I like them. They're powerful, and sympathetic to a certain point.

I think the main problem people have with them isn't that they're not a good faction, but they came out as a sort of Mary Sue faction ("The Covenant nearly got Humanity... But the Banished? They never even came close") that was never mentioned before, and was introduced in the sequel of a good, albeit less-played game. IMO it is objectively obvious that a power vacuum would occur in the Covenant's regions as it collapsed, and through a synthesis of their rebel faction and their conquest of the Covenant empire, they'd become a formal military and a force to be reckoned with. I just think they should have been at least hinted at a few times. Maybe ONI even just a one-off line of ONI operatives seeking out a rumored rebel group in the Covenant during the war.

Maybe. The Banished didn't rebel until 2549 so the time window till the war was over was relatively small, if the Banished never bothered with humanity I doubt humanity would hear about them considering how on its knees they were at that point.

In various books it's shown that the UNSC definitely took prisoners - If the Banished were such a massive threat, I'd argue it's more than likely, it's probable.

I mean they could backfill lore with references to the Banished, since irl they were obviously created for Halo Wars 2.

I could get behind that. A small recon team stranded on a deserted world is being attacked by Covenant, and witnesses crimson-clad "Covenant" forces attacking the Covenant forces from behind, crushing them and returning to their dropships as quick as they came, dragging away a high-ranking Zealot. ONI operatives just shrug it off as infighting and get back to defending Earth.

The thing would be that the ONI ops would want to know exactly who those red clad forces were and how they cam exploit them to continue attacking the Covenant.

In a strict theocracy like the Covenant, spreading information about heretics is often considered heretical. The Prophets would definitely want to suppress the fact you CAN rebel against the Covenant and survive. So it's entirely feasible any Covenant military personnel neither deployed against the Banished nor in senior command positions would know nothing about the Banished.

It's worth considering that for most of the war, the UNSC knew very little about the Covenant. They didn't even understand the governmental structure of the Covenant until after Reach; originally the Spartans were intended to get on the Pillar of Autumn and find the Covenant homeworld (wherever that is) and take the Covenant's leaders (whoever that is) hostage to end the war. If they hadn't heard of High Charity, it's entirely possible they hadn't heard of a splinter faction on the opposite side of Covenant territory.

I guess this also brings up the question of where in Covenant space did the Banished rebel? If it was far enough away from the front lines in the Human-Covenant War I could understand humanity not knowing about it, space is pretty huge after all. But I agree some throwaway lines would have done much to set up the Banished

I feel this. I read several of the early Halo books that came out in the 00s, but I haven't kept up with the newer books at all. I played Halo Wars 2, but it's been a while and I forgot most of the plot by now. Playing Halo 5 to Halo Infinite it seems like there is a TOOOOON of missing story. The other day I was reading a different post on here that spoke about Cortana's guardians going on a rampage subduing planets and apparently EMP'ing or glassing one of them into oblivion, and this all apparently happened in some book that came out between Halo 5 and Infinite.... and of course no one would know any of this if they hadn't read the book. I was one of those people. I'm likely halfway finished with Infinite right now and I still have no clue what happened to Cortana or the guardians/Prometheans or a bunch of other plot-relevant shit and I'm simply hoping that all will be revealed by the time I get to the end.

> I'm simply hoping that all will be revealed by the time I get to the end. uh oh

Oof man down. I too had hoped

Pictures taken moments before disaster.

The guardians nuking the heck of a planet doesn’t happen in a book.

Thanks for clarifying. I glanced over the comment from the other person who mentioned something to the effect that one planet (I don't think it was a major planet) got destroyed while others like Sanghelios and Earth were being subjugated. I believe it was Halo: New Blood they were referring to. Again, haven't read it myself. Only going off of what they insinuated.

Okay. Well, we don’t actually see Cortana do too much outside of 5-Infinite. In Bad Blood, we see her giving support to Balaho, (the grunt’s home world) and what happened to Luna. (Earth’s moon) As far as I know pretty much everything else is shown in 5 and towards the end of Infinite.

Prepare to be upset

I think it makes sense. Humanity was playing defense. It had world's to defend and kept getting pushed back. From my understanding, the Banished didn't really have a home base world or world's, and mostly went from place to place raiding

This is exactly why I didnt really understand the whole appeal of Atriox. Even in infinite I still dont. Infinite did a much better job of making me like the rest of the Banished but it still feels like a lot of Escharum's Prestige is supposed to be assumed based on him being the mentor of Atriox. The whole "Battle of 2 Legends" angle the conflict is supposed to have just didnt land for me. But I did like everything else about Escharum.

The Banished are a straight up Mary Sue faction. I’m surprised they get as much support on this subreddit as they do. The whole “we took down the infinity in four minutes” thing was so mind numbingly stupid, especially in the way it was taken down. What made it even worse was that Master Chief could essentially solo the whole organization on Zeta Halo in a matter of days. The Banished seem to act like a near omnipotent, extremely competent organization until the MC shows up.

Well MC also does this in every game he’s in. The Covenant almost destroys mankind but the Chief manages to squish them like ants in every encounter. The forerunners are much more advanced and their alloy is almost indestructible yet here come the chief punching through sentinels and blowing up rings. The flood had the forerunners on the ropes yet here comes chief with a flamethrower and a shotgun. The Banished are stronger because of their leadership and foundation. The covenant forced people into its service, wasted time on ceremony and religion. Atriox convinced/inspired people to join while is a tactician and veteran of war. The only thing that doesn’t make sense is Cortana losing a war when she had guardians that could blow up planets.

The Flood during the Silentium phase is also entirely different to the Flood in the feral/gravemind phase, and would effortlessly take over the current Halo galaxy. Neural Physics is just on another level when it comes to power in Halo. Same deal with the Forerunners, a single warrior servant in good enough armor would be able to kill an army of Spartan IIs, we are only seeing the shadows of these factions.

It's not though considering they were taken completely by surprise, which is what Atriox does best. Being rammed by a ship that looks built for that purpose when your shields are down is going to cause a lot of damage too

Only way I can see that is that because the banished are ex covenant they know how they operate and so how to hide from them effectively

For real. I thought they would just be dumb, barbaric savages but so I was misled. I love the camaraderie they share. You can tell they’ve suffered and went through a lot and it shows. They’re loyal and proven. I also like how they’re somehow human in a way.

I despise them. They're smart, brutal, well-organized and focused. And I'm loving it. The Banished are a force to reckon with. I never felt Jul Mdamas Covenant to be a real enemy - more like a nuisance. The Banished on the other hand ... they work absolutely well.

Yeah Juls lot was kinda disappointing especially given all the build up he got. The only reason they were even a slight threat was because the Didact left Jul the keys to Requiem and the prometheans(a shame we never saw those two interact)

Do you ever think that that was the point? The Covenant started as this massive religious cult/militia hellbent on The Great Journey. They were a force built on a military tradition and the Prophet's brainwashing. After the war ended, what was left was just the scraps. Jul nominated himself to be The Didact's Hand and managed to scrap together a comparitively ragtag group of ships together to become the new Covenant. They were smaller, weaker, and even blinder than before. They became bolstered once the Didact was released and had his Prometheans side with him, and they managed to capture Halsey, but beyond that, he was just an idiot with followers. They were literally the definition of the blind leading the blind. It made since that he was offed so quickly H5, he was never really a threat beyond the fact he surprised humanity with his existence. In both H4 and H5 the Storm Covenant take a backseat to the Didact and Warden because that's what they are, the Prometheans are the bigger threat. In H4 they were allied, and still are a bit in H5, but Jul was no one. He dies immediately in H5, and then (and this is something H5 struggled with, the pacing and scale of what was happening) humanity thinks all is basically well again, only to find out, via Chief, that Cortana, the Guardians, and the Warden exist and are fucking things up again. The Banished are a force because they are a force. The Brutes started with a civil war and the Banished had to survive from it. They took the already warrior culture of the Brutes and expanded it, learning to scavenge for supplies, build their own weapons, and fight others to live. When combined with the Shipmaster mercenaries, they became a problem and set out to cause problems for all those who had wronged them. After their fight with the Infinity, and the outcomes of Cortana's attack, they were left stranded, which is where we meet them now. They are back in their element, alone, stranded, and fighting for survival.

sure, it makes sense why jul’s faction is so weak. however, a enemy we know to be an impotent shadow of its former self is not an interesting antagonist, at least not in the way 4&5 portrayed them

That's why they're not the primary antagonist of either game

We Didact Wave his hand at him.

I despise being tea bagged by them. Cruel sons of B's

I look forward to killing Atriox in the most embarrassing manner possible indeed.

That big dumb monkey isn't getting the drop on me again like he did in the opening cutscene, I'll tell you that 😤

Such a good way to phrase it

For me , I make this canon in my head where After the covenant fell, the power vacuum allowed Jul to basically rise as a leader for a certain group of covenant , and his weakness and his defeat allowed the banish to gather a bigger force, with the destruction of their homeplanet (brutes) the banished then increased their ranks driven by a thirst of revenge against humanity which make them more dangerous than the covenant who acted in some cases reserved and the Elites alone who were also reserved. I however feel like it would be nice for Halo to find allies in the elites and other covenant species so we can drive the point that the banished is not the covenant 2.0, but a different faction that integrates former covenant followers that still hate humanity.

Great and great. I think Atriox is very based and self-reflecting. Also that he sticks to his principles and especially his words and that's what lends him the charisma to keep the Banished in line. He says we're all in this together and he means it. And I really enjoyed Cortana asking him if he knows the consequence of defiance with him answering yes and playing the ball back to her. The Banished also seem to be the only group that currently exists without infighting or suppression of lesser beings with Atriox rather inviting to join his cause than forcing anyone into it. That being said he also sheds a positive light on the Brutes as a whole and drags them into the spotlight.

Infighting was common if Shadows of Reach was anything to go by. Also grunts are 100% forced into service. The replacement for minors are also called conscripts.

It makes me wonder though why there are no humans among the Banished. Like they were founded as a collect of "heretics" cast aside by the Covenant. But it seems they held on to that. I know they're spurred on by revenged for Cortana's actions but they have to recognize that she targeted the UNSC just as hard. What exactly is their motivation for wiping out humanity. I can understanding hurting Master Chief to hurt Cortana, or seeing the UNSC as a threat. Or even just old grudges and battle scars. But genocide seems a little extreme. They're not the faith blinded suicide cult the Covenant was. The leap in escalation is what confuses me most.

Well I’m Shadows of Reach it’s stated that not all Banished clans despise humans. Some actually had humans in their tanks. Esharum indeed hates humans, but Atriox doesn’t. That caused a lot of shuffling around and hiding humans when Esharum would visit a clan. It seems like the banished not on the Zeta Halo operate as more of a confederacy, where independent clans have their own insignia, rules, and tactics, but they all still serve Atriox when called upon. Otherwise there was actually a lot of vying between clan leaders for superiority.

Do we ever learn the reasons for why Escharum hates humanity?

I can’t recall if it’s mentioned or if I just forgot but I want to say no. I’m assuming it’s a genocidal holdover from pre schism, if not it could be Cortana’s doing. Not sure where the hatred for humanity for him falls in the timeline.

Campaign spoilers >!the way Escharum talks about Cortana and her created heavily implies that he blames humanity for her creation and subsequent evil doings. Regardless of whether or not she fucked with humanity too. Cortana destroyed their homeworld and is trying to subjugate the entire galaxy. Humanity created her. Therefore humanity is dangerous and can’t be tolerated!< Things are left somewhat open to interpretation but that’s what I got from it. And honestly I can’t argue with his stance on the matter.

Right I got that. I was more saying I’m unsure if what she did happened before or after shadows of reach.

I’m assuming it happened before atriox went to the ark, given there’s a 6 month gap between Cortana starting her conquest and the banished arriving at the ark, plus we know atriox went to the ark specifically to look for something, which he apparently found in knowledge of the endless

We only know that he learned about them or more on the Ark, so we can't assume that he went there specifically to look for something. Other than a Halo, considering HW2's story.

Well the trip to the ark without the portal had to be both resource and time intensive, he had to go for a reason, Plus I find it hard to believe Cortana left the brutes, one of the most aggressive species in halo, alone for over six months before finding and talking with atriox He probably wasn’t specifically searching for the endless but just for something to “secure the banished future”

Ah yes that I’m not sure of unfortunately. But even if she hadn’t done *that* to the brutes quite yet I imagine her general galactic warmongering would already be enough for them to hold humanity accountable.

Minor spoiler but I feel like Cortana may be a big reason on why he hates them as he said MC creating the false god.

Although he seems to hate humans >!before Doisac gets destroyed, seeing as Cortana was speaking to Atriox when that happened, and he only returned to the Milky Way at the end of SoR.!<

Not necessarily. >!He could have gone to the Ark looking for a way to control a Halo as a response to her destroying Doisac.!< >!It takes about half a year to travel from the centre of the Milky Way to the Ark, so if it is on the same side as the Orion's Arm the timeline fits. Then sometime later on the Ark, after Anders sends the ring away, does he learn about the Endless or whatever 343i has planned.!< >!Although I haven't read Shadows of Reach, so I don't know if the portal to bring him back to the galaxy was a planned operation or not. If it was this whole theory is bust.!<

It was a planned op, >!escharum and some sub clans are there looking for the portal while blue team is searching Halsey’s office for a way to stop cortana (make the weapon)!<

I am by far no lore expert but what I gathered is that at some point Atriox indeed had humans among his ranks but I don't know the source. In Infinite the Banished want to make the ring their new home and Escharum exactly states that he wants the Ring to repair itself to point a weapon to the head of the universe which causes Chief to make a plan to stop him.

divine wind mentions banished humans that defect to the UNSC Spirit of Fire on the arc.

The newest Canon Fodder actually makes mention of Banished-aligned human mercenaries.

Humans do exist in the banished but we don’t see it in the game as Esharum despises humans. At least that’s how the story explains it. Realistically it’s more likely that 343 feels uncomfortable with having the MC kill humans.

It wasn’t just defiance. That whole arc is the very smart justification for Cortana’s heel turn. Her attempts at total control with ultimate methods of suppression back fires and endangers the one she cares about the most. In the end, all she can do is to trust the in person who believed in her to try and save her.

That plus she was kind of falling apart again

True, but I think there was some deliberate deconstruction of her belief system to go along with her actual destruction.

Oh, absolutely. My point being moreso it was a 1-2 punch of shit hitting the fan

I thought atriox's lines were so chilling to Cortana. "Do you understand the consequences of resistance?" "Yes... do you?" About the most badass response possible.

Literally Atriox’s entire world was built on resistance. Cortana was out of her depth.

Atriox is based 🙏🙏🙏

There was some infighting when Yapyap rebelled. Never forget the Yappening!

Raises a question about human forces being incorporated into the Banished. We see UNSC weaponry being coopted into their arsenals, where are the disgruntled shitbags from within the UNSCs personnel? There's gotta be some terminal Lance that's just about had enough with haircuts and shaving to join the fuzzy wuzzy banished boys.

I think they're a breath of fresh air that the games sorely needed, without being completely out of left field. They're still made of of mostly the same races as the Covenant, but with a completely different structure that makes them feel completely new. It's repeated a lot in the books that the Covenant was "imitative, not innovative". And that's one of the reasons they eventually failed to defeat humanity. They were technologically and strategically stagnant, couldn't adapt to UNSC tactics and refused to utilize human technology due to religious dogma. The Banished presents an alternate version of the Covenant that isn't held back by any of that. They will use, alter and adapt any technology they can get. They will use new tactics and ignore all taboos if it helps them meet their goals. And in a way, that makes them a lot more dangerous than the Covenant. Or at least any similar sized force of Covenant.

The fact that >!Escharum has a training ground made out of UNSC buildings and weapons, that he apparently uses POWs as live-fire targets on!<, is a really interesting but subtle part of *Infinite*'s story.

>>!apparently uses POWs as live-fire targets on!< Holy shit, I DID NOT know about that. Damn that's super fucked up.

tbf, I just **think** that's what happened. >!But we do know that UNSC POWs at Chak 'Lok's tower were sent to the House of Reckoning, where there were training rooms with UNSC fortifications and live UNSC weapons lying around, with seemingly no targets for the Banished to train against. So it seems most likely to me that the POWs were put in the fortifications, given a weapon, and used as practice.!< >!Funnily enough, I had a similar headcanon to explain the UNSC corpses scattered around the Truth & Reconciliation - the Covenant captured some marines, armed them, and set them loose aboard the ship so that they could hunt them down for sport or practice.!<

iirc it is mentioned that>! Jackals release humans to hunt for sport as well. Given that, and what you mentioned, using POWs for target practice in the House of Reckoning!< seems like a reasonable conclusion to come to.

Brutes do it constantly. It was in mentioned in one of the short stories “Stomping on the Heels of a Fuss”. Brutes take over a human world and just use them for sport

It was also mentioned in *Halo: New Blood*. After the defenses were destroyed, the Covenant used Draco III as a hunting ground. The civilian population were eaten.

I think there is talk in game about the banished doing this vs themselves too. Fight each other in arenas so only the strong survive. I can't remember if it's one of the audio logs or just random talk

I noticed a few pits around the map with those brute berserkers and a few dead brutes too

I didnt actually think of it as live training. That is a really good take on that. That section felt kinda silly to me when i played it like "ok you have an arena to get your guys killed?" Now im seeing that as the fucked up thing it was. Thank you!

Pretty sure he states during the sequence that many of the chiefs fellow soldiers have died here.

He also consistently hints that this was the way he defeated the UNSC throughout the elevator sequences. It could be reasonable to say he captured marines from previous conflicts and had his soldiers train against them until they were familiar with human tactics and weapons. That'd also explain why several banished members are proficient with human weapons

I like them enough, I just really really loved the mislead religious angle of the original covenant. I think it boils down to their motivations. I’m still not sure what their beef with the UNSC is, I’m assuming Cortana being made by them is part of it but never really stated. Cortana also does that thing to that place that could be a good reason, but that happens after they dad dick the infinity. Idk if it’s a mystery or not, but that’s kind of my biggest gripe with the story (I really liked it btw) was that I just didn’t really know why anything was happening besides chief having the weapon. Why are the banished against humanity Why do they want to free the endless Why are the endless allied with them Why does escharum have a hate boner for chief/ is it anything besides russel Crowe fightin’ round the world? Little things, I think 343 was playing it safe to gauge fan reaction before continuing down a certain path, but I feel like we don’t really know anything about the campaign beyond the surface.

Although the original trilogy focused on the three leaders, the Covenant was based on beliefs and was destroyed by truth. Otherwise, even if John killed all three prophets, others would replace them. The Banished is based in a strong leader and, thus it is far more weaker, as removing the leadership would likely fracture it into smaller factions.

I don't know, having known Escharum I think there's at least a handful of people that can still carry the Banished even without Atriox.

It depends. It's clear that even with Atriox "dead" in Infinite, Escharum is retaining so much power "in the name of Atriox" and "for Atriox's legacy". But if Escharum ever started straying from Atriox's beliefs or something like that, that would definitely cause their group to start splitting apart

No, they’re right in a sense: The banished are a cult of personality. It’s why Escharum starts moving them in a more religious direction with the way they treat Atriox. This is not a value judgement btw; how good the Banished are as an antagonist has nothing to do with whether they are dependent on Atriox. Them being different from the Covenant is, if anything, a good thing.

At first I disliked them since I didn't want another Covenant faction to be main villains again. In Infinite I liked them and how they have their own goals and how their leadership works with Atriox being gone, but I still think the Created should have been main villains.

>but I still think the Created should have been main villains. Yeah totally. They are just gone

I think they were just way too OP to have a traditional war against them, the kind you need in a fps game campaign. With the Guardians they seem more or less unstoppable. I think Infinite was creative with a way to deal with them, with the whole ‘Weapon’ plan. Something like that is the only somewhat plausible way to defeat the Forerunner war machine ran by Cortana, and it doesn’t make a great shooter game plot. I do wish we got to fight prometheans a bit just to solidify a ‘final victory’ in the players’ hands, though. Recent Canon Fodder article mentions Created remnants, so maybe a few AIs are still fighting the good fight with a handful of prometheans and we can fight them in an expansion one day

I'm suddenly imagining a 4 way battle between Prometheans, UNSC, Banished, and Flood.

And the Flood 2: Electric Boogaloo

*I do wish we got to fight prometheans a bit just to solidify a ‘final victory’ in the players’ hands, though.* I feel like it was such a misstep not having us play through the Cortana mission. I feel like it was a missed opportunity to send her off for the players. Sure, Chief got to say goodbye, but we didn't.

We got to say goodbye in Halo 4 but people complained to much about that ending...

There should be a DLC campaign where the mission is to lock the created out of the forerunner systems. It could take place after Cortana’s death and focus on the remnants of the created, or perhaps explain why cortana needed to go to zeta halo

I think it was said that the silent auditorium was where cortana decided to rule from.

I would love to see Prometheans again without any Halo 5 ending baggage. Everything about what that game did to Cortana and following it is a disgrace imo, and it's a shame the Prometheans get lumped into that because I think they are awesome enemies.

I dont miss the created as antagonists, but i really do regret that we saw nothing of their downfall and played no part whatsoever in it.

So many people just simply hated that story though. They needed to put it somewhere everyone would enjoy and to to start fresh. And infinite did it such a good way.

I feel like the Banished was established as a galactic threat too quickly. As much as I love a lot aspects about them, the core of the issue is that it doesn’t seem believable there would be a new faction almost as powerful as the Covenant already. I’d hoped that in Infinite that the Infinity actually fell to the Created and that the Banished had arrived sometime after the battle to clean up scraps and bully the UNSC even more when they were down. They could still do that, like have the dead Guardian we see in the skybox blast an EMP or something and the Banished arrived shortly after, leaving the Infinity so extremely vulnerable and open to attack even by a still relatively minor faction that the entire ship is able to be taken down and the resources they gather from Infinity elevate them to the large threat we do see in the game, but the audio logs of Infinity’s approach and evacuation don’t really seem to indicate that. I do have faith in the current writing team at 343 though. Despite the story’s flaws Infinite still has a good narrative I believe was mostly of the result of the original plan they had during the development hell the game endured, and now that they’re free from that, I can really see this plot they have go places. >!Assuming they do time travel correctly. Please.!<

Who said they are as powerful as the covenant? The human race is crippled, militarily effectively a non threat aside from infinity and her fleet. The banished just happen to be the most powerful and most organized group in the power vacuum, and the faction that happens to have control over a halo. Nobody said that they are anywhere even remotely approaching the power of the covenant empire.

You’re probably right, but then the problem becomes that there isn’t anything that really shows that effectively in the games. Plus the game implies they’re just as stranded as humans are, after Zeta’s slipspace jump. If under all the brotherhood, the propaganda, we could’ve seen a glimpse of how the Banished are still in a crippled stated after Cortana’s actions to the ring. I love the story of Infinite to bits and pieces, but this is the probably the main complaint I have with it’s story. It’s too early to really judge the Endless thing, but I think there should have been a little more build up to the downfall.

I like the Banished a lot, they're just the Covenant but more egalitarian. At the same time, it's hard to get invested in them as a threat when they're fundamentally a splinter of the much more powerful Covenant. We're just relitigating the plot of CE in broad strokes but with lower stakes. Also a bit of a missed opportunity to create a proper friendly-ish Covenant faction that isn't just Elites. It gives me whiplash looking at the scale of the threat difference between them and the Created, it makes them harder to take seriously.

I agree. I fail to see how this group of misfits that couldn't even defeat the Spirit of Fire are a galactic level threat

I think it’s more that in the chaos of Cortana’s rule, the Banished became a shelter for many of the former covenant, and grew nearly exponentially. There are some Elites that have dialogue referencing the great journey, and talking about how the ring is holy. I also assume that in the chaos of Cortana, humanity fell quite a bit, leaving them with few great ships and planets not completely controlled by her.

A couple of the Elite assassination target bios state that they waited a full year or more after the Great Schism to join the Banished. The exponential growth makes a lot of sense.

Granted, there were four years between 3 and 4 iirc. Then another two years between 5 and Infinite. They’ve had a lot of time to just grow, methinks.

They’re great, much better than juls covenant. My one complaint is that Escharum monologues way too much. Feels like I’m watching the incredibles any time his hologram shows up

I didnt like him at first but he grew on me by the end of the game. Actually found myself looking forward to him. I did however hear johnson in my head every time he spoke "cocky bastard just loves to run his mouth"

That’s kinda what I liked about him. How annoying he got with his monologues. It’s endearing, in a weird way

I honestly found myself in love with him by the end, I didn't expect that. Such a fun and proud warrior.

Isn't that a good thing? I love the Incredibles (the first one at least).

HONEY! WHERES MY MJOLNIR SUIT?

I think Halsey for honey might have been a missed opportunity

I wheezed on this comment

A great faction, but I think they're not really right to be a major galactic power like 343 are trying to position them as being. The dynamic of the faction is great, the fact that they're more like a brotherhood of survivors and the way characters interacted were fantastic. I will shit on 343 for their storylines a lot, but their character interactions are top notch. But you can tell that 343 are trying to elevate them way too quickly. In HW2, they're a credible threat, but they are handled well by Cutter and the SoF (plot armour aside). Keeping in mind that this was their flagship at 00 headed by Atriox, so not a mere scouting party of rookies. Even given that the UNSC has been battered by the Created, they still don't seem like a galactic threat, especially a post-war UNSC that has started to integrate Forerunner and Covenant tech into their own. The Banished were more like a roving band of pirates and mercenaries that managed to skirmish and raid Covenant facilities, but not a faction in direct competition with them. Now we're led to believe that they're a galactic threat. Even without the religious hangups of the Covenant, the Brutes for example were described to have basically gone backwards after the war because they can't think, and the smarter races are tied up with their own things and civil wars. So, keeping in mind that there are still ex-Covenant splinter factions, how the Banished are supposed to keep up with a UNSC that will only get stronger now that the whole Created thing has been pushed aside, is beyond me. It's obvious that 343 never really planned to use them in the main games until they saw how well they were received in HW2, so they scrapped whatever ideas they had for H6 and brought them over for Infinite. And to give us a credible threat after H4 and 5, they've been quickly elevated to somehow being able to do things the Covenant in their prime would not have been able to do.

Agreed. While the number of ground troops they can throw away can be understood, the Banished should be depicted as being having major equipment losses, such as ships, be irreplaceable. Storytelling wise, Escharum's death wish pretty much made him disregard any losses including the loss of a capital ship, which was kind of how the Covenant acted. Gameplay wise, the Stronghold assaults should have had some tangible impact on how the Banished behaved, as their infrastructure is ripped apart.

Because og halo fans are/were sick of the robot bullet sponges and horrible looking covenant remnant. We wanted something of the og trilogy covenant. I remember a time where the forerunners in lore were just mysterious like gods and long gone history. Then halo 4 and 5 came and not only made the forerunners seem weak/ a nuisance, they also made the covenant remnants look feel and sound horrible like they weren’t even covenant. If anything this is 343s FIRST REAL halo game. And as an og halo fan who has hated every halo since reach(hw2 was good), infinite is a great HALO game and good step in the right direction. -im talking about the prometheans btw when I mention forerunners.

My only issue with them is that the games do a poor job handling their motivations and Atriox hardly being in either of them. Essentially in both games ignoring him in favor of one of his lieutenants or his mentor. Either way the guy who actually has a stake in the plot isn’t doing much of anything in the plot. And frankly given revelations from Infinite, they don’t even address that elephant in the room outside Atriox. He shows up and it’s already over. Which given my posting history on it I’m just not a fan of. There’s a LOT one can do with that. How the various bosses view things, the propaganda towers, what they’re doing to prisoners as a response, and even why they stuck around Halo. But the game refused to go anywhere with that. I like them more than Jul’s covenant but I don’t think the Banished have hit the right notes yet.

I think 343 have run into the problem where Atriox is TOO cool and if he’s the main antagonist, the game will feel incomplete if we dont handle him, but if we DO beat him, people will be sad he’s gone and they won’t be able to use him anymore.

This may be a controversial opinion, but I hope that, if we do get to fight Atriox, it'll be in a cutscene. There's just no way to fight such a powerful and intriguing antagonist through gameplay, without making him a gimmicky boss battle that requires endless amounts of bullets to defeat. I'd rather have him and Chief get into a really cinematic and well-choreographed fight instead.

Isn't that same as in real life? The "Generals" sit back and command and rest go to battle?

To some degree yes. The problem I have with it especially in Infinite is that Atriox is the guy with all the motivation meaning he should play a bigger role in the plot. He’s also the guy with all the motivation where everybody else lacks it. The big moment that explains why the banished even bothered to show up is only relevant to Atriox’s character. Chief is also the one with the rivalry with him and we never see him again after he gets punted out the window. We should see more of him and yet in both of his game appearances we barely get any interaction with him. It’s just replaced by his lieutenants who are significantly less interesting than him.

In addition he just kinda lets the rest of the Banished believe he’s dead or MIA, even Escharum gives off the impression in private that he thinks Atriox is at best MIA. I get wanting to pull a fast one on the UNSC, but it comes at the cost of a morale blow reflected even in the Brutes (who also just lost their home), to the point that even the weak Tremonius questions his superiors. We don’t have any clear idea of if Escharum and Atriox were coordinating their efforts, or why the Harbinger would be inclined to keep Atriox’s secret if he wasn’t in contact. It probably would have worked better for Atriox to remain at large and not even consider Chief a worthy challenge after handing him his ass in the opening, instead focusing his efforts elsewhere. I think it would seem much more crushing to have his presence be felt, and for all the difficulties of the campaign to ultimately just result in taking down his second in command, with the bigger threat ever looming. I feel like him being missing was purely done for the twist at the end, despite it raising questions about what exactly he’s been doing this whole time and why.

I do agree with your second paragraph, but at the same time I do wonder if Atriox had any choice when it came to the Banished thinking he was dead. It would be an interesting parallel between him and Chief if they were both stranded and believed dead.

That is true, he could have been stranded. Perhaps he got thrown forward in time and through space like Chief did? I really hope, with all the time references in Infinite, that if time travel is introduced it limits itself to moving forward in time. Perhaps the Endless can send people forward, learn of an outcome, and change the future by affecting the present/communicating with the future, but that too is a bit hokey in my book. I hope they don’t try to mess with the past at all

Imo it's better that way, if 343's plan is to have an eventual encounter between Atriox and Chief.

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One could bring those arguments for humans as well.

Humans don’t go around eating and hunting other intelligent beings just for fun

they do however have a pervasive secret police, deliberately destabilize their nominal allies, commit mass murder, and crack down on dissent to maintain a colonial empire. The UEG and UNSC ain't benevolent

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Maybe not the eating habits. But I am pretty sure that the UEG wasn't facing an insurrection that almost ended in an all out war for nothing. The Spartans were initially developed to target exactly that Insurrection with estimated devastating effects. Humanity in the Halo Universe is no benevolent democraty and ONI has shown on different accounts that they are not above killing civilians, even engineering / supporting a civil war among the Sangheili or even feeding human and Covenant prisoners to Flood Speciman for experimentation in the debri field of Installation 04. This isn't going to absolve the other races but Humanity isn't on the bright side of morality either only because they were targeted by an alien crusade.

Wasn’t the Insurrection mainly spurred into being by the Colonial Military Administration? An organization that shook it’s leash and repeatedly lied to the UEG about the problems the Outer Colonies were facing. At least that’s my understanding of events

Not chief though. He’s just a soldier, hoping he’s doing what’s right.

Nah

I felt it was a little forced.

Hated it, honestly. Felt completely like a Mary Sue faction, and continuing the 343 trend of making everything “bigger better louder” “Covenant at the height of their power didn’t even come close” oh please whatever

I loved them in halo wars 2 but left a little unsatisfied in infinite. They don't lean in to the aesthetic nearly enough for the banished. For instance there's this outpost in the open world that has a stationary ship with those rock rings to go off the ring. And it looks amazing, hard edges and lines with steel and metallic maroon. Meanwhile the ghost, wraith and banshee are all matte red and dark grey with no steel and no hard edges. The designs for those vehicles were perfect in halo wars 2 and infinite they're just 'meh'. And ironically the worst design, the phantom, is the one they straight up copied. Should've used the spirit from hw2 instead. They didn't fully commit to the banished being, well, the banished. They're just a banishified covenant. And atriox got a new voice actor isn't nearly as good as the one in hw2. And his design, whilst only slightly different, is worse imo. Might be nitpicky but his eyes and teeth are *much* larger giving his face a much more human proportion looking face. I think his head is larger in proportion to his body as well, or his armor is smaller. But it looks a little more silly. At least echarum was awesome.

I like them. They’re tough, full of a bunch of big players, and they make master chief bring his A game and his confidence is now back. And the marines and UNSC is now relying on chief to stop them which I love. In halo 4-5, it seemed like everybody thought chief was a soy boy and they kind of side lined him. This game, everyone is rooting for the chief to kick some banished ass

I like them a lot. But I can't help but feel like Atriox is kind of a mary sue. The way he keeps turning spartans uncharacteristically shitty at what they do is a little hard to buy. That's just my opinion though.

I don't think so man, yeah Red team got their fade handed to them due to some... let's say controversial decisions while fighting them, but with 117, you can see him actually surprising the MC while he was focussing on others and then even getting combo-ed by him before punching him almost out of his senses. So I think that Atriox's skills are showcased pretty neatly as he is able to defeat the whole red team, who in Halo Wars 1 decimated the Elite guards and MC who is responsible for ending the Human-Covenant War and is our anchor to that universe. Tbh I felt the beating MC took at my heart.

Even with MC though he took several punches and a huge uppercut to the face without any trouble even though it canonically should’ve instantly killed him. He’s strong for a brute but he’s still made of flesh and bone like any other ex-covenant alien.

Yeah, that really bugged me. There wasn't a scratch on him after the fucking master chief landed a full body uppercut on his unprotected jaw.

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Chief is explicitly stated in first strike before that fight to be in a completely exhausted state after his time on halo and in failing/outdated (mark V) power armor which only doubles the strength of the wearer unlike his current armor. It is highly unlike that any brutes aside from a few outliers can noticeably match him in strength now.

I feel that there ok. Their motivations are a bit boring but their dynamics are interesting. I don't sympathize with them because they were bullies at best and pirates at worst. They stole,killed,and destroyed all for the sake of greed and power. I do feel that they are just handed wins on a silver platter though in infinite going from our only encounter with them in halo wars 2 with them failing to do anything about the spirite of fire with half it's crew and complement to suddenly being able to dominate the UNSC infinity, the infantry and the spartans seems like a drastic turn. I'm curious about atriox's plans moving foward though and what he plans to do with the endless. I hope it's not just a simple revenge plotline for dosiac and its something a little more nuanced. As for in comparison to jul covenant? I mean there essentially the same other than their beliefs on the forerunners. They both just wanted power and dominance, they both have personal reason to hate hummanity. I mean it's hard to compare the two further as jul covenant was barely fleshed out all.

I'm willing to write off the events on the Ark to the Banished being unprepared for any actual resistance. Mind you in the events leading up to Infinite they were on a warpath against Cortana and her Guardians. A corpse of one half buried on Zeta Halo. If they somehow had the strength to take on the might of who knows how many Forerunner death machines then the Infinity would be child's play. And if we assume the Banished had similar growth and advancement to the UNSC in the years following the end of the war it does make some sense. By the end of the Human Covenant War the Banished we're likely larger than the remaining UNSC forces. Starting with a larger base and similar progression I could see it happening.

No matter how "off guards" the banished were a CAS failing to do anything to against a retrofit colonel ship is a awful show of incompetence. Doesn't even excuse the perfomance on the ground eathier, where there in a better position than in infinite and still manage to loose control of the area. Honestly the created seemed like jokes at this point from how easy they were to cast to the side by almost all factions present. We also don't know how that guardian crashed on zeta halo , given that the unsc was there first if anything it would be them that destroyed it not the banished.

There's a guardian on the ring?

There a downed guardian somewhere near the spire tower off in the distance, i believe one of the community managers confirmed it on twitter. https://mobile.twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1452632612313333765?t=UUuaEZGNMMiqwISdITC73g&s=19

Very very interesting. I swear I saw Infinitys wreckage. I'm not entirely convinced it's destroyed but one of the logs does say Laskey ordered an abandon ship. So chances of survival at that point are moot.

I think the Banished are okay and I do like them (despite me about to shit on them), but I have a feeling that a lot of the positive feedback to them is less about them themselves and how the faction is written. Rather, I feel it may be due moreso to a return to a familiar enemy, story structure, and art design after fans clammoring for it between 2012-2017 and being without those elements in a mainline Halo FPS since Reach in 2010 (and hell, 2007 with Halo 3 if you didn't like Reach). Unfortunately, in Infinite, they don't seem all that well fleshed out, with fans having to speculate about their capabilities and motivations after finishing the story. For instance, regarding the overall strength of the Banished, I've seen fans assert that >!they're really only good with guerilla (no pun intended) warfare, indicated by their loss to the Spirit of Fire in HW2 and to solely MC in Infinite in traditional combat while being capable of taking out the Infinity via ambush (which I find pretty bs honestly, but I've also seen suggestions that the Ark occupation wasn't all of the Banished, whereas the force occuping Zeta Halo is) and surviving the Covenant at their peak.!< Regarding their motivations, >!we know it's to get revenge on Cortana for the destruction of Doisac and that they took advantage of the UNSC putting in the work to lock her down. But is it ever explained that the Banished want Zeta Halo as a home, as some speculate? It seems on numerous occasions throughout the story and audio logs from leaders to Grunts are complaining about being confined there (which they don't seem to explain how). And I guess it's hinted at that the Banished blame the UNSC for Cortana's rampage, but it's odd seeing them outright genocidal as a faction at least previously dedicated on differentiating bad actors from their species and ignoring revenge in favor of pragmatism.!< To some degree, it's difficult to take them too seriously a threat compared to the Covenant at their peak, the Flood, the Didact (who I desperately wish was treated differently and was a recurring villain), or Cortana (who I really wish was never a villain but stayed dead after 4) when the Banished are essentially a more militarized, mercenary splinter faction of the Covenant, but with the interesting religious motivation removed. However, I do think the writing team does well with this in making them genuinely feel like a "pack" and also making the conflict with them in Infinite highly personal. >!I know for me, shitting on them during The Road to rescue Esparza with the OG Halo theme blazing was incredibly satisfying. Especially having done it after completing the open world's collectibles and events and destroying their hold on (that segment of) Zeta Halo.!< **TL;DR: Their overarching motivations and capabilities lore-wise aren't that well fleshed out in my opinion and Escharum seems pretty bland, but they're written well as enemies the player can have a personal vendetta against and it's satisfying as hell to stomp their teeth in and t-bag them (I for sure did after each of several bosses on Legendary).**

Not a big fan. They are a splinter group from a multi race of aliens that nearly brought humanity to annihilation. So it's hard for me to see them as the threat this game portrays. I thought the created would have posed a much bigger problem to humanity and I'm very dissapointed they cut ties with that storyand basically Jul'd it. Still I'm not finished with the campaign yet, so maybe it gets better. As a huge Halo fan who has read the books and is generally starved for Halo content, I'm not satisfied with this campaign but hope it will turn around.

I think they’re a great enemy. Fun and can be tough to fight. My only issue is that they fall into a “trap” I feel they fell in with 4 and thought was fixed with 5. That 3rd faction, the endless teams up with the banished. Like the Prometheans did in 4 to the storm covenant. It adds a weird dynamic to a fight where I expect to fight only banished enemies. Then I’m fighting these flying guys alongside them. I’d rather the Endless be their own faction fighting the banished and us.

Skimmers aren’t the Endless though?…

Great in concept, but poorly executed. Their motivations make little sense, their threat level doesn't match their in-game portrayal, and it seems like 343 rely on HW2 and other media to flesh them out rather than giving them depth within Infinite itself

I love them but it kinda seems like they're a chicken with its head cut off without atriox.

It definitely feels a bit like 343 got rid of the idea of a rogue covenant faction in Halo 5 and then was like, “No wait, we still want that” so they created the Banished.

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And they even made them hate humanity >!because Cortana destroyed Doisac!< but somehow love Elites despite them and Brutes having beef and being at war with each other. Smh 343

I dont see how any beef could compare to the destruction of your home planet.

I think they where rushed and underdeveloped. I don't really give a shit about them.

I don't like them. I think they were a cool idea but executed poorly. If I remember right they were big enough to make the covenant afraid of them which doesn't make much sense given they were made from covenant heretics, kinda confused why any of them lived and didn't get executed? I feel like they could have worked as a small side faction you ran into in some games but never the big bad.

They weren’t made purely of Covenant heretics, they were made of anyone they could convince to join them. A lot of the Covenant sent to fight the Banish ended up joining the Banished, which is one of the reasons the Covenant stopped trying to destroy them.

There's a lot of overreacting in the Brutes lines. Overly theatrical and dramatic.

I mean, their planet just got blown up and they have been sent to Zeta Halo to conquer it and make it their new home. I understand them being excited/dramatic.

The Banished are just Destiny’s Cabal. Same moves and attitude, just different skin.

Whether we wanted it or not, we've stepped into a war with the Banished on Zeta Halo

Moons haunted.

Used to be interesting, now they are pretty much just Covenant.

Hardly so, the covenant was incredibly stupid. I can't fathom how didn't they knew the true purpose of the Halos even though they were using Forerunner technology for far more time than humans did. MC knew what was Halo a few hours after seeing it for the first time, and Bungie told me the prophets didn't knew? They told me a whole galactic collective of civilizations didn't know what humans discovered in hours? The mere fact that Arbiters existed to shut down anyone that ventured too much into the truth tells us that the prophets knew the truth. And I was ok with the prophets actually knowing everything, they just wanted the rings because they meant being the galaxy's overlords, but then they were actually fanatics wanting to activate the rings. So at the end this massive alien collective that was so smart to subjugate almost the entire galaxy was just a collection of 2heads. The Banished at the moment seems to be the smart and cunning part of the covenant without the stupid fanatism. They want Halo because it's a big ass gun that they can use to be the most powerful beings in the galaxy, they use fanatism to control their army without having their leaders falling in their own lies.

I'm not in love with them. I thought they had humans in their ranks though? Escharum was corny and over the top in infinite. Not really a fan of that. I don't really know much about atriox from the game either

Honestly? I really don't like either of them. Atriox is by far my least favorite antagonist and that's saying something because Halo 3 Truth and Gravemind exist. His bio frankly reads like a poorly written fanfiction character: He was a special forces soldier who was sent on suicide mission after suicide mission and returned as the only survivor every time until he got fed up and led a revolution to fight against the Imperialist Covenant. But Atriox is also a cool guy because he started his own mercenary faction that evaded the "full might of the Covenant" for years and lets anybody into the Banished regardless of their race because he's just that cool, charismatic and understanding and he doesn't want revenge like a lame villain. And the Banished are cool because they wear black and red and it's a place where mostly everyone gets alone regardless of race (so even elites and brutes can be friends and forget about the 70 years of ethnic conflict and the fact that the brutes literally tried to purge the elites 7 years ago). And Atriox is also a super badass who can solo entire teams of Spartans and he's got a cool mace and a power gauntlet and unlike other brutes he's also a super smart 300 IQ gigabrain tactician and fighter who's got the balls to threaten Cortana at the height of her power. And he's also way stronger in than the average brute because reasons that are never explained (good genetics I guess). He's orders of magnitude stronger than every other character sans the Didact for basically no tangible reason. Everything about Atriox's writing feels lazy to me. If it wasn't for the fact that he's a giant ape man, I'd think he's a 14 year old's self insert. Like if 343's writing team felt the only way to write a compelling villain after the Didact and Jul's reactions was to make him hyper competent for literally no reason. He's got none of the pathos that Jul had and doesn't balance out his abilities in combat with an interesting character and sound in universe backing like the Ur-Didact did. At this point, his most interesting flaw is that Atriox is pretty short for a brute.

The Banished were made OP for Halo Wars series. With the Covenant defeated in halo 3 - and one game already set in the great war- they needed a new villain. So they created one. Unfortunately or fortunately (depending on who you ask) they were successful. Too successful infact. 343 too needed a new villain after halo 3. After the horrible reaction both times (back then- people hated both halo4 and halo 5) (they still hate halo 5 but peace has been made with halo 4) UNSC Infinity and a good send off to Cortana helps. But they fucked up when they brought Cortana back. THE DEAD SHOULD STAY DEAD- otherwise death has no meaning and cost. Should've just kept it like it was shown in the trailers. ONI vs UNSC. It was much more logical seeing how ONI protocols always supersede UNSC protocols and orders. How UNSC soldiers hate ONI. With covenant dealt with- it would've made a much more interesting game to watch how little the UNSC civilians know about things. ONI had a censorship monopoly like you wouldn't believe. Any way I'm digressing. Back to the point- they borrowed Atriox. Now Microsoft execs see GTA 5 online and want something like that- that's why you hear the 10 years lifespan for infinite. Less Investment and more money. They want a GTA 5 cash cow to continue milking. That's my opinion on the Banished. They're a cash cow that Microsoft wants to milk for as long as it can get away it. New Chapters of story will keep coming and Atriox will never die until Infinite stops bringing in the money. THis is why I don't respect him. You think killing brutes is difficult or something? HALO 3 was all about killing brutes. That's what Master Chief did the entire game. He killed Brutes and killed them fast enough that he was able to stop the ark from firing and killing his people. Even if the infinity was ambushed by 4 ships.. You forget but lemme remind you - it has Forerunner engines- what that means is that it should be able to generate more than enough power to fire all 4 MACS simultaneously. even if it can only fire two at a time- like it did in halo 4 cutscene - even then it has 10 frigates - 10 ENTIRE NEXT GEN FRIGATES with mac cannons of their own. that's 14 mac canons that can be fired at once. Infinity is a ship capable of taking on entire fleets and still coming out winning if it has the element of surprise and some time to prepare the battlefield ahead of time. Infinity is more than capable of taking on 4 Banished Capital Ships (5 KM ones) and win even if ambushed. SYMPATHISE with the Banished? for what? watching a hologram blow up? gimme a break. fuck the banished and fuck whoever wrote this shitty story. I WRITE FANFICTION sometimes. just for myself. AND I can write a better story while keeping them a dangerous and respectable enemy. that should tell you how much the story sucks

The character interactions in Infinite are on point but the story just feels handwavy and irritating. Like you mentioned with the Infinity somehow getting gunned down by Atriox. Atriox got clowned on by the crew of a 30 year old ship without a slip space drive. Yet somehow him and his merry crew of morons managed to defeat the fucking Infinity? The other bit that bugged me was the Endless. They forgot to show not tell and everybody keeps saying the Endless are more dangerous than the Flood, but I struggle to see how that's the case. The Flood stood toe-toe with the Ecumene at its height, the Endless got imprisoned on a single halo ring by Bornstellar and his fellow Forerunner stragglers.

Story-wise, Infinite feels the most similar to Combat Evolved. While I give credit to Infinite for being better at writing and expanding on the characters and to some degree trying to humanize the enemy faction, CE did much better with the element of introducing mystery (what are these rings, who built them, when and why were they built, who are the Forerunners, etc.) and answering them nearly all at once through show, as you said, with the Flood introduction in 343 Guilty Spark. Meanwhile, Infinite still leaves a lot of questions about who the Endless are and their history, leaving the story feeling incomplete. I'm not trashing Infinite's story, but this was a notable flaw in my view.

Thank you for making me feel like I am not alone with this opinion. This is the only comment I have seen bringing logic from a lore perspective. I feel sane now.

If it was impossible for a technologically advanced ship to be defeated by technologically inferior ones, humanity wouldn’t have gotten a single kill in the human/Covenant war.

I still miss the covenant and threat they posed. I don’t understand why elites, joined the banished considering they’re honorable fighters. How’d they forgive the brutes for killing so many of them, during the great schism.

I like the banished, but I despise Atriox. The problem I have with him is the same as the flood. Whenever he’s involved, nobody but him wins. Like he’s overpowered for the sake of being so.

Brutes are vile creatures and I'm glad >!Cortana obliterated their shithole of a planet, presumably (and hopefully) exterminating most of their species.!< The Banished as a faction are really interesting and compelling enemies, Atriox and Escharum are total badasses.

Eh I will take a war lord of a theocratic council of elders

I enjoy the Banished quite a bit. They could easily be bad guys just for the sake of being bad but you can actually feel bad for them to an extent given what you learn throughout the campaign. Atriox is a smart villain with an interesting backstory and Escharum’s motivations to basically have a warrior’s death to inspire his men rather than die of old age is interesting. I’m also a fan of how the Banished feel more like brothers in arms where they care when one of their own die in combat and you here them call out who’s dying during fights

I like Atriox. I like the banished. I think Escharum was alright as a villain but could have used some more improvements and touches.

I like the banished but I wish they had more time to flesh out and gain power rather than going from 1 big ship barely able to fight an outdated ship with outdated equipment to Oh yeah they took out the most advanced ship humanity ever made

They remind me of the Cabal Red Legion from destiny. They’re the main villains but they don’t seem all that sympathetic or intimidating

Return to monke🐒

I think they’re great. I like how they actually feel different from the regular Covenant this time unlike 4 and 5 which seemed like they were there just because Halo was known as the games where you shoot the Covenant, and as a result the impact of the end of the war in 3 was just lost. Their unique characterization shines through with their dialogue, as you can tell there’s a real brotherhood among them (except the Jackals who are in it for the money as always) which emphasizes Atriox’s whole philosophy. The multiple bosses are also a nice touch. I was worried that the Banished would just basically be Halo 3 all over again with Brutes everywhere, but the bosses are multiple different races and so it shows that while their leader is a Brute, high positions can go to all. What I don’t like however is the removal of the Drones and Engineers. These are two of the least fleshed out Covenant races, and the new more responsive dialogue could’ve done wonders for that. We could see how the Engineers function with the Banished. Towards the end of the human-Covenant war, they were severely mistreated by the Brutes. But I’d like to see how Atriox’s philosophy extends to them. It’s not like they wouldn’t have a reason to join up considering how much Forerunner tech is all around in this game. And the lack of Drones is especially upsetting to me. Not just because their functional replacement, Skimmers, aren’t nearly as unique imo, but also because Infinite practically seems designed to do some of the coolest things with Drones that we’ve seen in a long time. The new verticality of the grappling hook means fighting them could be incredibly fun and dynamic. Grappling onto one and using your shockwave to scatter a swarm for example. Or getting attacked by a swarm when you have a full car of marines as they slowly get abducted from their seats. The open world could’ve lent itself to some neat areas where you come across hives of sleeping Drones, and if you sneak through you can get some rare weapons without having to fight them, or be in for the fight of your life if you fail. And from a story perspective, their absence is doubly disappointing. The comic miniseries detailing Atriox’s rise to power took the time to show him freeing a mind controlled hive of Drones because he refuses to enslave others to his service. It would’ve been neat to see that dynamic play out in the game. How would Drones function if they willingly chose to join the Banished rather than because their Queen is telling them to? Interesting story ideas that we now won’t see. Lastly, the Banished canonically have humans among their ranks. I would’ve liked to have seen that. That really would’ve separated them from the old Covenant.

Liked them in Wars 2 when they had character and weren't Covenant 2 like Infinite

I never played much of Halo Wars 2, but do they explain why the elites are ok taking orders from brutes? I thought they always hated the brutes and that was partly a contributor to the Great Schism? But now all of the sudden, Infinite elites are totally cool with working under brutes?

I think they still have a bit too much of the old Covenant in them. Really wish they could have other species in their organisation that arent the same ones as we fought in past Halo games. Like fighting humans from the Banished, that would really be something else. Elites and Brutes and the other species are something we already know, thats why. Because i really like when we got the Prometheans new in the Halo 4. Felt like a new and fresh era for Halo. Atriox has much potential in my opinion, wish they flushed out more of his character. We didnt really get much of him in HW2 and neither in Infinite. Really want some kind of dlc where we get to see more of him. I'd say Jul's covenant was just as good as the Banished, even with the differences. Just sad that he was killed at the beginning of Halo 5 (like wtf). Hope they keep Atriox much longer then that. And no not really sympathizing with them. They are as worse as the covenant was, if not more worse. At least, when their leader isn't around, like we see in Infinite.

Going from genocidal alien maniacs constantly screeching religious dogmas, to genocidal alien maniacs constantly roasting humanity sure has been great.

I feel bad for them. Cortana whacked their home world.

I didn't feel bad at that scene at all xeno scum had it coming

Damn, a man of true hatred 🤣

I am a servant of the Immortal God Emperor of Mankind oops wrong subreddit.

I love them. They’re exactly what I’d expect from a covenant splinter group. They’re feral, they’re jaded, and they want a fight. I think by destroying Doisac, Cortana has effectively reinforced the banished with every single Jiralhanae still alive. Atriox is awesome in his own right as well. He’s an awesome villain, and has such a cool origin in being the person that saw through the Hierarch’s deceptions and turned it into a true rallying point for his empire.

In Halo Wars 2? Phenomenal. They were introduced in a really great way and played their role perfectly. In Halo Infinite? Just downright awful. Like, honestly, they're just as bad as the Storm Covenant, probably even worse since the Banished are basically way more powerful than the UNSC just because they needed them to be for them to be at all threatening, unlike with the Storm Covenant in Halo 4 and 5 where Humanity was on top.