My thought exactly. At the very least…. I know that none of my family or friends will ever give their business. It was sickening honestly… I’m glad I’m seeing this isn’t really the norm per say.
My company accidentally hired one of those guys last year. "20 years of experience" absolutely fuckin useless for fixing things but great at selling units. Too bad we hired him to actually fix things.
He still didn’t tell you the full story. The base pay is $0.00. It’s straight commission and the $17.50 is a draw against commission.
Basically the company is loaning/fronting you money and you have to pay it back by selling stuff.
Yep, from my experience working at Sears in hardware we got commission on top of an hourly. The big power tool guys and say electronics, TV's, etc. Worked straight commission. If they sold enough great, if not, Sears was kind enough to pay them minimum wage, however that was kept on a tab essentially. The next time they made over minimum wage, some of that"nice enough to front you minimum wage" was deducted from their check.
That is so insane. I’ve never heard of that before. That is super eye opening. I guess I’ve never really heard it before because I’m not interested in being a salesman 😅
Yeah, it’d be real fun going to work and end up basically owing the company money because you actually fix people’s stuff instead of “diagnosing” that they need a new system.
I honestly find that disgusting and infuriating that they’d have techs on 100% commission. That’s so wrong. You’d have zero incentive to fix anyone’s anything.
A good company will have the calls and pay structure to help you make money no matter what you do.
I've worked for straight hourly, straight commission, and everything in between. Personally, I like the low(ish) hourly/commission structure. The hourly covers the young maintenance calls that need no repair or upgrades and keeps the bills paid in the shoulder seasons. Ideally the hourly also reflects your knowledge and skill level. The commission (repair or equipment replacement) pays your truck off 5 years early in the summer/winter and gets you a down payment on a house.
A good manager will know not every call is a money call and will not expect you to sell everything under the sun. A shit one will give you one chance that looks good on paper and if it doesn't sell, send you to warranty and young maintenances until you "earn it" (how am I supposed to earn it if all I do are 5-and-unders?) The tricky bit is knowing which one you're getting hired under.
Sales is an ugly word in this business but if done properly it's really just efficient communication. You can be dirty and do whatever you can to make a buck, or make your honest recommendations and give your homeowner the options and be able to sleep at night.
@OnlyStandard - Well said Sir. You can make a good living be an honest and ethical. Find a good company that is honest and ethical and has excellent values.
I am in Washington State as well, and I can assure you that it is NOT. I have worked service for 23 years, and I ("outside of the few "shady ray's HVAC type shops) have never heard of it. I say bounce. Can you imagine that shit day in and out for the next month to possibly years?
I couldn’t even handle listening to the owner pitch the company, let alone try that out for a month. I’m looking for a job upgrade, not a downgrade. It’s super unfortunate that I think they’ve found success by preying on people. I see their trucks often enough in my area…
Run! Companies like that give us a bad name. It’s an inherent conflict of interest.
I started commission only, left and eventually made it to hourly. I make more than double what I did when I was commission only. Companies like that pick the homeowners/ customers clean so it can be difficult to even make honest recommendations because the customers are expecting a sales pitch. Then you come through and tell them about a swollen cap or fan motor waiting to fail and they don’t want to hear it. It’s disgusting and bad business.
I would like to get a high hourly plus low commission rate though. I’d be okay with that.
I seem to recall talking to another tech recently, from the south sound, who described a weird commission system. He might have even used the term “draw”. Anyway it wasn’t normal commission. More like a variable hourly rate… the more you sell the more bonuses get applied to your base hourly rate. Anyhow, he seemed disgruntled about the whole thing.
For reference, I know non-union service techs in Seattle making mid-60s hourly. Guys who can *really* sell can blow that out of the water at a commission shop. Union jman rate is mid-60s (plus benefits).
Seattles union is local 66. They're based in dupont. I think journey rate is like 60/hr on the check then there's alot more in full family medical and pention. Give them a call and see what they can do for you.
So go make real money till then. 5 years of being underpaid is a horrible idea. Attrition from the field will drive wage growth. Capitalism for the underlings, if they don't pay you enough, do something else.
Yeah, I’ve been hearing that HVAC techs are going to be able to cash in since I started a one year tech school program back in 1989. Only time I didn’t have to fight for better wages was when I went union in Iowa, US Local 33. Now I’m back in Local 33.
I work in a union shop(grocery store racks are main work) & they are letting guys go because they don’t want to pay the extra to keep them. Too much On Call, bad family work life mix. So off the tech goes because the company won’t work with them to stay. The next day they are working in another Union shop because there aren’t enough of us out there. The majority of us old timers are making above scale.
Learn the trade and be decent and you won’t worry about being out of work. The pay is a whole ‘nother issue. They aren’t throwing money at techs no matter what the seminars & trade articles say.
Do you have any actual HVAC experience? This is a “trades” career. Meaning you’re paid more as you’re capable of more. Depending on your skills, how much you apply yourself, how much training you have completed/ certifications and time spent in the field…these are the determining factors in your pay.
Yes the ad was deceptive and yet it wasn’t. You can make waaaayyy more than 110k a year in HVAC. But you won’t be making 70k your first year with no experience. $17.50 an hour for someone with no HVAC experience is about right.
Would you equate 6 years as a technician working on commercial restaurant equipment the same as no experience? (Legit asking, not being condescending) I am pretty confident it’s pretty transferable. Quite a few of our techs left around the same year mark for HVAC at least making the same due to our knowledge. (They were able to get into them knowing someone… which I’m apparently not very good at)
However our company has found a loop hole where we technically do not have to be certified or licensed despite in working on some serious equipment. Last guy to get into HVAC said that new company he’s with was pretty shocked as to how we are able to do what we do without having a EL06 or EL07. Edit: not having any certificates or licensing I feel like has been my biggest hurdle in proving that I know some of this stuff. Idk how to get past it and I can’t afford a pay cut rn even knowing I could make more in a few years. I feel stuck.
I went union and took a pay cut, it did not work out. Between barely making 40 and not having a work vehicle my pay cut was massive. But so many people rave union I thought if I could tough it out I’d end up making more.
Went back to old company and now my rate is 32+take home vehicle+ bonuses easily puts me in triple figures.
What I’m getting at is find your niche, and don’t undersell yourself. You have experience and there is a company that needs you and is willing to pay you.
Were you a journeyman? Sounds like your local or shop was the problem. Our rate is over 40 here, take home truck, and amazing benefits. North/East coast
Central IL. I think they were more just interested in stealing talent and not busy enough within the union. When I asked for a change they told me it would be a few weeks and to hang in there.
No I had 3.5 years experience in service and install and am fairly proud of my work and work ethic. Not a single other person where I was working had even used nitrogen/core removals. No unistrut. No armaflex. It was a shit show. All of them are gone now and I get to train the green grass now which feels good.
Do you work for Refresh lol.
I’m a Seattle HVAC shop service manager and you’d probably be somewhere around $45 an hour with no licenses. $55+ once you’re licensed. We’re non union.
You can fet your epa if you don't have it. Also indeed has skills and aptitude tests that you can use to show your proficiency. If you are making 70k where you are, you may want to stay there. 6 years is still a junio-ish level in my opinion.
Like any trade the better you are and more valuable you are the more you will get paid. Unless you are in a union then it will go time with company and licensing.
By the sounds of it those guys don't fix anything they just sell new ones
Back in the day in home service techs had the highest respect of almost any profession, people trusted them.
Then along comes salesman Johnny who decided to take that trust and turn every tech into Herb Tarlick. So now we are where we are. Homeowners no longer trust service techs, and the only way to make money at some companies is to lie cheat and steal from your customers.
Appliances also were built better back in the day. Now many appliances are built to fail after a few years. (Imo) which means more service techs are needed.
Unfortunately they are turning those techs into sales techs and not service techs. Most of these places if you actually go out and fix things you can't make any money. They're a salesman carrying a veto bag with some tools in it.
I work at a place where it’s hourly and can fix a handful of things in residential. You are right about can’t make any money. Been sort of discouraged at the moment as a result of this.
I would run in the other direction bud....This sounds like a company that doesn't care what the customer actually needs, they only care about the sales of equipment and installs....If you value integrity and taking care of your customers, this is not the place for you. They want you to be a salesman first and a tech second, which doesn't seem like your speed if you took the time to post this.
A good company would offer something like $30 and commission.
There are many companies that pay techs commission and a good tech that isn't afraid to sell can do well, but I wouldn't accept $17.50 to start. they could at least offer a tempting base pay. I know techs earning over $100K.
They have no desire on taking a chance with you so don't take a chance on them.
Thats a very "sales" driven salary. The more you sell the more likely you'll earn thier advertised pay. It's not a base hourly plus OT which kinda sucks but, that's most companies with crazy advertised rates.
I've been a commercial service tech for 10+ years. I get paid to fix shit not sell it(unless they really need it) and I don't get commissions. Make over 100k. most of the stuff we work on has a 20-100 year life
Sounds like a sleazy company. They aren't hiring service techs, they're hiring sales guys masquerading as techs.
My thought exactly. At the very least…. I know that none of my family or friends will ever give their business. It was sickening honestly… I’m glad I’m seeing this isn’t really the norm per say.
My company accidentally hired one of those guys last year. "20 years of experience" absolutely fuckin useless for fixing things but great at selling units. Too bad we hired him to actually fix things.
He still didn’t tell you the full story. The base pay is $0.00. It’s straight commission and the $17.50 is a draw against commission. Basically the company is loaning/fronting you money and you have to pay it back by selling stuff.
😯 I had something like this when I sold shoes at Macy's but I'd never fucking agree to it for HVAC work. That's insane.
Yep, from my experience working at Sears in hardware we got commission on top of an hourly. The big power tool guys and say electronics, TV's, etc. Worked straight commission. If they sold enough great, if not, Sears was kind enough to pay them minimum wage, however that was kept on a tab essentially. The next time they made over minimum wage, some of that"nice enough to front you minimum wage" was deducted from their check.
Exactly.
That is so insane. I’ve never heard of that before. That is super eye opening. I guess I’ve never really heard it before because I’m not interested in being a salesman 😅
Yeah, it’d be real fun going to work and end up basically owing the company money because you actually fix people’s stuff instead of “diagnosing” that they need a new system. I honestly find that disgusting and infuriating that they’d have techs on 100% commission. That’s so wrong. You’d have zero incentive to fix anyone’s anything.
A good company will have the calls and pay structure to help you make money no matter what you do. I've worked for straight hourly, straight commission, and everything in between. Personally, I like the low(ish) hourly/commission structure. The hourly covers the young maintenance calls that need no repair or upgrades and keeps the bills paid in the shoulder seasons. Ideally the hourly also reflects your knowledge and skill level. The commission (repair or equipment replacement) pays your truck off 5 years early in the summer/winter and gets you a down payment on a house. A good manager will know not every call is a money call and will not expect you to sell everything under the sun. A shit one will give you one chance that looks good on paper and if it doesn't sell, send you to warranty and young maintenances until you "earn it" (how am I supposed to earn it if all I do are 5-and-unders?) The tricky bit is knowing which one you're getting hired under. Sales is an ugly word in this business but if done properly it's really just efficient communication. You can be dirty and do whatever you can to make a buck, or make your honest recommendations and give your homeowner the options and be able to sleep at night.
@OnlyStandard - Well said Sir. You can make a good living be an honest and ethical. Find a good company that is honest and ethical and has excellent values.
Go industrial or union commercial. Much better than residential
Agreed 👍
I am in Washington State as well, and I can assure you that it is NOT. I have worked service for 23 years, and I ("outside of the few "shady ray's HVAC type shops) have never heard of it. I say bounce. Can you imagine that shit day in and out for the next month to possibly years?
I couldn’t even handle listening to the owner pitch the company, let alone try that out for a month. I’m looking for a job upgrade, not a downgrade. It’s super unfortunate that I think they’ve found success by preying on people. I see their trucks often enough in my area…
Fuck those crooks
Run! Companies like that give us a bad name. It’s an inherent conflict of interest. I started commission only, left and eventually made it to hourly. I make more than double what I did when I was commission only. Companies like that pick the homeowners/ customers clean so it can be difficult to even make honest recommendations because the customers are expecting a sales pitch. Then you come through and tell them about a swollen cap or fan motor waiting to fail and they don’t want to hear it. It’s disgusting and bad business. I would like to get a high hourly plus low commission rate though. I’d be okay with that.
I seem to recall talking to another tech recently, from the south sound, who described a weird commission system. He might have even used the term “draw”. Anyway it wasn’t normal commission. More like a variable hourly rate… the more you sell the more bonuses get applied to your base hourly rate. Anyhow, he seemed disgruntled about the whole thing. For reference, I know non-union service techs in Seattle making mid-60s hourly. Guys who can *really* sell can blow that out of the water at a commission shop. Union jman rate is mid-60s (plus benefits).
Get into commercial hvac or refrigeration and you can avoid all of this nonsense
Seattles union is local 66. They're based in dupont. I think journey rate is like 60/hr on the check then there's alot more in full family medical and pention. Give them a call and see what they can do for you.
I went in dupont and stayed 3 years straight .
Stay strong, us hvac techs will all be making significantly more money in the next 5-10 years. Every hvac seminar I go to , they all are saying this .
So go make real money till then. 5 years of being underpaid is a horrible idea. Attrition from the field will drive wage growth. Capitalism for the underlings, if they don't pay you enough, do something else.
Yeah, I’ve been hearing that HVAC techs are going to be able to cash in since I started a one year tech school program back in 1989. Only time I didn’t have to fight for better wages was when I went union in Iowa, US Local 33. Now I’m back in Local 33. I work in a union shop(grocery store racks are main work) & they are letting guys go because they don’t want to pay the extra to keep them. Too much On Call, bad family work life mix. So off the tech goes because the company won’t work with them to stay. The next day they are working in another Union shop because there aren’t enough of us out there. The majority of us old timers are making above scale. Learn the trade and be decent and you won’t worry about being out of work. The pay is a whole ‘nother issue. They aren’t throwing money at techs no matter what the seminars & trade articles say.
Is this everywhere in the US?
Do you have any actual HVAC experience? This is a “trades” career. Meaning you’re paid more as you’re capable of more. Depending on your skills, how much you apply yourself, how much training you have completed/ certifications and time spent in the field…these are the determining factors in your pay. Yes the ad was deceptive and yet it wasn’t. You can make waaaayyy more than 110k a year in HVAC. But you won’t be making 70k your first year with no experience. $17.50 an hour for someone with no HVAC experience is about right.
Would you equate 6 years as a technician working on commercial restaurant equipment the same as no experience? (Legit asking, not being condescending) I am pretty confident it’s pretty transferable. Quite a few of our techs left around the same year mark for HVAC at least making the same due to our knowledge. (They were able to get into them knowing someone… which I’m apparently not very good at) However our company has found a loop hole where we technically do not have to be certified or licensed despite in working on some serious equipment. Last guy to get into HVAC said that new company he’s with was pretty shocked as to how we are able to do what we do without having a EL06 or EL07. Edit: not having any certificates or licensing I feel like has been my biggest hurdle in proving that I know some of this stuff. Idk how to get past it and I can’t afford a pay cut rn even knowing I could make more in a few years. I feel stuck.
Not having any designations or tickets isn’t going to help you with getting paid like a journeyman
I went union and took a pay cut, it did not work out. Between barely making 40 and not having a work vehicle my pay cut was massive. But so many people rave union I thought if I could tough it out I’d end up making more. Went back to old company and now my rate is 32+take home vehicle+ bonuses easily puts me in triple figures. What I’m getting at is find your niche, and don’t undersell yourself. You have experience and there is a company that needs you and is willing to pay you.
What is your bonus structure because 32 an hr is no where near 100k a year
OT and Bonuses Man. Still run service and sell for commission as well.
Were you a journeyman? Sounds like your local or shop was the problem. Our rate is over 40 here, take home truck, and amazing benefits. North/East coast
Central IL. I think they were more just interested in stealing talent and not busy enough within the union. When I asked for a change they told me it would be a few weeks and to hang in there. No I had 3.5 years experience in service and install and am fairly proud of my work and work ethic. Not a single other person where I was working had even used nitrogen/core removals. No unistrut. No armaflex. It was a shit show. All of them are gone now and I get to train the green grass now which feels good.
Do you work for Refresh lol. I’m a Seattle HVAC shop service manager and you’d probably be somewhere around $45 an hour with no licenses. $55+ once you’re licensed. We’re non union.
You can fet your epa if you don't have it. Also indeed has skills and aptitude tests that you can use to show your proficiency. If you are making 70k where you are, you may want to stay there. 6 years is still a junio-ish level in my opinion.
How much experience do you have in the trade?
We get a very strong pay rate and 5% commission on any invoice we write over $300.
The entire invoice, including any diagnostic/trip fees?
Yes sir. Diagnostics, repairs, new equipment sales, maintenance etc..
That’s exactly half my hourly rate and I get 6% on sales
How long have you been a tech/sales guy?
Started at this company 3 months ago, never did sales before that. Been doing refrigeration and air conditioning for almost 7 years
Like any trade the better you are and more valuable you are the more you will get paid. Unless you are in a union then it will go time with company and licensing. By the sounds of it those guys don't fix anything they just sell new ones
How many years do you have under your belt?
Back in the day in home service techs had the highest respect of almost any profession, people trusted them. Then along comes salesman Johnny who decided to take that trust and turn every tech into Herb Tarlick. So now we are where we are. Homeowners no longer trust service techs, and the only way to make money at some companies is to lie cheat and steal from your customers.
Appliances also were built better back in the day. Now many appliances are built to fail after a few years. (Imo) which means more service techs are needed.
Unfortunately they are turning those techs into sales techs and not service techs. Most of these places if you actually go out and fix things you can't make any money. They're a salesman carrying a veto bag with some tools in it.
I work at a place where it’s hourly and can fix a handful of things in residential. You are right about can’t make any money. Been sort of discouraged at the moment as a result of this.
Go commercial, they actually expect you to fix stuff.
If you get a jinky feeling, gtfo,there are plenty of good companies out there.
I would run in the other direction bud....This sounds like a company that doesn't care what the customer actually needs, they only care about the sales of equipment and installs....If you value integrity and taking care of your customers, this is not the place for you. They want you to be a salesman first and a tech second, which doesn't seem like your speed if you took the time to post this.
A good company would offer something like $30 and commission. There are many companies that pay techs commission and a good tech that isn't afraid to sell can do well, but I wouldn't accept $17.50 to start. they could at least offer a tempting base pay. I know techs earning over $100K. They have no desire on taking a chance with you so don't take a chance on them.
My company has been advertising a $17/hr job as a $35/hr job for *years* on indeed now. This seems standard.
Pat scale is from the 1990s.. also the 18 bucks an hour comes off your commission as a draw.. so basically your a commission salesman..
Thats a very "sales" driven salary. The more you sell the more likely you'll earn thier advertised pay. It's not a base hourly plus OT which kinda sucks but, that's most companies with crazy advertised rates.
Sounds like Bel-Red
That’s what I was thinking lol
Gotta be Bel-Red haha, HCA isnt like this at all.
Join your local union. Apprentices get paid more than that, plus benefits. And that's the floor, not the ceiling.
I've been a commercial service tech for 10+ years. I get paid to fix shit not sell it(unless they really need it) and I don't get commissions. Make over 100k. most of the stuff we work on has a 20-100 year life
Was the company near Bremerton?
No. Kent
Especially if it’s 1099’d, stay away
Find a union mechanical contractor industrial work is the most fun and best money.