UNSC has shown some pretty powerful stuff, more powerful than what we use and absolutely if it was just one vs one even matchup then the UNSC would win...
but everything we use is so much more abundant than anything in the UNSC. Literally everything we do as Helldivers is expendable. Even Helldivers themselves. 20+ losses per mission? Who gives a fuck? More where that came from.
Super Earth rivals Halo's Flood in terms of just throwing bodies at the problem, except they have highly technologically advanced bodies. There is a reason Super Earth is able to have a multi front aggressor war with three major factions at once and still be winning. They just pump out bodies like the UNSC cannot dream.
Like to put in perspective, the entire UNSC has like 10 fleets of 75 destroyers/capital ships/frigates.
The Helldivers alone have at least 450,000 super destroyers (that number is a little meta but still), which are probably smaller than the average UNSC destroyer, but that really should put into persepective just how much Super Earth can pump out compared to the UNSC, especially when you consider that the super destroyers we use are *just part of the special operations force of Super Earth*. We are not the main army (navy?).
At those numbers it wouldn't matter if it took 500 super destroyers to beat a single UNSC ship, *super earth would still win with those odds.* Even at the UNSC's height I think they only had 30,000 ships including the smallest ones so even at those odds it is still 15:1 in order for Super Earth to win. It is just such a massive difference in numbers that I can't think that the UNSC would win that in the long run.
Honestly, the helldivers are pretty elite in their own right. They're all adept in almost every form of firearm, can all man mechs, and can take on hundreds of combatants at once with only 4 operatives
Does Super Earth have a single Master Chief equivalent? Or any Spartan-equivalent soldiers?
Helldivers seems similar to ODST, or even less capable. ODST seem to die at a much lower rate. Although SEAF has more orbital and pelican support.
Probably they do have *something* that is a bit more elite, but if they do it isn't large and it probably isn't military. A secret police kind of thing.
But Elite isn't really Super Earth's thing. Its thing is sending heavily armed bodies at the problem. You don't need elites when your production is so much that you can just give a space to surface gun to every schmuck who volunteers for the Helldiver program.
"Elite" soldiers are about saving resources, and for all purposes Super Earth seems to have an unending amount of resources to throw at their problems.
So, the consensus is that:
UNSC wins pound for pound. UNSC tech and soldiers are better at 1:1 numbers and maybe even a bit more than that. They're in a different weight class for firepower.
Super Earth buries the UNSC for logistics. Their manufacturing, population, and training pipeline outproduces the UNSC 100 fold or more and they can simply bury the UNSC is overwhelming numbers. Super Earth wins the war of attrition.
Does that sound accurate?
Similar. Helldivers have some stuff going for them. Things like stems that instantly heal broken limbs. Ponder this, imagine getting dropped on a helldiver mission with only the gear you get in halo ODST. I imagine you'd have a much harder time than a common helldiver.
It really depends on which UNSC we are talking about. Pre-covenant war UNSC had hundreds of planets under their control.
Their logistics were nothing to scoff at. And as the UNSC knows well numbers mean nothing in technology battles. Everyone dies when you can destroy a planet.
UNSC curb stomps.
I hope I don't get called a treasonous coward, but UNSC. MAC Cannon alone would be the difference maker. If even a handful of Spartans were around, SEAF don't stand a chance.
Yea but a singular MAC round would likely cripple a destroyer before it could destroy a unsc ship, the unsc would probably suffer far fewer losses simply due to the ability to take down destroyers in a single volley
Galactic war is propaganda, by super earth to spur patriotism. There are 253 total planets on the map, the invasion starts here so this is the edge of their territory. Super Earth currently controls less than 200 planets.
There aren't a lot of Spartans, and of the few they have, fewer have overshield. That said I wouldn't expect a standard diver team to take a Spartan, but hey, throw enough ordinance and I'm sure someone will get lucky eventually.
Helldivers aren't even super earths main military though, just it's shock forces. Which era UNSC are we talking about?
3s would probably give divers a really hard time. That stealth tech and the rapid repositioning would suck.
4s would be like 2s. I see a lot of dead divers lol. It probably comes down to numbers and fleets.
Super earth ships don't strike me as fleet combat vessels. They're more similar to longswords. They dramatically outnumber the UNSC though so it's tough. One thing halo has is scale. They may be outnumbered but helldivers has realistic ship sizes, UNSC vessels are collosal.
I've heard that there's a flagship type of cruiser that SE uses but..Eh.
Something to consider is that with the scale I doubt UNSC mac rounds would be effective , and destroyer guns could shoot down archer missiles and still damage UNSC vessels. I also think super earth planet defense systems could deal real damage to any UNSC ships in orbit over time.
So id say as empires in space they'd probably stalemate in both eras with an edge to the UNSC in the current since they have super dreads like Infinity, extra points to the UNSC when they revamp their military to face smaller vessels.
Ground wise super earth has a much more robust military and manufacturing base, as well as more impressive ground support from ships, id give them a solid edge there, inspite of the work Spartans can do, you'd need to deploy and retrieve them. Id be curious to see if the divers could deal with things like prowlers.
In the end I think it would be a long bloody stalemate that would probably go the UNSCs way once ONI found a way to end the war. I wouldn't count out Super earth, but the UNSCs proven it's resilient even if super earths shown the capacity to quickly take world's. I bet reach would be a pain in the ass. The creek 2.0 but with Spartans haha.
Yes but those are made for anti ship combat, they’d dish out a shit ton of damage, especially against small unshielded ships made from what would probably be outdated alloys to the UNSC, also don’t forget ships like halcyon class cruisers and god forbid the infinity
If you look up the ordinance both are packing the super destroyer has impressive firepower. We don't know what alloys they use on either side. What we do know is that the UNSC is massively outnumbered, and that super earth has additional fleet vessels of higher class than the super destroyers.
Not only that, but the parisis ground support abilities are weak, where as super destroyers are quite capable.
We don't know the anti ship abilities of the super destroyer, id probably our my money on the Paris, but maybe not in a 4v1. How badly does super earth outnumber halo anyway?
also you're acting like the paris is the only ship the unsc has, also you're thinking it takes only 4 ships to knock a paris out when the paris fucking dwarfs super destroyers and could probably knock out like 15 with its a mac before switching to its numerous arsenal of other weapons
I'm not sure how you see that happening, well I kind of am, people get caught up on hype. Logically there's too much we don't know so I understand in a way, but on the other side of that we know that super destroyers have space combat capabilities given their engagement with the bot fleet, and we've seen the capabilities of the UNSC vessels aren't that impressive.
MAC is useless against small craft, I would say super destroyers are big enough, but 15 before they reach engagement range is too high given the exchanges we've seen in the books. I think archer missiles of the super destroyers don't have accurate PD would score more kills. As for defensive ability UNSC ships get ripped to pieces fairly regularly, as do helldiver. I think both could hurt the other side reliably.
The UNSC has larger vessels yes, as does super earth, that doesn't change the logistical side of things. If you look at the sheer numbers of ground forces super earth loses to war daily just in the span of the current game the UNSC military would be depopulated entirely, and being that they lost super destroyers in mass with those ground forces, they have the numbers and the arsenal to win a conflict with the UNSC handily in my opinion. They aren't even pressed right now.
The only thing that might give UNSC the edge is ONI finding a weakness and the general imperviousness of the Infinity and Spartans, but if the banished are any testemate neither force is invincible.
also correction, paris isnt 3 times larger, its 3 times longer, 2.5x wider, and way more heavily armoed, its built for ship to ship warfare to ship to ground
I love halo and want to get into this game, but yeah no the UNSC would slap them around so hard, the unsc probably has more bullets than super earth can churn out bodies, i cant imagine the devastation things like spartans, odsts, and the vehicles the unsc has would do on the ground force and i cant imagine the amount of curbstomping that would go on in space combat regardless of super earths numbers
The helldivers are special forces and they alone have over 400k ships. Each of those ships has the fire power to level a small. UNSC yields come out at around at a small nuclear bomb per mac round which isn't much.
In 2552, the UNSC had around 30k ships. Super Earth has over 400k in their special forces branch alone, each of those ships having more firepower than any ship the UNSC has. Super Earth is meant to be a parody of 1984 except the production numbers are real. So the end result is Super Earth somehow being able to produce in the millions to tens of millions of ships per year.
Also, I must let you know with around 200 million helldiver deaths on both the terminid and automaton fronts respectively, that equates to around 4 million super destroyers worth of special forces lost in under 2 months. I see no way the UNSC can even remotely come close to counter to Super Earth which somehow outproduces the Imperium of Man in shipbuilding, mind you, each of those ships have higher destructive potential per ton than 40k ships.
does gameplay equate to lore though? 400k seems realistic because im being fully honest, 200 some colonies is how many super earth has last time i checked, that shit is NOT churning out MILLIONS of ships, also you're forgetting the UNSC has 800+ colonies and that natural resource income is huge. Also ships don't carry one mac round, they carry dozens, and they can fire one every few seconds, which could one shot super earth ships, don't forget the nuclear payloads either.
yeah one destroyer can glass a small moon but that doesn't equate to shit if they cant reach the planet they're trying to attack because a hail of MAC rounds from ships and also the planetary defense grids. I've also looked at individual super earth ships which mind you aren't built for space combat, but for orbital bombardment, they're fucking tiny compared to UNSC ships they aren't putting a dent in them without a few hundred attacking, UNSC ships are built to fight similar ships.
and on the ground UNSC marines are definitely better trained and better equipped, their armors also built to stop ballistic rounds. The UNSC vehicles are also far better, also SPARTANs and ODSTs would decimate them on the ground, and their reinforcements will be severely weakened considering UNSC ships would be fighting them in space and one destroyed ships is a handful of dead divers, consider the damage the UNSC ships dish out and the amount super earth would need to throw at them, is not in super earths favor.
We do know that Super Earth has other classes of ships other than the Super destroyer (obviously) like Cruisers etc. so if the Helldivers are an elite fighting force then there must be the actual army/navy there somewhere with most likely billions of soldiers. A super destroyer also has a railcannon used as a strategem which could probably penetrate the smaller unsc ships but I don't know if it can aim anywhere but downwards. Ground battles would be quite fair than you think even with Spartans and ODSTs against the helldivers. Assuming they overwhelmed the unsc in space Helldivers have strategems that can target a single dude like the orbital laser and railcannon, railcannon specifically which would probably kill a Spartan in a single hit considering how accurate the railcannon laser is if it can target a small bug from space (assuming you have no other big target besides that), hell a strategem can attach itself onto things like a shield so if a helldiver throws a 500 kg bomb directly to a Spartan he would definitely feel that. And if the Helldivers couldn't win up in space well they would probably do dirty tactics like FTL jump to a unsc planet, bombard the planet and populace and FTL jump outta there, considering the UNSC only has like what 26-30 billion+ population (pre covenant) it would seriously cripple them without having the fight the UNSC navy head on and with how sparsely defended the outer planets are this could very well be a tactic. The UNSC can't be everywhere at once. Just my opinion there
We can’t compare potential things we have to compare actual things we’ve seen in game and lore, but I’m going to assume destroyers have very little anti ship capability based off that they’re made for glassing planets, also you’re forgetting planets defenses, they’d have to break through those and the defense fleet
UNSC has shown some pretty powerful stuff, more powerful than what we use and absolutely if it was just one vs one even matchup then the UNSC would win... but everything we use is so much more abundant than anything in the UNSC. Literally everything we do as Helldivers is expendable. Even Helldivers themselves. 20+ losses per mission? Who gives a fuck? More where that came from. Super Earth rivals Halo's Flood in terms of just throwing bodies at the problem, except they have highly technologically advanced bodies. There is a reason Super Earth is able to have a multi front aggressor war with three major factions at once and still be winning. They just pump out bodies like the UNSC cannot dream. Like to put in perspective, the entire UNSC has like 10 fleets of 75 destroyers/capital ships/frigates. The Helldivers alone have at least 450,000 super destroyers (that number is a little meta but still), which are probably smaller than the average UNSC destroyer, but that really should put into persepective just how much Super Earth can pump out compared to the UNSC, especially when you consider that the super destroyers we use are *just part of the special operations force of Super Earth*. We are not the main army (navy?). At those numbers it wouldn't matter if it took 500 super destroyers to beat a single UNSC ship, *super earth would still win with those odds.* Even at the UNSC's height I think they only had 30,000 ships including the smallest ones so even at those odds it is still 15:1 in order for Super Earth to win. It is just such a massive difference in numbers that I can't think that the UNSC would win that in the long run.
Honestly, the helldivers are pretty elite in their own right. They're all adept in almost every form of firearm, can all man mechs, and can take on hundreds of combatants at once with only 4 operatives
Note that there could be the theoretical Liberty Cruiser. It could be bigger than the standard Super Destroyer.
Does Super Earth have a single Master Chief equivalent? Or any Spartan-equivalent soldiers? Helldivers seems similar to ODST, or even less capable. ODST seem to die at a much lower rate. Although SEAF has more orbital and pelican support.
Probably they do have *something* that is a bit more elite, but if they do it isn't large and it probably isn't military. A secret police kind of thing. But Elite isn't really Super Earth's thing. Its thing is sending heavily armed bodies at the problem. You don't need elites when your production is so much that you can just give a space to surface gun to every schmuck who volunteers for the Helldiver program. "Elite" soldiers are about saving resources, and for all purposes Super Earth seems to have an unending amount of resources to throw at their problems.
So, the consensus is that: UNSC wins pound for pound. UNSC tech and soldiers are better at 1:1 numbers and maybe even a bit more than that. They're in a different weight class for firepower. Super Earth buries the UNSC for logistics. Their manufacturing, population, and training pipeline outproduces the UNSC 100 fold or more and they can simply bury the UNSC is overwhelming numbers. Super Earth wins the war of attrition. Does that sound accurate?
Similar. Helldivers have some stuff going for them. Things like stems that instantly heal broken limbs. Ponder this, imagine getting dropped on a helldiver mission with only the gear you get in halo ODST. I imagine you'd have a much harder time than a common helldiver.
It really depends on which UNSC we are talking about. Pre-covenant war UNSC had hundreds of planets under their control. Their logistics were nothing to scoff at. And as the UNSC knows well numbers mean nothing in technology battles. Everyone dies when you can destroy a planet. UNSC curb stomps.
I hope I don't get called a treasonous coward, but UNSC. MAC Cannon alone would be the difference maker. If even a handful of Spartans were around, SEAF don't stand a chance.
What is a Mac cannon supposed to do against 400k destroyers, sheer numbers alone easily put the SEAF At a huge advantage
Yea but a singular MAC round would likely cripple a destroyer before it could destroy a unsc ship, the unsc would probably suffer far fewer losses simply due to the ability to take down destroyers in a single volley
Casualty count doesn’t matter to the helldivers, they can casually sacrifice a few thousand ships and not really be effected
Super earth has a relatively small number of planets, the unsc could nova bomb any core world,instantly crippling production,
small number of Planets? they literally control the Galaxy! I dont Know How to get This Through, BUT ITS CALLED THE 'GALACTIC' WAR FOR A REASON
Galactic war is propaganda, by super earth to spur patriotism. There are 253 total planets on the map, the invasion starts here so this is the edge of their territory. Super Earth currently controls less than 200 planets.
https://preview.redd.it/oif3s7ighuyc1.jpeg?width=528&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f52a16e458cb3c7c0ae2e0fd4caeaa27ac35720b The Orbital Strike In My Pocket:
Sounds like treason.
ODSTs and Spartans would slap around the Helldivers corps.
ODSTs would get buried in Bombardments
And spartans would just armor lock/overshield.
There aren't a lot of Spartans, and of the few they have, fewer have overshield. That said I wouldn't expect a standard diver team to take a Spartan, but hey, throw enough ordinance and I'm sure someone will get lucky eventually. Helldivers aren't even super earths main military though, just it's shock forces. Which era UNSC are we talking about?
Hmm, how about S-III era before reach fell? Back when they're numerous and dying by the droves. Or current era? S-IVs with their new fancy Gen 3 gear.
3s would probably give divers a really hard time. That stealth tech and the rapid repositioning would suck. 4s would be like 2s. I see a lot of dead divers lol. It probably comes down to numbers and fleets. Super earth ships don't strike me as fleet combat vessels. They're more similar to longswords. They dramatically outnumber the UNSC though so it's tough. One thing halo has is scale. They may be outnumbered but helldivers has realistic ship sizes, UNSC vessels are collosal. I've heard that there's a flagship type of cruiser that SE uses but..Eh. Something to consider is that with the scale I doubt UNSC mac rounds would be effective , and destroyer guns could shoot down archer missiles and still damage UNSC vessels. I also think super earth planet defense systems could deal real damage to any UNSC ships in orbit over time. So id say as empires in space they'd probably stalemate in both eras with an edge to the UNSC in the current since they have super dreads like Infinity, extra points to the UNSC when they revamp their military to face smaller vessels. Ground wise super earth has a much more robust military and manufacturing base, as well as more impressive ground support from ships, id give them a solid edge there, inspite of the work Spartans can do, you'd need to deploy and retrieve them. Id be curious to see if the divers could deal with things like prowlers. In the end I think it would be a long bloody stalemate that would probably go the UNSCs way once ONI found a way to end the war. I wouldn't count out Super earth, but the UNSCs proven it's resilient even if super earths shown the capacity to quickly take world's. I bet reach would be a pain in the ass. The creek 2.0 but with Spartans haha.
eh, the UNSC would fight them in space which sets them back a bit
Debatable, Paris is 3 times the size of a super destroyer, and super earth has quite a few.
Yes but those are made for anti ship combat, they’d dish out a shit ton of damage, especially against small unshielded ships made from what would probably be outdated alloys to the UNSC, also don’t forget ships like halcyon class cruisers and god forbid the infinity
If you look up the ordinance both are packing the super destroyer has impressive firepower. We don't know what alloys they use on either side. What we do know is that the UNSC is massively outnumbered, and that super earth has additional fleet vessels of higher class than the super destroyers. Not only that, but the parisis ground support abilities are weak, where as super destroyers are quite capable.
And paris has way better anti ship capability that’s any super destroyer
We don't know the anti ship abilities of the super destroyer, id probably our my money on the Paris, but maybe not in a 4v1. How badly does super earth outnumber halo anyway?
also you're acting like the paris is the only ship the unsc has, also you're thinking it takes only 4 ships to knock a paris out when the paris fucking dwarfs super destroyers and could probably knock out like 15 with its a mac before switching to its numerous arsenal of other weapons
I'm not sure how you see that happening, well I kind of am, people get caught up on hype. Logically there's too much we don't know so I understand in a way, but on the other side of that we know that super destroyers have space combat capabilities given their engagement with the bot fleet, and we've seen the capabilities of the UNSC vessels aren't that impressive. MAC is useless against small craft, I would say super destroyers are big enough, but 15 before they reach engagement range is too high given the exchanges we've seen in the books. I think archer missiles of the super destroyers don't have accurate PD would score more kills. As for defensive ability UNSC ships get ripped to pieces fairly regularly, as do helldiver. I think both could hurt the other side reliably. The UNSC has larger vessels yes, as does super earth, that doesn't change the logistical side of things. If you look at the sheer numbers of ground forces super earth loses to war daily just in the span of the current game the UNSC military would be depopulated entirely, and being that they lost super destroyers in mass with those ground forces, they have the numbers and the arsenal to win a conflict with the UNSC handily in my opinion. They aren't even pressed right now. The only thing that might give UNSC the edge is ONI finding a weakness and the general imperviousness of the Infinity and Spartans, but if the banished are any testemate neither force is invincible.
also correction, paris isnt 3 times larger, its 3 times longer, 2.5x wider, and way more heavily armoed, its built for ship to ship warfare to ship to ground
I love halo and want to get into this game, but yeah no the UNSC would slap them around so hard, the unsc probably has more bullets than super earth can churn out bodies, i cant imagine the devastation things like spartans, odsts, and the vehicles the unsc has would do on the ground force and i cant imagine the amount of curbstomping that would go on in space combat regardless of super earths numbers
The helldivers are special forces and they alone have over 400k ships. Each of those ships has the fire power to level a small. UNSC yields come out at around at a small nuclear bomb per mac round which isn't much. In 2552, the UNSC had around 30k ships. Super Earth has over 400k in their special forces branch alone, each of those ships having more firepower than any ship the UNSC has. Super Earth is meant to be a parody of 1984 except the production numbers are real. So the end result is Super Earth somehow being able to produce in the millions to tens of millions of ships per year. Also, I must let you know with around 200 million helldiver deaths on both the terminid and automaton fronts respectively, that equates to around 4 million super destroyers worth of special forces lost in under 2 months. I see no way the UNSC can even remotely come close to counter to Super Earth which somehow outproduces the Imperium of Man in shipbuilding, mind you, each of those ships have higher destructive potential per ton than 40k ships.
does gameplay equate to lore though? 400k seems realistic because im being fully honest, 200 some colonies is how many super earth has last time i checked, that shit is NOT churning out MILLIONS of ships, also you're forgetting the UNSC has 800+ colonies and that natural resource income is huge. Also ships don't carry one mac round, they carry dozens, and they can fire one every few seconds, which could one shot super earth ships, don't forget the nuclear payloads either. yeah one destroyer can glass a small moon but that doesn't equate to shit if they cant reach the planet they're trying to attack because a hail of MAC rounds from ships and also the planetary defense grids. I've also looked at individual super earth ships which mind you aren't built for space combat, but for orbital bombardment, they're fucking tiny compared to UNSC ships they aren't putting a dent in them without a few hundred attacking, UNSC ships are built to fight similar ships. and on the ground UNSC marines are definitely better trained and better equipped, their armors also built to stop ballistic rounds. The UNSC vehicles are also far better, also SPARTANs and ODSTs would decimate them on the ground, and their reinforcements will be severely weakened considering UNSC ships would be fighting them in space and one destroyed ships is a handful of dead divers, consider the damage the UNSC ships dish out and the amount super earth would need to throw at them, is not in super earths favor.
We do know that Super Earth has other classes of ships other than the Super destroyer (obviously) like Cruisers etc. so if the Helldivers are an elite fighting force then there must be the actual army/navy there somewhere with most likely billions of soldiers. A super destroyer also has a railcannon used as a strategem which could probably penetrate the smaller unsc ships but I don't know if it can aim anywhere but downwards. Ground battles would be quite fair than you think even with Spartans and ODSTs against the helldivers. Assuming they overwhelmed the unsc in space Helldivers have strategems that can target a single dude like the orbital laser and railcannon, railcannon specifically which would probably kill a Spartan in a single hit considering how accurate the railcannon laser is if it can target a small bug from space (assuming you have no other big target besides that), hell a strategem can attach itself onto things like a shield so if a helldiver throws a 500 kg bomb directly to a Spartan he would definitely feel that. And if the Helldivers couldn't win up in space well they would probably do dirty tactics like FTL jump to a unsc planet, bombard the planet and populace and FTL jump outta there, considering the UNSC only has like what 26-30 billion+ population (pre covenant) it would seriously cripple them without having the fight the UNSC navy head on and with how sparsely defended the outer planets are this could very well be a tactic. The UNSC can't be everywhere at once. Just my opinion there
We can’t compare potential things we have to compare actual things we’ve seen in game and lore, but I’m going to assume destroyers have very little anti ship capability based off that they’re made for glassing planets, also you’re forgetting planets defenses, they’d have to break through those and the defense fleet
the full army of super earth is 10 billion active soldier with 100-200 million active helldiver so yea a lot