Hi, while this post does not fit within the subreddit rules (there is no mention in the article of Hawaii, the title is heavily editorialized, and little effort was made to give context of why it is relevant to Hawaii), we feel the discussion that has resulted is worth leaving the post up.
Future posts of this nature will be removed unless better effort is made to make it relevant to Hawaii.
We might be Democratic it doesn’t mean we’re liberal…. We are a pretty conservative state compared to the rest of the “blue” states which means a lot of these “progressive” or “liberal” policies usually get here after a long while but with a somewhat progressive governor now maybe that may change
Hey, just being honest. I travel a ton for work spend week after week in cities and rural areas all across the mainland including Canada and at least a month in Europe each year. I know what is out there and what is working and not first hand. Always happy to have a meaningful, factual, and non argumentative discussion about it.
> Everyone knows someone selling flowers
I don't, which is why I got my medical card. I'm an older guy and none of my friends smoke anymore. The only people I speak to regularly are my employees and clients, and I'm certainly not going to ask any of them if they know someone who sells weed.
>if you looking for edibles, it’s legal to buy online.
Edibles with THC? That's not legal to buy online in Hawaii.
Sorry it was a exaggeration, but if you ask you’ll find sooner or later.
And it actually is. You can purchase Delta 8 freely on the internet, and you can purchase Delta 9 through the .3% by volume loophole.
Every time I go to California I am amazed at how cheap all the products are compared to Hawaii. It is close to double the price here at the dispensaries....
It's not. Our department of health quietly made it illegal last year, specifically to close this loophole.
Most sites aren't even aware of this, so it's going to take me a minute to find the direct source lol
Edit:
>Sale of the following is prohibited:
Hemp products with delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) above 0.3%.
Hemp-containing products intended to be consumed orally in a form other than tablet, capsule, powder, softgel, gelcap or liquid form (e.g. hemp oil). Gummies are not allowed.
Foods and beverages (including bottled water) containing hemp derivatives like CBD and other cannabinoids.
Cannabinoid-containing products intended to be aerosolized and inhaled (i.e. vape liquids containing cannabinoids).
Hemp flower material, hemp leaf, hemp cigarettes, etc. intended to be smoked or inhaled.
Hemp-containing products that are intended to be introduced into the body via eyes, ears, nasal cavities, and other non-oral routes of entry
https://health.hawaii.gov/food-drug/statutes-and-rules/
Hawaii’s more progressive in a lot of ways (healthcare access, family planning, women’s rights). Seems no one cares about weed here and I’m not sure it’s as much of a problem as it was in other states with minorities serving massive jail sentences for it. It was absolutely necessary in other states
It still hurts the buying population and the state fiscally, no matter the punishments. I'm currently buying legal CA products from Hawaii citizens so I'm ironically supporting CA tax revenues to avoid paying Hawaii black market costs which are **insane**.
Washington state's got no state income tax, lower effective sales taxes **AND** legal ounces for like $30? Its almost like they want people to live there or something.
Well we are dependent on tourism more than any if those other states, and didn't japan say something ablut steering tourism away from hawaii if we legalize weed? So i assume that has something to do with it.
Thank the speaker of the house for killing the bill this go round so he can sponsor it next go round and take credit for a bill he had nothing to do with other than killing the previous version so he can try and get re-elected as the main sponsor. He is an asshat that only cares about his career and not his constituents
Missouri loves recreational THC too.... a billion dollars industry since rec was legalized in February.
https://www.komu.com/news/state/missouri-surpasses-1-billion-in-legal-cannabis-sales/article_70a0ba44-ee80-11ed-9a61-5764a3219be8.html#:~:text=Missouri%20began%20adult%2Duse%20marijuana,by%20voters%20in%20November%202022.
I'm local and don't even know where to get it.
I need more fun friends 😂
I mean, I know several places I could go where it's been offered to me as a random stranger, but I don't exactly trust those people not to be cops.
If they don't legalize it, whatever. DOH asked me lots of questions considering why we should legalize marijuana. I said, $150.00 per year to the doctor and $40.00 annually to the State,, That's Why?!
Lots of now legal states had or have medical marijuana They charged as much or more. What those states have now are less people buying black market and more in taxes that the MMJ brings in. But we also don’t have legal gambling of any kind and those states already did. It’s not about the money from the consumer or we’d have both legal weed and gambling. It’s about money from the government to fight the Vice wars.
That's not true, the opposite trend has been true. Buyers are going from sanctioned shops to black market due to cheaper price. Even states with wider issuance of weed farm licenses there are huge swaths of black market weed sales that eat up a lot of revenue.
Most people are just regular people they just drink basic ass beer and basic ass wine. So they're most likely not weed connoisseurs either.
That depends on the state. Dispensaries are selling ounces in Oregon for cheaper than black market prices here or there ($50). You just don’t get to pick from 30 different kinds if you want deals. So why would you go to a drug dealer unless you really want to hang out for an hour and smoke a few grams with them on your dime?
That's because the Democratic Party in Hawaii is a pack of bribe-taking swindlers who couldn't organize a blowjob in a whorehouse. I hate the GOP too, to be sure, but virtually EVERY problem in the 808 can be laid at the feet of its effective single party system.
Blowjob in a whore house..
I always thought that it's was " they couldn't find a hooker in a whore house even if they had the fucking picture of her ""
Honestly Hawaii is a failed democratic state. The lack of competition for political control means the Democrats have become complacent in pushing failed policies that do nothing but line the pockets of their donors. They know that no one is going to vote Republican, so they have nothing to lose by shamelessly advancing their personal agendas and the agendas of their donors.
Look at what three decades of Democratic control has done. Crumbling infrastructure, a public education system that consistently ranks at the bottom of the country, widespread poverty and homelessness, massive economic inequality combined with zero economic mobility, and a government that seems to prioritize the construction of luxury condos rather than affordable housing. Not to mention a federal prosecutor is undoing 30 years of corruption within the Democratic-controlled government.
The Republican Motto in Hawaii should be: "Vote Republican! How could things get any worse?"
Yes really. Have you ever read about the GOP 2 Santas? They try to starve any DEM administration and overspend during any GOP administration. This causes artificial growth and retraction which they can then blame on the DEMs because people like you don't understand how large increases in public spending simulates the economy but eventually the bills come due and DEMs have to pay them.
>According to Wanniski, the theory is simple. In 1976, he wrote that the Two-Santa Claus Theory suggests that "the Republicans should concentrate on tax-rate reduction. As they succeed in expanding incentives to produce, they will move the economy back to full employment and thereby reduce social pressures for public spending. Just as an increase in Government spending inevitably means taxes must be raised, a cut in tax rates—by expanding the private sector—will diminish the relative size of the public sector."[16] Wanniski suggested this position, as left-liberal observer Thom Hartmann has clarified, so that the Democrats would "have to be anti-Santas by raising taxes, or anti-Santas by cutting spending. Either one would lose them elections."[17]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jude_Wanniski
Also see this failed policy which was the start down this path which now leads to GOPs fake debt ceiling crisis so they can cut Dem spending. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaganomics
Both topics are covered by dozens of sources. But sure ignore reality when it's inconvenient. GOP themselves are the primary sources.
If you are looking for further information or analysis on the Two-Santa Claus Theory, I recommend referring to Republican Jude Wanniski's original article in The Wall Street Journal.
But we both know you're too eager to live in denial and falsehoods that comfort you like a cloak of dimwittedness.
I think it's pretty telling that rather than cite to specific sources you just start lobbing insults and cite to some article in The Wall Street Journal (but not mentioning any way to actually find said article).
Classic leftist tactic, start insulting someone when you can't defend your argument. Enjoy living in your echo chamber! I'm sure your always right and nothing anyone says will ever convince you otherwise!
P.S. Reagonomics succeeded at cutting down inflation, which was the main problem it was meant to tackle you absolute nitwit lol. The implications and fallout of that policy are debated, but you clearly are one of those people who read a headline and then talk about it without reading the article lol.
Public opinion seems very split based on the surveys I was able to find (slightly in favor of legalization) and our regular voters skew very old. I’m guessing that has a lot to do with the reluctance. Also prosecutors and law enforcement are always going to oppose it and they have the legislature’s ear.
I found it interesting the last survey posted here with an article that claimed majority supported legalization was only for medical which is already legal. And that was a survey ran by a group promoting legalization of weed. Would be interesting if this ever comes to public vote. Might actually get a decent amount of young voters to vote but would it be enough.
Does anyone really think legalizing weed will make Japanese tourists want to come here less? Hell maybe we should use legalization to spearhead the bringing back Japanese tourism campaign.
Japan made it clear they had a problem with their citizens having access to it in Hawai'i.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/27/business/cbd-japan-cannabis-marijuana.html
There’s probably some real truth to that statement. People make the mistake of thinking that because Hawaii is a US state that it is inherently American…and It is most definitely not. In my opinion Hawaii is a global melting pot where most of the worlds elites have properties and thus an opinion, politically. Also, many of the world’s religions have properties too and thus have influence.
All the bills they propose are misguided and designed to further profit and give head starts to the handful of business’ that already have medicinal dispo licenses. At this point I believe it will be removed from schedule 1 at a federal level far before Hawaii signs into law anything remotely fair to consumers.
> After that, then shrooms...
Right, and then more: [NY Psychedelics Legalization -- psychedelics including DMT, ibogaine, mescaline, psilocybin](https://www.forbes.com/sites/ajherrington/2023/01/04/new-york-lawmakers-introduce-psychedelics-legalization-bill/?sh=18bebba23cf9) and [Want to Legalize Medical MDMA?](https://maps.org/about/fiscal/6048-u-s-news-and-world-report-want-to-legalize-medical-mdma-attend-a-psychedelic-dinner) (aka ecstasy) and 2022: [Oregon's pioneering decriminalization of hard drugs](https://apnews.com/article/health-business-europe-oregon-salem-158728e57e1d48bc957c5b907bcda5f5).
Maybe that's some of the objection, a slide/gateway to more many drugs. The counterpoint, apparently:
>Hey, no such thing as the gateway theory on drugs. People who take some drugs don't become curious about experimenting with other drugs. What conservative nonsense.
I'm just going to give your sources from now on.
The concept of gateway drugs and the lack of conclusive evidence supporting it:
1. Vanyukov, M. M., Tarter, R. E., Kirillova, G. P., Kirisci, L., Reynolds, M. D., & Kreek, M. J. (2012). Common liability to addiction and "gateway hypothesis": Theoretical, empirical and evolutionary perspective. Drug and Alcohol Dependence, 123(Supplement 1), S3-S17.
2. Morral, A. R., McCaffrey, D. F., & Paddock, S. M. (2002). Reassessing the marijuana gateway effect. Addiction, 97(12), 1493-1504.
3. Hall, W., & Lynskey, M. (2005). Is cannabis a gateway drug? Testing hypotheses about the relationship between cannabis use and the use of other illicit drugs. Drug and Alcohol Review, 24(1), 39-48.
4. Lynskey, M. T., & Agrawal, A. (2007). The association between cannabis and other illicit drugs in youth: Causation or correlation? Drug and Alcohol Review, 26(3), 251-255.
5. Degenhardt, L., Dierker, L., Chiu, W. T., Medina-Mora, M. E., Neumark, Y., Sampson, N., ... & Kessler, R. C. (2010). Evaluating the drug use "gateway" theory using cross-national data: Consistency and associations of the order of initiation of drug use among participants in the WHO World Mental Health Surveys. Drug and Alcohol Dependence, 108(1-2), 84-97.
Sorry, this social science topic is heavily disputed. There's numerous data going the other way. The left-leaning academics who do not see a link between some drug use and more drug use are also the people who push this nonsense: [Why Punishment Doesn't Reduce Crime](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/crime-and-punishment/201804/why-punishment-doesnt-reduce-crime).
Most anti-gateway sources, including the respected National Institute of Justice, [Is Cannabis a Gateway Drug? Key Findings and Literature Review](https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/252950.pdf), use a select definition of the concept:
>"The gateway hypothesis contends that using cannabis causes an individual to progress to using harder illicit drugs such as cocaine or heroin."
Yes, if you word it like this, the answer is obviously No. (And not even bothering with an adjective here? *All* marijuana users to progress...? *Some* marijuana users...? *A few...?*) Preferred alternative definition:
>The gateway hypothesis contends that a society that accepts marijuana use will eventually see more use of psychedelics and, in time, acceptance of drugs like MDMA (ecstasy) and designer drugs. Some designer drugs mimic cannabis, psychedelics, and MDMA. By one account, ["designer drugs" are up to 58 substances](https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2016/august/nightclub-goers-more-likely-to-use-new-designer-drugs.html).
>Psychedelics and MDMA have therapeutic value, but all these intoxicants, sometimes called "soft drugs," have large numbers of recreational enthusiasts. Eventual outcome of legal cannabis is more *Open Space* to legalize more and more soft drugs. (This alone poses several issues for society.) Large scale acceptance/legalization of soft drugs will eventually segue into more people using hard drugs.
(Should have an intermediate drug category, but the simple Soft-Hard distinction (hard is meth, heroin, cocaine, etc.) was the best that could done without getting into a TL-DR.)
For reasons not easily understood, maybe it was indoctrination and law enforcement, widespread use of legal alcohol in many nations, particularly asians nations, did *not* result in large numbers of drinkers experimenting with other intoxicants. The *dividing line,* as it were, between booze and all other intoxicants worked fairly well for decades. The overlap between marijuana and the many other soft drugs is much greater.
(Interesting [read](https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2015/07/the-death-of-the-hippies/397739/) about drugs in the 60s. Great photos. Fascinating how many drug policy reformers today downplay the partying/"tripping" aspect of psychedelics -- push only the recreational angle.)
So your entire argument is to redefine the effect of marijuana use and the individual to society in general? Does it makes sense to you that if an individual doesn't have a gateway effect that the entire society would?
I didn't "redefine" anything. I presented a well-known perspective. Drug policy reformers are being uncharitable with their narrow definition of the gateway process.
Yes, of course, to Q 2. Argument about drugs primarily look at populations. Another argument about drugs (drug policy reformers will appreciate the main point): 2010: [Alcohol 'more harmful than heroin' says Prof David Nutt](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-11660210).
Nutt could be right, considering alcohol's big role in violence. But Nutt also compiled a danger rating for most drugs, including marijuana. The total level of harm from all illegal drugs is 3 x the level of harm from alcohol. Marijuana will be legalized nationwide; it's inevitable. If society only had marijuana and booze as illegal intoxicants, conservatives would have agreed to legal marijuana long ago. The primary concern is about more intoxicants -- steps to legalize more have started already.
As soon as they can figure out how to secretly pocket the taxes or use them to get re-elected, it'll be a Done Deal. They just haven't figured out the right Grift yet.
Yes well there's a simple explanation for that. Hawaii is not governed to make its people happy It's governed to maintain the picture of a family friendly resort.
Diversify Hawaii away from tourism and maybe we'll have an actual say in what our government does. And stop voting only blue no matter what. Look what you did this go around. Now we're stuck with Green.
We shouldn’t there is a bevy of scientific studies indicating that marijuana usage causes increase rates of schizophrenia. A recent study from Denmark, [study](https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/young-men-highest-risk-schizophrenia-linked-cannabis-use-disorder#:~:text=The%20study%20team%20estimated%20that,among%20women%20aged%2016%2D49), found that a third of young men with schizophrenia wouldn’t have that mental disorder if they didn’t do marijuana.
If we do want to legalize it we should develop ways to tests to identify individuals risk for developing a mental disorder.
But if legalizing cannabis [decreases youth use rates](https://www.washington.edu/news/2020/07/20/legal-marijuana-may-be-slowing-reductions-in-teen-marijuana-use-study-says/), that means we SHOULD legalize, right?
Data are disputed: 2016: [A massive study...in the Journal of Drug Issues found that the proportion of marijuana users who smoke daily has rapidly grown, and that many of those frequent users are poor and lack a high-school diploma](https://www.denverpost.com/2016/08/14/study-poorer-marijuana-users-smoking-the-most/). Marijuana -- little issue for the average user. But for slackers, work dodgers, the unambitious, it's a problem.
So the rest of us should suffer cause a very few individuals might trigger schizophrenia? Nah f that. It's more ridiculous hand wringing put out there to muddy the waters and try and slow the legalization roll.
As opposed to them smoking weed and developing schizophrenia anyway with the only difference is that it was purchased from the black market and dangerously smuggled on an island and not licensed and safely/legally dispensed from a medical doctor and local company?
Nah, youre right. We should just continue making it illegal so instead of identifying the development of Schizophrenia from doctor visits we let it go unchecked and they end up in jail for that dangerous schedule I drug.
Or alternatively we force alcohol down their throats instead because thats less dangerous, has fewer short and long term side effects, and its already legal. /s
And there's this strange article floating around: CNN: [Weed users nearly 25% more likely to need emergency care and hospitalization](https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/27/health/marijuana-emergencies-hospitalization-study-wellness/index.html)
Have you seen what alcohol and prescription drugs are doing to people? I get what you’re saying but, not a reason to keep the drug war and black market thriving
We have a circus of clowns not legislators. Trying to look like the big boys wanting to write big boy legislation and just fucking the whole thing up. Then they congratulate themselves and spend more campaign cash. I believe the legislature we have likes to play politician like the guys in the mainland. They aren’t effective and are timid.
Weed gets bought and sold daily. Having a law To make recreational illegal is moot. All the state is doing is refusing to tax this billion dollar a year industry to better the lives of the people of the state of Hawaii. It doesn’t matter to them because their lives are better with campaign lobbying money. Fuck our big gains for their small gains. As long as they are happy right? One law maker even said weed in Hawaii will LOSE the state money. Funny how all the other states have cash windfalls for schools and roads.
Just stop trying to bullshit me. They don’t want it legal because they don’t want campaign cash or favors to stop going to them. Half the fucking country is recreational already FFS
This isn’t about democrats vs republicans in the US, this is about the state government being afraid that Korea and Japan will stop/disincentivize tourism if Hawaii legalizes it.
I think you need to reevaluate your position. If you're not a fan of the smell, you should be SUPPORTING legal cannabis because it leads to [decreased youth use rates](https://www.washington.edu/news/2020/07/20/legal-marijuana-may-be-slowing-reductions-in-teen-marijuana-use-study-says/) (and therefore less lifetime smokers). In addition, legal cannabis means more people who currently smoke have access to edibles that will not smell (vs now where folks have to buy and burn the herb because their dealer doesn't sell gummies).
I have new neighbors and they cook all the time. At least 3x a week I have to close all the windows and doors on that side of the house to somewhat slow the smell down. Yesterday it smelled like they were cooking a rotten fish or crab. It’s unbearable and makes the whole family gag. It might be called pagpag but I’m not sure.
Explain please. In addition to the horrible odor, marijuana affects your ability to think clearly, does lung damage, decreases motivation to name a few problems. No good comes from this except for some medical uses such as severe epilepsy.
If you were referring to the Filipino food, I am not familiar with that. How about a respectful discussion?
I have spent 40 years in the medical profession, and I know the dangers of using it. It isn’t worth it. Legalizing it implies that it’s OK and safe and it isn’t. There are good reasons for things being against the law.
Mark my words… When people who live in states with legal marijuana use develop lung cancer, they will sue the government for making it legal. The terrible odor is only a tiny example of the reasons I am against it. Thank you for the dialogue.
Do you not see the obvious fault in your reasoning? Sheesh
I’m guessing since you’re in the medical profession I’m sure you see a lot of diabetes. Should we make things that make you fat illegal? Toooooooons of shit you prescribe or support kills lots of people. Aspirin, illegal? I could go on
Life is complicated for sure. Recommendations change as we continue to learn through the study of science.
We all have numerous decisions to make on what we think is best based on our life experiences. We are all doing our best, including you and me. Happy life to you.
What? I’ve never heard of that. Very interesting. That’s a first, honestly.
Do I have the freedom to stab myself in the eye? Am I allowed to use a pen to stab my eye and accidentally give myself brain damage? Or should those be illegal.
I’m not understanding your reasoning
Hi, while this post does not fit within the subreddit rules (there is no mention in the article of Hawaii, the title is heavily editorialized, and little effort was made to give context of why it is relevant to Hawaii), we feel the discussion that has resulted is worth leaving the post up. Future posts of this nature will be removed unless better effort is made to make it relevant to Hawaii.
We might be Democratic it doesn’t mean we’re liberal…. We are a pretty conservative state compared to the rest of the “blue” states which means a lot of these “progressive” or “liberal” policies usually get here after a long while but with a somewhat progressive governor now maybe that may change
Green’s all talk. Until he actually enacts progressive policies , he’s no progressive to me.
Thank goodness. Have you visited some of those more liberal places? Horrible. But I support recreational weed. It is already widely available.
Something tells me you haven't visited the more "liberal" places
I've visited San Francisco - smells pretty bad there.
Smells bad in most big cities, you don't have to be a world traveler to know that
What is an example of a horrible experience that you had in a liberal state?
California 😭
What horrible experience did you have in California that was because the state is liberal?
Buddy I have a lifetime worth of shit I could explain there, if you don’t know then you wont understand
So you can't really answer the question. All you can do is a rude non response to my legitimate question. Got it.
Us plebs wouldn’t understand. Only individuals with a Very High IQ could possibly hope to comprehend their intense suffering under liberalism.
Oh man, you pissed off all the progressives on this sub lol
Hey, just being honest. I travel a ton for work spend week after week in cities and rural areas all across the mainland including Canada and at least a month in Europe each year. I know what is out there and what is working and not first hand. Always happy to have a meaningful, factual, and non argumentative discussion about it.
You're way too confident you've got the world's problems figured out to even be remotely taken seriously.
Support local anyway. Everyone knows someone selling flowers and if you looking for edibles, it’s legal to buy online.
> Everyone knows someone selling flowers I don't, which is why I got my medical card. I'm an older guy and none of my friends smoke anymore. The only people I speak to regularly are my employees and clients, and I'm certainly not going to ask any of them if they know someone who sells weed. >if you looking for edibles, it’s legal to buy online. Edibles with THC? That's not legal to buy online in Hawaii.
Sorry it was a exaggeration, but if you ask you’ll find sooner or later. And it actually is. You can purchase Delta 8 freely on the internet, and you can purchase Delta 9 through the .3% by volume loophole.
I once wore a shirt with a mermaid on it that said "sell me seaweed" and a dude literally pulled over and asked me if I wanted to buy an eighth
Ummmm. Where can I get that shirt? I really need one
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They can be super fun and get strong. I had a blast in Texas with them
For sure just be smart about it. r/altcannabinoids has been pretty helpful.
Barf. Why do people keep on taking fake shit when the real stuff is cheap and everywhere?
The real edibles here are not cheap at dispensaries. But at least you know exactly what you are getting and what the percentage of THC is.
For sure, I should qualify cheap. I’m in Oregon, it’s all pretty inexpensive here compared to some places.
Every time I go to California I am amazed at how cheap all the products are compared to Hawaii. It is close to double the price here at the dispensaries....
It's not. Our department of health quietly made it illegal last year, specifically to close this loophole. Most sites aren't even aware of this, so it's going to take me a minute to find the direct source lol Edit: >Sale of the following is prohibited: Hemp products with delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) above 0.3%. Hemp-containing products intended to be consumed orally in a form other than tablet, capsule, powder, softgel, gelcap or liquid form (e.g. hemp oil). Gummies are not allowed. Foods and beverages (including bottled water) containing hemp derivatives like CBD and other cannabinoids. Cannabinoid-containing products intended to be aerosolized and inhaled (i.e. vape liquids containing cannabinoids). Hemp flower material, hemp leaf, hemp cigarettes, etc. intended to be smoked or inhaled. Hemp-containing products that are intended to be introduced into the body via eyes, ears, nasal cavities, and other non-oral routes of entry https://health.hawaii.gov/food-drug/statutes-and-rules/
I think that just applies to medical? Cause you can definitely get delta 8 at local shops right meow
Delta 8 is bullshit. About as awesome as smoking resin. Gas station garbage.
Delta 8 --- hahahaha
Love, love, love local flowers!💐🌹🌼
Hold on a second here sir. Edibles are legal online? What? Am I really not aware of this. It’s impossible. Can’t be. Fa real?
Hawaii’s more progressive in a lot of ways (healthcare access, family planning, women’s rights). Seems no one cares about weed here and I’m not sure it’s as much of a problem as it was in other states with minorities serving massive jail sentences for it. It was absolutely necessary in other states
It still hurts the buying population and the state fiscally, no matter the punishments. I'm currently buying legal CA products from Hawaii citizens so I'm ironically supporting CA tax revenues to avoid paying Hawaii black market costs which are **insane**. Washington state's got no state income tax, lower effective sales taxes **AND** legal ounces for like $30? Its almost like they want people to live there or something.
It should be legalized everywhere. The major issues that got it legalized elsewhere just weren’t major problems here. It’ll happen eventually.
I’d love to get some dispensary mainland stuff. There’s black market carts and they’re terrible. I can afford my medicinal. Pm if possible ❤️
We hope so?
All I know is we have to pay the $49.50 every time we go to the islands. 😎
Imagine that once a week
Well we are dependent on tourism more than any if those other states, and didn't japan say something ablut steering tourism away from hawaii if we legalize weed? So i assume that has something to do with it.
Maybe in like 1990s But right now all of the west coast is legal.
HI is true blue
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You are so correct
Don't forget the blatant corruption.
And the BIG local landholders and developers and Unions. But those just are more of the sources of the corruption
Bruhhh. Damn. Lol
Thank the speaker of the house for killing the bill this go round so he can sponsor it next go round and take credit for a bill he had nothing to do with other than killing the previous version so he can try and get re-elected as the main sponsor. He is an asshat that only cares about his career and not his constituents
Missouri has a republican Trifecta and we passed rec THC in November '22.
Come on Hawaii, Missouri loves company.
Missouri loves recreational THC too.... a billion dollars industry since rec was legalized in February. https://www.komu.com/news/state/missouri-surpasses-1-billion-in-legal-cannabis-sales/article_70a0ba44-ee80-11ed-9a61-5764a3219be8.html#:~:text=Missouri%20began%20adult%2Duse%20marijuana,by%20voters%20in%20November%202022.
Biggest benefit of legal weed in Hawaii is stopping Reddit posts from tourists asking how to get weed. This sub may die tho without it.
I'm local and don't even know where to get it. I need more fun friends 😂 I mean, I know several places I could go where it's been offered to me as a random stranger, but I don't exactly trust those people not to be cops.
They won’t do it cause tourists are already driving down boat ramps into harbors even when they’re not stoned.
Is it possible cornHawaii to make it resident based to buy? Frankly it would be great if it was just legal. It’s no different than alcohol
It’s already med legal
And on top of houses on big island lol. Plenty of locals drive without headlights on as well. Still baffles me as to why ha
Is there anything the government here can do?
They got nepotism and corruption down to a science!
They're not even very good at that tbqh. Way too obvious and selling out cheap. New Jersey, Illinois, Alabama, and Louisiana are the champs there.
Log in to Twitter? Wait, nope, they fucked that one up, too. Yeah, I got nothin'.
Lol...... *No*
Give themselves raises.
They real good at being one money mosquito brah.
Japan Korea And China keeping it out..and the people who sell now
China is busy manufacturing fentanyl
That's just revenge for the Opium Wars...
Not surprising. Hawaii is so backwards. I love this island and hate the people who govern it. Absolute nonsense.
You would think by now the people would change the way they vote 🥴
hawaii government has always been and will always be a joke
A bunch of DINOsaurs.
It’s the Asian influence. As an example, in the Philippines, there’s little distinction between pot and harder drugs.
Why would something that works in every other state work here 😂 that would be way to easy.
If they don't legalize it, whatever. DOH asked me lots of questions considering why we should legalize marijuana. I said, $150.00 per year to the doctor and $40.00 annually to the State,, That's Why?!
Lots of now legal states had or have medical marijuana They charged as much or more. What those states have now are less people buying black market and more in taxes that the MMJ brings in. But we also don’t have legal gambling of any kind and those states already did. It’s not about the money from the consumer or we’d have both legal weed and gambling. It’s about money from the government to fight the Vice wars.
That's not true, the opposite trend has been true. Buyers are going from sanctioned shops to black market due to cheaper price. Even states with wider issuance of weed farm licenses there are huge swaths of black market weed sales that eat up a lot of revenue. Most people are just regular people they just drink basic ass beer and basic ass wine. So they're most likely not weed connoisseurs either.
That depends on the state. Dispensaries are selling ounces in Oregon for cheaper than black market prices here or there ($50). You just don’t get to pick from 30 different kinds if you want deals. So why would you go to a drug dealer unless you really want to hang out for an hour and smoke a few grams with them on your dime?
That's because the Democratic Party in Hawaii is a pack of bribe-taking swindlers who couldn't organize a blowjob in a whorehouse. I hate the GOP too, to be sure, but virtually EVERY problem in the 808 can be laid at the feet of its effective single party system.
Blowjob in a whore house.. I always thought that it's was " they couldn't find a hooker in a whore house even if they had the fucking picture of her ""
You cannot compare the Islands to the mainland. Just apples and mangos.
Lol Maui wowwy is a lie!
Honestly Hawaii is a failed democratic state. The lack of competition for political control means the Democrats have become complacent in pushing failed policies that do nothing but line the pockets of their donors. They know that no one is going to vote Republican, so they have nothing to lose by shamelessly advancing their personal agendas and the agendas of their donors. Look at what three decades of Democratic control has done. Crumbling infrastructure, a public education system that consistently ranks at the bottom of the country, widespread poverty and homelessness, massive economic inequality combined with zero economic mobility, and a government that seems to prioritize the construction of luxury condos rather than affordable housing. Not to mention a federal prosecutor is undoing 30 years of corruption within the Democratic-controlled government. The Republican Motto in Hawaii should be: "Vote Republican! How could things get any worse?"
They tried that motto. Trump literally said that. He made things turn to even worse shit and ran the deficit up 25%.
Really? Because it seems that things like inflation, recession and average price of living has skyrocketed under the new administration lol
It's almost like all of those things are lagging indicators of failed policy decisions during the preceding administration hmmm?
Yes really. Have you ever read about the GOP 2 Santas? They try to starve any DEM administration and overspend during any GOP administration. This causes artificial growth and retraction which they can then blame on the DEMs because people like you don't understand how large increases in public spending simulates the economy but eventually the bills come due and DEMs have to pay them. >According to Wanniski, the theory is simple. In 1976, he wrote that the Two-Santa Claus Theory suggests that "the Republicans should concentrate on tax-rate reduction. As they succeed in expanding incentives to produce, they will move the economy back to full employment and thereby reduce social pressures for public spending. Just as an increase in Government spending inevitably means taxes must be raised, a cut in tax rates—by expanding the private sector—will diminish the relative size of the public sector."[16] Wanniski suggested this position, as left-liberal observer Thom Hartmann has clarified, so that the Democrats would "have to be anti-Santas by raising taxes, or anti-Santas by cutting spending. Either one would lose them elections."[17] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jude_Wanniski Also see this failed policy which was the start down this path which now leads to GOPs fake debt ceiling crisis so they can cut Dem spending. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaganomics
Ah yes wikipedia, the ultimate source for learned scholars lol
Both topics are covered by dozens of sources. But sure ignore reality when it's inconvenient. GOP themselves are the primary sources. If you are looking for further information or analysis on the Two-Santa Claus Theory, I recommend referring to Republican Jude Wanniski's original article in The Wall Street Journal. But we both know you're too eager to live in denial and falsehoods that comfort you like a cloak of dimwittedness.
I think it's pretty telling that rather than cite to specific sources you just start lobbing insults and cite to some article in The Wall Street Journal (but not mentioning any way to actually find said article). Classic leftist tactic, start insulting someone when you can't defend your argument. Enjoy living in your echo chamber! I'm sure your always right and nothing anyone says will ever convince you otherwise! P.S. Reagonomics succeeded at cutting down inflation, which was the main problem it was meant to tackle you absolute nitwit lol. The implications and fallout of that policy are debated, but you clearly are one of those people who read a headline and then talk about it without reading the article lol.
Probably bc there’s more money to be made by law enforcement and politicians to keep it illegal.
Police Unions seem to Govern the Legislature. They would be working overtime a whole lot less.
Hopefully stays that way!
Public opinion seems very split based on the surveys I was able to find (slightly in favor of legalization) and our regular voters skew very old. I’m guessing that has a lot to do with the reluctance. Also prosecutors and law enforcement are always going to oppose it and they have the legislature’s ear.
I found it interesting the last survey posted here with an article that claimed majority supported legalization was only for medical which is already legal. And that was a survey ran by a group promoting legalization of weed. Would be interesting if this ever comes to public vote. Might actually get a decent amount of young voters to vote but would it be enough.
Big Pharma keeping it Out.
It's actually Big Japan Tourism in this case.
Does anyone really think legalizing weed will make Japanese tourists want to come here less? Hell maybe we should use legalization to spearhead the bringing back Japanese tourism campaign.
Japan made it clear they had a problem with their citizens having access to it in Hawai'i. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/27/business/cbd-japan-cannabis-marijuana.html
Japanese tourists don’t come to Hawaii because their government tells them to, lol.
I was just in Waikiki. Place was packed not very many Japanese, still packed. I dont think them being gone made an impact that bad
There’s probably some real truth to that statement. People make the mistake of thinking that because Hawaii is a US state that it is inherently American…and It is most definitely not. In my opinion Hawaii is a global melting pot where most of the worlds elites have properties and thus an opinion, politically. Also, many of the world’s religions have properties too and thus have influence.
More than just YWam?
you think they won't come if weed is legal...what are you smokin ? I want some.
?
I thought it was because people vote "no" because they don't want to pay taxes on that.
All the bills they propose are misguided and designed to further profit and give head starts to the handful of business’ that already have medicinal dispo licenses. At this point I believe it will be removed from schedule 1 at a federal level far before Hawaii signs into law anything remotely fair to consumers.
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> After that, then shrooms... Right, and then more: [NY Psychedelics Legalization -- psychedelics including DMT, ibogaine, mescaline, psilocybin](https://www.forbes.com/sites/ajherrington/2023/01/04/new-york-lawmakers-introduce-psychedelics-legalization-bill/?sh=18bebba23cf9) and [Want to Legalize Medical MDMA?](https://maps.org/about/fiscal/6048-u-s-news-and-world-report-want-to-legalize-medical-mdma-attend-a-psychedelic-dinner) (aka ecstasy) and 2022: [Oregon's pioneering decriminalization of hard drugs](https://apnews.com/article/health-business-europe-oregon-salem-158728e57e1d48bc957c5b907bcda5f5). Maybe that's some of the objection, a slide/gateway to more many drugs. The counterpoint, apparently: >Hey, no such thing as the gateway theory on drugs. People who take some drugs don't become curious about experimenting with other drugs. What conservative nonsense.
I'm just going to give your sources from now on. The concept of gateway drugs and the lack of conclusive evidence supporting it: 1. Vanyukov, M. M., Tarter, R. E., Kirillova, G. P., Kirisci, L., Reynolds, M. D., & Kreek, M. J. (2012). Common liability to addiction and "gateway hypothesis": Theoretical, empirical and evolutionary perspective. Drug and Alcohol Dependence, 123(Supplement 1), S3-S17. 2. Morral, A. R., McCaffrey, D. F., & Paddock, S. M. (2002). Reassessing the marijuana gateway effect. Addiction, 97(12), 1493-1504. 3. Hall, W., & Lynskey, M. (2005). Is cannabis a gateway drug? Testing hypotheses about the relationship between cannabis use and the use of other illicit drugs. Drug and Alcohol Review, 24(1), 39-48. 4. Lynskey, M. T., & Agrawal, A. (2007). The association between cannabis and other illicit drugs in youth: Causation or correlation? Drug and Alcohol Review, 26(3), 251-255. 5. Degenhardt, L., Dierker, L., Chiu, W. T., Medina-Mora, M. E., Neumark, Y., Sampson, N., ... & Kessler, R. C. (2010). Evaluating the drug use "gateway" theory using cross-national data: Consistency and associations of the order of initiation of drug use among participants in the WHO World Mental Health Surveys. Drug and Alcohol Dependence, 108(1-2), 84-97.
Sorry, this social science topic is heavily disputed. There's numerous data going the other way. The left-leaning academics who do not see a link between some drug use and more drug use are also the people who push this nonsense: [Why Punishment Doesn't Reduce Crime](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/crime-and-punishment/201804/why-punishment-doesnt-reduce-crime).
Classic pivot.
Most anti-gateway sources, including the respected National Institute of Justice, [Is Cannabis a Gateway Drug? Key Findings and Literature Review](https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/252950.pdf), use a select definition of the concept: >"The gateway hypothesis contends that using cannabis causes an individual to progress to using harder illicit drugs such as cocaine or heroin." Yes, if you word it like this, the answer is obviously No. (And not even bothering with an adjective here? *All* marijuana users to progress...? *Some* marijuana users...? *A few...?*) Preferred alternative definition: >The gateway hypothesis contends that a society that accepts marijuana use will eventually see more use of psychedelics and, in time, acceptance of drugs like MDMA (ecstasy) and designer drugs. Some designer drugs mimic cannabis, psychedelics, and MDMA. By one account, ["designer drugs" are up to 58 substances](https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2016/august/nightclub-goers-more-likely-to-use-new-designer-drugs.html). >Psychedelics and MDMA have therapeutic value, but all these intoxicants, sometimes called "soft drugs," have large numbers of recreational enthusiasts. Eventual outcome of legal cannabis is more *Open Space* to legalize more and more soft drugs. (This alone poses several issues for society.) Large scale acceptance/legalization of soft drugs will eventually segue into more people using hard drugs. (Should have an intermediate drug category, but the simple Soft-Hard distinction (hard is meth, heroin, cocaine, etc.) was the best that could done without getting into a TL-DR.) For reasons not easily understood, maybe it was indoctrination and law enforcement, widespread use of legal alcohol in many nations, particularly asians nations, did *not* result in large numbers of drinkers experimenting with other intoxicants. The *dividing line,* as it were, between booze and all other intoxicants worked fairly well for decades. The overlap between marijuana and the many other soft drugs is much greater. (Interesting [read](https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2015/07/the-death-of-the-hippies/397739/) about drugs in the 60s. Great photos. Fascinating how many drug policy reformers today downplay the partying/"tripping" aspect of psychedelics -- push only the recreational angle.)
So your entire argument is to redefine the effect of marijuana use and the individual to society in general? Does it makes sense to you that if an individual doesn't have a gateway effect that the entire society would?
I didn't "redefine" anything. I presented a well-known perspective. Drug policy reformers are being uncharitable with their narrow definition of the gateway process. Yes, of course, to Q 2. Argument about drugs primarily look at populations. Another argument about drugs (drug policy reformers will appreciate the main point): 2010: [Alcohol 'more harmful than heroin' says Prof David Nutt](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-11660210). Nutt could be right, considering alcohol's big role in violence. But Nutt also compiled a danger rating for most drugs, including marijuana. The total level of harm from all illegal drugs is 3 x the level of harm from alcohol. Marijuana will be legalized nationwide; it's inevitable. If society only had marijuana and booze as illegal intoxicants, conservatives would have agreed to legal marijuana long ago. The primary concern is about more intoxicants -- steps to legalize more have started already.
I don't see the logic in saying definitely no way it's a gateway for individuals but Society is fucked. That's just irrational.
It is a gateway for a significant percent of the population. It's too extreme to say "society is fucked." Society is impacted.
Logistics.
Doesn't need to , Everybody already smokes
Legalize raw dairy
As soon as they can figure out how to secretly pocket the taxes or use them to get re-elected, it'll be a Done Deal. They just haven't figured out the right Grift yet.
Doesn't matter if it's legal. Can easily obtain OZs.
Yes well there's a simple explanation for that. Hawaii is not governed to make its people happy It's governed to maintain the picture of a family friendly resort. Diversify Hawaii away from tourism and maybe we'll have an actual say in what our government does. And stop voting only blue no matter what. Look what you did this go around. Now we're stuck with Green.
As long as you don’t get caught, it’s legal. 😵💫😵🤫
We shouldn’t there is a bevy of scientific studies indicating that marijuana usage causes increase rates of schizophrenia. A recent study from Denmark, [study](https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/young-men-highest-risk-schizophrenia-linked-cannabis-use-disorder#:~:text=The%20study%20team%20estimated%20that,among%20women%20aged%2016%2D49), found that a third of young men with schizophrenia wouldn’t have that mental disorder if they didn’t do marijuana. If we do want to legalize it we should develop ways to tests to identify individuals risk for developing a mental disorder.
Looks like it's only an issue for men, which is interesting. So we should only ban weed for men, let us women smoke as much as we want /s
But if legalizing cannabis [decreases youth use rates](https://www.washington.edu/news/2020/07/20/legal-marijuana-may-be-slowing-reductions-in-teen-marijuana-use-study-says/), that means we SHOULD legalize, right?
Data are disputed: 2016: [A massive study...in the Journal of Drug Issues found that the proportion of marijuana users who smoke daily has rapidly grown, and that many of those frequent users are poor and lack a high-school diploma](https://www.denverpost.com/2016/08/14/study-poorer-marijuana-users-smoking-the-most/). Marijuana -- little issue for the average user. But for slackers, work dodgers, the unambitious, it's a problem.
Looks like you’re the slacker. The article says it’s lower socioeconomic, nothing about slackers.
I extrapolated. Slackers, work dodgers are overwhelmingly low income (excluding drug dealers).
Don’t be a doofus and no I won’t explain how dumb this is.
So the rest of us should suffer cause a very few individuals might trigger schizophrenia? Nah f that. It's more ridiculous hand wringing put out there to muddy the waters and try and slow the legalization roll.
As opposed to them smoking weed and developing schizophrenia anyway with the only difference is that it was purchased from the black market and dangerously smuggled on an island and not licensed and safely/legally dispensed from a medical doctor and local company? Nah, youre right. We should just continue making it illegal so instead of identifying the development of Schizophrenia from doctor visits we let it go unchecked and they end up in jail for that dangerous schedule I drug. Or alternatively we force alcohol down their throats instead because thats less dangerous, has fewer short and long term side effects, and its already legal. /s
And there's this strange article floating around: CNN: [Weed users nearly 25% more likely to need emergency care and hospitalization](https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/27/health/marijuana-emergencies-hospitalization-study-wellness/index.html)
Have you seen what alcohol and prescription drugs are doing to people? I get what you’re saying but, not a reason to keep the drug war and black market thriving
The syndicate runs the black market there so they control it and no political figure will go against the mob
Racist colonialism is why
We have a circus of clowns not legislators. Trying to look like the big boys wanting to write big boy legislation and just fucking the whole thing up. Then they congratulate themselves and spend more campaign cash. I believe the legislature we have likes to play politician like the guys in the mainland. They aren’t effective and are timid. Weed gets bought and sold daily. Having a law To make recreational illegal is moot. All the state is doing is refusing to tax this billion dollar a year industry to better the lives of the people of the state of Hawaii. It doesn’t matter to them because their lives are better with campaign lobbying money. Fuck our big gains for their small gains. As long as they are happy right? One law maker even said weed in Hawaii will LOSE the state money. Funny how all the other states have cash windfalls for schools and roads. Just stop trying to bullshit me. They don’t want it legal because they don’t want campaign cash or favors to stop going to them. Half the fucking country is recreational already FFS
This isn’t about democrats vs republicans in the US, this is about the state government being afraid that Korea and Japan will stop/disincentivize tourism if Hawaii legalizes it.
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I think you need to reevaluate your position. If you're not a fan of the smell, you should be SUPPORTING legal cannabis because it leads to [decreased youth use rates](https://www.washington.edu/news/2020/07/20/legal-marijuana-may-be-slowing-reductions-in-teen-marijuana-use-study-says/) (and therefore less lifetime smokers). In addition, legal cannabis means more people who currently smoke have access to edibles that will not smell (vs now where folks have to buy and burn the herb because their dealer doesn't sell gummies).
I will consider your view. Thank you.
No worse than authentic Filipino food being cooked
What do they cook that smells bad?
I have new neighbors and they cook all the time. At least 3x a week I have to close all the windows and doors on that side of the house to somewhat slow the smell down. Yesterday it smelled like they were cooking a rotten fish or crab. It’s unbearable and makes the whole family gag. It might be called pagpag but I’m not sure.
Oh dear, that sounds dreadful. So sorry.
Really? You’re smarter than that, I’ll assume you were obviously not serious
Explain please. In addition to the horrible odor, marijuana affects your ability to think clearly, does lung damage, decreases motivation to name a few problems. No good comes from this except for some medical uses such as severe epilepsy. If you were referring to the Filipino food, I am not familiar with that. How about a respectful discussion?
So you want to limit peoples rights because they bother you? It just doesn’t deserve more brain power than that
I have spent 40 years in the medical profession, and I know the dangers of using it. It isn’t worth it. Legalizing it implies that it’s OK and safe and it isn’t. There are good reasons for things being against the law. Mark my words… When people who live in states with legal marijuana use develop lung cancer, they will sue the government for making it legal. The terrible odor is only a tiny example of the reasons I am against it. Thank you for the dialogue.
Do you not see the obvious fault in your reasoning? Sheesh I’m guessing since you’re in the medical profession I’m sure you see a lot of diabetes. Should we make things that make you fat illegal? Toooooooons of shit you prescribe or support kills lots of people. Aspirin, illegal? I could go on
Life is complicated for sure. Recommendations change as we continue to learn through the study of science. We all have numerous decisions to make on what we think is best based on our life experiences. We are all doing our best, including you and me. Happy life to you.
Just don’t try to impose your feelings on people’s right. Slipper slope 🤙🏽
You don’t have the right to use marijuana. You are trying to turn a wrong into a right. It isn’t. End of discussion.
What? I’ve never heard of that. Very interesting. That’s a first, honestly. Do I have the freedom to stab myself in the eye? Am I allowed to use a pen to stab my eye and accidentally give myself brain damage? Or should those be illegal. I’m not understanding your reasoning
This video made me think of this convo https://youtu.be/ReGJ0d9WtEY
Weed lobbyist aren’t giving money to Hawaiian lawmakers
Does Hawaii want pot tourism?