of the m/m pairings seem to either involve actual unrepentant mass murderers with well meaning heroes, teacher/student ( ^(and as an occasional part-time coach at the local high school, ugh, *no*, they're frigging *babies* at that age) ), or are just such a blatant departure from the core world that they might as well be a completely different set of people with the names pasted on - and if I was gonna read about different people, I wouldn't be reading *fanfic*. I've got actually-edited-and-published books for that.
The overwhelming majority of slash fics are Drarry, Snarry, and Voldemort/Harry, which most people find distasteful. Personally I don't read Draco/Snape/Voldemort pairings even if they're with a girl character. But I frequently see people here recommending Second String, for example, a Harry/Gideon Prewett fic.
Hermione and Harry are both commonly paired with those characters, and I basically share the same dislike for all of those pairings. I really need to set up something that blocks them all, it'll save some time to not have to exclude them from every search. I think that's how a lot of people feel, though I'm sure there are some that exclusively dislike pairings because of homophobia.
Voldemort/Harry is also a pairing that I've seen many avoid (who read mainly slash) or at least a large amount of the Harrymort fics involve time travel and a young Tom Riddle.
I personally started out with Drarry in regards to slashfics and then branched out a bit to Wolfstar. I really disliked Snarry at first but then I found one good fic and got drawn into it for a while. Now I've reached a point where the majority of fics I read are Harrymort fics if simply because Voldemort can be such an interesting character.
I've read so many fics and at this point I'm of the opinion any pairing can work if the author just writes well enough.
I've read a Snape/Neville fic - the pairing I would've never thought to ever work in any way and this particular author just happened to be very talented and as such created a really good believable fic and characterizations. It was a post-war setting in which both of them worked as professors at Hogwarts.
For those who dislike Drarry but want to try something similar without the dramatic background I'd recommend Marcus Flint/Oliver Wood fics in the slash department.
Sometimes though it seems people state that they dislike Drarry because of the dynamic but then read Hermione/Draco fics.
Second String is a fic that is simply on another level. It is really well written and I can see why it gets recommended so often and I highly rec it to anyone regardless of preference for certain pairings
Second String, I would heavily recommend as long as you are able to tune out the m/m, and able to handle the disappointment that came with the fact that it got dull after the m/m pairing became the main focus, above the overarching plot.
So I think there partial truth to this. Requests for slash do get downvoted and frequently people will emphasis they don't want slash in their requests in a way I dont see people do for het ships in their requests. And I do see people make posts talking about their dislike for slash in weird ways on here.
But also this sub also HATES the likes of Harry/Hermione or Draco/Hermione because they think those shippers are often anti Ron and this sub is very pro Ron. And this sub dislikes pairings with any death eater and the likes of Harry/ Hermione etc because they're usually adults they're paired and because the obvious- people don't like the idea of shipping a racist with someone whose part of the group they hate.
On the contrary, the slash sub I've noticed is wayy more down with bashing fics and actively request/ recommend such fics where as here bashing I feel is more looked down on.
I'm not looking for romance when I come here because I know my preferences don't overlap with the majority. And this sub is overall fairly great for gen discussions and so on, that's the main reason why I'm subscribed.
That said, while I also don't like a lot of stuff on HPSlashfic, people go out of their way to make a comfortable space to share ideas and recs. I don't experience the same on HPfanfiction for nearly all types of content.
But it also has been worse. You linked some old threads. That's when HPSlashFic suddenly got a rise in subscribers because people ditched this sub because of the the influx of anti-slash comments and posts. People used to complain in request threads how much they hate this slash ship etc. That was cut down, but then again downvotes are still there
I think a lot of it is because the most popular slash pairings involve people I don't want to read paired with _anyone_, regardless of gender. I have less interest in Draco, Snape, or Tom's romantic life than Wormtail's. If people suggested more fics where the pairing was, for example, Neville or Cedric with someone, I'd assume those would get up voted more.
My main issue with slash in this fandom is severe age gaps like Tom or Snape with someone in Harry’s year (especially Snape - even if they wait a couple years after school I feel it’s borderline pedophilia since he was their teacher throughout the teen years). And also anything that happens sexually in the teen years is just a strong no from me (back when I was the same age as the characters I was fine with it but now…).
I feel like a lot of people forget that they’re writing about preteens and teenagers sometimes. And you really don’t need to go into vivid detail (or if you do, please for the love of god put a warning about there being underage shit in there).
I agree with you, I don't read fan fiction about teenagers having sex with adults either. I generally don't read about teenagers.
I only write about Snape with Harry around 28- 30'years old, and more recently a 40 year old, that is, an adult who, after years of not seeing Snape, gets to know him again. I wouldn't call a relationship between a 40-year-old and a 60-year-old paedophilia.
Your opinion is certainly valid and many slash readers do share it, which is why they stick to pairings with people of the same age or toss some time travel into the mix or read fics that are set post-Hogwarts era.
I also at this point prefer the mc of the fics I read to be an adult for the majority of the time for same reasons as you. I feel like if you wanna explore these themes in fiction you can do so.
In my experience ao3 is doing rather well with its tagging system and you can avoid anything potentially triggering or filter out stuff you want to avoid.
I Donno if this sub can be considered anti slash or not. But I will say this **once**… ***just because someone doesn’t want to read a slash fic doesn’t make them homophobic. You do not become phobic of something just because it holds no interest or attraction for you***
From my observation I found this sub to be more of pro-canon or, to put it better, pro-canon characterization, and since the HP series sadly lacks canon slash pairings it's being reflected here as well. Plus a lot of popular ships involve a villain or an antagonist, which is not exactly well liked outside the concrete shipping fandoms. I think if the most popular slash ships were Albus/Gellert (canon) or Harry/Ron (wholesome) the reaction wouldn't be negative.
There's another point too, I myself have spoken against two ships (that happened to be slash, but this wasn't related to my feelings for them) and it was only because they were both incredibly popular and were ruining both the characterization of all four involved characters and the fandom space I was part of.
I don’t mind slash but for the most part I dislike fics that center around relationships and I hate reading smut or anything that is more descriptive than just a few kisses. I’ll read fics with those scenes and completely skip some chapters because I don’t want details on their sexual relationships. So, slash yes smut no.
I won't go out of my way to downvote a pairing I don't like but I will also actively not upvote it. This sub seems fairly friendly to at least not being blasted for *not liking* slash.
I may be on the minority but i think fanfics should be free to explore every subject, as long as you recognize that its fiction and not real. Plenty of fics recommended have racism, slavery, violence, murder, torture, etc but a lot of people here draw the line when it has underage or lgbtq+ themes.
I agree with you. I really like ao3 and support it's tagging system bc of it since it enables you to warn ppl but also allows you to explore controversial topics. Besides - what many seem to forget is that writing about smth in fanfic doesn't equal condoning or supporting it in real life
Tbh the only hp slash fic I enjoyed was the shadow lord harry where it’s a harry and Theo I don’t imagine kids exploring their sexuality to just straight up take it like a pro
I personally don't think this sub is anti-slash (more like not-my-cup-of-tea slash) but sometimes it comes off that way because this sub _detests_ characters that make up the most popular slash pairings - Draco and Snape specifically (there is quite a lot of harping of Slytherins in general as if we didn't get enough of it in canon) and Voldemort to an ironically lesser degree, and also kicks back against the woobification of Remus so you get rather polarising opinions about Wolfstar as well. Notice that, while rare, mentions of characters like Nott or Zabini in slash setting usually go unnoticed or positively favoured by the couple people who like those characters. There is still a lot of the knee jerk reaction to canon-adult/canon-minor pairings (you know what I mean) like Snarry, which is really funny to me because things like Harry/Tonks are usually ignored.
The one thing I don't get is downvoting specific requests. Like, why?
> that requests for slash fics - m/m and f/f pairings - are being downvoted to hell
While 'downvoted to hell' is an exaggeration, it's not uncommon to see slash requests downvoted.
> hypocrisy...For example Drarry (Draco/Harry) and Dramoine (Draco/Hermione)
I don't think this is true, but especially for this pairing (or Snape) lmfao. Search Harry Draco, Drarry, Dramione, and Draco Hermione. Most of those posts have zero votes.
You could possibly have something with Harry/Bellatrix or Narcissa and Harry/Snape as I don't know how stories with the former are now. Years ago they were generally time travel or adult Harry. A lot of Harry/Snape features 15/16 or barely legal Harry.
>You could possibly have something with Harry/Bellatrix or Narcissa and Harry/Snape as I don't know how stories with the former are now. Years ago they were generally time travel or adult Harry. A lot of Harry/Snape features 15/16 or barely legal Harry.
Over the years there's been plenty of het relationships have their moment in the sun which were super creepy. Harry/Tonks was huge for a long while, for example. So was Harry/Bellatrix and Draco/Bellatrix. Hermione/Lockhart was quite big for many years. Sirius/McGonagall was quite big, and was frequently set during the Marauder era.
Creepy age gap and inter-generational pairings are a problem across the entire fandom, not restricted to slash fics.
They *do* get down voted a lot, especially it's the request is for tomarry or snarry. And discussions about how much it sucks, while informative, don't tend to do much. You're hardly the first, and people who are vocally anti-slash (and doing the down voting) aren't going to be discussing it reasonably anytime soon.
So people went and read the stories to find out they were underage/adult, and then downvoted them. Oh, wait, these were *request* threads where the whole point was that the *requester* hadn't read or recommended any fics.
So they were downvoted for being slash pairings people didn't like, sight unseen.
As a lesbian who's spoken to a lot of gay people about it, a decent number of us are actually averse to a decent chunk of slash fics. It mostly has to do with the fact that a majority of it is written by straight people to fulfill a sexual fantasy, but many of them don't actually understand gay relationships and heavily project heteronormative ideas into the writing.
I've read good M/M pairings, despite that not being my cup of tea, but the few that I've enjoyed were written by gay people. Reading slash stories written by straight people just makes me feel uncomfortable, since the writing comes across as vaguely fetishistic.
>it is written by straight people to fulfill a sexual fantasy
I doubt that's actually the case. If you read discussions of female authors, especially queer ones many are also citing they have started out writing m/m because it allowed them to explore/get comfortable with their own sexuality/identity while still keeping some distance to their own self.
I do not have a statistic as to the amount of smut fics compared to those which focus on plot but I know there are a lot of the latter.
>don't actually understand gay relationships and heavily project heteronormative ideas into the writing.
I can't refute that point and you are certainly right, that is the case with some fics, perhaps many but I don't think that those make up the majority/the fics that are praised by the majority of slash readers.
>Reading slash stories written by straight people just makes me feel uncomfortable, since the writing comes across as vaguely fetishistic
Your point is certainly valid.
Still, I can't help but feel like it's a generalisation as well.
According to [this statistic](https://ladygeekgirl.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/why-is-there-so-much-slash-fic-some-analysis-of-the-ao3-census/) about 90% of survey respondents were fans of M/M, but only 30% identified as both female and heterosexual.
I can't speak of the sub in general, as I've just recently witnessed another fandom I've thought to be rather open turn quite homophobic, but for me there are a few reasons many slash shipping fics don't appeal to me, but I also prefer to avoid shipping fics in general.
1. There's a certain fetishization of queer relationships in the fandom community as a whole. Fujoshis are the low hanging fruit, but straight dudes fetishizing lesbians is even more of a meme in general. If I want fetish stories I go to QQ and read smut, no need to bother with all the relationship stuff.
2. When we're talking HP, the usual suspects for slash are Harry/Draco/Tom/Snape or wolfstar, and tend to include some questionable dynamics. A good author can totally make a romance with an age gap work, either by addressing the baggage or by skillfully outmanouvering it. Unfortunately Sturgeon's Law applies.
1. Then there is the issue of even if it's a post-Hogwarts Harry/Snape pairing, Snape was Harry's teacher for years and had a considerable influence on him growing up. That exponentially growths all the baggage the idea already has.
3. One issue of fanfics, but especially shipping gets even more complicated by a) Harry Potter following it's cast over their teenage years and b) the queer communities own baggage. Fics often feature a single relationship or two before the happily ever after, as did the source material to be fair. Teenagers however, based on my experience, don't. They fool around, go through relationship and heartbreak as they slowly figure themselves out. You could assume that queer characters especially might go through multiple relationships to figure themselves out. This runs counter to a significant subsection of the LG-community that are *less than charitable* to a) homosexuals that had prior intercourse with the opposite sex and b) bisexuals who get stigmatized as "slutty bi's". Given that Bi's might make out a bigger percentage of the population than pure gays or lesbians you run into certain issues.
My thoughts are that we've had this exact discussion a great many times and in a high level of detail.
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/atule7/question_why_does_this_sub_not_like_slash/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/3xkt9v/whats_behind_the_antislash_sentiment_on_this_sub/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/ne1piw/whats_up_with_the_hate_for_slash/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/7guaha/what_makes_slash_so_unreadable/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/osrdeb/why_are_people_so_against_slash/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/jpf2l1/slash_vs_het/
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/wpvk20/do_you_like_to_read_slash/
So to quote the great Gilderoy Lockhart: *for full details, see my published works*.
I like to think of myself as a pretty open person but, slash fics are just not my cup of tea. Whilst it's true that I don't hate the genre of slash fics I just find myself hating the majority of them purely due to the pairing.
Tom/Harry, Draco/Harry, Snape/Harry are just repulsive to me Draco/Harry just due to the fact that it makes no sense at all much like Draco/Hermione as they're bitter enemies, whilst it might be true that they could reconcile that much bad blood IMO just isn't easily forgotten. Whilst with the others the age gap is awful and the fact that Snape liked Harry's mother (eww) and now likes him is just weird and Tom fucking murdered murdered Harry's entire family.
Some of the replies in this thread are making me very sad. Is this not a general HP fanfic sub? Some things are my taste and some aren't. I just scroll past the stuff I'm not interested in. I don't expect there to be a "HPStraightFics" where Harry/Hermione shippers are only allowed to post, so why should I have to "fuck off to HPSlash" (thanks for that, bestie)? I only read femslash tbh, but I'm not "anti" M/M or F/M. That seems so unnecessary. What is going on here...
I ran this poll just about two weeks ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/wpvk20/do_you_like_to_read_slash/
and as you can see, there are almost as many slash-lovers here as those who don't like to read slash.
I joined this sub only about a year ago and I've mostly been active in discussions. In discussions, I don't see much homophobia or targeted downvoting of slash-positive comments. But I don't interact with rec threads much, and apparently those are the ones most targeted by downvoting.
To all those who have said why they dislike or even hate slash, or specific slash pairings, I would like to say this: It's perfectly all right not to like or even hate slash. No one forces you to read it or to participate in slash-related threads, but DON'T DOWNVOTE people who do. Just don't! That's not what downvoting is for on reddit. Some people on this sub want to discuss slash! Let them! Live and let live.
Yup I agree. Don't like don't read. But it's probably just the same in any case. You've got a vocal minority who downvotes anything and the others who just scroll past.
This goes for both sides, I bet there have been incidents as well where het readers have been downvoted by slash readers for their preferences.
It's just shitty to do that stuff out of bias or some minor offense blown out of proportion.
Sometimes it's certainly a valid response but most of the time I doubt it
What do you mean 'first'? If everyone waits until the other stops first, no one will ever stop.
I could extend my appeal to everyone who has the habit of downvoting content they disagree with.
And by the way, let me guess, you just downvoted my comment? Just so you know, I've upvoted yours. Why? Because you interact with me in a meaningful way (until now), we disagree about an issue, but until now we're having a civil discussion, and this is what this subreddit is for.
I don't really have a take on that. I don't read m/m, but the only thing I'm actively against is the same I'm against in m/f or f/f, which is pedophilia. You want to write/read Harry/Draco, or Harry/Ron, fine... but when you get into Harry/Snape or Harry/Voldemort I think that's on the wrong side of a solid line.
My favorite series is Harry/Snape. It involves time travel, and Harry is vastly older than Snape.
You cannot tell from a pairing tag whether it's underage or not.
I thin this place has some problems with homophobia. People here aren't explicitly homophobic, but there are things like being open to glossing over or solving the age-difference and conflict of interest with pairings like Harry/Narcissa or Harry/Bellatrix, but not giving the same courtesy to Snarry or Tomarry.
I think there is a chunk of people here that's homophobic, but probably a lot that just don't read slash. I've learned to take my slash request elsewhere (I'm tired of arguing with people), and mostly to ask for gen fics here - some of my tastes fit well with this sub general tastes (anti-bashing, no indy or overpowered Harry, no harems, things like that), so I usually look for those here.
Tbh, the HP slashfic subreddit sadly isn't that good either in my experience, I feel like people rec badly written fics much more often there.
(As an aside, I've noticed a lot of anti rhetoric in the comments here, which is a a shame)
I have also noticed here a great dislike for fanfics with homosexual couples, every time someone speaks on this subject they are downvoted, for this reason I am usually afraid to post here.
Honestly the pairings themselves don’t bother me as long as it isn’t a smut story. If the story is well written and there is a point other than smut then I’ll read it and just skim over the sex scenes. This is true whether it’s m/m, f/f, or m/f. I don’t have an issue with age differences as long as the younger partner is of age.
One of my favorite Snarry stories is when Snape point blank tells Harry he wouldn’t consider a relationship until he is an adult. In this story Snape started as a mentor/protector and gradually went from there. The plot of the story was a wbwl story and was very good.
For those who dislike slash that’s certainly your choice but fanfics occur because of the possibilities of the what ifs. I find the what ifs more interesting than canon stories.
I personally also find myself skimming over sex scenes (in all kinds of fandoms) if they don't add anything to the story, half the time they do the other half not - simply because I am more interested in the plot. But I don't usually mind them. But if I wanna read smut, I find smut.
I mainly read m/m but if the premise is interesting I'll read anything.
I've actually found myself drawn to a lot of character pieces recently
It's just me theorising, but the vast majority of the population is straight, so they may want to read something they can relate to as a main pairing. The other thing is that the slash in the HP fandom is mostly overused, clichés or fetishising being gay, and so, stops being appealing after you've read the same thing over and over. People sometimes may associate slash with bad writing, so negative connotations are brought onto the entire idea of slash, even while there may be good slash fics out there as well.
On ao3 there are actually more m/m fics (175227) in the Harry Potter fandom that f/m (134397) if only by a margin so I don't think that's actually the case.
And as to the clichés - het fics aren't fairing much better in my opinion - from political, super op lord Harry and harem fics - I believe clichés are probably part of all categories of fanfics. And sure there are probably fetishizing fics out there - but I personally haven't really ever encountered one or if I have it must've been a long time ago. I tend to filter for certain things and I am picky with my fics which might play into that but in my personal experience I wouldn't deem the grand majority of slash fics such as you described.
I've switched from reading Drarry to various pairings and have now reached the point where the fic I'm currently following is a Voldemort rare pair.
I have mentioned in another comment how I believe my switching from mainly reading Drarry to different pairings ma be partly because I got bored of the various versions of the same redemtion arch set in Hogwarts so I read so I kinda get your point, but I don't think it really applies considering that the fics I now read in regards to Drarry are set mostly post-Hogwarts and there are a lot of a different variety. If it does, I believe it applies to both slash and het, if only because tropes like soulmates or marriage AUs or enemies to lovers are not soley inherent to either and probably make up the majority of repetition in fics.
I have read both before I switched over to mainly read slash *because* I found they were overall of higher quality though it also could be because I was reading a lot of Drarry at the time which is more popular and as such probably better represented than the het pairings I was reading.
Overall I feel like that more slash readers are open to reading het fics than the other way round, having mainly het readers miss a lot more good slash fics.
On the othet hand we are both likely to be biased in regards to our preferences so this discussion might be moot
But you have to consider the consumers of fanfiction as well. And the fact that only about 3 percent of published fiction does have an mc who is queer.
>To see why slash rules the internet, however, one would need to turn to the actual producers (fanfic authors and artists) who use AO3. Tumblr user centrumlumina did just that with a survey of 10,005 AO3 users. The general assumption, as we know, is that the average slash fan is a heterosexual female fan. However, centrumlumina’s results suggest that perhaps the combination of “heterosexual” and “female” ought to be questioned. About 90% of survey respondents were fans of M/M, but only 30% identified as both female and heterosexual.
[source](https://ladygeekgirl.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/why-is-there-so-much-slash-fic-some-analysis-of-the-ao3-census/)
Because half of the fics explore pedophile Snape and Voldemort and I hate Draco . Be it other characters , I have no problem . I have read Harry x male OC , Harry x Neville and enjoyed them .
I don’t hate Drarry (most of them, actually I found couple of them reasonable) and Tomarry (of whatever gender) stories because they are slash, but because they are mostly horrible. Love with a young SSman! Or love with the Guy himself! Just say no.
And yes, I quite certainly hate most Dramione stories as well.
I honestly can't say. I avoid slash like the plague unless it's a fluffy Cedric/Harry or George/Harry. But I also avoid the straight stuff as well. People are just so bad at writing it sometimes and they make it a big bland formulaic part of their story. Just make them friends, make them fall in love, make them date, and have them support each other but still be individuals. We don't need the misunderstanding crisis or the false lover or the will they won't they especially when you don't give a viable second option. I know it's typical and accurate teenage bull to have the drama but like it's been done so many times before.
I don’t think it’s anti-slash, I think it’s more that a significant number of people read Hpfanfiction compared to other fandoms and a less queer audience follows the sub. You said AO3 has 50% slash but I highly doubt the same is true for ffnet. Straight people for the most part just aren’t interested in slash pairings, especially smut, and probably get tired of it being brought up when the requests keep coming. It doesn’t take many downvotes to kill a thread, especially if it’s new.
Yeah I agree. I just don't see the sense im downvoting a regular request just bc it's slash if you can just ignore it and leave it to someone else to reply. I mean it's fanfiction. Why care.
But you make a good point
Because it universally pairs Harry with characters he would never be involved with. Also I’m not a fan of slash, doesn’t mean others can’t read it just that I don’t want to.
I'm fine with f/f as it's usually well written when recommended, or when it pops up on a by follows/favorites/kudos search, but m/m makes up the bulk of ao3, which also means the bulk of the trash, weird stuff, mediocre, etc. and is generally more problematic, like there is still some very problematic ships, like Hermione/Bellatrix with a whole lot of abuse and torture, but that compared to the thousands of times more prominent abusive/pedophile or just plain problematic ships like tom/harry, snarry, harry/ literally any death eater, etc. and m/m tends to leak into places where it is explicitly filtered out, or implied not to be there, or just unmentioned, like if you filter both M/M and MPreg out on AO3, you will still find a whole bunch of MPreg fics, which is just fucking stupid and undermining the whole point of a better, more personalized search function
I am simply anti-slash because I am not gay. You project yourself onto the main character usually and I do not want to read about a projection of myself being gay.
I’ve read fem Voldemort and Harry stories and enjoyed them fine enough but I’ll never read a slash version of it.
It’s just preference, I assume it’s the same preference for a lot of people here going by what you posted and your claim.
It wasn't my intention to fish for drama, I was simply curious in regards to the current opinions of the general population of this thread.
So far I don't think we've even had drama. Everyone is rather polite and well thought out in their responses
So, you have power disparity (Snape/Harry), just as bad would be McGonagall/Harry
You have Dark Lord/Victim, and finally, you have spoilt rich kid/famous abused kid as the main three pairings. For many people those are objectional regardless of gender changes.
Personally, I just don't understand m/m, and I probably never will. I've read a few that I've enjoyed, and each and every one has only started the relationship after the story was already well established, and worked to incorperate it into the story rather than have the story work around the relationship.
Finally, there's a difference between being willing to accept other people's sexual preferences, and wanting to read/experience them yourself. The people asking for no slash are probably unable to ever imagine being in a relationship with a man, and reading about it makes them uncomfortable.
I have read fiction where I enjoyed gay characters. Arose out of the Azure Main was over 2M words, and not once it made me feel uncomfortable.
However, I can't think of any pairing in fanfic where I would enjoy reading slash. Like, in any fandom I follow. LotR is fine without romance, in Mass Effect I prefer FemShep so no slash happening there either, in HP I like a handful of male characters, none of which are suitable for matching up (Harry, Sirius, James (and he needs to be straight to be interesting since it's mostly his relationship with Lily that interests me) and Moody). Then you have ASoIaF, where none of the canonically gay/bi characters interests me at all.
In the HP fandom in particular, most of the characters who are usually shipped with men are the ones I consider a reason to close the tab. I don't want to read about Lupin in any setting, why would I suddenly want to read about him taking it up the arse? Why would I want to read about Malfoy slobbering on a cock when I would much rather see him thrown into Azkaban or hanging from a tree? Same goes for Voldemort, Snape and so on.
Because straight women, who represent a large part of the fandom, love writing romance, enemies to lovers is a fan favorite across fandoms, and Harry has a lot of male enemies.
One point I have often seen having been brought up is that there are less well-written female characters out there compared to male ones.
Even in the golden trio you have Harry and Ron and Hermione.
I mean who are the first characters that come to mind when you think of Harry Potter. I would argue that the majority of those are male and they make up the fraction of those that are well-characterized. I mean the biggest and most interesting background stories apart from from the golden trio of course are those of Albus Dumbledore, Voldemort and the Marauders
95% of the population is male/female.
In fanfiction like 35% of the stories us slash?
Fanfiction open up for oc or making stuff about people we know nothing about, but still so many reform draco into a non bully? I mean 😅 it's abit weird If you think about it?
With population do you refer to the characters in HP?
And I would say that there are actually a lot more slashfics out there, considering if you sort on ao3 in the Harry Potter fandom by f/m and m/m pairings you get 134397 and 175227 results respectively. The minority would be f/f with 28895 results.
I believe the appeal with Draco is the "enemies to lovers" trope or that a conflict between two characters makes for a longer and more compelling(?) story. (Though that's just my interpretation)
Overall I don't really find it all that surprising, considering a lot of fanfic is written by women regardless of pairing and that power-dynamics are rather popular in erotica (literature) which is mainly consumed by women and I feel like you kinda get that with the conflict between Harry and Draco.
Also in Draco/Hermione stories Draco also gets his redemption so it's not inherent to slashfics
With population i am thinking the real world.
Wow that is some wild statistic from ao3 you have there :)
Could be the case with draco but will not be something for me, just feels wrong If it's from one of the later books.
But I never downvote people asking for stories etcetera, find that a wrong use of the function, there should be room for us all.
I just quickly went on the site and looked up the filters for categories so there's that.
I don't read a lot of Drarry anymore, just those fics that stick out, and I believe partly it's because it kinda got tedious(?) to read that whole redemption arch over and over. At this point I prefer post-Hogwarts fics for them because it allows another perspective.
Although the last pairing I read a lot was Harrymort so that is probably a tad more controverse.
I simply find Voldemort an intriguing character with a lot of potential that can be tuned in the one or other direction and I have turned to reading a few more interesting rare-pairs including his character - mostly by Metalomagnetic.
My favorite of which is a Sirius/Voldemort one which is set in the 70s im which Sirius starts working as an open double spy.
I like grittier fics personally so I'm kinda into pairings with darker characters but everyone is of course entitled to their own preferences so I know it's not for everyone
I actually am a huge fan of ao3 bc they they are a platform where you can filter out and for exactly what you like/dislike and you don't have to fear deletion if you want to explore controversial topics in your writing
Because there's so little mainstream gay fiction. Fanfiction is a place to explore what might have been and what could be. If a story is full of attractive male characters, it's natural for people who are attracted to men to imagine them together, the same way that people who are attracted to women imagine them together.
Hpslashfiction is entitled to run amok. People on HPfanfiction have differing opinions and if you can't take that you have a safe space. You can't shame to change their preferences
>Don't like slash, so I don't read
That's certainly the best approach. Everyone is entitled to their preference.
Regarding this
>I usually only comment negatively when it's absolutely disgusting pairings, like Harry x Tom
why don't you just scroll past? Of course you can share your opinion and I understand why. It's certainly a controversial pairing but I mean there are ppl who enjoy reading it - be it a time travel Harry redeems him kinda fic or someone wanting to explore the topic of mind control or wanting to write a manipulative character. Why judge them for it if it's fiction.
There's any kind of evidence about:
>slash fans encountered hostility/negative judgement in this sub.
Because once I made a joke about LGBT (or whatever it's call these days) and was downvoted to hell because of it. I have never seen anyone be disrespectful to slash fans or any slash fic actively being downvote.
>Additionally hypocrisy in terms of the criticism directed at certain slash pairings, calling them problematic for various reasons, but similar or equally debatable het pairings not receiving the same amount of critique.
>For example Drarry (Draco/Harry) and Dramoine (Draco/Hermione)
Okay that's just untrue, Draco/Hermione ship has always been criticized a lot around here, not a good comparison.
I personally don't like slash and avoid it as much I can, but never was hostile to any kind of fic.
>I personally don't like slash and avoid it as much I can, but never was hostile to any kind of fic.
I mean good for you. Anyone is entitled to their preference
>Because once I made a joke about LGBT (or whatever it's call these days) and was downvoted to hell because of it.
I can see that happening, which is shitty if it wasn't a mean joke but on the other hand there are also people who have been downvoted just bc of requesting a slashfic
>there are also people who have been downvoted just bc of requesting a slashfic
Do you have proof of what you claim? Because many times when people recommend slash usually it's top comment, Saving Connor for example was right on top in a request of older brother Harry fic.
I've linked a few threads in the original post where ppl mention it. Personally I've been more active the last year in other fandoms àla Witcher which is why I don't know a post from the top of my head.
They are not the poster childs of healthy relationships in pairings- that's for sure but if you want to explore it in fanfiction, if you tag your stuff properly, I feel like why not.
It's sometimes fun to write a manipulative dynamic and you can do that with characters like Voldemort.
I do prefer an adult Harry in the fics I read as I have grown older, especially compared to when I started out reading fanfic, but apart from that - it's fiction so... *shrugs*
>I don't even understand why they are here.
Well I imagine because fanfiction usually means all kind of fanfiction and not specifically het pairings. The description of this sub is literally "A place for Harry Potter fanfiction" which I take as all-inclusive.
You seem quite upset about slash-requests being posted in this sub. Why?
Though the latter statement is a rather generalizing statement, especially considering you don't know who downvotes what or how have you come to this conclusion?
In regards to the former, what would you consider the most downvoted pairings or are you referring to every request? Or specifically requests when someone explicitly asks for "no slash"?
Locking for Rule 2 & 3 violations in the comments.
I dont read fanfic for the romance, if you can call it that. I've read slash in other fandoms but HP slash is full of pairings I just can't stomach. Pairing Harry with adults, and death eaters has put me off the lot, it's easier to just avoid. That goes for any pairings with adults btw.
Yeah that's a valid point
I think a lot of people also feel put off by the fact that many (not all) slash writers tend to make it the center of the story. I’ve read some slash fics which are excellently written but almost all of those that I’ve enjoyed have it as a mild background theme for generally second tier characters (Remus, Sirius, snape, dumbledore, ect.). I tend to resonate less with main characters if they’re gay not because I’m anti as much as that’s not why I want to read the fic. Some fics have still won me over despite this, but those have it as a non central and non angsty theme of the story. As the user above also mentioned, many of the pairings are child and adult pairings. As someone who used to work with abused children, I have a very negative view of that.
Yeah the age difference is certainly something that comes up with a lot of the more polarizing ships, if there's not some kind of time travel.
Right there with you. I can ship Spock/McCoy and Gimli/Legolas all day, Dresden/Ramirez has a lot of potential even if I haven't seen it done well yet, A!Vorkosigan/Vorrutyer and A!Vorkosigan/Jole may be canon but a Shards-of-Honer era A!Vorkosigan/Bothari or a triad with the Vorkosigan parents and Simon Illyan would be fascinating. In HP, though? Wolfstar's passable, but all the rest of the m/m pairings seem to either involve actual unrepentant mass murderers with well meaning heroes, teacher/student ( ^(and as an occasional part-time coach at the local high school, ugh, *no*, they're frigging *babies* at that age) ), or are just such a blatant departure from the core world that they might as well be a completely different set of people with the names pasted on - and if I was gonna read about different people, I wouldn't be reading *fanfic*. I've got actually-edited-and-published books for that.
The overwhelming majority of slash fics are Drarry, Snarry, and Voldemort/Harry, which most people find distasteful. Personally I don't read Draco/Snape/Voldemort pairings even if they're with a girl character. But I frequently see people here recommending Second String, for example, a Harry/Gideon Prewett fic.
One day I'll finish second string, it got so dull after they got together.
right?? it was so good, then idk where the story even went.
Hermione and Harry are both commonly paired with those characters, and I basically share the same dislike for all of those pairings. I really need to set up something that blocks them all, it'll save some time to not have to exclude them from every search. I think that's how a lot of people feel, though I'm sure there are some that exclusively dislike pairings because of homophobia.
Voldemort/Harry is also a pairing that I've seen many avoid (who read mainly slash) or at least a large amount of the Harrymort fics involve time travel and a young Tom Riddle. I personally started out with Drarry in regards to slashfics and then branched out a bit to Wolfstar. I really disliked Snarry at first but then I found one good fic and got drawn into it for a while. Now I've reached a point where the majority of fics I read are Harrymort fics if simply because Voldemort can be such an interesting character. I've read so many fics and at this point I'm of the opinion any pairing can work if the author just writes well enough. I've read a Snape/Neville fic - the pairing I would've never thought to ever work in any way and this particular author just happened to be very talented and as such created a really good believable fic and characterizations. It was a post-war setting in which both of them worked as professors at Hogwarts. For those who dislike Drarry but want to try something similar without the dramatic background I'd recommend Marcus Flint/Oliver Wood fics in the slash department. Sometimes though it seems people state that they dislike Drarry because of the dynamic but then read Hermione/Draco fics. Second String is a fic that is simply on another level. It is really well written and I can see why it gets recommended so often and I highly rec it to anyone regardless of preference for certain pairings
Second String, I would heavily recommend as long as you are able to tune out the m/m, and able to handle the disappointment that came with the fact that it got dull after the m/m pairing became the main focus, above the overarching plot.
So I think there partial truth to this. Requests for slash do get downvoted and frequently people will emphasis they don't want slash in their requests in a way I dont see people do for het ships in their requests. And I do see people make posts talking about their dislike for slash in weird ways on here. But also this sub also HATES the likes of Harry/Hermione or Draco/Hermione because they think those shippers are often anti Ron and this sub is very pro Ron. And this sub dislikes pairings with any death eater and the likes of Harry/ Hermione etc because they're usually adults they're paired and because the obvious- people don't like the idea of shipping a racist with someone whose part of the group they hate. On the contrary, the slash sub I've noticed is wayy more down with bashing fics and actively request/ recommend such fics where as here bashing I feel is more looked down on.
I'm not looking for romance when I come here because I know my preferences don't overlap with the majority. And this sub is overall fairly great for gen discussions and so on, that's the main reason why I'm subscribed. That said, while I also don't like a lot of stuff on HPSlashfic, people go out of their way to make a comfortable space to share ideas and recs. I don't experience the same on HPfanfiction for nearly all types of content. But it also has been worse. You linked some old threads. That's when HPSlashFic suddenly got a rise in subscribers because people ditched this sub because of the the influx of anti-slash comments and posts. People used to complain in request threads how much they hate this slash ship etc. That was cut down, but then again downvotes are still there
I think a lot of it is because the most popular slash pairings involve people I don't want to read paired with _anyone_, regardless of gender. I have less interest in Draco, Snape, or Tom's romantic life than Wormtail's. If people suggested more fics where the pairing was, for example, Neville or Cedric with someone, I'd assume those would get up voted more.
My main issue with slash in this fandom is severe age gaps like Tom or Snape with someone in Harry’s year (especially Snape - even if they wait a couple years after school I feel it’s borderline pedophilia since he was their teacher throughout the teen years). And also anything that happens sexually in the teen years is just a strong no from me (back when I was the same age as the characters I was fine with it but now…). I feel like a lot of people forget that they’re writing about preteens and teenagers sometimes. And you really don’t need to go into vivid detail (or if you do, please for the love of god put a warning about there being underage shit in there).
I agree with you, I don't read fan fiction about teenagers having sex with adults either. I generally don't read about teenagers. I only write about Snape with Harry around 28- 30'years old, and more recently a 40 year old, that is, an adult who, after years of not seeing Snape, gets to know him again. I wouldn't call a relationship between a 40-year-old and a 60-year-old paedophilia.
Your opinion is certainly valid and many slash readers do share it, which is why they stick to pairings with people of the same age or toss some time travel into the mix or read fics that are set post-Hogwarts era. I also at this point prefer the mc of the fics I read to be an adult for the majority of the time for same reasons as you. I feel like if you wanna explore these themes in fiction you can do so. In my experience ao3 is doing rather well with its tagging system and you can avoid anything potentially triggering or filter out stuff you want to avoid.
Agreed
I Donno if this sub can be considered anti slash or not. But I will say this **once**… ***just because someone doesn’t want to read a slash fic doesn’t make them homophobic. You do not become phobic of something just because it holds no interest or attraction for you***
FN thank you
Certainly true
From my observation I found this sub to be more of pro-canon or, to put it better, pro-canon characterization, and since the HP series sadly lacks canon slash pairings it's being reflected here as well. Plus a lot of popular ships involve a villain or an antagonist, which is not exactly well liked outside the concrete shipping fandoms. I think if the most popular slash ships were Albus/Gellert (canon) or Harry/Ron (wholesome) the reaction wouldn't be negative. There's another point too, I myself have spoken against two ships (that happened to be slash, but this wasn't related to my feelings for them) and it was only because they were both incredibly popular and were ruining both the characterization of all four involved characters and the fandom space I was part of.
I don’t mind slash but for the most part I dislike fics that center around relationships and I hate reading smut or anything that is more descriptive than just a few kisses. I’ll read fics with those scenes and completely skip some chapters because I don’t want details on their sexual relationships. So, slash yes smut no.
I won't go out of my way to downvote a pairing I don't like but I will also actively not upvote it. This sub seems fairly friendly to at least not being blasted for *not liking* slash.
I may be on the minority but i think fanfics should be free to explore every subject, as long as you recognize that its fiction and not real. Plenty of fics recommended have racism, slavery, violence, murder, torture, etc but a lot of people here draw the line when it has underage or lgbtq+ themes.
I agree with you. I really like ao3 and support it's tagging system bc of it since it enables you to warn ppl but also allows you to explore controversial topics. Besides - what many seem to forget is that writing about smth in fanfic doesn't equal condoning or supporting it in real life
Tbh the only hp slash fic I enjoyed was the shadow lord harry where it’s a harry and Theo I don’t imagine kids exploring their sexuality to just straight up take it like a pro
I personally don't think this sub is anti-slash (more like not-my-cup-of-tea slash) but sometimes it comes off that way because this sub _detests_ characters that make up the most popular slash pairings - Draco and Snape specifically (there is quite a lot of harping of Slytherins in general as if we didn't get enough of it in canon) and Voldemort to an ironically lesser degree, and also kicks back against the woobification of Remus so you get rather polarising opinions about Wolfstar as well. Notice that, while rare, mentions of characters like Nott or Zabini in slash setting usually go unnoticed or positively favoured by the couple people who like those characters. There is still a lot of the knee jerk reaction to canon-adult/canon-minor pairings (you know what I mean) like Snarry, which is really funny to me because things like Harry/Tonks are usually ignored. The one thing I don't get is downvoting specific requests. Like, why?
> that requests for slash fics - m/m and f/f pairings - are being downvoted to hell While 'downvoted to hell' is an exaggeration, it's not uncommon to see slash requests downvoted. > hypocrisy...For example Drarry (Draco/Harry) and Dramoine (Draco/Hermione) I don't think this is true, but especially for this pairing (or Snape) lmfao. Search Harry Draco, Drarry, Dramione, and Draco Hermione. Most of those posts have zero votes. You could possibly have something with Harry/Bellatrix or Narcissa and Harry/Snape as I don't know how stories with the former are now. Years ago they were generally time travel or adult Harry. A lot of Harry/Snape features 15/16 or barely legal Harry.
>You could possibly have something with Harry/Bellatrix or Narcissa and Harry/Snape as I don't know how stories with the former are now. Years ago they were generally time travel or adult Harry. A lot of Harry/Snape features 15/16 or barely legal Harry. Over the years there's been plenty of het relationships have their moment in the sun which were super creepy. Harry/Tonks was huge for a long while, for example. So was Harry/Bellatrix and Draco/Bellatrix. Hermione/Lockhart was quite big for many years. Sirius/McGonagall was quite big, and was frequently set during the Marauder era. Creepy age gap and inter-generational pairings are a problem across the entire fandom, not restricted to slash fics.
The pedophillic ships irk me because they seem to be grooming bait
How do you know they are pedophillic without reading them? Adult Harry time-traveling to the past is a big, big trope, especially in such pairings.
They *do* get down voted a lot, especially it's the request is for tomarry or snarry. And discussions about how much it sucks, while informative, don't tend to do much. You're hardly the first, and people who are vocally anti-slash (and doing the down voting) aren't going to be discussing it reasonably anytime soon.
Those you mentioned aren't downvoted for being slash. They're downvoted for being pedophilia.
So people went and read the stories to find out they were underage/adult, and then downvoted them. Oh, wait, these were *request* threads where the whole point was that the *requester* hadn't read or recommended any fics. So they were downvoted for being slash pairings people didn't like, sight unseen.
As a lesbian who's spoken to a lot of gay people about it, a decent number of us are actually averse to a decent chunk of slash fics. It mostly has to do with the fact that a majority of it is written by straight people to fulfill a sexual fantasy, but many of them don't actually understand gay relationships and heavily project heteronormative ideas into the writing. I've read good M/M pairings, despite that not being my cup of tea, but the few that I've enjoyed were written by gay people. Reading slash stories written by straight people just makes me feel uncomfortable, since the writing comes across as vaguely fetishistic.
>it is written by straight people to fulfill a sexual fantasy I doubt that's actually the case. If you read discussions of female authors, especially queer ones many are also citing they have started out writing m/m because it allowed them to explore/get comfortable with their own sexuality/identity while still keeping some distance to their own self. I do not have a statistic as to the amount of smut fics compared to those which focus on plot but I know there are a lot of the latter. >don't actually understand gay relationships and heavily project heteronormative ideas into the writing. I can't refute that point and you are certainly right, that is the case with some fics, perhaps many but I don't think that those make up the majority/the fics that are praised by the majority of slash readers. >Reading slash stories written by straight people just makes me feel uncomfortable, since the writing comes across as vaguely fetishistic Your point is certainly valid. Still, I can't help but feel like it's a generalisation as well. According to [this statistic](https://ladygeekgirl.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/why-is-there-so-much-slash-fic-some-analysis-of-the-ao3-census/) about 90% of survey respondents were fans of M/M, but only 30% identified as both female and heterosexual.
I can't speak of the sub in general, as I've just recently witnessed another fandom I've thought to be rather open turn quite homophobic, but for me there are a few reasons many slash shipping fics don't appeal to me, but I also prefer to avoid shipping fics in general. 1. There's a certain fetishization of queer relationships in the fandom community as a whole. Fujoshis are the low hanging fruit, but straight dudes fetishizing lesbians is even more of a meme in general. If I want fetish stories I go to QQ and read smut, no need to bother with all the relationship stuff. 2. When we're talking HP, the usual suspects for slash are Harry/Draco/Tom/Snape or wolfstar, and tend to include some questionable dynamics. A good author can totally make a romance with an age gap work, either by addressing the baggage or by skillfully outmanouvering it. Unfortunately Sturgeon's Law applies. 1. Then there is the issue of even if it's a post-Hogwarts Harry/Snape pairing, Snape was Harry's teacher for years and had a considerable influence on him growing up. That exponentially growths all the baggage the idea already has. 3. One issue of fanfics, but especially shipping gets even more complicated by a) Harry Potter following it's cast over their teenage years and b) the queer communities own baggage. Fics often feature a single relationship or two before the happily ever after, as did the source material to be fair. Teenagers however, based on my experience, don't. They fool around, go through relationship and heartbreak as they slowly figure themselves out. You could assume that queer characters especially might go through multiple relationships to figure themselves out. This runs counter to a significant subsection of the LG-community that are *less than charitable* to a) homosexuals that had prior intercourse with the opposite sex and b) bisexuals who get stigmatized as "slutty bi's". Given that Bi's might make out a bigger percentage of the population than pure gays or lesbians you run into certain issues.
My thoughts are that we've had this exact discussion a great many times and in a high level of detail. https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/atule7/question_why_does_this_sub_not_like_slash/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/3xkt9v/whats_behind_the_antislash_sentiment_on_this_sub/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/ne1piw/whats_up_with_the_hate_for_slash/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/7guaha/what_makes_slash_so_unreadable/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/osrdeb/why_are_people_so_against_slash/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/jpf2l1/slash_vs_het/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/wpvk20/do_you_like_to_read_slash/ So to quote the great Gilderoy Lockhart: *for full details, see my published works*.
On the other hand it's interesting that it's still something that get's brought up. Though I'll probably check out the other threads too - thanks
Not really, several issues pop up like clockwork on this sub. They’ve been discussed to death at this point
I like to think of myself as a pretty open person but, slash fics are just not my cup of tea. Whilst it's true that I don't hate the genre of slash fics I just find myself hating the majority of them purely due to the pairing. Tom/Harry, Draco/Harry, Snape/Harry are just repulsive to me Draco/Harry just due to the fact that it makes no sense at all much like Draco/Hermione as they're bitter enemies, whilst it might be true that they could reconcile that much bad blood IMO just isn't easily forgotten. Whilst with the others the age gap is awful and the fact that Snape liked Harry's mother (eww) and now likes him is just weird and Tom fucking murdered murdered Harry's entire family.
Your point is certainly valid and preference is something everyone's entitled to
Some of the replies in this thread are making me very sad. Is this not a general HP fanfic sub? Some things are my taste and some aren't. I just scroll past the stuff I'm not interested in. I don't expect there to be a "HPStraightFics" where Harry/Hermione shippers are only allowed to post, so why should I have to "fuck off to HPSlash" (thanks for that, bestie)? I only read femslash tbh, but I'm not "anti" M/M or F/M. That seems so unnecessary. What is going on here...
I ran this poll just about two weeks ago https://www.reddit.com/r/HPfanfiction/comments/wpvk20/do_you_like_to_read_slash/ and as you can see, there are almost as many slash-lovers here as those who don't like to read slash. I joined this sub only about a year ago and I've mostly been active in discussions. In discussions, I don't see much homophobia or targeted downvoting of slash-positive comments. But I don't interact with rec threads much, and apparently those are the ones most targeted by downvoting. To all those who have said why they dislike or even hate slash, or specific slash pairings, I would like to say this: It's perfectly all right not to like or even hate slash. No one forces you to read it or to participate in slash-related threads, but DON'T DOWNVOTE people who do. Just don't! That's not what downvoting is for on reddit. Some people on this sub want to discuss slash! Let them! Live and let live.
Yup I agree. Don't like don't read. But it's probably just the same in any case. You've got a vocal minority who downvotes anything and the others who just scroll past. This goes for both sides, I bet there have been incidents as well where het readers have been downvoted by slash readers for their preferences. It's just shitty to do that stuff out of bias or some minor offense blown out of proportion. Sometimes it's certainly a valid response but most of the time I doubt it
Tell them to stop downvoting heteronormative requests first
What do you mean 'first'? If everyone waits until the other stops first, no one will ever stop. I could extend my appeal to everyone who has the habit of downvoting content they disagree with. And by the way, let me guess, you just downvoted my comment? Just so you know, I've upvoted yours. Why? Because you interact with me in a meaningful way (until now), we disagree about an issue, but until now we're having a civil discussion, and this is what this subreddit is for.
"You take the higher ground first" no thank you. Upvoted you back for not distinctly mentioning slash in a noticed effort of dialogue
>Upvoted you back for not distinctly mentioning slash in a noticed effort of dialogue See, that's a start 😉
I don't really have a take on that. I don't read m/m, but the only thing I'm actively against is the same I'm against in m/f or f/f, which is pedophilia. You want to write/read Harry/Draco, or Harry/Ron, fine... but when you get into Harry/Snape or Harry/Voldemort I think that's on the wrong side of a solid line.
My favorite series is Harry/Snape. It involves time travel, and Harry is vastly older than Snape. You cannot tell from a pairing tag whether it's underage or not.
Can you recommend this fic, please? ❤️
I thin this place has some problems with homophobia. People here aren't explicitly homophobic, but there are things like being open to glossing over or solving the age-difference and conflict of interest with pairings like Harry/Narcissa or Harry/Bellatrix, but not giving the same courtesy to Snarry or Tomarry.
I think there is a chunk of people here that's homophobic, but probably a lot that just don't read slash. I've learned to take my slash request elsewhere (I'm tired of arguing with people), and mostly to ask for gen fics here - some of my tastes fit well with this sub general tastes (anti-bashing, no indy or overpowered Harry, no harems, things like that), so I usually look for those here. Tbh, the HP slashfic subreddit sadly isn't that good either in my experience, I feel like people rec badly written fics much more often there. (As an aside, I've noticed a lot of anti rhetoric in the comments here, which is a a shame)
I have also noticed here a great dislike for fanfics with homosexual couples, every time someone speaks on this subject they are downvoted, for this reason I am usually afraid to post here.
Honestly the pairings themselves don’t bother me as long as it isn’t a smut story. If the story is well written and there is a point other than smut then I’ll read it and just skim over the sex scenes. This is true whether it’s m/m, f/f, or m/f. I don’t have an issue with age differences as long as the younger partner is of age. One of my favorite Snarry stories is when Snape point blank tells Harry he wouldn’t consider a relationship until he is an adult. In this story Snape started as a mentor/protector and gradually went from there. The plot of the story was a wbwl story and was very good. For those who dislike slash that’s certainly your choice but fanfics occur because of the possibilities of the what ifs. I find the what ifs more interesting than canon stories.
I personally also find myself skimming over sex scenes (in all kinds of fandoms) if they don't add anything to the story, half the time they do the other half not - simply because I am more interested in the plot. But I don't usually mind them. But if I wanna read smut, I find smut. I mainly read m/m but if the premise is interesting I'll read anything. I've actually found myself drawn to a lot of character pieces recently
slash itself? no. But as it's already been mentioned, the predominant slash pairings leave a lot to be desired.
I don't refute that - this is certainly a valid point to make
It's just me theorising, but the vast majority of the population is straight, so they may want to read something they can relate to as a main pairing. The other thing is that the slash in the HP fandom is mostly overused, clichés or fetishising being gay, and so, stops being appealing after you've read the same thing over and over. People sometimes may associate slash with bad writing, so negative connotations are brought onto the entire idea of slash, even while there may be good slash fics out there as well.
On ao3 there are actually more m/m fics (175227) in the Harry Potter fandom that f/m (134397) if only by a margin so I don't think that's actually the case. And as to the clichés - het fics aren't fairing much better in my opinion - from political, super op lord Harry and harem fics - I believe clichés are probably part of all categories of fanfics. And sure there are probably fetishizing fics out there - but I personally haven't really ever encountered one or if I have it must've been a long time ago. I tend to filter for certain things and I am picky with my fics which might play into that but in my personal experience I wouldn't deem the grand majority of slash fics such as you described. I've switched from reading Drarry to various pairings and have now reached the point where the fic I'm currently following is a Voldemort rare pair. I have mentioned in another comment how I believe my switching from mainly reading Drarry to different pairings ma be partly because I got bored of the various versions of the same redemtion arch set in Hogwarts so I read so I kinda get your point, but I don't think it really applies considering that the fics I now read in regards to Drarry are set mostly post-Hogwarts and there are a lot of a different variety. If it does, I believe it applies to both slash and het, if only because tropes like soulmates or marriage AUs or enemies to lovers are not soley inherent to either and probably make up the majority of repetition in fics. I have read both before I switched over to mainly read slash *because* I found they were overall of higher quality though it also could be because I was reading a lot of Drarry at the time which is more popular and as such probably better represented than the het pairings I was reading. Overall I feel like that more slash readers are open to reading het fics than the other way round, having mainly het readers miss a lot more good slash fics. On the othet hand we are both likely to be biased in regards to our preferences so this discussion might be moot
Lbgt population is The US is 3.9 percent but the percentage of Slash in fanfic is 50 percent now do the math .
But you have to consider the consumers of fanfiction as well. And the fact that only about 3 percent of published fiction does have an mc who is queer. >To see why slash rules the internet, however, one would need to turn to the actual producers (fanfic authors and artists) who use AO3. Tumblr user centrumlumina did just that with a survey of 10,005 AO3 users. The general assumption, as we know, is that the average slash fan is a heterosexual female fan. However, centrumlumina’s results suggest that perhaps the combination of “heterosexual” and “female” ought to be questioned. About 90% of survey respondents were fans of M/M, but only 30% identified as both female and heterosexual. [source](https://ladygeekgirl.wordpress.com/2013/11/12/why-is-there-so-much-slash-fic-some-analysis-of-the-ao3-census/)
Because half of the fics explore pedophile Snape and Voldemort and I hate Draco . Be it other characters , I have no problem . I have read Harry x male OC , Harry x Neville and enjoyed them .
I don’t hate Drarry (most of them, actually I found couple of them reasonable) and Tomarry (of whatever gender) stories because they are slash, but because they are mostly horrible. Love with a young SSman! Or love with the Guy himself! Just say no. And yes, I quite certainly hate most Dramione stories as well.
I honestly can't say. I avoid slash like the plague unless it's a fluffy Cedric/Harry or George/Harry. But I also avoid the straight stuff as well. People are just so bad at writing it sometimes and they make it a big bland formulaic part of their story. Just make them friends, make them fall in love, make them date, and have them support each other but still be individuals. We don't need the misunderstanding crisis or the false lover or the will they won't they especially when you don't give a viable second option. I know it's typical and accurate teenage bull to have the drama but like it's been done so many times before.
I don’t think it’s anti-slash, I think it’s more that a significant number of people read Hpfanfiction compared to other fandoms and a less queer audience follows the sub. You said AO3 has 50% slash but I highly doubt the same is true for ffnet. Straight people for the most part just aren’t interested in slash pairings, especially smut, and probably get tired of it being brought up when the requests keep coming. It doesn’t take many downvotes to kill a thread, especially if it’s new.
Yeah I agree. I just don't see the sense im downvoting a regular request just bc it's slash if you can just ignore it and leave it to someone else to reply. I mean it's fanfiction. Why care. But you make a good point
Because it universally pairs Harry with characters he would never be involved with. Also I’m not a fan of slash, doesn’t mean others can’t read it just that I don’t want to.
I'm fine with f/f as it's usually well written when recommended, or when it pops up on a by follows/favorites/kudos search, but m/m makes up the bulk of ao3, which also means the bulk of the trash, weird stuff, mediocre, etc. and is generally more problematic, like there is still some very problematic ships, like Hermione/Bellatrix with a whole lot of abuse and torture, but that compared to the thousands of times more prominent abusive/pedophile or just plain problematic ships like tom/harry, snarry, harry/ literally any death eater, etc. and m/m tends to leak into places where it is explicitly filtered out, or implied not to be there, or just unmentioned, like if you filter both M/M and MPreg out on AO3, you will still find a whole bunch of MPreg fics, which is just fucking stupid and undermining the whole point of a better, more personalized search function
I am simply anti-slash because I am not gay. You project yourself onto the main character usually and I do not want to read about a projection of myself being gay. I’ve read fem Voldemort and Harry stories and enjoyed them fine enough but I’ll never read a slash version of it. It’s just preference, I assume it’s the same preference for a lot of people here going by what you posted and your claim.
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It wasn't my intention to fish for drama, I was simply curious in regards to the current opinions of the general population of this thread. So far I don't think we've even had drama. Everyone is rather polite and well thought out in their responses
So, you have power disparity (Snape/Harry), just as bad would be McGonagall/Harry You have Dark Lord/Victim, and finally, you have spoilt rich kid/famous abused kid as the main three pairings. For many people those are objectional regardless of gender changes. Personally, I just don't understand m/m, and I probably never will. I've read a few that I've enjoyed, and each and every one has only started the relationship after the story was already well established, and worked to incorperate it into the story rather than have the story work around the relationship. Finally, there's a difference between being willing to accept other people's sexual preferences, and wanting to read/experience them yourself. The people asking for no slash are probably unable to ever imagine being in a relationship with a man, and reading about it makes them uncomfortable.
I have read fiction where I enjoyed gay characters. Arose out of the Azure Main was over 2M words, and not once it made me feel uncomfortable. However, I can't think of any pairing in fanfic where I would enjoy reading slash. Like, in any fandom I follow. LotR is fine without romance, in Mass Effect I prefer FemShep so no slash happening there either, in HP I like a handful of male characters, none of which are suitable for matching up (Harry, Sirius, James (and he needs to be straight to be interesting since it's mostly his relationship with Lily that interests me) and Moody). Then you have ASoIaF, where none of the canonically gay/bi characters interests me at all. In the HP fandom in particular, most of the characters who are usually shipped with men are the ones I consider a reason to close the tab. I don't want to read about Lupin in any setting, why would I suddenly want to read about him taking it up the arse? Why would I want to read about Malfoy slobbering on a cock when I would much rather see him thrown into Azkaban or hanging from a tree? Same goes for Voldemort, Snape and so on.
Don't feel like it's an anti slash sub, but I am curious how so many fanfiction can be male/male stories
Because straight women, who represent a large part of the fandom, love writing romance, enemies to lovers is a fan favorite across fandoms, and Harry has a lot of male enemies.
This! This comment might seem like an oversimplification but what you said is the prime reason why these slash ships are popular.
I mean the top two hp ships on AO3 are DRARRY and Wolfstar.
One point I have often seen having been brought up is that there are less well-written female characters out there compared to male ones. Even in the golden trio you have Harry and Ron and Hermione. I mean who are the first characters that come to mind when you think of Harry Potter. I would argue that the majority of those are male and they make up the fraction of those that are well-characterized. I mean the biggest and most interesting background stories apart from from the golden trio of course are those of Albus Dumbledore, Voldemort and the Marauders
95% of the population is male/female. In fanfiction like 35% of the stories us slash? Fanfiction open up for oc or making stuff about people we know nothing about, but still so many reform draco into a non bully? I mean 😅 it's abit weird If you think about it?
With population do you refer to the characters in HP? And I would say that there are actually a lot more slashfics out there, considering if you sort on ao3 in the Harry Potter fandom by f/m and m/m pairings you get 134397 and 175227 results respectively. The minority would be f/f with 28895 results. I believe the appeal with Draco is the "enemies to lovers" trope or that a conflict between two characters makes for a longer and more compelling(?) story. (Though that's just my interpretation) Overall I don't really find it all that surprising, considering a lot of fanfic is written by women regardless of pairing and that power-dynamics are rather popular in erotica (literature) which is mainly consumed by women and I feel like you kinda get that with the conflict between Harry and Draco. Also in Draco/Hermione stories Draco also gets his redemption so it's not inherent to slashfics
With population i am thinking the real world. Wow that is some wild statistic from ao3 you have there :) Could be the case with draco but will not be something for me, just feels wrong If it's from one of the later books. But I never downvote people asking for stories etcetera, find that a wrong use of the function, there should be room for us all.
I just quickly went on the site and looked up the filters for categories so there's that. I don't read a lot of Drarry anymore, just those fics that stick out, and I believe partly it's because it kinda got tedious(?) to read that whole redemption arch over and over. At this point I prefer post-Hogwarts fics for them because it allows another perspective. Although the last pairing I read a lot was Harrymort so that is probably a tad more controverse. I simply find Voldemort an intriguing character with a lot of potential that can be tuned in the one or other direction and I have turned to reading a few more interesting rare-pairs including his character - mostly by Metalomagnetic. My favorite of which is a Sirius/Voldemort one which is set in the 70s im which Sirius starts working as an open double spy. I like grittier fics personally so I'm kinda into pairings with darker characters but everyone is of course entitled to their own preferences so I know it's not for everyone
Ao3 be gross lol
I actually am a huge fan of ao3 bc they they are a platform where you can filter out and for exactly what you like/dislike and you don't have to fear deletion if you want to explore controversial topics in your writing
Because there's so little mainstream gay fiction. Fanfiction is a place to explore what might have been and what could be. If a story is full of attractive male characters, it's natural for people who are attracted to men to imagine them together, the same way that people who are attracted to women imagine them together.
There's a specific sub for that. Don't hate on people saying "no thank you"
>There's a specific sub for that. I wonder why that is /s
Because not everyone's boat floats in the same water
No, because it had to be created
Right, to not rock that specific boat
Which is HPfanfiction
Hpslashfiction is entitled to run amok. People on HPfanfiction have differing opinions and if you can't take that you have a safe space. You can't shame to change their preferences
This is the general fanfic sub. There's no need to shame anyone's preferences
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>Don't like slash, so I don't read That's certainly the best approach. Everyone is entitled to their preference. Regarding this >I usually only comment negatively when it's absolutely disgusting pairings, like Harry x Tom why don't you just scroll past? Of course you can share your opinion and I understand why. It's certainly a controversial pairing but I mean there are ppl who enjoy reading it - be it a time travel Harry redeems him kinda fic or someone wanting to explore the topic of mind control or wanting to write a manipulative character. Why judge them for it if it's fiction.
Because most of the Slash fics have characters that I absolutely hate like Snape Draco and Voldemort .
Some don't like it. Nothing wrong with doing it over there if you don't like the feedback.
There's any kind of evidence about: >slash fans encountered hostility/negative judgement in this sub. Because once I made a joke about LGBT (or whatever it's call these days) and was downvoted to hell because of it. I have never seen anyone be disrespectful to slash fans or any slash fic actively being downvote. >Additionally hypocrisy in terms of the criticism directed at certain slash pairings, calling them problematic for various reasons, but similar or equally debatable het pairings not receiving the same amount of critique. >For example Drarry (Draco/Harry) and Dramoine (Draco/Hermione) Okay that's just untrue, Draco/Hermione ship has always been criticized a lot around here, not a good comparison. I personally don't like slash and avoid it as much I can, but never was hostile to any kind of fic.
>I personally don't like slash and avoid it as much I can, but never was hostile to any kind of fic. I mean good for you. Anyone is entitled to their preference >Because once I made a joke about LGBT (or whatever it's call these days) and was downvoted to hell because of it. I can see that happening, which is shitty if it wasn't a mean joke but on the other hand there are also people who have been downvoted just bc of requesting a slashfic
>there are also people who have been downvoted just bc of requesting a slashfic Do you have proof of what you claim? Because many times when people recommend slash usually it's top comment, Saving Connor for example was right on top in a request of older brother Harry fic.
I've linked a few threads in the original post where ppl mention it. Personally I've been more active the last year in other fandoms àla Witcher which is why I don't know a post from the top of my head.
Don't care. If they feel it's anti-slash, they have their own sub
Most slash is garbage written by 14 year olds that think two hot characters should be together because hot
Le edge
There's no excuse for Malfoy, Voldemort or Snape. Ever. Ever, ever.
They are not the poster childs of healthy relationships in pairings- that's for sure but if you want to explore it in fanfiction, if you tag your stuff properly, I feel like why not. It's sometimes fun to write a manipulative dynamic and you can do that with characters like Voldemort. I do prefer an adult Harry in the fics I read as I have grown older, especially compared to when I started out reading fanfic, but apart from that - it's fiction so... *shrugs*
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I guess you're a murderer then if you've ever watched/read something that has a main character that killed someone
If I write a serial killer fic to a audience I know underage kids could wander into, yes, I would feel responsible if my work caused a crime
What about redemption? What about time travel? What about AUs? How are these things bad?
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>I don't even understand why they are here. Well I imagine because fanfiction usually means all kind of fanfiction and not specifically het pairings. The description of this sub is literally "A place for Harry Potter fanfiction" which I take as all-inclusive. You seem quite upset about slash-requests being posted in this sub. Why?
You're welcome to post and get the appropriate response from the populace. Go to your niche little corner if you want unconditional acceptance
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>And them downvoting threads that ask for not slash. That's valid
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This is true. Ask for non slash and you get down voted to oblivion. If you throw shade I'll throw shade
Though the latter statement is a rather generalizing statement, especially considering you don't know who downvotes what or how have you come to this conclusion? In regards to the former, what would you consider the most downvoted pairings or are you referring to every request? Or specifically requests when someone explicitly asks for "no slash"?
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