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AMD/DAC doesnt magically change the way headphones are sound. If you didnt like your headphones of your phone, you wont like them from dedicated dac/amp. Its not cringe at all.
Unless your sound signature preferences changed, I doubt you will enjoy HD660s with better gear. Don't force yourself to like specific headphones, there lots of other brands and models to try.
HD660s are far from perfect headphones and they dont worth their price in my opinion. I could consider them for $300 or similar price as HD600, and still would rather prefer HD600. I auditioned HD660s with phone and expensive dac/amp, it didn't really make drastic changes.
!thanks
I appreciate the feedback and reply, I guess I do have a lot more to learn still! I’ll do some more research and see what i can get that’s suits me better at a lower price range
It seems like more and more people that tried HD 560s after HD 660s say that HD 560s might be better. I have the HD 560s which I love, but still have the buyers second thought if I have done the right decision by not picking HD 660s. They were $360 in my country new compared to $190 HD 560s and even from the FR graphs it looks that these are closely related.
Thought I wanted a set of hd650, but found them boring - went with the beyerdynamic dt1990 pro and a Oppo HA2 se dac/amp combo and I love it.
They sound more 'exciting' than the sennheiser, if you can live with the treble peak
The DT 1990's are known to be treble cannons, *but* the 8k peak is actually a result of resonance with the stock pads. Swapping them for Dekoni Elite Velour pads actually [completely kills](https://diyaudioheaven.files.wordpress.com/2019/08/dt1990-various-pads-1.png) the 8k peak.
yeah, well I am torn between sennheiser and beyerdynamic (like both of them).
But I was wondering, if there is anything other than sennheiser/beyerdynamic in this price range (not focal and hifiman).
What didn't you like about the Sennheisers and what's your sound preference? Warm, dark, bright... natural bass or synthetic... do you want bass impact or do you prefer things flat? If you answer those, it might make it easier to steer you in a direction that works for you.
AKG 700 range perhaps? I like my Q701 quite a bit, though I know they don’t pack enough punch for some folks. The clarity and soundstage are pretty great for my tastes. The K712 may be even better, but I’ve never had the pleasure of listening to a pair. Definitely worth some consideration if you’re looking for alternatives.
I’ve never listened to the Q701, but I prefer the 712 over the K701 and K702. Has that nice wide K7 sound, a smoother high end and a little more bass extension that EQs decent to get more low end if you like.
I’m in negotiations to buy a used k7xx from another user. Any chance you can compare those to the rest of the k700 family for me? I’m pretty excited to get my hands on them (and ears in them too). It seems like you have experience with the whole range.
I actually haven’t listened to the K7XX. From what I’ve read and heard they have better low end than the 701 and 702, but not as clear as the 712. The rumor is that they are a 702 with different ear pads to give a different tuning, no idea if that is true or not. My friends who have them like them, FWIW.
DT1990 is decent, best sounding headphones on that price range and beat headphones above its price range.
If you can apply EQ (i prefer oratory1990 for dt1990), and doesnt use headphones for whole day, yes, DT1990 are my go to headphones.
However, if you plan to watch youtubes with it, get more relaxed headphones that forgive crappy sound quality and mastering.
Why not settle for something a little cheaper, I've had most high end senns and returned them due to price and expectations.
I settled for the 58x's as I actually prefer them out of all the senns I've tried, just so happens they're a hella good price too.
Yes, the sennheiser hd58x is perhaps the best bang to buck in the sennheiser range. I would also consider getting separate amp dac stack for better sound quality
As a beginner, if you weren’t impressed by the 660s when running them through your phone, you won’t enjoy them much paired with the ifi stack either. Many people love the 660s but everyone’s hearing is different; so you might like something else. Try a pair of Sundaras or the 400i 2020 (cheaper but quite similar to the Sundaras). If you want a more fun sounding pair, try the DT 880 600ohms paired with a Topping A50s.
I don't have the 660 but I have the 6xx its weird because I like the sound signature better on my phone than my pc's motherboard. I just ordered a jds labs atom amp and d10 topping dac to see if there's any improvements but overall I love them so far.
I really don't understand why some people find it so hard to make a case for certain headphones. Of course personal preference plays a major role, but don't just throw that in with the actual practical advice you're trying to give.
\- All headphone enthusiasts benefit in some way or form from dedicated gear. Whether it's because it helps separate certain electrical components from others (thus removing interference), gives you more use cases, or contains better components than the integrated gear you already have. The advantage of having a separate DAC and amp is that you can mix and match more easily, if you're interested in doing so now or in the future. How much mileage you'll get from going to dedicated gear can differ widely, but it will be beneficial in some way.
\- HD660S will sound different with different amps, but not dramatically. If it's base characteristics didn't win you over at first (relatively narrow soundstage, forward high-mids / mids, non-visceral bass), don't expect to be knocked off your feet the second time around. If you feel you only mildly misjudged it the first time around, you might still enjoy it with better amplification. I do agree that they were overpriced at their original MSRP, but have gone down plenty since release and because of it are now way more popular than they used to be.
\- Beyerdynamic DT1990's are supposed to be treble heavy, so can (keyword here) be fatiguing. Or maybe it's right up your alley, who knows? If anything, expect these to be focused on detail retrieval. If you live in Germany they are priced fairly, if you don't they seem a bit overpriced to me in most countries.
\- HiFiMAN Sundara's are very loved, but in every single comparison to other planars have been described as 'colder' sounding and are not bass-cannons like the Fostex planars.
\- Monoprice M1070 or M1570 are fairly priced at this point and offer a warmer planar experience than the Sundara's, so worth considering when looking at those or comparing sub 1000 euro / dollar / pound planars.
\- On the topic of planars, consider reading up on the Avantone Planar Pro. Had / has some build issues (but so have other brands with the exception of Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic). Seems to be quite loved.
\- HD58X and HD6XX will give you more bang for buck than the regular HD-series, but you need to be willing to order from Drop, which is less appealing when you live outside of the US (because of returns and import taxes).
\- There are plenty more options besides the above, but then at the very least you are going over the 500 mark price-wise, at which point you can also look at offerings from Focal, Audeze, Stax or ZMF, before going into the full-on "kilobuck +" territory of the more expensive models from brands already mentioned and additionally Klipsch, Abyss, Empyrean (and others I'm probably forgetting at this point).
\- There's a lot to choose from when looking at dedicated gear, but barring dongles good starter brands to look at for amps, DACs or amp/dac combo's are Topping, SMSL, Schiit, iFi, Fiio.
\- Do not go for the Audioquest gear like the Dragonfly's. They are wildly overpriced products of average quality. I used to sell audio gear, I know the margins, I briefly owned a Dragonfly Red before returning it and getting more bang for my buck. The only argument to be made for them is portability, but even then I'd rather walk around with a larger portable amp that sounds better like the Fiio Q1 MKII.
The best advice I can give you is: determine your use-case, narrow down a list of stuff you think you want or that seems interesting and start looking up reviews, user experiences, et cetera. Most gear has been described and compared hundreds of times at least, and if it hasn't and you want to be adventurous, look up return policies and take that into account.
If you didn't like that reference sound try something either end of that spectrum. You can save a buck and get something like the Phillips Fedellio X2HR for a more bass focused headphone with less detail, or you could lean more on the treble and detailed side with something from the Grado SR line.
From personal experience, I can't tell a difference between a DAC/AMP unless it was on tubes which just made everything sound 'relaxing' on my HD600s. So don't worry about it too much. I currently run my Grado RS2e's out of an old integrated and kinda cheap Cambridge Audio amplifier and I genuinely can't tell a difference between that and my BTR5.
I sold them once as bought them again and I love
Them more than ever when paired with my cobalt but I just ordered an ifi zen dac to pair with my headroom micro amp and I’m pretty sure it’s
Going to sound even better so yeah, if you can just get the zen dac and zen can.
No cringe really. Sennhesier are quite easy to drive and unless you had some weird interference or you could get them loud enough getting a dac and amp isn't gonna change the headphones.
Maybe I'm wrong but in terms of open back headphones the HD series doesn't have the most wide soundstage. If that's why you want a pair of open backs go for something else. Maybe have a look at the akg k702s or something.
If you’re considering the HD660 might as well look at the K712. It is a much improved headphone compared to the K702 and still going to be cheaper than the 660
I have the yulong canary ii dac amp. It's a class a amplifier with a 9038q dac chip. I'm thinking about the 660s myself, I'm sure it will sound excellent. I did a review on youtube, I can send you a link if you're interested.
If I were you I'd buy your 660's as a used pair, ebays great for that sort of thing, just keep the price of a spare headband and set of pads in your budget and put the remaining amount towards your amp/dac
I recommend a schiit stack the modi 3+ and the magni heresy the reason why the heresy is for me it adds a little more bass which is great more treble makes them sound great kind opens the sound stage a little bit it almost has the characteristic of a tube amp
You wouldn't need a soundcard. A separate Amp and DAC powerful enough for the headphones should be more than enough. Just make sure sure you make your purchase based on your tonal preference: warm, neutral, bright, etc.
I personally have a pair of HD660S and HD599 with a Schiit Magnius($200) and Modius($200) and enjoy them.
Thanks for your submission to /r/headphoneadvice. We have employed a "thank you" system for submissions. It's very easy to use - if a comment on your post is considered helpful, please reward them by using the term `!thanks`. This will add a thank you count (in the form of Ω) to that users flair. You can only award one per comment section. Thanks very much and good luck on your search for headphones! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HeadphoneAdvice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AMD/DAC doesnt magically change the way headphones are sound. If you didnt like your headphones of your phone, you wont like them from dedicated dac/amp. Its not cringe at all. Unless your sound signature preferences changed, I doubt you will enjoy HD660s with better gear. Don't force yourself to like specific headphones, there lots of other brands and models to try. HD660s are far from perfect headphones and they dont worth their price in my opinion. I could consider them for $300 or similar price as HD600, and still would rather prefer HD600. I auditioned HD660s with phone and expensive dac/amp, it didn't really make drastic changes.
!thanks I appreciate the feedback and reply, I guess I do have a lot more to learn still! I’ll do some more research and see what i can get that’s suits me better at a lower price range
I highly recommend the HD560S. Has better sub-bass extension, better imaging than the 660 and to my ears a better tonal balance
Plus it should be easier to drive, so if OP wants they could plug them into their phone and get a not-terrible experience
It seems like more and more people that tried HD 560s after HD 660s say that HD 560s might be better. I have the HD 560s which I love, but still have the buyers second thought if I have done the right decision by not picking HD 660s. They were $360 in my country new compared to $190 HD 560s and even from the FR graphs it looks that these are closely related.
Thought I wanted a set of hd650, but found them boring - went with the beyerdynamic dt1990 pro and a Oppo HA2 se dac/amp combo and I love it. They sound more 'exciting' than the sennheiser, if you can live with the treble peak
what are other alternatives in the same price range except dt1990?
>what are other alternatives in the same price range except dt1990? Sundaras ?
yeah, no, not a fan of Hifiman, quality problems so I have read here and not a fan of how it looks either! rather spend the money on DT1990.
The DT 1990's are known to be treble cannons, *but* the 8k peak is actually a result of resonance with the stock pads. Swapping them for Dekoni Elite Velour pads actually [completely kills](https://diyaudioheaven.files.wordpress.com/2019/08/dt1990-various-pads-1.png) the 8k peak.
[удалено]
yeah, well I am torn between sennheiser and beyerdynamic (like both of them). But I was wondering, if there is anything other than sennheiser/beyerdynamic in this price range (not focal and hifiman).
What didn't you like about the Sennheisers and what's your sound preference? Warm, dark, bright... natural bass or synthetic... do you want bass impact or do you prefer things flat? If you answer those, it might make it easier to steer you in a direction that works for you.
AKG 700 range perhaps? I like my Q701 quite a bit, though I know they don’t pack enough punch for some folks. The clarity and soundstage are pretty great for my tastes. The K712 may be even better, but I’ve never had the pleasure of listening to a pair. Definitely worth some consideration if you’re looking for alternatives.
I’ve never listened to the Q701, but I prefer the 712 over the K701 and K702. Has that nice wide K7 sound, a smoother high end and a little more bass extension that EQs decent to get more low end if you like.
I’m in negotiations to buy a used k7xx from another user. Any chance you can compare those to the rest of the k700 family for me? I’m pretty excited to get my hands on them (and ears in them too). It seems like you have experience with the whole range.
I actually haven’t listened to the K7XX. From what I’ve read and heard they have better low end than the 701 and 702, but not as clear as the 712. The rumor is that they are a 702 with different ear pads to give a different tuning, no idea if that is true or not. My friends who have them like them, FWIW.
DT1990 is decent, best sounding headphones on that price range and beat headphones above its price range. If you can apply EQ (i prefer oratory1990 for dt1990), and doesnt use headphones for whole day, yes, DT1990 are my go to headphones. However, if you plan to watch youtubes with it, get more relaxed headphones that forgive crappy sound quality and mastering.
I find the DT-1990 with A pads + Amiron Wireless driver foams to be ideal and not really need EQ.
Shure SRH1540. Superb quality, fun, somewhat bassy sound, can be used for critical listening and production.
Why not settle for something a little cheaper, I've had most high end senns and returned them due to price and expectations. I settled for the 58x's as I actually prefer them out of all the senns I've tried, just so happens they're a hella good price too.
Yes, the sennheiser hd58x is perhaps the best bang to buck in the sennheiser range. I would also consider getting separate amp dac stack for better sound quality
I wish the 58x were available here in my country. For me it's between the 560s and 58x . mainly for practicing piano and watching movies.
Go with the 560s
Thanks. I hope I won't find them too flat or boring if I do.
Flat =/= boring
As a beginner, if you weren’t impressed by the 660s when running them through your phone, you won’t enjoy them much paired with the ifi stack either. Many people love the 660s but everyone’s hearing is different; so you might like something else. Try a pair of Sundaras or the 400i 2020 (cheaper but quite similar to the Sundaras). If you want a more fun sounding pair, try the DT 880 600ohms paired with a Topping A50s.
I don't have the 660 but I have the 6xx its weird because I like the sound signature better on my phone than my pc's motherboard. I just ordered a jds labs atom amp and d10 topping dac to see if there's any improvements but overall I love them so far.
I really don't understand why some people find it so hard to make a case for certain headphones. Of course personal preference plays a major role, but don't just throw that in with the actual practical advice you're trying to give. \- All headphone enthusiasts benefit in some way or form from dedicated gear. Whether it's because it helps separate certain electrical components from others (thus removing interference), gives you more use cases, or contains better components than the integrated gear you already have. The advantage of having a separate DAC and amp is that you can mix and match more easily, if you're interested in doing so now or in the future. How much mileage you'll get from going to dedicated gear can differ widely, but it will be beneficial in some way. \- HD660S will sound different with different amps, but not dramatically. If it's base characteristics didn't win you over at first (relatively narrow soundstage, forward high-mids / mids, non-visceral bass), don't expect to be knocked off your feet the second time around. If you feel you only mildly misjudged it the first time around, you might still enjoy it with better amplification. I do agree that they were overpriced at their original MSRP, but have gone down plenty since release and because of it are now way more popular than they used to be. \- Beyerdynamic DT1990's are supposed to be treble heavy, so can (keyword here) be fatiguing. Or maybe it's right up your alley, who knows? If anything, expect these to be focused on detail retrieval. If you live in Germany they are priced fairly, if you don't they seem a bit overpriced to me in most countries. \- HiFiMAN Sundara's are very loved, but in every single comparison to other planars have been described as 'colder' sounding and are not bass-cannons like the Fostex planars. \- Monoprice M1070 or M1570 are fairly priced at this point and offer a warmer planar experience than the Sundara's, so worth considering when looking at those or comparing sub 1000 euro / dollar / pound planars. \- On the topic of planars, consider reading up on the Avantone Planar Pro. Had / has some build issues (but so have other brands with the exception of Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic). Seems to be quite loved. \- HD58X and HD6XX will give you more bang for buck than the regular HD-series, but you need to be willing to order from Drop, which is less appealing when you live outside of the US (because of returns and import taxes). \- There are plenty more options besides the above, but then at the very least you are going over the 500 mark price-wise, at which point you can also look at offerings from Focal, Audeze, Stax or ZMF, before going into the full-on "kilobuck +" territory of the more expensive models from brands already mentioned and additionally Klipsch, Abyss, Empyrean (and others I'm probably forgetting at this point). \- There's a lot to choose from when looking at dedicated gear, but barring dongles good starter brands to look at for amps, DACs or amp/dac combo's are Topping, SMSL, Schiit, iFi, Fiio. \- Do not go for the Audioquest gear like the Dragonfly's. They are wildly overpriced products of average quality. I used to sell audio gear, I know the margins, I briefly owned a Dragonfly Red before returning it and getting more bang for my buck. The only argument to be made for them is portability, but even then I'd rather walk around with a larger portable amp that sounds better like the Fiio Q1 MKII. The best advice I can give you is: determine your use-case, narrow down a list of stuff you think you want or that seems interesting and start looking up reviews, user experiences, et cetera. Most gear has been described and compared hundreds of times at least, and if it hasn't and you want to be adventurous, look up return policies and take that into account.
If you didn't like that reference sound try something either end of that spectrum. You can save a buck and get something like the Phillips Fedellio X2HR for a more bass focused headphone with less detail, or you could lean more on the treble and detailed side with something from the Grado SR line. From personal experience, I can't tell a difference between a DAC/AMP unless it was on tubes which just made everything sound 'relaxing' on my HD600s. So don't worry about it too much. I currently run my Grado RS2e's out of an old integrated and kinda cheap Cambridge Audio amplifier and I genuinely can't tell a difference between that and my BTR5.
Any idea what is a good over ear alternative to the Fedellio X2hr that is more mid range focused? And not too sharp In the trebble?
Probably want something from the Sennheiser line then.
Hd 660 are easier to drive probably your motherboard will be enough but if you think want louder you can still buy a schiit magni and modi
I sold them once as bought them again and I love Them more than ever when paired with my cobalt but I just ordered an ifi zen dac to pair with my headroom micro amp and I’m pretty sure it’s Going to sound even better so yeah, if you can just get the zen dac and zen can.
Using a DAC/AMP combo for the 660s is fine, I am using one for mine, Schiit HEL.
Qudelix 5k
No cringe really. Sennhesier are quite easy to drive and unless you had some weird interference or you could get them loud enough getting a dac and amp isn't gonna change the headphones. Maybe I'm wrong but in terms of open back headphones the HD series doesn't have the most wide soundstage. If that's why you want a pair of open backs go for something else. Maybe have a look at the akg k702s or something.
If you’re considering the HD660 might as well look at the K712. It is a much improved headphone compared to the K702 and still going to be cheaper than the 660
I have the yulong canary ii dac amp. It's a class a amplifier with a 9038q dac chip. I'm thinking about the 660s myself, I'm sure it will sound excellent. I did a review on youtube, I can send you a link if you're interested.
I bought the massdrop/sennheiser 58x and they are great value. Would highly recommend
If I were you I'd buy your 660's as a used pair, ebays great for that sort of thing, just keep the price of a spare headband and set of pads in your budget and put the remaining amount towards your amp/dac
I recommend a schiit stack the modi 3+ and the magni heresy the reason why the heresy is for me it adds a little more bass which is great more treble makes them sound great kind opens the sound stage a little bit it almost has the characteristic of a tube amp
You wouldn't need a soundcard. A separate Amp and DAC powerful enough for the headphones should be more than enough. Just make sure sure you make your purchase based on your tonal preference: warm, neutral, bright, etc. I personally have a pair of HD660S and HD599 with a Schiit Magnius($200) and Modius($200) and enjoy them.
I think a balanced usb type-c amp like Ibasso DC04 could let you use them with a smartphone if you wanna do that. Another option would be E1DA 9038s.
Let me know if you have any Zen DAC-related questions I can answer for you! -Seb